I don't think there were was much in the way of linebacker talent in the free agency pool. Robinson was about as good as it was going to get, given the lack of money and more pressing needs.
NYG continues to sign LBs who are closer to backup level in terms of talent. While KR runs well and provides some plays at times, he often over-runs running plays, misses tackles, and isn't really ideal for the role.
Same goes for Casillas, and JT Thomas.
I agree, but KR is better than Casillas. I'd be surprised if they go LB early in the draft, but hopefully they can find a mid-round prospect with some speed/coverage ability that can bump Casillas off the roster (short term) and start at WLB longer term.
Casillas, Robinson, Goodson and Kennard works for me
would love a rangy pissed off pass-rushing LB in this draft. Or a DL passrusher. Add that and in this defense could be disgustingly good in 2017.
I can't help but believe we have something special in the works here. Tell me this team stays relatively healthy and I will guarantee 10 wins--in their sleep.
I do think Robinson has value and is a good piece to have on passing downs. He has a non-redundant role here, IMO.
KR and Casillas actually saw a lot of playing time together last season. In base packages one of them was off the field, but nickel would either be both of them or one of them with Kennard. And dime I believe was usually KR at LB.
RE: Casillas, Robinson, Goodson and Kennard works for me
would love a rangy pissed off pass-rushing LB in this draft. Or a DL passrusher. Add that and in this defense could be disgustingly good in 2017.
I can't help but believe we have something special in the works here. Tell me this team stays relatively healthy and I will guarantee 10 wins--in their sleep.
If asshat reports regarding the offer to Hankins are true (1-2 year deal), then I'd expect them to be looking for a penetrating DT in the 1st 3 rounds.
Robinson played pretty well for us least year, we should be happy
pick that Vandy LB .... then go OL in the 2nd rd and Butts in the 3rd (may have to give up our 4th to do it)
Sign me up for this please. I've been saying for weeks I don't see a big difference between the OT's who currently have 2nd round projections like Moton and Garcia and those who have 1st round like Robinson, Bolles and Ramcyk. The Giants would get better value waiting a round to get their much needed OT. As for TE, Butt will be there because of his injury but other good options like Leggett, Shaheen or Engram may also be there.
If ever there's a year for the Giants to draft a linebacker in the first round I believe this is it.
pick that Vandy LB .... then go OL in the 2nd rd and Butts in the 3rd (may have to give up our 4th to do it)
Sign me up for this please. I've been saying for weeks I don't see a big difference between the OT's who currently have 2nd round projections like Moton and Garcia and those who have 1st round like Robinson, Bolles and Ramcyk. The Giants would get better value waiting a round to get their much needed OT. As for TE, Butt will be there because of his injury but other good options like Leggett, Shaheen or Engram may also be there.
If ever there's a year for the Giants to draft a linebacker in the first round I believe this is it.
I believe Reese has been seen scouting the Vandy LB. May have even been mentioned on this thread. Not sure where I saw that.
Forces them to sign mediocre talent time and time again. It's this year or Armageddon for the next three or four years while we drag ourselves our from Cap Hell.
Forces them to sign mediocre talent time and time again. It's this year or Armageddon for the next three or four years while we drag ourselves our from Cap Hell.
Yeah, 'cause Vernon, Harrsion, and Jenkins were the very definition of mediocre talent.
Forces them to sign mediocre talent time and time again. It's this year or Armageddon for the next three or four years while we drag ourselves our from Cap Hell.
We're gonna have a good to very good to possibly great team on our hands the next 2-3-4 years. You can have your cap space. I'll take winning football.
Forces them to sign mediocre talent time and time again. It's this year or Armageddon for the next three or four years while we drag ourselves our from Cap Hell.
Why is it going to be Armageddon? The majority of the defense is young and under contract. The cap goes up every year. With a couple of restructures you get the offensive FAs under contract easily next year.
Forces them to sign mediocre talent time and time again. It's this year or Armageddon for the next three or four years while we drag ourselves our from Cap Hell.
We're gonna have a good to very good to possibly great team on our hands the next 2-3-4 years. You can have your cap space. I'll take winning football.
Agreed. Why in gods green earth do fans worry about cap space so much? Let the team worry about that stuff and let's just enjoy the product on the field and winning.
The constant complaining about the cap is new these last few years and good lord it's annoying.
I don't agree with some of the moves over the last couple seasons but overall the roster is enough to contend.
It's important to remember that they had relative good luck in terms of health in 2016. It's not crazy to expect depth to play more of a role in 2017. I would really have liked to come out of this offseason with another top shelf corner to do two things:
- provide excellent CB depth in 2017
- provide a seamless transition from DRC if/when he leaves after 2017
I'd expect the defense to not be as strong this year, and the offense to be better.
spent wisely, not overpaying for talent and obtaining talent that fills needs and represents value.
We have spent a lot of money, some of that to retain our own, some of it to go out and get good players who addressed need. So far, I'm failing to see what the concern is about the acquisitions.
The only thing you can say is that we didn't sign a FA OL - but for the second year in a row, there was little availability of talent that represented both need and value. Going out and signing Whitworth at 35, or paying Osemele the highest amount ever given to a guard wasn't going to magically do wonders for the team.
RE: Of course you worry about the cap - you worry that money is
spent wisely, not overpaying for talent and obtaining talent that fills needs and represents value.
We have spent a lot of money, some of that to retain our own, some of it to go out and get good players who addressed need. So far, I'm failing to see what the concern is about the acquisitions.
The only thing you can say is that we didn't sign a FA OL - but for the second year in a row, there was little availability of talent that represented both need and value. Going out and signing Whitworth at 35, or paying Osemele the highest amount ever given to a guard wasn't going to magically do wonders for the team.
Osemele makes a lot of money, no doubt. His cap hit in 2017 will be $13.2 million.
But Vernon's in 2017 is $16 million. $17 million in 2018. $19.5 million in 2019. JPP's is only $7.25 million in 2017. But in 2018 & 2019 it is $17.5 million and $19.5 million.
Starting in 2018 we will be spending $34.5 million on JPP and Vernon. That's 20% of the entire cap if we assume a bump to $175 million in 2018.
Will that do wonders for the team?
RE: RE: Of course you worry about the cap - you worry that money is
spent wisely, not overpaying for talent and obtaining talent that fills needs and represents value.
We have spent a lot of money, some of that to retain our own, some of it to go out and get good players who addressed need. So far, I'm failing to see what the concern is about the acquisitions.
The only thing you can say is that we didn't sign a FA OL - but for the second year in a row, there was little availability of talent that represented both need and value. Going out and signing Whitworth at 35, or paying Osemele the highest amount ever given to a guard wasn't going to magically do wonders for the team.
Osemele makes a lot of money, no doubt. His cap hit in 2017 will be $13.2 million.
But Vernon's in 2017 is $16 million. $17 million in 2018. $19.5 million in 2019. JPP's is only $7.25 million in 2017. But in 2018 & 2019 it is $17.5 million and $19.5 million.
Starting in 2018 we will be spending $34.5 million on JPP and Vernon. That's 20% of the entire cap if we assume a bump to $175 million in 2018.
Will that do wonders for the team?
It puts them in contention for a championship.
Those numbers aren't etched in stone, anyway. As we've seen, contract structure in the nfl are flexible things, and the Giants have the benefit of a very good brain managing the cap.
the cap is why we have to make decisions between players/positions instead of just being able to stockpile.
Why wouldn't you care about the cap?
Umm because I don't work for the team? Why would any fan know more about managing the cap then the Giants front office does? You guys worry about so much how do u enjoy the game?
I do think Robinson has value and is a good piece to have on passing downs. He has a non-redundant role here, IMO.
Add that, and this is probably the best defense in football.
Same goes for Casillas, and JT Thomas.
I agree, but KR is better than Casillas. I'd be surprised if they go LB early in the draft, but hopefully they can find a mid-round prospect with some speed/coverage ability that can bump Casillas off the roster (short term) and start at WLB longer term.
I can't help but believe we have something special in the works here. Tell me this team stays relatively healthy and I will guarantee 10 wins--in their sleep.
I do think Robinson has value and is a good piece to have on passing downs. He has a non-redundant role here, IMO.
KR and Casillas actually saw a lot of playing time together last season. In base packages one of them was off the field, but nickel would either be both of them or one of them with Kennard. And dime I believe was usually KR at LB.
I can't help but believe we have something special in the works here. Tell me this team stays relatively healthy and I will guarantee 10 wins--in their sleep.
If asshat reports regarding the offer to Hankins are true (1-2 year deal), then I'd expect them to be looking for a penetrating DT in the 1st 3 rounds.
Ive been saying this since yesterday !!!
Sign me up for this please. I've been saying for weeks I don't see a big difference between the OT's who currently have 2nd round projections like Moton and Garcia and those who have 1st round like Robinson, Bolles and Ramcyk. The Giants would get better value waiting a round to get their much needed OT. As for TE, Butt will be there because of his injury but other good options like Leggett, Shaheen or Engram may also be there.
If ever there's a year for the Giants to draft a linebacker in the first round I believe this is it.
Quote:
pick that Vandy LB .... then go OL in the 2nd rd and Butts in the 3rd (may have to give up our 4th to do it)
Sign me up for this please. I've been saying for weeks I don't see a big difference between the OT's who currently have 2nd round projections like Moton and Garcia and those who have 1st round like Robinson, Bolles and Ramcyk. The Giants would get better value waiting a round to get their much needed OT. As for TE, Butt will be there because of his injury but other good options like Leggett, Shaheen or Engram may also be there.
If ever there's a year for the Giants to draft a linebacker in the first round I believe this is it.
I believe Reese has been seen scouting the Vandy LB. May have even been mentioned on this thread. Not sure where I saw that.
Yeah, 'cause Vernon, Harrsion, and Jenkins were the very definition of mediocre talent.
We're gonna have a good to very good to possibly great team on our hands the next 2-3-4 years. You can have your cap space. I'll take winning football.
Why is it going to be Armageddon? The majority of the defense is young and under contract. The cap goes up every year. With a couple of restructures you get the offensive FAs under contract easily next year.
Where's the panic coming from?
Quote:
Forces them to sign mediocre talent time and time again. It's this year or Armageddon for the next three or four years while we drag ourselves our from Cap Hell.
We're gonna have a good to very good to possibly great team on our hands the next 2-3-4 years. You can have your cap space. I'll take winning football.
Agreed. Why in gods green earth do fans worry about cap space so much? Let the team worry about that stuff and let's just enjoy the product on the field and winning.
The constant complaining about the cap is new these last few years and good lord it's annoying.
It's important to remember that they had relative good luck in terms of health in 2016. It's not crazy to expect depth to play more of a role in 2017. I would really have liked to come out of this offseason with another top shelf corner to do two things:
- provide excellent CB depth in 2017
- provide a seamless transition from DRC if/when he leaves after 2017
I'd expect the defense to not be as strong this year, and the offense to be better.
Why wouldn't you care about the cap?
We have spent a lot of money, some of that to retain our own, some of it to go out and get good players who addressed need. So far, I'm failing to see what the concern is about the acquisitions.
The only thing you can say is that we didn't sign a FA OL - but for the second year in a row, there was little availability of talent that represented both need and value. Going out and signing Whitworth at 35, or paying Osemele the highest amount ever given to a guard wasn't going to magically do wonders for the team.
We have spent a lot of money, some of that to retain our own, some of it to go out and get good players who addressed need. So far, I'm failing to see what the concern is about the acquisitions.
The only thing you can say is that we didn't sign a FA OL - but for the second year in a row, there was little availability of talent that represented both need and value. Going out and signing Whitworth at 35, or paying Osemele the highest amount ever given to a guard wasn't going to magically do wonders for the team.
Osemele makes a lot of money, no doubt. His cap hit in 2017 will be $13.2 million.
But Vernon's in 2017 is $16 million. $17 million in 2018. $19.5 million in 2019. JPP's is only $7.25 million in 2017. But in 2018 & 2019 it is $17.5 million and $19.5 million.
Starting in 2018 we will be spending $34.5 million on JPP and Vernon. That's 20% of the entire cap if we assume a bump to $175 million in 2018.
Will that do wonders for the team?
Quote:
spent wisely, not overpaying for talent and obtaining talent that fills needs and represents value.
We have spent a lot of money, some of that to retain our own, some of it to go out and get good players who addressed need. So far, I'm failing to see what the concern is about the acquisitions.
The only thing you can say is that we didn't sign a FA OL - but for the second year in a row, there was little availability of talent that represented both need and value. Going out and signing Whitworth at 35, or paying Osemele the highest amount ever given to a guard wasn't going to magically do wonders for the team.
Osemele makes a lot of money, no doubt. His cap hit in 2017 will be $13.2 million.
But Vernon's in 2017 is $16 million. $17 million in 2018. $19.5 million in 2019. JPP's is only $7.25 million in 2017. But in 2018 & 2019 it is $17.5 million and $19.5 million.
Starting in 2018 we will be spending $34.5 million on JPP and Vernon. That's 20% of the entire cap if we assume a bump to $175 million in 2018.
Will that do wonders for the team?
It puts them in contention for a championship.
Those numbers aren't etched in stone, anyway. As we've seen, contract structure in the nfl are flexible things, and the Giants have the benefit of a very good brain managing the cap.
Why wouldn't you care about the cap?
Umm because I don't work for the team? Why would any fan know more about managing the cap then the Giants front office does? You guys worry about so much how do u enjoy the game?