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Bob Mcginn article with quotes from scouts

bigblue12 : 3/22/2017 8:23 am
I wait for this article every year and it is always good. I'm sure this has been posted before but I have not seen it.
Link - ( New Window )
Updated on 3/5  
The_Boss : 3/22/2017 8:45 am : link
Not sure if I've seen it either but this is always a must read every spring. Good stuff.
RE: Updated on 3/5  
bigblue12 : 3/22/2017 8:48 am : link
In comment 13402248 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Not sure if I've seen it either but this is always a must read every spring. Good stuff.


I saw that it is an older article, but I have not seen it so I figured I might not be the only one.
McGinn is a must read...  
Capt. Don : 3/22/2017 8:57 am : link
I was shocked that he had Malik Hooker in the 3rd tier. Everything I have read has said top 10, maybe top 5.

McGinn has him in the group that will probably be available at the end of round 1.
Ahhh  
Joey in VA : 3/22/2017 9:06 am : link
Now that's good stuff. Not some long drawn out useless mock draft or overly flowery "scout" lingo to make himself sound oh so educated.
Love  
DanMetroMan : 3/22/2017 9:12 am : link
this article every year. 100% nothing to do with race (because I know people will go there) but Bolles looks so goofy to be a guy who "ran with gangs".
Agreed  
Kevin in Annapolis : 3/22/2017 9:14 am : link
very informative article. Has some player slotted differently that you see in mocks (e.g. Hooker and Reddick between 25-50), may be because the article is 3 weeks old. Nice to have real info from real scouts.
OJ Howad is a pipe dream,  
Brown Recluse : 3/22/2017 9:19 am : link
but man would be be great on this team.
I've previously post on BBI  
YANKEE28 : 3/22/2017 9:26 am : link
about Dalvin Tomlinson of Alabama. Great kid with a great story and not often you see a highly rated D Tackle with a degree in Finance. State Champion high school wrestler in Georgia. Lost his Dad early in life and his Mom several years later.

If you watched Alabama, you will see games in which he played all 4 D line positions in the same game. Some draft "experts" had him as a 4th rounder (crazy). He is going to be a steady solid reliable player for the team that drafts him. He lacks the explosiveness to be a first rounder, but he would be a great pick at #55.

bibblue12- thanks for posting. I look forward to McGinns article every year. Mcginn never postures himself as a draft expert. He always states that he has a great relationship with pro scouts and relies on combining their comments to draw his conclusions. It works, because on draft weekend, you will see a lot of truth in his annual article.
Correct me if I am wrong  
Kevin in Annapolis : 3/22/2017 9:27 am : link
but doesn't McGinn also do position specific articles leading up to the draft?
Will the we can't draft Dalvin Cook crowd  
ajr2456 : 3/22/2017 9:34 am : link
be ok with Bolles?
You wanted legit scouting reports  
JonC : 3/22/2017 9:36 am : link
here's your man.
Love McGinn writeups this time of year.  
Giantgator : 3/22/2017 9:36 am : link
Brings into focus the challenge of being a GM, because every single player, no matter how highly regarded, has warts or red flags.
RE: Will the we can't draft Dalvin Cook crowd  
DanMetroMan : 3/22/2017 9:38 am : link
In comment 13402298 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
be ok with Bolles?


Bolles age has to be a red flag (I'd argue far more than his "past'). 25 before the season ever begins?
RE: RE: Will the we can't draft Dalvin Cook crowd  
ajr2456 : 3/22/2017 9:41 am : link
In comment 13402302 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 13402298 ajr2456 said:


Quote:


be ok with Bolles?



Bolles age has to be a red flag (I'd argue far more than his "past'). 25 before the season ever begins?


That's why I wouldn't draft him, by the time he fully adjusts to the NFL he'll be nearing 30.

There's been a lot of talk of Cook's issues when he was 14. This guy actually ran with gangs.
RE: RE: Will the we can't draft Dalvin Cook crowd  
Capt. Don : 3/22/2017 9:43 am : link
In comment 13402302 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 13402298 ajr2456 said:


Quote:


be ok with Bolles?



Bolles age has to be a red flag (I'd argue far more than his "past'). 25 before the season ever begins?


Certainly something to consider but I dont think it should keep us from drafting him. Age is not a big deal for an OL.
We  
DanMetroMan : 3/22/2017 9:48 am : link
go through this every year but the Giants will roll the dice on guys with "pasts" if they deem him the right guy. In general they do a great job of assessing the risks.
Hopefully this quiets down the Cunningham  
Eman11 : 3/22/2017 10:16 am : link
Crowd a bit. I'm not crazy about him and much rather have Foster or Davis if they are there. To me it's a no brainer grabbing either one over him, and I'd pass on him if he's there and they're not.
I wonder if (depending how things break)  
Chris684 : 3/22/2017 10:20 am : link
Tre'Davious White's name pops up at number 23.

That is a targeted position, conference and school for NYG in the Reese era.
RE: We  
Ira : 3/22/2017 10:21 am : link
In comment 13402311 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
go through this every year but the Giants will roll the dice on guys with "pasts" if they deem him the right guy. In general they do a great job of assessing the risks.


I agree. The Giants are good at doing due diligence on players who have questions like that.
bb12, this was a great write-up.  
Ira : 3/22/2017 10:22 am : link
Thanks for sharing it.
By all accounts  
bigblue12 : 3/22/2017 10:23 am : link
Bolles seems to have straightened out his life.
With free agency, why do people care about age?  
jcn56 : 3/22/2017 10:27 am : link
Players are rentals - if anything, a guy coming in older would presumably be more mature and physically developed (relative to where he would be 2 years earlier).

The guy would be under contract for 4-5 years (depending on round, options, etc.). Even if drafted at 25, he'd still only be 30 when he hits FA, at which point you'd only really be interested in extending him for a few years anyway.

Where's the downside of drafting an older player?
RE: With free agency, why do people care about age?  
ajr2456 : 3/22/2017 10:32 am : link
In comment 13402357 jcn56 said:
Quote:
Players are rentals - if anything, a guy coming in older would presumably be more mature and physically developed (relative to where he would be 2 years earlier).

The guy would be under contract for 4-5 years (depending on round, options, etc.). Even if drafted at 25, he'd still only be 30 when he hits FA, at which point you'd only really be interested in extending him for a few years anyway.

Where's the downside of drafting an older player?


The downside is he needs to get stronger, and there is going to be a learning curve from college to the NFL no matter how old you are.

Possibility by the time he adjusts to the NFL game he's pushing 30.
If it takes him 5 years to adjust, it's already a bad pick.  
jcn56 : 3/22/2017 10:35 am : link
Wouldn't make a difference if he were 28 or 30.

As for getting stronger, that applies to all players coming in, wouldn't be any different if he were younger.
RE: With free agency, why do people care about age?  
Brown Recluse : 3/22/2017 10:36 am : link
In comment 13402357 jcn56 said:
Quote:
Players are rentals - if anything, a guy coming in older would presumably be more mature and physically developed (relative to where he would be 2 years earlier).

The guy would be under contract for 4-5 years (depending on round, options, etc.). Even if drafted at 25, he'd still only be 30 when he hits FA, at which point you'd only really be interested in extending him for a few years anyway.

Where's the downside of drafting an older player?


Theoretically, younger player represents a higher ceiling and longer return on investment.

Free agents are often stop gaps and quick fixes. The draft, in theory, is for building the nucleus.
No, didn't mean it like that - I meant that players become FAs  
jcn56 : 3/22/2017 10:48 am : link
after 4-5 years anyway. You're still building your nucleus, just that the player has 2 years less of effective career (and even that's a guess purely based on age, since health is such a crapshoot).

Considering how likely it is a player will move on after a first or second contract, the maximum career length being shortened by age isn't really relevant.
RE: If it takes him 5 years to adjust, it's already a bad pick.  
ajr2456 : 3/22/2017 11:10 am : link
In comment 13402370 jcn56 said:
Quote:
Wouldn't make a difference if he were 28 or 30.

As for getting stronger, that applies to all players coming in, wouldn't be any different if he were younger.


Pushing 30 doesn't mean 30. If it takes him two years he's already 27. At some point you stop improving from a physical standpoint.

As opposed to a guy would be 24.

Same reason why you don't see NBA teams take 4 year guys in the first round..
Great  
AcidTest : 3/22/2017 12:58 pm : link
article. Thanks.
I don't like when a draftee is 24 or 25  
djm : 3/22/2017 11:35 pm : link
Because his older age could be an advantage for him at the collegiate level. And that could mean he's not going to be as good in the pros. It's one thing for 25 year old to dominate 19 year olds in college, quite another to play well against men in the pros.

The younger prospect will always carry more appeal.
RE: Hopefully this quiets down the Cunningham  
SHO'NUFF : 3/23/2017 1:13 am : link
In comment 13402333 Eman11 said:
Quote:
Crowd a bit. I'm not crazy about him and much rather have Foster or Davis if they are there. To me it's a no brainer grabbing either one over him, and I'd pass on him if he's there and they're not.


Yeah, someone in the other thread made Cunningham sound like the next LT...not a good writeup for him.
RE: I don't like when a draftee is 24 or 25  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/24/2017 2:58 pm : link
In comment 13403507 djm said:
Quote:
Because his older age could be an advantage for him at the collegiate level. And that could mean he's not going to be as good in the pros. It's one thing for 25 year old to dominate 19 year olds in college, quite another to play well against men in the pros.

The younger prospect will always carry more appeal.


Really depends on how developed he is, which requires more consideration. An older player isn't an immediate disqualification to me if it means you're not waiting 1-2 years for him to grasp the pro level. I look at Tim Williams from Bama, he's 23, but he's an advanced pass rush OLB in addition to his physicals, which are very, very good. He already knows a variety of block-shedding moves and seems to demonstrate knowing how to set up his assignment.
What he has to learn is run support, but that is something that can be taught IMO.
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