Just curious if anyone has heard anything on Cruz? It doesn't seem like there's been any rumors of landing spots for him since free agency began. Obviously we had to cut him due to his contract but I'm surprised if he's not even getting a look from teams (maybe he his and it's just been quiet). It wasn't like he was completely unproductive last year in his first year back.
Unfortunately, I think that injury put Cruz in the same basket as Nicks, and he won't ever be the same player again.
Unfortunately, I think that injury put Cruz in the same basket as Nicks, and he won't ever be the same player again.
This is a make or break year for him. He is 3 years removed from the knee injury and has had more then 2 years to actually train and rehab it.
He could possibly play better this year, but it all depends if someone picks him up.
That's probably the biggest question. As a player, I still think he's serviceable in the slot. He didn't have the same quickness in and out of cuts like he did during his prime, but I think he still has enough to be a solid backup. I personally would love him back at a reasonable cost. Injuries are unavoidable and it would help to have someone who knows the system as part of the rotation.
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I think he's probably lost his quickness.
Panthers signed former Bucs WR Russell Shepard, who will probably be their slot WR.
Cruz goes through two years of ball-busting rehab to get back to his team as soon as possible and you want to know if the desire is still there?
He complains that he's not getting the ball thrown to him and he's called selfish and a bad teammate.
The Giants are a bit more than a half away from the end of their 2011 season and playing like they didn't much care when one electrifying play turns the game around and sets up a postseason that we'll be re-watching for the rest of our lives.
There's no loyalty any more, not from the teams, the players or the fans.
Ding ding. We'll always remember Cruz for what he was a few years back. Explosive young player that came out of nowhere to have 2 of the more productive seasons we've ever had at WR.
But the current state of Cruz is he simply can't play at that level, as sad/mean as that is. On a pass heavy offense (#8 in the NFL in pass attempts), and as the #2 WR on the team he totaled only 39 catches. 16 of those came in the first 4 games of the season. Over the final 3/4 of the season he averaged less than 2 catches per game.
I remember, when Nicks went down, and he was moved out of the slot, he did not perform well....
With another year of healing, possibly playing in the slot rather than WR, who knows? And the big question is, does he really want it?
I must be getting sentimental in my old age....let him come to camp, if he wants to for vet min, and see if he can "win" a job as backup to SS....
The only visit he's had so far was with Carolina, whose GM he's familiar with from his time with the Giants. So now you have to ask, is that for lack of effort on Cruz/his agents part, or have teams seen enough of Cruz to know that he's a fallback option to be considered only after the draft and injuries are factored in?
Only time will tell.
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but I watched Cruz play on my team last year and I wouldn't want him on my roster for 2017 if I was an NFL team
Ding ding. We'll always remember Cruz for what he was a few years back. Explosive young player that came out of nowhere to have 2 of the more productive seasons we've ever had at WR.
But the current state of Cruz is he simply can't play at that level, as sad/mean as that is. On a pass heavy offense (#8 in the NFL in pass attempts), and as the #2 WR on the team he totaled only 39 catches. 16 of those came in the first 4 games of the season. Over the final 3/4 of the season he averaged less than 2 catches per game.
I still disagree with this assessment. He is a slot receiver and should be in the slot. He was never effective on the outside. But JonC has it right IMO. Is the desire there? If so, I think he can still play slot on another team effectively.
I think there's some truth to this, no doubt. I wonder if he did have a lack of desire, it would be more due to worrying about getting hurt again as opposed to his off the field options (or a combination of both). The "pep talk" he needed to get on the field in the preseason last year always stuck with me.
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He's 30, he's a multi-millionaire with a ring and options away from football.
I think there's some truth to this, no doubt. I wonder if he did have a lack of desire, it would be more due to worrying about getting hurt again as opposed to his off the field options (or a combination of both). The "pep talk" he needed to get on the field in the preseason last year always stuck with me.
There was a different energy to him during interviews, to my eye. At the time, I figured it was joy and relief to get back on the field. But, as the season wore on he disappeared far too often ... was it he's no longer the same player or was it a degree of surrender.
We probably should've cut him in camp like we wanted too. King deserved to play over him.
Loved Cruz but he is a guy who should retire for health reasons. He made some decent money and can move into a career in broadcasting or something else.
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In comment 13410281 JonC said:
There was a different energy to him during interviews, to my eye. At the time, I figured it was joy and relief to get back on the field. But, as the season wore on he disappeared far too often ... was it he's no longer the same player or was it a degree of surrender.
Or was it from running the same two routes all year that never really suited his strengths? I don't argue that he's likely lost some physically but many of his greatest plays came from running Gillbride's option read routes and Eli being on the same page. McAdoo's plays/routes were being opening criticized as lacking any variation and/or coordinated design to get someone open. Has he lost it physically or mentally (or both)? Likely, but he may have also surrendered to frustration to some extent which as a pro isn't acceptable either but it happens. (P. S. This isn't meant as a bring back Gillbride/Caughlin rant)
Bingo. Love me some Cruz, and will always remember his heroics fondly, but really can't see him continuing his career any longer. If he proves me wrong, I'll be cheering loudly for him.
Now go even further and you will probably not see Tye or Donnell in another uniform after they are done with the Giants. Add in Jennings and Andre Williams and you will see that basically everyone that Eli's had to work with, outside of OBJ, the past 2-3 years is not even NFL-caliber talent.
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In comment 13410362 Danny Kanell said:
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In comment 13410281 JonC said:
There was a different energy to him during interviews, to my eye. At the time, I figured it was joy and relief to get back on the field. But, as the season wore on he disappeared far too often ... was it he's no longer the same player or was it a degree of surrender.
Or was it from running the same two routes all year that never really suited his strengths? I don't argue that he's likely lost some physically but many of his greatest plays came from running Gillbride's option read routes and Eli being on the same page. McAdoo's plays/routes were being opening criticized as lacking any variation and/or coordinated design to get someone open. Has he lost it physically or mentally (or both)? Likely, but he may have also surrendered to frustration to some extent which as a pro isn't acceptable either but it happens. (P. S. This isn't meant as a bring back Gillbride/Caughlin rant)
All really good points to consider.
I lost a lot of my faith in the collective football intelligence of BBI (not saying that I have a lot either) during Nicks' last year. In all those Nicks threads almost half, or maybe even half, accused Nicks of doggin' it; playing poorly on purpose because the Giants had extended Cruz before Nicks. Including some I really wouldn't have expected. It was his contract year, his contract year.
One other thing. The offense sucked last year. At some time wouldn't it have made sense to switch Cruz and Shepard? See if Cruz and Manning could have rediscovered their chemistry and if the rookie could play outside?
If Shepard isn't a deep threat, can only play the slot and can't manage more than four yards after catch then he's not the steal everyone thought they were getting. Shepard only had six catches of greater than 20 yards, long 30. Cruz in 2011 had 25 catches greater than 20 yards.
OK, Shepard was only a rookie, but he's got a lot of catching up to do.
I lost a lot of my faith in the collective football intelligence of BBI (not saying that I have a lot either) during Nicks' last year. In all those Nicks threads almost half, or maybe even half, accused Nicks of doggin' it; playing poorly on purpose because the Giants had extended Cruz before Nicks. Including some I really wouldn't have expected. It was his contract year, his contract year.
One other thing. The offense sucked last year. At some time wouldn't it have made sense to switch Cruz and Shepard? See if Cruz and Manning could have rediscovered their chemistry and if the rookie could play outside?
If Shepard isn't a deep threat, can only play the slot and can't manage more than four yards after catch then he's not the steal everyone thought they were getting. Shepard only had six catches of greater than 20 yards, long 30. Cruz in 2011 had 25 catches greater than 20 yards.
OK, Shepard was only a rookie, but he's got a lot of catching up to do.
Agreed
I don't understand why many can't believe he had a little rust from the layoff.
Its reasonable to assume that he could play this year at a better level. It's probable, not a certain.
I am sure some team will invite him to camp, but that will happen after the draft, not before it. No one is going to bank on him being a starter right now, and for good reason.
couple that with diminished skills and I expect a tearful press conference in the near future.
Shepard and Cruz in the slot on 4 WR sets?
It could be he is no longer to perform at this level, it could be his heart's not in it at the level it needs to be.
He'll need to demonstrate the desire and ability are there.
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He's 30, he's a multi-millionaire with a ring and options away from football.
Cruz goes through two years of ball-busting rehab to get back to his team as soon as possible and you want to know if the desire is still there?
He complains that he's not getting the ball thrown to him and he's called selfish and a bad teammate.
The Giants are a bit more than a half away from the end of their 2011 season and playing like they didn't much care when one electrifying play turns the game around and sets up a postseason that we'll be re-watching for the rest of our lives.
There's no loyalty any more, not from the teams, the players or the fans.
You're acting like going through that ball-busting rehab netted him nothing. It got him back on the field, into the NFL playoffs, and made him millions of dollars.
Yes, at 30 years old, having done that crazy rehab, and now having to prove himself again to another team? And as Jon said with millions in the bank, relatively healthy now to live a normal life, and a bunch of options off the field?
It's a very, very plausible question.
It could be he is no longer to perform at this level, it could be his heart's not in it at the level it needs to be.
He'll need to demonstrate the desire and ability are there.
Funny, you make it seem like the job was handed to him last year, when everyone had him being on the verge of being cut. Lack of desire shouldn't be in question. His ability should be, and it's possible he has healed further. Someone will take a bet on him for a camp.
To perform successfully at that level requires not only a relentless commitment to your body, but in the games themselves, it requires a level of intensity and focus that I don't think any of us can relate to, and that's the "heart" I can see fading... a super-awareness of your ever move, without overthinking it, and just a total internal commitment to every fine-tuned motion you make.
There are physical specimens in the league that don't put up the numbers they should, because it's very easy to tune out and take a route off, which again, isn't the same as dogging it. It's almost an unconscious thing. You go through the motions, so to speak. At 30 years old? It's a thing that can happen. You run your route, make your cut, but there isn't an acute perception there to know that precise nanosecond when that burst is necessary to beat your man.
You need to be hungry in a way that you know if you fail on that route, if you don't beat your man, the life you need to be the best version of yourself can vanish. For Cruz, that urgency isn't there in reality. It's fair to say he can't trick himself into thinking it is.
Shepard and Cruz in the slot on 4 WR sets?
I'd rather have a WR who can play on special teams as the #4 WR.
Shepard and Cruz in the slot on 4 WR sets?
I was one of the biggest Cruz supporters here, but I think the ship has sailed. He can't play specials and, at this point, might not take a vet minimum contract which is all he would deserve. I also don't think he'd be interested in being a 4th WR.
I think Cruz gets signed somewhere after June 1st
A decent slot receiver is needed by many teams in this league .
I think Cruz gets signed somewhere after June 1st
A decent slot receiver is needed by many teams in this league .
I agree and I agree with those that believe he can have a better season with another year of healing behind him. I sensed that he was just very afraid to re-injure himself know another injury would surely end his tenure with the Giants. I don't think he expected this with the team having another star receiver in OBJ.
I think now that he's sees the desperation of his situation he is going to play lights out if another team gives him a shot. Now he knows he has nothing to loose (career wise).
I lost a lot of my faith in the collective football intelligence of BBI (not saying that I have a lot either) during Nicks' last year. In all those Nicks threads almost half, or maybe even half, accused Nicks of doggin' it; playing poorly on purpose because the Giants had extended Cruz before Nicks. Including some I really wouldn't have expected. It was his contract year, his contract year.
One other thing. The offense sucked last year. At some time wouldn't it have made sense to switch Cruz and Shepard? See if Cruz and Manning could have rediscovered their chemistry and if the rookie could play outside?
If Shepard isn't a deep threat, can only play the slot and can't manage more than four yards after catch then he's not the steal everyone thought they were getting. Shepard only had six catches of greater than 20 yards, long 30. Cruz in 2011 had 25 catches greater than 20 yards.
OK, Shepard was only a rookie, but he's got a lot of catching up to do.
Yep, some of those comments came from posters you wouldn't expect that from. Lost a lot of respect for the board, especially when we know how Hakeem put it on the line when healthy. It's shitty to see someone give up their body for our entertainment, and we have chickenshit comments about how the guy is mailing it in for checks.