Greater likelihood of trade up this year? Agree with Dottino

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(in the first round at least) and I fully support it for the reasons I outlined in the thread
Link - ( New Window )

I love the mixed signals. Hopefully the Giants can keep this up until they make their selection.

I can see a trade up in the 2nd round, but not the first.

move up in round 1 for rueben foster.

gerald everett in round 2

antonio garcia in round 3

I think the player they crave is Howard.

A move up in the second wouldn't cost as much in draft pick assets so this is more likely.

It's Howard they crave but I think they settle on Njoku if Howard is gone

Donta Foreman in Rd 2

And Elis got his weapons and the offense will be ranked near the top

In comment 13410786 Eric from BBI said:

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I think the player they crave is Howard.

Eric, I think he is a generational talent a the position. A complete TE in a world where there are very few of those.

Can you elaborate why you think they crave Howard?

If there is someone they really want and that player makes it past the 16th to 18th pick, I could see the team doing something to move up a few slots. But I don't expect a major leap that would cost a premium pick

In comment 13410786 Eric from BBI said:

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I think the player they crave is Howard.

Yep.

In comment 13410809 Beer Man said:

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If there is someone they really want and that player makes it past the 16th to 18th pick, I could see the team doing something to move up a few slots. But I don't expect a major leap that would cost a premium pick

this is the scenario I was advocating for, exactly in that range. It would cost the Giants 3rd, but if somehow Howard drops to that range or Njoku is there but whispered to be taken soon, Giants should pounce.

But it depends how far they need to go up, I don't think the Giants want to lose a 2nd or 3rd round pick. I think a forth rounder where they sit is a definite possibility. So if it's a matter of moving up a couple of spots, yes they will do it, I don't see them moving up 10 spots though, moving up to 18 would cost us our third, maybe we get back a 6th or 7th, that would be possible only for Howard, but I am not certain about that since the money they spent on Ellison is significant.

We'll be drafting a solid red chip prospect at #23. There are 8 blue chip prospects in this draft imo. The odds are even if one of them slides a bit, say to #13, the cost will be enormous to move up to get in range. You'd have to forfeit this years 2nd Rounder to make that move. Bad idea.

The 2nd round I could see. Especially after hitting paydirt on Landon Collins with this strategy. But it's not a decision you make until you know if 'you're guy' has slid into Day 2.

Just not the year to upgrade LT or DE, and CB and WR could wait unless a prospect slips they can't refuse (eg, Lattimore).

QB. Usually, when teams trade up, it's for a QB. Hope that's not the case.

but rather a package of the rest, otherwise stand down.

at all

sure they do crave Howard, but Reese isn't trading into the top ten to get him, which is where he's expected to go. The cost would be incredible. Different story if Howard somehow slips to the late teens. I'm OK if they trade up, but only if they don't give up more than one day three pick.

I also don't agree that the Giants have an "all in" mentality, and will therefore do anything to "win now" because Eli's "window" is closing. Reese isn't going to sacrifice the future, and as someone else noted, Pugh, Richburg, and Fluker are all FAs next year. And even if they ultimately produce, many first round picks don't do so as rookies. They can also get hurt like anyone else.

In comment 13410786 Eric from BBI said:

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I think the player they crave is Howard.

i agree. the guy seems pro ready too. wouldnt mind it

The only guy I can recall off the top of my head is Winslow.

I expect the quarterbacks to go earlier than is being talked about; they always move up as the draft approaches. That's how you end up with Blaine Gabbert and Christian Ponder getting picked super high.

History says that Howard won't go top 10.

I wouldn't have thought that but considering that it seems that there isn't a great match at 23 I guess a trade shouldn't be too surprising.

In comment 13410841 Go Terps said:

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The only guy I can recall off the top of my head is Winslow. I expect the quarterbacks to go earlier than is being talked about; they always move up as the draft approaches. That's how you end up with Blaine Gabbert and Christian Ponder getting picked super high. History says that Howard won't go top 10.

eric ebron

the Giants moves in FA this year are consistent with the way Reese works - he plays for value

I think he gets far more value drafting in the first five rounds in a deep draft than trading up with any of those picks - and given his history - especially with TE - it is a very unlikely target, value wise, to trade up for

so it's fun to talk about but I just don't see it

any draftee - even Howard, as much as the salivary glands are inspired by him, is a move for the future and not an all in now pick

Picking a Manning, a QB, is an all in move for the Giants, not a TE, and there is no Manning in the draft this year

going to absolutely hate it if Reese starts burning multiple picks to move up in the first round. That's just desperate and stupid. What is the success rate for first round picks? 50%? Just stay put, and take one of the following:

Njoku.
Cunningham.
Bolles.

that's for damn sure

In comment 13410857 gidiefor said:

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the Giants moves in FA this year are consistent with the way Reese works - he plays for value I think he gets far more value drafting in the first five rounds in a deep draft than trading up with any of those picks - and given his history - especially with TE - it is a very unlikely target, value wise, to trade up for so it's fun to talk about but I just don't see it any draftee - even Howard, as much as the salivary glands are inspired by him, is a move for the future and not an all in now pick Picking a Manning, a QB, is an all in move for the Giants, not a TE, and there is no Manning in the draft this year

Agreed. I'd rather Reese take Mahomes at #23 than trade more than one day three pick to move up for Howard. And I have no interest in taking Mahomes at #23, although I think the Giants might well do so.

They have some warts but very high ceilings. I'd much rather draft them than trade up in the 1st Round.

I most likely would be very annoyed if we gave up a second this year. A third? I am sure we will have another shot as a possibly starter in the third too. Now, if we have to pull a move like we did with Shockey (going up one pick or just a couple) and not give up much then fine.

shot at a possible ...

of them, is not all that terrific, why would we ever consider taking one in the first round?

As to trading up, lawd no..Take whatever red chip is there

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also just took Reese off the proverbial "hot seat," so there's no need for him to have an "all in" "win now or else" approach.

In comment 13410857 gidiefor said:

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the Giants moves in FA this year are consistent with the way Reese works - he plays for value I think he gets far more value drafting in the first five rounds in a deep draft than trading up with any of those picks - and given his history - especially with TE - it is a very unlikely target, value wise, to trade up for so it's fun to talk about but I just don't see it any draftee - even Howard, as much as the salivary glands are inspired by him, is a move for the future and not an all in now pick Picking a Manning, a QB, is an all in move for the Giants, not a TE, and there is no Manning in the draft this year

Reese has an affinity for play makers over safer players. He's demonstrated this countless times. it's why he drafts players like David Wilson, Ramses Barden (even trading up with a rival to select him) or Jerrell Jernigan - and many more in the top few rounds of the draft.

If there is a play maker in the 16 - 18/20 range I could absolutely see a trade up.

Exactly.

but if Foster is somehow in reach I would probably strongly consider it, otherwise I just go BPA at 23.

In comment 13410845 BleedBlue said:

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In comment 13410841 Go Terps said: Quote: The only guy I can recall off the top of my head is Winslow. I expect the quarterbacks to go earlier than is being talked about; they always move up as the draft approaches. That's how you end up with Blaine Gabbert and Christian Ponder getting picked super high. History says that Howard won't go top 10. eric ebron

Vernon Davis

Not named Myles Garrett. In order to move up from 23 with giving up the third rounder you wouldnt be able to get anywhere near the top 10. Maybe you trade up to 15 tops, giving up 23 and a third.. But what player is going to fall past 15 that is worth this type of deal? A tight end? In the deepest TE class in recent memory.. Pleeaase.

yes move up and get the final piece to the passing game.
Imagine all the passes that Tye caught last year and got three yards now see Howard with the same catches and in the Redzone.

...I would have liked to see Vernon Davis play with a good QB. He's had a pack of bums throwing it to him his entire career. Before you comment, Yes I think Alex Smith is a bum.

3rd round track record, there is literally zero scenario I shed a tear with Reese giving up a 3rd round pick for a player he covets in the 1st.

2016: Darian Thompson S
2015: Owamagbe Odighizuwa DE
2014: Jay Bromley DT
2013: Damontre Moore DE
2012: Jayron Hosley CB
2011: Jerrel Jernigan WR
2010: Chad Jones S
2009: Ramses Barden WR (trade up), Travis Beckum TE
2008: Mario Manningham WR
2007: Jay Alford DT

People overrate draft picks immensely. I read the comments every year after the draft "I love our Uconn WR Geremy Davis. I think he has a chance to start" or "Greg Jones, that guy is a legit NFL linebacker. I'm excited about that pick" and it's a lottery ticket getting one of those guys to actually pan out and start let alone excel.

3rd round isn't much more likely. I posted the success rate from 2004 to 2014 last week, here it is again:

Historic Success Chart

The numbers show us the following outline for finding consistent starters:

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1st Round - OL (83%) LB (70%) TE (67%) DB (64%) QB (63%) WR (58%) RB (58%) DL (58%) 2nd Round - OL (70%) LB (55%) TE (50%) WR (49%) DB (46%) QB (27%) DL (26%) RB (25%) 3rd Round - OL (40%) TE (39%) LB (34%) DL (27%) WR (25%) DB (24%) QB (17%) RB (16%) 4th Round - DL (37%) TE (33%) OL (29%) LB (16%) WR(12%) DB (11%) RB (11%) QB (8%) 5th Round - TE (32%) DB (17%) WR (16%) OL (16%) DL (13%) RB (9%) LB (4%) QB (0%) 6th Round - TE (26%) OL (16%) DL (13%) WR (9%) DB (8%) RB (6%) LB (5%) QB (0%) 7th Round - DB (11%) OL (9%) QB (6%) WR (5%) DL (3%) LB (2%) RB (0%) TE (0%)

(perhaps aside from Trubisky). I'm not sure they'd want Howard over Garrett or Thomas, but they probably would take him over any other defensive player.

I think that Howard is a star in the making, but the cost to get up to him might be astronomical. You're not getting him for a 3 and 4 plus our 1.

is with the Giants and a bold off-season move or two or three. I nailed it in 2004. Bold I know. I nailed it last year. Even bolder...and I think they will trade up this year.

They don't really need quantity as much as they need impact. They signed a lunch pail guy for the offense and will likely draft another but they could really use one more impact player on O and D. Trading up helps that cause.

...Davis will have played with now that he's a 'Skin. Not sure what he has left in the tank at this point though.

but the Giants LOVE the kid. Has it ever happened during the 1st round where a team like the Giants would call the Ravens and make an offer for Howard giving #23 and #87 or whatever?

(Howard is one of the few players I can see our team trading up for.)

In comment 13410778 David in LA said:

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I think they will wait until round 2-3 to take a QB. I can't blame them for taking a guy in round 1 but gun to my head, I don't see it. I think they go for the impact player in round 1 either by trade up or standing pat and then they will let the QB dust settle.

Honestly I don't know what the hell they do. Every day I change my mind. I know what I want though. I want a defensive bad ass in round 1 if all things are equal. Then get the TE, RB, OL, CB later on--in no particular order.

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If there's someone they really like it makes sense as long as they aren't giving up a ton.

How far you think we need to move up? I'd guess to pick 10(Bills). Saints need defensive playmaker at 11, and the Browns would be an ideal landing spot for Howard. That's a huge jump, and would cost a ton.

In comment 13410920 djm said:

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In comment 13410778 David in LA said: Quote: . I think they will wait until round 2-3 to take a QB. I can't blame them for taking a guy in round 1 but gun to my head, I don't see it. I think they go for the impact player in round 1 either by trade up or standing pat and then they will let the QB dust settle. Honestly I don't know what the hell they do. Every day I change my mind. I know what I want though. I want a defensive bad ass in round 1 if all things are equal. Then get the TE, RB, OL, CB later on--in no particular order.

Round 2-3 would not surprise me at all, perhaps one of the QB's we really like will be there anyways. Just looking at the moves we've made this offseason, we're in "win now" mode. Personally, I'm hoping that we come out of this draft with one really good playmaker on offense.

How does that conversation go exactly with the opposing GM? Trade down with us so we can get the player we really love but we don't want to give you much for him???