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NFT: Knicks Chat: Jayson Tatum

giantsfan44ab : 3/30/2017 10:15 am
Around the league:

-Bucks might legitimately be a top 3 team in the east. I was debating PaulBlake yesterday about saric over brogdon for MVP but last night doesn't do me any favors. He gutted out the win for the bucks, 16 and 9 assists

-Dragic 20 and 9, will be tank commander Friday as well

-Orlando didn't do any favors allowing Westbrook to go off for 57, 11 and 13

-Neither did Philly. Is richaun Holmes actually better than Noel? This guy is hitting 3s. 25 and 8 last night?

-Davis 30 and 13/cousins with 29 6 and 16. Add an actually decent wing player to NO and it will provide exponential returns.

-curry with 29 and 11. If KD is back I don't know if I'd give SA one game on GS. I don't think we'll see it, I'm taking houston over SA.

-Wall dropped 41 but everyone in LA went off so it didn't matter


Draftexpress uploaded videos on jayson Tatum:

Strengths: https://youtu.be/H-p0T2WhXM8

Weaknesses: https://youtu.be/wyk-CJFfEI4

Something just screams very, very good NBA player to me. Maybe it's the fact that he can get from the 3 point line to the basket in seemingly 2 dribbles. Maybe it's his uncontestable jump shots due to his high release.

I think he's the best pure scorer in the draft, and since he started getting shit together later on in the season I don't see why he'd be anyhing but a good defender in the NBA.

I like the comparisons on him. I think he ends up becoming something in the ballpark of a Danny Granger/Paul George.
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RE: Actually, he's probably  
Deej : 3/30/2017 4:56 pm : link
In comment 13412321 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
ahead of schedule.


Remember all the "it will take him 3 years to develop" talk? That was physical. So you're probably right. He's fine on the development curve.
Yeah, I think the scouts  
bceagle05 : 3/30/2017 4:59 pm : link
were mostly right about KP - the sky's the limit in terms of talent, but it's gonna take time for him to gain the necessary size and strength. I don't fault them for not anticipating the immediate impact - it was a pleasant surprise. I remember being blown away watching him excel in Summer League games.
Damn Pip  
DanMetroMan : 3/30/2017 5:05 pm : link
@ScottiePippen thinks old boss @PhilJackson11 should be fired #Knicks
Still salty  
bceagle05 : 3/30/2017 5:07 pm : link
about that Kukoc game-winner.
RE: Yeah, I think the scouts  
nygiants16 : 3/30/2017 5:14 pm : link
In comment 13412342 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
were mostly right about KP - the sky's the limit in terms of talent, but it's gonna take time for him to gain the necessary size and strength. I don't fault them for not anticipating the immediate impact - it was a pleasant surprise. I remember being blown away watching him excel in Summer League games.


i read chris sheridans write up after knocks picked kp, basically said phil is going to get killed because kp has 2 years before he is even a rotational player..

here we are 2nd year and kp averaging 19 and 7 on good averages
Is it just me or has Ricky Rubio been amazing since the Knicks rumors?  
Anakim : 3/30/2017 11:07 pm : link
Just our luck...though he probably would've hurt El Tanko
RE: Is it just me or has Ricky Rubio been amazing since the Knicks rumors?  
giantsfan44ab : 3/31/2017 8:56 am : link
In comment 13412534 Anakim said:
Quote:
Just our luck...though he probably would've hurt El Tanko


Since all star he's averaging 17 points, 10.5 assists, 4.5 boards on 47% from the field and 43% from 3.
Leaf  
DanMetroMan : 3/31/2017 9:59 am : link
and Markkanen declare
Leaf is a good indication of the depth in this draft  
Greg from LI : 3/31/2017 11:11 am : link
He'd go in the top ten most years and this year he'll probably be in the mid to late teen.
I was disappointed we didn't pull off the Rubio trade.  
bceagle05 : 3/31/2017 11:22 am : link
He would've been a nice two-year stop gap at a reasonable price even if we do draft a PG this year, and it would prevent us from grossly overpaying Holiday, Teague or Hill this summer. As far as the tank is concerned, it's an interesting question: Would you rather have the fifth pick OR Rubio + the 8-10th pick?
RE: I was disappointed we didn't pull off the Rubio trade.  
DanMetroMan : 3/31/2017 11:23 am : link
In comment 13412940 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
He would've been a nice two-year stop gap at a reasonable price even if we do draft a PG this year, and it would prevent us from grossly overpaying Holiday, Teague or Hill this summer. As far as the tank is concerned, it's an interesting question: Would you rather have the fifth pick OR Rubio + the 8-10th pick?


I'd prefer Rubio + 8-10 if Fultz, Ball, Tatum and Jackson were off the board.
In that scenario, I think I'd rather have Smith than Rubio+  
Greg from LI : 3/31/2017 11:25 am : link
Unless you buy into the current Rubio as being the kind of player he'll be going forward, which I don't.
I'm  
DanMetroMan : 3/31/2017 11:27 am : link
getting a little nervous about the Smith/Rose comparisons. There is a lot to like but I want someone who is going to help KP/Willy. I admittedly have seen less of Smith than the other PG's so my opinion isn't very strong.
People comparing Smith to Rose are lazy and wrong  
Greg from LI : 3/31/2017 11:43 am : link
Smith looks to set up his teammates. It's just that he didn't have many teammates who were worth a shit. Their second and third leading scorers were the relentlessly mediocre Terry Henderson and Napoleon Dynamite, I mean Mav Rowan.

On a bad team, playing at less than 100%, Smith averaged almost two more assists per game than Rose did on a powerhouse Memphis team that should have won a national championship.

Smith is taking the fall for NCSU's failures, and that's really not fair. It was such an awful situation that virtually no kid could have salvaged. Why doesn't anyone knock Fultz for Washington being terrible? And Washington had a much more talented roster, too.
RE: I'm  
Deej : 3/31/2017 11:47 am : link
In comment 13412950 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
getting a little nervous about the Smith/Rose comparisons. There is a lot to like but I want someone who is going to help KP/Willy. I admittedly have seen less of Smith than the other PG's so my opinion isn't very strong.


I think the comps are more on athleticism and penetration ability. I've seen more highlights of Smith finding a teammate as part of a play (rather than as a desperate measure) than I've seen Rose do so all season.

My concern on Smith is principally health. Im warming up to him as the pick. All things being equal, I'd take a little bit less value at PG over an a SF (especially a big SF like Isaac who is potentially going to be a hybrid 3/4 rather than a 3).
My concern with Smith  
giantsfan44ab : 3/31/2017 12:43 pm : link
is his wingspan. It's only 2 inches longer than Isaiah Thomas's. I don't think it's going to inhibit him from being a great player but it may limit his defensive potential/finishing.

Eric Bledsoe with a short wingspan I think describes Smith perfectly.
I  
DanMetroMan : 3/31/2017 12:45 pm : link
have nothing against Smith. I just despise Derrick Rose lol
RE: My concern with Smith  
Deej : 3/31/2017 12:45 pm : link
In comment 13413101 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
is his wingspan. It's only 2 inches longer than Isaiah Thomas's. I don't think it's going to inhibit him from being a great player but it may limit his defensive potential/finishing.

Eric Bledsoe with a short wingspan I think describes Smith perfectly.


And Chris Paul's wingspan is under 6'5", and he's a premier defensive 1.
RE: RE: My concern with Smith  
giantsfan44ab : 3/31/2017 12:51 pm : link
In comment 13413104 Deej said:
Quote:
In comment 13413101 giantsfan44ab said:


Quote:


is his wingspan. It's only 2 inches longer than Isaiah Thomas's. I don't think it's going to inhibit him from being a great player but it may limit his defensive potential/finishing.

Eric Bledsoe with a short wingspan I think describes Smith perfectly.



And Chris Paul's wingspan is under 6'5", and he's a premier defensive 1.


Still has 2 inches on Smith's. I think CP3 is the exception for undersized players becoming good defenders. I guess Lowry too, but not sure what his wingspan is.

I'd still run to the table for Smith I think, but I don't think he's significantly better than Fox overall (offensively yes, defensively no).
unless Fox improves his outside shot dramatically, he'll always be  
Greg from LI : 3/31/2017 1:10 pm : link
a limited player in the current NBA. Sure, you can throw out a John Wall comparison, but even Wall was a much better outside shot at Kentucky - 32% on 3s vs Fox's 24%.

Players can improve their outside shot, but when you start out as low as Fox is how much more can you reasonably expect him to do?
Wall  
DanMetroMan : 3/31/2017 1:15 pm : link
is also a freak in terms of quickness/speed. Not saying Fox isn't a good athlete but Wall is on another level.
Yeah I'm very much on the Smith/Tatum bandwagon  
bceagle05 : 3/31/2017 1:17 pm : link
if we're fourth or fifth. I really can't believe we may climb that high in the rankings after starting 14-10 or whatever. Just a monumental - and much needed - collapse.
RE: Yeah I'm very much on the Smith/Tatum bandwagon  
giantsfan44ab : 3/31/2017 1:43 pm : link
In comment 13413160 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
if we're fourth or fifth. I really can't believe we may climb that high in the rankings after starting 14-10 or whatever. Just a monumental - and much needed - collapse.


I'm content with either Smith, tatum or Isaac at this point. I keep convincing myself one over the other but in reality any of those 3 I'll be happy with. Ball/fultz/jackson is just icing at this point for me.
Triangle  
TyreeHelmet : 3/31/2017 1:50 pm : link
Does it worry you guys that Jackson will make this pick trying to find a player that fits the triangle? It's the last thing I want a team to be considering when drafting a player, just get the best player.

I think Smith would be a home run pick. If he gets to 5 or later, could be the steal of the draft. I just worry Phil passes on him or Fox because they aren't "triangle PGs", whatever that even means.
It's definitely a concern  
bceagle05 : 3/31/2017 1:54 pm : link
but in Phil's world, any good player can and should excel in the triangle. If you look at some of his draft picks and the guys he's signed or pursued in free agency (DeAndre Jordan), many don't exhibit the typical "triangle" traits.
RE: Triangle  
giantsfan44ab : 3/31/2017 2:03 pm : link
In comment 13413216 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
Does it worry you guys that Jackson will make this pick trying to find a player that fits the triangle? It's the last thing I want a team to be considering when drafting a player, just get the best player.

I think Smith would be a home run pick. If he gets to 5 or later, could be the steal of the draft. I just worry Phil passes on him or Fox because they aren't "triangle PGs", whatever that even means.


Was Jerian Grant a "triangle PG"?

I question Phil as an executive because he seems to approach his job as a coach rather than from a business/analytical perspective. I don't question his eye for talent, and I genuinely think the Knicks have a pretty good scouting department.
RE: RE: Triangle  
TyreeHelmet : 3/31/2017 2:34 pm : link
In comment 13413238 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
In comment 13413216 TyreeHelmet said:


Quote:


Does it worry you guys that Jackson will make this pick trying to find a player that fits the triangle? It's the last thing I want a team to be considering when drafting a player, just get the best player.

I think Smith would be a home run pick. If he gets to 5 or later, could be the steal of the draft. I just worry Phil passes on him or Fox because they aren't "triangle PGs", whatever that even means.



Was Jerian Grant a "triangle PG"?

I question Phil as an executive because he seems to approach his job as a coach rather than from a business/analytical perspective. I don't question his eye for talent, and I genuinely think the Knicks have a pretty good scouting department.


I honestly have no clue what a "triangle PG" is. Is it Ron Harper or Steve Kerr/ John Paxson? My concern is it coming into play at all.

Phil has attributed the KP pick to Clarence Gaines. Even still Phil deserves a ton of credit for it and I'm his biggest opponent. By all accounts, Grant was Phil's pick and against the scouting department. That worries me.

This offseason has massive implications for the Knicks future. It will be interesting to follow.
D. Rose still talking defense!  
bceagle05 : 3/31/2017 3:01 pm : link
Quote:
While the Knicks were busy trying to make sense of Jackson’s offense this season they ignored the other end of the court. And ultimately that was the team’s biggest failure according to Rose.

“I believe so,” Rose said on Friday. “But I’ve been saying that the entire year. We weren’t consistent defensively this year and it shows with our record.”

Isola - ( New Window )
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