Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner
 

Archived Thread

What's the diff btween guaranteed at signing and total gtd

Milton : 4/20/2017 1:10 pm
Looking at Hankins's deal with the Colts he is guaranteed $10M in the first year of the deal with $4.5M of his 2018 salary becoming guaranteed in March 2018. The contract is described as including $14.5M in guaranteed money with $10M guaranteed at signing.

What if he is released in February 2018? Is that $4.5M guaranteed or isn't? Why describe the contract as having $14.5M guaranteed if the team can avoid the additional $4.5M in "guaranteed" money by releasing him in February? Either it's guaranteed or it isn't. Is there a detail that I'm missing?

contract details from spotrac

contract details from OTC
guaranteed at signing  
giants#1 : 4/20/2017 1:16 pm : link
means the second he signs the contract he will earn at least that amount.

Other guarantees can be contingent on meeting certain goals. For example, Beckham's 5th year option, when it's picked up, will be 'guaranteed for injury'. So if Beckham blows out his knee week 17 of this season (knock on wood), he'll still get the ~$9M in 2018. On the other hand, if Beckham pulls an Aaron Hernandez between now and the end of the season, the Giants could cut him and not owe anything.

Roster and workout bonuses are typically 'guaranteed' money, provided players are still on the team when the guaranteed money vests and/or attend the requisite offseason workouts.
RE: guaranteed at signing  
Milton : 4/20/2017 1:24 pm : link
In comment 13435673 giants#1 said:
Quote:
means the second he signs the contract he will earn at least that amount.
That part I get.

Quote:
Other guarantees can be contingent on meeting certain goals.
Then they're not guaranteed, are they? So why call them that? That's my point. Why say his contract has $14.5M in guaranteed money if only $10M is actually guaranteed? It's misleading.
I agree.  
therealmf : 4/20/2017 1:24 pm : link
It seems contradictory to have monies that are called guarantees but are payable only if certain conditions are met.

Isn't this the same situation that caused Joey Bosa to hold out?
The funny thing is...  
Milton : 4/20/2017 1:37 pm : link
If he were to receive a $4.5M roster bonus in March 18 instead of having it come due as the guaranteed portion of his 2018 salary he would get the money a lot sooner, but then his agent wouldn't get to describe it as "guaranteed" money.

p.s.-- I mean why not just call the whole damn contract as guaranteed because if he plays it out, they have to pay him.
I don't know  
rasbutant : 4/20/2017 2:33 pm : link
this article has a little more info in it.....
Link - ( New Window )
RE: RE: guaranteed at signing  
giants#1 : 4/20/2017 2:36 pm : link
In comment 13435699 Milton said:
Quote:
In comment 13435673 giants#1 said:


Quote:


means the second he signs the contract he will earn at least that amount.

That part I get.



Quote:


Other guarantees can be contingent on meeting certain goals.

Then they're not guaranteed, are they? So why call them that? That's my point. Why say his contract has $14.5M in guaranteed money if only $10M is actually guaranteed? It's misleading.


They are guaranteed once the vesting requirements are met. The 'guaranteed' term is used to differentiate the money from a base salary which is paid (earned) on a per game basis.
RE: The funny thing is...  
giants#1 : 4/20/2017 2:40 pm : link
In comment 13435730 Milton said:
Quote:
If he were to receive a $4.5M roster bonus in March 18 instead of having it come due as the guaranteed portion of his 2018 salary he would get the money a lot sooner, but then his agent wouldn't get to describe it as "guaranteed" money.

p.s.-- I mean why not just call the whole damn contract as guaranteed because if he plays it out, they have to pay him.


If part of a base salary is guaranteed, then they do call it guaranteed.

The only money that isn't guaranteed is base salary (usually) and incentives. With some of the larger contracts now, you see some or all of the base salary fully guaranteed in the first 2 years of the deal.

Everything else is either fully guaranteed (e.g. signing bonus) or partially guaranteed (e.g. in case of injury, vesting date, offseason requirements, etc). It's 'guaranteed' because they get all of the money (once it vests) even if they get cut whereas base salary/incentives would not be paid in those situations.
It is a strange option........  
Doomster : 4/20/2017 3:55 pm : link
Suppose Hankins sucks the first year...makes no difference, the money is guaranteed......

However, if they cut him before March of 2018, the so-called guaranteed money of 4.5M is not given to him....it basically is a roster bonus, and why they didn't call it that, is beyond me....
Also the numbers don't add up.....  
Doomster : 4/20/2017 4:04 pm : link
Originally, they said he signed for 10M per, which he didn't....

If he plays all 3 years, he gets 25.5M......he has incentives of 1M per, which if reached makes it 28.5.....so he just falls short of 9M per, and it really is only 10M actually guaranteed.....less than what he wanted....but probably that deal was coming off the table, so he signed....
RE: RE: The funny thing is...  
Milton : 4/20/2017 4:20 pm : link
In comment 13435863 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 13435730 Milton said:


Quote:


If he were to receive a $4.5M roster bonus in March 18 instead of having it come due as the guaranteed portion of his 2018 salary he would get the money a lot sooner, but then his agent wouldn't get to describe it as "guaranteed" money.

p.s.-- I mean why not just call the whole damn contract as guaranteed because if he plays it out, they have to pay him.



If part of a base salary is guaranteed, then they do call it guaranteed.

The only money that isn't guaranteed is base salary (usually) and incentives. With some of the larger contracts now, you see some or all of the base salary fully guaranteed in the first 2 years of the deal.

Everything else is either fully guaranteed (e.g. signing bonus) or partially guaranteed (e.g. in case of injury, vesting date, offseason requirements, etc). It's 'guaranteed' because they get all of the money (once it vests) even if they get cut whereas base salary/incentives would not be paid in those situations.
I understand exactly what they are saying and my point is that it's not true that $14.5M is guaranteed. They can fuck around with the semantics all they want in terms of when money "becomes" guaranteed, but he is not guaranteed to make $14.5M on this contract. He is only guaranteed to make $10M.
RE: Also the numbers don't add up.....  
Milton : 4/20/2017 4:22 pm : link
In comment 13436035 Doomster said:
Quote:
Originally, they said he signed for 10M per, which he didn't....

If he plays all 3 years, he gets 25.5M......he has incentives of 1M per, which if reached makes it 28.5.....so he just falls short of 9M per, and it really is only 10M actually guaranteed.....less than what he wanted....but probably that deal was coming off the table, so he signed....
Check out the OTC link. It has additional info about $500K each year that brings it to $27M.
Back to the Corner