Raanan (again) - Giants will NOT be drafting Njoku

of how insane it would be to draft these mediocre offensive lineman over Njoku...

...that's the anti-thesis of their usual approach. So I doubt it strongly.

not being in the conversation

It is amazing how people criticize someone when they give them information they don't want to hear

adamant about Njoku not being the man @ 23 says something.

.

In comment 13442332 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

Quote:

adamant about Njoku not being the man @ 23 says something.

Either it is the largest smoke screen in history, or GASP... he has information that the GIants have no interest in Njoku

In comment 13442327 jlukes said:

Quote:

not being in the conversation It is amazing how people criticize someone when they give them information they don't want to hear

That's quite possible. But also consider that our resident insider, hitdog, who has proven his connections on several times has said they do have some interest in Njoku.

In comment 13442327 jlukes said:

Quote:

not being in the conversation It is amazing how people criticize someone when they give them information they don't want to hear

maybe because of the backfire from the floyd leaks the giants are throwing out misinformation...like canceling his meeting and such...everyone seems to be in love with him or he has a guarantee to be top 20 which is why the giants pulled him off there board...IDK

gets me every time.

Giants would love a pass rusher, a premier TE, and a LT. Leak it to the press!

predicting Bolles is a dart board throw.

If the conversation is, "he just needs another year," Bolles is the last player we will pick.

If the conversation is, "we can probably keep Eli alive for one more year, but we have to do something else," Bolles could be in the conversation as the 2018 starting LT replacement.

In comment 13442332 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

Quote:

adamant about Njoku not being the man @ 23 says something.

Not to mention the Giants canceled Njoku team visit last minute (which to date I have read nothing that says why)

In comment 13442343 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

gets me every time. Giants would love a pass rusher, a premier TE, and a LT. Leak it to the press!

Shocking leaks!

In comment 13442343 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

gets me every time. Giants would love a pass rusher, a premier TE, and a LT. Leak it to the press!

Thanks UConn, you just ruined another draft for the Giants.

.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 13442348 Beer Man said:

Quote:

In comment 13442332 SFGFNCGiantsFan said: Quote: adamant about Njoku not being the man @ 23 says something. Not to mention the Giants canceled Njoku team visit last minute (which to date I have read nothing that says why)

It was a scheduling conflict. Was posted yesterday. He was coming to see the Jets and then also the Giants. But he had another interview the following day and couldn't get to the Giants (IIRC - paraphrasing the post - think Dave TE said what it was.).

Bolles ranked higher than Ramczyk which is interesting. Health concerns but more upside I would imagine with Ram vs. character concerns and peaking with Bolles.

Lineman is not their, chances are good giants will draft the Miami te

think Denver takes Bolles, and Baltimore takes Robinson. The Giants have no interest in Ramczyk, so no OL in the first.

Davis, Charlton, Reddick, Howard, McCaffrey all gone as well.

Look for an edge rusher.

think Lamp goes to Miami at #22.

stuff with Njoku that none of us knows.. I think people get to enamored with a player without really knowing much about him. There is a lot of football we have not seen from him yet and a ton of behind the scenes stuff that none of us knows. Either way I doubt Jordan would say something so emphatically without some knowledge of the situation.

Smokescreens me nothing when you are drafting 23rd in the first round. Who knows how this will shake out. The top of the draft could be very shaky with some serious surprises. Of course, the surprise is usually because we all following the so called "experts" and none of them really know how one team feels about a certain player over another...

a lot earlier than the mocks are telling us.

Sherff at Guard went #5 overall 2 years ago and we were interested in him as well as others, I'm assuming. Weak OL class or not, if Lamp is considered to be the best lineman I can see him getting snatched up early.

If that happens it really shakes things up, and we see something like that happen every year.

But I guess he knows something we don't

Perhaps they are looking for less of a project and more of a "instant coffee" type player, like Bolles or Davis.

Regarding TEs as early draft picks.

if we took Bolles over Lamp or Robinson (assuming they are available, which they were on this mock).

Not only are they younger, but I just think Lamp and Robinson are going to be better pros.

In comment 13442386 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

if we took Bolles over Lamp or Robinson (assuming they are available, which they were on this mock). Not only are they younger, but I just think Lamp and Robinson are going to be better pros.

I think Lamp was taken earlier

In comment 13442362 AcidTest said:

Quote:

think Denver takes Bolles, and Baltimore takes Robinson. The Giants have no interest in Ramczyk, so no OL in the first. Davis, Charlton, Reddick, Howard, McCaffrey all gone as well. Look for an edge rusher.

If edge rusher is the pick I say Bowser or Willis.

will go for his highest rated DE and take his highest rated OL in round two.

The Giants don't value TE, RB and LB like the fans do. They are very reluctant to spend a premium pick there.

In comment 13442386 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

if we took Bolles over Lamp or Robinson (assuming they are available, which they were on this mock). Not only are they younger, but I just think Lamp and Robinson are going to be better pros.

I think all three are gone before we pick. That makes the whole debate over an OL moot. Lamp has the best chance of falling to #23, but Miami is apparently very interested in him.

Watt or Bowser would be my guys if Lamp and Robinson are gone.

In comment 13442391 Rjanyg said:

Quote:

In comment 13442362 AcidTest said: Quote: think Denver takes Bolles, and Baltimore takes Robinson. The Giants have no interest in Ramczyk, so no OL in the first. Davis, Charlton, Reddick, Howard, McCaffrey all gone as well. Look for an edge rusher. If edge rusher is the pick I say Bowser or Willis.

Agreed, but I think it would be Bowser. Better in space. Another small possibility is a trade down to target Rivers.

In comment 13442398 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

Watt or Bowser would be my guys if Lamp and Robinson are gone.

Don't want Watt. Explosive, but very little experience on D, and all those knee surgeries. Pass.

and I'm sure he knows Njoku isn't an option, but I do have a question....

What benefit is it to the Giants to make this known? Is it to be honest with agents and/or players for respect? I don't understand why they would be so adamant about not taking a guy that's being mocked to them.

A guy like Mixon I get, there is PR involved.

they were way too aggressive and adamant about certain targets last season. And nobody had Apple up in that conversation the week prior while named-targets went later. Notice how much more downplayed their articles have been on specific players this week.

Furthermore, if the Giants felt they were subject to too many leaks last year, the prudent play would be to just shut the f-up this year versus throwing even more smokescreens. When 22 guys are going to be picked ahead of you, you think maybe the smoke-screen approach becomes kind of laughable?

In comment 13442407 Jimmy Googs said:

Quote:

they were way too aggressive and adamant about certain targets last season. And nobody had Apple up in that conversation the week prior while named-targets went later. Notice how much more downplayed their articles have been on specific players this week. Furthermore, if the Giants felt they were subject to too many leaks last year, the prudent play would be to just shut the f-up this year versus throwing even more smokescreens. When 22 guys are going to be picked ahead of you, you think maybe the smoke-screen approach becomes kind of laughable?

Last year the beat writers were adamant about a couple of guys and nobody knew the interst in Apple, but all of the guys the beat writers said the Giants were interested in, were taken before us. This makes no sense. It's not like we passed on Floyd for Apple. Clearly the Giants had to change directions based on how it all unfolded.

also always says he goes on his "informed opinion"...nothing straight from Giants brass.

If not a OL the pick will be a pass rusher or a CB. Bank on it.

by beats, and both went later...

Fills a need, big upside, good kid.

- According to Sy his assigned value is right there when we pick (along with the other 3 OL players)
- He has everything you need to be a tackle in the NFL.
- The one knock is overall strength, but frankly a lot of players coming out have that knock and most add strength and weight their first year. Its fairly common, even Pugh did it.
- We were told that Fluker was brought in as a Guard (then it was reported that he would compete for both spots later). If we take this on face value, then drafting a Tackle makes sense
- They have also said they are open to moving Flowers. Again, this makes picking a Tackle make sense. Let it play out who is RT & LT
- Bolles fits the Tackle pick. Ram is coming off injury (a big Giants red flag), and lots of people think Lamp and Robinson are NFL guards. Bolles, it can be argued, is the purest Tackle in the draft.

In comment 13442431 Jimmy Googs said:

Quote:

by beats, and both went later...

Discussed by who? BBI'ers? The Giants expressed interest in Floyd and Conklin who were both taken right before them.

but I am pretty sure nobody in the Giant's front office told him they would not draft Njoku. Even if they did decide that, there is zero advantage is saying that before the draft. If they did, it is a story they are planting. But that is also pointless because no other NFL team is making a draft decision based on that information.

Chances are Ranaan is basing it on the fact that the Giants do not typically spend premium draft picks on non-premium positions (as they see it). They draft DEs, DBs, WRs and Olinemen in the first round. I think he would have same the same certainty about any TE, DT, RB, or LB.

In comment 13442447 Mike from Ohio said:

Quote:

but I am pretty sure nobody in the Giant's front office told him they would not draft Njoku. Even if they did decide that, there is zero advantage is saying that before the draft. If they did, it is a story they are planting. But that is also pointless because no other NFL team is making a draft decision based on that information. Chances are Ranaan is basing it on the fact that the Giants do not typically spend premium draft picks on non-premium positions (as they see it). They draft DEs, DBs, WRs and Olinemen in the first round. I think he would have same the same certainty about any TE, DT, RB, or LB.

I agree. I also can't see another GM seeing this report and making any sort of opinion on who they are drafting one way or another. This isn't Hold Em', there's a lot at play here and you need to trust your scouts and process, whatever that may be.

but didn't have accuracy beyond those two.

.

do you have any proof of that? I remember tons of talk about Floyd and Conklin.

The value at #23 doesnt matchup as well for WR or DE, the other premium NYG positions, or for OL which many would consider a need.

The situation with Conley will impact the board for CBs, but I still think TD White could be in play. NYG like the position, school and conference.

Personally I would go playmaker at TE or RB if we could but I anticipate Howard, Njoku, Cook and McCaffrey will all be off the board by 23.

just saying more players were discussed as well. Absolutely recall most, if not all. sports media writeups had Hargreaves before Apple. Not digging up proof...

out of your a**. Most writers believed Heargraves was above Apple, but were the Giants saying that they liked him better than Apple? No.

Against the 30.

So canceling it was very significant. Doesn't seem like a smokescreen to me.

In comment 13442501 Chris684 said:

Quote:

The value at #23 doesnt matchup as well for WR or DE, the other premium NYG positions, or for OL which many would consider a need. The situation with Conley will impact the board for CBs, but I still think TD White could be in play. NYG like the position, school and conference. Personally I would go playmaker at TE or RB if we could but I anticipate Howard, Njoku, Cook and McCaffrey will all be off the board by 23.

Hitdog has said he doesn't think the pick will be a DB or DL. Of course it's impossible to predict right now, but he's the most accurate when it comes to Giants info.

I said the same thing and was told CB and OL unlikely.

OL or DL?

Njoku freakish athlete and young

that they aren't picking Njoku.

Accept it.

In comment 13442501 Chris684 said:

Quote:

The value at #23 doesnt matchup as well for WR or DE, the other premium NYG positions, or for OL which many would consider a need. The situation with Conley will impact the board for CBs, but I still think TD White could be in play. NYG like the position, school and conference. Personally I would go playmaker at TE or RB if we could but I anticipate Howard, Njoku, Cook and McCaffrey will all be off the board by 23.

But Engram won't.He would be a perfect fit for this passing game, making it all-world.I don't think he'll be around in the 2nd round for us & Mayock just rated Engram as his #24th best player!

In comment 13442434 PatersonPlank said:

Quote:

- According to Sy his assigned value is right there when we pick (along with the other 3 OL players) - He has everything you need to be a tackle in the NFL. - The one knock is overall strength, but frankly a lot of players coming out have that knock and most add strength and weight their first year. Its fairly common, even Pugh did it. - We were told that Fluker was brought in as a Guard (then it was reported that he would compete for both spots later). If we take this on face value, then drafting a Tackle makes sense - They have also said they are open to moving Flowers. Again, this makes picking a Tackle make sense. Let it play out who is RT & LT - Bolles fits the Tackle pick. Ram is coming off injury (a big Giants red flag), and lots of people think Lamp and Robinson are NFL guards. Bolles, it can be argued, is the purest Tackle in the draft.

Bolles seems like the anti-Flowers.

Doesn't Dave like Lamp better?

OL ... if a DE they really like is there, he's probably the pick ... but it's a lean crop, the hybrid OLBs included.

Based on what I'm hearing the past 24 hours, it might add to hoping Mahomes or McCaffrey or Corey Davis slips to them.

In comment 13442551 Jay in Toronto said:

Quote:

In comment 13442434 PatersonPlank said: Quote: Bolles seems like the anti-Flowers. Doesn't Dave like Lamp better?

Dave does indeed like Lamp better. Infact Dave thinks Bolles is overrated and was helped by his OG at Utah.

"If you read my comments here, without Asiata helping him on combo blocks, etc., he�s �just a guy.� "

In comment 13442552 JonC said:

Quote:

OL ... if a DE they really like is there, he's probably the pick ... but it's a lean crop, the hybrid OLBs included. Based on what I'm hearing the past 24 hours, it might add to hoping Mahomes or McCaffrey or Corey Davis slips to them.

Not Mahommes please Lord. McCaffrey I could deal with, especially if they sign Blount. Davis would be pretty amazing too. But where does he fit? 4 wide set with OBJ and Shepard in the slots?

In comment 13442552 JonC said:

Quote:

OL ... if a DE they really like is there, he's probably the pick ... but it's a lean crop, the hybrid OLBs included. Based on what I'm hearing the past 24 hours, it might add to hoping Mahomes or McCaffrey or Corey Davis slips to them.

Jon, I get the feeling they might move up if a top player like McCaffrey slips a little. Do you think that might be in the cards?

Didn't you say you'd heard Davis and Howard?

In comment 13442545 LakeGeorgeGiant said:

Quote:

that they aren't picking Njoku. Accept it.

People aren't accepting it because he fits the things (athleticism, age) that the Giants seem to prioritize with their first pick. Garret Bolles, OTOH, is the antithesis of a player they draft. He's older than Odell. He's way older than Landon Collins, Ereck Flowers, and Eli Apple. He's 4 months younger than Jonathan Hankins, who just completed his rookie contract.

It's entirely possible the Giants don't draft Njoku for some reason or another. But he has the profile of a Giants high draft pick. Bolles doesn't. If they do draft Bolles, I think it says a lot more about their need at the position than how they view the individual player.

and whether they like him for 23.
jordan probably right on the latter. doesnt mean they dont like him (and the 3 TEs).

In comment 13442545 LakeGeorgeGiant said:

Quote:

that they aren't picking Njoku. Accept it.

Based on what? Is Raanan Jerry Reese?

In comment 13442590 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

Quote:

In comment 13442545 LakeGeorgeGiant said: Quote: that they aren't picking Njoku. Accept it. People aren't accepting it because he fits the things (athleticism, age) that the Giants seem to prioritize with their first pick. Garret Bolles, OTOH, is the antithesis of a player they draft. He's older than Odell. He's way older than Landon Collins, Ereck Flowers, and Eli Apple. He's 4 months younger than Jonathan Hankins, who just completed his rookie contract. It's entirely possible the Giants don't draft Njoku for some reason or another. But he has the profile of a Giants high draft pick. Bolles doesn't. If they do draft Bolles, I think it says a lot more about their need at the position than how they view the individual player.

You aren't factoring in what we deem a premier position into the above. You can make a case for Bolles and Njoku but only 1 plays a position that we usually covet in round 1. What holds more value is yet to be seen...

but everything is pointing away from Njoku.

I don't see how he "fits the mold". Reese is fairly consistent with positions he drafts in round 1. TE isn't among them. Taking Njoku would be very much out of character.

I think some fans want Njoku and are desperately arguing with anyone that says he won't be the pick. They are collectively covering their ears and shouting "la la la Njoku."

Imo there will be a lot of good options at 23, but the Njoku brigade has tunnel vision right now.

In comment 13442622 Anakim said:

Quote:

In comment 13442545 LakeGeorgeGiant said: Quote: that they aren't picking Njoku. Accept it. Based on what? Is Raanan Jerry Reese?

...and this Giants regime's tendencies, and hotdog, and JonC, and Dave, and the fact that they cancelled his visit.

Are you being willfully dense?

Not hotdog ;)

In comment 13442631 LakeGeorgeGiant said:

Quote:

but everything is pointing away from Njoku. I don't see how he "fits the mold". Reese is fairly consistent with positions he drafts in round 1. TE isn't among them. Taking Njoku would be very much out of character. I think some fans want Njoku and are desperately arguing with anyone that says he won't be the pick. They are collectively covering their ears and shouting "la la la Njoku." Imo there will be a lot of good options at 23, but the Njoku brigade has tunnel vision right now.

I just don't get your reasoning. Yeah, we haven't taken a TE in the first round under Reese's watch, but Njoku is a young, extremely athletic, high character guy that fits the mold of what Reese likes in the first round (see: JPP, OBJ, Ereck Flowers and Eli Apple).

In comment 13442633 LakeGeorgeGiant said:

Quote:

In comment 13442622 Anakim said: Quote: In comment 13442545 LakeGeorgeGiant said: Quote: that they aren't picking Njoku. Accept it. Based on what? Is Raanan Jerry Reese? ...and this Giants regime's tendencies, and hotdog, and JonC, and Dave, and the fact that they cancelled his visit. Are you being willfully dense?

So because they cancelled his visit it means that he's not going to be the pick? You realize that over the course of the past few years, the Giants don't bring in a lot of prospects to work out and they've shown that they're more than willing to take someone that they haven't shown that much interest in.

You mentioned on another thread you don't know where the notion came from that they don't like him. Is he a guy they like but not at 23 or do you think they like him maybe at 23?

Bolles is like Flowers with a McAdoo Hair cut

In comment 13442638 Anakim said:

Quote:

In comment 13442631 LakeGeorgeGiant said: Quote: but everything is pointing away from Njoku. I don't see how he "fits the mold". Reese is fairly consistent with positions he drafts in round 1. TE isn't among them. Taking Njoku would be very much out of character. I think some fans want Njoku and are desperately arguing with anyone that says he won't be the pick. They are collectively covering their ears and shouting "la la la Njoku." Imo there will be a lot of good options at 23, but the Njoku brigade has tunnel vision right now. I just don't get your reasoning. Yeah, we haven't taken a TE in the first round under Reese's watch, but Njoku is a young, extremely athletic, high character guy that fits the mold of what Reese likes in the first round (see: JPP, OBJ, Ereck Flowers and Eli Apple).

That is the reasoning. We value TE less than the norm. For Njoku to be the pick, he'd have to be very much ahead of the next ranked guy at a premium position. He's also not the only young, athletic, high character guy that will be an option at 23, so there's that too.

just about every game you see him getting off balance or overextended in pass blocking. Sometimes he gets caught reaching, other pulled around by the DE. If that is a quickly correctable flaw, then it might work out okay. Seems like a pretty decent run blocker with good feet & athletic ability.

Not in my top for preferred picks, but there is some talent there at least.

In comment 13442501 Chris684 said:

Quote:

The value at #23 doesnt matchup as well for WR or DE, the other premium NYG positions, or for OL which many would consider a need. The situation with Conley will impact the board for CBs, but I still think TD White could be in play. NYG like the position, school and conference. Personally I would go playmaker at TE or RB if we could but I anticipate Howard, Njoku, Cook and McCaffrey will all be off the board by 23.

The value at #23 lines up perfectly for the top 4 OL players. Look at Sy's ratings for one example. All 4 are 79-83, which is late first round approximately.

In comment 13442655 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

In comment 13442638 Anakim said: Quote: In comment 13442631 LakeGeorgeGiant said: Quote: but everything is pointing away from Njoku. I don't see how he "fits the mold". Reese is fairly consistent with positions he drafts in round 1. TE isn't among them. Taking Njoku would be very much out of character. I think some fans want Njoku and are desperately arguing with anyone that says he won't be the pick. They are collectively covering their ears and shouting "la la la Njoku." Imo there will be a lot of good options at 23, but the Njoku brigade has tunnel vision right now. I just don't get your reasoning. Yeah, we haven't taken a TE in the first round under Reese's watch, but Njoku is a young, extremely athletic, high character guy that fits the mold of what Reese likes in the first round (see: JPP, OBJ, Ereck Flowers and Eli Apple). That is the reasoning. We value TE less than the norm. For Njoku to be the pick, he'd have to be very much ahead of the next ranked guy at a premium position. He's also not the only young, athletic, high character guy that will be an option at 23, so there's that too.

"We value TE less than the norm" - we also value linebackers less than the norm but that didn't stop us from being interested in Leonard Floyd and presumably in Davis and Cunningham.

we clearly liked his pass rush capabilities or he wouldn't have been in the convo that high.

I don't know why you are so defensive on this.

is because he will be gone before the Giants pick ..

In comment 13442673 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

we clearly liked his pass rush capabilities or he wouldn't have been in the convo that high. I don't know why you are so defensive on this.

OK, so would you be willing to say that Cunningham and Davis are out of the question at 23?

in the war room. I don't know if the Giants are interested in Njoku or not but neither does anyone else here barring the fact that they're a Giants insider.

In comment 13442676 Anakim said:

Quote:

In comment 13442673 UConn4523 said: Quote: we clearly liked his pass rush capabilities or he wouldn't have been in the convo that high. I don't know why you are so defensive on this. OK, so would you be willing to say that Cunningham and Davis are out of the question at 23?

I think 23 is a whole different ball game than 10 (Floyd). Cunningham doesn't seem to have the same length and seems to be a notch below Floyd in explosion. I'm guessing he won't be the pick (although the value at 23 vs. 10 can offset that). I suspect Davis will be in play due to wanting that every-down LBer who can run sideline to sideline, maybe we break the mold here.

With no more Hankins I'm also wondering if that alters the need to draft another playmaker on D (Davis for this argument) vs. adding a TE in round 1 when we've already improved our offense with Marshall/Ellison. I don't think Njoku will be out of consideration, but I'm guessing there will be other players ranked higher by the time its out pick.

In comment 13442516 Keith said:

Quote:

out of your a**. Most writers believed Heargraves was above Apple, but were the Giants saying that they liked him better than Apple? No.

Never said Giants weren't targeting Apple all along. That's my point. People don't know.

The beats never had him linked and were talking Hargreaves if anything happened at corner.

In comment 13442638 Anakim said:

Quote:

In comment 13442631 LakeGeorgeGiant said: Quote: but everything is pointing away from Njoku. I don't see how he "fits the mold". Reese is fairly consistent with positions he drafts in round 1. TE isn't among them. Taking Njoku would be very much out of character. I think some fans want Njoku and are desperately arguing with anyone that says he won't be the pick. They are collectively covering their ears and shouting "la la la Njoku." Imo there will be a lot of good options at 23, but the Njoku brigade has tunnel vision right now. I just don't get your reasoning. Yeah, we haven't taken a TE in the first round under Reese's watch, but Njoku is a young, extremely athletic, high character guy that fits the mold of what Reese likes in the first round (see: JPP, OBJ, Ereck Flowers and Eli Apple).

Normally you are correct about the process. Those previous picks are fair analogies to Njoku, based on youth, character, and athletic upside.

The bottom line: Ranaan has this called correctly. As hitdog mentioned, the team does not dislike Njoku. He's just not a 1st round player to them based on his one dimensionality. David Njoku is not a complete enough football player right now to be the 23rd pick.

Thrill Ride has used the term repeatedly: "risk aversion." That's how Jerry and co. operate in the 1st round. No matter how athletic Njoku looks, drafting him in hopes of teaching him to play TE constitutes risk. That's the organizational attitude.

on a player like Flowers and apparently are really high on the possibility of taking a player like Mahomes (or Watson) in the first this year.

Digging back further, it's not like Wilson or JPP were considered safe first rounders either.

is a pipe dream, he's going top 12.

In comment 13442766 Devon said:

Quote:

on a player like Flowers and apparently are really high on the possibility of taking a player like Mahomes (or Watson) in the first this year. Digging back further, it's not like Wilson or JPP were considered safe first rounders either.

All of the guys you mentioned had really high grades internally, especially Wilson (they loved him).

Admittedly, they preferred Scherf to Flowers but went 5th to Washington.

Every pick has some degree of risk, or projection, baked into it. JPP was a very unpopular pick based on his very limited body of work at USF.

From The Org perspective, the riskiest propositions involve medical (Gurley, Ramcyzk, Foster) and character (Tunsil).

Maybe this isn't the best conversational detour for David Njoku -- the team is just unconvinced he'll be a good enough two-way TE to justify pick 23. Remember, TE is a very cerebral position based on both the route definitons and blocking assignments -- that's a lot to learn for guy like Njoku who has not been playing TE very long.

Stated differently, the "risk" is that they'd be forgoing a more complete NFL player to take him, and he might be too much of project to get on the field and impact early in his career.

Do the Giants devalue TEs? Thrill Ride does not buy that narrative at all. We really liked Tyler Eifert in '13 but went with Pugh. And the player we wanted at #40 last year was Hunter Henry from Arkansas but the Chargers took hm 35th and we settled for Sterling.

In comment 13442692 Jimmy Googs said:

Quote:

In comment 13442516 Keith said: Quote: out of your a**. Most writers believed Heargraves was above Apple, but were the Giants saying that they liked him better than Apple? No. Never said Giants weren't targeting Apple all along. That's my point. People don't know. The beats never had him linked and were talking Hargreaves if anything happened at corner.

I understand what you are saying, but here is what you aren't getting.....A writer can have an opinion, but they can also pass along information they know. J-Raan is passing along information that the Giants won't draft Njoku at 23, but he also gives his opinion that they will draft Bolles.

Last year, the beats were givin information that the Gmen liked Floyd and Conklin, but their opinion was that Heargraves>Apple.

I was just saying he may not know but his opinion is that they won't draft Njoku.

In comment 13442654 ghost718 said:

Quote:

Bolles is like Flowers with a McAdoo Hair cut

Bolles is literally the complete opposite of Flowers. Bolles positives are his feet and athletic ability. His negative is his strength and age. Flowers positive was his strength and his age. His negative was his athletic ability.

than we should draft a Pro Bowl LT...

In comment 13442825 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

Bolles is literally the complete opposite of Flowers. Bolles positives are his feet and athletic ability. His negative is his strength and age. Flowers positive was his strength and his age. His negative was his athletic ability.

Yeah well,I don't see it like that.Flowers was considered a better athlete than your giving him credit.As far as strength,both look top heavy to me,and both are known for there dispositions.

I'm a fan of Njoku but can understand why NYG would not be inclined to pick him at 23. It's not that they don't like him. It may simply come down to they already have a young TE on the roster in Jerell Adams.

Certainly Adams isn't the overall Athlete or has the natural hands of the top 3 guys, but he doesn't compare poorly to this year's TE class. Fan's often overvalue combine performances but just to use as comparison Adams would come out pretty good. Last year he was a top performer in 40 yds, vertical, 3 cone, & both shuttles. If he was competing this year, he would do the same. For example, his 40 time was the same as Njoku and his vertical was a lot better than Howard.

In comment 13442638 Anakim said:

Quote:

In comment 13442631 LakeGeorgeGiant said: Quote: but everything is pointing away from Njoku. I don't see how he "fits the mold". Reese is fairly consistent with positions he drafts in round 1. TE isn't among them. Taking Njoku would be very much out of character. I think some fans want Njoku and are desperately arguing with anyone that says he won't be the pick. They are collectively covering their ears and shouting "la la la Njoku." Imo there will be a lot of good options at 23, but the Njoku brigade has tunnel vision right now. I just don't get your reasoning. Yeah, we haven't taken a TE in the first round under Reese's watch, but Njoku is a young, extremely athletic, high character guy that fits the mold of what Reese likes in the first round (see: JPP, OBJ, Ereck Flowers and Eli Apple).

Fits the mold perhaps in terms of athletic ability, but the Giants don't simply draft the youngest best lathlete with a clean record.

You are leaving out the factor that likely has more sway over their decision making process: positional value. We have almost ten years of track record to go by where we can infer pretty easily that the Giants put a premium on WR, DE, CB ahead of other positions. People have been clamoring for TE since Shockey ended, and year after year that position does not show up in the early rounds.

We take every opportunity to try force the rationalization that THIS is the year they do it, and they don't. It's just not important to them.

In comment 13442618 hitdog42 said:

Quote:

and whether they like him for 23. jordan probably right on the latter. doesnt mean they dont like him (and the 3 TEs).

You are correct on this. I'm not saying they don't like them at all. I mean they won't take em at 23 unless it's Howard.

But if they were ever to slide back, gain picks, and draft Njoku I'd be thrilled.

In comment 13442411 Keith said:

Quote:

In comment 13442407 Jimmy Googs said: Quote: they were way too aggressive and adamant about certain targets last season. And nobody had Apple up in that conversation the week prior while named-targets went later. Notice how much more downplayed their articles have been on specific players this week. Furthermore, if the Giants felt they were subject to too many leaks last year, the prudent play would be to just shut the f-up this year versus throwing even more smokescreens. When 22 guys are going to be picked ahead of you, you think maybe the smoke-screen approach becomes kind of laughable? Last year the beat writers were adamant about a couple of guys and nobody knew the interst in Apple, but all of the guys the beat writers said the Giants were interested in, were taken before us. This makes no sense. It's not like we passed on Floyd for Apple. Clearly the Giants had to change directions based on how it all unfolded.

Last year the Giants had the 10th pick in the draft. It's a lot easier to predict how the first ten prospects will come off the board than it is to predict how the first 23 prospects will come off the board. The added uncertainty means it's easier for teams drafting late to mask their likes and dislikes. It's harder to pretend you don't like a top ten prospect than it is to pretend you don't like a prospect projected to go in the 20-30 range.

As I've said before, we were spoiled by picking in the top 12 the past few years and now we are applying the same dynamics to drafting at #23 that we witnessed drafting at #10. It's a very different world drafting in the back third of round 1 than it is drafting in the top third.

that while the Giants do clearly prefer drafting premium positions in the first round, that does not mean they will not stray from that. David Wilson was a first round pick from this front office.

Yes, I know he was the last pick in the first round, but I am trying to illustrate that while it is unlikely the Giants don't take a premium position, it is not some sacrosanct rule they follow.

In comment 13442552 JonC said:

Quote:

Based on what I'm hearing the past 24 hours, it might add to hoping Mahomes or McCaffrey or Corey Davis slips to them.

This. My uninformed instinct is that if Corey Davis is there, they are running to the podium.

Feel the same that the number of variables involved at #23 pick are exponential to picking in top 10.

To the point that media/beats honing in on just a few key targets is not practical, even with inside info.

Going to be a long night Thursday before our guys get to the podium.

which is nice for a change...

In comment 13442348 Beer Man said:

Quote:

In comment 13442332 SFGFNCGiantsFan said: Quote: adamant about Njoku not being the man @ 23 says something. Not to mention the Giants canceled Njoku team visit last minute (which to date I have read nothing that says why)

I saw or heard something that said there was a scheduling snafu and he was scheduled for the Jets at the same time. Not sure I buy it -- if it was just that, why not reschedule?

Giants Daily‏
@NYGDaily

Draft Rumor: Per @nfldraftscout, New York Giants would "jump at the chance" to draft Miami TE David Njoku.

In comment 13444029 Anakim said:

Quote:

Giants Daily‏ @NYGDaily Draft Rumor: Per @nfldraftscout, New York Giants would "jump at the chance" to draft Miami TE David Njoku.

Maybe they're trying to do a better job of keeping their preferences under wraps than they did last year.

In comment 13442444 Keith said:

Quote:

In comment 13442431 Jimmy Googs said: Quote: by beats, and both went later... Discussed by who? BBI'ers? The Giants expressed interest in Floyd and Conklin who were both taken right before them.

Says who? 4 of the 23 outlets said so?

No one really know anything right now. No one really knew anything last year. Anyone can connect the dots and report inside info when all it really is is guesswork based on analysis. You guys have to know that.

For every real leak there are fake leaks. Even if some of the leaks were true there is too much misinformation. The truth gets lost in the haze. Dozens of reporters have confirmed that they are lied to over and over this time of year.

In comment 13444029 Anakim said:

Quote:

Giants Daily‏ @NYGDaily Draft Rumor: Per @nfldraftscout, New York Giants would "jump at the chance" to draft Miami TE David Njoku.

Lol. I rest my case.

It's lying season.

For coming at him like 2 years ago pretty hard, maybe a year ago.

Reese blew it off but maybe now he's playing his card and leaking this to Raanan as a nice smoke cloud

In comment 13442909 Mike from Ohio said:

Quote:

that while the Giants do clearly prefer drafting premium positions in the first round, that does not mean they will not stray from that. David Wilson was a first round pick from this front office. Yes, I know he was the last pick in the first round, but I am trying to illustrate that while it is unlikely the Giants don't take a premium position, it is not some sacrosanct rule they follow.

Point taken, Flowers represents breaking that pattern too, but even then he checked the size/measurables chart for a prototype LT.

And picking at the back of the round gives a good bit more leeway. It's why I'm not dismissing it entirely, but I still don't think it makes sense given the needs they have at those positions we know they value highly.

Is why would the Giants leak who they are NOT drafting to reportersif not disinformation? What fucking good does this do them? Jordan, if you're reading this, I am not calling you a liar, but obv you got permission to have this on the record. Why on Earth would the Giants want you to report on who they are or are not taking? I am serious with the question...what good does it do?

The idea that they would let this slip after what happened last year is so fucking Mickey Mouse and stupid that I almost don't believe it.

Please somebody help me with this

In comment 13442891 JordanRaanan said:

Quote:

In comment 13442618 hitdog42 said: Quote: and whether they like him for 23. jordan probably right on the latter. doesnt mean they dont like him (and the 3 TEs). You are correct on this. I'm not saying they don't like them at all. I mean they won't take em at 23 unless it's Howard.

Jordan.

Thrill Ride here. Still down in the trenches defending your work. Each year, your sources have pretty sharp intel. Keep doing what youre doing and don't let the NARPs drag you down!!

The Thrill Ride hears his own whispers and agrees about Njoku not being a complete enough TE to earn the 23rd pick.

Unless the stars align and Howard falls, Thrill narrows it to Jarrad Davis (your #1 likeliest), Adoree (still insist he's on our radar big-time), and Bolles (seemingly a necessity pick here but evidently they do like him).

If I'm right, we should exchange emails and totally hang out together right now.

-- T.Ride

In comment 13444085 chopperhatch said:

Quote:

Is why would the Giants leak who they are NOT drafting to reportersif not disinformation? What fucking good does this do them? Jordan, if you're reading this, I am not calling you a liar, but obv you got permission to have this on the record. Why on Earth would the Giants want you to report on who they are or are not taking? I am serious with the question...what good does it do? The idea that they would let this slip after what happened last year is so fucking Mickey Mouse and stupid that I almost don't believe it. Please somebody help me with this

You can't understand why teams leak fake draft interest?

If the Giants leak 5 different players to one batch of reporters and 5 more to another batch of reporters...mission accomplished, no one really knows who the Giants pick.

I can't believe how confounding this thing is. It shouldn't be. Every single year we go through the same process. Local reporters all sling different names around. 4-5 might get the first round right. 4-5 don't.

If you were running a team and draft how would you handle the local media? Do you really think Reese is telling any of these writers the truth? Even if some scout or personnel guy leaked the truth, it's lost within the haze of lies. It's impossible to tell truth from fiction.

they are doing their job. But how on earth do you know that Jordan "got permission to release this info?" What info?

Where does Jordan say "I have spoken to the Giants and they confirmed they won't draft Njoku?" ----nowhere did Jordan say that. He merely stated his opinion. It's an opinion that is rooted in research some sources, but there is nothing concrete here.

It's a writers opinion.

but that OL is holding them back they need to protect eli more than ever and get more out of their running game so bolles,lamp and ramzchk need to at least be considered at 23
or garcia in the 2nd

couple of others could be good later rounds where i hope they find someone to knock jerry into a backup role finally a OG with possible RT options as neither fluker or hart look to be the answer possibly move pugh out to OT and slot hart or the draft pick in at OG? they need to fix the OL even with the poor draft class they need to do something about it

even if you like another player or position better or dont rate them highly enough i can agree with that but they badly need to upgrade the OL if they plan going deeper into the playoffs this year and not getting eli killed by his OL

TE i would hope is in the mix roaming the middle of the field with obj,shepard,vereen and marshall in that line up a threat TE could open things up for the outside WR,improve the redzone scoring potential and drag that safety out the box to relieve some pressure on the run game. guys i personally like for that would njoku,engram and shaheen

hankins loss pushes the need at DT up to anywhere between 2-4 rounds,a deep CB class and the continued mutterings about DRC means i can see CB being addressed earlier than many fans think as well round 3 maybe def before the 6th

i would like blount but smith towards the end of the draft looks like a good alternative also,ideally sign blount and draft smith starter and develop the future starter there as well