In four years. He might turn out to be a very good player but it sure seems like we are spinning our wheels.
Did we not need to replace Jonathan Hankins?
I don't have a strong negative feeling toward Tomlinson but I do question the strategy or philosophy that seems to lead us to have to recycle DTs every four years. It's hard to get better at other positions when that is the case.
Excepting of course that 4yrs ago the Giants had a historically bad defense.
Does not play like an NFL player. Can't engage and shed, instantly swallowed, painfully slow/lacks quick twitch, I just don't see it. I hope I'm wrong, I don't have a trained eye by any stretch, but wow am I disappointed by this pick. Would have MUCH rather had Wormley if they are gonna go DT. Bummed. More bummed that Walker went 3 picks before us.
Have you ever played DT? Have you ever coached DL?
Nope. Didn't think so. You sound ridiculous with all due respect.
Certainly never have claimed to. In fact, most of my posts I preface with the fact I don't have the prowess of anything near a scout, or anything of that nature. I just don't see the qualities I would have liked in a DT. I don't understand the vitriol.
We really need an OT, and the top tier of guys who might turn out to be year 1 starters seemed to be gone early in the 2nd...in a deep year, would it be worth it to try to trade up, and what would it cost? Or would it be better to have skipped TE in favor of an OL in 1st (any except Bolles at that point), but several TE's went between our 1st and 2nd. Engram likely would be gone, and several other options.
I'm guessing the Giants weren't overly impressed with this OT class, and we really should be OK on the OL interior. We need OT help, but they haven't given up on Flowers yet, and him improving really is our best hope, and certainly possible. Maybe they hit with Fluker at RT, or Hart develops. Maybe they feel like there's a guy in the next tier that they can grab in the 3rd, who is maybe not a huge drop from the top tier, who all had questions this year (injury, playing time, production/consistency, etc). But they can't make a guy appear if he isn't there this year, they can't always find a trade down (tho certainly possible they had more chances than we know about), and we don't know how they have these guys rated - it's always funny when I see 'They could have had him X picks later, should've traded down' - never a guarantee, and if you like the guys better to pull the trigger.
Here's hoping these are good picks, they pan out and contribute next year, and help keep our D playing like the 2nd half and help our O look more like 2 years agon than last year (when we didn't have a great OL either, but managed some rushing). I'd love to see them add an OT, and a RB to complement Perkins, but can't complain about the positions addressed so far, and I won't claim to know which guys will be good or who would have been picked when...
He adds nothing to the pass rush. I'm just very disappointed.
Had had 70 QB hurries @ Alabama. It doesn't sound like you really know much of anything about this player considering how much you're complaining about him.
Again, from what I've seen, albeit limited to less than a season worth of his games, a lot of his production as far as pass rush goes seems to have been a product of who he's playing with as opposed to his own ability.
I'm happy to defer to those who know more, and would be ecstatic to be wrong. God knows I have been before. I just don't see "it" as a pass rusher/pressure up the middle. He looks like he'll be a good contributor as far as playing the run goes, but I fear he's another 2 down DT is all.
He adds nothing to the pass rush. I'm just very disappointed.
Had had 70 QB hurries @ Alabama. It doesn't sound like you really know much of anything about this player considering how much you're complaining about him.
Again, from what I've seen, albeit limited to less than a season worth of his games, a lot of his production as far as pass rush goes seems to have been a product of who he's playing with as opposed to his own ability.
I'm happy to defer to those who know more, and would be ecstatic to be wrong. God knows I have been before. I just don't see "it" as a pass rusher/pressure up the middle. He looks like he'll be a good contributor as far as playing the run goes, but I fear he's another 2 down DT is all.
This would have been a completely reasonable reaction to the pick to begin with - but instead, you basically threw up your arms and acted like Reese traded away an entire draft for a kicker.
Tomlinson is going to pair well with Harrison. He's not Aaron Donald but he doesn't need to be. This team created a run stuffing identity last year and it's important to retain that strength. Tomlinson allows us to do that. He can play on passing downs. He's not going to put up sack numbers but he does get penetration from time to time and can push the pocket.
I'm not a scout and I don't know as much as guys like Dave or Sy but I do root for Alabama and watch all of their games and I can assure you that DT is a good player and will be a good fit for our defense.
He adds nothing to the pass rush. I'm just very disappointed.
Had had 70 QB hurries @ Alabama. It doesn't sound like you really know much of anything about this player considering how much you're complaining about him.
Again, from what I've seen, albeit limited to less than a season worth of his games, a lot of his production as far as pass rush goes seems to have been a product of who he's playing with as opposed to his own ability.
I'm happy to defer to those who know more, and would be ecstatic to be wrong. God knows I have been before. I just don't see "it" as a pass rusher/pressure up the middle. He looks like he'll be a good contributor as far as playing the run goes, but I fear he's another 2 down DT is all.
This would have been a completely reasonable reaction to the pick to begin with - but instead, you basically threw up your arms and acted like Reese traded away an entire draft for a kicker.
Tomlinson is going to pair well with Harrison. He's not Aaron Donald but he doesn't need to be. This team created a run stuffing identity last year and it's important to retain that strength. Tomlinson allows us to do that. He can play on passing downs. He's not going to put up sack numbers but he does get penetration from time to time and can push the pocket.
I'm not a scout and I don't know as much as guys like Dave or Sy but I do root for Alabama and watch all of their games and I can assure you that DT is a good player and will be a good fit for our defense.
Fair enough, definitely a knee jerk reaction on my part. Simply put, I personally don't see what I wanted for this defense from this player at this position. He's a Giant, I'm gonna root my ass off for him, and hope that you're right and I'm wrong.
I hope he enjoys his limited time in NY before moving on for his second contract.
Dumber comments the later it gets. People actually believe the Giants are drsfting players in the second round because on 2 games per year. Games they swept last year.
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push, even when single teamed. What do you see in this video that excites you? I ask that genuinely, not to be an ass. Link - ( New Window )
more and more. Look, say what you want about the flashy guys or the guys considered to have more talent. You need to bring effort every Sunday to be a starter in this league and this guy not only has talent, but you can tell he's gonna be a Harrison type effort guy every play. Remember, first 2 rounds we need guys with really high floors. Won't have to worry about this guy getting his shit pushed in by anyone out there. Love it. Oh, and we have like, no good DTs besides Harrison. If we went DT in round 1 that would have been more than justified.
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Another DT who won't be on the team Â
In four years. He might turn out to be a very good player but it sure seems like we are spinning our wheels.
Did we not need to replace Jonathan Hankins?
I don't have a strong negative feeling toward Tomlinson but I do question the strategy or philosophy that seems to lead us to have to recycle DTs every four years. It's hard to get better at other positions when that is the case.
It's a necessary evil in the cap era. The Giants seem to feel they can continue to find replacement DT's every few years in the draft instead of re-upping a guy they already have. You can't pay every guy you draft when his rookie deal is up. It's just the nature of the league. You're going to lose talent somewhere and are going to need to replace it with a less costly player.
Not sure what people would rather do. Pay Hankins 10M a year so that we can draft another position but then get crunched somewhere else because we're now committed to Hankins?
Cap resources are finite. This is just how it goes.
What do you know about the cap. Under the new CBA, I guess you didn't notice, the league has increased the cap by 10 to 12 million the last four years. Except for Dallas, teams re-signed almost all of their core free agents.
You pay another couple of million to keep Hankins, who you know is a good player, and use your 2nd round pick to upgrade a much-needed-position. There's no assurance that Tomlinson will be as good as Joseph or Hankins. And there's the two ACLs.
Jerry just doesn't do the draft well. Another opinion
In four years. He might turn out to be a very good player but it sure seems like we are spinning our wheels.
Did we not need to replace Jonathan Hankins?
I don't have a strong negative feeling toward Tomlinson but I do question the strategy or philosophy that seems to lead us to have to recycle DTs every four years. It's hard to get better at other positions when that is the case.
It's a necessary evil in the cap era. The Giants seem to feel they can continue to find replacement DT's every few years in the draft instead of re-upping a guy they already have. You can't pay every guy you draft when his rookie deal is up. It's just the nature of the league. You're going to lose talent somewhere and are going to need to replace it with a less costly player.
Not sure what people would rather do. Pay Hankins 10M a year so that we can draft another position but then get crunched somewhere else because we're now committed to Hankins?
Cap resources are finite. This is just how it goes.
What do you know about the cap. Under the new CBA, I guess you didn't notice, the league has increased the cap by 10 to 12 million the last four years. Except for Dallas, teams re-signed almost all of their core free agents.
You pay another couple of million to keep Hankins, who you know is a good player, and use your 2nd round pick to upgrade a much-needed-position. There's no assurance that Tomlinson will be as good as Joseph or Hankins. And there's the two ACLs.
Jerry just doesn't do the draft well. Another opinion Jordan: Jerry blows it again. - ( New Window )
My opinion is that you don't really know what you're talking about. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but not all opinions are created equal, or hold equal weight. It would have been an outrageous allocation of dollars towards one position group given what we paid Snacks and what Hankins wanted. You do realize we need to earmark extra money for OBJ's eventual extension, and guys like Richburg and Pugh up next at the feeding table, right?
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
Yah but that's kind of my point. Harrison is a NT, I think DT is kind of a redundancy. You don't think so?
Colin, how's the middle of the defense look if Snacks gets dinged up? Â
If something happens to him, we can move him to nose.
Plus, we play the best running offense twice a season. And with how good our secondary is, we can trust our line to shut down the run and have our secondary guys causing mayhem on the backend making plays.
Sy56 & Dave in the first Podcast nailed it with our first pick Â
Sy56 nailed it with Tomlinson, now granted he said to us in the 3rd it’s a great pick and had Engram as the possible 23rd for us as well. Kudo’s to Sy & Dave you are both awesome.
IMO he is an upgrade from big Hank at least I hope so.
'Yikes not 1 but 2 ACL tears micky : 4/28/2017 10:12 pm'... Â
Tore 1 as a senior in high school playing soccer. The other in 2013 at 'Bama. Has since played in 33 consecutive games over 3 seasons. So the knees have passed muster by the docs and the real test, playing ball.
The Giants said they needed another guy like Hankins, despite what you think they took the guy they thought they needed. If Snacks got hurt then where do we turn for his position? You guys are just mad because you can't brag, LOL, what fucking babies, I have grand daughter's more grown up then some of you. Complain if the player don't work out, but he is a Giant now you opinions are worthless, so either be a fan or shut up. These mocks and all this draft predictions have gone way over the top now.
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
Yah but that's kind of my point. Harrison is a NT, I think DT is kind of a redundancy. You don't think so?
What if Snacks gets hurt? Then you have a big weakness at DT. We really needed one and Tomlinson looked really good in college
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
Yah but that's kind of my point. Harrison is a NT, I think DT is kind of a redundancy. You don't think so?
A redundancy that worked to great effect. One could argue the defense was built around being able to hold teams down in the run game. By drafting Tomlinson, it tells me that that's exactly what they wanted. Maybe after years of striking out, they've decided to stop looking for that pass rushing DT that's been their white whale. They certainly had their pick of any number of known pass rush DT prospects at the third pick and left them on the table.
because of the players around him remember that a lot of people were claiming that Damon Harrison was only good because he played between Shelden Richardson and Muhammad Wilkerson.
''A redundancy that worked to great effect. One could argue the defense was built around being able to hold teams down in the run game. By drafting Tomlinson, it tells me that that's exactly what they wanted. Maybe after years of striking out, they've decided to stop looking for that pass rushing DT that's been their white whale. They certainly had their pick of any number of known pass rush DT prospects at the third pick and left them on the table.''
In addition, when you field 4 players who can hold up, you gain the luxury of changing up gap assignments to a certain degree. Whereas with even one 'skinny' type, your options are forced.
Any of the bigs can get sacks when its their turn.
Also, JPP, Vernon, Wynn and Okwara can rotate into interior on occasion, and LBs and safeties are available at times.
because of the players around him remember that a lot of people were claiming that Damon Harrison was only good because he played between Shelden Richardson and Muhammad Wilkerson.
things that I saw in DT M. Adams that reminded me of what I liked in Hank, coming into his own draft:
For a tall DT you need to double check 'plays with enough leverage', check.
Tall DT - 'can he get horizontal to extend his range of plays, taking advantage of length' and 'just enough change of direction with that horizontal move to have a broader radius of tackling than otherwise?' Check.
To explain this one, draw a circle around a players feet and roughly indicate tackling radius. Why I did NOT like DT E. Quarles, for example, failed this part, stays on his feet some player runs right by him.
With Adams, passes batted down and fumbles recovered, indicate things that are otherwise hard to measure - and cinched it.
As I said, I like the DT pick, but will see for shits and kicks if Adams' career pans out as well as Hanks' has.
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
Yah but that's kind of my point. Harrison is a NT, I think DT is kind of a redundancy. You don't think so?
A redundancy that worked to great effect. One could argue the defense was built around being able to hold teams down in the run game. By drafting Tomlinson, it tells me that that's exactly what they wanted. Maybe after years of striking out, they've decided to stop looking for that pass rushing DT that's been their white whale. They certainly had their pick of any number of known pass rush DT prospects at the third pick and left them on the table.
If your argument is that you wanted the Giants to draft a second NT, that's one thing. I got attacked, and called a moron in so many words, because I said he's not someone who has the tools to generate pressure up the gut, which is what this team has been lacking.
One could also argue that our 3 biggest issues coming out of last year will remain the same going into next: the OL, the pass rush, and the LB corp. I think my initial comment sounded like I was condemning the player, I'm not. I'm just disappointed in the direction the team is taking.
Nope. No one is "seeing double".
Reading is fundamental - ( New Window )
unless injury history.....which he did not have
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In comment 13450391 Reb8thVA said:
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In four years. He might turn out to be a very good player but it sure seems like we are spinning our wheels.
Did we not need to replace Jonathan Hankins?
I don't have a strong negative feeling toward Tomlinson but I do question the strategy or philosophy that seems to lead us to have to recycle DTs every four years. It's hard to get better at other positions when that is the case.
Excepting of course that 4yrs ago the Giants had a historically bad defense.
Jerry is doo doo - ( New Window )
Sounds like a high floor guy, he should contribute significantly year one. Not a sexy pick but it fills a need, obviously.
Another high character guy, another just a guy who plays ball. No off field concerns. Just like our Round 1 guy.
Those who like the way Jerry handled this also thought that David Wilson was a great first round pick.
What an asinine comment. As if the situation with Hankins was in any way related to drafting Wilson.
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Does not play like an NFL player. Can't engage and shed, instantly swallowed, painfully slow/lacks quick twitch, I just don't see it. I hope I'm wrong, I don't have a trained eye by any stretch, but wow am I disappointed by this pick. Would have MUCH rather had Wormley if they are gonna go DT. Bummed. More bummed that Walker went 3 picks before us.
Have you ever played DT? Have you ever coached DL?
Nope. Didn't think so. You sound ridiculous with all due respect.
Certainly never have claimed to. In fact, most of my posts I preface with the fact I don't have the prowess of anything near a scout, or anything of that nature. I just don't see the qualities I would have liked in a DT. I don't understand the vitriol.
Link - ( New Window )
I really like the pick
2nd round grades - ( New Window )
I'm guessing the Giants weren't overly impressed with this OT class, and we really should be OK on the OL interior. We need OT help, but they haven't given up on Flowers yet, and him improving really is our best hope, and certainly possible. Maybe they hit with Fluker at RT, or Hart develops. Maybe they feel like there's a guy in the next tier that they can grab in the 3rd, who is maybe not a huge drop from the top tier, who all had questions this year (injury, playing time, production/consistency, etc). But they can't make a guy appear if he isn't there this year, they can't always find a trade down (tho certainly possible they had more chances than we know about), and we don't know how they have these guys rated - it's always funny when I see 'They could have had him X picks later, should've traded down' - never a guarantee, and if you like the guys better to pull the trigger.
Here's hoping these are good picks, they pan out and contribute next year, and help keep our D playing like the 2nd half and help our O look more like 2 years agon than last year (when we didn't have a great OL either, but managed some rushing). I'd love to see them add an OT, and a RB to complement Perkins, but can't complain about the positions addressed so far, and I won't claim to know which guys will be good or who would have been picked when...
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He adds nothing to the pass rush. I'm just very disappointed.
Had had 70 QB hurries @ Alabama. It doesn't sound like you really know much of anything about this player considering how much you're complaining about him.
Again, from what I've seen, albeit limited to less than a season worth of his games, a lot of his production as far as pass rush goes seems to have been a product of who he's playing with as opposed to his own ability.
I'm happy to defer to those who know more, and would be ecstatic to be wrong. God knows I have been before. I just don't see "it" as a pass rusher/pressure up the middle. He looks like he'll be a good contributor as far as playing the run goes, but I fear he's another 2 down DT is all.
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In comment 13450625 colin said:
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He adds nothing to the pass rush. I'm just very disappointed.
Had had 70 QB hurries @ Alabama. It doesn't sound like you really know much of anything about this player considering how much you're complaining about him.
Again, from what I've seen, albeit limited to less than a season worth of his games, a lot of his production as far as pass rush goes seems to have been a product of who he's playing with as opposed to his own ability.
I'm happy to defer to those who know more, and would be ecstatic to be wrong. God knows I have been before. I just don't see "it" as a pass rusher/pressure up the middle. He looks like he'll be a good contributor as far as playing the run goes, but I fear he's another 2 down DT is all.
This would have been a completely reasonable reaction to the pick to begin with - but instead, you basically threw up your arms and acted like Reese traded away an entire draft for a kicker.
Tomlinson is going to pair well with Harrison. He's not Aaron Donald but he doesn't need to be. This team created a run stuffing identity last year and it's important to retain that strength. Tomlinson allows us to do that. He can play on passing downs. He's not going to put up sack numbers but he does get penetration from time to time and can push the pocket.
I'm not a scout and I don't know as much as guys like Dave or Sy but I do root for Alabama and watch all of their games and I can assure you that DT is a good player and will be a good fit for our defense.
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In comment 13450637 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 13450625 colin said:
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He adds nothing to the pass rush. I'm just very disappointed.
Had had 70 QB hurries @ Alabama. It doesn't sound like you really know much of anything about this player considering how much you're complaining about him.
Again, from what I've seen, albeit limited to less than a season worth of his games, a lot of his production as far as pass rush goes seems to have been a product of who he's playing with as opposed to his own ability.
I'm happy to defer to those who know more, and would be ecstatic to be wrong. God knows I have been before. I just don't see "it" as a pass rusher/pressure up the middle. He looks like he'll be a good contributor as far as playing the run goes, but I fear he's another 2 down DT is all.
This would have been a completely reasonable reaction to the pick to begin with - but instead, you basically threw up your arms and acted like Reese traded away an entire draft for a kicker.
Tomlinson is going to pair well with Harrison. He's not Aaron Donald but he doesn't need to be. This team created a run stuffing identity last year and it's important to retain that strength. Tomlinson allows us to do that. He can play on passing downs. He's not going to put up sack numbers but he does get penetration from time to time and can push the pocket.
I'm not a scout and I don't know as much as guys like Dave or Sy but I do root for Alabama and watch all of their games and I can assure you that DT is a good player and will be a good fit for our defense.
Fair enough, definitely a knee jerk reaction on my part. Simply put, I personally don't see what I wanted for this defense from this player at this position. He's a Giant, I'm gonna root my ass off for him, and hope that you're right and I'm wrong.
on a side note, allen looks like he could be related to strahan
I hope he enjoys his limited time in NY before moving on for his second contract.
Dumber comments the later it gets. People actually believe the Giants are drsfting players in the second round because on 2 games per year. Games they swept last year.
Makes sense.
on a side note, allen looks like he could be related to strahan
Is that Clemson highlight reel you suggested on YouTube?
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push, even when single teamed. What do you see in this video that excites you? I ask that genuinely, not to be an ass.
Link - ( New Window )
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watch the Clemson tape
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
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In comment 13450402 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 13450391 Reb8thVA said:
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In four years. He might turn out to be a very good player but it sure seems like we are spinning our wheels.
Did we not need to replace Jonathan Hankins?
I don't have a strong negative feeling toward Tomlinson but I do question the strategy or philosophy that seems to lead us to have to recycle DTs every four years. It's hard to get better at other positions when that is the case.
It's a necessary evil in the cap era. The Giants seem to feel they can continue to find replacement DT's every few years in the draft instead of re-upping a guy they already have. You can't pay every guy you draft when his rookie deal is up. It's just the nature of the league. You're going to lose talent somewhere and are going to need to replace it with a less costly player.
Not sure what people would rather do. Pay Hankins 10M a year so that we can draft another position but then get crunched somewhere else because we're now committed to Hankins?
Cap resources are finite. This is just how it goes.
What do you know about the cap. Under the new CBA, I guess you didn't notice, the league has increased the cap by 10 to 12 million the last four years. Except for Dallas, teams re-signed almost all of their core free agents.
You pay another couple of million to keep Hankins, who you know is a good player, and use your 2nd round pick to upgrade a much-needed-position. There's no assurance that Tomlinson will be as good as Joseph or Hankins. And there's the two ACLs.
Jerry just doesn't do the draft well. Another opinion
Jordan: Jerry blows it again. - ( New Window )
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In comment 13450435 Reb8thVA said:
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In comment 13450402 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 13450391 Reb8thVA said:
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In four years. He might turn out to be a very good player but it sure seems like we are spinning our wheels.
Did we not need to replace Jonathan Hankins?
I don't have a strong negative feeling toward Tomlinson but I do question the strategy or philosophy that seems to lead us to have to recycle DTs every four years. It's hard to get better at other positions when that is the case.
It's a necessary evil in the cap era. The Giants seem to feel they can continue to find replacement DT's every few years in the draft instead of re-upping a guy they already have. You can't pay every guy you draft when his rookie deal is up. It's just the nature of the league. You're going to lose talent somewhere and are going to need to replace it with a less costly player.
Not sure what people would rather do. Pay Hankins 10M a year so that we can draft another position but then get crunched somewhere else because we're now committed to Hankins?
Cap resources are finite. This is just how it goes.
What do you know about the cap. Under the new CBA, I guess you didn't notice, the league has increased the cap by 10 to 12 million the last four years. Except for Dallas, teams re-signed almost all of their core free agents.
You pay another couple of million to keep Hankins, who you know is a good player, and use your 2nd round pick to upgrade a much-needed-position. There's no assurance that Tomlinson will be as good as Joseph or Hankins. And there's the two ACLs.
Jerry just doesn't do the draft well. Another opinion Jordan: Jerry blows it again. - ( New Window )
My opinion is that you don't really know what you're talking about. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but not all opinions are created equal, or hold equal weight. It would have been an outrageous allocation of dollars towards one position group given what we paid Snacks and what Hankins wanted. You do realize we need to earmark extra money for OBJ's eventual extension, and guys like Richburg and Pugh up next at the feeding table, right?
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In comment 13451157 bc4life said:
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watch the Clemson tape
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
Yah but that's kind of my point. Harrison is a NT, I think DT is kind of a redundancy. You don't think so?
Plus, we play the best running offense twice a season. And with how good our secondary is, we can trust our line to shut down the run and have our secondary guys causing mayhem on the backend making plays.
IMO he is an upgrade from big Hank at least I hope so.
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In comment 13451535 colin said:
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In comment 13451157 bc4life said:
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watch the Clemson tape
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
Yah but that's kind of my point. Harrison is a NT, I think DT is kind of a redundancy. You don't think so?
What if Snacks gets hurt? Then you have a big weakness at DT. We really needed one and Tomlinson looked really good in college
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In comment 13451535 colin said:
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In comment 13451157 bc4life said:
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watch the Clemson tape
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
Yah but that's kind of my point. Harrison is a NT, I think DT is kind of a redundancy. You don't think so?
A redundancy that worked to great effect. One could argue the defense was built around being able to hold teams down in the run game. By drafting Tomlinson, it tells me that that's exactly what they wanted. Maybe after years of striking out, they've decided to stop looking for that pass rushing DT that's been their white whale. They certainly had their pick of any number of known pass rush DT prospects at the third pick and left them on the table.
In addition, when you field 4 players who can hold up, you gain the luxury of changing up gap assignments to a certain degree. Whereas with even one 'skinny' type, your options are forced.
Any of the bigs can get sacks when its their turn.
Also, JPP, Vernon, Wynn and Okwara can rotate into interior on occasion, and LBs and safeties are available at times.
Another Mic drop
Will watch Adams at Green Bay, I think it was, to check myself.
For a tall DT you need to double check 'plays with enough leverage', check.
Tall DT - 'can he get horizontal to extend his range of plays, taking advantage of length' and 'just enough change of direction with that horizontal move to have a broader radius of tackling than otherwise?' Check.
To explain this one, draw a circle around a players feet and roughly indicate tackling radius. Why I did NOT like DT E. Quarles, for example, failed this part, stays on his feet some player runs right by him.
With Adams, passes batted down and fumbles recovered, indicate things that are otherwise hard to measure - and cinched it.
As I said, I like the DT pick, but will see for shits and kicks if Adams' career pans out as well as Hanks' has.
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In comment 13451542 Ten Ton Hammer said:
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In comment 13451535 colin said:
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In comment 13451157 bc4life said:
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watch the Clemson tape
This one? I don't know man, this isn't impressive to me in the least. Actually, rather disheartening. I see a NT who can eat up blockers, but gets no push
That's kind of what a nose tackle does by definition. Any pass rush you get from a NT is gravy.
Yah but that's kind of my point. Harrison is a NT, I think DT is kind of a redundancy. You don't think so?
A redundancy that worked to great effect. One could argue the defense was built around being able to hold teams down in the run game. By drafting Tomlinson, it tells me that that's exactly what they wanted. Maybe after years of striking out, they've decided to stop looking for that pass rushing DT that's been their white whale. They certainly had their pick of any number of known pass rush DT prospects at the third pick and left them on the table.
If your argument is that you wanted the Giants to draft a second NT, that's one thing. I got attacked, and called a moron in so many words, because I said he's not someone who has the tools to generate pressure up the gut, which is what this team has been lacking.
One could also argue that our 3 biggest issues coming out of last year will remain the same going into next: the OL, the pass rush, and the LB corp. I think my initial comment sounded like I was condemning the player, I'm not. I'm just disappointed in the direction the team is taking.