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Two teams again traded up in front of the Giants

jdf : 4/29/2017 3:06 am
this time in the third round. The Patriots, having just selected their first pick two picks before, traded up to pick #85 to select OT Antonio Garcia, and then Kansas City traded up to #86 to select RB Kareem Hunt.

Now for all we know the Giants were dead set on taking Webb at #87, or the Pats and Chiefs may have been worried some other team behind the Giants wanted these players. But the players they chose are certainly both at positions of need for the Giants, and it's not unreasonable to think the Patriots and Chiefs made their moves in order to beat the Giants to these picks.

We'll probably never know. And having this happen in the third round is certainly less of an issue than what seemed to happen last year in the first round. But it does seem a bit curious.
I suspect no  
George from PA : 4/29/2017 3:24 am : link
Drafting a QB is not a choice made quickly....

Oh, Hunt is gone...let's grab Webb. That's it...Garcia's taken, grab Webb.

I am assuming grabbing Webb was decided early in the round and discussed several times
So those two teams had to trade draft choices to  
joeinpa : 4/29/2017 6:18 am : link
Get the guy they wanted, and Reese got he guy he wanted by staying put.
JR outsmarted them again
Dude it's the third round  
Brandon Walsh : 4/29/2017 6:43 am : link
You're reading to much into it.

It's a lot different than the 1st round where teams actually do draft similulations
I think the trades  
MotownGIANTS : 4/29/2017 7:01 am : link
were made due to us ... not that there was a leak but RB and OT was the greatest need and value for us and those were 2 of the best left it was not a great reach to think we go either one...from he looks it was the OT for sake of debate.

I like Foreman as a bruiser and he'd be cheaper(but Blount is an option) so that's why I say the OT.

Now Jourdan Lewis did have GREAT value at CB and is a need even more pressing than QB, which is a need whether people want to see it or not. So as some have said we take a gamble on a spread QB with the great potential and some rough spot but all rough spots that are correctable with good coaching. He sits behind Eli for 2 yr minimum (barring injury) gets the coaching and a mentor. Now bad for the long term plan whereas we reach the next 2 yrs for a QB or over pay in FA and that is a cap killer ... how often has that worked for teams?
Sure teams trade up all the time  
Jesse B : 4/29/2017 7:12 am : link
Every year. Giants would to if they thought a player was so much better then all available remaining players as they did with Collins and Nassib Barden

And even though Reese has made many picks in his tenure that run contradictory to our vision we still love to assume he has the same vision we do. It should be clear now that is just Not the case

Giants were taking a QB there  
ZogZerg : 4/29/2017 8:05 am : link
so it didn't matter.
Do you think other teams don't know what the Giants needs are?  
Mike from Ohio : 4/29/2017 8:06 am : link
And don't trade up to get a guy they have a strong belief on? That happens to every team, and happens to most of the most years. So what is the point you are trying to make? A team that wanted an OT knew the Giants may want the same OT so they jumped ahead of them? That is what happens in the draft and is not even slightly unusual?

Or do you believe the Giants "telegraphed" their intention to take a specific player with a specific pick, and it cost the Giants? If so, let me assure you that didn't happen.

The front office telegraphing all their picks and getting beat to them is starting to take on a BBI life like stealing Cruz from the Jets and getting the Saints first rounder for Shockey...
I guess  
EddieNYG : 4/29/2017 8:11 am : link
It makes some fans feel better by rationalizing why the Giants didn't get a player they wanted in a particular round by saying the Giants let teams move up ahead of them.

It's really laughable.
I don't think the trade ups changed the plans of the Giants  
Mike in NY : 4/29/2017 8:11 am : link
Mara family probably would like to see an immediate return on investment from every pick because the more you hit on the draft the less you need to spend in Free Agency. To select a QB like Davis Webb when you already have Eli Manning would likely need their sign off since he will be sitting on a bench for most, if not all, of his rookie contract in an ideal world. After what happened with Ryan Nassib they were probably even harsher about that this high, so this was something that was discussed well before the actual pick.
There really are a lot of stupid OP's following this draft  
Torrag : 4/29/2017 8:15 am : link
Seems like more than usual but maybe I've got rose colored hindsight. Delete this garbage.
Patriots needed to get in front uf  
XBRONX : 4/29/2017 8:47 am : link
Giants. Fake news
BBI getting a bit paranoid...  
Jimmy Googs : 4/29/2017 8:53 am : link
.
Teams do this shit all the time  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 4/29/2017 9:11 am : link
It's not a conspiracy against the Giants, and it's not the Giants leaking their targets.

The Giants clearly need OL and RB help. Teams that wanted these players thought they might not make it past the Giants.

It's not rocket science and it happens to many teams every year.
Some really excellent posts on here.  
Big Blue '56 : 4/29/2017 9:15 am : link
👍👍👍
RE: Patriots needed to get in front uf  
jdf : 4/29/2017 9:24 am : link
In comment 13451717 XBRONX said:
Quote:
Giants. Fake news


They felt the need to get in front of somebody. That's the fact, not an alternative one.

Maybe they wanted to get in front of Miami, which had pick #86 before trading it to get KC. Maybe it was the Giants at #87. But somebody in the New England front office thought it was important enough to pull the trigger for an OT who was probably one of the last available with some starting-level qualities in the NFL.
Everyone in the world knows  
David B. : 4/29/2017 9:27 am : link
The Giants need an OT (and still do). You don't need to be Belichick to know that. It's not like they telegraphed it like Leonard Floyd. So if you like Garcia, you'd make that move -- especially if you have a surplus of picks.

People ARE going to keep moving ahead of the Giants to take Tackles until the Giants actually draft one.
RE: Teams do this shit all the time  
jdf : 4/29/2017 9:28 am : link
In comment 13451769 LakeGeorgeGiant said:
Quote:
It's not a conspiracy against the Giants, and it's not the Giants leaking their targets.

The Giants clearly need OL and RB help. Teams that wanted these players thought they might not make it past the Giants.

It's not rocket science and it happens to many teams every year.


I agree with this, actually. But it is a matter of those teams being more aggressive in pursuing their needs. I would have liked to have seen the Giants doing that, particularly for OL.
Jdf  
Mike from Ohio : 4/29/2017 9:39 am : link
Your assumption is that the Giants really wanted one of the OTs that were taken just in front of them. What are you basing that on?

If you consider the possibility that they didn't have a strong belief in any of those guys (a very distinct possibility) then it makes complete sense why they didn't trade up to get one. Fans like to believe the Giants are desperately looking for a tackle in this draft, and their is simply no evidence that that is the case.
RE: Jdf  
jdf : 4/29/2017 9:53 am : link
In comment 13451849 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
Your assumption is that the Giants really wanted one of the OTs that were taken just in front of them. What are you basing that on?

If you consider the possibility that they didn't have a strong belief in any of those guys (a very distinct possibility) then it makes complete sense why they didn't trade up to get one. Fans like to believe the Giants are desperately looking for a tackle in this draft, and their is simply no evidence that that is the case.


Well, I'd say it is the fans, or some of them anyway, who are desperate for OT help this offseason, and there is little evidence that the front office is (I don't believe the signing of Fluker was a serious attempt to address the situation).

Posters on other threads have pointed out that the Giants have invested more draft resources in their OLine in recent years than the Patriots. But here is a case where New England made a calculated mid-round investment that the Giants presumably were not wiling to match. It seems like their approach has been more cost-effective in the long run. I guess we'll have to wait and see how Garcia turns out.
Assume  
GeoMan999 : 4/29/2017 9:55 am : link
You just made an ASS out of U and US
The front office may not believe OT  
Mike from Ohio : 4/29/2017 10:07 am : link
is as big a need as fans think it is. If that is the case, nobody is jumping the Giants and taking a player the Giants wanted. You can disagree about whether they should or should not be looking for tackle, but you can't argue they were beaten to one they want because as a fan you have zero way of knowing that.
RE: The front office may not believe OT  
jdf : 4/29/2017 10:12 am : link
In comment 13451926 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
is as big a need as fans think it is. If that is the case, nobody is jumping the Giants and taking a player the Giants wanted. You can disagree about whether they should or should not be looking for tackle, but you can't argue they were beaten to one they want because as a fan you have zero way of knowing that.


You're right, of course. We may never know. The best we can do is keep track of what Garcia does (and Hunt, for that matter) in future years. I guess that's what makes the draft fun.

Anyway, I appreciate your constructive discussion.
Imagine if a team trades up in front of us in the 4th?!  
Giantology : 4/29/2017 10:19 am : link
Then we'll definitely know that someone has leaked our board!!!
There are so many teams that are going to trade up ahead if us that  
Jimmy Googs : 4/29/2017 11:12 am : link
I bet we will be left with the last 3 picks in the entire draft...
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