Washington Post - Engram, bust potential

"a bastion of sports knowledge", LMAO

Like going to a bakery to find out what kind of television to purchase

work out?

In comment 13460256 mavric said:

Quote:

"a bastion of sports knowledge", LMAO Like going to a bakery to find out what kind of television to purchase

I agree. But, when I lived in the area...I didn't read the Post for my sports...I loved watching the George Michael Sports Machine!

In comment 13460257 Jimmy Googs said:

Quote:

work out?

My sentiments, exactly.

makes it really easy to see who really knows the strengths and weaknesses of teams and players that fit within their schemes and who looks at Kiper's list of positions of need for each team and decided if they did a good job or not.

Does Engram give the Giants offense some versatility in non-11 personal packages?

that we drafted him so we can finally stop using the 11 personnel so much. Also, does he watch his boy Jordan Reed play?

A quick excerpt from NFL.com when he was scouted.

"WEAKNESSES Fails to get over the face of the defensive end when reach blocking. Footwork is not consistent or sustained often enough when blocking, causes him to go to the ground. Posture can get too tall when attacking shoulder of opposition, loses positioning in that way. Needs better anticipation when asked to block at the second level. The type that turns and watches the play after the ball carrier runs past him. Route tree is limited, many or flare outs to the flats. Asked to sit down in soft areas. Hips can get too high when he is asked to run routes, not much exaggeration with head movement."

their list from last year was:
- Wentz
- Bosa
- Fuller
- Burns
- Lynch

Lynch really didn't get much of a chance in Denver year 1, but the rest of the guys were at least serviceable

In comment 13460260 Giants in 07 said:

Quote:

makes it really easy to see who really knows the strengths and weaknesses of teams and players that fit within their schemes and who looks at Kiper's list of positions of need for each team and decided if they did a good job or not. Does Engram give the Giants offense some versatility in non-11 personal packages?

Didn't Coach Mac mentioned that 11 personnel was due to a lack of options (TE, FB)? I have a feeling with the addition of Engram and Ellison, 11 personnel won't be trotted out as often.

They're basing all of this on the factoid that they were in 11-personnel a lot. Yes, they were, but as a result of the roster situation not any intended scheme.

these reporters know more about running a football team than the people that do it for a living?

In comment 13460278 Gman11 said:

Quote:

these reporters know more about running a football team than the people that do it for a living?

as Jerry said regarding the criticism from Shaun O'Hara, which is also applicable here...

"Shaun can have his opinion, he can say what he wants to say. But we do this for a living," Reese said during an appearance with Michael Kay and Don LaGreca on ESPN Radio 98.7. "That's all I have to say about that."

Is not a reason to assume there is bust potential.

In comment 13460273 Ten Ton Hammer said:

Quote:

They're basing all of this on the factoid that they were in 11-personnel a lot. Yes, they were, but as a result of the roster situation not any intended scheme.

Not to mention that they seem to believe Will Tye was a good run blocker...

if he knew anything about McAdoo he's know he would like to run a similar offense to Green Bay. We drafted Engram to help break up the coverage on Beckham, not to block on every down.

Just so lazy.

there are very few outright busts. It's pretty hard to play in the NFL, let alone stand out or be a pro-bowler. I hate Ereck Flowers, but I wouldnt even call him a bust at this point. I would even consider him a success if he moved to guard and played well, like a Robert Gallery. Not what was expected out of the guy, but to call him a bust would be off IMO.

Jamarcus Russell was a bust, Cedric Jones was a bust, Vernon Gholston was a bust. I highly doubt Engram BUSTS, he would have to put forth an Adrian Robinson like effort to earn that title, and that aint happening.

played for 5 years in the NFL, starting every game in his final 2 seasons. He had 15 career sacks. Not stellar by any means, but not a bust. A bust is somebody who completely flames out.

Best production and measurable as of any player at the position. Most polished route runner in the draft. He's a much safer pick than Njoku or even Howard.

Also, how often did the writer expect EE to be an in-line blocker in Ole Miss' backyard offense?

In comment 13460257 Jimmy Googs said:

Quote:

work out?

What the fuck does this have to do with anything?

last year, it means we're wedded to doing it almost exclusively this year misses the cause and effect. We did it last year because we lacked options. We had no FB and barely a playable TE. I expect a decent amount of 2 TE sets. Also, I expect EE to get some lineups at inline. The article notes he did so 1/3 of the time, and then proceeds to pretend like it is 0%.

if they want to lull area Redskins fans into a false sense of security of the Giants perhaps not having new offensive weapons, so be it. We'll find out this fall.

packages displays a serious lack of critical thinking. With no FB and a limited WR corps, NYG were forced to rely on 11 personnel alignments. With Marshall, Engram, and a FB, that is no longer the case. How reporters can't see that is mind-boggling.

Quote:

Did this guy really just compare Evan Engram to Will Tye?

Quote:

Why did I read this? Pointless article.

Quote:

If Peppers has "never shown the ability to be dominant at anything except returning kicks", how in the world was he Big 10 Defensive Player of the Year? Doesn't Ohio State have anyone?

In comment 13460328 Deej said:

Quote:

In comment 13460257 Jimmy Googs said: Quote: work out? What the fuck does this have to do with anything?

Just a little humor, potty mouth. Sorry if your horse didn't win...

another WR type TE the Posts' Skins have. But, what do I know

by McAdoo who designs and runs the offense. He had a very successful year last year with a lousy OL and a lot of new pieces. I think we let him show us why, where and how he uses Engram and the rest. But everybody is entitled to their opinion. These sports writers have to write something or be replaced, so who cares what they dream up for a story deadline.

In comment 13460348 Jimmy Googs said:

Quote:

In comment 13460328 Deej said: Quote: In comment 13460257 Jimmy Googs said: Quote: work out? What the fuck does this have to do with anything? Just a little humor, potty mouth. Sorry if your horse didn't win...

humor should be funny, even if little. Politics arent allowed in these parts. If they were, I'd have a funny retort.

.

about when we play Jordan Reed. They said, "Do other teams' fans say, 'yay, they're putting Jordan Reed on the field and he can't block!' or do they say, 'Crap, this guy gives us fits in the passing game...'"

I think there is truth in that. It's more about what he can do than what he can't, if he's used well.

Fake News

Did they claim the reed/Engram 40 yard GIF was Russian propaganda ?

even in REAL news, much less sports.

wrap your fish in it, line the kitty litter, that sort of trash

like 15 out of the last 20 years? And a couple of SBs as well?

and called himself a WR, would he have made it to 23? I'm inclined to think he wouldn't.

In comment 13460317 FatMan in Charlotte said:

Quote:

played for 5 years in the NFL, starting every game in his final 2 seasons. He had 15 career sacks. Not stellar by any means, but not a bust. A bust is somebody who completely flames out.

Thank you.

In comment 13460426 jcn56 said:

Quote:

and called himself a WR, would he have made it to 23? I'm inclined to think he wouldn't.

Been saying all along we are lucky teams let the "TE" label get in the way of his freakish attributes ... especially teams that reached for "true WRs" in the top 10-15.

I put it at zero. It was safe pick especially for a team that lacked some TE talent.

At the very least he'll find a useful pass catching role. No chance the guy can't play and produce in the NFL. It will be very easy to find production for this player.

I think they missed that about a third of Engrams snaps came from the H back position. Just reading the blurb in OP you'd think he lined up as a slot 2/3 of the time which isn't the case. Also, the kids a wicked mismatch in the H and the slot and on the line as a receiver. He's also not a minus blocker, he's not a plus blocker either but he's serviceable.

is between the ears or in the chest, a la Travis Beckum.. Physically, he's got everything he needs to be successful, be it as a WR or TE or whatever.

In comment 13460317 FatMan in Charlotte said:

Quote:

played for 5 years in the NFL, starting every game in his final 2 seasons. He had 15 career sacks. Not stellar by any means, but not a bust. A bust is somebody who completely flames out.

making his argument about the word "bust"

In comment 13460259 froggerjoe said:

Quote:

In comment 13460257 Jimmy Googs said: Quote: work out? My sentiments, exactly.

Stupid sentiment. Shows that: 1) you don't understand how polls work (a probability is just that - a probability. That means there's still an element of chance occurring). If something has a 90% chance of occurring, theres still a 10% chance it does not... and 2) you're basing your thoughts on a sports writers opinion from something totally unrelated.

Hey, I the NYT gave this movie a bad review and I liked it! Better not trust their geopolitical reporting.

Otherwise, you better just make sure to ignore every other news outlet, since they all pretty much had similar outlooks as WaPo regarding the probability of the election results.

In comment 13460278 Gman11 said:

Quote:

these reporters know more about running a football team than the people that do it for a living?

So then what's the point of this message board, or any of Sy/Dave Te's draft analysis? Nobody is allowed to disagree with the Giants?

It would look like this and mainly a run and play action formation but Versatile while OBJ takes a quick rest..

WR: Marshall/Harris on the outside

WR: Engram in the slot

TE: Ellison

RB: Perkins


That's a pretty lethal run formation and also serviceable in the deep or short passing attack..

Where does it say or imply Will Tye was a great blocker????
Where does it say or imply Evan Ingram did not line up as an H back in college???

In comment 13460456 Sonic Youth said:

Quote:

Otherwise, you better just make sure to ignore every other news outlet, since they all pretty much had similar outlooks as WaPo regarding the probability of the election results.

my sentiments, exactly...

from a writer in Redskins land. Maybe he didn't read that the Giants had also signed FA Ellison to be the blocking TE on running downs. He will see Engrams true potential when the Skins drop back in the cover-2 when trying to contain the Giants passing attack.

In comment 13460402 idiotsavant said:

Quote:

even in REAL news, much less sports. wrap your fish in it, line the kitty litter, that sort of trash

WaPo is one of the three most highly-regarded papers in the country. Is your preference the Washington Times?

The more I read about Engram, the more I'm convinced he's, "A solution looking for a problem."

I think the TE label really aided the Giants. Engram is a "modern TE" which really means he's a wide receiver with enough size to be a better than average blocker as a wide receiver.

What part of 6' 3" 235 lbs and 4.4 speed says bust? If he never takes a snap at TE and becomes the #2 wide receiver with Beckham #1 and Shepard #3 in the slot, I'd be 100% satisfied with this pick.

Travis Beckum

Quote:

Even in college, Engram was a liability as a run-blocker.

"Even in college," lol

It's the only sample we have.

In comment 13460426 jcn56 said:

Quote:

and called himself a WR, would he have made it to 23? I'm inclined to think he wouldn't.

I think the lack of tape on him working as an outside receiver would have led to him being downgraded from what his measurables and balls skills suggest if he were scouted as a WR. As we see in free agent pricing, slot WRs are less valued than outside receivers for the same production.

as I think he can easily be a great WR.. but their points are valid.. Most of his production in college came as a slot WR.. between Shep, Marshall, OBJ, Ellison, Engram and Perkins only 5 of these guys can stay out there.. You need Ellison and Perkins out there to at least show the defense that we might run.. you need OBJ out there because really its OBJ.. So that leaves either Marshall or Shep who will have to be replaced with Engram..

Obviously he is a first round pick and he will get multiple years to prove his worth... but for next season unless we have an injury, I don't see that much output from him..

In comment 13460499 Sy'56 said:

Quote:

Travis Beckum

I actually liked Beckum's skillset. He had that one 67 yarder against GB that showed what type of athlete he was. Wasn't a great fit in the Gilbride offense, and I believe he had some injuries.

him off the LOS.

Mostly because they didn't believe he could ever be a target...

In comment 13460731 chuckydee9 said:

Quote:

as I think he can easily be a great WR.. but their points are valid.. Most of his production in college came as a slot WR.. between Shep, Marshall, OBJ, Ellison, Engram and Perkins only 5 of these guys can stay out there.. You need Ellison and Perkins out there to at least show the defense that we might run.. you need OBJ out there because really its OBJ.. So that leaves either Marshall or Shep who will have to be replaced with Engram.. Obviously he is a first round pick and he will get multiple years to prove his worth... but for next season unless we have an injury, I don't see that much output from him..

Eh, I can guarantee you we'll run without an inline TE a bunch. Put Marshall and EE out there. What does a defense do? Go big and you cant cover everyone. Go small and our big targets should do well blocking CBs.

We can create mismatches in the running game by going "smaller" now.

Corral in the stupid in that article. Here's the thing WaPo, a WR in the slot who is 234lbs gives you what now...OPTIONS...that's right options. Put a DB on him and Eli can change to a run to his side sure that a 234lb WR will smother a DB. Or put a LB on him if you think it's a run and watch him fly down the seam for an easy 10 yard completion or more. His presence as the move TE/H Back will give DCs fits, especially with Beckham looming as a deep threat and a QB who has the freedom to change plays as he sees fit.

since Salieri and Mozart.

probably payed for it out of his personal household funds( cooking staff, etc). WH Correspondents Dinner (lol). The haves and the have nots.

In comment 13460499 Sy'56 said:

Quote:

Travis Beckum

My worry is that our system is not really defined around a dominate tight-end, hence the need for prioritized blocking skill.

In comment 13460982 mdc1 said:

Quote:

In comment 13460499 Sy'56 said: Quote: Travis Beckum My worry is that our system is not really defined around a dominate tight-end, hence the need for prioritized blocking skill.

It certainly isn't defined around a TE, but it certainly uses one. And the person who installed this offense came up as a TE coach.

from this butt hurt propaganda rag

thats whats up

the source/agenda potential.

Plaxico Burress. We'll soon see whether he can run routes like Plax and take the ball away from the defender like Plax. If he can, the Giants struck gold.

may be worthy of being a suitable Fish wrap.

wrt to the media. Witness how casually some among us parrot the demonstrable nonsense that their petty brains effortlessly absorb.

Quote:

The Failing Washington Post

Quote:

The Washington Post....really? Canton : 5/4/2017 12:10 pm : link Fake News

Quote:

seriously washington post has zero credibility

Quote:

Zero credibility Mr. Nickels : 5/4/2017 7:13 pm : link from this butt hurt propaganda rag

Who supposes these Mensa candidates are, in lieu of WaPo, instead turning to the WSJ, Foreign Affairs, and The Economist and totally not tuned to their favorite cable station. :eyeroll:

Despite their (fairly open) biases, the big 3 newspapers in this country - NYT, WaPo, WSJ - are still remarkably high quality publications. People who read them regularly are made smarter. Publications which, by the way, (alongside print in general) do an enormously disproportionate amount of on the ground reporting which mostly mind-numbing "commentators" and dogshit blogs reliably leach off of. As their revenue decreases with the rise of new media, so does the breadth of face to face reporting.

Or, whatever, fuck it. Bob Woodward is a hack and fake and writes for a rag worthy of kitty litter. We'll go with that.

The hope is that this sort of lazy dismissiveness is confined to a handful of lemming simps on a message board, but we regrettably know that is not the case.

--

This particular article was indeed poor, though (and it's fair to impugn their sports coverage...obviously not a focus). But reflective of how much the draft is indeed a crap shoot. Consider how we (myself included) readily celebrate the draft opinions of some posters here. One affirmed confidently that Bryce Petty was to be a great NFL QB. How's that workin out...

In comment 13460278 Gman11 said:

Quote:

these reporters know more about running a football team than the people that do it for a living?

You mean they post on BBI?

whenever a writer dares question a move.

''bezos propaganda vehicle
mdc1 : 5/4/2017 6:37 pm : link : reply

probably payed for it out of his personal household funds( cooking staff, etc). WH Correspondents Dinner (lol). The haves and the have nots.''

the shock effect and less for accuracy only to draw attention to themselves, selling your integrity for a headline that is worthless, yuck..

Engram is a tweener. Generally, teams draft those guys later because they are a gamble. Reed was a 5th round pick, Hernandez, may God have mercy on his soul, was a 4th rounder and Marshall was a 6th round pick.

That's not to say that Engram won't have his uses or be a good player, but recognize that this was gutsy pick in the first round by Reese.

We failed to utilize our previous H back, Beckham, in any meaningful way. This is a challenge to McAdoo to make sure we keep EE on the field and maintain the ground game.

I think he can do it, but opposing D coordinators will be able to exploit some situations. Lets see.

In comment 13461452 Overseer said:

Quote:

wrt to the media. Despite their (fairly open) biases, the big 3 newspapers in this country - NYT, WaPo, WSJ - are still remarkably high quality publications.

They were and still can be but need revamping of thought process. Their ridiculously wide open biases are best served for the Editorial page though, not every story and headline...

is a fair & thoughtful journalist?

In comment 13462033 Overseer said:

Quote:

is a fair & thoughtful journalist?

I don't know offhand. What did he say about Engram?

turns political. LOL you never disappoint BBI...

that's the shit, has anyone ever done an investigative on Bob fucking 'wood' - ward? You 'regular sheeple' know so little.

Wake up sheeple!


So you don't think Bob Woodward
Overseer : 12:56 pm : link : reply

is a fair & thoughtful journalist?


RE: So you don't think Bob Woodward
Jimmy Googs : 1:00 pm : link : reply

In comment 13462033 Overseer said:

Quote:
is a fair & thoughtful journalist?


I don't know offhand. What did he say about Engram?""
-----------------------------------------

Coogs has his fucking priorities in order.

did Bob "Woody McWoodPecker" Woodward actually KNOW it was really the Germans that invaded Pearl Harbor, or did he just GUESS or hear that it was the Germans that really invaded Pearl Harbor, before he started his very. famous. investigation?

Think about that sheeple.

to be very fucking clear, sheeple.

Was it actually Bob Fuching Woodward that invaded little Pearl Harbor?

That bastard.

except the giants wont be using him as an inline blocker much, therefore, not applicable.

who invaded Pear Harbor and Bob Woodward who sank the Lusitania.

Hard to keep track of this shit.

because all draft picks have the potential to be busts until they prove themselves