To win the job? I want the best player to with the job. I actually dont care what alignment works best out there. I kinda wish Hart would win one of the positions with Bisnowaty so that we can have a young line set for a few years. But Im not rooting for one guy or another. I just want some god damn push for a change.
I'm not sold on Flowers. Sure I hope he "gets it" his 3rd year, like so many hope, or think he will, but I can't, judging by last year, assume he will be the best LT of all the Ts they have on the roster. I dont care where he was drafted, or how young he is, there better be a real competition for both T spots. If that happens, I dont have any favorites, Flowers, Fluker, Pugh, Bisno, Hart, I dont care. Problem is, I dont believe there will be a fully open competition, and the HOPE will be what fans will live on. Hope that Flowers "gets it", because he is clearly the guy the Giants want to stay at LT. After him, all else is secondary. LT is the key. Who is the best T on the roster? I want to know, and I want that guy to play LT. All the rest can sort itself out, that is if they have a real competition. I think Reese's ego is going to have a big influence on this competition, and I HOPE, Flowers backs up his draft position from 2 years ago,I dont see how he can be worse than he was last year, but whether he lives up to his #9 overall pick status is highly questionable, I think Reese is clinging to that.
I'm not sold on Flowers. Sure I hope he "gets it" his 3rd year, like so many hope, or think he will, but I can't, judging by last year, assume he will be the best LT of all the Ts they have on the roster. I dont care where he was drafted, or how young he is, there better be a real competition for both T spots. If that happens, I dont have any favorites, Flowers, Fluker, Pugh, Bisno, Hart, I dont care. Problem is, I dont believe there will be a fully open competition, and the HOPE will be what fans will live on. Hope that Flowers "gets it", because he is clearly the guy the Giants want to stay at LT. After him, all else is secondary. LT is the key. Who is the best T on the roster? I want to know, and I want that guy to play LT. All the rest can sort itself out, that is if they have a real competition. I think Reese's ego is going to have a big influence on this competition, and I HOPE, Flowers backs up his draft position from 2 years ago,I dont see how he can be worse than he was last year, but whether he lives up to his #9 overall pick status is highly questionable, I think Reese is clinging to that.
I think the Flowers logic extends beyond just hoping he succeeds. He is a top ten pick. He has all the tools to be a monster bookend. He is cost controlled. He is going into his third year which is not an unreasonable amount of time to develop into a good Tackle in the NFL.
The Giants do not give up on prospects this early. Especially one with Flowers' measurables. The fact that he has not ever had a suitable blocking TE to help in his development is a valid point. Why people are itching to move on from him when there is literally no better option is still perplexing to me. Until he proves to be a total liability, he is our best bet at LT.
To win the job? I want the best player to with the job.
Because I've seen Hart and I think his upside is limited. But he does have experience over Bisnowaty. So if Bisnowaty wins the job, it means he got up to speed quickly enough that they could trust him despite being a rookie.
I generally always want to see the guy with the greater upside win the job as long as he actually wins it by realizing his potential.
Until he proves to be a total liability, he is our best bet at LT.
Chopperhatch, what does Flowers have to do or not do to prove he shouldn't be the LT in your opinion?
Should he stay at left tackle if his play equals last year?
How much of a dip from last year should make the Giants act?
We all heard the excuses/reasons of why he should stay there.
Well this is the year most experts and fans say expect a jump in his play, and every Giant fan wants that; but if he continues to play like last year even after all the hard work he put in.....then what?
When should he be moved inside or to the RT spot if he has not improved? This year, next...when?
What would make him a total liability, in your words?
Does he have all the tools to be a very good left tackle, probably.
Having the tools and using to their fullest extend is another thing?
We all are hoping for that jump but we want it to be this year.
I could see Fluker winning the RT spot, I think he is a better T than G... but seems the Giants want him as a RG. Honestly I would pull for that, he is massive and strong. I would think it helps the run game more than any other change. He had a rough time at G for SD.
Bisnowaty is a wildcard, but I think he makes the roster as a backup this year.
next March. And if Flowers doesn't work out at LT, you have 4 spots to fill next March by signing your own free agents or others or by promoting backups.
next March. And if Flowers doesn't work out at LT, you have 4 spots to fill next March by signing your own free agents or others or by promoting backups.
Ivan, if Flowers shits the bed again, he'll have another year on his rookie contract remaining. This year will determine if the Giants pick-up his 5th year option as the deadline will be in May. Even if Flowers somehow proves competent, I suspect the 5th year option is off the table as it is calculated differently for players chosen in the Top 10. This year the 5th year option for OL picked in the Top 10 is more than $13MM. So far his body of work will be earning him a prove it deal like Fluker for $1MM/yr.
Personally, I want 5 guys, I don't care who, to set themselves apart from the rest over the summer.
Chad Wheeler is a much better fit on the left side at the moment because he is better in pass pro than run blocking. If Bisnowaty won the starting RT job then Wheeler would possibly be the swing tackle this season. With a year in an NFL strength and conditioning program Wheeler could battle for a starting spot in a year. Wheeler and Jarron Jones have the highest upsides among the UDFA's.
RE: Until he proves to be a total liability, he is our best bet at LT.
Chopperhatch, what does Flowers have to do or not do to prove he shouldn't be the LT in your opinion?
Should he stay at left tackle if his play equals last year?
How much of a dip from last year should make the Giants act?
We all heard the excuses/reasons of why he should stay there.
Well this is the year most experts and fans say expect a jump in his play, and every Giant fan wants that; but if he continues to play like last year even after all the hard work he put in.....then what?
When should he be moved inside or to the RT spot if he has not improved? This year, next...when?
What would make him a total liability, in your words?
Does he have all the tools to be a very good left tackle, probably.
Having the tools and using to their fullest extend is another thing?
We all are hoping for that jump but we want it to be this year.
I am going to attempt to answer all of your questions even though you seemed to ask the same ones a couple times.
If after this year he makes no step forward, then you know that it should be addressed next offseason. The guy just turned 23. He looked good in spots his rookie year when he was thrust into starting then injuring his ankle. You have to do your due diligence with a top 10 pick who was drafted when he was 20 years old. Giving up on Flowers after two years as a pro is just asking for him to mature into a good player one year larer.
What would make him a total liability? Do you really need to ask that question? Someone who is totally overmatched at his position. Greg Robinson. Robert Gallery when he played Tackle. Winston Justice. Ian Allen. Someone who literally shows no ability to protect the quarterback or play his position. Flowers has not been a disaster at LT despite what the screamers on this site would have you believe. He latches on and dominates at times, then he gets his feet crossed up or holds his guy. That is not a total liability. Its a guy still learning the pro game speed.
Moved to right side? You realize he has NEVER played RT before right? Guard is an option if he looks like shit after this year.
And having all the tools means he has all the ability to be a top 5 LT in the league. Tying it in with skills for the position is a whole other story.
believes in some long shot making an impact. Bisnowaty is in the running for the BBI hall of fame without taking even a preseason snap.
The 6th rounder is unlikely to beat out the guy with 2 years experience, Hart, or the other guys with even more experience than Hart.
Hart was a 7th rounder who has sucked. Fluker hasn't been good, hence the low ball contract.
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did. He may not win the job but he has a legitimate opportunity to start. He isn't some shitty project like James Brewer.
Every Giant fan wants him to succeed. But with the glowing reports he got from Reese and others, we all figured he be further along by now. Maybe we expected too much, maybe Reese reached a little.
I can see were you are coming from; and I think we also agree that if we all don't see a jump in his play this season the Giant need to act next offseason by moving him inside or to RT.
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Regardless, Milton laid out the "why" above: if Fluker and Biz win the jobs it means they outplayed Jerry & Hart. Beyond that, I personally do not see it with Hart. He is both slow and weak which is a bad combination. At least Biz seems to have a power element.
But really I just want the team to be able to run the ball. Since we're a "catch and throw" offense with a 5 headed receiving monster the ball should come out quickly to negate the rush. We need to uproot people on the LOS when its hat on hat in the run game, and I think the line I mentioned gives the best chance to do so.
I prefer it to the alternative. I just think it's a stretch to write his name into a starting role. We like 'power' linemen, but Ereck Flowers is a good example of how being big and strong and mean doesn't mean you're good enough to play.
Nothing wrong with optimism, but many of these posts
are more akin to the "drowning man grasping at straws" type.
Not supporting what the Giants did in the offseason to help improve the O-line because it was basically de minimus. Flowers and Hart are problem-children to operating an effective Offense until proven otherwise. Even if Fluker and the late round picks win jobs, it is just difficult to imagine that much of an upgrade.
But at least Reese got some more weapons for Eli so that defenses have to stay true to covering the whole field (and not just OBJ), and Ellison has a proven track record so there should be more balance and efficiency on the Offense.
If he makes a smooth transition to right tackle, his superior athletic ability and aggressive nature could shine. Especially if you put him next to a big, long-armed monster like Fluker.
Hart's Pro Day...
Quote:
Offensive guard Bobby Hart (6-4 3/8, 325) ran the 40 in 5.67 seconds on both attempts. He had a 27-inch vertical jump and a 7-foot-11 broad jump. Hart did the short shuttle in 5.07 seconds and the three-cone drill in 8.08 seconds. He performed 22 reps on the bench press.
Bisnowaty's numbers are superior in every single measurable but weight. He's taller, has longer arms, bigger hands, 4/10ths of a second faster in the 40 and Bisnowaty ran the 3-cone in 7.28 seconds at the Pittsburgh pro day. Throw in the fact that Bisnowaty is in the first year of his rookie contract and you can see why it would be an exciting development for him to win/earn the starting right tackle job.
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Bisnowaty was all ACC his last two years. He has the size and measurables you look for. Many had him as one of if not the top OT heading into the season last year. It's not splitting hairs.
I prefer it to the alternative. I just think it's a stretch to write his name into a starting role. We like 'power' linemen, but Ereck Flowers is a good example of how being big and strong and mean doesn't mean you're good enough to play.
Even if its a stretch Im talking my best case scenario. But lets be clear: nobody beating out Hart is a "stretch". Hart has not shown himself to be a good starter. If your evaluation of him is different so be it.
RE: Nothing wrong with optimism, but many of these posts
are more akin to the "drowning man grasping at straws" type.
Not supporting what the Giants did in the offseason to help improve the O-line because it was basically de minimus. Flowers and Hart are problem-children to operating an effective Offense until proven otherwise. Even if Fluker and the late round picks win jobs, it is just difficult to imagine that much of an upgrade.
But at least Reese got some more weapons for Eli so that defenses have to stay true to covering the whole field (and not just OBJ), and Ellison has a proven track record so there should be more balance and efficiency on the Offense.
Wow - another evaluation of Hart I find wildly off the mark. Imagining someone with better measurables beating out Bobby freaking Hart is alin to drowning and grasping for straws? Good Lord.
Good lord yourself....its not someone beating out Hart
If we get a later round draft pick who pans out, like a Diehl for example who was a 5th rounder, they could easily supplant them. Hoping it happens just means we want to upgrade our line, and upgrade the weak links.
I know the picture is in jest, but perhaps one of Flowers defenders can find the screen capture of last season when Flowers did this exact move using his left arm on Harrison. I'm sure someone has it because there was a vocal contingent of BBI that tried to argue that the holding call was BS.
bisnowaty to take the RT job with fluker the RG would give them a chance to run the ball to the right side alot better than last year with hart and jerry over there.
pugh is looking for a big pay day but as a LG he isnt that irreplaceable they would need to over pay him,i would like pugh back he is thier best OL but with beckhams and richbergs contracts coming up i cant see him getting what he is looking for from the giants
they have a few guys on the roster that could fit at LG without blowing up the salary cap to do it,wheeler and dunker are probably eyeing that shot right now they are banking on flowers getting it this year to give them the OL they really want
who knows maybe flowers would be better at RT and bisnowaty is the next diehl and takes the LT position its not like flowers is untouchable as the LT. i dont think he has been as bad as some think but i dont think he is as good as his 9th overall pick status would expect him to be either they need to run the ball better with however plays the OT spots
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Bisnowaty was all ACC his last two years. He has the size and measurables you look for. Many had him as one of if not the top OT heading into the season last year. It's not splitting hairs.
And then, in a draft with no offensive tackles to be had, in a league that's always looking for linemen that can play at this level, he was there to be picked in the sixth round.
Not that that's 100% definitive of anything, but we're either underselling the difficulty curve of rookie linemen, or overselling on a guy who "looks the part" just like the team might have done when they picked Flowers.
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Bisnowaty was all ACC his last two years. He has the size and measurables you look for. Many had him as one of if not the top OT heading into the season last year. It's not splitting hairs.
And then, in a draft with no offensive tackles to be had, in a league that's always looking for linemen that can play at this level, he was there to be picked in the sixth round.
Not that that's 100% definitive of anything, but we're either underselling the difficulty curve of rookie linemen, or overselling on a guy who "looks the part" just like the team might have done when they picked Flowers.
Or teams simply struggle to evaluate OL talent in recent years.
it will mean we are really bad off talent wise for a RT, not trashing the guy but how bad could the veterans be at that position...
The incumbent RT is Bobby Hart. Did you watch him play last year?
yes I did watch him play last year and he was not very good but was he so bad that a rookie could come in and take his job...
Sure. Why not?
Saying that Hart was "not very good" is an understatement, in my opinion. I thought he was terrible. Now, could he improve this year? I suppose he could. It's not like he doesn't have any room for it. And for now he's penciled in as the starting RT, but the operative word is "penciled." Has he set such a high standard of OT play that the idea of a rookie coming in and taking his job is inconceivable? Not to me.
...and then there are "high floor, low ceiling" prospects. Bisnowaty could be the kind of guy who comes in and starts as a rookie but never gets all that much better. Think Mike Rosenthal. The Giants selected Petitgout in the 1st round and Rosenthal in the 5th round that year, but it was Rosenthal who started as a rookie, not Petitgout. Ultimately Petitgout had the better career, although that could be debated.
Bisnowaty, Hart, Fluker and Jerry have played a lot of football
Fluker and Jerry obviously have started almost every game the last few years at the NFL and before that in the SEC which led to them being high draft picks. Hart and Bisnowaty started almost every game of their careers in the ACC, though neither is a top talent or proven much at the NFL level. Getting 2 solid contributors on the right side of the line out of those 4 players doesn't seem unrealistic. None of them are 1 year flash in the pans like Mitch Petrus and all of them seem to have the toughness and intangibles you look for in an offensive lineman.
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Bisnowaty was all ACC his last two years. He has the size and measurables you look for. Many had him as one of if not the top OT heading into the season last year. It's not splitting hairs.
And then, in a draft with no offensive tackles to be had, in a league that's always looking for linemen that can play at this level, he was there to be picked in the sixth round.
Not that that's 100% definitive of anything, but we're either underselling the difficulty curve of rookie linemen, or overselling on a guy who "looks the part" just like the team might have done when they picked Flowers.
Or teams simply struggle to evaluate OL talent in recent years.
I don't disagree with this comment. And unfortunately, the Giants are one of the bigger offenders at that.
You'd get it if you were around during halftime of that Bears game.
Clearly.. you were not.
The 6th rounder is unlikely to beat out the guy with 2 years experience, Hart, or the other guys with even more experience than Hart.
I think the Flowers logic extends beyond just hoping he succeeds. He is a top ten pick. He has all the tools to be a monster bookend. He is cost controlled. He is going into his third year which is not an unreasonable amount of time to develop into a good Tackle in the NFL.
The Giants do not give up on prospects this early. Especially one with Flowers' measurables. The fact that he has not ever had a suitable blocking TE to help in his development is a valid point. Why people are itching to move on from him when there is literally no better option is still perplexing to me. Until he proves to be a total liability, he is our best bet at LT.
I generally always want to see the guy with the greater upside win the job as long as he actually wins it by realizing his potential.
Should he stay at left tackle if his play equals last year?
How much of a dip from last year should make the Giants act?
We all heard the excuses/reasons of why he should stay there.
Well this is the year most experts and fans say expect a jump in his play, and every Giant fan wants that; but if he continues to play like last year even after all the hard work he put in.....then what?
When should he be moved inside or to the RT spot if he has not improved? This year, next...when?
What would make him a total liability, in your words?
Does he have all the tools to be a very good left tackle, probably.
Having the tools and using to their fullest extend is another thing?
We all are hoping for that jump but we want it to be this year.
I could see Fluker winning the RT spot, I think he is a better T than G... but seems the Giants want him as a RG. Honestly I would pull for that, he is massive and strong. I would think it helps the run game more than any other change. He had a rough time at G for SD.
Bisnowaty is a wildcard, but I think he makes the roster as a backup this year.
back ups Wheeler- Halapio- Jones- Jerry- Hart
And if Flowers sucks, at least it's a pretty deep OT draft class next year
Who in their right mind HOPES for Jerry to start??
Ivan, if Flowers shits the bed again, he'll have another year on his rookie contract remaining. This year will determine if the Giants pick-up his 5th year option as the deadline will be in May. Even if Flowers somehow proves competent, I suspect the 5th year option is off the table as it is calculated differently for players chosen in the Top 10. This year the 5th year option for OL picked in the Top 10 is more than $13MM. So far his body of work will be earning him a prove it deal like Fluker for $1MM/yr.
Chad Wheeler is a much better fit on the left side at the moment because he is better in pass pro than run blocking. If Bisnowaty won the starting RT job then Wheeler would possibly be the swing tackle this season. With a year in an NFL strength and conditioning program Wheeler could battle for a starting spot in a year. Wheeler and Jarron Jones have the highest upsides among the UDFA's.
Should he stay at left tackle if his play equals last year?
How much of a dip from last year should make the Giants act?
We all heard the excuses/reasons of why he should stay there.
Well this is the year most experts and fans say expect a jump in his play, and every Giant fan wants that; but if he continues to play like last year even after all the hard work he put in.....then what?
When should he be moved inside or to the RT spot if he has not improved? This year, next...when?
What would make him a total liability, in your words?
Does he have all the tools to be a very good left tackle, probably.
Having the tools and using to their fullest extend is another thing?
We all are hoping for that jump but we want it to be this year.
I am going to attempt to answer all of your questions even though you seemed to ask the same ones a couple times.
If after this year he makes no step forward, then you know that it should be addressed next offseason. The guy just turned 23. He looked good in spots his rookie year when he was thrust into starting then injuring his ankle. You have to do your due diligence with a top 10 pick who was drafted when he was 20 years old. Giving up on Flowers after two years as a pro is just asking for him to mature into a good player one year larer.
What would make him a total liability? Do you really need to ask that question? Someone who is totally overmatched at his position. Greg Robinson. Robert Gallery when he played Tackle. Winston Justice. Ian Allen. Someone who literally shows no ability to protect the quarterback or play his position. Flowers has not been a disaster at LT despite what the screamers on this site would have you believe. He latches on and dominates at times, then he gets his feet crossed up or holds his guy. That is not a total liability. Its a guy still learning the pro game speed.
Moved to right side? You realize he has NEVER played RT before right? Guard is an option if he looks like shit after this year.
And having all the tools means he has all the ability to be a top 5 LT in the league. Tying it in with skills for the position is a whole other story.
The 6th rounder is unlikely to beat out the guy with 2 years experience, Hart, or the other guys with even more experience than Hart.
Hart was a 7th rounder who has sucked. Fluker hasn't been good, hence the low ball contract.
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did. He may not win the job but he has a legitimate opportunity to start. He isn't some shitty project like James Brewer.
I can see were you are coming from; and I think we also agree that if we all don't see a jump in his play this season the Giant need to act next offseason by moving him inside or to RT.
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
But really I just want the team to be able to run the ball. Since we're a "catch and throw" offense with a 5 headed receiving monster the ball should come out quickly to negate the rush. We need to uproot people on the LOS when its hat on hat in the run game, and I think the line I mentioned gives the best chance to do so.
Not supporting what the Giants did in the offseason to help improve the O-line because it was basically de minimus. Flowers and Hart are problem-children to operating an effective Offense until proven otherwise. Even if Fluker and the late round picks win jobs, it is just difficult to imagine that much of an upgrade.
But at least Reese got some more weapons for Eli so that defenses have to stay true to covering the whole field (and not just OBJ), and Ellison has a proven track record so there should be more balance and efficiency on the Offense.
Hart's Pro Day...
Bisnowaty's numbers are superior in every single measurable but weight. He's taller, has longer arms, bigger hands, 4/10ths of a second faster in the 40 and Bisnowaty ran the 3-cone in 7.28 seconds at the Pittsburgh pro day. Throw in the fact that Bisnowaty is in the first year of his rookie contract and you can see why it would be an exciting development for him to win/earn the starting right tackle job.
Quote:
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Bisnowaty was all ACC his last two years. He has the size and measurables you look for. Many had him as one of if not the top OT heading into the season last year. It's not splitting hairs.
Even if its a stretch Im talking my best case scenario. But lets be clear: nobody beating out Hart is a "stretch". Hart has not shown himself to be a good starter. If your evaluation of him is different so be it.
Not supporting what the Giants did in the offseason to help improve the O-line because it was basically de minimus. Flowers and Hart are problem-children to operating an effective Offense until proven otherwise. Even if Fluker and the late round picks win jobs, it is just difficult to imagine that much of an upgrade.
But at least Reese got some more weapons for Eli so that defenses have to stay true to covering the whole field (and not just OBJ), and Ellison has a proven track record so there should be more balance and efficiency on the Offense.
Wow - another evaluation of Hart I find wildly off the mark. Imagining someone with better measurables beating out Bobby freaking Hart is alin to drowning and grasping for straws? Good Lord.
Its that even if someone does, the expectation that the O-line will really be much better is the grasping.
Its that even if someone does, the expectation that the O-line will really be much better is the grasping.
It can be much better run blocking that is for damn sure.
Well at least we'll see if Flowers has refined his choke-hold technique when Harrison wheels past him.
I know the picture is in jest, but perhaps one of Flowers defenders can find the screen capture of last season when Flowers did this exact move using his left arm on Harrison. I'm sure someone has it because there was a vocal contingent of BBI that tried to argue that the holding call was BS.
but alas, onto 2017...
pugh is looking for a big pay day but as a LG he isnt that irreplaceable they would need to over pay him,i would like pugh back he is thier best OL but with beckhams and richbergs contracts coming up i cant see him getting what he is looking for from the giants
they have a few guys on the roster that could fit at LG without blowing up the salary cap to do it,wheeler and dunker are probably eyeing that shot right now they are banking on flowers getting it this year to give them the OL they really want
who knows maybe flowers would be better at RT and bisnowaty is the next diehl and takes the LT position its not like flowers is untouchable as the LT. i dont think he has been as bad as some think but i dont think he is as good as his 9th overall pick status would expect him to be either they need to run the ball better with however plays the OT spots
Quote:
In comment 13488126 WillVAB said:
Quote:
Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Bisnowaty was all ACC his last two years. He has the size and measurables you look for. Many had him as one of if not the top OT heading into the season last year. It's not splitting hairs.
And then, in a draft with no offensive tackles to be had, in a league that's always looking for linemen that can play at this level, he was there to be picked in the sixth round.
Not that that's 100% definitive of anything, but we're either underselling the difficulty curve of rookie linemen, or overselling on a guy who "looks the part" just like the team might have done when they picked Flowers.
Quote:
In comment 13488193 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 13488126 WillVAB said:
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Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Bisnowaty was all ACC his last two years. He has the size and measurables you look for. Many had him as one of if not the top OT heading into the season last year. It's not splitting hairs.
And then, in a draft with no offensive tackles to be had, in a league that's always looking for linemen that can play at this level, he was there to be picked in the sixth round.
Not that that's 100% definitive of anything, but we're either underselling the difficulty curve of rookie linemen, or overselling on a guy who "looks the part" just like the team might have done when they picked Flowers.
Or teams simply struggle to evaluate OL talent in recent years.
The incumbent RT is Bobby Hart. Did you watch him play last year?
I think our Tackles did a fairly good job in 2016 at showing how bad you can be at that position...
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it will mean we are really bad off talent wise for a RT, not trashing the guy but how bad could the veterans be at that position...
The incumbent RT is Bobby Hart. Did you watch him play last year?
yes I did watch him play last year and he was not very good but was he so bad that a rookie could come in and take his job...
The incumbent RT is Bobby Hart. Did you watch him play last year?
yes I did watch him play last year and he was not very good but was he so bad that a rookie could come in and take his job...
Sure. Why not?
Saying that Hart was "not very good" is an understatement, in my opinion. I thought he was terrible. Now, could he improve this year? I suppose he could. It's not like he doesn't have any room for it. And for now he's penciled in as the starting RT, but the operative word is "penciled." Has he set such a high standard of OT play that the idea of a rookie coming in and taking his job is inconceivable? Not to me.
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In comment 13488304 WillVAB said:
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In comment 13488193 Ten Ton Hammer said:
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In comment 13488126 WillVAB said:
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Bisnowaty has a much better resume heading into the league than Hart when he did.
I think when you're talking about 6th vs 7th rounders, you're really kind of splitting hairs. Hart started for two years for a big time college football power and an eventual national championship team. He didn't exactly have a college career of little significance.
I hope for the best with Bisnowaty, but there is a little bit of wild optimism at play here. I see a lot of people commenting as if they're expecting him to make some kind of impact as a rookie.
Bisnowaty was all ACC his last two years. He has the size and measurables you look for. Many had him as one of if not the top OT heading into the season last year. It's not splitting hairs.
And then, in a draft with no offensive tackles to be had, in a league that's always looking for linemen that can play at this level, he was there to be picked in the sixth round.
Not that that's 100% definitive of anything, but we're either underselling the difficulty curve of rookie linemen, or overselling on a guy who "looks the part" just like the team might have done when they picked Flowers.
Or teams simply struggle to evaluate OL talent in recent years.
I don't disagree with this comment. And unfortunately, the Giants are one of the bigger offenders at that.