is Isaac or Monk or Fox, of guys I think have a shot. I'd be okay with several others though, including Smith and Frank -- if that's what the scouts say, so be it.
In the 2nd I'd like a linebacker defender. A guy who is 20 pounds of muscle too big to be a wing, but plays it anyway. And who starts fights, even in practice. This team is tissue paper soft. Need some sandpaper.
is Isaac or Monk or Fox, of guys I think have a shot. I'd be okay with several others though, including Smith and Frank -- if that's what the scouts say, so be it.
In the 2nd I'd like a linebacker defender. A guy who is 20 pounds of muscle too big to be a wing, but plays it anyway. And who starts fights, even in practice. This team is tissue paper soft. Need some sandpaper.
I don't think there is any chance Fox is available. I'd do back flips if he made it to 8. I think he has a legit shot to be the best player in this draft down the road
is Isaac or Monk or Fox, of guys I think have a shot. I'd be okay with several others though, including Smith and Frank -- if that's what the scouts say, so be it.
In the 2nd I'd like a linebacker defender. A guy who is 20 pounds of muscle too big to be a wing, but plays it anyway. And who starts fights, even in practice. This team is tissue paper soft. Need some sandpaper.
I don't think there is any chance Fox is available. I'd do back flips if he made it to 8. I think he has a legit shot to be the best player in this draft down the road
I think the mortal locks to go before us at Fultz, Ball, and Jackson. There is a story where everyone else could slip, albeit a very low % for some (Tatum, Fox). Say Tatum to Celts, the other locks top 4. Sac decides Isaac is the shit. Magic dont want to pair Fox and Elf do to shooting, so they go Monk. Minny just took a PG and/or has the same concerns about shooting, so goes Markkanen, Smith, or off the board. Fox then falls to 8. Low chance, but plausible. Implausible is all those teams passing on Jackson.
RE: Berman says that the Nuggets called the Knicks about Mudiay
but in a sport where one guy can change the entire fortunes of a team, it bothers me that his team was awful. Same with Ben Simmons. It's not hard to make the NCAA tournament, and both LSU and Washington the last 2 years didn't even sniff the tournament.
that's a fantastic get for the Wolves if it goes thru. 7 is a ?. Lavine is a good player, could be Butler good but unlikely, and not soon. You're gonna have to max Lavine soon, and he's also hurt. Dunn's first year was so bad that you have to write off the draft position. Not even clearly a rotation guard going forward IMO.
Butler is gonna do so much for them. He will make them better than just his play. He will teach them how to win. I also think he's easy top 15, maybe top 10. I think they're getting him on the cheap because of the GSW/CLE fear. Love is a worse player who returned #1 overall.
just don't think he will be able to play point unless its triangle offense, and I dont see the triangle here long because i dont think Phil lasts more than 2 years
We're going to get stuck with this fucking French schmuck, aren't we?
You're better than that
LOL, better than what?
I don't care that he's French. I just can't spell his last name and don't like the player.
And it pisses me the fuck off that the Knicks can be as shitty as they were and STILL not get an impact player in the draft.
Frenchy Guy could be a total bust, lol, but this is eerily reminiscent of what people were mad about when they drafted KP. He was gonna sit for years and maybe be an NBA starter someday.
We're going to get stuck with this fucking French schmuck, aren't we?
You're better than that
LOL, better than what?
I don't care that he's French. I just can't spell his last name and don't like the player.
And it pisses me the fuck off that the Knicks can be as shitty as they were and STILL not get an impact player in the draft.
Frenchy Guy could be a total bust, lol, but this is eerily reminiscent of what people were mad about when they drafted KP. He was gonna sit for years and maybe be an NBA starter someday.
I think people were scarred from Bargnani when they took KP and were afraid we were getting another soft Euro.
that we're drafting guys to fit a system that won't be here more than 2 years. I mean I know Phil is calling the shots now but in 2 years we're going to be running something completely different. Swing for the fences, not for a double down the left field line
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
Smith apparently wouldn't do medicals on his knees.
The idea is to try and get a kid with a high ceiling. I'd rather take a boom or bust player than a fucking role player. These are the types of guys you can usually find in free agency or by making smaller scale trades. Spending the 8th pick on a guy with limited upside sucks.
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
I hope Batum isn't his ceiling. You're talking about a non-all star who's not much of a different maker out there
The idea is to try and get a kid with a high ceiling. I'd rather take a boom or bust player than a fucking role player. These are the types of guys you can usually find in free agency or by making smaller scale trades. Spending the 8th pick on a guy with limited upside sucks.
Doesn't matter what pro sport it is- when teams take a foreign player or a non- name player, the fans scream about how their club made a massive error because their team did not draft the name player the media spoon fed them.
Of course, most posters/fans couldn't scout a pro prospect to save their lives, but it doesn't stop them from expressing their opinion LOUDLY and OFTEN.
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
I hope Batum isn't his ceiling. You're talking about a non-all star who's not much of a different maker out there
Batum had the skills to be a star, he just didnt have the mental drive I think.
That's my thing on these players. Their mental makeup is so important. It's the difference between Kobe and a host of guys with better measurables. Whose to say Frank has Batum's makeup?
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
I hope Batum isn't his ceiling. You're talking about a non-all star who's not much of a different maker out there
What?
Batum is a great player.
I have no strong feelings about the French kid either way
The idea is to try and get a kid with a high ceiling. I'd rather take a boom or bust player than a fucking role player. These are the types of guys you can usually find in free agency or by making smaller scale trades. Spending the 8th pick on a guy with limited upside sucks.
how do you know what the kid is going to be?
No one does, but if you think his ceiling is higher than Monk, I completely disagree.
The idea is to try and get a kid with a high ceiling. I'd rather take a boom or bust player than a fucking role player. These are the types of guys you can usually find in free agency or by making smaller scale trades. Spending the 8th pick on a guy with limited upside sucks.
how do you know what the kid is going to be?
No one does, but if you think his ceiling is higher than Monk, I completely disagree.
The single thing the Knicks have is a guy who is good at recognizing European players in Gaines. If he really likes Frank, I'm on board. Monk and Smith both came with a ton of questions as well.
Porzingis is a singular player. There really aren't any comps for him. Nothing about Frenchy is special.
The situations are really similar, tbh. Let's not pretend anyone was selling porzingis at the time as some special player. People went nuts because he was sold as a huge project.
I'd love to be wrong about the kid. You'll have to forgive me, as virtually nothing the Knicks have done in the last 2 decades has instilled any confidence.
It just seems like most people have him pegged as a role player. The odds of him being more than that appear awfully slim.
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
I hope Batum isn't his ceiling. You're talking about a non-all star who's not much of a different maker out there
Two best players are both miserable, coach is running a system he dislikes, and the team president is incompetent. Oh, and we have the worst owner in sports.
I'd love to be wrong about the kid. You'll have to forgive me, as virtually nothing the Knicks have done in the last 2 decades has instilled any confidence.
It just seems like most people have him pegged as a role player. The odds of him being more than that appear awfully slim.
Look, I'm squarely basing this on how well they've done drafting from europe. It's paper thin reasoning, I'm aware.
Look, I fully admit I did not like the KP pick and happily that was a great pick. Maybe this kid turns into something. But I'm taking Malik Monk all day long. Hope I'm wrong. God the fucking Knicks are such a joke. I'm fucking livid with this pick.
I'd love to be wrong about the kid. You'll have to forgive me, as virtually nothing the Knicks have done in the last 2 decades has instilled any confidence.
It just seems like most people have him pegged as a role player. The odds of him being more than that appear awfully slim.
If there is one thing, it's recent draft picks of Euros. KP and Willy. I dont hold the Greek or Louis L against them as it was the ass end of a shitty draft -- doesnt look like they made a big miss there. Black and Felicio look good tho.
maybe the Knicks can work magic and trade into lottery for him. Oh that's right we don't have any assets. I'll give frenchy a shot, I do like a few things about his game. I just want more talent and youth on this roster.
major thing between frenchy and KP was people at least said KP had a huge ceiling, I think we just got a safe rotational/starter here. There's not much star potential, just a solid all around game.
He's not a real point. Average athlete. Average handle. Decent shot this year, lousy before, remind to be seen if the improvement lasts. For all the talk about his D, it's mostly projection based on long arms.
I'd love to be wrong about the kid. You'll have to forgive me, as virtually nothing the Knicks have done in the last 2 decades has instilled any confidence.
It just seems like most people have him pegged as a role player. The odds of him being more than that appear awfully slim.
If there is one thing, it's recent draft picks of Euros. KP and Willy. I dont hold the Greek or Louis L against them as it was the ass end of a shitty draft -- doesnt look like they made a big miss there. Black and Felicio look good tho.
Yeah, I get it - I just feel like if he's "good regular" that doesn't really move the needle much at all.
I'd rather just swing for the fences.
I feel like both Monk and DSJ will be better players.
He's not a real point. Average athlete. Average handle. Decent shot this year, lousy before, remind to be seen if the improvement lasts. For all the talk about his D, it's mostly projection based on long arms.
So what is the standout gift he hangs his hat on?
Holy fucking shit. Talk about a pessimistic view. I know you don't actually believe all of that.
that it seems like a system pick more than anything.
I know Phil can't look at it this way, but i'm going to be a fan of the Knicks long after Phil is gone, and does anyone here think Phil is going to last more than 2 years? I certainly dont
How many times have you seen him play?
From someone who has seen him play "A true point guard with a pass first mentality He can control the pace of the game nicely Excellent passer with great court vision He is always looking to find the open teammate He can pass on the move and also while penetrating Excels on the open court and loves to run the break Great ball handler He has a nice hesitation dribble and he has also an improving crossover dribble on his repertoire Possesses an explosive first step."
major thing between frenchy and KP was people at least said KP had a huge ceiling, I think we just got a safe rotational/starter here. There's not much star potential, just a solid all around game.
What this said. In a horseshit season where we were out of playoff contention by December, we drafted the French George Hill. Would rather have gone with Monk or Mitchell here, then Frank Mason and Deandre Burton in red 2.
really a fan of that trade for the Bulls, unless they could have kept #16. The Finnish guy can shoot, but looks like he needs to add weight. Levine can play, but is coming off a torn ACL. Dunn is an unknown.
Bitching gets you nowhere. There are plenty of reasons to like the pick.
Only if you are opposing the Knicks or think the triangle can actually succeed without someone like Jordan, Shaq, or Kobe. There is nothing that says All-Star about any aspect of Frenchy's game. Monk or DSJ have far more upside.
He's not a real point. Average athlete. Average handle. Decent shot this year, lousy before, remind to be seen if the improvement lasts. For all the talk about his D, it's mostly projection based on long arms.
So what is the standout gift he hangs his hat on?
Holy fucking shit. Talk about a pessimistic view. I know you don't actually believe all of that.
He's not a real point. Average athlete. Average handle. Decent shot this year, lousy before, remind to be seen if the improvement lasts. For all the talk about his D, it's mostly projection based on long arms.
So what is the standout gift he hangs his hat on?
I don't want to come off as a homer, because i'm razor's edge close to ditching this team, but he's 19 years old. Everything about him is projection. They didn't just pull his name out of a homeless dude's hat. He was projected to be drafted where he was, so people think he clearly can play at a high enough level to be a top ten nba draft pick.
Hate hate this pick. Giannis and KP were described as raw with a high upside. No one - nobody is describing Frank as this. "Hopefully he's a starter". Great. I can't believe they passed on Monk and DSJ for him. Hope I'm wrong.
But can we please stop with the KP comparisons? Sure fans booed, but the one thing about that pick was that while it was widely acknowledged that he was raw and would take years to develop, the common thoughts were that his ceiling was incredible. If he could get there. To say otherwise is revisionist bullshit. We all took solace in the fact, afterwards, that MAYBE we had something special on our hands. Has ANYONE that has seen Frenchy play say that? The best I've heard so far is that he "can be a starter". Maybe he will work out, but to keep saying "we said the same thing two years ago" is a terrible comparison. Everyone thought that KP had a very high ceiling. Frenchy? Maybe a starter. Big difference.
I hope he becomes an all star, but I have yet to see anyone in the know suggest that at this point.
major thing between frenchy and KP was people at least said KP had a huge ceiling, I think we just got a safe rotational/starter here. There's not much star potential, just a solid all around game.
I don't know how anyone can say an 18 year old kid that played well with grown men and has the size and length and shot that frank possesses has limited upside. This is the herd mentality. One guy says it the rest follow suit. He wouldn't be rated top ten virtually everywhere if he didn't have major upside..
Honestly, I'm not sure we need a "star" as much as we need an underrated floor leader anyway. Monk is nice but do we really want a scoring guard or the cerebral defensive pg? Gimme the latter.
I would have been happy with smith monk or frank but if they all turn out to be equals I would want frank. We need that type of player.
RE: I still think the Knicks are going to try to move Melo tonight
Someone said Khris Middleton and I guess that's his upside. Middleton is bigger, longer and more athletic though. 40% 3 point shooter is a lofty expectation for any player also.
But can we please stop with the KP comparisons? Sure fans booed, but the one thing about that pick was that while it was widely acknowledged that he was raw and would take years to develop, the common thoughts were that his ceiling was incredible. If he could get there. To say otherwise is revisionist bullshit. We all took solace in the fact, afterwards, that MAYBE we had something special on our hands. Has ANYONE that has seen Frenchy play say that? The best I've heard so far is that he "can be a starter". Maybe he will work out, but to keep saying "we said the same thing two years ago" is a terrible comparison. Everyone thought that KP had a very high ceiling. Frenchy? Maybe a starter. Big difference.
I hope he becomes an all star, but I have yet to see anyone in the know suggest that at this point.
The point of citing the Porzingis draft is not to compare the player. It's to highlight the fact that nobody knew a damn thing about Porzingis. Including the people who watched him play. Nobody really got it right other than the obvious, that someone his size with that shot had incredible potential. Even the experts that liked Porzingis figured he had a CHANCE to be a starter in years.
The most interesting player in this draft may be point guard Frank Ntilikina of France. Ntilikina is just 18 years old, and in just under 600 minutes in French league Pro-A this season, he shot an above-average 43 percent from behind the 3-point line, equaling an eFG percentage of 57. His efficient play at such a young age in Europe makes him the most likely member of this class to play at an All-Star level, but his limited minutes and the unknowns that accompany the fact that he is coming from Europe, also give him a 59 percent chance of being a bust according to our model.
1. How many games of Frank have you seen? Enough to get a gauge of his athleticism and skills with the ball in his hands. How many games of DSJ and Monk have I seen? Many more, and guess what, they actually do things that good basketball players do, I don't have to pray/imagine either of those two doing them.
2. He fits the triangle better. Phil will be gone in 2 years, nobody plays the system. And what does a triangel player even mean? Why don't we fill a roster full of Ivy League players in short shorts to make Phil happy?
3. He isn't a me-first player. How do we know what DSJ and Monk will become? It's like saying you'd rather have Duhon, who didn't shoot because he couldn't, than Baron Davis or Stevie Francis.
This is like Phil drafting a Ron Harper before he has a Michael Jordan or Scottie Pippen. Smith and Monk have "play-now" skills but you refuse to project the other aspects of their games, yet you are all projections when it comes to Frenchy? We have no talent except for KP, whom Phil is trying to trade, but we are looking for role players for a system?
WTF?! This is different than KP. KP could do things at 7-3 that Frenchy can't at 6-5.
And why does it matter how many of his games I have seen? I have seen many of Monk's and Smith's games, and they have the present performance to go with their potential.
Chris Brickley, a former Knicks assistant coach who now trains NBA players and has worked with Ntilikina, says the Frenchmans stroke is NBA ready. He has proof, too: theres an arduous drill Brickley likes to put his players through; it consists of launching 100 3s from different spots on the floor. Brickley says that when Kevin Durant runs through it, hell nail around 80 percent. Most guards, he adds, drain about 70.
And the first time I ran Frank through, says Brickley, he hit 78.
NOBODY (inc the Knicks ) know what his ceiling is. He could be the best pick in this draft (or the biggest bust). They like his IQ and his maturity on court at 18. My biggest issue is who runs the point next season? There will be more to this off season for sure. Rubio would be perfect for many reasons.
athletically gifted and dynamic with the ball. This is not drafting a foreign player with little to no tape who has unique all-league talent. This is drafting a foreign player with little to no tape whom you hope fit a role in your system.
The problem is, we have NOTHING!!
So the thinking is Smith and Monk will make multiple all-stars teams and have lengthy highlgiht reels but play on bad teams while our Frenchy contributes to our many championships....
I don't know why so many people are comfortable making that leap....
RE: Quickness is the polite way of saying someone isn't fast, lol
athletically gifted and dynamic with the ball. This is not drafting a foreign player with little to no tape who has unique all-league talent. This is drafting a foreign player with little to no tape whom you hope fit a role in your system.
The problem is, we have NOTHING!!
So the thinking is Smith and Monk will make multiple all-stars teams and have lengthy highlgiht reels but play on bad teams while our Frenchy contributes to our many championships....
I don't know why so many people are comfortable making that leap....
Man, all this stuff is a leap. D'Angelo Russell was supposed to make multiple all star teams too.
Improve on the defensive end, wolves could be fielding 3 top 15-20 players (KAT and butler could both be top 10) next season. Suddenly Rubio and dieng don't look awful as 4th/5th options
I can't get mad at this. Knicks needed a pg and took one that nearly everyone had ranked pretty high. And he's younger than any of them, played in a man's league and seems to be defensive minded with a J.
I'll save my anger for the 300 days of the year that the knicks do something really stupid. This ain't one of them.
Many of the same people saying this guy has no upside are the same ones that said KP was going to need 2-3 years to even approach what he did in 15-16. No one knows shit. He's 18.
I can't get mad at this. Knicks needed a pg and took one that nearly everyone had ranked pretty high. And he's younger than any of them, played in a man's league and seems to be defensive minded with a J.
I'll save my anger for the 300 days of the year that the knicks do something really stupid. This ain't one of them.
Many of the same people saying this guy has no upside are the same ones that said KP was going to need 2-3 years to even approach what he did in 15-16. No one knows shit. He's 18.
I get this. But every Knick fan has every right to vent with this franchise. They are irrelevant. Hopefully it starts to turn now.
Jackson had a handle and quickness (when he was young). Does this guy?
Jackson was never quick. Quicker than me sure. Quicker than most NBA pgs even in the pg challenged era of 1989? No. He wasn't quick.
before he started putting on weight he was plenty quick. He wasn't KJ blazing past people for dunks, but he had enough wiggle to regularly get in the lane.
Reminds me of when the Knicks drafted KP. Nary a good word said about him and people went home angry. Some things never change in the world of Knick fans.
He's flying back to France tonight to be with his team as they play
I can't get mad at this. Knicks needed a pg and took one that nearly everyone had ranked pretty high. And he's younger than any of them, played in a man's league and seems to be defensive minded with a J.
I'll save my anger for the 300 days of the year that the knicks do something really stupid. This ain't one of them.
Many of the same people saying this guy has no upside are the same ones that said KP was going to need 2-3 years to even approach what he did in 15-16. No one knows shit. He's 18.
I get this. But every Knick fan has every right to vent with this franchise. They are irrelevant. Hopefully it starts to turn now.
I don't question how terrible they are but moments like this when the knicks bring in young intriguing talent are to be treasured. He's an intriguing prospect. We will see how it goes.
how rare it's been for the Knicks to actually have a lottery pick.
This and two years ago were literally the two most enjoyable moments for me as a knicks since 1999. I did enjoy the 54 win season under Woodson but the excitement leading up to KP and tonight trump that. That's how bad this has gotten.
Knowing we have our picks next year and beyond makes me feel good but we have to hit them. Please let Frankie be a beast one day.
Video of Frank with the NBA's top workout guru, Chris Brickley
cbrickley603If you ask me, @frank_ntilikina is the most talented, high IQ, hard working, humble prospect in the draft‼️‼️SKY IS THE LIMIT"
and his next quote suggests, he went straight to his gym, after he got off the plane this morning..
Quote:
cbrickley603@frank_ntilikina Straight off the plane ✈️ // One of my favorite and most talented point guards in the 2017 draft‼️ #7AMworkoutGRIND //📸 #TheAcademy
Not shocked in the least. I'd use melo as a super sub 6th man let him play big minutes in that role and give the keys to KP. This is assuming we don't trade melo in the summer.
I don't know enough about this kid to opine on good or bad pick
But here's the fucking question that hasn't been answered for 3 years - are the Knicks going to run the triangle or not? If so, OK, a PG with potential to fit could be a good pick.
But then, why the fuck did we hire Horny as a coach? To run some kind of quasi triangle? That wasn't really the triangle? Or is Jax going to run more triangle camps?
Oh by the way, I'm so fucking sick of the triangle. And Big Chief Triangle needs to go back to LA and beg his girl to take him back.
Frank and his work ethic/ playing style is everything this franchise needs. Pray this kid pans out because if his play style reaches its potential it's going to elevate the knicks big time. He might be a dud but if he's the goods we're gonna be happy he was the pick over a guy like monk. Monk could be a shinier player but the knicks don't need shiny. They need a junk yard dog floor leader. He needs to be a star but not a scoring star. That's just my opinion maybe I'm wrong.
RE: I guess we aren't trading lee or oquinn or melo for picks
Not shocked in the least. I'd use melo as a super sub 6th man let him play big minutes in that role and give the keys to KP. This is assuming we don't trade melo in the summer.
Frank and his work ethic/ playing style is everything this franchise needs. Pray this kid pans out because if his play style reaches its potential it's going to elevate the knicks big time. He might be a dud but if he's the goods we're gonna be happy he was the pick over a guy like monk. Monk could be a shinier player but the knicks don't need shiny. They need a junk yard dog floor leader. He needs to be a star but not a scoring star. That's just my opinion maybe I'm wrong.
knicks havnt had a defensive stopper at point in a long time..
i wanted mitchell to pair with him as a young defensive back court but i will settle for josh hart...
RE: I don't know enough about this kid to opine on good or bad pick
But here's the fucking question that hasn't been answered for 3 years - are the Knicks going to run the triangle or not? If so, OK, a PG with potential to fit could be a good pick.
But then, why the fuck did we hire Horny as a coach? To run some kind of quasi triangle? That wasn't really the triangle? Or is Jax going to run more triangle camps?
Oh by the way, I'm so fucking sick of the triangle. And Big Chief Triangle needs to go back to LA and beg his girl to take him back.
Towards the end of the season, they doubled down on Triangle and said they were re-committed to it.
but I have to trust the Knicks' European scouts. They've done a good job.
Melo cannot be on this team next season. We must turn the fucking page.
Yep. I see zero positive to having him around. He'll likely hurt our draft position for next year, and I think guys like Kristaps will be better off in the long run not having him on the team.
Turn the page is the best way to put it. Even if it means buying him out we have to do it
Frank and his work ethic/ playing style is everything this franchise needs. Pray this kid pans out because if his play style reaches its potential it's going to elevate the knicks big time. He might be a dud but if he's the goods we're gonna be happy he was the pick over a guy like monk. Monk could be a shinier player but the knicks don't need shiny. They need a junk yard dog floor leader. He needs to be a star but not a scoring star. That's just my opinion maybe I'm wrong.
I couldn't agree more. If KP gets his head out of his ass. Rose is gone for sure and Melo either plays fiddle to KP or traded.
In that scenario, KP is the teams alpha and much happier as a result, he becomes the "good kid/man" again and loves NY and meets Phil next year. And Frank can bring that hard working selfless culture to the team and put Kristaps in the absolute best state mentally and on the floor.
They will grow together. They're combined ages are younger then Vince Carter.
I absolute LOVE the pick.
Monk is probly better but I like this "culture change" pick.
It's what's best as long as he can play Pg. hopefully he gets big mins as a rookie.
We should probly keep Lee now just as some sort of mentor or trade him for a better one. And sign some old fuck who was good and can teach.
RE: RE: Frank was clearly the least exciting choice there,
but I have to trust the Knicks' European scouts. They've done a good job.
Melo cannot be on this team next season. We must turn the fucking page.
Yep. I see zero positive to having him around. He'll likely hurt our draft position for next year, and I think guys like Kristaps will be better off in the long run not having him on the team.
Turn the page is the best way to put it. Even if it means buying him out we have to do it
I have to agree with you both.
I'd love to keep Melo as a 6th man but he simply wouldn't be happy in that role and would keep the toxic vibe going.
Buy him out if it comes to it. Start super fresh with these two kids.
And was just trying to humble him. And if he doesn't make anymore dumb FA signings this season then I will be a PUMPED UP KNICKS FAN , especially if they fetch something for Melo
ESPN graphic above - Knicks draft eye highest ceiling player in the draft by far
I got super high on Monk the past few weeks, but originally months ago Frank was the guy I wanted.
I absolutely was furious at first but now I'm super happy with this pick and think his upside is pretty decent. I love his attitude and all around game. Doesn't seem like he will ever be an elite scorer tho but he can be an extremely efficient one it seems along with making everyone around him better.
The Walt Clyde Frazier comparison is actually a great one.
ESPN graphic above - Knicks draft eye highest ceiling player in the draft by far
I got super high on Monk the past few weeks, but originally months ago Frank was the guy I wanted.
I absolutely was furious at first but now I'm super happy with this pick and think his upside is pretty decent. I love his attitude and all around game. Doesn't seem like he will ever be an elite scorer tho but he can be an extremely efficient one it seems along with making everyone around him better.
The Walt Clyde Frazier comparison is actually a great one.
Walt Clyde Frazier was one of the greatest PG's of all time. If this guy becomes a 1/4 of the player Frazier was we should be happy.
"Strengths: Elite size for a point guard with very good athleticism and quickness Impressive wingspan (close to 7 ft) Very mature for his age with a good basketball IQ He has a thin frame, but his body structure suggests that he can add weight and increase his muscle tone nicely A true point guard with a pass first mentality He can control the pace of the game nicely Excellent passer with great court vision He is always looking to find the open teammate He can pass on the move and also while penetrating Excels on the open court and loves to run the break Great ball handler He has a nice hesitation dribble and he has also an improving crossover dribble on his repertoire Possesses an explosive first step Really good on ISO situations thanks to his athleticism, length and excellent ball handling He can create his own shoot and score off the dribble from mid-range and has also a floater as a counter move When he has time to gather he can finish strong at the rim Improving 3-point shooter He is already very good on Pick and Roll situations as the ball handler, because he shows patience and is always looking for the right choice His body and physical tools are his biggest weapons on Defense He has great lateral quickness which helps him stay in front of his man When he is motivated on Defense he can be a lockdown defender His length and athleticism help him make a lot of steals Versatile defender with the potential to guard multiple positions in the future He has a high upside
Weaknesses: He really needs to add some muscle to his body or else he could have problems at the next level He hasnt been tested at a senior level yet His shooting release looks a little odd at times and thats the main reason he isnt a consistent shooter from long range yet He needs to become more vocal and learn when he has to take over a game At times he is too unselfish and too keen to pass the ball and as a result he looks passive He must add some aggressiveness to his game He has problems finishing through contact at the rim due to his thin body and at times he looks like he is even avoiding contact, settling for a mid-range shot He has problems against physical game He isnt always focused on defense At times he forgets to keep a low stance when he is guarding his opponent and as a result he can be crossed easily He relies too much on his length to make steals when he gets crossed, which leads to bad fouls He has problems defending the Pick and Roll, looking lost at times Stronger players can post him up
Overall: Ntilikina is undoubtedly one of the best International players of his generation. His elite physical tools and feel for the game, combined with his high upside makes him a really intriguing prospect ... He is not NBA ready just yet, but he has all the tools to become a very good player in the future ...
Notes: He was born in Belgium and he is originating from Rwanda, but he was raised in France He was a member of the France team that won the U16 European Championship in 2014 He was named French League Best Young Player in 2015/16 season ...
Isaiah Hartenstein of Germany
Sindarius Thornwell of South Carolina
John Motley of Baylor
Ike Anigbogu of UCLA
Edmond Sumner of Xavier
Monte Morris of Iowa State
Tyler Dorsey of Oregon
Jaron Blossomgame of Clemson
PJ Dozier of South Carolina
but speaking to what Deej said earlier, would have liked a guy like Thornwell. Tough as nails. A bulldog. Excellent defender. Think we need a huge culture change and Thornwell is as tough as they come
Strengths: Jaramaz is talented European PG with size and speed ... A good athlete who likes attacking the rim and tries to dunk the ball every time he has chance ... He likes pushing the ball in transition and making good passes in the open court as well ... Quick first step allows him to separate himself from defense and score ... Most effective playing fast pace and running at full speed ... If he attacks the defenders off the dribble he will most likely drive to his right and finish with right hand (feels most comfortable) ... Reads defenders well at P&R game situations and is smart enough to recognize when defenders are playing under to take 15-feet jump-shot that he feels comfortable and is very effective with ... Good passer who will find open teammates for easy shots or layups. Improved his outside shooting and is not afraid to take deep shots under the pressure ... Defensively does a good job at being active and staying in the passing lines/can pressure the ball on both G positions in defense ... Handles the ball well and doesnt turn it over (1.6 TO) ... Rebounds the ball well for his size and does a great job at following missed shots; scores numerous times on put-backs dunks and easy layups under the rim when no one is expecting ... Hard worker on the court and great kid off the floor.
Weaknesses: Jaramaz has to improve his outside shooting in order to be more effective player at the next level (this season he is shooting only 28.4% for 3) ... Must become a better decision maker on P&R situations ... His jump shot has low point of release and has to learn how to shoots it higher among other things in that area; in my opinion he has to change his shooting form in order to increase his outside percentage ... Defensively he is trying to go for too much at the times ... His age works against him some as he's already draft eligible and older than other options at the PG position ...
I mean, he could be a stash, but it's not like we're overflowing with talent at either spot
exactly - looking at PG and assuming Rose is gone - Frenchy and the Serb will be competing with Chasson Randle and Ron Baker - both of whom I like, but not exactly all-stars.
I mean, he could be a stash, but it's not like we're overflowing with talent at either spot
exactly - looking at PG and assuming Rose is gone - Frenchy and the Serb will be competing with Chasson Randle and Ron Baker - both of whom I like, but not exactly all-stars.
In theory yes, but I can see Phil Jackson wanting a veteran PG to run his beloved triangle offense, which he won't stop shoving down our throats even if it is not workable without having the best player in the game who will succeed in any offensive scheme.
In theory yes, but I can see Phil Jackson wanting a veteran PG to run his beloved triangle offense, which he won't stop shoving down our throats even if it is not workable without having the best player in the game who will succeed in any offensive scheme.
Look, I can't predict Jax any more than you can - but I see the opposite - I think he's sick of "veteran" PGs, none of whom can run the triangle or care to defend the point.
Picking 2 young Euro PGs sends that message IMO. We're not going to have a "veteran" PG this year.
Darren WolfsonVerified account @DWolfsonKSTP
Have long followed ex-#Badgers star Nigel Hayes' path since he turned the #Gophers down. Told he's committed to #Knicks for summer league.
RE: Yea its time to send Melo to Cleveland or the Clippers
Darren WolfsonVerified account @DWolfsonKSTP
Have long followed ex-#Badgers star Nigel Hayes' path since he turned the #Gophers down. Told he's committed to #Knicks for summer league.
Nigel has a real shot to make the team.
He can't shoot for shit, but he's a plus defender, passer, post player. More importantly, he's a Phil guy. Really smart dude (obviously, Wisconsin **ducks**) and culturally aware. Great for a locker room, which Phil really values.
You said Frank is not a good athlete. Please explain how can a player be a top notch one on one defender with quick feet and not be a very good athlete
You said Frank is not a good athlete. Please explain how can a player be a top notch one on one defender with quick feet and not be a very good athlete
Tayshaun Prince? Marc Gasol? Thabo Sefaosha? Should I keep going?
Quote:
What a tool.
i would so write a clause into Alonzo's contract that Lavar was not allowed anywhere near the team or arena.
AMEN! Keep that fucker away.
Starts at 730. I though it was 7, but not to be.
In the 2nd I'd like a linebacker defender. A guy who is 20 pounds of muscle too big to be a wing, but plays it anyway. And who starts fights, even in practice. This team is tissue paper soft. Need some sandpaper.
In the 2nd I'd like a linebacker defender. A guy who is 20 pounds of muscle too big to be a wing, but plays it anyway. And who starts fights, even in practice. This team is tissue paper soft. Need some sandpaper.
I don't think there is any chance Fox is available. I'd do back flips if he made it to 8. I think he has a legit shot to be the best player in this draft down the road
Josg Jackson slides. Damn rough day
Quote:
is Isaac or Monk or Fox, of guys I think have a shot. I'd be okay with several others though, including Smith and Frank -- if that's what the scouts say, so be it.
In the 2nd I'd like a linebacker defender. A guy who is 20 pounds of muscle too big to be a wing, but plays it anyway. And who starts fights, even in practice. This team is tissue paper soft. Need some sandpaper.
I don't think there is any chance Fox is available. I'd do back flips if he made it to 8. I think he has a legit shot to be the best player in this draft down the road
I think the mortal locks to go before us at Fultz, Ball, and Jackson. There is a story where everyone else could slip, albeit a very low % for some (Tatum, Fox). Say Tatum to Celts, the other locks top 4. Sac decides Isaac is the shit. Magic dont want to pair Fox and Elf do to shooting, so they go Monk. Minny just took a PG and/or has the same concerns about shooting, so goes Markkanen, Smith, or off the board. Fox then falls to 8. Low chance, but plausible. Implausible is all those teams passing on Jackson.
For cheap enough, sure. But his shot is so broke that he's just a flyer.
Some people saw it early, say he no-comments a lot of the interesting questions regarding his relationship strain with the team.
It's certainly very strange. Though on the other hand, plenty of college "winners" go on to suck.
Very steep price. Dunn was bad last year but he has a ton of potential.
Adios, Rondo
Bulls are a wildcard. They have holes everywhere lol.
Lavine is a health risk, Dunn was brutal last year, and the 7th pick is good I guess?
wade for pkrzingis hahahhaha
Butler is gonna do so much for them. He will make them better than just his play. He will teach them how to win. I also think he's easy top 15, maybe top 10. I think they're getting him on the cheap because of the GSW/CLE fear. Love is a worse player who returned #1 overall.
Wades got 24 million reasons to smile
More
Indiana and Boston are engaged in serious talks on a Paul George trade, league sources tell @TheVertical.
WOJBOMB
More
Indiana and Boston are engaged in serious talks on a Paul George trade, league sources tell @TheVertical.
WOJBOMB
Woah.
More
Indiana and Boston are engaged in serious talks on a Paul George trade, league sources tell @TheVertical.
WOJBOMB
wonder if tatum would go back to pacers
Quote:
@WojVerticalNBA 1m1 minute ago
More
Indiana and Boston are engaged in serious talks on a Paul George trade, league sources tell @TheVertical.
WOJBOMB
wonder if tatum would go back to pacers
Almost certainly. They're pretty similar players.
Arguably the usage of Butler is to have him as the ball dominant guard, so you could pair him with a Lee if you think Lee can keep up with 1s.
Draft going chalk so far.
It would be pretty wild if they could get it done without that.
Maybe Laker pick + Brown + Smart?
agreed
Except he has shown he will do something really stupid. Probably asked Rambis who he preferred
You're better than that
Then DSJ will be there at 8
Wouldn't be a Knicks draft if they didn't.
I'd appreciate no spoilers but I don't speak for everyone here. They may feel differently.
Quote:
We're going to get stuck with this fucking French schmuck, aren't we?
You're better than that
LOL, better than what?
I don't care that he's French. I just can't spell his last name and don't like the player.
And it pisses me the fuck off that the Knicks can be as shitty as they were and STILL not get an impact player in the draft.
Quote:
In comment 13508627 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
We're going to get stuck with this fucking French schmuck, aren't we?
You're better than that
LOL, better than what?
I don't care that he's French. I just can't spell his last name and don't like the player.
And it pisses me the fuck off that the Knicks can be as shitty as they were and STILL not get an impact player in the draft.
Frenchy Guy could be a total bust, lol, but this is eerily reminiscent of what people were mad about when they drafted KP. He was gonna sit for years and maybe be an NBA starter someday.
LFGGGG
Quote:
draftexpress.com has the picks way before they are announced.
I'd appreciate no spoilers but I don't speak for everyone here. They may feel differently.
+1
Quote:
In comment 13508633 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
In comment 13508627 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
We're going to get stuck with this fucking French schmuck, aren't we?
You're better than that
LOL, better than what?
I don't care that he's French. I just can't spell his last name and don't like the player.
And it pisses me the fuck off that the Knicks can be as shitty as they were and STILL not get an impact player in the draft.
Frenchy Guy could be a total bust, lol, but this is eerily reminiscent of what people were mad about when they drafted KP. He was gonna sit for years and maybe be an NBA starter someday.
I think people were scarred from Bargnani when they took KP and were afraid we were getting another soft Euro.
Monk was the guy or dsj
Scare me. That and the loser label. High risk.
I hate the Knicks.
I'm captaining the band wagon and im fine with that.
I'm captaining the band wagon and im fine with that.
Ok I'm on board.
Why do some question his ceiling? Don't know shit about him
smith has something eith his knees...
wonder how far monk falls
hey it coukd be worse could be having the night the bulls are having
Yup. You gamble on greatness picking #8, and the Knicks just folded and took the nice, safe decent rotation piece.
Quote:
was the right pick. I'm hyped.
I'm captaining the band wagon and im fine with that.
Ok I'm on board.
Why do some question his ceiling? Don't know shit about him
He's not great at attacking the hoop and isn't as explosive as Monk/Smith.
He is also better at pretty much everything else.
Quote:
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
smith has something eith his knees...
wonder how far monk falls
hey it coukd be worse could be having the night the bulls are having
Man you are such a Knick homer. Fuck this team.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
Quote:
In comment 13508663 Enzo said:
Quote:
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
smith has something eith his knees...
wonder how far monk falls
hey it coukd be worse could be having the night the bulls are having
Man you are such a Knick homer. Fuck this team.
huh? i wanted monk, but let me ask you how many frank games have you watched?
i bet you hated the kp pick to
Quote:
In comment 13508664 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
was the right pick. I'm hyped.
I'm captaining the band wagon and im fine with that.
Ok I'm on board.
Why do some question his ceiling? Don't know shit about him
He's not great at attacking the hoop and isn't as explosive as Monk/Smith.
He is also better at pretty much everything else.
So he can shoot, pass, play D, and play PG?
Alrighty then, let's do it. Could be best for KP and his growth.
Top 5 pick next year to get a wing or something
Quote:
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
I hope Batum isn't his ceiling. You're talking about a non-all star who's not much of a different maker out there
how do you know what the kid is going to be?
Of course, most posters/fans couldn't scout a pro prospect to save their lives, but it doesn't stop them from expressing their opinion LOUDLY and OFTEN.
Never fails.
Quote:
In comment 13508663 Enzo said:
Quote:
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
I hope Batum isn't his ceiling. You're talking about a non-all star who's not much of a different maker out there
Batum had the skills to be a star, he just didnt have the mental drive I think.
That's my thing on these players. Their mental makeup is so important. It's the difference between Kobe and a host of guys with better measurables. Whose to say Frank has Batum's makeup?
Quote:
In comment 13508663 Enzo said:
Quote:
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
I hope Batum isn't his ceiling. You're talking about a non-all star who's not much of a different maker out there
What?
Batum is a great player.
Quote:
The idea is to try and get a kid with a high ceiling. I'd rather take a boom or bust player than a fucking role player. These are the types of guys you can usually find in free agency or by making smaller scale trades. Spending the 8th pick on a guy with limited upside sucks.
how do you know what the kid is going to be?
No one does, but if you think his ceiling is higher than Monk, I completely disagree.
Tatum hurts. Crowder I think they didnt want b/c of Brown. Bradley they didnt want to pay.
I like it a lot if they can extend him.
fake wojo account
Quote:
celtics trade tatum, crowder and bradley for george
Tatum hurts. Crowder I think they didnt want b/c of Brown. Bradley they didnt want to pay.
I like it a lot if they can extend him.
Quote:
In comment 13508682 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
The idea is to try and get a kid with a high ceiling. I'd rather take a boom or bust player than a fucking role player. These are the types of guys you can usually find in free agency or by making smaller scale trades. Spending the 8th pick on a guy with limited upside sucks.
how do you know what the kid is going to be?
No one does, but if you think his ceiling is higher than Monk, I completely disagree.
The single thing the Knicks have is a guy who is good at recognizing European players in Gaines. If he really likes Frank, I'm on board. Monk and Smith both came with a ton of questions as well.
The situations are really similar, tbh. Let's not pretend anyone was selling porzingis at the time as some special player. People went nuts because he was sold as a huge project.
Quote:
celtics trade tatum, crowder and bradley for george
fake wojo account
my fault it was retweeted by other writers...
It just seems like most people have him pegged as a role player. The odds of him being more than that appear awfully slim.
Quote:
In comment 13508672 Deej said:
Quote:
In comment 13508663 Enzo said:
Quote:
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
Eh, he could have Batum like skils. I think he has enough talent to be a star. People poo poo his 3 point shot because of his FT%, ignoring how few FTs he took. If he 3's, moves the ball right, and defends, that's not far from stardom.
Lets see what he is first.
I hope Batum isn't his ceiling. You're talking about a non-all star who's not much of a different maker out there
What?
Batum is a great player.
um, no. Are you drunk?
Lol.
Seems like a good kid.
It just seems like most people have him pegged as a role player. The odds of him being more than that appear awfully slim.
Look, I'm squarely basing this on how well they've done drafting from europe. It's paper thin reasoning, I'm aware.
Quote:
In comment 13508668 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 13508663 Enzo said:
Quote:
but it looks like we just passed up on two dynamic guards to draft a fucking role player.
smith has something eith his knees...
wonder how far monk falls
hey it coukd be worse could be having the night the bulls are having
Man you are such a Knick homer. Fuck this team.
huh? i wanted monk, but let me ask you how many frank games have you watched?
i bet you hated the kp pick to
I hope I'm wrong. I wanted Monk.
Good night for Kings.
It just seems like most people have him pegged as a role player. The odds of him being more than that appear awfully slim.
If there is one thing, it's recent draft picks of Euros. KP and Willy. I dont hold the Greek or Louis L against them as it was the ass end of a shitty draft -- doesnt look like they made a big miss there. Black and Felicio look good tho.
This is Phuckface in action.
This won't end well.
um, no. Are you drunk?
Definitely a little, but how many players are getting 15-6-6 and 2 3s per game?
actually knicks have one of the best euro scouts in the nba...
None of those people are here working now though. That's just being scared of ghosts.
And maybe they got this wrong, who can say. But they've gotten a lot right in recent years going back to Gallinari.
So what is the standout gift he hangs his hat on?
Quote:
I'd love to be wrong about the kid. You'll have to forgive me, as virtually nothing the Knicks have done in the last 2 decades has instilled any confidence.
It just seems like most people have him pegged as a role player. The odds of him being more than that appear awfully slim.
If there is one thing, it's recent draft picks of Euros. KP and Willy. I dont hold the Greek or Louis L against them as it was the ass end of a shitty draft -- doesnt look like they made a big miss there. Black and Felicio look good tho.
Yeah, I get it - I just feel like if he's "good regular" that doesn't really move the needle much at all.
I'd rather just swing for the fences.
I feel like both Monk and DSJ will be better players.
So what is the standout gift he hangs his hat on?
Holy fucking shit. Talk about a pessimistic view. I know you don't actually believe all of that.
I know Phil can't look at it this way, but i'm going to be a fan of the Knicks long after Phil is gone, and does anyone here think Phil is going to last more than 2 years? I certainly dont
nope next year doncic and you will like it!
From someone who has seen him play "A true point guard with a pass first mentality He can control the pace of the game nicely Excellent passer with great court vision He is always looking to find the open teammate He can pass on the move and also while penetrating Excels on the open court and loves to run the break Great ball handler He has a nice hesitation dribble and he has also an improving crossover dribble on his repertoire Possesses an explosive first step."
What this said. In a horseshit season where we were out of playoff contention by December, we drafted the French George Hill. Would rather have gone with Monk or Mitchell here, then Frank Mason and Deandre Burton in red 2.
Its more awful that you actually had Knicks season tickets.
Ron Fucking Baker, son.
Because we're talked about it before.
Bitching gets you nowhere. There are plenty of reasons to like the pick.
Quote:
You still didn't give an answer.
Because we're talked about it before.
Bitching gets you nowhere. There are plenty of reasons to like the pick.
Only if you are opposing the Knicks or think the triangle can actually succeed without someone like Jordan, Shaq, or Kobe. There is nothing that says All-Star about any aspect of Frenchy's game. Monk or DSJ have far more upside.
Frank and Porzingus let's go!!! Lil Willy too!!
Then a top pick next year!! Let's get Melo, Lee and KOQ shipped out right now!!!
Hah, won't that just be the icing on the cake.
Quote:
He's not a real point. Average athlete. Average handle. Decent shot this year, lousy before, remind to be seen if the improvement lasts. For all the talk about his D, it's mostly projection based on long arms.
So what is the standout gift he hangs his hat on?
Holy fucking shit. Talk about a pessimistic view. I know you don't actually believe all of that.
Any UVA pick would have been better. No doubt.
So what is the standout gift he hangs his hat on?
I don't want to come off as a homer, because i'm razor's edge close to ditching this team, but he's 19 years old. Everything about him is projection. They didn't just pull his name out of a homeless dude's hat. He was projected to be drafted where he was, so people think he clearly can play at a high enough level to be a top ten nba draft pick.
That's what they do every night.
That's a low key blessing though.
Can't get mad until the kid fails. It's not like this is a colossal reach.
Plus let's be honest, we've had good fortunes with euro picks lately.
Actually when it comes to drafting you can give the knicks some benefit of the doubt. They've been pretty good at drafting.
It's been their vet FA moves that have been awful. And coaching hires.
Link - ( New Window )
I hope he becomes an all star, but I have yet to see anyone in the know suggest that at this point.
Quote:
problem is that given their terrible past picks, you just can't give the Knicks the benefit of the doubt.
Actually when it comes to drafting you can give the knicks some benefit of the doubt. They've been pretty good at drafting.
It's been their vet FA moves that have been awful. And coaching hires.
I don't know how anyone can say an 18 year old kid that played well with grown men and has the size and length and shot that frank possesses has limited upside. This is the herd mentality. One guy says it the rest follow suit. He wouldn't be rated top ten virtually everywhere if he didn't have major upside..
Honestly, I'm not sure we need a "star" as much as we need an underrated floor leader anyway. Monk is nice but do we really want a scoring guard or the cerebral defensive pg? Gimme the latter.
I would have been happy with smith monk or frank but if they all turn out to be equals I would want frank. We need that type of player.
As they say, ma nishtana?
Someone said Khris Middleton and I guess that's his upside. Middleton is bigger, longer and more athletic though. 40% 3 point shooter is a lofty expectation for any player also.
I hope he becomes an all star, but I have yet to see anyone in the know suggest that at this point.
The point of citing the Porzingis draft is not to compare the player. It's to highlight the fact that nobody knew a damn thing about Porzingis. Including the people who watched him play. Nobody really got it right other than the obvious, that someone his size with that shot had incredible potential. Even the experts that liked Porzingis figured he had a CHANCE to be a starter in years.
I dont want Melo back either and I would even buy him out, but I could at least see the other side of the argument.
Rose should not be brought back under any circumstance.
Get rid of Melo, turn the keys over to Kristaps, and tank as hard as you can next year
interesting quote..
Butler runs the offense Lee provides spacing. Ease frank into a lead guard roll.
He's under contract for two more years, and then he's a restricted free agent.
Where is he going?
2. He fits the triangle better. Phil will be gone in 2 years, nobody plays the system. And what does a triangel player even mean? Why don't we fill a roster full of Ivy League players in short shorts to make Phil happy?
3. He isn't a me-first player. How do we know what DSJ and Monk will become? It's like saying you'd rather have Duhon, who didn't shoot because he couldn't, than Baron Davis or Stevie Francis.
This is like Phil drafting a Ron Harper before he has a Michael Jordan or Scottie Pippen. Smith and Monk have "play-now" skills but you refuse to project the other aspects of their games, yet you are all projections when it comes to Frenchy? We have no talent except for KP, whom Phil is trying to trade, but we are looking for role players for a system?
WTF?! This is different than KP. KP could do things at 7-3 that Frenchy can't at 6-5.
Jackson had a handle and quickness (when he was young). Does this guy?
Sorry brother.
When the Cuse is the 14 seed in the ACC tournament next year I'll be taking my lumps.
WTF?! This is different than KP. KP could do things at 7-3 that Frenchy can't at 6-5.
Such as what?
Uhh, what in the hell are you talking about
Yes
I can see that
A cancer? Wtf are you babbling about?
And the first time I ran Frank through, says Brickley, he hit 78.
My concern aligns with Mook in that if this were a system pick rather than a true BPA, then it's a bad move because forcing into a system.
Then again, DennyinDenville hates the pick, and smart money is always on the opposite of what the clown thinks.
My concern aligns with Mook in that if this were a system pick rather than a true BPA, then it's a bad move because forcing into a system.
Then again, DennyinDenville hates the pick, and smart money is always on the opposite of what the clown thinks.
I love the pick you nimrod. Lmao. Wtf are you smoking. Jaja
That's certainly true. It should be expected, given that KP is a natural shooter.
But they drafted a point guard this time.
DennyInDenville : 8:14 pm : link : reply
Fuck
DennyInDenville : 8:15 pm : link : reply
Goodness.
Monk was the guy or dsj
Hey there's no way this ISNT the year the wolves make the jump now. Right?
Quote:
what about old school comp, mark jackson?
Jackson had a handle and quickness (when he was young). Does this guy?
Jackson was never quick. Quicker than me sure. Quicker than most NBA pgs even in the pg challenged era of 1989? No. He wasn't quick.
The problem is, we have NOTHING!!
So the thinking is Smith and Monk will make multiple all-stars teams and have lengthy highlgiht reels but play on bad teams while our Frenchy contributes to our many championships....
I don't know why so many people are comfortable making that leap....
Ha fair enough. Jackson was quick. He had great vision and moxy. Could also back down and use that big ass of his to put opposing pgs on notice.
The problem is, we have NOTHING!!
So the thinking is Smith and Monk will make multiple all-stars teams and have lengthy highlgiht reels but play on bad teams while our Frenchy contributes to our many championships....
I don't know why so many people are comfortable making that leap....
Man, all this stuff is a leap. D'Angelo Russell was supposed to make multiple all star teams too.
I'll save my anger for the 300 days of the year that the knicks do something really stupid. This ain't one of them.
Many of the same people saying this guy has no upside are the same ones that said KP was going to need 2-3 years to even approach what he did in 15-16. No one knows shit. He's 18.
I'll save my anger for the 300 days of the year that the knicks do something really stupid. This ain't one of them.
Many of the same people saying this guy has no upside are the same ones that said KP was going to need 2-3 years to even approach what he did in 15-16. No one knows shit. He's 18.
I get this. But every Knick fan has every right to vent with this franchise. They are irrelevant. Hopefully it starts to turn now.
You just can't gamble on guards who aren't off the charts athletically if you are expecting greatness. Nash and Lowry are outliers.
Just shot a 1-on-t interview with @FrankLikina. Place hes most excited to see when he moves to NY?
The gym.
#KnicksDraft17
9:36 PM Jun 22, 2017
He has the length to defend and experience against older players, but I am not sure he has the feet to match up with NBA PG's
Quote:
In comment 13508779 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
what about old school comp, mark jackson?
Jackson had a handle and quickness (when he was young). Does this guy?
Jackson was never quick. Quicker than me sure. Quicker than most NBA pgs even in the pg challenged era of 1989? No. He wasn't quick.
before he started putting on weight he was plenty quick. He wasn't KJ blazing past people for dunks, but he had enough wiggle to regularly get in the lane.
Red Bar = Starter
Black Bar = Backup
Percentage after name is the sum of these. Remaining percentage = complete bust.
Just shot a 1-on-t interview with @FrankLikina. Place hes most excited to see when he moves to NY?
The gym.#KnicksDraft17
Seem like a team-guy.
I am hopeful he will turn into a solid PG
Hopefully we're back in the lottery next year and this time hopefully in the top 3.
Quote:
I can't get mad at this. Knicks needed a pg and took one that nearly everyone had ranked pretty high. And he's younger than any of them, played in a man's league and seems to be defensive minded with a J.
I'll save my anger for the 300 days of the year that the knicks do something really stupid. This ain't one of them.
Many of the same people saying this guy has no upside are the same ones that said KP was going to need 2-3 years to even approach what he did in 15-16. No one knows shit. He's 18.
I get this. But every Knick fan has every right to vent with this franchise. They are irrelevant. Hopefully it starts to turn now.
I don't question how terrible they are but moments like this when the knicks bring in young intriguing talent are to be treasured. He's an intriguing prospect. We will see how it goes.
Seem like a team-guy.
Hopefully Dolan has him on a jet. Little bastard is probably too busy at his concert though.
This and two years ago were literally the two most enjoyable moments for me as a knicks since 1999. I did enjoy the 54 win season under Woodson but the excitement leading up to KP and tonight trump that. That's how bad this has gotten.
Knowing we have our picks next year and beyond makes me feel good but we have to hit them. Please let Frankie be a beast one day.
and his next quote suggests, he went straight to his gym, after he got off the plane this morning..
Link - ( New Window )
But then, why the fuck did we hire Horny as a coach? To run some kind of quasi triangle? That wasn't really the triangle? Or is Jax going to run more triangle camps?
Oh by the way, I'm so fucking sick of the triangle. And Big Chief Triangle needs to go back to LA and beg his girl to take him back.
i dont think phil wants to trade lee..
knicks havnt had a defensive stopper at point in a long time..
i wanted mitchell to pair with him as a young defensive back court but i will settle for josh hart...
But then, why the fuck did we hire Horny as a coach? To run some kind of quasi triangle? That wasn't really the triangle? Or is Jax going to run more triangle camps?
Oh by the way, I'm so fucking sick of the triangle. And Big Chief Triangle needs to go back to LA and beg his girl to take him back.
Towards the end of the season, they doubled down on Triangle and said they were re-committed to it.
Ugh.
Melo cannot be on this team next season. We must turn the fucking page.
Melo cannot be on this team next season. We must turn the fucking page.
Yep. I see zero positive to having him around. He'll likely hurt our draft position for next year, and I think guys like Kristaps will be better off in the long run not having him on the team.
Turn the page is the best way to put it. Even if it means buying him out we have to do it
I couldn't agree more. If KP gets his head out of his ass. Rose is gone for sure and Melo either plays fiddle to KP or traded.
In that scenario, KP is the teams alpha and much happier as a result, he becomes the "good kid/man" again and loves NY and meets Phil next year. And Frank can bring that hard working selfless culture to the team and put Kristaps in the absolute best state mentally and on the floor.
They will grow together. They're combined ages are younger then Vince Carter.
I absolute LOVE the pick.
Monk is probly better but I like this "culture change" pick.
It's what's best as long as he can play Pg. hopefully he gets big mins as a rookie.
We should probly keep Lee now just as some sort of mentor or trade him for a better one. And sign some old fuck who was good and can teach.
Quote:
but I have to trust the Knicks' European scouts. They've done a good job.
Melo cannot be on this team next season. We must turn the fucking page.
Yep. I see zero positive to having him around. He'll likely hurt our draft position for next year, and I think guys like Kristaps will be better off in the long run not having him on the team.
Turn the page is the best way to put it. Even if it means buying him out we have to do it
I have to agree with you both.
I'd love to keep Melo as a 6th man but he simply wouldn't be happy in that role and would keep the toxic vibe going.
Buy him out if it comes to it. Start super fresh with these two kids.
ESPN graphic above - Knicks draft eye highest ceiling player in the draft by far
ESPN graphic above - Knicks draft eye highest ceiling player in the draft by far
I got super high on Monk the past few weeks, but originally months ago Frank was the guy I wanted.
I absolutely was furious at first but now I'm super happy with this pick and think his upside is pretty decent. I love his attitude and all around game. Doesn't seem like he will ever be an elite scorer tho but he can be an extremely efficient one it seems along with making everyone around him better.
The Walt Clyde Frazier comparison is actually a great one.
Some intriguing bigs like Hartenstein and Anigbogu
Quote:
BBI - Knicks drafted a low ceiling player
ESPN graphic above - Knicks draft eye highest ceiling player in the draft by far
I got super high on Monk the past few weeks, but originally months ago Frank was the guy I wanted.
I absolutely was furious at first but now I'm super happy with this pick and think his upside is pretty decent. I love his attitude and all around game. Doesn't seem like he will ever be an elite scorer tho but he can be an extremely efficient one it seems along with making everyone around him better.
The Walt Clyde Frazier comparison is actually a great one.
Walt Clyde Frazier was one of the greatest PG's of all time. If this guy becomes a 1/4 of the player Frazier was we should be happy.
Weaknesses: He really needs to add some muscle to his body or else he could have problems at the next level He hasnt been tested at a senior level yet His shooting release looks a little odd at times and thats the main reason he isnt a consistent shooter from long range yet He needs to become more vocal and learn when he has to take over a game At times he is too unselfish and too keen to pass the ball and as a result he looks passive He must add some aggressiveness to his game He has problems finishing through contact at the rim due to his thin body and at times he looks like he is even avoiding contact, settling for a mid-range shot He has problems against physical game He isnt always focused on defense At times he forgets to keep a low stance when he is guarding his opponent and as a result he can be crossed easily He relies too much on his length to make steals when he gets crossed, which leads to bad fouls He has problems defending the Pick and Roll, looking lost at times Stronger players can post him up
Overall: Ntilikina is undoubtedly one of the best International players of his generation. His elite physical tools and feel for the game, combined with his high upside makes him a really intriguing prospect ... He is not NBA ready just yet, but he has all the tools to become a very good player in the future ...
Notes: He was born in Belgium and he is originating from Rwanda, but he was raised in France He was a member of the France team that won the U16 European Championship in 2014 He was named French League Best Young Player in 2015/16 season ...
Stefanos Makris 9/14/16"
draft net ratings - ( New Window )
Isaiah Hartenstein
Semi Ojeleye
Sindarius Thornwell
John Motley
Ike Anigbogu
Ivan Rabb
Edmond Sumner
Monte Morris
Tyler Dorsey
Jaron Blossomgame
Dwyane Bacon
Jawun Evans
Isaiah Hartenstein
Semi Ojeleye
Sindarius Thornwell
John Motley
Ike Anigbogu
Ivan Rabb
Edmond Sumner
Monte Morris
Tyler Dorsey
Jaron Blossomgame
Dwyane Bacon
Jawun Evans
Forgot PJ Dozier
Spoke too soon
Isaiah Hartenstein of Germany
Sindarius Thornwell of South Carolina
John Motley of Baylor
Ike Anigbogu of UCLA
Edmond Sumner of Xavier
Monte Morris of Iowa State
Tyler Dorsey of Oregon
Jaron Blossomgame of Clemson
PJ Dozier of South Carolina
Shot 44% from 3
Jeanne? He has Morphin's Syndrome
Jerry West.
Nice pieces for a Melo deal!
Him or Blossomgame look intriguing for what is left
Quote:
Come on, Phil!
Him or Blossomgame look intriguing for what is left
Agreed. Those two or PJ Dozier of South Carolina. Kobi Simmons could be a nice find for Summer League.
Unless we are going to stash French F**k, are we really going to have him waste away as our 3rd PG while he could get starting minutes in Europe?
Weaknesses: Jaramaz has to improve his outside shooting in order to be more effective player at the next level (this season he is shooting only 28.4% for 3) ... Must become a better decision maker on P&R situations ... His jump shot has low point of release and has to learn how to shoots it higher among other things in that area; in my opinion he has to change his shooting form in order to increase his outside percentage ... Defensively he is trying to go for too much at the times ... His age works against him some as he's already draft eligible and older than other options at the PG position ...
Quote:
Kid looked really good to me.
Unless we are going to stash French F**k, are we really going to have him waste away as our 3rd PG while he could get starting minutes in Europe?
He's perfect for the tank, we can give him 12-16 mins
exactly - looking at PG and assuming Rose is gone - Frenchy and the Serb will be competing with Chasson Randle and Ron Baker - both of whom I like, but not exactly all-stars.
Quote:
I mean, he could be a stash, but it's not like we're overflowing with talent at either spot
exactly - looking at PG and assuming Rose is gone - Frenchy and the Serb will be competing with Chasson Randle and Ron Baker - both of whom I like, but not exactly all-stars.
In theory yes, but I can see Phil Jackson wanting a veteran PG to run his beloved triangle offense, which he won't stop shoving down our throats even if it is not workable without having the best player in the game who will succeed in any offensive scheme.
Link - ( New Window )
Look, I can't predict Jax any more than you can - but I see the opposite - I think he's sick of "veteran" PGs, none of whom can run the triangle or care to defend the point.
Picking 2 young Euro PGs sends that message IMO. We're not going to have a "veteran" PG this year.
Have long followed ex-#Badgers star Nigel Hayes' path since he turned the #Gophers down. Told he's committed to #Knicks for summer league.
Yup I'd even take albatross contracts back for that to happen as well
Have long followed ex-#Badgers star Nigel Hayes' path since he turned the #Gophers down. Told he's committed to #Knicks for summer league.
Nigel has a real shot to make the team.
He can't shoot for shit, but he's a plus defender, passer, post player. More importantly, he's a Phil guy. Really smart dude (obviously, Wisconsin **ducks**) and culturally aware. Great for a locker room, which Phil really values.
It's cool, there's about 5 other teams you can root for so you're good.
Quote:
By far - not even close.. Horrible
It's cool, there's about 5 other teams you can root for so you're good.
Sooo... I can't comment on how a team did in the draft?
Tayshaun Prince? Marc Gasol? Thabo Sefaosha? Should I keep going?