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Brandon Jacobs or Ahmad Bradshaw (hypothetical exercise)

uncledave : 6/23/2017 2:54 pm
If you could bring back one of these two gems as a rookie today - who would your pick be and why? They would be coming back to this Giants team as it currently stands...
Jacobs & Bradshaw Highlights Tribute Video - ( New Window )
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RE: Bradshaw  
DonQuixote : 6/23/2017 6:37 pm : link
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:
Quote:
and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter" - although he lacked the elite speed that would've made him a hall of fame caliber player.

Jacobs looked scarier. That's it.
Bradshaw Career - ( New Window )


Absolutely. People forget what a great all around back AB was for us. As much as I appreciated BJs attidude, he was more of a gimmick IMO.
If Bradshaw had a healthy career...  
Milton : 6/23/2017 6:56 pm : link
He would've been one of the top three RBs in the league in my opinion. I liken him to Marshawn Lynch. He was a little smaller than Lynch, but no less tough, no less physical, no easier for one man to stop. And he was probably a better receiver than Lynch although I can't say for sure because I didn't see enough of Lynch.

That being said, the bowlegged running style that made Bradshaw great was also what wore him down and led to the missed practices and shortened career. So I'm not sure you could have one without the other (meaning the injuries and his greatness were connected).

As for Jacobs, ultimately he was too one-dimensional and I think he lost much of his explosiveness after his first two years as a starter. Just too many hits to his lower body given his upright running style (which may have simply a result of being 6'4"). I always felt he should've been playing at a lower weight. Did he really need to be 267 lbs? Wouldn't he have been just as feared at 247 lbs and all the more lighter on his feet? I never understood that. And his unreliability as a pass-catcher made him one-dimensional.

As a defensive coordinator in the 2007 playoffs, I would've been more worried about a healthy Bradshaw in the backfield than a healthy Jacobs. It's just a shame that Bradshaw couldn't stay healthy, but like I said, given the way he ran, good health was never in the cards.
We all loved the way Jacobs ran over people  
81_Great_Dane : 6/23/2017 7:15 pm : link
but he didn't keep his feet afterwards. Look at the LaRon Landry video. Jacobs crushes him... and goes down. He got an extra 5-7 yards after contact. Nice, but not amazing. That was the thing with Jacobs. Guys didn't bounce off him, Earl Campbell-style. He'd deliver punishment but go down himself.

He was not an outstanding short yardage runner, either. Not great moving the pile on short yardage. Much better, much more difficult to tackle, if he could get to the linebackers.

Jacobs at his best was good for a couple of 30+ yard runs a game. Which was fantastic -- but he didn't have breakaway speed. He'd usually be run down from behind by DBs. He wasn't generally a threat to go all the way no matter where the Giants were on the field.

Plus the things that made Jacobs inspiring also made him a headache at times, remember? Throwing his helmet in the stands, and that crap?

So a lot of people overrated Jacobs because he was very entertaining to watch. He'd truck tacklers. He'd break into the backfield for long runs. But he didn't stay upright after trucking those tacklers. A faster back would have more TDs out of those long runs. He wasn't a reliable short-yardage guy.

He was a helluva weapon, but he had limitations. That's not a big knock on the guy; every player has strengths and weaknesses. Everybody has limitations. (Earl Campbell wasn't a good receiver, no use if the team had to start passing to play catch up. Etc.)

Both Bradshaw and Jacobs were good players who were never quite as good as we all hoped they'd be. But I'd lean a little toward Bradshaw.
RE: This offense  
Brick72 : 6/23/2017 7:23 pm : link
In comment 13509818 map7711 said:
Quote:
Could use some of Jacobs nasty attitude

Have to agree. Jacobs would fit this 2017 team best with his attitude and intimidation factor. Defenses would really have to try to figure out Perkins/Jacobs running and OBJ/Marshall/Sheppard/Engram receiving. That's a lot to handle.

The caveat is the OL. Jacobs needs a hole and was simply not effective without one. Let's be honest, if there was no hole BJ tiptoed and went nowhere. But in 2017 Ellison could be that difference maker helping with OL blocking.

Even then, I think Bradshaw would make a hell of a difference on this team. Other than LT he's my all time favorite Giant. Can you even imagine Perkins watching Bradshaw run? The knowledge, the smarts, the insane cuts, the nuances of moving to holes? Not to mention showing the kid how to block and pick up blitzes. Geez, that would be a pretty freaking scary duo for a defense to handle. The D would never be able to play Cover 2 like they do now.
RE: Bradshaw  
Milton : 6/23/2017 7:29 pm : link
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:
Quote:
and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter"
But you can also see from the video the kind of strain he was placing on his feet and ankles with the way he ran. It's what made him so difficult to tackle, but he was destined to have an injury-riddled career because of it.
RE: The fun thing about those two play together  
Brick72 : 6/23/2017 7:33 pm : link
In comment 13510051 Motley Two said:
Quote:
was Bradshaw played like he was every bit as large as Jacobs. He punished plenty of guys too.

Very good point. Despite his size Bradshaw punished plenty of players. He stiff armed someone (I don't remember who) into oblivion and flat out ran over many others.
RE: Bradshaw  
Johnny5 : 6/23/2017 7:49 pm : link
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:
Quote:
and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter" - although he lacked the elite speed that would've made him a hall of fame caliber player.

Jacobs looked scarier. That's it.
Bradshaw Career - ( New Window )

Looked scarier my ass. I remember being at a Bears/Giants game and watched Urlacher try to tackle Jacobs for a loss and bounce off of him like a child. Any other RB it's a tackle for a loss. And his blocking was immense. If you don't think Jacobs had a massive effect on softening up a defense, I don't know what to say. And I LOVE me some Bradshaw. You are not giving Jacobs enough credit IMO. To me they are a package deal I could never pick... lol
RE: RE: This offense  
Milton : 6/23/2017 7:50 pm : link
In comment 13510150 Brick72 said:
Quote:
Can you even imagine Perkins watching Bradshaw run? The knowledge, the smarts, the insane cuts, the nuances of moving to holes?
What Bradshaw did could not be duplicated, could not be taught. It was all natural born ability. If Perkins tried to do the same, he would wind up on IR by the end of the day.
RE: Bradshaw  
Brick72 : 6/23/2017 7:53 pm : link
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:
Quote:
and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter" - although he lacked the elite speed that would've made him a hall of fame caliber player.

Jacobs looked scarier. That's it.
Bradshaw Career - ( New Window )

Wow! Thanks. Watching that reminded me of goal line situations. 3rd and 2 I always expected AB to make it but always held my breath with BJ. That video crystallized it for me. Plus AB was a trusted receiver out of the backfield.

Loved BJ, but when the chips were on the line had to go with Bradshaw. The guy was a nonstop machine. Here's the thing. 3rd and 1. BJ is going to power in. Nothing fancy and the defense is going to expect that. AB is going to go over, under or around and the D has to cover all three. Truly loved both of them for what they added but AB was the quintessential beast.
Both or none.  
mattlawson : 6/23/2017 8:03 pm : link
And I have a Bradshaw jersey, one of my favorite Giants of all time. But it was guestalt principal at work, they made each other better than they were individually.
RE: RE: RE: This offense  
Brick72 : 6/23/2017 8:16 pm : link
In comment 13510182 Milton said:
Quote:
In comment 13510150 Brick72 said:


Quote:

Can you even imagine Perkins watching Bradshaw run? The knowledge, the smarts, the insane cuts, the nuances of moving to holes?

What Bradshaw did could not be duplicated, could not be taught. It was all natural born ability. If Perkins tried to do the same, he would wind up on IR by the end of the day.
You're probably right. The kinds of things Bradshaw did can't easily be taught. Those runs were insane at times. But if Perkins could pick up on the blocking and going to the hole it would be fun to watch. One thing I loved to see was AB picking up a LB or blitzing safety and leveling them. Never got much attention probably because he was so good at it that it became normal. Perkins is a willing learner. Show him this stuff. There is something about Perkins that says he can move in that direction.
Bradshaw, no question  
NYG07 : 6/23/2017 9:12 pm : link
Jacobs was a beast and a great Giant, but Ahmad was the better player. Bradshaw was one tough POS. He ran just as hard as Jacobs but had much better quickness and vision. If injuries did not take their toll he might still be a Giant. I will never forget him dragging Ty Warren for extra yards in the Superbowl.
Jacobs  
Mr. Nickels : 6/23/2017 10:07 pm : link
was SUBSTANTIALLY better than Bradshaw.

We don't win Super Bowl 42 without him.

He had a mythical size advantage at the position and was still just as fast. Modern day Christian Okoye.

He was drafted much higher.

He had toughness both intimidation and health wise.

He holds the Giants record for touchdowns.
Bradshaw for me  
TyFromQueens : 6/23/2017 11:53 pm : link
He was the more complete player and could break off big runs.

Jacobs is still one of my favorite players of all times for sure. But AB was more versatile.
It's very close, because I love both of those backs  
David in LA : 6/24/2017 12:23 am : link
but I'd go by Jacobs. Something about that first handoff to a guy like that just sets the tone for the entire game, and makes the defense know it's not a one man job to take him out.
Jacobs is so overrated  
annexOPR : 6/24/2017 1:15 am : link
I guess I'm the only one that remembers how many times he was easily tripped up by an arm tackle or how mediocre he was in short yardage

Looked like a freak of nature, but Bradshaw was a much better player.
Jacobs  
RasputinPrime : 6/24/2017 1:26 am : link
just a unique beast. Feed the beast.
This was a real fun tandem  
giantgiantfan : 6/24/2017 1:48 am : link
Then there was that year with Ward too. Earth, wind, fire. Kinda dumb sounding now, but it was a fun year for the Giants rushing attack.

I'll take Bradshaw. One of my favorites.
1. Bradshaw
2. a) Jacobs b) Hampton

Love Jacobs though, one of my favorite Gifs

I want 'em both back  
JCin332 : 6/24/2017 8:06 am : link
..
Tempted to go with Bradshaw...  
Klaatu : 6/24/2017 8:32 am : link
Just because I mocked him to the Giants in 2007 (although I had them taking him in the 4th round), but I'd have to pick Jacobs. Not only did he define "tone-setter," but he was devastating as Eli's last line of defense. A true Giant in every sense of the word.
RE: Bradshaw  
Moondawg : 6/24/2017 9:31 am : link
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:
Quote:
and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter" - although he lacked the elite speed that would've made him a hall of fame caliber player.

Jacobs looked scarier. That's it.
Bradshaw Career - ( New Window )


"It's not even close." I don't know you, but STFU with that shit. People who say that sound like children.




Sorry for the harshness. It's just an annoyance on BBI.
Bradshaw.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 6/24/2017 9:33 am : link
I loved him.
Jacobs  
Jimmy Googs : 6/24/2017 9:51 am : link
and its not even close...
RE: RE: Bradshaw  
Brown Recluse : 6/24/2017 10:07 am : link
In comment 13510502 Moondawg said:
Quote:
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:


Quote:


and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter" - although he lacked the elite speed that would've made him a hall of fame caliber player.

Jacobs looked scarier. That's it.
Bradshaw Career - ( New Window )



"It's not even close." I don't know you, but STFU with that shit. People who say that sound like children.




Sorry for the harshness. It's just an annoyance on BBI.


I get that. Especially when it is actually pretty close, haha
RE: Bradshaw  
WillVAB : 6/24/2017 10:27 am : link
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:
Quote:
and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter" - although he lacked the elite speed that would've made him a hall of fame caliber player.

Jacobs looked scarier. That's it.
Bradshaw Career - ( New Window )



I agree with this. Jacobs was at his best running off tackle through a huge hole created by the best OL in the league. Good in pass pro. Zero elusiveness. Mediocre at best in short yardage. Bad receiver. He would struggle to impact at all behind this OL.

Bradshaw was simply a better player overall and in every facet of the game outside of pass pro, and Bradshaw wasn't far behind in that category.

RE: RE: Bradshaw  
annexOPR : 6/24/2017 10:28 am : link
In comment 13510502 Moondawg said:
Quote:
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:


Quote:


and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter" - although he lacked the elite speed that would've made him a hall of fame caliber player.

Jacobs looked scarier. That's it.
Bradshaw Career - ( New Window )



"It's not even close." I don't know you, but STFU with that shit. People who say that sound like children.




Sorry for the harshness. It's just an annoyance on BBI.


You showed me ... do internet tough guys feel better after this kind of bs?


back to Bradshaw ... - ( New Window )
1:07 - 2:20 of this video  
annexOPR : 6/24/2017 10:45 am : link
there is nothing Jacobs brought to the table that Bradshaw didn't. He looked scarier - and that's it.
1:07 ... or watch the whole thing - ( New Window )
http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/news/2219527-brandon-jacobs-running-ba  
annexOPR : 6/24/2017 10:49 am : link
"Once his specialty with the Giants as a 6-4, 256-pounder who scored 15 rushing touchdowns in 2008, Jacobs struggled mightily to pick up the tough yards between the tackles last season. With Ahmad Bradshaw becoming solid near paydirt, they could afford to let him go."

and I'm done. Happy Saturday ladies and gents.
The OP said which would you bring back as a rookie.  
Brown Recluse : 6/24/2017 11:08 am : link
So your quote about whatever took place after 2008 is entirely pointless. At the peak of their respective careers, it is actually close. And you're trying way too hard to validate one over the other.
BRadshaw every time - he ran strong and was elusive  
PatersonPlank : 6/24/2017 11:38 am : link
Jacobs needed more help from the OL, he needed a hole. Bradshaw created a lot more and was betting catching the ball.
Bradshaw  
Clintqb17 : 6/24/2017 11:54 am : link
Every day and twice on sundays.
Annex  
Johnny5 : 6/24/2017 12:09 pm : link
There is one thing about arguing a point, and then another about being a tool about it. You crossed over, congratulations.

And again, Bradshaw is one of my fave all time Giants but to me they are inseparable and will always come as a package deal. They each had strengths and weaknesses and together they gave us one of the most fun to watch run games the Giants have ever had.
Brad  
thomasa510 : 6/24/2017 12:16 pm : link
Bradshaw was the better player imho, but Jacobs had heart though it wasn't always backed up.

When push comes to shove bradshaw
Big Jake!  
trueblueinpw : 6/24/2017 12:31 pm : link
Nasty, mean, wore down the defenses and productive. Loved AB too.
RE: Bradshaw  
trueblueinpw : 6/24/2017 12:58 pm : link
In comment 13510093 annexOPR said:
Quote:
and it's not even close. Ran just as hard as Jacobs with a much more complete skill set. If you have 20 minutes, watch the attachment. Bradshaw routinely created big plays on his own with no blocking and was much more of a "home run hitter" - although he lacked the elite speed that would've made him a hall of fame caliber player.

Jacobs looked scarier. That's it.
Bradshaw Career - ( New Window )


Nice highlight reel. AB was freaking awesome!
If both are healthy, it's no contest!  
Doomster : 6/24/2017 1:59 pm : link
It's Bradshaw....

He had the ability to take it to the house....he could make guys miss.....he could make something out of nothing.....

Guys are so in love with Jacobs because he could knock guys over, and then maybe get a couple of yards.....big deal.....as big as he was, HE COULD NOT MOVE THE PILE! HE COULD NOT MAKE SOMETHING OUT OF NOTHING!Those two 4th and one runs against the Eagles in the 2008 playoffs, showed that....'Nuff said....
RE: If both are healthy, it's no contest!  
annexOPR : 6/24/2017 2:14 pm : link
In comment 13510677 Doomster said:
Quote:
It's Bradshaw....

He had the ability to take it to the house....he could make guys miss.....he could make something out of nothing.....

Guys are so in love with Jacobs because he could knock guys over, and then maybe get a couple of yards.....big deal.....as big as he was, HE COULD NOT MOVE THE PILE! HE COULD NOT MAKE SOMETHING OUT OF NOTHING!Those two 4th and one runs against the Eagles in the 2008 playoffs, showed that....'Nuff said....


Amen. Nice to see someone else actually look beyond the "beast" tag associated with Jacobs. He certainly looked the part, didn't always play as big n' bad as some on here recall.

I just have no idea how anyone could say Jacobs was a better player. He did nothing better than Bradshaw. Nothing.
BJac highlights  
Johnny5 : 6/24/2017 2:19 pm : link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2ARInxkR1U

Kinda grainy, but...
I like Jacobs, but he was greatly overrated by BBI  
PatersonPlank : 6/24/2017 2:20 pm : link
Do you know one year Bradshaw rushed for over 1,200 yards and caught over 300 yds of passes? Thats abiut 1,600 in total yards from scrimmage. Jacobs would come in to grind out games in the later stages when the D was worn out. He'd run them over.
I didn't say Jacobs was better  
Johnny5 : 6/24/2017 2:22 pm : link
I said I couldn't pick. Though will always be a package deal to me for the Giants. Elusiveness and pure vision and cutback goes to Bradshaw no question. And to say Jacobs only *looked* scary is a freaking joke.
RE: I didn't say Jacobs was better  
annexOPR : 6/24/2017 2:27 pm : link
In comment 13510690 Johnny5 said:
Quote:
I said I couldn't pick. Though will always be a package deal to me for the Giants. Elusiveness and pure vision and cutback goes to Bradshaw no question. And to say Jacobs only *looked* scary is a freaking joke.


All I'm saying is, for everyone drooling over Jacobs "beastly plows", Bradshaw did the exact same thing to defenders - with more ability in the pass game and didn't need a huge lane to gain yardage.

Hence the "Jacobs looked scarier", Bradshaw was just a tough / hard nosed / "fiery competitor" - with a better all around skill set. Bradshaw was the better player. Bradshaw would be a godsend in this offense.
Bradshaw did not do  
Brown Recluse : 6/24/2017 3:47 pm : link
"The exact same thing." Sure he had his moments. I've seen Orleans Dawkwa run through defenders too. But I never saw Bradshaw run through all pro/hall of fame players like Ray Lewis or Brian Urlacher.

Bradshaw was a great player. No one will dispute that. But ask any defender who they'd rather not see coming toward them and they'll pick Jacobs over Bradshaw every time. And thats why some people prefer him in this offense alongside Perkins (who is already a lot like Bradshaw.)

There really is no wrong answer here though. They were both great.
RE: Bradshaw did not do  
adamg : 6/24/2017 4:29 pm : link
In comment 13510745 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
"The exact same thing." Sure he had his moments. I've seen Orleans Dawkwa run through defenders too. But I never saw Bradshaw run through all pro/hall of fame players like Ray Lewis or Brian Urlacher.

Bradshaw was a great player. No one will dispute that. But ask any defender who they'd rather not see coming toward them and they'll pick Jacobs over Bradshaw every time. And thats why some people prefer him in this offense alongside Perkins (who is already a lot like Bradshaw.)

There really is no wrong answer here though. They were both great.


That's exactly my thinking.

Bradshaw might be the best RB on the team right now, but he'd push Perkins into a backup role. Jacobs would be a perfect complement. We don't have a bruiser like that.
RE: Bradshaw did not do  
WillVAB : 6/24/2017 7:15 pm : link
In comment 13510745 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
"The exact same thing." Sure he had his moments. I've seen Orleans Dawkwa run through defenders too. But I never saw Bradshaw run through all pro/hall of fame players like Ray Lewis or Brian Urlacher.

Bradshaw was a great player. No one will dispute that. But ask any defender who they'd rather not see coming toward them and they'll pick Jacobs over Bradshaw every time. And thats why some people prefer him in this offense alongside Perkins (who is already a lot like Bradshaw.)

There really is no wrong answer here though. They were both great.


Jacobs didn't run anyone over unless he had a full head of steam. Which required push from the OL and a hole. He would be worthless behind this OL.

Anytime DL got penetration with Jacobs in the backfield he took a loss. He was a big dude who ran tall.
Jacobs.  
madgiantscow009 : 6/24/2017 10:31 pm : link
but I like bradshaw personally more. Best blocking back and second best blocking back in the league.
Jacobs  
George : 6/24/2017 11:15 pm : link
wasn't the sharpest bulb in the chandelier, but I loved the way he just destroyed tacklers.
It's an opinion. Guys like these bring more to the table  
LauderdaleMatty : 6/25/2017 1:47 am : link
Than their skills. In a contest like football seeing a RB knock a defender so hard they wilted helps the team beyond the play. Jacobs scaring defenders helped the team when he was in the field due to that. Caught up w him as guys destroyed his legs. But early on he was a monster.

Bradshaw was also a rough and tough guy. But at 205 it's different. Not any less important but different. Players respect a guy who played as hurt as he did. Shame. His style may have hurt him but as a 7th rounder he was an insanely great pick.

Love them both. Just think Bradshaw was a better all around back. Him by a nose I guess.
I'll take Tiki over either...  
x meadowlander : 6/25/2017 8:56 am : link
...and yes, Bradshaw was definitely nastier than Jacobs in his prime.

Think of how spoiled we were. Tiki/BJac/Bradshaw/Ward. Bonkers RB quality for overtime a decade there.
Tiki and Bradshaw  
annexOPR : 6/25/2017 10:48 am : link
both were special. Could create on their own and were fun to watch. I still remember chanting MVP at a game Tiki ran for over 200 yards ... (Chiefs? I think)

Jacobs/Ward benefited greatly from the OL performance. Ward was garbage after he left here and Jacobs would be absolutely useless in this current offense.

But he sure would look like a "beast" on those 1-2 yard runs.

In other news, I think we might have something special in Perkins. Loved what he showed last year, especially behind that pathetic OL. Really psyched to see him in year 2.
Bradshaw  
AnishPatel : 6/25/2017 11:43 am : link
With this OL, Jacobs isn't going anywhere. In fact, the way our OL was run blocking, we'd probably see more tackles for a loss with Jacobs as a RB now. I'd rather have bradshaw who at least can make something out nothing, and at least get back to the LOS.
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