Buster Olney& #8207;Verified account
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Sources: Mets open for business now, willing to listen to offers for Granderson, Addison Reed, Bruce, Cabrera, etc. Far behind in races.
I'd have to be absolutely blown away so I'd need a few of Fisher, Martes, Tucker, Paulino, Whitley, Teoscar Hernandez, Bukauskas. But the Astros system is so loaded as much as I love DeGrom I could find something.
As for the rest of the names on the list, I get why they were each brought in and in a vacuum many of those moves made sense, but turning over the aging roster has been overdue since the Royals exposed it as one of the worst defensive/situational hitting groups ever to make it to the WS. Unfortunately the only step that was taken at that point was allowing our best hitter to leave, but that's a different story. Going forward Sandy needs to re-focus the roster to amplify the strengths of the team and get back to the basics - pitching, defense, hitters who can give pitchers tough at bats and get on base in front of Cespedes.
Hopefully dealing some of those guys can build the farm back up a little bit too, maybe even adding a few young arms into the bullpen that can make an impact pretty quickly.
Houston would be making this deal as part of a "win now" run. So they won't be moving Springer, Correa, etc.
Is a package of Martes, Tucker, Fisher, Paulino even enough??
The Astros have one of the better systems in baseball. If the Mets landed say 4 big prospects (close to the bigs) then yeah it's something I would have to consider. I love DeGrom and wouldn't "want" to trade him but they are going to be doing something of an "on the fly" rebuild with Walker, Granderson, Duda, likely TDA all more likely than not gone and Rosario, Smith entering the picture. I could absolutely come up with a deal with the Astros where I say yes (using minor leaguers only).
would suspect it would come down to a bidding war and how hungry a team is to try and win a WS. He's team controlled for 3 more seasons so the price would "hurt". It would be a deal where fans would be conflicted giving up so much. The Mets wouldn't move him for a "fair" price. No real reason to. They can still point to DeGrom/Thor next season at the top of the rotation "worst" case.
I'm not so sure the Mets model is sustainable as is. Relying on young power pitchers in an era where it is very difficult for them to stay healthy is tough. The offense is average at best and streaky.
I'm not so sure the Mets model is sustainable as is. Relying on young power pitchers in an era where it is very difficult for them to stay healthy is tough. The offense is average at best and streaky.
There is a very good point in here that if the opportunity arises to do what the Cubs did swiping Addisson Russell, there is a lot less injury risk in great position players vs. pitchers. To get JDG with 3 years of control it would probably take a massive amount of talent, with at least 1 or 2 pieces being on that Addisson Russell level.
not too concerned with a potential DeGrom trade. I'd be blown away if it happened. My bigger concern is dealing guys like Bruce/Granderson with the goal being saving money for Freddie. For once I'd like to see the Mets worry about biggest returns and not who will kick in cash. I'm not expecting monster returns but get the best possible talent.
Assuming he is pitching to the level of a #1/#2, that would mean he would be line for a payday of about $25 to 30 million a year for 5 years. Does anyone really think the Mets going to pay a pitcher (any pitcher for that matter) at that age, that amount money for those years?
If deGrom was a FA at 27, you can do it. But not at 32. So that means the probability is he going to be traded anyway. Don't think the Astros didn't consider this as well.
It would be a very bold move to make if you're the Mets. You would have to fend off the anger of the fan base if you did it this year. Barring any medical issue, next July chances are this same trade idea will present itself. It is just a matter of when the Mets elect to finally do pull the trigger.
not too concerned with a potential DeGrom trade. I'd be blown away if it happened. My bigger concern is dealing guys like Bruce/Granderson with the goal being saving money for Freddie. For once I'd like to see the Mets worry about biggest returns and not who will kick in cash. I'm not expecting monster returns but get the best possible talent.
Agreed. Since none of those guys are going to bring back top prospects, I'm hoping they target high upside guys who are further away and pitchers who are closer to the bigs, likely don't have crazy upside, but can provide depth in the rotation and bullpen pretty quickly.
not too concerned with a potential DeGrom trade. I'd be blown away if it happened. My bigger concern is dealing guys like Bruce/Granderson with the goal being saving money for Freddie. For once I'd like to see the Mets worry about biggest returns and not who will kick in cash. I'm not expecting monster returns but get the best possible talent.
Agreed. Since none of those guys are going to bring back top prospects, I'm hoping they target high upside guys who are further away and pitchers who are closer to the bigs, likely don't have crazy upside, but can provide depth in the rotation and bullpen pretty quickly.
Yup. You are better off shooting for lottery tickets or guys with huge arms who haven't put it together when it comes to the Granderson/Bruce types. Nobody is dealing an MLB ready projected starting catcher for one of them (for example). Might as well add a few lottery tickets.
Not for nothing but including deGrom in the headline
makes it seem like the Mets are willing to sell off pieces including deGrom. Olney was pretty clear that Sandy is only fielding offers on upcoming free agents like Granderson, Cabrera, Reed, ect. The Astros can want deGrom, Syndergaard, Conforto and a host of players. Doesn't mean they can get them.
I also feel this is a typical Sandy type leak. Might as well start creating a buzz a month out and see what teams offer but I doubt we'd be trading anyone for at least a month.
I can only put so much in one headline. I didn't aim to confuse anyone. It was 2 different (though related stories). That the Astros are interested in DeGrom and that the Mets are looking to sell off their other veterans.
bad as Cabrera has been the Mets should still pick up his option unless they find a good trade partner. They don't have a 3B on the roster and bringing him back for an extra 6 million should be a no-brainer.
I can only put so much in one headline. I didn't aim to confuse anyone. It was 2 different (though related stories). That the Astros are interested in DeGrom and that the Mets are looking to sell off their other veterans.
Yeah I was just trying to clarify so non-Mets fans knew. Sorry if that came off dick-ish.
bad as Cabrera has been the Mets should still pick up his option unless they find a good trade partner. They don't have a 3B on the roster and bringing him back for an extra 6 million should be a no-brainer.
When you brought up that he asked not to play 3B this year I wasn't sure but I definitely believe it now. Why else would the Mets be considering him at 2B? The defense at 3B has been atrocious. Wonder what the deal is there.
bad as Cabrera has been the Mets should still pick up his option unless they find a good trade partner. They don't have a 3B on the roster and bringing him back for an extra 6 million should be a no-brainer.
When you brought up that he asked not to play 3B this year I wasn't sure but I definitely believe it now. Why else would the Mets be considering him at 2B? The defense at 3B has been atrocious. Wonder what the deal is there.
He's not even a FA so the only explanation I have is maybe he doesn't like the angle/trouble seeing the bat off the ball from 3. If he were a pending FA I guess I could see not wanting to move off your position (the implication being you "weren't" a SS anymore). Then again, Cespedes "won't" play RF and unlike 3b it's not as if he's going to get injured because of a different angle so it's unclear what the issue is with playing 3b. For whatever the reason asking him or Walker about 3b was almost taboo (just like Cespedes in RF). Never really understood why? Maybe they have a good answer.
Team has many holes and a god awful system after rosario and smith come up.
If the astros who are world series ready put tucker, paulino, alvarez and peacock in a deal im all in.
And nobody knows how good Rosario or Smith will be. Rosario has been very poor in June. His road OPS is not impressive. Smith has yet to develop the power he will need to be a ML 1B.
Both guys could make it. Both guys could fail. Much better prospects have not made it.
Never say never, but the return on DeGrom better be more than good
Nice year last year but he has become one of my all time hated Mets this season. Shows up to spring fat. Has one of his worst seasons statistically ever... Is flat out lazy in the field dropping pop ups, ect. Demands to be traded for being asked to move off SS. FUCK YOU!
Nice year last year but he has become one of my all time hated Mets this season. Shows up to spring fat. Has one of his worst seasons statistically ever... Is flat out lazy in the field dropping pop ups, ect. Demands to be traded for being asked to move off SS. FUCK YOU!
Amen brother Z
RE: RE: I wouldn't trade DeGrom for any package of youth
He's cost controlled and the Mets are still expected to be contenders next season, barring the injury catastrophe that has happened the past couple of seasons.
deGrom is one of my favorite non Yankee players in the league, but I cringe to think what the cost would be. And rightfully so. The Astros are interested. Great. So isn't every other team in baseball.
Nice year last year but he has become one of my all time hated Mets this season. Shows up to spring fat. Has one of his worst seasons statistically ever... Is flat out lazy in the field dropping pop ups, ect. Demands to be traded for being asked to move off SS. FUCK YOU!
lets say the Yankees were involved. What would the package look like? Frazier, Matteo and Rutherford? Is that too much? Too little?
As a Yankee fan familiar with the system..
First and foremost I don't want DeGrom.
However the trade you mentioned is a tad too much, bias aside.
If you want Frazier, okay. But no Mateo or Rutherford.
I would do Fowler, Mateo, Rutherford maybe. Plus one of our lotto ticket arms. But I'd want Flores included from the Mets. Maybe add Frazier to the deal if the Mets want to add both Reed and Blevins , we'd also throw in Wade and Ref/Austin, plus another low level arm. And cash.
He's cost controlled and the Mets are still expected to be contenders next season, barring the injury catastrophe that has happened the past couple of seasons.
deGrom is one of my favorite non Yankee players in the league, but I cringe to think what the cost would be. And rightfully so. The Astros are interested. Great. So isn't every other team in baseball.
If they don't make some roster adjustments they won't be expected to be contenders next season. Can't keep leaning on guys that get hurt to not get hurt. At some point you have to change your expectations to suit what the reality seems to be. And that is that this team as built needs their rotation, which has yet to be healthy, to be healthy and great because the offense is dreadfully inconsistent
and sign legit free agents in 2018, which is going to be one of the best free agent classes ever.
Sandy's 1990s Moneyball approach has been an abject failure. Trade way Cabrera, Walker, Reed, Granderson, Duda and Bruce. None of those guys is getting you a top prospect but together they should help replenish a depleted farm system at the lower levels. The lack of talent at AA is stunning. Not a single real prospect in Bing--a complete indictment of Mets poor drafting over the last seven years.
Play the young guys next year and then next offseason, go after Machado, Harper, Miller, Britton Kuechel etc . . .
You likely need to do what Omar did in 2005 and get two big free agents because the first makes the team more attractive to the second.
Unfortunately, despite his intelligence, Sandy appears to me to be an old man stuck in his ways, so that likely means signing Walker to a three-year deal and watching another broken down player get paid while on the DL.
Fine then sit his ass on the bench for the remainder of the season and promote Rosario. Decline his option and let him try to find a team who would give him close to what the Mets might have given him if they had picked up the option.
But the way the Mets handled this was atrocious. Informing him right before the game? Like Cabrera said, why didn't they tell him while he was rehabbing in the minors so he could have played some 2B and prepared himself?
I think he was angry and frustrated at the whole situation. That said, he has to keep his mouth shut.
So Cabrera stupidly shot his mouth off but the dysfunctional Mets management again showed how clueless they are. Sad thing is, I would wish for Sandy and Terry to retire but who's to say the Wilpons would not just hire another mediocre duo?
But the way the Mets handled this was atrocious. Informing him right before the game? Like Cabrera said, why didn't they tell him while he was rehabbing in the minors so he could have played some 2B and prepared himself?
I think he was angry and frustrated at the whole situation. That said, he has to keep his mouth shut.
So Cabrera stupidly shot his mouth off but the dysfunctional Mets management again showed how clueless they are. Sad thing is, I would wish for Sandy and Terry to retire but who's to say the Wilpons would not just hire another mediocre duo?
The Mets are a second rate organization. We all know this. They handle things poorly, starting from the top.
We are all so lucky to root for the Giants, who are top notch.
But the way the Mets handled this was atrocious. Informing him right before the game? Like Cabrera said, why didn't they tell him while he was rehabbing in the minors so he could have played some 2B and prepared himself?
I think he was angry and frustrated at the whole situation. That said, he has to keep his mouth shut.
So Cabrera stupidly shot his mouth off but the dysfunctional Mets management again showed how clueless they are. Sad thing is, I would wish for Sandy and Terry to retire but who's to say the Wilpons would not just hire another mediocre duo?
It's not like this was some dramatic switch for him. They're not asking him to play catcher. He's had around 200 starts at 2B in his career.
I guess we are including Rosario and Thor too?:)
Quote:
please
I guess we are including Rosario and Thor too?:)
Lol - more of a joke that I don't think they move Degrom unless blown away.
I'd have to be absolutely blown away so I'd need a few of Fisher, Martes, Tucker, Paulino, Whitley, Teoscar Hernandez, Bukauskas. But the Astros system is so loaded as much as I love DeGrom I could find something.
Is a package of Martes, Tucker, Fisher, Paulino even enough??
As for the rest of the names on the list, I get why they were each brought in and in a vacuum many of those moves made sense, but turning over the aging roster has been overdue since the Royals exposed it as one of the worst defensive/situational hitting groups ever to make it to the WS. Unfortunately the only step that was taken at that point was allowing our best hitter to leave, but that's a different story. Going forward Sandy needs to re-focus the roster to amplify the strengths of the team and get back to the basics - pitching, defense, hitters who can give pitchers tough at bats and get on base in front of Cespedes.
Hopefully dealing some of those guys can build the farm back up a little bit too, maybe even adding a few young arms into the bullpen that can make an impact pretty quickly.
Is a package of Martes, Tucker, Fisher, Paulino even enough??
The Astros have one of the better systems in baseball. If the Mets landed say 4 big prospects (close to the bigs) then yeah it's something I would have to consider. I love DeGrom and wouldn't "want" to trade him but they are going to be doing something of an "on the fly" rebuild with Walker, Granderson, Duda, likely TDA all more likely than not gone and Rosario, Smith entering the picture. I could absolutely come up with a deal with the Astros where I say yes (using minor leaguers only).
There is a very good point in here that if the opportunity arises to do what the Cubs did swiping Addisson Russell, there is a lot less injury risk in great position players vs. pitchers. To get JDG with 3 years of control it would probably take a massive amount of talent, with at least 1 or 2 pieces being on that Addisson Russell level.
Assuming he is pitching to the level of a #1/#2, that would mean he would be line for a payday of about $25 to 30 million a year for 5 years. Does anyone really think the Mets going to pay a pitcher (any pitcher for that matter) at that age, that amount money for those years?
If deGrom was a FA at 27, you can do it. But not at 32. So that means the probability is he going to be traded anyway. Don't think the Astros didn't consider this as well.
It would be a very bold move to make if you're the Mets. You would have to fend off the anger of the fan base if you did it this year. Barring any medical issue, next July chances are this same trade idea will present itself. It is just a matter of when the Mets elect to finally do pull the trigger.
Agreed. Since none of those guys are going to bring back top prospects, I'm hoping they target high upside guys who are further away and pitchers who are closer to the bigs, likely don't have crazy upside, but can provide depth in the rotation and bullpen pretty quickly.
Quote:
not too concerned with a potential DeGrom trade. I'd be blown away if it happened. My bigger concern is dealing guys like Bruce/Granderson with the goal being saving money for Freddie. For once I'd like to see the Mets worry about biggest returns and not who will kick in cash. I'm not expecting monster returns but get the best possible talent.
Agreed. Since none of those guys are going to bring back top prospects, I'm hoping they target high upside guys who are further away and pitchers who are closer to the bigs, likely don't have crazy upside, but can provide depth in the rotation and bullpen pretty quickly.
Yup. You are better off shooting for lottery tickets or guys with huge arms who haven't put it together when it comes to the Granderson/Bruce types. Nobody is dealing an MLB ready projected starting catcher for one of them (for example). Might as well add a few lottery tickets.
I also feel this is a typical Sandy type leak. Might as well start creating a buzz a month out and see what teams offer but I doubt we'd be trading anyone for at least a month.
Yeah I was just trying to clarify so non-Mets fans knew. Sorry if that came off dick-ish.
When you brought up that he asked not to play 3B this year I wasn't sure but I definitely believe it now. Why else would the Mets be considering him at 2B? The defense at 3B has been atrocious. Wonder what the deal is there.
Quote:
bad as Cabrera has been the Mets should still pick up his option unless they find a good trade partner. They don't have a 3B on the roster and bringing him back for an extra 6 million should be a no-brainer.
When you brought up that he asked not to play 3B this year I wasn't sure but I definitely believe it now. Why else would the Mets be considering him at 2B? The defense at 3B has been atrocious. Wonder what the deal is there.
He's not even a FA so the only explanation I have is maybe he doesn't like the angle/trouble seeing the bat off the ball from 3. If he were a pending FA I guess I could see not wanting to move off your position (the implication being you "weren't" a SS anymore). Then again, Cespedes "won't" play RF and unlike 3b it's not as if he's going to get injured because of a different angle so it's unclear what the issue is with playing 3b. For whatever the reason asking him or Walker about 3b was almost taboo (just like Cespedes in RF). Never really understood why? Maybe they have a good answer.
He's 29. It's absolutely worth discussing.
If the astros who are world series ready put tucker, paulino, alvarez and peacock in a deal im all in.
If the astros who are world series ready put tucker, paulino, alvarez and peacock in a deal im all in.
And nobody knows how good Rosario or Smith will be. Rosario has been very poor in June. His road OPS is not impressive. Smith has yet to develop the power he will need to be a ML 1B.
Both guys could make it. Both guys could fail. Much better prospects have not made it.
Why not? He's not some young pup.
That 8.2 mill salary isn't something. That's not enough for his family
Amen brother Z
Quote:
...none.
Why not? He's not some young pup.
deGrom is one of my favorite non Yankee players in the league, but I cringe to think what the cost would be. And rightfully so. The Astros are interested. Great. So isn't every other team in baseball.
Trade him to the Phillies.
As a Yankee fan familiar with the system..
First and foremost I don't want DeGrom.
However the trade you mentioned is a tad too much, bias aside.
If you want Frazier, okay. But no Mateo or Rutherford.
I would do Fowler, Mateo, Rutherford maybe. Plus one of our lotto ticket arms. But I'd want Flores included from the Mets. Maybe add Frazier to the deal if the Mets want to add both Reed and Blevins , we'd also throw in Wade and Ref/Austin, plus another low level arm. And cash.
deGrom is one of my favorite non Yankee players in the league, but I cringe to think what the cost would be. And rightfully so. The Astros are interested. Great. So isn't every other team in baseball.
If they don't make some roster adjustments they won't be expected to be contenders next season. Can't keep leaning on guys that get hurt to not get hurt. At some point you have to change your expectations to suit what the reality seems to be. And that is that this team as built needs their rotation, which has yet to be healthy, to be healthy and great because the offense is dreadfully inconsistent
The Mets bungled this and they should be playing Rosario instead of Reyes at SS
Sandy's 1990s Moneyball approach has been an abject failure. Trade way Cabrera, Walker, Reed, Granderson, Duda and Bruce. None of those guys is getting you a top prospect but together they should help replenish a depleted farm system at the lower levels. The lack of talent at AA is stunning. Not a single real prospect in Bing--a complete indictment of Mets poor drafting over the last seven years.
Play the young guys next year and then next offseason, go after Machado, Harper, Miller, Britton Kuechel etc . . .
You likely need to do what Omar did in 2005 and get two big free agents because the first makes the team more attractive to the second.
Unfortunately, despite his intelligence, Sandy appears to me to be an old man stuck in his ways, so that likely means signing Walker to a three-year deal and watching another broken down player get paid while on the DL.
I think he was angry and frustrated at the whole situation. That said, he has to keep his mouth shut.
So Cabrera stupidly shot his mouth off but the dysfunctional Mets management again showed how clueless they are. Sad thing is, I would wish for Sandy and Terry to retire but who's to say the Wilpons would not just hire another mediocre duo?
I think he was angry and frustrated at the whole situation. That said, he has to keep his mouth shut.
So Cabrera stupidly shot his mouth off but the dysfunctional Mets management again showed how clueless they are. Sad thing is, I would wish for Sandy and Terry to retire but who's to say the Wilpons would not just hire another mediocre duo?
The Mets are a second rate organization. We all know this. They handle things poorly, starting from the top.
We are all so lucky to root for the Giants, who are top notch.
I think he was angry and frustrated at the whole situation. That said, he has to keep his mouth shut.
So Cabrera stupidly shot his mouth off but the dysfunctional Mets management again showed how clueless they are. Sad thing is, I would wish for Sandy and Terry to retire but who's to say the Wilpons would not just hire another mediocre duo?
It's not like this was some dramatic switch for him. They're not asking him to play catcher. He's had around 200 starts at 2B in his career.
this guy is bit of a gamer. just like Murphy