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Schwartz NYP: Inside Marshall's orientation to Eli

Defenderdawg : 6/27/2017 5:27 pm
"That’s one of the reasons we have a great opportunity, because everyone knows where they’re supposed to be and knows where the ball’s gonna be and when it’s coming,’’ Marshall said. “That’s something I never had to deal with my entire career. I never had a quarterback be so precise with his preparation and also just ball placement and getting the ball out quick. That’s been the biggest adjustment for me.’’
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I don't know about coming here because of Beckham  
Go Terps : 6/27/2017 9:00 pm : link
I could see coming here to play with Eli, but I don't know that Beckham makes the Giants any more attractive to a veteran free agent.
Marshall is going to be a in the Red Zone  
JohnF : 6/27/2017 9:00 pm : link
He may not have that many yards, but he's going to be Eli's favorite target down there. Defenses have to put their #1 DB's on OBJ, so Marshall is going to feast on #2's and #3's.

Add to the fact that he's big enough to block for the running game...something we really haven't had out of our WR's in quite a long time.
be a major factor in the End Zone  
JohnF : 6/27/2017 9:01 pm : link
..
He's going to be a beast.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 6/27/2017 9:13 pm : link
.
I'm not too concerned with Marshall not providing  
The_Boss : 6/27/2017 9:14 pm : link
The "oooh" or "aaah" plays. One must remember, the NYG boast one of the best secondaries in football. The battles to come in training camp should be epic.
RE: the  
B in ALB : 6/27/2017 9:26 pm : link
In comment 13512813 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
only thing that makes me nervous is we didn't hear a lot of "oohh" and "ahh" plays from reporters this spring on Marshall.


Ooohs and ahhs in June? Is that the barometer these days? Wow.
There's a lot I like about Marshall  
Milton : 6/27/2017 9:31 pm : link
First of all, I respect the fact that he overcame mental illness earlier in his career. It didn't make him perfect, but it gives him perspective even when he makes a misstep. I expect him to be both an asset on the field and in the locker room. And I expect him to be a positive veteran influence on OBJ in a way that Cruz was unable to. And that's not a dig at Cruz (I love the guy), it was just the circumstances and timing.
p.s.--When you reach that age where you lose a step, it helps to be 6'4"
Eli has all the weapons and should have a career year  
SHO'NUFF : 6/27/2017 9:41 pm : link
but the O-line is going to fuck that up.
RE: I don't know about coming here because of Beckham  
arcarsenal : 6/27/2017 9:41 pm : link
In comment 13512922 Go Terps said:
Quote:
I could see coming here to play with Eli, but I don't know that Beckham makes the Giants any more attractive to a veteran free agent.


He said it himself. There's nothing to be skeptical about.
Sure B...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/27/2017 9:47 pm : link
Marshall is 33 and coming off a down season.

We heard lots of good stuff about Sterling Shepard.

Hoping for 2015 version of Marshall and not the 2002 version of Herman Moore with the Giants.

(BTW fellas, it's OK to not to always been a blind cheerleader for the team but to question things).
Marshall  
WillVAB : 6/27/2017 9:47 pm : link
Eli hasn't had a WR w his size and talent on the outside since Plax. Marshall had a killer year in '15 -- great in the red zone, good after the catch, good speed to beat guys deep, and used his size to beat defenders. Anyone remember how bad he made Prince look that year?

Marshall should have a big year with OBJ on the other side and Engram/Shep to attract coverage. All comes down to the OL.
Herman Moore?  
arcarsenal : 6/27/2017 9:50 pm : link
LOL, cmon.

It's one thing to wonder how much Marshall has in the tank. It's another to use an absolutely ridiculous comparison.

Moore was signed mid-season out of desperation because we literally had no healthy WR's left on the team at that point. He was coming off a season where he played in 3 games and caught 4 passes. He appeared in one game and caught 0 passes.

This isn't even in the same universe.
RE: Sure B...  
B in ALB : 6/27/2017 9:58 pm : link
In comment 13512954 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Marshall is 33 and coming off a down season.

We heard lots of good stuff about Sterling Shepard.

Hoping for 2015 version of Marshall and not the 2002 version of Herman Moore with the Giants.

(BTW fellas, it's OK to not to always been a blind cheerleader for the team but to question things).


I'm never a blind cheerleader Eric. Never been the case.
Ever. You don't know me personally but I'd think you know my football experience from various posts over the last 17 years. To position your argument based on "oooohs" and "ahhhs" in June is well below your football aptitude.

A 33 year old vet receiver looking to prove something might be exactly what this team - and OBJ - needs.

(and to compare Marshall to shot HM is beyond ridiculous)
..  
arcarsenal : 6/27/2017 10:00 pm : link
Quote:
So it was extremely important for me to go to a place where, I didn't want to be the No. 1. I wanted a dominant No. 1. And Odell is the biggest superstar in our business and obviously, we have a great defense so it will be awesome to see all those guys grow in Year 2 all together."


Quote:
“I just think that there’s a lot of opportunity on the other side of Odell,” Marshall said. Unlike with the Jets, Marshall will clearly be the No. 2 option behind Beckham Jr., though playing alongside the Giants’ young star receiver was a factor that attracted Marshall to the team.


Quote:
"I have a great relationship with @OBJ_3. I just love the guy to death." - @BMarshall


Quote:
"This kid isn't even in his prime yet and he's a monster." - @BMarshall on @OBJ_3


Quote:
“I’m super excited to play with and experience an awesome quarterback in Eli Manning and play with the biggest superstar in the NFL, Odell, on the other side,” Marshall said. “I’m eager to take pressure of him. He’s seen funky coverages. So many teams do everything they can to pull him out of the game.”


I think it's safe to say that Odell most certainly had an impact on Marshall's decision to come here.
RE: ..  
B in ALB : 6/27/2017 10:02 pm : link
In comment 13512964 arcarsenal said:
Quote:


Quote:


So it was extremely important for me to go to a place where, I didn't want to be the No. 1. I wanted a dominant No. 1. And Odell is the biggest superstar in our business and obviously, we have a great defense so it will be awesome to see all those guys grow in Year 2 all together."





Quote:


“I just think that there’s a lot of opportunity on the other side of Odell,” Marshall said. Unlike with the Jets, Marshall will clearly be the No. 2 option behind Beckham Jr., though playing alongside the Giants’ young star receiver was a factor that attracted Marshall to the team.





Quote:


"I have a great relationship with @OBJ_3. I just love the guy to death." - @BMarshall





Quote:


"This kid isn't even in his prime yet and he's a monster." - @BMarshall on @OBJ_3





Quote:


“I’m super excited to play with and experience an awesome quarterback in Eli Manning and play with the biggest superstar in the NFL, Odell, on the other side,” Marshall said. “I’m eager to take pressure of him. He’s seen funky coverages. So many teams do everything they can to pull him out of the game.”



I think it's safe to say that Odell most certainly had an impact on Marshall's decision to come here.



That's all well and good. But did Jordan Raanan, Pat Leonard and Gary Myers "oooooh" and "ahhhhh" during June workouts?

(soooory, but that's it in a nutshell)
Stop it Arc  
UConn4523 : 6/27/2017 10:04 pm : link
you are tainting the notion that Odell isn't a team player and that no one wants to play with him.
Of course he said it  
Go Terps : 6/27/2017 10:05 pm : link
He's probably been asked a million times about playing with Beckham, and he's smart enough to say exactly what the fans want to hear. It means nothing.

LOL..  
arcarsenal : 6/27/2017 10:07 pm : link
You're something else, man.

So, we have to dismiss what the guy actually said because he was "supposed" to say it, but we should believe you that he thinks otherwise because........?

He's FRIENDS with Odell. He's not saying this because he feels obligated to say it. He's been friends with Beckham since before March.

But somehow, we're supposed to dismiss the idea that he could have come here to play with him even though he said it himself.

Rich.
RE: Of course he said it  
UConn4523 : 6/27/2017 10:09 pm : link
In comment 13512970 Go Terps said:
Quote:
He's probably been asked a million times about playing with Beckham, and he's smart enough to say exactly what the fans want to hear. It means nothing.


Well it means something, you are just choosing to believe what you want which is fine. At this point in his career I don't see much of a reason for Marshall to lie, and if he did in fact turn down better offers that gives more validity.

I just don't understand why you think a player in the twilight of his career, who's never won anything, wouldn't factor in who's playing along side of him and consider it a positive thing if said player was great.
RE: the  
djm : 6/27/2017 10:12 pm : link
In comment 13512813 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
only thing that makes me nervous is we didn't hear a lot of "oohh" and "ahh" plays from reporters this spring on Marshall.


I don't think we get a lot of ooh and ahh plays from Marshall but I think we're gonna like him regardless. He will be the best outside wr that Beckham will have played with up until this point and will represent a clear upgrade over Cruz and Randle before him. I don't think we get the big stuff downfield but Marshall will move the chains and beat single coverage enough for Eli to squeeze plays in there.

Marshall gives the WR position credibility just with his size and savy but the real key is going to be Engram. If he's the goods watch out. I also think Shepard is in for a really big year. People are writing him off but he's the perfect age and in the perfect position to clean up. Eli loves going to guys like Shepard.
No career year for Marshall  
KWALL2 : 6/27/2017 10:21 pm : link
But it will be his most memorable for him as he finally plays on a winner.

Marshall won't see the ball like he has in he past. He's just a piece now and not the main guy.

Beckham, Engram, Shepard. All 3 will have big years. Marshall may be 4th option this year.
RE: Eli has all the weapons and should have a career year  
Milton : 6/27/2017 10:21 pm : link
In comment 13512942 SHO'NUFF said:
Quote:
but the O-line is going to fuck that up.
If the starting five can remain healthy, the OL will be good enough. In 2015 they were starting to gel, but Richburg played all of 2016 with one hand and Pugh missed a bunch of games. And it didn't help that their starting RB lost a step between 2015 and 2016 and their 3rd down back spent the year on IR.

If the interior trio of Pugh, Richburg, and Jerry (Fluker?) are playing at/near 100% health, I think they are good enough to overcome less than stellar play at the tackle positions. If Flowers shows even a little improvement, that will go a long way. He doesn't need to be great, he doesn't need to be good, he just needs to be middle of the road. And on the right side, I'm not too hopeful about Hart. If Bisnowaty takes well to the switch from the left side to the right side, that's a camp battle I'd like to see him win. His upside is higher than Hart's and he's under contract for four years.

Bottomline, I expect the OL to pick up where the 2015 OL left off, not the 2016 version.
And I still say  
djm : 6/27/2017 10:25 pm : link
Guys "cutting" into other players stats is a myth. If you have the qb and the team is loaded with star WRs and TEs they all get their numbers when All is said and done. I can cite dozens of examples over the years of teams 3-4 deep with wr talent plus the TE and with the star qb, they all got their numbers in the end. I am talking even on a FF level they produced big. Everyone ignores history: stat cutting is a myth if the qb is worth anything.

Eli will spread the wealth. For every vultured pass that the other guys do not get there will be longer drives, more Td opportunities and more chances for everyone.

It's all about the qb getting everyone involved. Eli has been doing so for years now. Unless last year is the start of something bad with Eli, which I don't think is so, all the skill players will get their burn it they are up for the opportunity. I don't think Eli was great last year but the wr and TEs were a bigger culprit with the offensive struggles. Eli makes mistakes but with legit weopons in place all over the place he's going to produce numbers. He always does.

Maybe less targets for Beckham and or Shepard but better production. Marshall and the TEs will get theirs too.
RE: Of course he said it  
BigBluDawg : 6/27/2017 10:27 pm : link
In comment 13512970 Go Terps said:
Quote:
He's probably been asked a million times about playing with Beckham, and he's smart enough to say exactly what the fans want to hear. It means nothing.


Those quotes are from the first day he signed, so he was asked a million times about playing with Beckham before anyone knew he was signing here ???

Sometimes you guys just need to admit you were wrong about certain stuff and move on sheesh
B  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/27/2017 10:29 pm : link
I'm optimistic about Marshall, but he was the premiere FA signed by the Giants at one of the very few positions where players can show off their skills during OTAs and mini-camp.

I think I remember reading he had a nifty one-handed catch in the red zone. That's good stuff. I just expected to hear more feedback from the beat reporters with blurbs like that.

We heard good stuff from more unlikely quarters like Matt LaCosse. Sterling Shepard was widely reported to have looked very sharp.

33 is a tricky age for a WR. The good news is that Marshall's game was never based around speed or quickness. He's a big, physical presence who at worst, should still be a red zone weapon. But I'm greedy. I want the 2015 version of Marshall. That may not be realistic.
E...  
arcarsenal : 6/27/2017 10:39 pm : link
We don't need the 2015 version. That's what makes it so much better. He can catch 60 balls for 800 yards just like he did last year and it'll probably be plenty good enough if we get another big year from Beckham, Shepard progresses and Engram is the real deal.

I'll be more concerned if we go through the majority of camp and none of the beats are mentioning him much.

For all the "ooh's" and "ahh's" a guy like Matt "Mr. June" LaCosse gets during OTA's, it's never happened in a game that meant something. Marshall is proven.

Even if he slows down a tick and isn't what he was in 2015, he's still going to be an upgrade over the 2016 version of Cruz and will provide the RZ target this team really needs.

If Marshall's 2017 numbers approach his 2015 numbers, it probably means Beckham got hurt.
OK Eric  
B in ALB : 6/27/2017 10:44 pm : link
but he was signed to be a #2 or #3 receiver and to open up opportunities around him. He knows that and based on his interviews, there's no doubt he knows it.

So what's the problem? The lack of "ooooohs" and "aaaahs" from the peanut gallery in June?

Or the signing itself?

With respect, I think your argument is a bit ridiculous. It's very early. Injuries happen. And maybe, just maybe, Marshall might save somebody's bacon.

In other words, the jury hasn't even been sent a letter yet.
Re: Ooohs and ahhs  
JohnF : 6/27/2017 11:04 pm : link
At 33, Marshall knows his body has only so much left in the tank. Going all out for OTA's would probably not be the smart move for a vet in his position.

He knows he'll be on the team, and I expect him to start pushing his limits later in "real" camp. Some guys are just better when they have the pads on, as well.

Remember, he's not going to go against the opposing teams #1 DB anymore. Nor will he be getting double teamed. Even if his skills have diminished a bit, going against weaker DB's slants things in his favor. I expect big games from BM, most likely early in the season (and hopefully against Dallas in the first game!)
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/27/2017 11:21 pm : link
We'll agree to disagree.

As I said, I'm optimistic. But I think it is OK to question how much a 33-year old receiver - who has said he only wants to play two more years tops - has left in the tank.

I'd feel a bit more sure of my optimism if Marshall had made one of those many "best of OTA/mini-camp" lists from the half-dozen reporters who cover the team.

There is a very good possibility that he is "pacing" himself. But I heard that same argument with Cruz.

My prediction - which will be in my WR preview - is one that you will like. But it's OK to be a tad not too pollyanish.
.  
arcarsenal : 6/27/2017 11:34 pm : link
Of course you can question what he has left in the tank. It's normal for anyone to wonder that about a player his age.

I just thought the Herman Moore comparison was fairly ridiculous. Moore was like 4 years removed from his last good NFL season by the time he got here. He obviously had nothing left in the tank.

Marshall is obviously not in his prime anymore, but I am very confident that he does still have some gas in the tank and will give us more than Cruz did. Marshall didn't suffer the same patellar tendon injury that Cruz did. Cruz also relied on his short burst and shiftiness to create space. Marshall utilizes a much different skillset.
The real question...  
Existenz : 6/28/2017 12:16 am : link
Is if Marshall will accept the "Toomer" style role in 2007. If he runs the routes that are called for him well and he has sure hands, he can thrive in this offense. He may just have to wait until his number is called some games.
Marshall and Odell outside require a corner and a safety  
est1986 : 6/28/2017 12:26 am : link
Then Shepard and Engram up the middle... We are going to rip pass coverages apart! This is going to be a great season. I said at the very least 10 wins last year and I don't see how we can have a worse record than last year. I expect a huge year.
Marshall still has something in the tank.  
idinkido : 6/28/2017 5:34 am : link
Don't underestimate him because of his age. This guy has produced big time carrying a lot of weight on his shoulders for a lot of years. His experience, skill, and size is going to prove out over many secondaries and don't be surprised to see
him bounce off contact and break a play for a big gain. Marshall is a very smart player and this can only help us especially in the red zone.
On paper,  
Doomster : 6/28/2017 6:43 am : link
the OBj, SS, Marshall, Engram and Vereen tandem looks awesome......but we have said the same thing a few times since 2011, and it hasn't panned out.....so there has to be some cautious optimism.....

Main thing is staying healthy, and giving Eli some time to throw.....

The one thing I want to see, is some execution by Eli and this offense in the preseason, which we never seem to see.....it's hard to come out of the starting blocks at the start of the season, when it seems you are just going through the motions in preseason....
Those are some interesting comments from Marshall...  
Pete in 'Vliet : 6/28/2017 8:27 am : link
Quote:
"I never had a quarterback be so precise with his preparation and also just ball placement and getting the ball out quick."


...especially, shortly after Bennett's comment that Cutler is a better QB than Eli. Suddenly Cutler's long time "football soul-mate" is now call Manning his best QB, even though they haven't played a game together?

It seems to me that Brandon is still in the "say whatever the team needs me to say" mode. We will see if his attitude changes as the season goes on, but his size and skill is still an upgrade over Cruz and he should be a valuable target for Eli.
Marshall doesn't need to be an ooh and ahh guy  
jgambrosio : 6/28/2017 8:39 am : link
First, that's Beckham. Second he's a huge target. He doesn't need to make things look spectacular with his size and reach. He also will be more of a possession guy than earlier in his career so his style will reflect that.

The question coming in from anyone is how he will mesh and that's been excellent so far.
Marshall's biggest contributions this year  
Simms11 : 6/28/2017 8:56 am : link
will come as a blocker and Red Zone target IMO. Two things we were lacking last year. He'll contribute, but may not still be the same receiver he was 2 years ago. He doesn't have to be. Especially with the other threats at receiver we now have (ie. S Shepard, OBJ, Vereen, Engram).
Just look at what we need him to do:  
BigBlueWhale : 6/28/2017 9:31 am : link
There's a reason he was hand-picked as the priority free agent this year: whether he's lost a step or not, we need him to be a reliable target on the backside when D's overplay Odell, and we need a red zone target for fades.

He can do both.

It's a great fit, especially when you consider how well Eli works with tall receivers. Not concerned one bit about a loss of effectiveness and I thought he still looked very good last year in the areas we need him to look good in.
RE: the  
Brown Recluse : 6/28/2017 10:31 am : link
In comment 13512813 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
only thing that makes me nervous is we didn't hear a lot of "oohh" and "ahh" plays from reporters this spring on Marshall.


We don't need oohhs and aahhs. Just take some attention away from Beckham, along with Engram.

That said, the risk in signing an old veteran is you never know if this will be the year his body gives up.
I think Marshall said it himself  
gmen9892 : 6/28/2017 10:46 am : link
He is not quite on the same page with Manning yet. There were a lot of drops and he said "The Giants probably think I am a bad investment right now". The dude is doing all the right things and putting in all the necessary work to get on the same page with Manning.

I dont think its a physical issue as much as it is a mental issue. Once he gets the reps and timing down, the proverbial "ooo's" and "ahh's" will come. I truly believe that.
RE: I think Marshall said it himself  
Brown Recluse : 6/28/2017 12:49 pm : link
In comment 13513509 gmen9892 said:
Quote:
He is not quite on the same page with Manning yet. There were a lot of drops and he said "The Giants probably think I am a bad investment right now". The dude is doing all the right things and putting in all the necessary work to get on the same page with Manning.

I dont think its a physical issue as much as it is a mental issue. Once he gets the reps and timing down, the proverbial "ooo's" and "ahh's" will come. I truly believe that.


Yup. Just read that in Defenderdawg's thread.

Quote:
"I think I dropped every other ball the first two weeks. I was like, 'These guys probably think they made a bad investment right now,' " said Marshall, who signed a two-year, $11 million contract with the Giants in March.

"I'm still trying to figure out the timing of the hitch route. I think our last practice Eli just threw it at my feet and said, 'I'm just going to throw it so you get the timing. I'm just going to do my job and you've got to do yours.' "

link - ( New Window )
Regarding Oooh's and Aaah's in minicamp  
Giantfan in skinland : 6/28/2017 3:36 pm : link
A) He and Eli have talked already about how they're still feeling each other out.

B) He's a vet. He's not going hard every play like a guy fighting for his NFL life.

C)
But also...  
Giantfan in skinland : 6/28/2017 3:38 pm : link
I don't view Marshall's role here as the guy we're gonna expect ooh and ahh plays from. If he all he ever does is out-muscle defenders for 7 yard gains on 3rd and 6, we'll be thrilled with the signing.
RE: If Marshall  
SGMen : 7/4/2017 12:03 am : link
In comment 13512919 Doomster said:
Quote:
has anything left in the tank, he could be the biggest steal in FAcy.....

Marshall was a #1 WR.....he is no longer that, and doesn't want to carry that burden, so this is a perfect fit for him....

I hope Eli does not get "gidifored" back there, wondering which open guy he should throw to....
All Marshall has to do is eek out one more big year, one more productive season. He's always been a bona-fide #1 so seeing him with single coverage, age 33 or not, may prove to be quite interesting. I mean, what if he has lower-ebb #1 ability still and ends up feeding off OBJ to the tune of 90-1200-12 type numbers! The offense would be Top 10. LOL
Oohh, First I am hearing that Marshall sucked at the OTAs  
Jimmy Googs : 7/4/2017 4:53 am : link
Ahh, just remembered that is pretty meaningless...
I'm with Eric as well, although  
aimrocky : 7/4/2017 7:32 am : link
I'm not concerned by the lack of love during OTA's. I always thought it was odd that the Marshall signing came with very little skepticism. The friendly contract makes this low risk, but he is a 33 year old receiver coming off a down year. It's not guaranteed that he plugs into this offense as a key cog.

I think the growth of Shepard, Perkins & Flowers along with the addition of Engram end up being more meaningful than the Marshall signing.
RE: Marshall is going to be a in the Red Zone  
Matt M. : 7/4/2017 7:38 am : link
In comment 13512923 JohnF said:
Quote:
He may not have that many yards, but he's going to be Eli's favorite target down there. Defenses have to put their #1 DB's on OBJ, so Marshall is going to feast on #2's and #3's.

Add to the fact that he's big enough to block for the running game...something we really haven't had out of our WR's in quite a long time.
I just hope McAdoo runs more than fades to Marshall and Engram down there.
Eric - I agree that it is OK to question  
Matt M. : 7/4/2017 7:41 am : link
I had (have?) questions and concerns about signing Marshall. But, even mentioning him in the same sentence as Herman Moore is nuts. Talk about apples and oranges.
RE: Of course he said it  
djm : 7/4/2017 10:40 am : link
In comment 13512970 Go Terps said:
Quote:
He's probably been asked a million times about playing with Beckham, and he's smart enough to say exactly what the fans want to hear. It means nothing.


Dude.
RE: I'm with Eric as well, although  
SGMen : 7/4/2017 10:57 am : link
In comment 13518949 aimrocky said:
Quote:
I'm not concerned by the lack of love during OTA's. I always thought it was odd that the Marshall signing came with very little skepticism. The friendly contract makes this low risk, but he is a 33 year old receiver coming off a down year. It's not guaranteed that he plugs into this offense as a key cog.

I think the growth of Shepard, Perkins & Flowers along with the addition of Engram end up being more meaningful than the Marshall signing.
I tend to disagree. If Marshall is "Cruz 2" where he can no longer accelerate to get open this offense will struggle. But Marshall has a "physical" game and I totally expect he'll produce 80-900-9 or thereabout type numbers as he'll be getting single coverage for the first time in his career.

And last year, the Jets were a mess at QB so while targeted the passes weren't always there for him to haul in. I also think that the Jets mindset was down and so was Marshall's so subconsciously the effort may not have always been 100%.

B. Marshall is a physical freak who was a #1 and now will be a #2, drawing single coverage against likely the 2nd best corner on a team. I believe he'll make his fair share of snags and he'll be a redzone presence that Eli will go to as he likes the big guys.
Finally, at age 33, he's matured some and won't likely be a guy you don't want around. Remember, we should have a winning team and that tends to keep guys happy and content.

And honestly, if he put up 85-1100-10 type numbers no one should be surprised either. He draws the #2 corner, likely, and should eat those guys up on many routes that he flourishes at due to his size. We shall see, it will be interesting indeed.
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