I can overlook the Norman meltdown. But I remember vividly the pouting when he didn't get the ball and he showed up Eli. And that bothers me and it's a worry for next year and it's about the only way I can see this team not blowing away the league.
I remember too the disregard (both implicit and explicit) that he showed for his head coach. The bravado not sustained that showed up shirtless in Green Bay and a potential trip to the superbowl crapped on with dropped wide open passes and Eli didn't show him up cause Eli is about team.
I also remember the first time he played; lined up split left (the top of my tv screen), the first graceful move he put on the CB and he was so open a stunned Eli couldn't react, the second play and the cb almost fell down reached out and grabbed for elusive lightning & took a penalty - gladly. A Giant fan since the mid fifties, only LT, Tucker Fredrickson, and Shockey had first moments that compared, only they didn't compare.
This is a generational talent. Brilliant in every way, the best route runner, best hands, most explosive YAC's, and, all his preening aside, still a charmer.
Who thinks he is bigger than the game and bigger than NY. And probably is.
And suddenly there's Marshall, a returning Vereen, a more mature and accomplished Shepard, the wonderful potential of Ephram, King, Lewis, Powe and Randall. And solid tough guy Ellison who is a better receiver and overall player than he's given credit for.
Our kitchen scraps will be other teams entrees.
As great as he is I am not sure that group is much the less for not having him. And the game is still played with one ball...and is he going to pout when Marshall gets red zone attention and Ephram breaks one down the middle.
And it's relative anyway. He will demand (appropriately so) a kings's ransom next year and that means less talent on the roster.
It's bold, it's daring and maybe even suicidial. But I'd trade the brilliance and the promise if I could bring back a high (and easy on the cap) no.`1.
Which is why I'm in the forklift business and don't trade cars or football players.
At least you're consistent...
However...Parcells quit Dallas mainly because Jones re-signed TO while Bill was vacationing in the Carribean. Parcells so loathed Owens that he couldn't even stomach calling him by name. He just identified him by the player's #.
Situations aren't the same . TO was older. Beckham, though frequently a prick, has not turned it inward on his teammates and coaches-at least yet. I don't think it will go there . But it could .
Do you genuinely feel going to Miami caused his outlying performance? I tend to think it was the finger injury he was playing through, the bitter cold, at least one of the throws being out of reach, and that it was his first play-off game.
Those all seem more likely to disrupt play than where he was 6 days before. But to each his own I guess.
Personally never get too excited rooting for jerks. Michael Boley, Josh Brown, Christian Peters, guys like that. I've just never seen or heard OBJ do anything to put him in the range to not root for or trust.
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Odell and Eli to Miami for Jarvis Landry and Tannehill. That way we can retain Odell's babysitter the WR coach from LSU to serve in the same capacity with Landry.
At least you're consistent...
Thanks, I had to work to come up with as ridiculous an idea as the premise of this one.
Well, yes.
What everyone remembers is the playoff games, of course, but Plaxico was added to a team that was about to go on a string of playoff run years and Beckham was drafted at a time when the team was bad enough to have a top 10 pick.
57 Games, 244 receptions 3,681 yards, 33 touchdowns
43 Games, 288 receptions 4,122 yards, 35 touchdowns
We're not trading him. I will never understand why people waste time writing up these giant, unreadable walls of texts proposing something that's never going to happen.
I reject the Cowboys example. Trading away Hershel Walker was a monumentally classic blunder by Minnesota - it's hard to believe that any team would give the Giants what Minnesota gave the Cowboys for Walker -- but if somehow the Giants could get four starters (3 above average offensive line men and an above average power running back) and 3 number ones and 3 number twos and a number three draft picks then I might listen to such a trade...
And another thing: Everybody remembers the Herschel-Walker-to-Minnesota trade because it was crucial to building the Cowboy dynasty. Nobody remembers the Eric Dickerson-to-Indianapolis trade because the haul of draft picks the Rams got back didn't amount to much. The draft is a crapshoot, always, full stop.
I sometimes feel like fans want a player to be All-Pro, never hurt, always happy, attending every event, early to arrive and late to leave, and to come over on their off days to wash the car, talk football and coach their kids, then say thank you for the privilege.
These are very young, rich, somewhat pampered elite athletes. Immature guys act immature. A lot of them grow up as they, well, grow up. As a fan you take the bad with the good, as long as the bad isn't criminal.
Odell is a great talent, maybe even a generational talent, but those saying that there aren't red flags with the guy are looking at him through blue colored glasses. Rams rookie game, Norman game, punching walls in GB, Boat Trip, Miserable playoff game, and I am missing a ton.
Now...Odell is also going to get PAID in 2 years, if not sooner. PAID to the point of tying up 1/12th of a salary cap in one non-qb player. It's scary. Also realize that if we DO give Odell a MEGA deal with multiple years it will be through the post-Eli era.
If a team called with 2 first rounders AND a good young cost controlled linebacker I would make the deal in a heartbeat. Jerry also knows how to draft WR early. His track record there is very very good.
So you're citing a game where Beckham had a few drops as some sort of indictment or example of a troubled player? One that isn't worth the trouble? One bad fricking game? One????
The Rams rookie game where he took a gigantic turd all over the St. Louis defense? What went wrong that day other than the fisher led rams acting like complete trash? Of course you mentioned the over stated Norman game. The same Norman that proceeds to get flagged and beaten every time these two square off while Beckham doesn't do anything wrong.
And you're missing so many other examples? Name them.
None of the examples matter enough. He's a keeper unless his legs and game fall apart. Once again people over think shit like this. The guy is a amazing football player. He needs some maturation but not on the field. And his off the field stuff isn't nearly as troubling as some insist on believing.
Think about that for a second. You want the guy traded because of shit you read that had absolutely nothing to do with the game of football.
Crazy.
But he got into a fight with Norman. And he had a bad game once. Once. One bad game out of forty two or so! One bad game! The guy is amazing out there. He's Baryshnikov on the gridiron.
Jerry rice was the best ever because he worked harder than anyone and was as driven and perfect as an athlete can be on and off the clock. We want Beckham to be that great for that long. He's on his way but the game gets harder it doesn't get easier. Beckham will need to keep up.
Dumb
Dumb
Dumb
Dumb (to Beetoven's 5th)
Playing off of that, how often do you draft a player of OBJ's caliber and impact? Saying that he's the best pick since LT illustrates that - it was 33 years between LT and OBJ. So assuming that the Giants aren't abnormally poor at identifying talent, you could make the case that they'd need 33 1st round picks to ensure that you could get another player on the level of LT/OBJ.
For 33 1st rounders, maybe.
you don't necessarily have to "like" him - but you also do not even consider trading a PROVEN ALL-PRO/FUTURE HOF caliber player @ only 24 years old for draft picks.
draft picks guarantee nothing. there's maybe a handful of players I would even consider trading Beckham before - and factoring in age - I doubt I'd trade him straight up for anyone.
he is incredible. we are lucky to have him. I'd like to keep him.
It's a miserable way to run a business and a team. Plenty of guys I'm sure the staff totally like and suck. Those guys get cut.
There are totally guys the staff might not like on the team who are good and they stay.
Worrying about optics, feelings, liking, not liking, etc. is what fans do. Well, and also some shitty teams. Thankfully our team doesn't do that.
How about this....if Webb is legit (which I strongly believe he is) then we re-sign Beckham because oyr QB woll
Derek Carr no question. 10+ year ascendant franchise QB > any WR.
Mack or Donald I wouldn't complain. Von if NYG ran a 3-4.
Julio would mostly be a push.
Probably Landon Collins. Guy's a monster.
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draft picks guarantee nothing. there's maybe a handful of players I would even consider trading Beckham before - and factoring in age - I doubt I'd trade him straight up for anyone.
Derek Carr no question. 10+ year ascendant franchise QB > any WR.
Mack or Donald I wouldn't complain. Von if NYG ran a 3-4.
Julio would mostly be a push.
Probably Landon Collins. Guy's a monster.
I can concede Carr because he's a QB. Mack is interesting but I still think I take Odell. I definitely take Odell over Donald and I love Collins, but he's well behind Odell.
Julio Jones is 28, has his share of injuries and doesn't score at the rate Beckham does (not even close actually). No way I trade Beckham straight up for Jones.
How about this....if Webb is legit (which I strongly believe he is) then we re-sign Beckham because oyr QB woll
because your "real concern" is absolutely ridiculous. the cap is rising, contracts can be re-negotiated, etc. you don't make a deal because of a 2 year hypothetical.
Eli's contract will be off the books around the same time line ... and you can be creative with structuring contracts - Odell's early years can be relatively light and escalate in years 2-5.
I'm tired of the constant bashing of Odell just because he has an ego. In any high pressure profession you are going to get people with big egos, it's part of life. The guy happens to be the best at what he does so I don't really mind him having an ego, but I think everyone else should realize that having an ego does not at all mean his is a bad teammate or a distraction to the team.
People are so damn sensitive these days.
Still I'd trade him.
Now he's on a video claiming he wants to be the highest paid player in the game.
That's going to drive his trade value down, but i'd still trade him.
I think he's going to be a distraction going forward. I think there's only one ball and we have enough great receivers to handle his loss and ALWAYS it's about what he'd bring back.
Still I'd trade him.
Now he's on a video claiming he wants to be the highest paid player in the game.
That's going to drive his trade value down, but i'd still trade him.
I think he's going to be a distraction going forward. I think there's only one ball and we have enough great receivers to handle his loss and ALWAYS it's about what he'd bring back.
GTFOH.
Face in palm...
Still I'd trade him.
Now he's on a video claiming he wants to be the highest paid player in the game.
That's going to drive his trade value down, but i'd still trade him.
I think he's going to be a distraction going forward. I think there's only one ball and we have enough great receivers to handle his loss and ALWAYS it's about what he'd bring back.
Who?
Don't sell him short, B. I think he really is that stupid.
TRAID HIM!
No to mention Eli's cap will be off the books right at the start of Beckhams new deal. And since QB's almost never become free agents, we don't have to worry about paying big QB money to anyone, anytime soon.
Shall I list the 100 or so examples of players acting like complete maniacs, or locker rooms filled with alleged or supposed toxicity and disharmony and yet despite these "issues" the teams they played for WON, and WON BIG???
Should I? Nope..because you won't read it anyway. You love this shit.
Do coaches and players get annoyed with incessant questions on shit like this? Of course. But here's the thing, the media is always going to annoy the coaches and players. They have to ask something.
Beckham wants to be paid. That's a distraction????? They all want to get paid!
No way is Beckham getting paid what Newhouse. He's slightly behind Flacco as one of the top QBs in the league. Flacco plus plus foot speed puts him over the top though.
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steelers are doing it, falcolns are doing it, patriots are doing it, i dont see how you cant do it? giants have cap space as it is and the cap just keeps going up...
No to mention Eli's cap will be off the books right at the start of Beckhams new deal. And since QB's almost never become free agents, we don't have to worry about paying big QB money to anyone, anytime soon.
Adjusted for inflation the Giants paid WRs and QBs and pass rushers and DBs and OL. And they won 2 super bowls doing so.
Beckham is worth the money. Great players that turn games on a dime are worth the money. Some of you guys just don't get it. Not paying super stars is just as risky as paying them, if not more so.
Pay the players. Then pray. It's how this works. If you don't pay the player you've already lost by running the risk that you won't adequately replace him.
The guy has some maturity issues. Many of his issues were related to his passion for the game - he's a fiery, competitive player. Let's see, his worst incidents were: Getting into a fight on field with Norman (bad, let himself get goaded or anger get the best of him, hopefully lesson learned there); kicking a net on sideline (OK, as long as he didn't hurt himself); and the boat and ensuing bad playoff game (Can't be sure of the link, but bad optics, he should know better). He's really never done anything that has me that concerned, other than act a bit immature. Some people buy the media line about him hook, line and sinker - but there's about 0.0000001 chance the Giants trade him. He's exactly what you hope for in a draft pick - one of the best at his position almost from game 1. He's had a few issues, but there's more off field effect than on (except the Norman fight, and I do think he's learned to control himself better, tho he'll always show emotion in tough/big games). Any number of reasons he could have struggled in 1st playoff game, I'm banking on him being better going forward. I'd rather watch and root for the Giants wwith him than without....our offense would be soooo terrible to watch if he's gone, and no trade will replace his contributions.