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Filling Holes

Phiddler : 8/12/2017 1:11 pm
Hypothetically, you can say that every position needs help. But most of us on BBI know where the weak links in the chain are. It was my gut feeling that several of those holes we are carrying into 2017 have been addressed, at least from a preliminary perspective:

1) Kerry Wynn made a statement about being a serviceable DE backup.

2) QB Geno Smith wasn’t perfect, but he matriculated the ball down the field, especially in contrast to Josh Johnson. So did Davis Webb.

3) Aldrick Rosas is going to be “kick” ass.

4) B.J. Goodson has some things to learn, but he made a claim for MLB last night.

5) Jay Bromley has finally showed up at DT, me thinks.

6) Jerell Adams is going to push a good TE prospect off the team.

7) Michael Hunter is showing early signs of being one of the 5 CBs we need.

There were a few more promising guys, like Travid Rudolph and Wayne Gallman, but it’s too early to tell. Maybe we will trade one of the TEs for OL or S help.

Nice Job  
PaulN : 8/12/2017 1:20 pm : link
Agree, I also think Powe is going to make this team, he looks good to me, was open a few times if the QB was able to deliver the ball.
Rudolph  
Mike in NY : 8/12/2017 1:23 pm : link
Appears to be a good route runner, but he looked out of place returning punts (did better on kickoffs) and that may cost him. Would like to see Johnson and Lane get shots next week at PR as the last skill position player on the roster will probably be the person who makes biggest impact on Special Teams
Nice job!  
larryflower37 : 8/12/2017 1:27 pm : link
Do we keep 3 or 4 te's ?

If it's 3
Ellison
Engram
Adams

If it's 4 who stays
Lacosse or Tye?


I would  
PaulN : 8/12/2017 1:34 pm : link
Keep just the three. LaCosse is a great practice player, until it shows up during a game, what is the point, we have three good ones now. Keep a fullback too, we also may need to keep extra linemen, Wynn looked great last night, there is no way he is getting cut. But I also like Taylor, need to keep the best football players, not the best practice players, with that said LaCosse still needs an opportunity, that is for certain, an opportunity with the ones or twos, no point putting him in when they did, it is pure garbage time.
RE: I would  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 1:38 pm : link
In comment 13558004 PaulN said:
Quote:
Keep just the three. LaCosse is a great practice player, until it shows up during a game, what is the point, we have three good ones now. Keep a fullback too, we also may need to keep extra linemen, Wynn looked great last night, there is no way he is getting cut. But I also like Taylor, need to keep the best football players, not the best practice players, with that said LaCosse still needs an opportunity, that is for certain, an opportunity with the ones or twos, no point putting him in when they did, it is pure garbage time.


Until it shows up in what game? He's been injured.
Wynn always shows up in pre-season  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 1:39 pm : link
Against 2s and 3s. He had reps last year in-season and was quite as a mouse.
It's LaCrosse or a FB  
BillT : 8/12/2017 1:40 pm : link
To me that's LaCrosse easily. He's healthy now and as likely to stay so as anyone else. He plays ST and has blocking size and skills.
The whole BJ Goodson thing irks me  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 1:41 pm : link
How many plays was Kelvin Shepard on the field last year? That's who Goodson is replacing. Keenen Robinson is still the MLB and field general for more than 60% of the plays.
RE: It's LaCrosse or a FB  
Mike in NY : 8/12/2017 1:53 pm : link
In comment 13558018 BillT said:
Quote:
To me that's LaCrosse easily. He's healthy now and as likely to stay so as anyone else. He plays ST and has blocking size and skills.


Tye had some nice blocks yesterday. LaCosse is slightly bigger, but he has not proven he can stay healthy.
RE: The whole BJ Goodson thing irks me  
Klaatu : 8/12/2017 2:07 pm : link
In comment 13558019 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
How many plays was Kelvin Shepard on the field last year? That's who Goodson is replacing. Keenen Robinson is still the MLB and field general for more than 60% of the plays.


Sheppard played about 40% of the defensive snaps last year. Robinson played about 70%, which shouldn't come as a surprise because the Giants were in sub-packages most of the time.

However, Robinson's injury history is very troubling. Last year was the only one in his four-year career where he played in all 16 regular season games (he averaged 12 in his first three years). And now he's coming off another injury, a concussion this time which kept him from practicing all last week.

So, it would behoove the Giants to see if Goodson is more than just a "two-down thumper," because they may need him to play in their nickel and dime as well as their base defense.
RE: RE: The whole BJ Goodson thing irks me  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 2:12 pm : link
In comment 13558037 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 13558019 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


How many plays was Kelvin Shepard on the field last year? That's who Goodson is replacing. Keenen Robinson is still the MLB and field general for more than 60% of the plays.



Sheppard played about 40% of the defensive snaps last year. Robinson played about 70%, which shouldn't come as a surprise because the Giants were in sub-packages most of the time.

However, Robinson's injury history is very troubling. Last year was the only one in his four-year career where he played in all 16 regular season games (he averaged 12 in his first three years). And now he's coming off another injury, a concussion this time which kept him from practicing all last week.

So, it would behoove the Giants to see if Goodson is more than just a "two-down thumper," because they may need him to play in their nickel and dime as well as their base defense.


Sure. And I'm fine with that if that's the case but there's been no mention of Goodson taking over for Robinson whatsoever...yet. I think calling him a "2 down thumper" is actually generous considering we play in the nickel with 3 CBs a TON. I just feel like the media and everyone seems to be anointing Goodson as the guy taking over this huge role yet if everyone is healthy he will barely even be on the field.
Based on what we did last year  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 2:16 pm : link
Robinson and Casillas seem to be the "guys". We should be slobbering all over them with questions and discussion.
RE: Wynn always shows up in pre-season  
BMac : 8/12/2017 2:22 pm : link
In comment 13558015 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Against 2s and 3s. He had reps last year in-season and was quite as a mouse.


Wynn has always been a solid, if unspectacular player. He plays the run very well, and has his moments in the passing game. What games have you been watching.
RE: RE: Wynn always shows up in pre-season  
Jay on the Island : 8/12/2017 2:34 pm : link
In comment 13558045 BMac said:
Quote:
In comment 13558015 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


Against 2s and 3s. He had reps last year in-season and was quite as a mouse.



Wynn has always been a solid, if unspectacular player. He plays the run very well, and has his moments in the passing game. What games have you been watching.

Moments in the passing game? Over the past two seasons combined,which includes 7 starts, Wynn has 0.5 sacks
RE: RE: RE: The whole BJ Goodson thing irks me  
Klaatu : 8/12/2017 2:51 pm : link
In comment 13558040 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
In comment 13558037 Klaatu said:


Quote:


In comment 13558019 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


How many plays was Kelvin Shepard on the field last year? That's who Goodson is replacing. Keenen Robinson is still the MLB and field general for more than 60% of the plays.



Sheppard played about 40% of the defensive snaps last year. Robinson played about 70%, which shouldn't come as a surprise because the Giants were in sub-packages most of the time.

However, Robinson's injury history is very troubling. Last year was the only one in his four-year career where he played in all 16 regular season games (he averaged 12 in his first three years). And now he's coming off another injury, a concussion this time which kept him from practicing all last week.

So, it would behoove the Giants to see if Goodson is more than just a "two-down thumper," because they may need him to play in their nickel and dime as well as their base defense.



Sure. And I'm fine with that if that's the case but there's been no mention of Goodson taking over for Robinson whatsoever...yet. I think calling him a "2 down thumper" is actually generous considering we play in the nickel with 3 CBs a TON. I just feel like the media and everyone seems to be anointing Goodson as the guy taking over this huge role yet if everyone is healthy he will barely even be on the field.


That's not exactly true. He's going to start at the MIKE in the base 4-3, flanked by Casillas and Kennard. If recent trends continue, that's going to be anywhere from 33% to 40% of the defensive snaps. And then there's special teams. Last year, Robinson played very sparingly on special teams (in nine games he didn't even take one snap on them), while Sheppard was a special teams mainstay. I would expect Goodson to fill that role this year, too.

And again, Robinson has hardly been a model of durability throughout his career (which is one reason I did not want the Giants to sign him to a multi-year deal), and they'd be smart to have someone waiting in the wings to take his place if he can't go. It doesn't really matter who that someone is, but it seems to me the Giants are hoping that it's Goodson.
RE: RE: Wynn always shows up in pre-season  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 2:53 pm : link
In comment 13558045 BMac said:
Quote:
In comment 13558015 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


Against 2s and 3s. He had reps last year in-season and was quite as a mouse.



Wynn has always been a solid, if unspectacular player. He plays the run very well, and has his moments in the passing game. What games have you been watching.


Always? What? lol. Okwara was the starting DE when JPP went down. How many snaps are you basing this off of?
RE: RE: RE: RE: The whole BJ Goodson thing irks me  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 2:57 pm : link
In comment 13558080 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 13558040 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


In comment 13558037 Klaatu said:


Quote:


In comment 13558019 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


How many plays was Kelvin Shepard on the field last year? That's who Goodson is replacing. Keenen Robinson is still the MLB and field general for more than 60% of the plays.



Sheppard played about 40% of the defensive snaps last year. Robinson played about 70%, which shouldn't come as a surprise because the Giants were in sub-packages most of the time.

However, Robinson's injury history is very troubling. Last year was the only one in his four-year career where he played in all 16 regular season games (he averaged 12 in his first three years). And now he's coming off another injury, a concussion this time which kept him from practicing all last week.

So, it would behoove the Giants to see if Goodson is more than just a "two-down thumper," because they may need him to play in their nickel and dime as well as their base defense.



Sure. And I'm fine with that if that's the case but there's been no mention of Goodson taking over for Robinson whatsoever...yet. I think calling him a "2 down thumper" is actually generous considering we play in the nickel with 3 CBs a TON. I just feel like the media and everyone seems to be anointing Goodson as the guy taking over this huge role yet if everyone is healthy he will barely even be on the field.



That's not exactly true. He's going to start at the MIKE in the base 4-3, flanked by Casillas and Kennard. If recent trends continue, that's going to be anywhere from 33% to 40% of the defensive snaps. And then there's special teams. Last year, Robinson played very sparingly on special teams (in nine games he didn't even take one snap on them), while Sheppard was a special teams mainstay. I would expect Goodson to fill that role this year, too.

And again, Robinson has hardly been a model of durability throughout his career (which is one reason I did not want the Giants to sign him to a multi-year deal), and they'd be smart to have someone waiting in the wings to take his place if he can't go. It doesn't really matter who that someone is, but it seems to me the Giants are hoping that it's Goodson.


You seem to want to shift the discussion to injuries and special teams. Im talking about the defense we run at the moment and the media all over Goodson for being the MLB of this defense... a leader...the guy.. and so on... If he's on the field 33% of the time you are talking about one down. Likely on first down you'll see Kennard-Goodson-Casillas. After that Kennard and Goodson leave and you are in a two LB set with Robinson and Cassilas.
And dont get me wrong...  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 3:01 pm : link
Love Goodson. I'm excited about his potential. I just think fans and the media have a general lack of awareness of what defense we run. Goodson is probably the 12th or 13th most important player on our D if things stay the same.
Z, what I'm talking about is this:  
Klaatu : 8/12/2017 3:06 pm : link
Quote:
yet if everyone is healthy he will barely even be on the field.


That's a huge exaggeration for a guy who will play in the base defense and on special teams, and it also assumes one of two things:

1. Robinson will remain healthy all season long. Certainly not a given, in my view.

or

2. Goodson will not be able to take Robinson's place on sub-packages. I'm not so sure about that. Even before Robinson entered the concussion protocol, Goodson was getting snaps with the first team in nickel and dime.
When I was talking about the field  
ZGiants98 : 8/12/2017 3:15 pm : link
I was talking about within the confines of our defense. I wasn't referring to special teams. It's fine. I'm aware if Robinson is injured Goodson's role would increase.

I guess we'll see how it shakes out.
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