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Some OL positives (long)

mainiac : 8/12/2017 5:13 pm
With the usual disclaimers (tiny sample, 1 pre-season game, I don't know assignments, etc.) there were some positives from the OL IMHO.

Starters were in for 1Q. I counted 11 pass plays, 6 runs, and 1 busted/dunno.

Flowers: couldn't see anything to really criticize, other than possibly the busted play at 9:50 of 1Q. Don't know his assignment on that play though. If you key on him, him pass blocking was excellent, and he didn't seem to miss any run blocks. He might be charged with a sack on the 1st play, but pressure up the middle (70 & 77) was the cause.

Pugh: solid in both pass and run; looked like he accomplished his assignment on every play.

Richburg: was pushed back into the pocket twice causing 1 sack, and while usually positioned well against the run sometimes had trouble holding his ground. Was beat cleanly about 6:35 1Q for TFL on run.

Jerry: I'm not a Jerry hater, but to me he was clearly the weak link. Was cleanly beat on 2 run plays (TFL), and while pass pro was better he had trouble sustaining blocks. So on a few plays his guy caused pressure or a hit. At about 9:10 1Q his assignment batted a pass, but Jerry held the pocket well on that play. Overall, of 18 plays, at least 5 involved Jerry missing his assignment or not sustaining his block.

Hart: surprised me. Really shined in pass pro. Was cleanly beat on 1 run play that resulted in no gain. Otherwise his run blocking was solid.

Overall pass pro was excellent on the edges, but there was push up the middle on 70 and 77. 6 runs resulted in 3 TFL or no gain, and 3 solid gains. The 3 successes every OL blocked their guy. The 3 fails involved 1 or more missed block.

My positive take on only 18 preseason plays: OT play was very good on both sides, and Pugh looked in form. Hope 74 and 68 can sustain this!

Yeah, not so much good  
Jimmy Googs : 8/12/2017 5:31 pm : link
(warning...short post)
RE: Yeah, not so much good  
section125 : 8/12/2017 5:38 pm : link
In comment 13558249 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
(warning...short post)


Stupid post, as usual. No warning necessary.
Jerry and Richburg  
wonderback : 8/12/2017 5:40 pm : link
Let's hope they look better next week. I'll be watching and hoping.
wonderback  
mainiac : 8/12/2017 5:46 pm : link
saw your thread regarding Richburg and agree. Interior OL was not so good, but if the tackles improve, I'll take it!
RE: RE: Yeah, not so much good  
Jimmy Googs : 8/12/2017 5:53 pm : link
In comment 13558258 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 13558249 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


(warning...short post)



Stupid post, as usual. No warning necessary.


How was it stupid Section? The O-line wasn't good, not awful, but not good. What's your problem...

That's where most games are own & lost ....  
Manny in CA : 8/12/2017 5:53 pm : link

On both sides of the ball - The interior of the lines.

When you can't run inside, the LBs run everything down on the corners

The you can't hold the middle on pass protection, the DEs destroy your passing attack
looking at highlight of JJ Watts sack  
idiotsavant : 8/12/2017 5:57 pm : link
I would not give Flowers a pass.

Regardless of assignment, he avoided Watt, ran around him, it looks highly silly.
I thought Fluker looked pretty good  
UberAlias : 8/12/2017 6:03 pm : link
I'd like to see him get a legitimate chance at the RG spot. John Jerry is not a player who shouldn't have to compete for his job.
Agree Manny...  
mainiac : 8/12/2017 6:06 pm : link
and last night's effort is not a formula for victory.

Only looking at the starters (1st Q), improve RG and the line looks competitive to me. After the 1st quarter backups went in and it was ugly all over IMO.
RE: Agree Manny...  
RobCarpenter : 8/12/2017 6:21 pm : link
In comment 13558296 mainiac said:
Quote:
and last night's effort is not a formula for victory.

Only looking at the starters (1st Q), improve RG and the line looks competitive to me. After the 1st quarter backups went in and it was ugly all over IMO.


You really can't evaluate the O line when Johnson is the QB. He's that bad.

I do agree Richburg did not get a good push. But Johnson can't play QB.
RE: looking at highlight of JJ Watts sack  
Diver_Down : 8/12/2017 6:24 pm : link
In comment 13558282 idiotsavant said:
Quote:
I would not give Flowers a pass.

Regardless of assignment, he avoided Watt, ran around him, it looks highly silly.


I just re-watched the game on NFL Network and that blown play is highly suspect. My first initial reaction was to lampoon Flowers on such a silly play. Last night, discussing the game on BBI, I came to accept that it was blown screen/play/whatever. But on re-watching that specific play, it was not or never was going to be a screen. Pugh didn't react like you would expect if it was a screen. Perkins was the only back. It was a fake hand-off to Perkins with the rest of the OL downblocking to sell the fake while Josh was to roll out and hit the receiver on a slant. Flowers wouldn't have purposely missed Watt without perhaps mishearing the playcall. It was definitely a FUBAR moment that was on Flowers.
After re-watching the game,  
Diver_Down : 8/12/2017 6:31 pm : link
Flowers did well. He didn't get the push in the run game that is expected, but he didn't whiff on any run blocks. His pass protection was reasonably good. But, we should temper the accolades with him. He was matched up with Watt. Though Watt might indeed be good, he still a rookie. A 3 year starter of Flowers size should have made Watt his bitch. Flowers can not allow a player of Watt's size to back him down in the pocket. If Harrison had suited up, Flowers would have been floundering.

I hope that Flowers gained some confidence in trusting his technique and can build on it in the coming games.
maybe he doesnt like the QB  
idiotsavant : 8/12/2017 6:32 pm : link
.
RE: wonderback  
wonderback : 8/12/2017 7:21 pm : link
In comment 13558270 mainiac said:
Quote:
saw your thread regarding Richburg and agree. Interior OL was not so good, but if the tackles improve, I'll take it!


I want Fluker to win the RG position. Don't know if he can. Jerry next to Richburg - I don't think they're strong enough. Hope I'm wrong. Fluker looks like a beast in the run game. Don't know if his pass blocking' s up to speed.

I guess we'll keep watching for now and see how it plays out. The right guard position could be the most important call to make regarding starting assignments.
Very hard to key in on who is good and who is bad......  
Dry Lightning : 8/13/2017 12:30 am : link
but overall very easy to see ZERO push in the run game, and pressure on the QB. Harder to evaluate the preseason because the defenses are at an advantage. No one really gives a damn on starting defenses so aggression is very high, just pinning their ears back and coming. You can be an optimist or a pessimist, but I think everyone knows the line looked like it has looked for a while. Like shit.
On that one WTF play by Flowers ...  
Beer Man : 8/13/2017 7:27 am : link
My first impression watching the play, was what the heck is Mac doing sending him out on a quick down & out route.
RE: I thought Fluker looked pretty good  
Beer Man : 8/13/2017 7:34 am : link
In comment 13558291 UberAlias said:
Quote:
I'd like to see him get a legitimate chance at the RG spot. John Jerry is not a player who shouldn't have to compete for his job.
Agree, he didn't look bad. but one of the knocks on him is that he struggles recognizing and picking up the blitz. There was that one play when no one lined up on him, he immediately moved over to hell Rich, and two guys blitzed the gaps; one was picked-up by he back, the other got to the QB.
RE: RE: I thought Fluker looked pretty good  
PatersonPlank : 8/13/2017 9:26 am : link
In comment 13558638 Beer Man said:
Quote:
In comment 13558291 UberAlias said:


Quote:


I'd like to see him get a legitimate chance at the RG spot. John Jerry is not a player who shouldn't have to compete for his job.

Agree, he didn't look bad. but one of the knocks on him is that he struggles recognizing and picking up the blitz. There was that one play when no one lined up on him, he immediately moved over to hell Rich, and two guys blitzed the gaps; one was picked-up by he back, the other got to the QB.


Raanan said in the tweets this morning that was on Lewis. He was supposed to run one of those "bubble screens" and didn't. If this is right, then it makes sense Flowers would ignore Watt and go after the LB or DB in front of Harris.
RE: RE: RE: I thought Fluker looked pretty good  
mainiac : 8/13/2017 9:36 am : link
In comment 13558671 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:

Raanan said in the tweets this morning that was on Lewis. He was supposed to run one of those "bubble screens" and didn't. If this is right, then it makes sense Flowers would ignore Watt and go after the LB or DB in front of Harris.


If so, then I think Flowers messed up. He was well past the line of scrimmage after releasing and would have been called if there was a pass play. He was so far out I was wondering if it was a designed QB run.
Unless Fluker is way better than Jerry,  
Doomster : 8/13/2017 11:13 am : link
Jerry, I just want him for a backup.....

this OL needs some continuity to it...throwing in a new guy, doesn't help that.....

Friday was a small sample.....

Can't wait to see this OL against a #1 DL for the next 3 weeks, to see what we actually have....and I want to see this OL and TE's in protect mode for Eli, with chip blocks....would love to see some double TE setups, with a FB, and the ability to run to either side....with an occasional play action thrown in....

RE: RE: RE: RE: I thought Fluker looked pretty good  
BigBlueShock : 8/13/2017 11:39 am : link
In comment 13558675 mainiac said:
Quote:
In comment 13558671 PatersonPlank said:


Quote:



Raanan said in the tweets this morning that was on Lewis. He was supposed to run one of those "bubble screens" and didn't. If this is right, then it makes sense Flowers would ignore Watt and go after the LB or DB in front of Harris.



If so, then I think Flowers messed up. He was well past the line of scrimmage after releasing and would have been called if there was a pass play. He was so far out I was wondering if it was a designed QB run.

Flowers did not mess up. McAdoo blamed Lewis who didn't do his job. Flowers assignment on the play was not Watt. That's why it is so hard to take all the immediate criticism on BBI seriously whenever there is a breakdown on a play. Nobody knows what the assignments are, yet everyone was in a rush to blame Flowers, who did his job on that play. Even in this thread where it's been explained that Lewis screwed up, people still want to point the blame at Flowers
RE: I thought Fluker looked pretty good  
Beer Man : 8/14/2017 1:31 pm : link
In comment 13558291 UberAlias said:
Quote:
I'd like to see him get a legitimate chance at the RG spot. John Jerry is not a player who shouldn't have to compete for his job.
Too bad we can't mix Jerry's pass blocking with Fluker's run blocking; that would be one lethal RG.
BBS  
idiotsavant : 8/14/2017 5:01 pm : link
- regardless of assignment, flowers had a large person, not accounted for, standing alone, pre snap with a straight clear line to his QB....

possibly the QB called a mishmash non play call, or was to sprint out the other side
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