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Who are we rooting for?

ZGiants98 : 8/13/2017 12:56 pm
There are a number of battles going on at the end of quite a few units. Who are we rooting for?

I'm hoping for...

Geno Smith over Josh Johnson. He's simply more talented.

Shane Smith over Josh Huesman. I want a mauler.

Darius Powe over Roger Lewis/Travis Rudolph. Love having another tall target if Marshall goes down. He also seems to be getting open and has the best hands.

Devin Taylor over ?. Like having a tall DE with experience as a rotational player. We have so much talent at DE a good player or two is going to get cut.

Stansly Maponga over JT Thomas. Enough is enough with Thomas. Time for new blood.

Donte Deyon over Valentino Blake. Sy had Deyon as one of the only CB that could stick with Odel in camp. He might not be great returning the ball on specials but with Harris that shouldn't be an issue.

Aldrick Rosas over Mike NUgent. Rooting for the kid with the big leg.

Who are you rooting for?
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RE: Webb didn't even get reps today  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 8/13/2017 4:28 pm : link
In comment 13558961 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
in practice. There is no chance in a million years they are rolling with him as the only backup QB. It's just not happening.


I don't disagree with what you're saying... they're obviously not giving Webb a legitimate chance to compete. It's just that neither of these guys (Johnson or Geno) is Matt Hasselback or Jon Kitna. Holding a roster spot for a guy who can't reasonably be expected to win a game isn't optimal roster usage.
RE: I've just studied the first Quarter --  
Larry in Pencilvania : 8/13/2017 4:39 pm : link
In comment 13558831 gidiefor said:
Quote:
I don't think Josh Johnson was all that bad --


Want to borrow my glasses? Fail
RE: RE: Webb didn't even get reps today  
ZGiants98 : 8/13/2017 4:42 pm : link
In comment 13558971 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
Quote:
In comment 13558961 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


in practice. There is no chance in a million years they are rolling with him as the only backup QB. It's just not happening.



I don't disagree with what you're saying... they're obviously not giving Webb a legitimate chance to compete. It's just that neither of these guys (Johnson or Geno) is Matt Hasselback or Jon Kitna. Holding a roster spot for a guy who can't reasonably be expected to win a game isn't optimal roster usage.


Yup. I still think there is an advantage of having a vet though. If Eli is lost for the year, we are done. However, if Eli gets a high ankle sprain and has to miss a month, I want a veteran that isn't going to have deer in the headlights. Johnson hasn't played in years. Geno might be a bit of a gun slinger but I'll still take that over the current options. Maybe he has a big game or maybe he kills us but at least there is a chance we split those games until Eli returns.
Am I the only one who thought Webb's mechanics were awful on Friday?  
Milton : 8/13/2017 4:49 pm : link
He missed an open receiver by a wide margin on his first throw and most of his other throws were off his back foot. At least that's what I was thinking watching it in real time. I haven't revisited it so my memory could be off.
My 53 + 10 man PS in ( )  
GeorgeAdams33 : 8/13/2017 5:16 pm : link
Manning, Smith, Webb

Perkins, Darkwa, Vereen, Gallman, (Abdullah)

Smith

Ellison, Engram, Adams, LaCosse, (Thompson)

Beckham, Marshall, Shepard, King, Harris, Powe, (Johnson)

Flowers, Pugh, Richburg, Bowie, Fluker, Jones, Bisnowaty, (Gettis), (Wheeler)

Harrison, Bromley, Thomas, Tomlinson, (Jones)

JPP, Vernon, Okwara, Moss, Wynn, Taylor, (Williams)

Casillas, Robinson, Goodson, Kennard, Maponga, Munson, (Skinner)

Collins, Pinkins

Adams, Thompson, (Robinson)

Jenkins, DRC, Apple, Hunter, DD, (Tribune)


Deossie, WIng, Rosas
RE: Webb didn't even get reps today  
pjcas18 : 8/13/2017 5:22 pm : link
In comment 13558961 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
in practice. There is no chance in a million years they are rolling with him as the only backup QB. It's just not happening.


I know, but you said who are we rooting for, backup QB was the only area I had a disagreement, unlikely, but best case IMO.

I hate 3 QBs on the roster.

It's often been said of Belichick's patriots that roster spots 1 - 22 are comparable to other teams but 23 - 53 is where he wins. Because he can coach.

I hate to give up the potential Matthew McCants or Wallace Gillbery's for Geno Smith.

though, acknowledging the flaws in this argument sometimes the Matthew McCant's or Wallace Gillbery's are Corey Washington or Ramses Barden and get held too long.

so it's not a strong feeling, just my preference.
George...  
ZGiants98 : 8/13/2017 5:23 pm : link
You have Jerry and Hart missing from your roster. Not happening. Agree with most of the rest though.
RE: RE: Webb didn't even get reps today  
ZGiants98 : 8/13/2017 5:24 pm : link
In comment 13559003 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
In comment 13558961 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


in practice. There is no chance in a million years they are rolling with him as the only backup QB. It's just not happening.



I know, but you said who are we rooting for, backup QB was the only area I had a disagreement, unlikely, but best case IMO.

I hate 3 QBs on the roster.

It's often been said of Belichick's patriots that roster spots 1 - 22 are comparable to other teams but 23 - 53 is where he wins. Because he can coach.

I hate to give up the potential Matthew McCants or Wallace Gillbery's for Geno Smith.

though, acknowledging the flaws in this argument sometimes the Matthew McCant's or Wallace Gillbery's are Corey Washington or Ramses Barden and get held too long.

so it's not a strong feeling, just my preference.


I gotcha. I mostly agree as well.
RE: The Geno Smith you saw  
robbieballs2003 : 8/13/2017 5:26 pm : link
In comment 13558873 gidiefor said:
Quote:
is the Geno Smith you get -- he did the same stuff with the Jets -- brilliant for a period then throws the ball up for grabs and the game proceeds to get out of control.

Johnson had a few bad plays -- but he did enough to get a TD and a field goal in his 1 and a half quarters and made no major game changing mistakes

Johnson is a much better game manager right now than either Smith or Davis -- Davis was not under center by the way for one snap -- he's a work in progress. Right now you can not turn the team over to him -- you only do that if Eli's career is over.


Um, how do you know that was Geno's fault? To me, it very easily could have been that the WR ran the wrong route. It looked like it was suppose to be a comeback of some sort but the receiver ran deep.
I am rooting for a trade  
Steve in South Jersey : 8/13/2017 5:29 pm : link
I don't feel good about the RB behind this OL. If a better RB can make it work then I would pursue a trade. Doubt they could trade for an OL that would be more than depth this year. A trade for a safety maybe. Feel good about the team as a whole.
RE: Am I the only one who thought Webb's mechanics were awful on Friday?  
robbieballs2003 : 8/13/2017 5:34 pm : link
In comment 13558990 Milton said:
Quote:
He missed an open receiver by a wide margin on his first throw and most of his other throws were off his back foot. At least that's what I was thinking watching it in real time. I haven't revisited it so my memory could be off.


Milton, it was his first real life NFL game experience. You can tell he was trying to get a feel out there especially on his first play. He settled down and was hitting his spots. I was impressed with how he battled back. Can you really be critical of a rookie on his first attempt ever after barely getting any reps in practice? Nobody is saying he is great or deserves the number 2 spot. However, what I am saying is that Geno and Josh don't inspire much of anything so why not give the rookie more of a chance?
Keep Hart  
GeorgeAdams33 : 8/13/2017 5:38 pm : link
Cut Taylor or Wynn
RE: Keep Hart  
ZGiants98 : 8/13/2017 5:41 pm : link
In comment 13559019 GeorgeAdams33 said:
Quote:
Cut Taylor or Wynn


And still no Jerry? You're missing Herzlich too. Anything's possible but that doesn't sound realistic.
Donte Deayon is a curious case  
Milton : 8/13/2017 5:51 pm : link
A cornerback's primary job is to cover and Deayon appears to be good at that, especially as regards those quicker, shiftier receivers. But he also needs to support the run and--if he's not a starter--play on special teams. And that's where he is lacking.

So if you're keeping only five cornerbacks and Deayon is the 5th best cover corner (and maybe even the 4th best when it comes to covering the likes of DeSean Jackson and Cole Beasley) but useless on specials and a liability versus the run, does he make your 53 man roster?

Disclaimer: This is just a hypothetical based on assorted camp reports. I don't have a strong opinion about the guy one way or another.
RE: RE: I've just studied the first Quarter --  
Jimmy Googs : 8/13/2017 6:13 pm : link
In comment 13558938 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 13558831 gidiefor said:


Quote:


I don't think Josh Johnson was all that bad --



I think much is being made for a few bad mistakes in the first preseason game. I can all but guarantee the Giants aren't saying bye bye birdie to Johnson just yet despite BBI saying bye bye birdie.

Plus, Geno got worse as the game progressed. I also don't understand bbi's hope that geno wins the job. He scares the shit out of me. He should scare the shit out of everyone. If he makes it good for him but I'd rather not see him playing football in big moments here.


No. There is no exact science with regards to QB development, but anybody can see Johnson doesn't have the right stuff in the way he commanded the field on plays that required his involvement. He was panicky, missed open receivers, ran when he need to stay, etc. Overall lack of poise. And this isn't a rookie which is why the Giants are staying with him.

Move on. I don't know if Geno or Webb are going to be the guy, but Johnson is not...
RE: Donte Deayon is a curious case  
ZGiants98 : 8/13/2017 6:19 pm : link
In comment 13559025 Milton said:
Quote:
A cornerback's primary job is to cover and Deayon appears to be good at that, especially as regards those quicker, shiftier receivers. But he also needs to support the run and--if he's not a starter--play on special teams. And that's where he is lacking.

So if you're keeping only five cornerbacks and Deayon is the 5th best cover corner (and maybe even the 4th best when it comes to covering the likes of DeSean Jackson and Cole Beasley) but useless on specials and a liability versus the run, does he make your 53 man roster?

Disclaimer: This is just a hypothetical based on assorted camp reports. I don't have a strong opinion about the guy one way or another.


How sure are we he can't play on specials? He might suck returning the ball but that doesn't mean he can't be a gunner or contribute in other ways. Harris should return kicks but after him I'm sure there are still many options (Darkwa, King, Gallman, ect.)
If Jerry isn't a starter  
GeorgeAdams33 : 8/13/2017 6:27 pm : link
I'm in favor of younger back-ups

As far as DD is concerned I remember a pre-season game at night against the Patriots back in 89' when David Meggett lost two or three punts in the lights and looked like just another wasted 5th round pick. If not DD then the 5th corner might not be on the roster.
RE: RE: Am I the only one who thought Webb's mechanics were awful on Friday?  
Milton : 8/13/2017 6:28 pm : link
In comment 13559015 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 13558990 Milton said:


Quote:


He missed an open receiver by a wide margin on his first throw and most of his other throws were off his back foot. At least that's what I was thinking watching it in real time. I haven't revisited it so my memory could be off.



Milton, it was his first real life NFL game experience. You can tell he was trying to get a feel out there especially on his first play. He settled down and was hitting his spots. I was impressed with how he battled back. Can you really be critical of a rookie on his first attempt ever after barely getting any reps in practice? Nobody is saying he is great or deserves the number 2 spot. However, what I am saying is that Geno and Josh don't inspire much of anything so why not give the rookie more of a chance?
I agree with you for the most part, particularly when it comes to Geno and Josh; and it's not like I came away discouraged by Webb's performance. There's a lot to like. But I think mechanics and accuracy were two issues pointed out in pre-draft scouting reports. I think the Giants have made the decision that what's best for his development is to spend a year focused almost solely on improving his mechanics. It's as if they're going out of their way to send the message to the media and fans: don't even think about Webb being anything more than the 3rd string QB. They will sell no wine before its time.
Accuracy problem?  
XBRONX : 8/13/2017 6:45 pm : link
He was at almost 62% completion rate last year. I know he is not Colt Brennan
RE: RE: Donte Deayon is a curious case  
Steve in South Jersey : 8/13/2017 6:51 pm : link
In comment 13559032 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
In comment 13559025 Milton said:


Quote:


A cornerback's primary job is to cover and Deayon appears to be good at that, especially as regards those quicker, shiftier receivers. But he also needs to support the run and--if he's not a starter--play on special teams. And that's where he is lacking.

So if you're keeping only five cornerbacks and Deayon is the 5th best cover corner (and maybe even the 4th best when it comes to covering the likes of DeSean Jackson and Cole Beasley) but useless on specials and a liability versus the run, does he make your 53 man roster?

Disclaimer: This is just a hypothetical based on assorted camp reports. I don't have a strong opinion about the guy one way or another.



How sure are we he can't play on specials? He might suck returning the ball but that doesn't mean he can't be a gunner or contribute in other ways. Harris should return kicks but after him I'm sure there are still many options (Darkwa, King, Gallman, ect.)


Can he be a gunner at his size? I have concerns about that but maybe other players his size have made it work. I think he has to be a returner or he won't contribute to special teams.
RE: RE: Donte Deayon is a curious case  
Milton : 8/13/2017 6:51 pm : link
In comment 13559032 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
In comment 13559025 Milton said:


Quote:


A cornerback's primary job is to cover and Deayon appears to be good at that, especially as regards those quicker, shiftier receivers. But he also needs to support the run and--if he's not a starter--play on special teams. And that's where he is lacking.

So if you're keeping only five cornerbacks and Deayon is the 5th best cover corner (and maybe even the 4th best when it comes to covering the likes of DeSean Jackson and Cole Beasley) but useless on specials and a liability versus the run, does he make your 53 man roster?

Disclaimer: This is just a hypothetical based on assorted camp reports. I don't have a strong opinion about the guy one way or another.




How sure are we he can't play on specials? He might suck returning the ball but that doesn't mean he can't be a gunner or contribute in other ways.
I'm not sure at all. I'm guessing his size makes him less than ideal even for a gunner, but I could easily be wrong.
I might be in the minority  
Jay on the Island : 8/13/2017 7:05 pm : link
but I don't want to keep a FB. I want the Giants to keep 4 TE's and preferably 9 offensive linemen. Ellison, Adams, LaCosse, and Engram can all line up in the backfield as an H-back and serve as the lead blocker in the run game while also creating more problems for defenses having to account for a player who is a threat in the receiving game. Imagine a defense having to contend with Engram at Hback with Adams or Ellison at TE with Beckham, Marshall, and Shepard at WR. Engram would often be lined up versus a linebacker which is a clear mismatch.
Could Giants afford to carry Donte Deayon as a healthy scratch  
Steve in South Jersey : 8/13/2017 7:12 pm : link
not dressing for a game unless DRC is injured or if playing a dangerous small & quick slot receiver.
RE: Could Giants afford to carry Donte Deayon as a healthy scratch  
Big Blue Blogger : 8/13/2017 7:24 pm : link
Steve in South Jersey said:
Quote:
not dressing for a game unless DRC is injured or if playing a dangerous small & quick slot receiver.
Yes. If they don't need the fifth CB to contribute on specials (e.g. if both gunners are WRs, etc.), he can be a coverage specialist who only dresses when needed on defense. On the other hand, why use a roster spot on Deayon in that scenario? He will almost certainly clear waivers, and he provides just as much utility on the practice squad as he would as a healthy scratch.
As a QB you have to find the open receiver  
Giant John : 8/13/2017 7:46 pm : link
It appeared Josh was not able to do that. He was critiqued for being bad with his check downs and after watching him I agree. Don't think he deserves to be on the team based on what I saw of his play. He missed a lot of open receivers.
D.Deyon  
annexOPR : 8/13/2017 8:22 pm : link
can play - and would be an ideal 4/5th corner

Rosas at kicker ... huge leg, looked great Friday, and let's just lock in a kicker for the next decade instead of watching solid young kickers go to Denver/Pitt for "solid vets"

Worried about kicking the FG? Score a f'ing TD and its irrelevant.
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