The Line is better than what it showed against Pittsburgh. This line practices opposite JPP, Snacks, Vernon.
In training camp however they don't finish off the blocks by Pancaking the guy to the ground. ATTENTION REPORTERS- Is there Video of the Giants linemen in the gym lifting? Who is the strongest? Who kills it in the Weight Room? There is competition between all the other team groups, it would be interesting to learn gain more info about the Lineman.
I like the Rookies Bisnowaty, and Wheeler. I think they have the capability to play physical. The rookies will follow the leader.
Pugh is in a contract year and I'm sure he is Motivated.
This is only reference to finding the dominant player, who sets the tone as to how physical the Giants line is willing to play, I have hopes for Flowers to emerge as the Dominant Lineman. Even when he had NO technique, I was proud of how he swatted away some defenders.
I believe there is a nucleus for the new guys to play smart and block defenders out of the play. We need the line to get stronger in the weight room and become bullies.
Giants were a Playoff team last year with a winning 11-5 record, but the running game was unsuccessful.
We are looking to play smart and physical this year.
Who will set the tone as a Dominant Lineman on a good line this year. Will we have a good Line? Since we have the same line as last year, essentially who will step up?
Come to think of it, if Giant linemen could learn the quadrille, they could probably also learn to coordinate with each other, and that is really what is missing here.
Let's give them at least 2 more games before we ask them to the dance.
damn computers!
Lets talk Football is all I am here for, to RELAX?
Arc who is the best Lineman in your opinion?
The reason they spend so much time on technique is that it's not just a matter of being stronger and hitting harder. These guys are already elite athletes. I think the weakest guy on the OL unit (that might be Richburg) could break most BBIers in half with one hand.
Besides, I'm pretty sure it's has already occurred to the players and coaches that it would be good to lift weights, bulk up and hit defense hard. I'm pretty confident saying that they're already trying to do that.
Also, I remember Trent Dilfer explaining on some sports radio show why nobody relies on 80s-style "smashmouth" football anymore. He said that in those days, you could simply win your matchups and rely on execution to make a play succeed. Nowadays, the players are too evenly matched. You can't just count on execution. You have to do something in the offense to create an instant's hesitation on the defense, then exploit that instant.
Today's offenses can't simply take the attitude "We don't care if you know what we're going to do; we're going to beat you anyway." The athletes on defense are just too good for the old "smashmouth" style to work consistently. That's not a Giants thing, it's an NFL thing.
By the way, the 2016 bGiants' personnel packages were so predictable, the plays they'd run were so limited, that they could do very little to create hesitation, never mind deception. It didn't work.
As far as Giant technique I think its a practice to allow the defender to go into the O-lineman's chest .
I think if they extend there arms and keep them away from the body its easier for them to control the movement of the defender -
Pretty sure our Oline's TECHNIQUE for running plays is to force the defenders to go directly into the backfield.
And the Giants ought to keep Shane Smith who could help big time with their shitty run game (responsible for the 4th and 1 conversion), and stop worrying about a 4th TE. There are plenty of weapons in the passing game.
I agree, they don't need a 4th TE, Ellison, Engram and Adams
is sufficient. Maybe they should keep a FB this year.
Keep in mind, Jerry got a 3 year deal to come back.
Fluker is on a one year prove it deal,
for very little money.
Exploiting that hesitation!
That is something that takes some nuance and savvy to create with Line blocking.
The next step in once the hesitation is accomplished, it still takes power/technique to push the defender totally out of position to finish the play.
Release the Tiki Missile!
I don't care if the line pancakes the defense or not. The idea is to win your battle with the guy across from you long enough for the play to get off.
The 49'ers of Walsh and Montana had a good line, but it wasn't a run drive dominating line. The joke was that the SF fans were screaming at Walsh for running all the sweeps he did. Didn't stop them from winning Lombardi's.
Bradshaw's line at Pittsburgh during the '70's was small, even for that time. They were VERY good at trapping, though. Didn't stop Franco Harris from getting yards and the Steelers from getting Lombardi's.
There's lots of ways to skin a cat here, beside "Smashmouth". Pre snap motion and multiple formations are effective in today's football, and I'm hoping we see more of that this year.
Unfortunately all signs point to this being another difficult year with these guys...
Unfortunately all signs point to this being another difficult year with these guys...
What signs exactly? This is preseason. What happened last year doesn't mean all that much..How about waiting for this year's version and year 2 of Solari to take hold. Practice is practice. Preseason games are preseason games..You work on things over and over. You can't extrapolate from practices and a few snaps in a preseason game that what occurred last year will occur again. Not yet anyway, even if it looks like the "same old, same old," when in fact all they're doing is working on things to improve. BBIers seem to need to see and hear that the OL after practices and limited game action is coming along..
Yeah, I think those are real signs...
But I am all-in if things can "take hold".
which is a trend -long in the works- and if that's not an invitation to draft bigger, better O Linesmen I don't know what is.
The next step in once the hesitation is accomplished, it still takes power/technique to push the defender totally out of position to finish the play
"Line blocking"? "The next step in once the hesitation is accomplished"??
Linemen across teams have utilized various techniques to be successful. A bigger indication for effectiveness is how cohesively they work together - after all, the goal is to keep the other guys either away from the QB or to open up holes for a ball carrier.
The post above outlining why SMASHMOUTH isn't just a throwaway line, but also not really something seen much in since the 80's due to parity probably goes right over your head, but the point about blocking is to execute the scheme as a group. Not missing assignments. Recognizing and picking up stunts. Negating spin moves one play and power moves the next. If you think pancake blocks happen frequently, you watch less football than I think you do. You might see only a couple a game - a game that will feature 100 plays with multiple guys blocking each play.
If you've seen this line and want them to be SMASHMOUTH, you are a fucking lunatic. You should want them to be technically sound and execute the blocking schemes that are expected when the plays are designed. You'll want them to pull on certain plays or move into space and drive downfield on screens. You'll want them to form a pocket on passing plays and open holes on running plays.
But let's get one thing straight - waving pom-poms over practice squad players you've never seen or rookie tackles you have no clue about isn't talking football. Using words like SMASHMOUTH and saying nonsensical things like "we need the line to get stronger in the weight room and become bullies" - it is yamming about in broken English and broken thoughts.
explains differences and benefits of
last spring i ranted about play action off outside zone ala falcons
not clear what our plan is.
https://www.bigblueview.com/2017/6/21/15828736/summer-school-dj-fluker-inside-zone-running-scheme-ny-giants-offensive-line-training-camp
for inside zone run blocking, especially maybe for relatively light in the pants blockers, footwork and angles would count for a shit ton,
whereas for outside zone, whomever is on the end of the train as it were, (a TE or an OT?) would need to move in space and ID a defender to hit.
then again, in inside zone, the center would have to move in space, assuming he is not stuck on a DT...being held inside that is, or simply blown aside
vs outside zone runs, if the DE can occupy a T -and- a TE that would leave the LB or safety free to hit the RB?
overall, outside zone run blocking would simpler to learn though
Pretty much how I see it too. I hope some time together as a unit can make those breakdowns less frequent.
He said the players are almost equal in strength and skill,
so offensive lines base a portion of their schemes on creating a hesitation response, and they use that fraction of a second to exploit the confusion.
Kind of like what I do to you every time!
Just talk football Fatman We don't have to agree. Don't Hate or be miserable because I speak more languages than you. Its just a sport ok ?
put all the Apples in one cart .
I agree about keeping the fullback and Trying fluker out
in place of Jerry . Lets wait another year is not helping
our star QB
I would like to learn gain more about this.
Lets talk Football is all I am here for, to RELAX?
Arc who is the best Lineman in your opinion?
WTF are you even talking about?
I hope he's a good football player. I guess if he can cleave another man in half with a broadsword that would be cool, but Im more interested in his ability as a lineman.
No, I want to learn gain more about everything you have to share. I like learn gaining as much as possible.
Lets talk Football is all I am here for, to RELAX?
Arc who is the best Lineman in your opinion?
Hello, my friend.
So you want to talk football?
Well, if you want to talk about the best offensive lineman on the Giants, it unfortunately is probably Justin Pugh. Which isn't saying a whole lot. I am hoping a healthy Weston Richburg will be better than he was last year when he was playing with torn tendons in his snapping hand.
I still have hope for Ereck Flowers but he's running out of time and if this isn't the year, they've got to move him off LT. I do think he's an NFL caliber lineman - just probably not where he is right now.
I'm hoping Fluker provides some solid depth - it looks like Jerry is still the RG for now. Bobby Hart may become a decent RT but he had a few whiffs in the preseason game and needs to be better.
I don't think Biz is going to give us anything this year - he's still a project. I do think Wheeler is interesting and might have an outside shot to help.
I'm still pretty worried about the line as a whole - I'm worried that it might wreck this season. But I expect a dominant defense, we do have great skill players, and #10 is still here.
I'm not sure this line has the talent to be a "smash mouth" unit. I don't think they're physical enough. Flowers actually might be the only guy who is, and he's probably in the wrong spot.
Solari is going to need to start earning his money. Our entire season is probably riding on this line getting it together.
He said the players are almost equal in strength and skill,
so offensive lines base a portion of their schemes on creating a hesitation response, and they use that fraction of a second to exploit the confusion.
Well, I was paraphrasing Trent Dilfer, who did not specifically talk about O-line techniques. He said that today's offenses need to create an instant of hesitation or indecision in the defense. He didn't specifically say the linemen have to do that.
And hey, guys, leave me out of this.
But what do I know, I like The Disco Biscuits.
Elite Mobster #32 : 8/14/2017 9:10 pm : link : reply
Made by Great Dane 81 -
He said the players are almost equal in strength and skill,
so offensive lines base a portion of their schemes on creating a hesitation response, and they use that fraction of a second to exploit the confusion
And yet - that's the exact opposite of what you are blabbering about in the OP. SMASHMOUTH!!! SMASHMOUTH!!
You aren't saying HESITATION.
Answer that one, genius.
Our problem has been, even on 3rd and short, the D knows its a pass so no hesitation factor.
Pass then run has been our motto, instead of run to pass, and its been fairly anemic when it really counted.
Since we ran the ball 47% of the time in 3rd and 3 or shorter, then what is the reasoning for the plays that failed?
They are able to stop the run - the majority of or conversions on 3rd and short (61%) were via the air.
Quote:
Our problem has been, even on 3rd and short, the D knows its a pass so no hesitation factor.
Since we ran the ball 47% of the time in 3rd and 3 or shorter, then what is the reasoning for the plays that failed?
They are able to stop the run - the majority of or conversions on 3rd and short (61%) were via the air.
I messaged you on FB
She was looking kinda dumb with her fingers and her thumb in the shape of an 'L' on her forehead.
that song is horrible, they shouldn't play smashmouth.
lol