To verify Flowers' struggles, I showed a handful of the lowlights to several ex-NFL offensive linemen and some independent offensive line coaches. They all agreed it was brutal. One said: Worst Ive seen, period."
At worst, Flowers would have been a reasonable 3rd or 4th round pick, and, if so, we made a mistake. But the draft is a crapshoot, even near the top, and just maybe Flowers will end up improving or helping us somewhere other than left tackle.
At worst, Flowers would have been a reasonable 3rd or 4th round pick, and, if so, we made a mistake. But the draft is a crapshoot, even near the top, and just maybe Flowers will end up improving or helping us somewhere other than left tackle.
how can he expect to get a story with BOTH sides??
I think most LTs from that draft had difficulties and have been switched to guard. While its debatable that we made a mistake with Flowers, I'm not sure another LT at that spot would have been the answer.
It's true which makes the Flowers situation even more maddening. We are a passing team w the worst pass blocking LT in the NFL. We drafted a big, snarling run blocking LT...? Is there a clear vision?
Flowers would probably be able to play LT in TC's O - even with the deep drops - because Tom used a power off tackle run game and used play action to keep the rush at bay. The LT was down in a 3 pt stance beating down a smaller DE. TEs and RBs were kept in to seal the edges.
In McAdoos finesse movement scheme Flowers is exposed. He is in a 2 pt stance even on run plays and just shielding guys or zone blocking. He isn't wearing them down. The DE is attacking him. What kills me is how good I think he'd be at RG. And a great RG would really help open up the run game.
To verify Flowers' struggles, I showed a handful of the lowlights to several ex-NFL offensive linemen and some independent offensive line coaches. They all agreed it was brutal. One said: Worst Ive seen, period."
I agree but has he even seen any snaps this pre season anywhere but LT? I don't believe he has so it appears it's LT or bust for him this year.
It seems they bounced a few guys around the line this camp because they want versatility in case someone goes down. It would've been a perfect opportunity to see if he could do well at RG.
I know that would leave them light at LT, but what if he doesn't get better at LT? Wouldn't it be beneficial to know he could play elsewhere on the line and not have wait until next year's camp to find out?
not for nothing but Jordan seems hell bent on basically proving that Flowers sucks. Let him play a few regular season games (after a strong finish to last year) before you publicly shame the guy.
I like Jordan usually but this Flowers thing is giving me a bad taste.
Clearly the Flowers-topic is on everybody's minds as it could be the biggest weakness Giants have. There are plenty of stories on ESPN about how good OBJ, Engram, Collins, etc are doing so shouldn't there be both sides to covering the Giants?
Why don't you just skip ridding about Giant news that concerns the O-line or Flowers if you disdain it. Or just wait until Game 1 to start following your favorite team if everything now is meaningless.
Maybe, maybe not. Either way, the starters aren't likely to play enough in preseason to permit much of an assessment. If Fluker were significantly outperforming Jerry or Hart, a change on the right side might have been possible; that doesn't seem to be the case. On the left side, the staff hasn't shown much interest in tinkering. Wheeler got some reps with the 1s, and didn't make a case for an open competition. Pugh is the only realistic alternative to Flowers. How many snaps has he taken at LT in four years?
itself wasn't unfair as to how he represented the situation.
Whether Ranaan did not reach out to credible sources is a different topic but that would be really disengenuous and really unneeded to sell this story imo. I am not a fan of his but assumes he stands by his sources.
He reads here so maybe he will give feedback
Wasn't Jordan the reporter that Flowers pushed previously?
Seems dopey to me. Taking all of one's shittiest product and then asking for reviews of it is bound to make the producer look worse than they are, no?
"I took all of Jordan's worst articles and brought them to three English professors and they said they were bad" sounds almost tautological. Obviously, lowlights are going to reveal poor play...
This is true and I have no problem with Raanan's report. He is speaking what most of us have been saying for over a year. And he's right about the hard selling job MacAdoo and Reece are giving us on Flowers while hoping he gets considerably better with fingers crossed.
Maybe Flowers will not be humiliated by this and maybe it will make him work even harder. From what I've been reading the kid is really trying so maybe he does need more time and a little better effort. But for me, seeing this O-Line be the biggest and most serious weakness on the team going into the 5th year in a row, it's hard to accept the fact that Reece is once again gambling on what hasn't worked the last two years.
Eli spent much of last season on his back after many plays and we are so lucky Eli is so durable but he is getting old and possibly more brittle and we really need to protect him. I'll go as far as saying if they did fix the oline this year we could definately go all the way. We still may but it's going to be a lot harder as the o-line is the offensive foundation that leads to consistent great running and passing plays. So like MacAdoo and Reece, I too have my fingers crossed.
RE: RE: Wasn't Jordan the reporter that Flowers pushed previously?
New York GiantsVerified account @Giants 1m1 minute ago
Coach McAdoo says the plan is to play Eli Manning in games two and three of the preseason. #NYGiants
certainly gotta respect and believe his view over Jordan's. I watched every clip from every play from 2 days ago on Flowers (someone posted it). I didn't see him get beat once.
not for nothing but Jordan seems hell bent on basically proving that Flowers sucks. Let him play a few regular season games (after a strong finish to last year) before you publicly shame the guy.
I like Jordan usually but this Flowers thing is giving me a bad taste.
The bad taste is from the constant fellating of Flowers trying to prop him up and defend him.
To Ranaan if Flowers plays to the level he did vs Pitt during the regular season he will be fine. Writers manipulate facts and sources for their own purposes all the time and he clearly has it in for EF.
Clearly. Even unconsciously it seems to inform his analysis somewhat. Can't blame him, but don't have to give his POV credence either, especially when the head coach contradicts it at every turn.
To Ranaan if Flowers plays to the level he did vs Pitt during the regular season he will be fine. Writers manipulate facts and sources for their own purposes all the time and he clearly has it in for EF.
You do realize that was vs 2nd and 3rd stringers for most part.
At worst, Flowers would have been a reasonable 3rd or 4th round pick, and, if so, we made a mistake. But the draft is a crapshoot, even near the top, and just maybe Flowers will end up improving or helping us somewhere other than left tackle.
At worst, Flowers would have been a reasonable 3rd or 4th round pick, and, if so, we made a mistake. But the draft is a crapshoot, even near the top, and just maybe Flowers will end up improving or helping us somewhere other than left tackle.
how can he expect to get a story with BOTH sides??
Flowers would probably be able to play LT in TC's O - even with the deep drops - because Tom used a power off tackle run game and used play action to keep the rush at bay. The LT was down in a 3 pt stance beating down a smaller DE. TEs and RBs were kept in to seal the edges.
In McAdoos finesse movement scheme Flowers is exposed. He is in a 2 pt stance even on run plays and just shielding guys or zone blocking. He isn't wearing them down. The DE is attacking him. What kills me is how good I think he'd be at RG. And a great RG would really help open up the run game.
Quote:
To verify Flowers' struggles, I showed a handful of the lowlights to several ex-NFL offensive linemen and some independent offensive line coaches. They all agreed it was brutal. One said: Worst Ive seen, period."
yikes!
I agree but has he even seen any snaps this pre season anywhere but LT? I don't believe he has so it appears it's LT or bust for him this year.
It seems they bounced a few guys around the line this camp because they want versatility in case someone goes down. It would've been a perfect opportunity to see if he could do well at RG.
I know that would leave them light at LT, but what if he doesn't get better at LT? Wouldn't it be beneficial to know he could play elsewhere on the line and not have wait until next year's camp to find out?
I like Jordan usually but this Flowers thing is giving me a bad taste.
Clearly the Flowers-topic is on everybody's minds as it could be the biggest weakness Giants have. There are plenty of stories on ESPN about how good OBJ, Engram, Collins, etc are doing so shouldn't there be both sides to covering the Giants?
Why don't you just skip ridding about Giant news that concerns the O-line or Flowers if you disdain it. Or just wait until Game 1 to start following your favorite team if everything now is meaningless.
I agree.....let the kid play in a game first.
Agreed. I think Flowers will have a big year. He's been working very hard, and lost a lot of weight.
Color me skeptical with these nameless "experts"...
Whether Ranaan did not reach out to credible sources is a different topic but that would be really disengenuous and really unneeded to sell this story imo. I am not a fan of his but assumes he stands by his sources.
He reads here so maybe he will give feedback
Flowers isn't perfect, but he's ours. So let's hope he keeps improving 1% each day.
LB Mark Herzlich (stinger) missed practice again.
Dan DugganVerified account @DDuggan21 4m4 minutes ago
LB Devon Kennard was back after being limited in the previous two practices. WR Dwayne Harris worked on the side.
Art StapletonVerified account @art_stapleton 5m5 minutes ago
Landon Collins (illness) and B.J. Goodson (back) return to practice for @Giants
Flowers isn't perfect, but he's ours. So let's hope he keeps improving 1% each day.
Yes, he was, because Jordan is making it his career goal to make sure Flowers sucks.
Undrafted FA WR Keeon Johnson carted off the field during practice. Suffered some sort of leg injury, couldn't put any weight on it.
WR Darius Powe (hamstring) and WR Kevin Snead (lower body) worked on the side. Adam Gettis back after missing Tuesday's practice.
I like Jordan usually but this Flowers thing is giving me a bad taste.
Well... he really might be right about it.
Notable development: UFA FB Shane Smith worked on the first-team punt and punt return units today.
Aldrick Rosas went 3-4 on field goals.
Tavarres King a full participant. Didn't look like Eli Apple did much. #Giants
Tavarres King also back at practice; Wayne Gallman has changed his number from 30 to 22. Was 9 in college, 4 in high school #GiantsCamp
Dan DugganVerified account @DDuggan21 4m4 minutes ago
Eli Apple didn't take any team snaps. Possibly a rest day for the 22 year old. Michael Hunter took his spot.
Quote:
I like Jordan usually but this Flowers thing is giving me a bad taste.
Well... he really might be right about it.
OK, so that makes it professionally OK to humiliate a player on a consistent basis?
"I took all of Jordan's worst articles and brought them to three English professors and they said they were bad" sounds almost tautological. Obviously, lowlights are going to reveal poor play...
Coach McAdoo: Eli Apple was out today with an ankle. #NYGiants
New York GiantsVerified account @Giants 3m3 minutes ago
Coach McAdoo: Dwayne Harris was held out of practice today with soreness in his upper body.
Art StapletonVerified account @art_stapleton 6m6 minutes ago
UDFA FB Shane Smith getting the reps with first team coming out of preseason game. Also on all four specials this week, too. @Giants
Coach McAdoo says the plan is to play Eli Manning in games two and three of the preseason. #NYGiants
Notable development: UFA FB Shane Smith worked on the first-team punt and punt return units today.
It is starting to feel more and more like Shane Smith makes this team if he stays healthy.
Of note...McAdoo called Ereck Flowers a "bright spot" after reviewing Friday's film. Also confirmed Manning will play vs CLE/NYJ-GM
The Giant Insider @GiantInsider 44s45 seconds ago
McAdoo also slightly hinted Davis Webb could compete for #2 spot-GM
Coach McAdoo: Eli Apple was out today with an ankle. #NYGiants
LOL! Sounds like a Coughlin injury report to me!
Quote:
New York GiantsVerified account @Giants 1m1 minute ago
Coach McAdoo: Eli Apple was out today with an ankle. #NYGiants
LOL! Sounds like a Coughlin injury report to me!
Just to be clear, not making light of an ankle injury Apple may have, just the text used if it was a true quote from McAdoo.
.@EliApple13 (ankle) says he's not sure if he'll be ready to go on Monday, is taking it day by day. #NYGiants
This is true and I have no problem with Raanan's report. He is speaking what most of us have been saying for over a year. And he's right about the hard selling job MacAdoo and Reece are giving us on Flowers while hoping he gets considerably better with fingers crossed.
Maybe Flowers will not be humiliated by this and maybe it will make him work even harder. From what I've been reading the kid is really trying so maybe he does need more time and a little better effort. But for me, seeing this O-Line be the biggest and most serious weakness on the team going into the 5th year in a row, it's hard to accept the fact that Reece is once again gambling on what hasn't worked the last two years.
Eli spent much of last season on his back after many plays and we are so lucky Eli is so durable but he is getting old and possibly more brittle and we really need to protect him. I'll go as far as saying if they did fix the oline this year we could definately go all the way. We still may but it's going to be a lot harder as the o-line is the offensive foundation that leads to consistent great running and passing plays. So like MacAdoo and Reece, I too have my fingers crossed.
Quote:
That probably wouldn't have anything to do with his consistent monitoring of the progress Flowers is/isn't making though......
Flowers isn't perfect, but he's ours. So let's hope he keeps improving 1% each day.
Yes, he was, because Jordan is making it his career goal to make sure Flowers sucks.
Flowers doesn't need any help with that. He has managed a stellar job so far.
Coach McAdoo says the plan is to play Eli Manning in games two and three of the preseason. #NYGiants
certainly gotta respect and believe his view over Jordan's. I watched every clip from every play from 2 days ago on Flowers (someone posted it). I didn't see him get beat once.
Of note...McAdoo called Ereck Flowers a "bright spot" after reviewing Friday's film. Also confirmed Manning will play vs CLE/NYJ-GM
The Giant Insider @GiantInsider 44s45 seconds ago
McAdoo also slightly hinted Davis Webb could compete for #2 spot-GM
That sounds good to me!
I like Jordan usually but this Flowers thing is giving me a bad taste.
The bad taste is from the constant fellating of Flowers trying to prop him up and defend him.
Clearly. Even unconsciously it seems to inform his analysis somewhat. Can't blame him, but don't have to give his POV credence either, especially when the head coach contradicts it at every turn.
You do realize that was vs 2nd and 3rd stringers for most part.