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John Jerry & Bobby Hart

VCruz80 : 9/11/2017 9:02 am
are the worst linemen ever.

They struggled in both PassPro and Run Game. I was really happy with the departure of Marshall Newhouse, but I understand now why he was starter during years.

The avg. starting position due to "success" in offense killed our D (and then, our chances) in the 2nd half. Even with OBJ this offense is among the worst in the league. There's not offense without OL.

PLEASE, SIGN A PAIR OF LINEMEN, PLEASE!!!!


They are both garbage  
superspynyg : 9/11/2017 9:04 am : link
and while we are on the subject so is our worthless oline coach. I understand that the talent he has to work with is not good but still his blocking schemes are terrible
Not the worst ever.  
x meadowlander : 9/11/2017 9:05 am : link
They are bad, but you only have to go back a few years to see even worse.

FWIW, it is not uncommon for a unit to come out shaky the first few weeks (see 2007 Defense for reference).

They've got to get it together though. To me, Jerry is the one who keeps jumping off the screen as a fuckup. Too many plays seem to blow up at his point of attack.

And as has been said many times here, Paul Perkins is not a #1 back.
I guess you forget how great Newsome and Mitchell were  
gidiefor : Mod : 9/11/2017 9:06 am : link
and a few other's too dim in my memory to be mentioned
Jones should start  
HoustonGiant : 9/11/2017 9:06 am : link
over Jerry
Very Avant Garde  
lecky : 9/11/2017 9:06 am : link
to blame the O-Line on here. There are O-Lines just as bad out there and those teams score more than 3 points.
They lost every battle on every snap  
averagejoe : 9/11/2017 9:08 am : link
for an entire game and both will start next week and both will be defended by their brainless coach.

Not sure Jerry or Hart could even make another NFL roster.
Like  
AcidTest : 9/11/2017 9:10 am : link
most others, I would bench Jerry for Jones. I'd also watch Hart closely for continued struggles, and possibly replace him with Wheeler.
I thought Jones won the starting right guard  
barens : 9/11/2017 9:11 am : link
position after starting the Jets game?
Agree,  
Doomster : 9/11/2017 9:11 am : link
They lost every battle on every snap
averagejoe : 9:08 am : link : reply
for an entire game and both will start next week and both will be defended by their brainless coach.

Not sure Jerry or Hart could even make another NFL roster.


Just like all the Giant cuts from last season that are not starting elsewhere...is there even one? No....
If it's me, I'm benching Jerry and putting in Fluker  
UberAlias : 9/11/2017 9:12 am : link
I get it, he has some flaws, but Jerry's redeeming quality is supposed to be that he is excellent in pass protection and continuity with the line, but contrarily we've been observing annual regressions.

McAdoo has no accountability for these guys. They couldn't get the job done a year ago but handed them all their spots with zero competition and every time he gets asked about it he makes excuses saying it is not all on them. Will it ever be on them, Ben???

Fluker at least brings something to the table in the running game, something this offense desperately needs.

I pull Jerry and Perkis and insert Fluker and Darkwa and give ourselves half a chance to run the ball.
RE: They lost every battle on every snap  
lecky : 9/11/2017 9:12 am : link
In comment 13593520 averagejoe said:
Quote:
for an entire game and both will start next week and both will be defended by their brainless coach.

Not sure Jerry or Hart could even make another NFL roster.


Then you adjust. You certainly dont just stand there and throw the ball away. How about something quick? How about screens? How about a 4 yard pass on 3rd and 3 instead of a 2 yard pass?
Every time someone complains about the o-line  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 9/11/2017 9:12 am : link
Who were the alternatives to pick up that we could afford or who was the amazing lineman we could have drafted as the class was not very Oline heavy?
You have to make players accountable  
mdthedream : 9/11/2017 9:13 am : link
When you made the change in the third preseason game and everything starts to click. Time to make the change.
But Mac is a F-in hard head  
Beer Man : 9/11/2017 9:18 am : link
who for some reason refuses to replace Jerry. I can only guess that Jerry is rotating Mac's socks or has compromising pictures of him.
RE: I guess you forget how great Newsome and Mitchell were  
Deej : 9/11/2017 9:23 am : link
In comment 13593512 gidiefor said:
Quote:
and a few other's too dim in my memory to be mentioned


Im thinking back to the Bishop, Gragg, Oben era. Those guys were terrible.
Dallas does not have a special defense.  
Renton : 9/11/2017 9:25 am : link
Just wait until these pukes play top pass rushers. It makes you wish Tam Hopkins and Ian Allen were on the right side.
Richburg  
Jeffrey : 9/11/2017 9:26 am : link
How does he escape some of the criticism? He is not a good run blocker and he is a smallish center who can be bull rushed. I know that he grades out as our 2nd best lineman, but isn't that more a comment on the other 3 than the fact that he is playing at a high level.
coaching coaching coaching  
grizz299 : 9/11/2017 9:31 am : link
He has ten times as much to work with as TC and every year the offense gets worse.
RE: Every time someone complains about the o-line  
TyreeHelmet : 9/11/2017 9:33 am : link
In comment 13593534 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
Who were the alternatives to pick up that we could afford or who was the amazing lineman we could have drafted as the class was not very Oline heavy?


Whitworth. Kick flowers to RG or RT.

Honestly changes were mandatory for this line. They've had enough time over the past few seasons to prove they are bad. And last night showed more of the same. Does anyone expect them to all of a sudden start playing well??
Hart and Jerry seem to be overwhelmed  
Rjanyg : 9/11/2017 9:34 am : link
They have issues with stunts and this has been going on since last year. To think they practice against one of the best fronts in the league and they can get this scheme down.

Lets also understand that as good as Eli's stats were his 1st 2 years in McAdoo's offense, his championship years came with a power running game and play action offense. Eli did all he could do to extend plays and avoid the pass rush but if the timing is disrupted at all he has no time to get to his 3rd or fourth option on straight drop plays.

Part of the issue is talent, part of the issue is scheme. Take note on the first drive of the 3rd quarter. Lots of play fakes, screens. misdirection. These things help both the QB and OL.

Go to 11 personnel and Eli gets rushed and we go backwards.
There's not a lot of talent on our o line regardless of draft #.  
plato : 9/11/2017 9:34 am : link
However the coaching has got to take some share of the blame. How much I don't know enough to grade coaching. But when performance is this bad coaching from position level, to coordinator to HC has plenty of fault. Solari I believe is "o" line coach in his second year. How good is he, has he progressed , can he integrate his line into the offense and what our RB's can do, and especially with Eli strengths?

Someone needs to review and take action not just the players grades, but the coaching cohesiveness with who we have as players and their abilities to produce an offense that can be coordinated, develop a style and rhythm and win games. Otherwise turn out the lights the party is over
.
Awful  
Ronzo17 : 9/11/2017 9:52 am : link
Shouldn't be playing. Put in fluckerand jones
Pass protection is supposed to be Jerry's Forte....  
Reb8thVA : 9/11/2017 10:04 am : link
Put Fluker in. Can it be much worse? At least we might be able to generate a running game.
Hart is only 21  
WillVAB : 9/11/2017 10:25 am : link
Maybe his balls will drop in the next 3 years.
I'd like to see Jones get the start  
Ira : 9/11/2017 10:37 am : link
at rg.
Why does  
Fish : 9/11/2017 11:05 am : link
Pugh and Richburg get a pass here? Jones should definitely start over Jerry. Not sure what else can be done. Pugh back to tackle where he WAS better.
How did Cam Robinson or Ramczyk  
LauderdaleMatty : 9/11/2017 11:25 am : link
Do? We all love Engram but this team is devoid of talent and depth along the OL. The bullshit that there wasn't an OL worth it at that spot is just as
Much a Guess as is that a Engram will be a stud. We needed OL talent and wheeler may be a find but he's a year away. Reese got a pass for his D rebuild. Now the OL needs the same

O Line  
TyreeHelmet : 9/11/2017 11:34 am : link
I know there was no easy fixes this offseason. But to do nothing and bring back the same unit is unacceptable. I know the free agent options were expensive, but sometimes you have to bite the bullet and address a glaring weakness.

Shpuld have signed Whitworth or Lang. Should have drafted an O lineman in the first 3 rounds. Could have been more aggressive in pursuing trades. Bringing back the same unit sends the wrong message and could torpedo this season.

Cue the Joe Thomas and Joe Staley rumors....
Did anyone watch any games yesterday?  
jcn56 : 9/11/2017 11:34 am : link
I don't think Jerry and Hart are any great shakes. And Jerry's inconsistency was enough to earn him a spot on the bench for a week, IMO.

...but...

If you're looking at these guys and comparing them to the line from 2007-2010 - I would suggest you start watching some more football on gameday.

Offensive line play sucks around the league. Not bad, not mediocre - sucks. PFF said that Hart was good enough for 16th tackle. They said Jerry was even better. Ironically, they gave Flowers a lower grade than both (I thought he had a better game than they did, but that's besides the point).

The line played a thoroughly average game when you compare it to the action around the rest of the league.

So why was the output so bad? Simple - because the playcalling was no great shakes, and Eli left a bunch of plays on the field.

Would better OL play have resulted in a better offense? Without a doubt. But compared to what's out there today, they performed well enough for these guys to put up some points.
You guys calling for Fluker need to realize  
BlueHurricane : 9/11/2017 11:37 am : link
He didn't even get a uniform last night. The guy is not coming in and making a difference.

This team is in very big trouble because once again Reese failed to fix this o-line.
The scary part is this OLine  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/11/2017 11:45 am : link
has been together for a few years now, too. Even with continuity, they still look like shit.

Jerry and Hart are trash.
RE: The scary part is this OLine  
TyreeHelmet : 9/11/2017 11:48 am : link
In comment 13594009 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
has been together for a few years now, too. Even with continuity, they still look like shit.

Jerry and Hart are trash.


Exactl and what I was referencing above. The jury is out on this unit. All the evidence is there that they are a bad group. They needed to be blown up and a minimum of 2 new starters brought it. Instead they did nothing and hoped they get better.
Sick and tired of not getting any push.  
Dankbeerman : 9/11/2017 11:52 am : link
Jerry and hart to the bench, give me from left to right: Pugh,Jones,richburg,fluker,flowers.

give me darkwa behind a fullback, and a blocking te. run with some power, give me some play action, if we are gonna play low scoring games control the ball and eat clock. support our deffensive efforts.

RG John Jerry allowed 2 sacks, 2 hurries on 45 pass blocks (73.4)  
Emil : 9/11/2017 11:57 am : link
Just an example of why PFF is garbage!

How can you allow two sacks, be a non factor in the run game and get a 73 rating? I'm not saying it's all Jerry's fault, but what are you going to beleive? Your eyes, or this rating system that tries to assess players without even knowing what those players are required to do on a given play.
Link - ( New Window )
I  
capegman : 9/11/2017 12:40 pm : link
find it hard to believe there were no training camp final cuts we could have picked up significantly better than Bobby Hart. He looked like a boy among men.
Jerry can not handle  
Peter from NH (formerly CT) : 9/11/2017 2:33 pm : link
the stunt.

Just not a smart enough athlete.

But, Giants seem to like him. I don't.
RE: Did anyone watch any games yesterday?  
Peter from NH (formerly CT) : 9/11/2017 2:38 pm : link
In comment 13593975 jcn56 said:
Quote:
I don't think Jerry and Hart are any great shakes. And Jerry's inconsistency was enough to earn him a spot on the bench for a week, IMO.


Offensive line play sucks around the league. Not bad, not mediocre - sucks. PFF said that Hart was good enough for 16th tackle. They said Jerry was even better. Ironically, they gave Flowers a lower grade than both (I thought he had a better game than they did, but that's besides the point).

I have to agree. I watched some games yesterday and there are there are just not enough high quality athletes playing Oline in the NFL right now. What Dallas has is really special (although Collins seemed to be allowed to tackle JPP on every play and only be called once....).
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