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Most treated Kevin Gilbride unfairly here-

Sean : 9/12/2017 8:21 pm
I don't mean this as a pile on Ben McAdoo post. I thought he did a very good job last year & think he is the right man for the job going forward.

With that said, most here were very hard on Gilbride, a man who led 2 Giant Super Bowl champion offenses. A lot of us, myself included, got so wrapped up in Eli's numbers and whether he could put up big numbers in a more QB friendly system. The bottom line, Gilbride's system worked just fine **when things were going well.** Eli's numbers have been better, but most of that can be attributed to Odell Beckham and his tremendous YAC results. Eli is Eli whether Gilbride is running the show or McAdoo. He throws a lot of picks and is not going to put up massive numbers, and that's okay.

Gilbride's system was volatile & with a bad offensive line it does not work (see 18 TD - 27 INT in 2013). The idea that Gilbride was causing Eli bad numbers is so absurd, it is about winning titles & they did that twice. Eli had a fantastic completion rating this past week and it was arguably one of his worst regular season games.
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Ha ha  
Mark from Jersey : 9/12/2017 9:18 pm : link
people longing for the days of Killdrive
RE: RE: Gilbride's offense reminded me of a high pressure direct injection  
Devon : 9/12/2017 9:18 pm : link
In comment 13596589 Devon said:
Quote:
In comment 13596564 jcn56 said:


Quote:


engine. When everything is working right, it's perfection. One small problem somewhere - and the engine could blow itself to bits.

Executed properly, it was unstoppable at times - and others, it couldn't get out of it's own fucking way. Despite the fact that we had more cap and draft picks allocated to the offense, it took two big time defensive performances to turn out those championship seasons.



The Giants had more % of cap space dedicated to the defense in both 2011 and 2007.

2012 was the year it swung the other way, thanks to several guys on the OL's cap hits kicking in.


2011, for example, was 43.02% offense, 55.06% defense... and remember the defense was only 27th ranked that regular season, even if they thankfully stepped up late.

I'm pretty sure the draft picks aren't as heavily sided towards the offense either, through those points, but I haven't checked that to 100% sure.
I think Gilbride was properly  
Enzo : 9/12/2017 9:20 pm : link
rated by most Giant fans. Seems like our view of him was similar to how he was viewed around the league. After all, how many interviews did he get for head coaching positions while he was the Giants' offensive coordinator? And he was lobbying for a head coaching gig at times. Hell, even TC didn't bring him in as a offensive coordinator to start.
Gilbride's offense was far more exciting  
dpinzow : 9/12/2017 9:22 pm : link
and still would have worked with a good OL. The collapse of our old OL (Diehl, Seubert, O'Hara, Snee, McKenzie) caused the 2013 debacle with Gilbride
...  
christian : 9/12/2017 9:25 pm : link
It's easy to critique a system in hindsight. Reality is good offense in the modern NFL requires 1) quality QB play 2) quality lineman 3) quality weapons.

You subtract any of the 3 and good luck.

The Giants have invested draft picks in the offense and cap space in the defense. If Pugh, Rich, and Flowers were plus players, we'd be a contender. Because they are not, we are not.

It's simple economics, the investments have not paid off.
RE: RE: RE: Gilbride's offense reminded me of a high pressure direct injection  
jcn56 : 9/12/2017 9:29 pm : link
In comment 13596596 Devon said:
Quote:
In comment 13596589 Devon said:


Quote:


In comment 13596564 jcn56 said:


Quote:


engine. When everything is working right, it's perfection. One small problem somewhere - and the engine could blow itself to bits.

Executed properly, it was unstoppable at times - and others, it couldn't get out of it's own fucking way. Despite the fact that we had more cap and draft picks allocated to the offense, it took two big time defensive performances to turn out those championship seasons.



The Giants had more % of cap space dedicated to the defense in both 2011 and 2007.

2012 was the year it swung the other way, thanks to several guys on the OL's cap hits kicking in.



2011, for example, was 43.02% offense, 55.06% defense... and remember the defense was only 27th ranked that regular season, even if they thankfully stepped up late.

I'm pretty sure the draft picks aren't as heavily sided towards the offense either, through those points, but I haven't checked that to 100% sure.


I don't think your numbers are accurate - what's your source? Spotrac only goes back to 13, but starting in 13 and going forward, it historically offensively biased. I seem to recall (and can't find a source for now) that the 07 team was particularly biased towards the offense.
BBI like so many anonymous internet sites encourages and plays to  
plato : 9/12/2017 9:35 pm : link
Bullying and attacks. Site was amazingly mean to Gilbride, allowing so many to vent ignorance in anger. Oh well, it's our current world.
He got  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 9/12/2017 9:37 pm : link
way too much shit on this website.
Missing Gilbride?  
DonQuixote : 9/12/2017 9:37 pm : link
Oh Please. If you are going to compare the Giants offense with past Giant offenses, fine, but I am more concerned with how they stack up with the rest of the league ... not good.
unfairly?  
RasputinPrime : 9/12/2017 9:37 pm : link
I didn't like his system. I still don't. You can win with any number of systems and I was hoping the post-Gilbride world would be more interesting and consistent. It hasn't happened yet.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Gilbride's offense reminded me of a high pressure direct injection  
Devon : 9/12/2017 9:39 pm : link
In comment 13596608 jcn56 said:
Quote:
In comment 13596596 Devon said:


Quote:


In comment 13596589 Devon said:


Quote:


In comment 13596564 jcn56 said:


Quote:


engine. When everything is working right, it's perfection. One small problem somewhere - and the engine could blow itself to bits.

Executed properly, it was unstoppable at times - and others, it couldn't get out of it's own fucking way. Despite the fact that we had more cap and draft picks allocated to the offense, it took two big time defensive performances to turn out those championship seasons.



The Giants had more % of cap space dedicated to the defense in both 2011 and 2007.

2012 was the year it swung the other way, thanks to several guys on the OL's cap hits kicking in.



2011, for example, was 43.02% offense, 55.06% defense... and remember the defense was only 27th ranked that regular season, even if they thankfully stepped up late.

I'm pretty sure the draft picks aren't as heavily sided towards the offense either, through those points, but I haven't checked that to 100% sure.



I don't think your numbers are accurate - what's your source? Spotrac only goes back to 13, but starting in 13 and going forward, it historically offensively biased. I seem to recall (and can't find a source for now) that the 07 team was particularly biased towards the offense.


And old FO almanac -- though I did read it wrong, as I was looking at payouts.

The share numbers were 45.08% to 52.41%, offense to defense. I remembered it being this way, before looking, because at the time when the defense was playing like trash, it was brought up. A lot. About how they weren't getting value for the money they were spending, but were getting great value out of the WR contracts.

Also, looking the drafts just now, you were definitely wrong on the draft pick distribution.

From 2004 through 2011, there were 23 picks spent on offense (that's including those traded to SD), 34 on defense, and two on specials.

Three firsts (again, including the SD picks) on offense, five on defense. Four seconds on offense, five on defense. Four thirds on offense, four on defense, one on specials.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Gilbride's offense reminded me of a high pressure direct injection  
Devon : 9/12/2017 9:46 pm : link
In comment 13596620 Devon said:
Quote:
In comment 13596608 jcn56 said:


Quote:


In comment 13596596 Devon said:


Quote:


In comment 13596589 Devon said:


Quote:


In comment 13596564 jcn56 said:


Quote:


engine. When everything is working right, it's perfection. One small problem somewhere - and the engine could blow itself to bits.

Executed properly, it was unstoppable at times - and others, it couldn't get out of it's own fucking way. Despite the fact that we had more cap and draft picks allocated to the offense, it took two big time defensive performances to turn out those championship seasons.



The Giants had more % of cap space dedicated to the defense in both 2011 and 2007.

2012 was the year it swung the other way, thanks to several guys on the OL's cap hits kicking in.



2011, for example, was 43.02% offense, 55.06% defense... and remember the defense was only 27th ranked that regular season, even if they thankfully stepped up late.

I'm pretty sure the draft picks aren't as heavily sided towards the offense either, through those points, but I haven't checked that to 100% sure.



I don't think your numbers are accurate - what's your source? Spotrac only goes back to 13, but starting in 13 and going forward, it historically offensively biased. I seem to recall (and can't find a source for now) that the 07 team was particularly biased towards the offense.



And old FO almanac -- though I did read it wrong, as I was looking at payouts.

The share numbers were 45.08% to 52.41%, offense to defense. I remembered it being this way, before looking, because at the time when the defense was playing like trash, it was brought up. A lot. About how they weren't getting value for the money they were spending, but were getting great value out of the WR contracts.

Also, looking the drafts just now, you were definitely wrong on the draft pick distribution.

From 2004 through 2011, there were 23 picks spent on offense (that's including those traded to SD), 34 on defense, and two on specials.

Three firsts (again, including the SD picks) on offense, five on defense. Four seconds on offense, five on defense. Four thirds on offense, four on defense, one on specials.


*edit out the one on specials for thirds, that was a fourth
Gilbride implemented ......  
Reb8thVA : 9/12/2017 9:54 pm : link
The most prolific Giants offense that I've seen in my lifetime. Of course the predictable fade pattern near the end zone and the shot gun draw or the 25 yard pass on 3&1 were sometimes maddening, I miss the downfield attack. I'm not a fan of McAdoo's WCO. Even if we were playing better, I just don't find it enjoyable to watch.
Not even close  
HomerJones45 : 9/12/2017 10:47 pm : link

At a time when the NFL has done everything to help the offense and teams score 3 td's in two minutes, Kid Slick's 'uncomplicated' offense cant't score 3 td's a game.

Gilbride was run out of town and isn't coming back so this debate is academic. All we can do is hope Kid Slick can come with a plan to crack that magical 20 point barrier
Gilbride  
PaulBlakeTSU : 9/12/2017 11:23 pm : link
could design an incredibly high-powered offense and at times, the Giants used it to great effect.

But when the O-line went to shit and we couldn't run the ball and didn't have much time to throw, Gilbride's scheme didn't work. His plays took too long to develop and we had too much of a carousel at WR to develop any chemistry or mastery of it. Unfortunately, he didn't seem to want to scrap his plan and develop a new scheme the way a mind like Belichick would.

Given the current state of the offensive line and run game, I wouldn't want Gilbride back because his offense wouldn't work for the same reason he was asked to leave.

But if we had an awesome offensive line? Gilbride and Eli could do some major damage.
Gilbride was a vey good OC and very well thought of  
PatersonPlank : 9/12/2017 11:53 pm : link
He was the mastermind of the Houston Oilers spread with Moon, what an offense that was. Sure it was complicated and had to have the WR's and QB on the same page, plus like any scheme it needed pass blocking. However when they had it going it was almost unstoppable.

Much better than the 3 yard out crap we have now.
Over Gillbride's 7 year stint as OC,  
BH28 : 9/13/2017 1:07 am : link
Giants averaged 24.2 points/game.

McAdoo's two year stint as OC yielded 25.05 points/game.

Last year as HC the average was 19.4.

But comparing their capacities as OCs, Gillbride was not missed in 2014 and 2015. It was the defense that let us down.
Kevin Gilbiride is not THE reason for their offensive success  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/13/2017 1:14 am : link
the years he was here. That offense had all-pros playing on it.

I don't know why we attribute success or failure so heavily toward coaching. He's the same coach who once called 58 passing plays in a windstorm in a miserable losing effort.
How many rushing yards did we  
Hereditaryemperor : 9/13/2017 5:36 am : link
have vs Dallas?

Perkins looks like a joke. Give Darkwa the rock.
this is nostalgic  
gidiefor : Mod : 9/13/2017 7:14 am : link
revisionist history
Scoring offenses under Coughlin/Gilbride NFL overall  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 7:20 am : link
2006: 11th
2007: 14th (Superbowl)
2008: 3rd
2009: 8th
2010: 7th
2011: 9th (Superbowl)
2012: 6th
2013: 28th (Fired)
RE: Gilbride  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 7:24 am : link
In comment 13596703 PaulBlakeTSU said:
Quote:
could design an incredibly high-powered offense and at times, the Giants used it to great effect.

But when the O-line went to shit and we couldn't run the ball and didn't have much time to throw, Gilbride's scheme didn't work. His plays took too long to develop and we had too much of a carousel at WR to develop any chemistry or mastery of it. Unfortunately, he didn't seem to want to scrap his plan and develop a new scheme the way a mind like Belichick would.

Given the current state of the offensive line and run game, I wouldn't want Gilbride back because his offense wouldn't work for the same reason he was asked to leave.

But if we had an awesome offensive line? Gilbride and Eli could do some major damage.


Agreed
The O-line went to shit in 2012 and the dominoes fell.  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 8:23 am : link
That's what happened.

You can blame Coughlin, you can blame Gilbride, you can blame Eli (he's going to be the next one run off with pitchforks)...

But that's what happened. And it's still happening.
Its not unreasonable to say that Eli is better suited  
WideRight : 9/13/2017 8:29 am : link
for Gilbride than McAdoo. Eli has the arm and the disposition for a higher risk, higher reward system. His mobility and accuracy are suboptimal for dink and dunk. That doesn't mean Gilbride is better, but coaches should be responsible for gameplanning that optimizes personnel....
RE: Scoring offenses under Coughlin/Gilbride NFL overall  
Sean : 9/13/2017 8:30 am : link
In comment 13596780 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
2006: 11th
2007: 14th (Superbowl)
2008: 3rd
2009: 8th
2010: 7th
2011: 9th (Superbowl)
2012: 6th
2013: 28th (Fired)


Wow. Did not realize this.
RE: The O-line went to shit in 2012 and the dominoes fell.  
nygiants16 : 9/13/2017 8:34 am : link
In comment 13596845 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
That's what happened.

You can blame Coughlin, you can blame Gilbride, you can blame Eli (he's going to be the next one run off with pitchforks)...

But that's what happened. And it's still happening.


coughlin and gillbrides best cosching job was 2011, the oline was dog shit but had vets, the rushing attack was dog shit, the defense was mediocre, yet gillbride and coughlin kept the team going and together...

2012 and 2013 it fell apart
RE: RE: Scoring offenses under Coughlin/Gilbride NFL overall  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 8:36 am : link
In comment 13596850 Sean said:
Quote:
In comment 13596780 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


2006: 11th
2007: 14th (Superbowl)
2008: 3rd
2009: 8th
2010: 7th
2011: 9th (Superbowl)
2012: 6th
2013: 28th (Fired)



Wow. Did not realize this.


I posted those numbers on every Gilbride bashing thread for years, but people still wanted him gone.
Sean, what Coughlin and Gilbride put together was an incredible system  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 8:38 am : link
that would still be going if we could have restocked the offensive line.

You want to know what I always defended them both so much? Because I knew the offense we were seeing was so special with Coughlin, Eli, and Gilbride.

They were Golden Years of NYG football, and like most things, nobody truly appreciates them until they're gone, and people realize the grass isn't always greener.
RE: RE: RE: Scoring offenses under Coughlin/Gilbride NFL overall  
Essex : 9/13/2017 8:55 am : link
In comment 13596860 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 13596850 Sean said:


Quote:


In comment 13596780 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


2006: 11th
2007: 14th (Superbowl)
2008: 3rd
2009: 8th
2010: 7th
2011: 9th (Superbowl)
2012: 6th
2013: 28th (Fired)



Wow. Did not realize this.



I posted those numbers on every Gilbride bashing thread for years, but people still wanted him gone.

Wait, so a OF who had a good offensive line put up good numbers when he had an OL, and bad numbers when he didn't. That is all those numbers show. Gilbride was fine, but neither he nor coughlin had an answer when the OL stumbled. At least, McAdoo had some answers, the league seems to have figured it out, and we may have to change again, but Gillbride's offense needed an OL, which we didn't have. It was the right choice to find someone who could work with our personnel.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Scoring offenses under Coughlin/Gilbride NFL overall  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 8:58 am : link
In comment 13596870 Essex said:
Quote:
In comment 13596860 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


In comment 13596850 Sean said:


Quote:


In comment 13596780 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


2006: 11th
2007: 14th (Superbowl)
2008: 3rd
2009: 8th
2010: 7th
2011: 9th (Superbowl)
2012: 6th
2013: 28th (Fired)



Wow. Did not realize this.



I posted those numbers on every Gilbride bashing thread for years, but people still wanted him gone.


Wait, so a OF who had a good offensive line put up good numbers when he had an OL, and bad numbers when he didn't. That is all those numbers show. Gilbride was fine, but neither he nor coughlin had an answer when the OL stumbled. At least, McAdoo had some answers, the league seems to have figured it out, and we may have to change again, but Gillbride's offense needed an OL, which we didn't have. It was the right choice to find someone who could work with our personnel.


The O-line started to decline in 2009. By 2011 it sucked. I think we were what? 31st or 32nd in the league in rushing? They did alright that year if I recall correctly.
It wasn't an "incredible" system  
Essex : 9/13/2017 8:59 am : link
It worked well and was in the top third of the league with a good OL and a franchise QB with top notch receivers, right where you would expect it to be.
Coach or talent?  
WideRight : 9/13/2017 9:00 am : link
Major FAs, Burress & McKenzie along with good draft picks, Snee, Barber, Jacobs. WIthout the talent, the O crashed and coaches burned.

You can say the same thing about Spags & the D. Success requires good coaching and talent. Can you evaluate coaching in the absence of good talent?
Here's something a little more relevant to today:  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 9:02 am : link
2006: 11 games over 20 points, 4 over 30
2007: 10 games over 20 points, 6 over 30
2008: 11 games over 20 points, 5 over 30, 2 over 40
2009: 11 games over 20 points, 4 over 30, 2 over 40
2010: 10 games over 20 points, 4 over 30, 2 over 40
2011: 13 games over 20 points, 5 over 30
2012: 10 games over 20 points, 2 over 30, 3 over 40, 1 over 50
2013: 10 games over 20 points, 1 over 30 (Fired)

McAdoo's offense has never broken 30 points, and we all know about the magic number of 20 points.
Also Britt is cherry picking stats,  
Essex : 9/13/2017 9:06 am : link
Our offensive efficiency was 24th in 2012 and 12th in 2011. The offense since after Hurricane Sandy was abymal and change was needed.
Just going by points scored when comparing coordinators  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/13/2017 9:07 am : link
Isn't providing enough context. Context matters. We know what spagnuolo can do as a DC but that didn't stop people from claiming he can't coach when the defense was bad in his first year back here with no players. Provide the talent the team needs and the results will be there if the coordinator is good at his job.
Ha, cherrypicking?  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 9:07 am : link
That's as basic as it gets.

I just posted scores and NFL rank.
..  
nygiants16 : 9/13/2017 9:07 am : link
didnt they break 30 against saints and panthers in 15?

last year they scored 27 and 28...
Also not really sure where all this scoring was going to come from  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/13/2017 9:14 am : link
The offensive line has been trash and they haven't had any offensive skill quality players other than Beckham. So where is this 30ppg going to come from? Even if you believe Eli can turn water into wine,he would need an offensive line and a running game.
RE: Also not really sure where all this scoring was going to come from  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 9:15 am : link
In comment 13596900 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
The offensive line has been trash and they haven't had any offensive skill quality players other than Beckham. So where is this 30ppg going to come from? Even if you believe Eli can turn water into wine,he would need an offensive line and a running game.


As mentioned above, in 2015 we scored over 30 several times, with the same, maybe worse, players.

What happened?
RE: Also not really sure where all this scoring was going to come from  
nygiants16 : 9/13/2017 9:18 am : link
In comment 13596900 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
The offensive line has been trash and they haven't had any offensive skill quality players other than Beckham. So where is this 30ppg going to come from? Even if you believe Eli can turn water into wine,he would need an offensive line and a running game.


ehh he won a superbowl with a garbage oline and no running game
To me, this offensive like has gotten worse.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/13/2017 9:19 am : link
Richburg looked like a guy you could build with as a rookie. He's either been hurt or regressed since. Not sure it IS the same players. Just one example I picked there are others.
Gilbride's Coughlin offense which is what it was  
arniefez : 9/13/2017 9:27 am : link
is as relevant in the 2017 NFL as Phil Jackson's triangle is in the 2017 NBA.
Gilbrides Offense was....  
Triple "G" : 9/13/2017 9:41 am : link
The most complicated Offense to ever see an NFL Field. This is coming from Receivers that were the top of their classes in performance and football smarts. Such as Chris Carter and Jerry Rice.

On the NFL Network the both of them were talking about Gilbride System. The both said they couldn't play in that system and be successful. There were far too many reads (Min 4 with a max 6) for the QB and Receiver's to make after the Huddle at the LOS. It was based on not only the safety/s but the LB's and how they lined up. Each and every subtle difference in the defensive lineup meant the receiver had a different cut or move or route to run. To get 3 receivers and a QB to see the field the exact same way is really too much to ask with all the different routes and cuts. That is why it sometimes looked like Eli was throwing to air, the receiver saw thing Eli saw another and the receiver cut left when Eli threw right.

That was just one example of a million different secenarios for play. I tried to make it simple)but when all pieces were on the same page that Offense could not be stopped. It was truly a high risk high reward system. We cant complain that system won this team 2 Super Bowls. It failed because Reese drafted too many receivers that could not grasp the nuances of the system in other words they were too stupid to understand it



RE: Gilbrides Offense was....  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 9:52 am : link
In comment 13596968 Triple "G" said:
Quote:
The most complicated Offense to ever see an NFL Field. This is coming from Receivers that were the top of their classes in performance and football smarts. Such as Chris Carter and Jerry Rice.

On the NFL Network the both of them were talking about Gilbride System. The both said they couldn't play in that system and be successful. There were far too many reads (Min 4 with a max 6) for the QB and Receiver's to make after the Huddle at the LOS. It was based on not only the safety/s but the LB's and how they lined up. Each and every subtle difference in the defensive lineup meant the receiver had a different cut or move or route to run. To get 3 receivers and a QB to see the field the exact same way is really too much to ask with all the different routes and cuts. That is why it sometimes looked like Eli was throwing to air, the receiver saw thing Eli saw another and the receiver cut left when Eli threw right.

That was just one example of a million different secenarios for play. I tried to make it simple)but when all pieces were on the same page that Offense could not be stopped. It was truly a high risk high reward system. We cant complain that system won this team 2 Super Bowls. It failed because Reese drafted too many receivers that could not grasp the nuances of the system in other words they were too stupid to understand it




Yet it was plug and play for a multitude of seasons and supposed "non-replaceable" receivers came and went successfully.
For instance....  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 9:57 am : link
Steve Smith had over 100 catches in 2009.

Mario Manningham had great years in the offense, not to mention being a Superbowl here (along with another journeyman David Tyree).
hero.  
Britt in VA : 9/13/2017 9:57 am : link
.
.....  
BrettNYG10 : 9/13/2017 10:14 am : link
I loved Gilbride, but he had to go. Same with TC. One day (hopefully not soon), the same might be said of Eli. The appreciation for their performances doesn't mean we necessarily want them back.

I was always surprised KG didn't get another coaching job after 'retirement'.
RE: .....  
jcn56 : 9/13/2017 10:17 am : link
In comment 13597030 BrettNYG10 said:
Quote:
I loved Gilbride, but he had to go. Same with TC. One day (hopefully not soon), the same might be said of Eli. The appreciation for their performances doesn't mean we necessarily want them back.

I was always surprised KG didn't get another coaching job after 'retirement'.


I fully believe the reports that KG had enough of coaching when he was done. He's got a good gig as an analyst now, and he spent a long time on the sidelines with a number of teams, got himself a ring. Not sure that even if he was offered another spot whether he'd have taken it.

I agree with the overall sentiment though - it's possible for someone to have done a good job but for it to have run it's course, and that was certainly the case for Gilbride here.
I couldn't stand the system.  
AnishPatel : 9/13/2017 10:57 am : link
I am thankful for the SBs, but I was very glad we made the change.
NYG had a top 10 offense for 5 of his 8 seasons  
Section331 : 9/13/2017 11:10 am : link
as OC, that has to mean something. That said, with restricted practice rules, I'm not sure such a complex offense is workable in today's NFL. I do think KG was unfairly maligned here. He had his warts, but overall he did a very good job.
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