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ESPN: Is Giants QB Eli Manning running on fumes?

Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/18/2017 8:26 am
Quote:
EAST RUTHERFORD, N.J. -- Eli Manning walked off the field in the third quarter of Sunday night’s loss to the Dallas Cowboys as television cameras zoomed in on his face. The look was eerily reminiscent to what New York Giants fans had seen countless times before, especially early in his career.

“Manning Face,” as it is known, is a mix of disgust and bewilderment. It was there on more than a few occasions Sunday night and has become more common to see over the past few years, including during Sunday’s 19-3 loss to the rival Cowboys....

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Is Giants QB Eli Manning running on fumes? - ( New Window )
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With the same offensive line and a slightly younger body  
jcn56 : 9/18/2017 9:17 am : link
on the road in Green Bay Eli looked like he was running on a lot more than just fumes.

I'm sure age has impacted his game, and maybe it's more obvious with him than other QBs because he's less mobile than most (all?) others. I still think more than anything else, it's mental with Eli. I think he's less willing to take the hits, and more conscious about getting the ball out of there faster.

Part of that is schematic, part of that is mental. The OL around him isn't going to make any huge strides any time soon - so he's going to have to find it in him to take more hits, to hang in there a bit longer, or we're going to have a very long season.
The Age Argument  
WillVAB : 9/18/2017 9:18 am : link
This is a horrible argument since it's predicated on the success of the offense and team, elements not entirely in a QB's control.

If you recall the SB last year, the early papers were headlined with Father Time catching up to Brady and the Patriots -- that is until they came back and won the game.

The same issue resurfaced after the Pats looked bad in their home opening loss. Now you don't hear a word about it after Brady torched a bad Saints team.

It's hard to take the age argument seriously when the narrative changes so quickly based off of wins and losses. It's especially hard to take seriously in Eli's case when anyone with a modicum of common sense can see the OL is the problem with this team, and has been for several years.
......  
BrettNYG10 : 9/18/2017 9:23 am : link
If Eli did have a physical decline, do you think that any of us here (i.e., non-professionals) would actually have the ability to notice? I don't think I could really tell. Most QB's don't decline in a manner as obvious as Peyton Manning. But if you lose just a little bit physically, it can kill you.
When was the last time  
BigBlueWhale : 9/18/2017 9:27 am : link
he had a big game?
RE: This question or insinuation always  
Jimmy Googs : 9/18/2017 9:27 am : link
In comment 13601653 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
gets people going on either support side or the against side of Eli declining crowds. The fact is he is declining, as any QB would as they enter the age group he is in. Add to it, he has not MISSED a game in his career. He has even had two different years where he went 4 games more (so two years of 20 physical, all out football games). The Championship game in SF was an epic battle and one that Eli took a pounding in.

You can't try and say ELI is not declining at all when clearly he has a ton of mileage on him. Add to it the amount of hits he has taken the last few years and you would be naive at best and a blatant homer at worst if you said these hits and years have not changed him some. It doesn't take much anymore to get Eli wrapping up the ball and hitting the deck. He rushes throws some now when the pressure seems more perceived than it may have been. He was never really mobile but now he makes Tom Brady look like Michael Vick back there. Eli has changed and it is obvious from just watching. Do not look for reasons or blame or ways it would be better if other things were different. Just observe and admit he has changed and declined in some areas. It isn't an insult or knock on him like he did something wrong. It is Father time showing the effects of a LOT of Football played and played behind some questionable blocking...

Does this mean he is done? Hell no. But, we can't expect him to be able tow in games. This is where the Giants management and coaching deserve a ton of blame. You have a patty cake offensive game style -lots of draws, lots short area passes etc. but you have a lot of bigger OLinemen who are not skilled or built for that- Flowers, Fluker, Hart, Jerry.. You have very little in terms of blocking ability at TE (at least last few years) and what you have now seems like you still don't know how to best deploy them. You have multiple RB's who are all kind of the same. You have no true Power back and thus no ability to switch to that kind of game if you need to get short yardage or run the clock out.

To me, ELI is well the backside of his career and if the Giants cannot fix the Oline that decline will become VERY noticeable to all by midseason..

Do not be surprised if this is it for Eli and the Gmen.


Strong post. Nice job here...
RE: When was the last time  
GMAN4LIFE : 9/18/2017 9:29 am : link
In comment 13601674 BigBlueWhale said:
Quote:
he had a big game?


real good question

when was the last time he threw 4 tds in a game?
RE: ......  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 9:29 am : link
In comment 13601671 BrettNYG10 said:
Quote:
If Eli did have a physical decline, do you think that any of us here (i.e., non-professionals) would actually have the ability to notice? I don't think I could really tell. Most QB's don't decline in a manner as obvious as Peyton Manning. But if you lose just a little bit physically, it can kill you.


Frankly, I don't know how anybody could tell right now, because the offensive line isn't giving us a chance to see him perform.

I've read a lot that that him covering the ball and taking a dive is indicative of mental decline. I'm not sure about that. It's a long season and he can't be taking monster shots left and right. There is a saying that one of the best abilities of a quarterback is availability. If you think McAdoo has any shot at turning this thing around this season, you need Eli to not be taking 5 monster shots a game. We need him to go down at this point in the season.
RE: RE: When was the last time  
BrettNYG10 : 9/18/2017 9:30 am : link
In comment 13601679 GMAN4LIFE said:
Quote:
In comment 13601674 BigBlueWhale said:


Quote:


he had a big game?



real good question

when was the last time he threw 4 tds in a game?


Last year against Philly on 11/6.
Also, the other thing about taking a dive vs. hanging in there longer,  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 9:34 am : link
is less INT's, which is by design I'm sure.

McAdoo has neutered Eli in that regard. Yeah, the turnovers are cut down, but we also aren't getting wow'd by any amazing throws in those situations, either.
RE: RE: ......  
BrettNYG10 : 9/18/2017 9:36 am : link
In comment 13601680 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 13601671 BrettNYG10 said:


Quote:


If Eli did have a physical decline, do you think that any of us here (i.e., non-professionals) would actually have the ability to notice? I don't think I could really tell. Most QB's don't decline in a manner as obvious as Peyton Manning. But if you lose just a little bit physically, it can kill you.



Frankly, I don't know how anybody could tell right now, because the offensive line isn't giving us a chance to see him perform.

I've read a lot that that him covering the ball and taking a dive is indicative of mental decline. I'm not sure about that. It's a long season and he can't be taking monster shots left and right. There is a saying that one of the best abilities of a quarterback is availability. If you think McAdoo has any shot at turning this thing around this season, you need Eli to not be taking 5 monster shots a game. We need him to go down at this point in the season.


Birtt, those are all good points. Eli can't play like the 2011 NFCCG every week, he'd be missing games constantly. It's a skill to know how to cushion blows, even if it means sacrificing a few plays here and there.

I don't think I could really have an idea about whether Eli's physical skills have declined barring a total collapse. He looks the same to me.

Eli (and the OL) will have better games. I think it's too soon to make definitive statements about Eli. He's bounced back from worse stretches in his career.
Phil Simms always said  
David B. : 9/18/2017 9:51 am : link
The biggest crime was that once you reach your mid to late 30s as a QB, you are finally seeing EVERYTHING. It all slows down, you know what everyone on the defense is doing, when their cheating up, blitzing, or faking. And just as your brain finally processes everything, according to Simms (and a few others) your body gives out. That's happening less since Phil played. Guys are playing longer now. It hasn't happened to Brady yet, and it hasn't happened to Eli yet either. He's been remarkably tough and healthy.

People think Eli's "playing scared" -- I think that's BS. I also think that questioning his courage at this point is despicable. I think if he has a chance to make a play, he tries like hell to make it, and he'll still take the hit to make it. But with this OL, when they can't run, and the rush is in his face in less than 2.5 seconds -- the time, under which he releases a ball on a 3 step drop -- and there is NO CHANCE to make a play, he hits the deck to keep from getting killed. IMO that's playing SMART, not scared. I'd rather him do that then throw it up for grabs or get himself hurt. If he starts forcing things in that situation, the same people will get on him for throwing too many picks. The perception from the media, and a bizarre segment of Giants fans has always been a no-win for Eli.

Again -- UNTIL the Giants can run the ball -- even a little, and keep defenses honest, he won't have the time to take many 5 or 7 step drops, so there won't be shots down field, or opportunities to stand tall in the pocket.

Get the run game going, and you'll be surprised at how effective Eli will be again. Though no one SHOULD be surprised.
I don't see it as questioning Eli's courage  
jcn56 : 9/18/2017 9:56 am : link
The guy is still sitting back there and taking a pounding. He's never missed a game. He's beyond having his courage questioned, IMO.

I do think you can question his timing and decision making. I think he gets rid of the ball more quickly in order to minimize hits mostly to minimize turnovers and sacks. He did this several times against Dallas - a few times overlooking open receivers who would have had bigger gains for the checkdowns. Part of that is schematic - he's being told to do that. Part of it is his internal clock, which is quick because he's conditioned to not expect protection.

I think that was the biggest difference in what we saw in GB, where had one of his receivers bothered to catch the ball we might have seen a completely different Eli. Same offense, same OL, same QB, same RBs - the WRs went cold. What is different now - where arguably the offensive personnel has improved around him?
Well, we've only seen one game back since the game you're talking  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 10:01 am : link
about.

I also think you have to take into account that we're seeing jailbreaks when other teams only rush 3 or 4 guys, and flooding all passing lanes. I haven't seen the all 22, but I'm guessing it's all a combination of a. the rush being in his face in less than 2 seconds from the snap of the ball, b. his first and second progression are well covered, and c. he's been trained to eat the ball rather than force it.

To me, that's mostly scheme. Yeah, his internal clock is probably effed up, but really, if you agree that those three things above are happening a lot, then you have to look at the offense itself.
If you are reading an article about Eli  
Mike from Ohio : 9/18/2017 10:01 am : link
that puts any stock in analyzing his face or body language, you are reading something not worth discussing. Anyone who has followed him, even casually, over his career knows that those things don't matter. He just carries himself the way he carries himself.

There is plenty to analyze about Eli's actual play. If you want to criticize him for not seemingly not seeing the field as well as he used to or hurrying throws and using some poor mechanics, have at it. But his face and his shoulders? Not in any way telling.
Eli & The WC Offense  
Danthebigbluefan : 9/18/2017 11:15 am : link
IMO is potentially the root of the problem here. Square peg round hole theory, that you are trying to fit a certain style and athletically inclined player into an offensive system that requires a different style of athlete.

Eli is not a "mobile" QB, and, though he has the ability and pocket presence to move around he is by no means an Aaron Rodgers-style QB.

The WC Offense under McAdoo and with Eli under center has to be adjusted. The ball comes out quicker and there's a supplementation of short, quick-routes to replace the traditional running game.

High completion % and all, this offense does not play to his strengths from what I've seen over 18 games. Eli is an extremely intelligent QB with a high football-IQ. His greatest strength is when he audibles and adjusts protection or changes the play from pass to run as he reads the defense.

I don't think Eli has decline by any drastic means in terms of his ability to throw a good ball and mentally "win" on any given play. So, to say he's running on fumes is wrong if you ask me.

What I would say is that Eli has been running on fumes from the exhaustion of having to get the ball out quickly knowing pressure is coming. He's running on fumes of a completely inept run-game that provides no need for the defense to maintain balance. He's running on fumes in that he has to do even MORE now to win games because teams know who is the playmaker on the offensive side of the ball.

Until McAdoo figures out and gets the offense rolling and in-sync, Eli will look like he's running on fumes.

It's not Eli. Give him time in the pocket and a decent running attack and watch him go.
He is the leader of not only the offense..  
EricJ : 9/18/2017 11:18 am : link
but the team. We know he is not a guy who leads by screaming at the rest of the offense but instead leads by example. It has been a while... time to step up and put the team on his back.... or at least the offense anyway.

I can tell you that as much as we love watching the dissension happening with the Cowboys, it will not take too long before our defense begins to point fingers at our offense.
I just don't see how you can fairly assess Eli  
That’s Gold, Jerry : 9/18/2017 11:23 am : link
considering the crap offensive line he has been given since 2012. I mean, he still threw for over 4,000 yards one year ago with 26 TDs and 16 INTs. That's still pretty good. Is it Eli's fault we have no running game or, until this year, no tight ends or really only one dominating receiver.

I think we are making a big mistake on criticism of Eli. I see him still the same as he always was. Eli showed up in last January's playoff game...I can't say that for others like OBJ or Cruz or Shepard.

We are in deep trouble because of the offensive line. Good God, can you imagine what Denver will do to us in a few weeks considering what they did to Dallas yesterday?
RE: Phil Simms always said  
EricJ : 9/18/2017 11:25 am : link
In comment 13601701 David B. said:
Quote:
People think Eli's "playing scared" -- I think that's BS. I also think that questioning his courage at this point is despicable. I think if he has a chance to make a play, he tries like hell to make it, and he'll still take the hit to make it. But with this OL, when they can't run, and the rush is in his face in less than 2.5 seconds -- the time, under which he releases a ball on a 3 step drop -- and there is NO CHANCE to make a play, he hits the deck to keep from getting killed.


It looks like he is making that decision that there is NO CHANCE a lot sooner than before. To me, this means he has lost confidence in the OL and not so much in himself. It also means he is quitting on the progressions before he has had a chance to go through them fully. OR.. he is looking for the shorter routes first because his window is closing before those longer routes are open.

So, I still think this is something that he has to deal with mentally. We know the OL is bad and that is not changing this season. What is Eli going to do to make this offense work?
I don't think there is really one single thing  
GiantFanInTX : 9/18/2017 11:40 am : link
you can point to. They're all causing issues. No one wants to admit that Eli is a problem, but he is. He is PART of it. Yes, the O line sucks, but he still needs to make plays and make accurate throws when he's given the time. He is still making some ugly throws.

That being said, the play calling and execution from the entire unit has been dreadful. Everyone knows our playbook. The receivers also need to get separation. A running game would also be nice.

It all starts up front though. That right side of the line is absolutely awful, and everyone knows it. Teams in this league are going to take advantage of it.
RE: I don't think there is really one single thing  
EricJ : 9/18/2017 11:46 am : link
In comment 13601891 GiantFanInTX said:
Quote:

That being said, the play calling and execution from the entire unit has been dreadful. Everyone knows our playbook.

Teams in this league are going to take advantage of it.


I can easily create a defensive game plan to beat the Giants. We may be one of the easiest teams to defend because we make it easy. It starts with the 11 personnel thing. Then, I see defenses using Eli's ability and willingness to quickly check out of the original play against us. In fact, I really wonder what percentage of our plays are run as called in the huddle vs being changed based upon what Eli sees from the defense. Then, how does that compare to other teams in the league.

Regarding this:  
David B. : 9/18/2017 11:58 am : link
Quote:
It looks like he is making that decision that there is NO CHANCE a lot sooner than before. To me, this means he has lost confidence in the OL and not so much in himself.


I certainly buy that. And when they're in his face before he can even set up, there IS NO CHANCE. And I'll give Eli the benefit of the doubt when deciding if there is no chance.

Quote:
It also means he is quitting on the progressions before he has had a chance to go through them fully. OR.. he is looking for the shorter routes first because his window is closing before those longer routes are open.


There are not many progressions on 3 step drop plays -- it's a timing play: 1-2-3 throw. And they're calling those 3 step drop plays so frequently NOT because it's a "WCO thing" but rather to help hide the OL's deficiencies -- they don't have to protect as long, and they're not even getting those blocked consistently.

I also don't buy the "square peg in a round WCO hole." Eli was very productive in McAdoo's offense in the first year McAdoo was OC -- the year the Defense couldn't stop anyone or hold a lead. The year he threw 6 TDs against NO, and the D let Brees throw 7. There were a lot of games where Eli did HIS job, and the D lost the games for them.

The difference is that the OL has regressed from there. There is NO EXCUSE for them not being able to run block, or for them getting confused on twists. They still can't run the ball to to the right, and they can barely run it to the left. And John Jerry is the main culprit. It's ridiculous a man his size can't run block. I'd get anyone else in there. It's not like he's protecting well on pass plays either.

Getting the ground game going to where they can run to even around 100 yards a game will fix 80% what's wrong here. It will keep defenses honest. It will allow for more diverse formations, more 5/7 step drop plays, play action -- all sorts of shit we didn't see in game one.
.  
arcarsenal : 9/18/2017 11:58 am : link
The Giants need to commit more to the run game. I know it sounds stupid given how inefficient we've been with it - but I think our playcalling pattern gets really predictable and is half the reason for the 3 and outs.

It seems like we often run on first down for little gain then go right to a pass play on 2nd down. If Eli gets sacked or the pass is incomplete, the drive usually fails right there because we don't convert the 3rd and long.

The Giants have to stick with the run game a bit more - holes will open up against these light fronts. We have to force teams to actually commit to defending the run somewhat otherwise our pass game is just never going to get going.
RE: .  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 12:02 pm : link
In comment 13601919 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
The Giants need to commit more to the run game. I know it sounds stupid given how inefficient we've been with it - but I think our playcalling pattern gets really predictable and is half the reason for the 3 and outs.

It seems like we often run on first down for little gain then go right to a pass play on 2nd down. If Eli gets sacked or the pass is incomplete, the drive usually fails right there because we don't convert the 3rd and long.

The Giants have to stick with the run game a bit more - holes will open up against these light fronts. We have to force teams to actually commit to defending the run somewhat otherwise our pass game is just never going to get going.


Unfortunately, committing to the run game has been yielding similar results of 3rd and long, as we often lose yards by our run plays getting blown up in the backfield.
Frankly, there's just not much that this offense actually does well...  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 12:03 pm : link
right now. At all.
.  
arcarsenal : 9/18/2017 12:06 pm : link
I don't feel like we ever really commit to running, though. We bail on it really quickly if a couple plays yield no gain. I think we have to just keep going at it a bit more and we'll start to hit on some gains. We get very one-dimensional very quickly.
I think in general  
Carson53 : 9/18/2017 12:14 pm : link
we will find out this season if he is running on "fumes".
We all realize the O Line is an issue, but the days of
many teams having very good or great offensive lines seems
to be over as well....I mean, look around the league,
you may be lucky to name more than a handful of good
offensive lines. The Raiders, Cowboys, Titans, and...
Eli is not athletic, can't extend plays, now it seems he
doesn't read thru his progressions as long as he use to.
After this season, they will have a better idea on him
moving forward.... I have a feeling this will be his last contract here though.
I am just trying to be a bit pragmatic here, when it comes to Eli. We know it's a touchy subject on BBI, regarding any discussion about him.
Eli is never going to be a scampering quarterback,  
SB 42 and 46 and ? : 9/18/2017 12:15 pm : link
but couldn't they at least move him more.

Take the snap from center and immediately roll out.

Couldn't he defeat a lot of the stunts and twists used against him if he weren't where he was supposed to be?
RE: .  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 9/18/2017 12:18 pm : link
In comment 13601940 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
I don't feel like we ever really commit to running, though. We bail on it really quickly if a couple plays yield no gain. I think we have to just keep going at it a bit more and we'll start to hit on some gains. We get very one-dimensional very quickly.


Arc, agreed. We abandon the run way too early & it makes us completely one dimensional. Perkins needs to hit those holders faster & harder when they're there.
RE: Also, the other thing about taking a dive vs. hanging in there longer,  
Gatorade Dunk : 9/18/2017 12:28 pm : link
In comment 13601683 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
is less INT's, which is by design I'm sure.

McAdoo has neutered Eli in that regard. Yeah, the turnovers are cut down, but we also aren't getting wow'd by any amazing throws in those situations, either.

It's not like the INTs have reduced to Rodgers-level, so it does beg the question of whether it's worth it. Eli is a gunslinger, and has been at his best when he's been able to play like one.

I have been fairly vocal that I believe that some of the blame does fall on Eli and not just the OL, but I'm willing to acknowledge that it's tough for any of us as fans to be able to tell where the responsibility/fault of one ends and the other begins. The same goes for Eli/Ben, IMO.

While it's fairly intuitive that Eli, as a natural gunslinger type, is not necessarily cut out for the WCO. Then again, Eli had two of his best seasons, statistically, when BMc was OC. Just like it's tough to tell entirely where the blame lies between the OL and Eli, it's also tough to determine where the breakdown falls between Eli and Ben.

All we really can do is hope that everything that comes out of NYG HQ isn't lip service and that this group has the creativity, talent and synergy to right the ship going forward.
RE: RE: .  
bigbluehoya : 9/18/2017 12:37 pm : link
In comment 13601959 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
In comment 13601940 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


I don't feel like we ever really commit to running, though. We bail on it really quickly if a couple plays yield no gain. I think we have to just keep going at it a bit more and we'll start to hit on some gains. We get very one-dimensional very quickly.



Arc, agreed. We abandon the run way too early & it makes us completely one dimensional. Perkins needs to hit those holders faster & harder when they're there.


Agree with this, but I think it goes deeper than sticking with it throughout the course of the game. From the outset of the game, they also need to show the defense that they are absolutely willing to run the ball on second and especially third down. Maybe that means running less on first down, I don't know exactly what the answer is.

It feels like every fan of every team complains about their play-calling being "predictable" when things aren't going well, but I do honestly think that it's been a little too easy to predict when NYG are passing/running, dating back to last year.


He's not running on fumes.  
Matt M. : 9/18/2017 12:51 pm : link
He's running an offense that has no semblance of balance, purpose or a plan. They seem to only rely on 1 read because of the OL, but that primary read is almost always a medium to deep/long developing route or a 2 yard pass. We have no real intermediate game to speak of, as the offense is being called. We got a TE to exploit the middle of the field and open things up, yet we never utilized him in this capacity last week. Call a better game, allow the running game to establish itself with the inclusion of the FB and Ellison and the play action will also come more into play.
He's running on fumes.....  
BillKo : 9/18/2017 1:31 pm : link
until he plays a good game, then he's the comeback kid and back where he belongs.

Makes for good reading.
RE: RE: Also, the other thing about taking a dive vs. hanging in there longer,  
Bill L : 9/18/2017 1:45 pm : link
In comment 13601973 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 13601683 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


is less INT's, which is by design I'm sure.

McAdoo has neutered Eli in that regard. Yeah, the turnovers are cut down, but we also aren't getting wow'd by any amazing throws in those situations, either.


It's not like the INTs have reduced to Rodgers-level, so it does beg the question of whether it's worth it. Eli is a gunslinger, and has been at his best when he's been able to play like one.

I have been fairly vocal that I believe that some of the blame does fall on Eli and not just the OL, but I'm willing to acknowledge that it's tough for any of us as fans to be able to tell where the responsibility/fault of one ends and the other begins. The same goes for Eli/Ben, IMO.

While it's fairly intuitive that Eli, as a natural gunslinger type, is not necessarily cut out for the WCO. Then again, Eli had two of his best seasons, statistically, when BMc was OC. Just like it's tough to tell entirely where the blame lies between the OL and Eli, it's also tough to determine where the breakdown falls between Eli and Ben.

All we really can do is hope that everything that comes out of NYG HQ isn't lip service and that this group has the creativity, talent and synergy to right the ship going forward.
i was thinking more of those sack fumbles than INT. Those always seemed to be real killers and where he always got tons of crap.
at some point Eli is the face of the franchise  
mdc1 : 9/18/2017 1:47 pm : link
and needs to step up as that leader instead of that "keep quiet and collect my money dude", he is paid handsomely for that. If he needs better protection, better OC, better HC he needs to do something about it. Although you could argue he is a player, he is the boss of most of those around him including our head coach. If this season's offense looks like last we should get rid of our head coach Macadoo as he is not a leader either as we found out in the playoffs.
RE: at some point Eli is the face of the franchise  
Bill L : 9/18/2017 1:53 pm : link
In comment 13602091 mdc1 said:
Quote:
and needs to step up as that leader instead of that "keep quiet and collect my money dude", he is paid handsomely for that. If he needs better protection, better OC, better HC he needs to do something about it. Although you could argue he is a player, he is the boss of most of those around him including our head coach. If this season's offense looks like last we should get rid of our head coach Macadoo as he is not a leader either as we found out in the playoffs.
for as long as he's been a Giant and even acknowledging his big contract (at the time he signed it), Eli has never ever seemed to me to be a "I'm just here to get paid" kind of guy.
Personally  
Jim in South Florida : 9/18/2017 1:54 pm : link
I sick of the Eli bashing, no quaterback can operate efficently behind the offensive line and running game he had last Sunday night.

Who would you like to put in the next game ? Geno ?
RE: RE: at some point Eli is the face of the franchise  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 1:57 pm : link
In comment 13602100 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 13602091 mdc1 said:


Quote:


and needs to step up as that leader instead of that "keep quiet and collect my money dude", he is paid handsomely for that. If he needs better protection, better OC, better HC he needs to do something about it. Although you could argue he is a player, he is the boss of most of those around him including our head coach. If this season's offense looks like last we should get rid of our head coach Macadoo as he is not a leader either as we found out in the playoffs.

for as long as he's been a Giant and even acknowledging his big contract (at the time he signed it), Eli has never ever seemed to me to be a "I'm just here to get paid" kind of guy.


From the article in the op:

Quote:
Manning doesn’t appear to fall into that category. He’s all-in on football and continues to be the first in the building and last to leave every day. He has been healthy, having never missed a start because of injury.
Two comments  
Rover : 9/18/2017 3:14 pm : link
1. It really is hard to attribute blame to Eli when the OL and running game are so poor. The Giants basically do 3 step drops exclusively.

2. I don't think Manning was all that good in 2016. The Giants D was awful then, so he was like Blaine Bortles-getting yards and stats in garbage time.
a few years ago  
PaulBlakeTSU : 9/18/2017 3:22 pm : link
when the Chiefs demolished the Patriots early in the season because the Chiefs D-LIne overwhelmed the Patriots O-line, everyone said that Tom was on the decline and that age had caught up to him, etc.

And then, Scarnecchia came back to coach the line, Belichick prepared his team better than any other team in the league, and suddenly Tom had time to throw. Suddenly, they got a running game going. And then wouldn't you know it? No one was questioning whether Tom was "cooked" or "running on fumes."

But hey, any article for a click.
It sure as heck looks like it.  
Flanker7 : 9/18/2017 3:50 pm : link
Nobody wanted to acknowledge it, but even last year you could tell something was "off". He can't "drive" throws like he used to.
RE: It sure as heck looks like it.  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 3:56 pm : link
In comment 13602290 Flanker7 said:
Quote:
Nobody wanted to acknowledge it, but even last year you could tell something was "off". He can't "drive" throws like he used to.


Yeah, well it's hard to drive throws when you can't step into them for fear of getting your leg snapped at the knees, as your own offensive teammate gets bulldozed back into you.
This is BSPN usual...  
Ed A. : 9/18/2017 4:02 pm : link
Giant hating BS. Take with a grain of salt. They love to show up Eli and the Giants.
The suck ass playcalling  
OC2.0 : 9/18/2017 6:16 pm : link
Isn't helping
RE: a few years ago  
Gatorade Dunk : 9/18/2017 6:22 pm : link
In comment 13602249 PaulBlakeTSU said:
Quote:
when the Chiefs demolished the Patriots early in the season because the Chiefs D-LIne overwhelmed the Patriots O-line, everyone said that Tom was on the decline and that age had caught up to him, etc.

And then, Scarnecchia came back to coach the line, Belichick prepared his team better than any other team in the league, and suddenly Tom had time to throw. Suddenly, they got a running game going. And then wouldn't you know it? No one was questioning whether Tom was "cooked" or "running on fumes."

But hey, any article for a click.

If Mouse McNally can be dragged out of retirement, I'm all for it.
McAdoo has been OC/HC for 3 years and has better players  
joe48 : 9/18/2017 7:26 pm : link
TC did not have the D McAdoo was given last year. Giants rode the back of the D to 11 wins last year. So far not impressed with McAdoo's offense which he brought to NY. He has done a poor job matching the offense to Eli. He will hear it from the fans tonight if the Giant's offense comes out and plays like they did against the Cowboys. He owns it !
94 TD's since 2014...  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 7:27 pm : link
good for 5th in the NFL, stat they just showed.

Washed up.
RE: The suck ass playcalling  
AnishPatel : 9/18/2017 7:31 pm : link
In comment 13602480 OC2.0 said:
Quote:
Isn't helping


What plays would you like to see?
RE: RE: RE: When was the last time  
montanagiant : 9/18/2017 7:53 pm : link
In comment 13601681 BrettNYG10 said:
Quote:
In comment 13601679 GMAN4LIFE said:


Quote:


In comment 13601674 BigBlueWhale said:


Quote:


he had a big game?



real good question

when was the last time he threw 4 tds in a game?



Last year against Philly on 11/6.

Holy shit if the WRs caught the balls that hit them in the hands vs GB in the playoffs last year he would have had a huge game
There's what happens when you hold the ball and try to make something  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 8:40 pm : link
happen with this line.
I've said everything in this article for years  
#10* : 9/19/2017 12:04 am : link
The Oline isn't getting better anytime soon (which is on Reese) so they need to look to tmrw instead of yesterday.
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