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O-Line and making a trade

Bramton1 : 9/18/2017 11:14 am
There has obviously been plenty of discussion both here and in the media about whether the Giants would try to trade a premium pick for an offensive lineman.

Going into tonight, I'm hoping for the best, but fearing the worst. So here's a question based on the worst case scenario.

The Giants are 0-3. The offensive line has continued to look awful, and the offense has not yet scored a touchdown. The calls to make a big trade for an offensive lineman have gotten quite loud, until the Giants organization comes out and says they they are not looking into making a trade.

Would you personally consider that to be conceding the season?
If the Giants are 0-3  
Jay on the Island : 9/18/2017 11:16 am : link
It would be a big mistake to trade an early pick for an offensive linemen. The Giants might find themselves in the range to get one of the top QB's in next years draft unless they are convinced that Webb is the long term answer.
RE: If the Giants are 0-3  
Bramton1 : 9/18/2017 11:19 am : link
In comment 13601854 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
It would be a big mistake to trade an early pick for an offensive linemen. The Giants might find themselves in the range to get one of the top QB's in next years draft unless they are convinced that Webb is the long term answer.


So before the season people were talking this team as a Super Bowl contender, but after three games you would want to Suck for Sam (and no, they aren't going to abandon Webb this quickly)? How about after 2 games?
If the Giants find themselves in position for a top quarterback  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 11:21 am : link
in the draft, and they actually take one, then what does that say about wasting yet another 3rd round premium pick on a quarterback just this past draft?
or the flip side  
Rocky369 : 9/18/2017 11:25 am : link
because the Giants drafted Webb this past draft, I do not see them using a top pick on a QB for the next 2 years, at least.
we should trade a late round pick for Adrian Peterson  
djm : 9/18/2017 11:29 am : link
..we aren't getting a live bodied OL this time of year. Teams aren't trading that guy. There's a vet RB who knows how to run for 4 when 4 is needed and he's on the bench stewing in New Orleans. If he can be had the Giants should be on the phone.
RE: If the Giants find themselves in position for a top quarterback  
djm : 9/18/2017 11:31 am : link
In comment 13601864 Britt in VA said:
[quote] in the draft, and they actually take one, then what does that say about wasting yet another 3rd round premium pick on a quarterback just this past draft? [/quote

If the Giants have a shot at a franchise QB in 2018 and they pass because of a late 3rd round pick in 2017 then the entire staff should be fired.

You never pass on a franchise QB unless you have on who is in his prime. If we suck bad enough to pick a big time QB i'd think it's safe to say the QB was part of the problem this season. Even if he wasn't, i'd take one.
If there is a highly desirable QB on the Board  
Jay in Toronto : 9/18/2017 11:31 am : link
and the Giants decide Webb is at least as good, their pick would be quite valuable, I imagine.
There is no trade market for a top OL right now  
Mike from Ohio : 9/18/2017 11:31 am : link
Joe Thomas won't fit under our salary cap. So are you asking if not making a trade that can't happen is conceding the season?
If we are 0-3 it probably means  
Carl in CT : 9/18/2017 11:39 am : link
We will get a top 10 pick or earlier and a premier LT or QB will be the pick.
Sorry if a top QB is there you take him  
Carl in CT : 9/18/2017 11:41 am : link
Forget Webb. - Ernie Acorsi.
I agree that you actually would take the Quarterback....  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 11:42 am : link
that said, I think it's an indictment of the front office that we had a season bad enough to be in position to do it, A., and B. that they didn't foresee it coming, so much so that they felt they could just burn a 3rd round pick on a project QB going into this season.
it would be an indictment, I should have said.  
Britt in VA : 9/18/2017 11:43 am : link
.
RE: RE: If the Giants are 0-3  
Jay on the Island : 9/18/2017 11:45 am : link
In comment 13601859 Bramton1 said:
Quote:
In comment 13601854 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


It would be a big mistake to trade an early pick for an offensive linemen. The Giants might find themselves in the range to get one of the top QB's in next years draft unless they are convinced that Webb is the long term answer.



So before the season people were talking this team as a Super Bowl contender, but after three games you would want to Suck for Sam (and no, they aren't going to abandon Webb this quickly)? How about after 2 games?

For fucks sake I wasn't saying to throw in the towel. I said they MIGHT find themselves in the range to get an heir to Eli. Yes let's panic and give up a 1st or 2nd round pick for Joe Staley or another aging offensive linemen on a huge contract like Brown because that's what successful franchises do.
No, it's just three games  
JonC : 9/18/2017 11:46 am : link
but could be an indicator this team isn't going anywhere this season.

If we're picking high next April, I wouldn't pass on a blue chip QB because Webb is tucked away on the roster.
Despite his poor showing so far  
Jay on the Island : 9/18/2017 11:46 am : link
I would still like to see the Giants take a chance on Josh Allen if available.
RE: There is no trade market for a top OL right now  
TyreeHelmet : 9/18/2017 11:47 am : link
In comment 13601879 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
Joe Thomas won't fit under our salary cap. So are you asking if not making a trade that can't happen is conceding the season?


This is beyond a long shot, but they could make it work under the cap. If there's any chance to get Joe Thomas, you do it. He could easily be an all pro for the next 3-4 seasons and on a very reasonable contract. I would happily give up a 2nd round pick for him.
RE: RE: There is no trade market for a top OL right now  
Vanzetti : 9/18/2017 11:52 am : link
In comment 13601904 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
In comment 13601879 Mike from Ohio said:


Quote:


Joe Thomas won't fit under our salary cap. So are you asking if not making a trade that can't happen is conceding the season?



This is beyond a long shot, but they could make it work under the cap. If there's any chance to get Joe Thomas, you do it. He could easily be an all pro for the next 3-4 seasons and on a very reasonable contract. I would happily give up a 2nd round pick for him.


He can fit under the cap. You just have to cut or trade a guy or two.
The chances of a trade  
JonC : 9/18/2017 11:57 am : link
are very low.
trades do not happen now  
micky : 9/18/2017 12:06 pm : link
plus giants will never give up a high draft choice for a ol
It should be a great  
ryanmkeane : 9/18/2017 12:10 pm : link
OL class coming out.
RB should've been taken in 3rd round instead of QB  
Earl the goat : 9/18/2017 12:23 pm : link
Donta Foreman would've been nice
RE: RB should've been taken in 3rd round instead of QB  
Sonic Youth : 9/18/2017 12:32 pm : link
In comment 13601968 Earl the goat said:
Quote:
Donta Foreman would've been nice
Was about to post this. Foreman should have been the pick there, not Webb.
Who do you trust to make that  
TMS : 9/18/2017 12:34 pm : link
talent evaluation in our 'consensus" front office ? ELI has needed an OL since the last SB and look at the results . We have had a gem in ELI but he always need a OL just like his brother (and Brady) as a drop back pocket passer. The reasons are obviously that we need a TALENT evaluator in that area.
RE: If the Giants find themselves in position for a top quarterback  
jeff57 : 9/18/2017 12:35 pm : link
In comment 13601864 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
in the draft, and they actually take one, then what does that say about wasting yet another 3rd round premium pick on a quarterback just this past draft?


That they didn't anticipate being in such a position.
Well  
Reale01 : 9/18/2017 1:05 pm : link
Here's the thing, for all intensive purposes, my thing is, after careful consideration, when you really think about it, the most obvious conclusion, all things considered, in my opinion, based on the information we have before us, the only logical conclusion is ...

inescapable.
Saints and Colts  
old man : 9/18/2017 1:06 pm : link
Look like they are going nowhere. They have anybody we can get?
So many OLs seem to suck already this year that unless we really crap out to 2-14+/- we'll still only get the 3rd best OL in the draft at best.
Maybe FA will provide a player or 2(that's not our own FA).



RE: If the Giants find themselves in position for a top quarterback  
Gatorade Dunk : 9/18/2017 1:08 pm : link
In comment 13601864 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
in the draft, and they actually take one, then what does that say about wasting yet another 3rd round premium pick on a quarterback just this past draft?

Since when is 3rd round a "premium pick"?

And that's not to say that I would want the Giants to follow up the Webb pick with a 1st round QB just a year later, but calling the 3rd round a "premium pick" seems to be working a little too hard to shape a narrative.
Draft QB  
PaulN : 9/18/2017 1:18 pm : link
If the season is a failure, no doubt, then you trade Eli and make Webb the backup, if Webb is that good but not as good as the draft pick, you trade him in a couple of years and get a backup QB. Good QB's are always worth accumulating.
RE: Well  
Gatorade Dunk : 9/18/2017 1:27 pm : link
In comment 13602028 Reale01 said:
Quote:
Here's the thing, for all intensive purposes, my thing is, after careful consideration, when you really think about it, the most obvious conclusion, all things considered, in my opinion, based on the information we have before us, the only logical conclusion is ...

inescapable.

You lost me at "intensive purposes"
You have to have a trade partner, what team will give up a top tier  
SterlingArcher : 9/18/2017 1:36 pm : link
olineman when they seem to be at a premium?
RE: we should trade a late round pick for Adrian Peterson  
clatterbuck : 9/18/2017 2:43 pm : link
In comment 13601876 djm said:
Quote:
..we aren't getting a live bodied OL this time of year. Teams aren't trading that guy. There's a vet RB who knows how to run for 4 when 4 is needed and he's on the bench stewing in New Orleans. If he can be had the Giants should be on the phone.


Why trade for a fading Peterson, especially if you're going to run him behind a problematic O-line?
Bob Papa  
antdog24 : 9/18/2017 2:48 pm : link
made a great point this morning on the opening drive. Who has extra starting linemen that they can just trade one away? Almost all of the teams are struggling on the offensive line and that's with their starters, if they had better players as depth they sure as hell aren't trading them either. It's a pipe dream.
RE: I agree that you actually would take the Quarterback....  
djm : 9/18/2017 3:18 pm : link
In comment 13601896 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
that said, I think it's an indictment of the front office that we had a season bad enough to be in position to do it, A., and B. that they didn't foresee it coming, so much so that they felt they could just burn a 3rd round pick on a project QB going into this season.


Honestly we are getting way ahead of ourselves. The Giants aren't losing 10-11 games this season.
RE: If the Giants are 0-3  
DelZotto : 9/18/2017 3:57 pm : link
In comment 13601854 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
It would be a big mistake to trade an early pick for an offensive linemen. The Giants might find themselves in the range to get one of the top QB's in next years draft unless they are convinced that Webb is the long term answer.


Rymzack and Bolles are already better than our LT, we needed another small TE like we needed a hole in the head.
Elway gets it  
DelZotto : 9/18/2017 4:00 pm : link
He rebuilt his OL in one off season, and they exposed the Boys to what they thought they were.
0-1  
joeinpa : 9/18/2017 4:26 pm : link
Home opener in a few hours, a team that had almost everyone thinking they ll be a contender; and now we are contemplating an 0-3 start and a high draft pick

Fans have every right to overreact to the last set of circumstances they ve see in regard to their team, it s what we do.

But really hard to understand that line of thinking a few hours removed from a pretty important game.
RE: RE: Well  
Reale01 : 9/18/2017 4:34 pm : link
In comment 13602070 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 13602028 Reale01 said:


Quote:


Here's the thing, for all intensive purposes, my thing is, after careful consideration, when you really think about it, the most obvious conclusion, all things considered, in my opinion, based on the information we have before us, the only logical conclusion is ...

inescapable.


You lost me at "intensive purposes"


To be absolutely and crystal clear, it is evident that when it comes right down to it, at the end of the day, it was an apparently ill-conceived attempt at, dare I say, humor.
RE: If the Giants find themselves in position for a top quarterback  
Mr. Nickels : 9/18/2017 6:51 pm : link
In comment 13601864 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
in the draft, and they actually take one, then what does that say about wasting yet another 3rd round premium pick on a quarterback just this past draft?


It says we're the browns
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