Coach Ben McAdoo: Cannot Understand All The...

That's it - that's all that separates a fan base an it's love for an acerbic coach that has sarcastic quips to every question when he meets the press, versus 'I can't stand the way this fucking guy baits the press' when things are going wrong.

The good news for McAdoo is people have short memories - start winning, and this will all dissipate quickly. The bad news is time is moving quickly and the chances of a quick turnaround aren't very promising.

a new GM, new coach, and to get rid of our best player. Sounds like a fullproof plan to me.

were garbage before McAdoo, but since became HC the Giants offense has been one of the worst in the NFL. The main argument to keep McAdoo was continuity on offense with Eli.

How is that working out?

He sold them a bill of goods about this WCO. Do not need to upgrade the OL etc. It is not working 3 years later and he is too arrogant and stubborn to make adjustments or maybe he doesn't know how. This is a guy who never had a coordinator position before the Giants hired him. It will be interesting to see if he makes any adjustments against the Eagles.
People say that we had a great offense in 2015 but the numbers were skewed because points were scored in garbage time. Even last year the defense masked the inept offense that can't score more than 20 points a game.

It's how the Giants are losing. Some of us have been expressing consternation since early last season about the obvious failings of McAdoo as an offensive coach (historically poor results and inexplicably running 11 personnel all the time). It's only two games but after substantial upgrades at WR and TE and upgrades at RB, McAdoo's offense is actually getting worse and he isn't making any adjustments. Teams having been whooping the Giants with vanilla two high safety defenses with defenders clearly knowing the routes and at times the plays McAdoo is calling. The offense is pathetic.

McAdoo's also been tossing Eli under the bus with public comments in the media. McAdoo is arrogant and failing. Not a recipe for success. McAdoo's problem isn't impetuous fair weather fans, McAdoo's problem is that he isn't a good offensive football coach.

The Wilpons and Dolan will be buying the Giants

Matt Harvey will replace Eli at QB
Carmelo Anthony will replace Odell at WR

In comment 13607924 trueblueinpw said:

Quote:

It's how the Giants are losing. Some of us have been expressing consternation since early last season about the obvious failings of McAdoo as an offensive coach (historically poor results and inexplicably running 11 personnel all the time). It's only two games but after substantial upgrades at WR and TE and upgrades at RB, McAdoo's offense is actually getting worse and he isn't making any adjustments. Teams having been whooping the Giants with vanilla two high safety defenses with defenders clearly knowing the routes and at times the plays McAdoo is calling. The offense is pathetic. McAdoo's also been tossing Eli under the bus with public comments in the media. McAdoo is arrogant and failing. Not a recipe for success. McAdoo's problem isn't impetuous fair weather fans, McAdoo's problem is that he isn't a good offensive football coach.

Your words:

"It's only two games but after substantial upgrades at WR and TE and upgrades at RB, McAdoo's offense is actually getting worse and he isn't making any adjustments."

My words:

Jerry Reese never learned a fundamental personnel lesson: the performance of wide receivers, tight ends and running backs is more dependent on the offensive line than vice-versa.

We want to see some balance. The defense needing fixing. After watching crap defense for a few years Jerry had no choice to fixit and it didn't take Him long to do it. What drives everyone crazy is that over a six year period he has not been able to systematically revamp the offensive line that needed to be retooled after 2011.

Think about it. Over a six year period he couldn't find one left tackle other then a Will Beaty who was probably more suited to play right tackle. Then he gave him that huge contract to boot. Then there was his disdain for finding a competent tighend. They say you build and retool things over time. He retooled the defense in one field swoop. But yet he mind numbingly over a six year period and stubbornly tried to fix the offense with duct tape and glue. That's why the fan base has so much distrust and dislike for Jerry Reese.

a big part is how the Giants are losing. When the team decided to fire the two time champion head coach TC I thought it might be a good idea to blow up the staff and start fresh. The Giants decided to promote the "genius" McAdoo to keep continuity on offense for Eli'S last seasons.

As of now that plan has failed miserably. Under this coach the Giants are the worst offense in the NFL.

It's hard to evaluate Reese. I'm not a huge fan of JR but mostly because he seems so thoroughly unlikeable in the rare times he appears in the media (I'm thinking of how he managed to shit on TC at TCs retirement presser).

On the other hand, he's won two SBs as GM and that's two more SB than most other NFL GMs can claim. He's had some good and even great drafts - sure the injuries and whiffs exist as well but no one hits on the draft all the time. I think an objective evaluation would put Reese among the very best GMs in the NFL.

But even if you make a solid case against Reese, can you really say that McAdoo is getting the most out of the offensive talent? I can't. Even with a suspect O line, which includes Pugh and Richburg who are good NFL players along with some JAGs, there's serious talent at the other skill positions. I think the problem with the offense is poor coaching and pathetically inept game planning and play calling.

Reminds me of the defense of Coughlin s last two seasons, non-competitive. That s on MacAdoo

In comment 13607913 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

a new GM, new coach, and to get rid of our best player. Sounds like a fullproof plan to me.

Have people really been talking about trading/cutting Beckham?

In comment 13607942 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

In comment 13607913 UConn4523 said: Quote: a new GM, new coach, and to get rid of our best player. Sounds like a fullproof plan to me. Not cutting, but definitely trading. There's and active thread on that now and there were multiple threads per week on it during the offseason. Have people really been talking about trading/cutting Beckham?

messed he spacing up on that response

My two biggest concerns are the players regressing rather than showing at least some improvement.
And the overall evaluation of talent not just the players but the coaching is suspect at best.

The LT position has been an issue for years and honestly we haven’t had one since Diehl IMO. Will Beatty was not a good LT but yet we drafted him as such same with Flowers.
In addition I know Solari came in with a solid reputation but how does an entire O-line regress in two years rather than show some signs of improvement or at the very least stay the same mediocre line?

I can’t help but to think if Flaherty was still here the sky would not be falling for most Giant fans.
The guy was a heck of a coach.

They can’t get off the field they can’t stop the run or tackle well so far this year and they clearly miss Hankins and are playing with rookie middle linebackers and the free safety What’s his name mr interceptor hasn’t done shit and so far is a liability.......the defense is letting the other team out to the 50 where they punt and the Giants are starting drives at the 10 yard line and then the coaches unwillingness to through downfield is all compounded with the Oline inability to block consistently ..... this problem is team wide!!!

In comment 13607955 NikkiMac said:

Quote:

They can’t get off the field they can’t stop the run or tackle well so far this year and they clearly miss Hankins and are playing with rookie middle linebackers and the free safety What’s his name mr interceptor hasn’t done shit and so far is a liability.......the defense is letting the other team out to the 50 where they punt and the Giants are starting drives at the 10 yard line and then the coaches unwillingness to through downfield is all compounded with the Oline inability to block consistently ..... this problem is team wide!!!

You couldn't be more wrong. The defense played very well week 1 and without their best CB and LBer they kept us in the game against Detroit but where constantly put in bad field position. What more can they realistically do? Tomlinson was making plays on Sunday, Hankins is an afterthought.

weren't going 3 and out 46% (actual number) of the time in the last 8 games under McAdoo.

In comment 13607924 trueblueinpw said:

Quote:

It's how the Giants are losing. Some of us have been expressing consternation since early last season about the obvious failings of McAdoo as an offensive coach (historically poor results and inexplicably running 11 personnel all the time). It's only two games but after substantial upgrades at WR and TE and upgrades at RB, McAdoo's offense is actually getting worse and he isn't making any adjustments. Teams having been whooping the Giants with vanilla two high safety defenses with defenders clearly knowing the routes and at times the plays McAdoo is calling. The offense is pathetic. McAdoo's also been tossing Eli under the bus with public comments in the media. McAdoo is arrogant and failing. Not a recipe for success. McAdoo's problem isn't impetuous fair weather fans, McAdoo's problem is that he isn't a good offensive football coach.

Agreed, Carl Banks said the giants are a "get right" team right now, in other words the giants offense is so terrible that their defenses "get right" against them. The giants are simply unable to attack an opposing D's weaknesses at all...depressing. But let's just keep doing what we are doing and keep saying "we need to get better, etc." Insanity.

In comment 13607958 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

weren't going 3 and out 46% (actual number) of the time in the last 8 games under McAdoo.

The stats damning McAdoo's pathetic offense are breath taking and mounting. We know McAdoos offense is at 8 straight games under 20 points; unless I misunderstood, Papa was saying on the radio that the next teams with consecutive games under 20 points was 2 games. The offense is historically bad.

OL first - where's the evidence of this?

Hell, the two SB champions we had recently weren't built like that either.

The problem isn't putting more focus on the OL instead of WR/DE/etc. - it's that what we have invested on the OL has failed miserably. Reese's problem isn't architectural - he spent two #1s and a #2 on that line, and they're not very good (and one of them is flat out awful despite being a top ten pick).

It's not the losing...
trueblueinpw : 7:53 am : link : reply
It's how the Giants are losing.

I agree.....this offense should be better than it is....



Some of us have been expressing consternation since early last season about the obvious failings of McAdoo as an offensive coach (historically poor results and inexplicably running 11 personnel all the time). It's only two games but after substantial upgrades at WR and TE and upgrades at RB, McAdoo's offense is actually getting worse and he isn't making any adjustments.

Well, substantial upgrades? That is questionable.....Marshall? How much of an upgrade has he been over Cruz? Double E? He is a rookie, and he is playing like one, thus far....many expected much more from him....he will get better as the season progresses, but to expect it right out of the gate is foolhardy.....Perkins/Gallman/Darkwa/Vereen? Who would be a starter on another team? OL additions? Can't even crack the starting lineup, which is pathetic......Subtract OBj from the equation, and what do you expect? But Mac is not really utilizing what he has.....He has to do a better job....




Teams having been whooping the Giants with vanilla two high safety defenses with defenders clearly knowing the routes and at times the plays McAdoo is calling. The offense is pathetic.

True....with 7 back there, an we are running short routes, which bunches the defense together, meaning when a pass is caught, the receiver is immediately tackled for no yac.....resulting in a lot of third down completions for no first downs.....he has to stretch the defense, or commit to a 2 TE offense/with FB, with Eli under center, and either run it, or use play action off if it......but the OL, TE's and FB have to block better.....break a few runs, and then Play action comes into play....




McAdoo's also been tossing Eli under the bus with public comments in the media. McAdoo is arrogant and failing. Not a recipe for success. McAdoo's problem isn't impetuous fair weather fans, McAdoo's problem is that he isn't a good offensive football coach.

Yes, with lack of experience, his main selling point was his continuing transition of the offense with Eli, after the first year......but we have not seen any growth in the offense after the first year....he does not look like he is capable of making adjustments to the defenses thrown at him, especially the two deep safety defense.....that is very telling.....

In comment 13607969 jcn56 said:

Quote:

OL first - where's the evidence of this? Hell, the two SB champions we had recently weren't built like that either. The problem isn't putting more focus on the OL instead of WR/DE/etc. - it's that what we have invested on the OL has failed miserably. Reese's problem isn't architectural - he spent two #1s and a #2 on that line, and they're not very good (and one of them is flat out awful despite being a top ten pick).

Our first Superbowl team was absolutely built on that philosophy.

The first thing Coughlin said in his introductory press conference was getting back to "Giants Football" and "controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball".

Within his first year of being here we added Snee, O'hara, and McKenzie, and already had Diehl and Suebert, and then Jacobs and Bradshaw. We have a major power running game and inflicted our will on other teams from the LOS.

We had two RB's go for 1000 yards each in 2008.

it is not 13 points in 2 games bad. These are the seasons that get coaches canned and QB's released if things do not get turned around.

In comment 13607969 jcn56 said:

Quote:

OL first - where's the evidence of this? Hell, the two SB champions we had recently weren't built like that either. The problem isn't putting more focus on the OL instead of WR/DE/etc. - it's that what we have invested on the OL has failed miserably. Reese's problem isn't architectural - he spent two #1s and a #2 on that line, and they're not very good (and one of them is flat out awful despite being a top ten pick).

Like Britt said....2007 was built around an OL and DL. 2011 was a gift from the football gods and Eli. That might have been one of the worst teams to ever win a Superbowl.

If your are gonna have a bad OL....you need a QB that can run like hell.

Losing doesn't help matters.

both deserve some blame for the current state of the team.

McAdoo can be doing more to mask the weaknesses of our offensive tackles. how about running more two tight end sets so that we can have extra blockers for manning who at this stage in his career cannot move around like he did in his prime? why does he run so many 5 wide and 4 wide formations that leave manning vulnerable? his orthodoxy to s system and failure to adapt personnel sets and playcalling for the reality of the strengths and weaknesses of his talent is a major weakness.

on top of being inflexible with his system, he doesn't hold his players accountable for poor performance and make changes when needed. flowers needs a break or a position switch as he can't handle left tackle at the moment. top ten pick or not, he is a weak link. even if wheeler is raw, how much worse can he be than flowers is today?

but if I was the coach, I would go to the GM and tell him to get me a couple of offensive linemen in the off season. I don't care how you get them or how much you pay them, just get them.

McAdoo has his hand in this also. To take a bad OL and just hope they'll get better had to be a mutual decision between Reese and McAdoo.

I actually love how macadoo treats the press.

1) Why can't people question McAdoo and his ability to coach? We were 11-5 last year because of our defense. The Offense was pathetic in many wins (both Dallas games, the Saints game, Ravens and Lions) and has now strung together quite the stretch of offensive ineptitude. His demeanor in press conferences is annoying because it seems FAKE, copy cat almost. You are no BB and do not have his resume (The guy had multiple SB appearances as a DC long before multiple appearances and wins as a HC).

2) I am starting to see a pattern where he does seem like he is throwing ELI under the bus. Not completely but subtly jabs here and there that seem like he has an issue with Eli. Go back to a year ago where he said Eli has to be able to throw from a dirty pocket (meaning guys around him, near his feet etc.) and not all pass plays can be blocked out perfectly. That to me says Eli isn't the kind of QB he likes in his system (he is no Aaron Rodgers, no Wilson, No Winston, Newton etc) as he has very limited mobility. I feel like the stubborn comments about the Oline not as bad as people say is more a comment about ELI not being able to help them by avoiding the rush and throwing on the run. It is almost like he is letting off frustration at being saddled with a QB who he doesn't see in his offense and especially long term.

I truly believe we are seeing the end of ELI in NY or the end of McAdoo as coach. I don't see both being here next year!

In comment 13608014 jvm52106 said:

Quote:

1) Why can't people question McAdoo and his ability to coach? We were 11-5 last year because of our defense. The Offense was pathetic in many wins (both Dallas games, the Saints game, Ravens and Lions) and has now strung together quite the stretch of offensive ineptitude. His demeanor in press conferences is annoying because it seems FAKE, copy cat almost. You are no BB and do not have his resume (The guy had multiple SB appearances as a DC long before multiple appearances and wins as a HC). 2) I am starting to see a pattern where he does seem like he is throwing ELI under the bus. Not completely but subtly jabs here and there that seem like he has an issue with Eli. Go back to a year ago where he said Eli has to be able to throw from a dirty pocket (meaning guys around him, near his feet etc.) and not all pass plays can be blocked out perfectly. That to me says Eli isn't the kind of QB he likes in his system (he is no Aaron Rodgers, no Wilson, No Winston, Newton etc) as he has very limited mobility. I feel like the stubborn comments about the Oline not as bad as people say is more a comment about ELI not being able to help them by avoiding the rush and throwing on the run. It is almost like he is letting off frustration at being saddled with a QB who he doesn't see in his offense and especially long term. I truly believe we are seeing the end of ELI in NY or the end of McAdoo as coach. I don't see both being here next year!

I agree with you completely, and based on that, it makes me believe that McAdoo sold Mara and/or Reese a false bill of goods, because I'm absolutely sure they asked him if Eli could be the guy in his system, and that he would be finishing out his contract (that he had just signed), and his final years, here.

In comment 13608020 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

In comment 13608014 jvm52106 said: Quote: 1) Why can't people question McAdoo and his ability to coach? We were 11-5 last year because of our defense. The Offense was pathetic in many wins (both Dallas games, the Saints game, Ravens and Lions) and has now strung together quite the stretch of offensive ineptitude. His demeanor in press conferences is annoying because it seems FAKE, copy cat almost. You are no BB and do not have his resume (The guy had multiple SB appearances as a DC long before multiple appearances and wins as a HC). 2) I am starting to see a pattern where he does seem like he is throwing ELI under the bus. Not completely but subtly jabs here and there that seem like he has an issue with Eli. Go back to a year ago where he said Eli has to be able to throw from a dirty pocket (meaning guys around him, near his feet etc.) and not all pass plays can be blocked out perfectly. That to me says Eli isn't the kind of QB he likes in his system (he is no Aaron Rodgers, no Wilson, No Winston, Newton etc) as he has very limited mobility. I feel like the stubborn comments about the Oline not as bad as people say is more a comment about ELI not being able to help them by avoiding the rush and throwing on the run. It is almost like he is letting off frustration at being saddled with a QB who he doesn't see in his offense and especially long term. I truly believe we are seeing the end of ELI in NY or the end of McAdoo as coach. I don't see both being here next year! I agree with you completely, and based on that, it makes me believe that McAdoo sold Mara and/or Reese a false bill of goods, because I'm absolutely sure they asked him if Eli could be the guy in his system, and that he would be finishing out his contract (that he had just signed), and his final years, here.

Makes one wonder what that last year, year and half was like for TC with McAdoo there.. Sure seems like B.McAdoo has changed a bit now that he has the control.

In comment 13607913 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

a new GM, new coach, and to get rid of our best player. Sounds like a fullproof plan to me.

fool proof

Win championship = We have the best coach in the sport

Don't Win Championship = Coach needs to be fired

yet the coaching staff continues to trot out the same lineup. Its not just the two games this season, it also sucked most of last season. After a while its nuts. I agree with giving things a chance, but after multiple failures you need to change things up and find a solution. Continuing to send out this starting 5 is insanity.

I'm not saying the OL needs to be the best, just be adequate. Right now the league, the players, the press/analysts/media, and the fans all see it sucks. When will the coaching staff stop being so stubborn.

In comment 13608057 PatersonPlank said:

Quote:

yet the coaching staff continues to trot out the same lineup. Its not just the two games this season, it also sucked most of last season. After a while its nuts. I agree with giving things a chance, but after multiple failures you need to change things up and find a solution. Continuing to send out this starting 5 is insanity. I'm not saying the OL needs to be the best, just be adequate. Right now the league, the players, the press/analysts/media, and the fans all see it sucks. When will the coaching staff stop being so stubborn.

Bingo.

All we heard all camp is how Flowers looked horrible. It's now translating to games, and getting the offense and Eli in trouble.

A good coach stays patient sometimes, but also has to know when to make a move and realize a player just isnt't the right fit.

Flowers needs to be moved somewhere away from LT, whether that's the other side or the bench.

Especially since he is the architect of the Offense and the play caller?

In comment 13607980 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

In comment 13607969 jcn56 said: Quote: OL first - where's the evidence of this? Hell, the two SB champions we had recently weren't built like that either. The problem isn't putting more focus on the OL instead of WR/DE/etc. - it's that what we have invested on the OL has failed miserably. Reese's problem isn't architectural - he spent two #1s and a #2 on that line, and they're not very good (and one of them is flat out awful despite being a top ten pick). Our first Superbowl team was absolutely built on that philosophy. The first thing Coughlin said in his introductory press conference was getting back to "Giants Football" and "controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball". Within his first year of being here we added Snee, O'hara, and McKenzie, and already had Diehl and Suebert, and then Jacobs and Bradshaw. We have a major power running game and inflicted our will on other teams from the LOS. We had two RB's go for 1000 yards each in 2008.

And he's building the same thing in JAX right now.

I can't understand how they can replace a couple guys on defense and go from one of the worst defenses to number two, and yet not think just once..hey maybe we can add two legit guys to the offensive line to protect the QB and see if it helps that side of the team. Everyone been screaming about flowers .. you had to think ok maybe we should get someone in free agency for this guy to learn from and can take over as needed and maybe we should think about not putting players that are undrafted or off another team scrap pile as starters when they obviously arnt cutting it. Ben and Jerry both are supposed to get the team in a position to win, one refuses to give up play calling because other coaches told him he should hold on to doing it, and the other seems afraid to admit that a number round one draft pick isn't doing his job and he hasn t made a move to get real protection for QB. Starting to think they both just want to get rid of Eli at this point, because they are pointing the finger a lot at him more then themselves.

The problem is that the current personnel cannot run this particular offense. The line cannot block or protect and the QB is both skittish and incredibly immobile. Doesn't matter if you have 3 All-Pro receivers if there is no time to set up and pass and no ability by the QB to avoid the rush. Add in the absence of a quality RB and you have the product we have seen for 1+ years now on the field.

In comment 13608091 WillVAB said:

Quote:

In comment 13607980 Britt in VA said: Quote: In comment 13607969 jcn56 said: Quote: OL first - where's the evidence of this? Hell, the two SB champions we had recently weren't built like that either. The problem isn't putting more focus on the OL instead of WR/DE/etc. - it's that what we have invested on the OL has failed miserably. Reese's problem isn't architectural - he spent two #1s and a #2 on that line, and they're not very good (and one of them is flat out awful despite being a top ten pick). Our first Superbowl team was absolutely built on that philosophy. The first thing Coughlin said in his introductory press conference was getting back to "Giants Football" and "controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball". Within his first year of being here we added Snee, O'hara, and McKenzie, and already had Diehl and Suebert, and then Jacobs and Bradshaw. We have a major power running game and inflicted our will on other teams from the LOS. We had two RB's go for 1000 yards each in 2008. And he's building the same thing in JAX right now.

He did it there the first time too.

2nd pick in the 1995 NFL Draft (first draft pick ever for the Jax franchise, Tom Coughlin the GM and Head Coach): Tony Bosselli.

In comment 13607986 AnnapolisMike said:

Quote:

In comment 13607969 jcn56 said: Quote: OL first - where's the evidence of this? Hell, the two SB champions we had recently weren't built like that either. The problem isn't putting more focus on the OL instead of WR/DE/etc. - it's that what we have invested on the OL has failed miserably. Reese's problem isn't architectural - he spent two #1s and a #2 on that line, and they're not very good (and one of them is flat out awful despite being a top ten pick). Like Britt said....2007 was built around an OL and DL. 2011 was a gift from the football gods and Eli. That might have been one of the worst teams to ever win a Superbowl. If your are gonna have a bad OL....you need a QB that can run like hell.

This team is still built the same way at DL. As far as the OL in 07 - the only significant resource spent on that line was the cash to acquire KM at RT. Otherwise, O'Hara was a mid-tier signing from the Browns in 04. Seubert an undrafted FA. Diehl? A 5th round pick. Snee, a 2nd rounder.

They all played well, don't get me wrong. But they weren't the Hogs. They were a good, not great OL. And they didn't represent some fundamental difference in investing in or building a team. The major different - they picked better players, even if they were picked later or for less money.

Solari was supposed to be another genius. The OL has gotten worse after 3 years together. Now he is publicly throwing Eli under the bus. Maybe Reese and McAdoo want Eli out and that is why Webb was drafted in the 3rd round. Remember neither Reese nor McAdoo hired Eli. McAdoo has Eli in a system where he is bound to fail.

I am a Ben M fan but all this shit for a 2nd year coach with god awful talent on the OL isn't his fault. Like I said before you're not making chicken salad with fucking tofu! I can't imagine the thought process of him right now knowing, that you're OL is that god awful and knowing you can't do anything to fix it because they are all bad as a unit.

You can't run block and pass block. That's game, set, match. You can't scheme for that and actually win games.

In comment 13607929 Earl the goat said:

Quote:

The Wilpons and Dolan will be buying the Giants Matt Harvey will replace Eli at QB Carmelo Anthony will replace Odell at WR

This could work Melo finds a sport where he catches a pass & doesn't have to pass it again!

When he was injured they should have found another vet Flowers was not ready three years later he is a bust we still
have John Jerry starting everyone and there brother says you
don't draft Guards high because there easy to come by .
You take Bobby Hart who most pun-dents thought could work his way into a serviceable guard not a tackle .
We drafted Pugh to play tackle where he did not fare all that
well now he is a decent guard . We take a center in Richberg
thats technically sound but can't anchor or move the DT's he faces and many times is physically overwhelmed .
So it really does not say much for talent evaluation .

Before the season, everyone said this was one of the Giants most talented teams ever. Now the GM should be in trouble? Really? There are no perfect teams, it’s up to the coaching staff to game plan and help cover any potential weakness. Reese went out and brought in Fluker and this staff continues to play Jerry and Hart. He signed Ellison, one of the best blocking TEs in the game and yet this dumbass coaching staff, has yet to use him to help the tackles.

Does McADoo even know the concept of max protect? Especially when you have playmakers at WR.

It’s easy to blame the GM. But they’re getting their ass kicked on the headsets

let's just blame Reese and the OL. Because that's all you ever do.

Never mind that there's a solid two way TE just rotting on the bench while one of the big 3 at WR wasn't even able to play.

But you're right...it's the OL and Reese. It's always that isn't it.

that the Giants' best offensive player was MIA in the past two weeks.

but when an offense performs this badly over a 16 game period it can't just be the OL. That's a lazy and convenient excuse.

I've seen shittier OLs be hidden better than McAdoo has hidden this one. Don't tell me this is the worst OL in the history of the NFL and even if it is, the WRs, TEs and QB are good enough to at least elevate this unit to just bad. Right now it's historically terrible.

IF you think this is all on the OL, every single aspect of this failure is on the OL, you're a frickin fool. It's never that simple. This is a fundamental failure of the highest order. You don't play THIS BADLY just off a struggling OL. No fucking way. The 2003 OL was worse and they scored more points than this team is scoring.

In comment 13608229 PEEJ said:

Quote:

that the Giants' best offensive player was MIA in the past two weeks.

Why not run the TWO TE sets that this team has the personnel to employ when the star WR is hurt and MArshall is ineffective and possibly still banged up himself?

No one can spin this failure to me. It's an awful oversight on McAdoo's part. He's a mess right now. A total mess.

He DID NOT take the Coughlin 2015 team and turn it into an 11-5 playoff team in 2016. He took Coughlins 2015 team, plus $200M of cash spent on 4 defensive studs, and went 11-5. It was a different team. Plus, if you look, the offense went almost immediately in the tank when Coughlin left. With Coughlin our offense was good but defense bad, with Mac he got Reese to save the D but his offense has sucked.

Again, I do believe the H****ey comparisons are valid until seen otherwise.

if the OL is that bad, WHY NOT RUN TWO TE SETS!!!!! Shit, run THREE TE SETS!! They have the personnel!

Nope, let's run end around with Shepard.

By the way the biggest play this offense has made in two weeks was made by the #3 TE. He played ONE snap on monday. One.

when no one is ever wide open, never...that's a playcalling and coaching problem. Shepard can't get open once? Engram can't be wide open just once downfield where we all say wow what a playcall!

It never happens. The coaching is abysmal.

the talent level on this offense from 2014 until today has been upgraded. The only thing that possibly has gotten worse is Eli and since the OP doesn't want to blame him, which is fine, it's fair to say that the talent today is better than 2014 or 2015. So why is the offense dramatically worse? What has changed?

One thing has changed. McAdoo is now the HC. It's his baby now.

This is one of those things that is so simple to see that even an ardent supporter and somewhat pollyanna fan like myself can't ignore the fact that McAdoo has been absolutely terrible here through the first 2 weeks of the season. And when you factor in last year's offensive output, the results are in. There is no mystery. The guy has lost this offense.

Maybe he turns it around. I won't close the book on him but McAdoo needs to take a long hard look at himself and open up that mind of his. He's blowing it.

when is it on the coaching if it isn't now?

Britt may have been right. I didn't want to admit it...and I was happy with the 11 wins last year...but this is alarming.

In comment 13608052 Biteymax22 said:

Quote:

Win championship = We have the best coach in the sport Don't Win Championship = Coach needs to be fired

Yeah you left out the little nugget that this offense is on a pace that would shatter futility records.

(or someone like that) would be scoring 25-30 pts per game. Its all on Mac.

because I'm bitter over Coughlin. Could not be farther from the truth. I wanted McAdoo as the replacement, based on what I had seen in 2014-2015.

Please, trust me, nobody wants to be wrong on this more than me. It sickens me watching this offense, and especially wasting Eli's final (and what should be some of his prime) years.

In comment 13608014 jvm52106 said:

Quote:

1) Why can't people question McAdoo and his ability to coach? We were 11-5 last year because of our defense. The Offense was pathetic in many wins (both Dallas games, the Saints game, Ravens and Lions) and has now strung together quite the stretch of offensive ineptitude. His demeanor in press conferences is annoying because it seems FAKE, copy cat almost. You are no BB and do not have his resume (The guy had multiple SB appearances as a DC long before multiple appearances and wins as a HC). 2) I am starting to see a pattern where he does seem like he is throwing ELI under the bus. Not completely but subtly jabs here and there that seem like he has an issue with Eli. Go back to a year ago where he said Eli has to be able to throw from a dirty pocket (meaning guys around him, near his feet etc.) and not all pass plays can be blocked out perfectly. That to me says Eli isn't the kind of QB he likes in his system (he is no Aaron Rodgers, no Wilson, No Winston, Newton etc) as he has very limited mobility. I feel like the stubborn comments about the Oline not as bad as people say is more a comment about ELI not being able to help them by avoiding the rush and throwing on the run. It is almost like he is letting off frustration at being saddled with a QB who he doesn't see in his offense and especially long term. I truly believe we are seeing the end of ELI in NY or the end of McAdoo as coach. I don't see both being here next year!

I agree. That is where the train seems to be heading.

In comment 13608144 AnishPatel said:

Quote:

I am a Ben M fan but all this shit for a 2nd year coach with god awful talent on the OL isn't his fault. Like I said before you're not making chicken salad with fucking tofu! I can't imagine the thought process of him right now knowing, that you're OL is that god awful and knowing you can't do anything to fix it because they are all bad as a unit. You can't run block and pass block. That's game, set, match. You can't scheme for that and actually win games.

But isn't it his responsibility to tell the GM what he needs? If he told Reese he was ok with the cast of characters assembled isn't he equally complicit? I have no sympathy for either of them.

Sunday's a must win. The team's struggled with its best player MIA the past two weeks. Marshall's been awful and that has nothing to do with the scheme.

I think there's some overreaction - about Reese, McAdoo, and even Eli - based off of two games against two good teams.

why give out 25 million for a blocking TE, while bypassing the FA LT that cost around the same money only to keep the guy on the bench?

That tells me that either McAdoo has fallen out of love with Ellison faster than shit through a goose, or has forgotten he has an embarrassment of riches at the TE position, or forgotten how bad this offense looks in 11 personnel, or never really wanted Ellison in the first place.

Any of the possible scenarios are scary to me.

djm, I don't think McAdoo has done a great job these past two weeks. He deserves a lot of criticism - including the topic you touched on. But I think those looking to run him out of town or think he sucks are overreacting. I don't think we know what we have with him yet. I think the criticisms contained to the past two games - such as yours - are thoughtful and appropriate. Those making sweeping statements about his quality or whether he's in over his head are getting a bit ahead of themselves. We've got plenty of season left to determine that.

In comment 13608234 PatersonPlank said:

Quote:

He DID NOT take the Coughlin 2015 team and turn it into an 11-5 playoff team in 2016. He took Coughlins 2015 team, plus $200M of cash spent on 4 defensive studs, and went 11-5. It was a different team. Plus, if you look, the offense went almost immediately in the tank when Coughlin left. With Coughlin our offense was good but defense bad, with Mac he got Reese to save the D but his offense has sucked. Again, I do believe the H****ey comparisons are valid until seen otherwise.

I do not know about comparisons to past coaches. But,I see it the same as you. He took a team he did not build that was infused with great talent on the side of the ball he has almost nothing to do with. Last year there was success, but the offense was garbage. Now, the offense is league worst through two games. This in an NFL that favors offense.

The jury is still way out on McAdoo. If nothing changes this week and the Giants get obliterated I would say the jury is back, and with a bad verdict.

when it comes tooth's teams problems, its his job to supply the talent and yet he leaves the O line still the anchor oaths team next to Eli...

McAdoo is in the 4th year running this scheme and it is not just about the OL and the QB. If he needed OL people he should be telling Reese. WCO does not need OL to block very long and does not run the ball very often. This is a bad scheme for this offense and after 3 years the scheme should have changed to better fit Eli. McAdoo is stubborn or not very smart or wants Eli to fail because it is not working. He is over his head and stubborn. Tries to emulate BB. McAdoo's first OC was with Giants and after 2 years he is HC. Bad move by front office. Acts like he is the smartest guy in the room. He has never won anything.

McAdoo is in the 4th year running this scheme and it is not just about the OL and the QB. If he needed OL people he should be telling Reese. WCO does not need OL to block very long and does not run the ball very often. This is a bad scheme for this offense and after 3 years the scheme should have changed to better fit Eli. McAdoo is stubborn or not very smart or wants Eli to fail because it is not working. He is over his head and stubborn. Tries to emulate BB. McAdoo's first OC job was with Giants and after 2 years he is HC. Bad move by front office. Acts like he is the smartest guy in the room. He has never won anything. Last year D carried team to 11 wins.

In comment 13608128 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

Our first Superbowl team was absolutely built on that philosophy. The first thing Coughlin said in his introductory press conference was getting back to "Giants Football" and "controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball". Within his first year of being here we added Snee, O'hara, and McKenzie, and already had Diehl and Suebert, and then Jacobs and Bradshaw. We have a major power running game and inflicted our will on other teams from the LOS. We had two RB's go for 1000 yards each in 2008. And he's building the same thing in JAX right now. He did it there the first time too. 2nd pick in the 1995 NFL Draft (first draft pick ever for the Jax franchise, Tom Coughlin the GM and Head Coach): Tony Bosselli.

Jax first three picks 2017 draft: RB, OT, DE.

Eli had 2 of his best seasons in 2014 and 2015 and the offense was in the top 10 in the league. I'm sorry, but 2016 and the first 2 games this year don't seem to me to be the same offense with about the same OL and more talent elsewhere.

You know, McAdoo has to be at least partially responsible for the personnel, both who we sign/draft and more importantly who makes the team and who plays. The OK was a disaster all summer, yet we start the same 5. We had some success in Week 1 with a TH or TE in the backfield and reverted back to 11 personnel most of the game on Monday. These are coaching decisions.

In comment 13608014 jvm52106 said:

Quote:

1) Why can't people question McAdoo and his ability to coach? We were 11-5 last year because of our defense. The Offense was pathetic in many wins (both Dallas games, the Saints game, Ravens and Lions) and has now strung together quite the stretch of offensive ineptitude. His demeanor in press conferences is annoying because it seems FAKE, copy cat almost. You are no BB and do not have his resume (The guy had multiple SB appearances as a DC long before multiple appearances and wins as a HC). 2) I am starting to see a pattern where he does seem like he is throwing ELI under the bus. Not completely but subtly jabs here and there that seem like he has an issue with Eli. Go back to a year ago where he said Eli has to be able to throw from a dirty pocket (meaning guys around him, near his feet etc.) and not all pass plays can be blocked out perfectly. That to me says Eli isn't the kind of QB he likes in his system (he is no Aaron Rodgers, no Wilson, No Winston, Newton etc) as he has very limited mobility. I feel like the stubborn comments about the Oline not as bad as people say is more a comment about ELI not being able to help them by avoiding the rush and throwing on the run. It is almost like he is letting off frustration at being saddled with a QB who he doesn't see in his offense and especially long term. I truly believe we are seeing the end of ELI in NY or the end of McAdoo as coach. I don't see both being here next year!

His demeanor is annoying in pressers because he speaks a lot but says absolutely nothing except tired cliches and he comes off as completely obtuse.

We'd like to think that he does this because he doesn't want to give anything away but given that nothing has seemed to change over several weeks with the offense, it seems more likely that he IS completely obtuse.