Can't link from work laptop but read on cell phone.
sportstalk360.com states that the Giants reached out to inquire about LT Duane Brown who continues to hold out.
He was scheduled to make 9.4 million and wants more.
What is the cost (trade) for someone like this? 2/3 rounder?
Move Flowers to G where he is better suited in the NFL?
He has actually looked better the past two years but obviously isn't the future for LT.
http://sportstalk360.com/ - ( New Window )
But with the season in shambles, I'd be hesitant to give up a high pick and/or use a lot cap space for a 32 year old Tackle. If we were a good Tackle away from making a serious SB push or he were younger and could be our LT for the next 5+ years, then I'd be all in.
Quote:
Sports Talk 360 is a privately run website run by a couple of lads who love their NFL. The Sports Talk 360 team are a dedicated couple of lads who seek to bring you all the News and Rumours in the world of the NFL.
Lads? Rumours? So they're in the UK, I take it. I'm sure they have their finger on the pulse of the Giants.
Quote:
Sports Talk 360 is a privately run website run by a couple of lads who love their NFL. The Sports Talk 360 team are a dedicated couple of lads who seek to bring you all the News and Rumours in the world of the NFL.
Huh. They seem like a fine couple of lads
Yeah, but it's not like anyone in the division is running away with it after the first quarter of the season.
Beason was acquired for practically nothing, the problem was he was oft-injured and remained that way.
Brown's a solid tackle - but approaching 33 years old, making almost $10M a year and wants a raise. How you justify handing over a 3rd round pick (which might be closer to the 2nd round than we'd like) for the right to pay him more money is beyond me.
Quote:
Quote:
Sports Talk 360 is a privately run website run by a couple of lads who love their NFL. The Sports Talk 360 team are a dedicated couple of lads who seek to bring you all the News and Rumours in the world of the NFL.
Lads? Rumours? So they're in the UK, I take it. I'm sure they have their finger on the pulse of the Giants.
Well, they could also be Canadians, which, um, I guess is better?
This is just desperation. At least Beason only cost a seventh round pick. The Texans want their second round pick back that they had to give to the Browns to get rid of Osweiler. And they know our second round pick will be very high.
And I agree, what’s the point of giving up draft picks now at 0-4?
A trade at this point would be a huge negative..
which..., pugh was a little light for guard so....
I would hardly ever give up draft picks, nah, not for old players especially
Quote:
make this trade 3 weeks ago. Trading futures to save this season at 0-4 is a risky move. Even a 10-2 finish wouldn't guarantee playoffs.
Agree, but put yourself in Jerry's and Mac's shoes, who both should know that they could be fired at season's end if things don't turn around. Jerry is trying to save his job, not the season.
Fair point. Playoffs is very unlikely right now, but Reese and McAdoo probably know that a 7-9 or 8-8 record can save their jobs.
Quote:
Sports Talk 360 is a privately run website run by a couple of lads who love their NFL. The Sports Talk 360 team are a dedicated couple of lads who seek to bring you all the News and Rumours in the world of the NFL.
Thread over.
Think before you post people... The chances of this being true are highly unlikely in the first place, but even if, it's not two guys in a vacuum jeopardizing the team's long term future without anyone holding them in check.
So you advocate giving up a premium draft pick for a 32 year old left tackle who’s been holding out through 4 games already?
Adding Brown would definitely help this year -- Brown-Flowers-Richberg-Fluker-Pugh is something we can work with. But it also hedges against a guy or two leaving next year, and gives Eli a quality LT to protect his blindside for the rest of his career.
You make a fair point - we as fans want to see the Giants rebuilt into a team that can contend for several years. Players, coaches, GMs want to win games now bc they’re playing/working to keep their jobs for next season.
Our general reaction is don’t mortgage a premium pick at this point - but whether or not this is true, im sure Mac and Reese care a lot more about figuring out how to go 9-7 with a strong finish so they keep their jobs
And the Giants suck at evaluating OL talent in the draft.
Give Him is Cage Too !!
Link - ( New Window )
Although it wouldve been great to have done this earlier, the Texans may not have been open to it until now.
This year is probably lost but if he could play at good level for 3 more years I think you do it to get the most out of Eli.
Link - ( New Window )
Think before you post people... The chances of this being true are highly unlikely in the first place, but even if, it's not two guys in a vacuum jeopardizing the team's long term future without anyone holding them in check.
I thought he just drank a lot?
It would be pointless if he were playing out the last year in his contract. But it wouldnt be pointless if we could secure him for the next three years.
From just a few posts above
Quote:
Pointless
It would be pointless if he were playing out the last year in his contract. But it wouldnt be pointless if we could secure him for the next three years.
I agree with this if the priority is to make another run with Eli. You wont find a better LT in FA this year. Maybe you draft one early, but they would still take time an may never reach Browns level. The big question is cost (in draft picks and in contract cost).
I totally understand not parting with a high pick, but counting on the OL in the draft is part of what got us in this mess in the first place. Premium OL picks aren't a guarantee to work out and I prefer we draft players, not positions.
They should have made a desperation move in the preseason when it was obvious they need help on the line.
Quote:
You guys realize that Mara signs off on these moves, right? Do you think that whatever our record is, Chris Mara is leaving the team? And with him there regardless, do you think he'd sign off on some desperation move that could hurt the team if the only aim was a longshot to save people's jobs?
Think before you post people... The chances of this being true are highly unlikely in the first place, but even if, it's not two guys in a vacuum jeopardizing the team's long term future without anyone holding them in check.
Yes, No and Yes. They don't want to look like fools after spending 200 million, handing the reins over to a novice and keeping Jerry Reach.
Man, you love your talking points. I can imagine you're similarly useless in conversations about political and current evennts.
Given the Giants propensity for miss evaluating OL prospects, not spending high picks on OLs with high floors and modest ceilings, and for standing-pat and letting people trade in front of them and pick their pockets, getting an immediate starter at OLT would be a nice pickup, so long as it isn't a costly, one-year rental. Think BEYOND this year. There's no guarantee they're going to be able to upgrade the position via FA (the Giants already know who will be available), OR get an immediate upgrade via the draft.
Yeah, it would have been nice for this to have happened long ago, but maybe this guy/situation wasn't available long ago.
Or, a thank you to Eli Manning as in "we want to keep you alive for 2018."
I wouldn't make the move, haven't we even given up a low round pick for next year already?
Anything higher than a five would be a horrible decision.
Given the Giants propensity for miss evaluating OL prospects, not spending high picks on OLs with high floors and modest ceilings, and for standing-pat and letting people trade in front of them and pick their pockets, getting an immediate starter at OLT would be a nice pickup, so long as it isn't a costly, one-year rental. Think BEYOND this year. There's no guarantee they're going to be able to upgrade the position via FA (the Giants already know who will be available), OR get an immediate upgrade via the draft.
Yeah, it would have been nice for this to have happened long ago, but maybe this guy/situation wasn't available long ago.
Actually, a pretty good point. Esp if you feel in next year's draft, no one will be ready to step in at LT....which is one of the toughest positions to nail down.
This guy could conceivably play 3-4 more years.
I just don't see how this is good for a guy who will be 33. Maybe he has 2 years left in him? And what do you do with Flowers? Sit him? He isn't moving to RT or RG.
Smoke here...that is all.
Quote:
In comment 13632747 jcn56 said:
Quote:
You guys realize that Mara signs off on these moves, right? Do you think that whatever our record is, Chris Mara is leaving the team? And with him there regardless, do you think he'd sign off on some desperation move that could hurt the team if the only aim was a longshot to save people's jobs?
Think before you post people... The chances of this being true are highly unlikely in the first place, but even if, it's not two guys in a vacuum jeopardizing the team's long term future without anyone holding them in check.
Yes, No and Yes. They don't want to look like fools after spending 200 million, handing the reins over to a novice and keeping Jerry Reach.
Man, you love your talking points. I can imagine you're similarly useless in conversations about political and current evennts.
Quote:
Sports Talk 360 is a privately run website run by a couple of lads who love their NFL. The Sports Talk 360 team are a dedicated couple of lads who seek to bring you all the News and Rumours in the world of the NFL.
You guys actually believe this shit? Lmaooo
Great job Reese
Metnut : 9:37 am : link : reply
make this trade 3 weeks ago. Trading futures to save this season at 0-4 is a risky move. Even a 10-2 finish wouldn't guarantee playoffs.ere not going 10-2 so no sense in
spending picks on a 30 yo .
Go after a pass rusher of O-lineman next year free agency
makes no sense right now . If he was 3-4 years younger
I would say go for it.
all this stupid move does is lose draft picks while "helping" this team win just enough to lose a top 10 1st rounder
the season is over - this move needed to happen in July
We will have zero answers if we go into the offseason with what we have.
This. If they leverage the future on a season that is undoubtedly lost, then this organization has officially come off the rails.
If he's just a short term bandaid? No thanks, no pick. Duane Brown isn't winning this team the Lombardi this year and it reeks of a desperation play by a FO that fears for its job. Clawing our way to 8-8 for a guy that won't benefit the franchise longterm isn't in our best interest.
If he's just a short term bandaid? No thanks, no pick. Duane Brown isn't winning this team the Lombardi this year and it reeks of a desperation play by a FO that fears for its job. Clawing our way to 8-8 for a guy that won't benefit the franchise longterm isn't in our best interest.
Exactly, The Horse is out of the barn. Now this poor GM wants to fix something that's way too late so he can get up in his presser during the bye week and say, "We always trying to upgrade at all positions during the season". People who think Reese is a effective GM need their thought process reviewed
That's going to be a high 2nd and 3rd rounder for a 32yo 9milluon plus LT
Please don't do it
regardless of what the numbers say you go ONE game at a time. the first four were REALLY good teams....every game on schedule left is winnable....why cant we rip off 6 in a row to get to 6-4??? this is the nfl....one game at a time. i make this move for a 4th rounder AT most. wouldnt trade a high pick, but 4+ id jump on it. 3rd would take me longer to think about. if this gives us a better chance of winning now, you do it....then in april we can go a different route ie barkley and use 2nd and 3rd rouders on OL and really sets us up well for 2018.
Quote:
In comment 13632794 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
In comment 13632747 jcn56 said:
Quote:
You guys realize that Mara signs off on these moves, right? Do you think that whatever our record is, Chris Mara is leaving the team? And with him there regardless, do you think he'd sign off on some desperation move that could hurt the team if the only aim was a longshot to save people's jobs?
Think before you post people... The chances of this being true are highly unlikely in the first place, but even if, it's not two guys in a vacuum jeopardizing the team's long term future without anyone holding them in check.
Yes, No and Yes. They don't want to look like fools after spending 200 million, handing the reins over to a novice and keeping Jerry Reach.
Man, you love your talking points. I can imagine you're similarly useless in conversations about political and current evennts.
Sorry Reese and MacAdoo are making you and your predictions look clueless. You'll learn how things work as you gain more experience in the world.
If you only understood how ironic it is for you to call anyone else clueless, the world might reverse on its axis.
That said, we can't both scream for O-line help and say we shouldn't go after O-line help. The season's teetering and it's not a month old yet. Yes, a 10-2 finish wouldn't guarantee playoffs, but 6-6 finish guarantees no playoffs. The front office has to show the players and fans that they're really committed to winning, every year.
We're deep into the thread now, but look up a bit, the source on this rumour is somewhat cheeky.
Maybe it's getting close to accepting that the championship window was never really there with this line. It's hard to expect the acquisition of two to four good starters in the next offseason or two when this front office hasn't been able to do that in the last 7 years.
Might be Mara's desperate attempt to still win games(in my Bob Uecker voice: JUST a bit late).
I d say there s a lot of quit on this board.
By the way if Giants win Sunday and the Cowboys get their third loss, or Eagles get their second. Please son t jump back on the wagon.
"institutional arrogance" requires a bit more clarification. Every team in the league has a philosophy they stick to. You could say this for just about any franchise.
I can stomach a 3rd for Brown and am ok paying him. Especially since they wont be paying flowers and possibly Pugh big money. I dont think PUgh is worth big money as a OG or OT.
They have Eli for 2 years. Bring him on. Its like having Duane brown for Odigizuwa.
I can stomach a 3rd for Brown and am ok paying him. Especially since they wont be paying flowers and possibly Pugh big money. I dont think PUgh is worth big money as a OG or OT.
They have Eli for 2 years. Bring him on. Its like having Duane brown for Odigizuwa.
Not quite, because you also have to give Brown a hefty raise in addition to giving up the third to acquire him. That's what makes the premise difficult, if it were only for a third rounder he'd be gone by now.
The problem is we've spent big money where we draft well: defensive line.
The problem is we've spent big money where we draft well: defensive line.
They struggle to select quality free agents as well. They need to identify the weaknesses of their talent evaluation before they commit any kind of premium picks or cap space to the position.
Also,do we draft well on the defensive line, namely end? Save for one or two seasons of your favorite player JPP, I would argue that we've been pretty weak there as well since Tuck and Umenyiora got old and retired, left.
Quote:
"institutional arrogance" requires a bit more clarification. Every team in the league has a philosophy they stick to. You could say this for just about any franchise.
How 'bout not firing a GM since 1979, does that qualify?
You can't say that about other franchise in the 4 major sports, let alone franchises in the NFL!
It is absolutely ludicrous to me.
Quote:
In comment 13634208 mdc1 said:
Quote:
"institutional arrogance" requires a bit more clarification. Every team in the league has a philosophy they stick to. You could say this for just about any franchise.
.
How 'bout not firing a GM since 1979, does that qualify?
You can't say that about other franchise in the 4 major sports, let alone franchises in the NFL!
It is absolutely ludicrous to me.
Stability is ludicrous? The Steelers have had 3 head coaches since 1969, iirc....
Quote:
In comment 13634300 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 13634208 mdc1 said:
Quote:
"institutional arrogance" requires a bit more clarification. Every team in the league has a philosophy they stick to. You could say this for just about any franchise.
.
How 'bout not firing a GM since 1979, does that qualify?
You can't say that about other franchise in the 4 major sports, let alone franchises in the NFL!
It is absolutely ludicrous to me.
Stability is ludicrous? The Steelers have had 3 head coaches since 1969, iirc....
When it's not working it is, not saying go all Cleveland Browns around here, but it hasn't been working.
Stability around these parts is also a synonym for stubbornness, and you picked the one franchise who are
like two peas in a pod with this franchise in a lot of ways.
What about the other 4 major sports, they all have it wrong,
and the Giants have it right, got it now.
Who are the franchises who have impressed you with their management style, and how successful are they? Who do you feel does it right or better? Because every team blows draft picks, or has a deficiency in some area. We can argue left and right about what you think the giants got wrong or right here and there and there are things they absolutely do poorly, but if you legitimately feel like things are just so dreadful, you should spend some time around other franchises and see the things they screw up and the consistent futility.
Nobody should be happy with the results for the Giants in 2017 so far, but one should take a hard look at how other places do it and how well that's worked out over the past 13 years before going 'woe is me' over how the Giants operate.
And we are not talking about that many new players getting snaps.
Coaches have to look hard at themselves on this one because those players aren't ready for work when the Star Spangled Banner finishes...
Who are the franchises who have impressed you with their management style, and how successful are they? Who do you feel does it right or better? Because every team blows draft picks, or has a deficiency in some area. We can argue left and right about what you think the giants got wrong or right here and there and there are things they absolutely do poorly, but if you legitimately feel like things are just so dreadful, you should spend some time around other franchises and see the things they screw up and the consistent futility.
Nobody should be happy with the results for the Giants in 2017 so far, but one should take a hard look at how other places do it and how well that's worked out over the past 13 years before going 'woe is me' over how the Giants operate.
You will change your tune when you have watched this organization a lot longer than you have presently.
I am not saying 'woe is me', saying it is a philosophical difference in my view. It started a few years ago for me.
You are wrong in presuming it's about 2017, very wrong in fact.
When you are not going to make the playoffs, 6 out 8 years, doesn't appear to be working. It appears that is stubbornness, do you have a better word for it, use it.
If you like the 'stability' that goes with that, good for you! A lot of people have wanted the GM gone, so I am far from alone on here in that regard.
He has fucked up twice in the last 5 years, but let's
have stability. Some of you have the fear of the unknown,
I don't subscribe to that mindset.
Quote:
you have to factor that they cant get it right at OT with a 1st rounder, Flowers, Pugh.
IMO Is rather those cap dollars go to Brown than Flowers or Pugh, that’s how I justify it.
I can stomach a 3rd for Brown and am ok paying him. Especially since they wont be paying flowers and possibly Pugh big money. I dont think PUgh is worth big money as a OG or OT.
They have Eli for 2 years. Bring him on. Its like having Duane brown for Odigizuwa.
Not quite, because you also have to give Brown a hefty raise in addition to giving up the third to acquire him. That's what makes the premise difficult, if it were only for a third rounder he'd be gone by now.