Vacchiano: Giants shouldn't sit Manning for Webb

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These coaches are coaching for their jobs. Eli isn t sitting.

and not the more obvious element - that with a broken OL and replacement WRs, on an offense that wasn't exactly functional to begin with, throwing a 3rd round pick rookie into the fire likely doesn't serve to prove much.

Hell, if they were thinking highly enough of Webb from the jump would they have kept Smith?

..Eli is the QB, he plays. The man has earned it.

Maybe you play Webb in a blowout either way..........

In comment 13642485 jcn56 said:

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and not the more obvious element - that with a broken OL and replacement WRs, on an offense that wasn't exactly functional to begin with, throwing a 3rd round pick rookie into the fire likely doesn't serve to prove much. Hell, if they were thinking highly enough of Webb from the jump would they have kept Smith?

Been listing that as one of the primary reasons all week. How in the world do you even get an evaluation of Webb behind this O-line, with no running game, and none of the starting WR's?

Even if he had talent, you'd shell shock him into David Carr.

nonsensical, which is why I half expect him to start before year's end with Slick calling the shots.

How they hell would we have any idea what we have in Webb with this garbage oline and when our best skill player is a rookie tight end

But I hate this damn season.

The realization of the end of the Eli era is here. At most we're looking at the remainder of this year and maybe 2018, but maybe less.

I remember this feeling only twice before.

Patrick Ewing and Mike Piazza.

Give him a few weeks of reps to get ready. Get Sheppard back and put him in.

Trubisky Is working with less in CHI.

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Even if they don't, there's no doubt that all the players left on this MASH-unit of a roster would benefit from having a veteran quarterback at the helm of this sinking ship. He's got a rookie tight end (Evan Engram), maybe a rookie running back (Wayne Gallman), and a second-year receiver (Sterling Shepard, when he's healthy) as the centerpieces of his offense now, and he has to operate with limited personnel-group options behind a crumbling offensive line.

Putting Webb in would sacrifice the other young players opportunities for development, as well.

before the ‘18 draft. If they don’t it’s an organizational failure

In comment 13642509 Dave on the UWS said:

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before the ‘18 draft. If they don’t it’s an organizational failure

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Sure, ideally, they'd want to see him before deciding on whether to draft a quarterback next season. But if they're sold on one of those 2018 quarterbacks, they should draft one anyway. Webb's a third-rounder, and that matters. It's not like they would have wasted a first- or second-round pick if they go in another direction. It's not like the Jets' situation, where they used a second-round pick on Hackenberg and two years later still haven't seen him in a game.

Let him quarterback until he's 50. No need to look to the future and evaluate the player you just took in third round with the season over.

In comment 13642509 Dave on the UWS said:

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before the ‘18 draft. If they don’t it’s an organizational failure

Stop making sense.

Ej Manuel a first rounder- Dak a 4th- russ a 3rd... who cares? The giants grade was higher than 3rd round. Does that matter?
Nobody is saying start the guy in a week. But saying it is not intelligent to prepare Webb to take meaningful snaps in a wasted year is well.... unintelligent.

In comment 13642509 Dave on the UWS said:

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before the ‘18 draft. If they don’t it’s an organizational failure

No it is not. It the organization does not think he has developed enough...they would be doing him harm in starting him. From the get go...they said Webb was developmental and not ready to start or even be the backup. Think of wine...drink it too early and it tastes like shit. Play Webb before he is ready...he will look like shit.

there is one single pro to starting him, and a ton of cons.

The pro does not outweigh the cons.

In comment 13642498 KWALL2 said:

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Give him a few weeks of reps to get ready. Get Sheppard back and put him in. Trubisky Is working with less in CHI.

So you're gonna drool over Tarik Cohen and then say Trubisky has less? Ok.

CHI OL and running game is in a different galaxy than NYG.

We're talking benching Mike Glennon vs. benching Eli Manning, here....

And secondly, Trubisky was the 2nd overall pick.

In comment 13642521 AnnapolisMike said:

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In comment 13642509 Dave on the UWS said: Quote: before the ‘18 draft. If they don’t it’s an organizational failure No it is not. It the organization does not think he has developed enough...they would be doing him harm in starting him. From the get go...they said Webb was developmental and not ready to start or even be the backup. Think of wine...drink it too early and it tastes like shit. Play Webb before he is ready...he will look like shit.

Why, is he Christian Hackenberg?

In this day and age, if the guy is unable to start at some point in year one, the Giants have their answer as to whether to draft a QB with the first pick next year.

In comment 13642527 Britt in VA said:

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there is one single pro to starting him, and a ton of cons. The pro does not outweigh the cons.

The pros are to see how Webb performs and to evaluate whether to take a QB in round 1. I can't think of a single con. To the team's future.

and many in Ralph's article.

You choosing to ignore them doesn't mean they are not there.

Wish in one hand, sh-t in the other, and see which one gets filled first.

Manning is not getting benched for Webb. And in the event that Manning were to get injured, it would likely be Geno Smith before Webb.

of a QB in the next draft, IF that QB is the BPA (or close to it).

Webb would have to go out there and light the world on fire otherwise, and there's little to no chance of that.

I do think he should get some reps this year, but I don't think it should be an entire game or even halves, I think you stand a greater chance of destroying the guy than you do of proving what he's got.

In comment 13642556 Britt in VA said:

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Wish in one hand, sh-t in the other, and see which one gets filled first. Manning is not getting benched for Webb. And in the event that Manning were to get injured, it would likely be Geno Smith before Webb.

I guess that's the same thinking that's led to 5 losing seasons out of the last 6. Manning is not being "benched." The team needs to look to the future and evaluate what they have before deciding whether to take a QB in round one.

they are going to do so regardless of what a limited Webb shows them this season.

A few scripted drives against 4th tier defenders in pre-season games is not a valid barometer.

Webb proving he can throw a ball in a few meaningless games later this year when the team is down by 24 points in the 4th quarter won't prevent the Giants from doing the smart thing and taking a highly regarded QB prospect in the draft.

I liked Webb in college, but I'm very much skeptical of his ceiling as a Pro.

When a team is struggling, the backup QB becomes everyone’s favorite player.

In comment 13642566 Vanzetti said:

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When a team is struggling, the backup QB becomes everyone’s favorite player.

Amen, so damn true. I miss Madden. Hope he is well.

has to be incapable of playing for anyone else to start. That could admittedly happen behind this OL. There's a real chance he doesn't finish the season. But then Smith, not Webb, will start. Webb could play if Smith is truly awful, but there is no chance he plays over Eli. None.

In comment 13642556 Britt in VA said:

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Wish in one hand, sh-t in the other, and see which one gets filled first. Manning is not getting benched for Webb. And in the event that Manning were to get injured, it would likely be Geno Smith before Webb.

I don't see Manning getting benched for a number of reasons. One reason not mentioned here by others is that i think McAdoo wants Eli to be the goat and I don't mean that as Greatest of All-Time. He can't trash the O-line that points at Reese. He can't blame injuries as they are only really present now (at 0-5).. His knocks on Eli have been obvious and I think they will continue..

I truly believe this is it for Eli in NY if McAdoo stays as coach!

In comment 13642498 KWALL2 said:

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Give him a few weeks of reps to get ready. Get Sheppard back and put him in. Trubisky Is working with less in CHI.

Trubisky has a great run game to back him up. If Webb comes in it's all on him to move the ball.

No reason to saddle Webbs' resume with all of the L's the Giants are going to take these next 11 games.

In comment 13642486 BillKo said:

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..Eli is the QB, he plays. The man has earned it. Maybe you play Webb in a blowout either way..........

yup, Webb will get plenty of mop up duty down the stretch.

From Ralph and on both sides of the argument.

My biggest fear in all of this is that Eli somehow gets this team to 5-11 or 6-10 and completely blows the draft position.

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When a team is struggling, the backup QB becomes everyone’s favorite player.

1. He's not the backup QB.
2. Nobody sees him as a savior.
3. The only point is to get a young player some PT to evaluate his talent.

They should give all of the young players more PT in this lost season.

Gallman? He should get all of the work. Vereen doesn't need to play. He'll be cut at the end of the year. Give Gallman all of the PT.
Backup DEs? Give them a lot more work.
Apple? He should start the rest of the way.

A young QB? We aren't talking about playing him this week. Give him weeks of prep and give him a 4-6 game stretch to start at the end of the year.

He would have Sheppard, Engram, Ellison, and Gallman. That's enough to see what he can do.

Its a much smarter plan then keep him on the bench because Eli has a streak.

And there are no cons to playing him? If he struggles? Great. Lets see how he reacts to it.

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No reason to saddle Webbs' resume with all of the L's...

You can't be serious. We should be worried about a rookies resume(whatever that means)?

thanks Ralph.

needs to see like 80% of the snaps. See what the kid can do. None of this RB by committee bullshit. Gallman looked awesome out there when he got his chances.

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So you're gonna drool over Tarik Cohen and then say Trubisky has less? Ok.

He has nothing at WR and TE. Nothing.

Trubisky had very little college experience. Similar to Webb. They got him ready in one week.

I also drooled over Engram and Sheppard. If Webb gets weeks to prep and he has Engram, Sheappard, Ellison, and Gallam, then he has enough.

Its enough to see what he can do.

but too many here act like every time the QB drops back he is sacked.

Our O Line is bad but it isn't as bad as many here want to believe (presumably to absolve Eli)... whether or not they end up doing it, there is something to be gained by seeing Webb play QB sooner rather than later.

there will still be plenty of opptys to see Webb's accuracy, ability to make plays on the move, make quick decisions, read defenses, audible at the line, etc... it doesn't have to be the only evaluation but it is at least a start.

in fact, to me the bigger argument against playing Webb isn't the Oline, but the lack of a competent receiving core.

that said, once we hit 10 games into the season, unless we are 4-6 or 5-5, I am going to root for Webb to see some meaningful playing time.

made a few plays that we haven't seen anyone do in our backfield in 5 years, oh and he hits the hole and falls forward when he gets tackled, what a fucking novel concept. Play this guy.

is a player. He should get a huge bump in PT especially as a 3rd down back. He'll shine here.

And we have sat through more awful football and look even more towards the draft and future.... and see if everyone is reverse engineering reasons to not see what we have before a pivotal draft for the franchise.

In comment 13642634 KWALL2 said:

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Quote: So you're gonna drool over Tarik Cohen and then say Trubisky has less? Ok. He has nothing at WR and TE. Nothing. Trubisky had very little college experience. Similar to Webb. They got him ready in one week. I also drooled over Engram and Sheppard. If Webb gets weeks to prep and he has Engram, Sheappard, Ellison, and Gallam, then he has enough. Its enough to see what he can do.

So you're just going to avoid the OL issue. Makes sense.

is starting to remind me of the 'Dark Ages', I don't think
it will last 17 years this time. That is a tongue and cheek
comment, nothing more. Keep in mind, Vacchiano wrote a book with Eli after they won a SB, so he will slant his musings
towards Eli. When the season goes down the tubes, it wouldn't
hurt to see Webb play some. Around here, it is earth shattering news if Eli doesn't play a game or two.

In comment 13642687 WillVAB said:

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In comment 13642634 KWALL2 said: Quote: Quote: So you're gonna drool over Tarik Cohen and then say Trubisky has less? Ok. He has nothing at WR and TE. Nothing. Trubisky had very little college experience. Similar to Webb. They got him ready in one week. I also drooled over Engram and Sheppard. If Webb gets weeks to prep and he has Engram, Sheappard, Ellison, and Gallam, then he has enough. Its enough to see what he can do. So you're just going to avoid the OL issue. Makes sense.

If the OL is the determining issue, then Geno Smith should be starting over Manning.

should get ample opportunity to play in some "garbage time" this year.

So keep playing Eli when the team is 0-10? Makes sense.

he should have played in the preseason.

Eli hardly plays...and for what...to see Smith and Johnson?