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NFT: Knicks Chat

DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 10:01 am
In Zach Lowe's most recent piece he predicts the Wizards will end up trading a pick with a center in order to get under the tax. If I'm the Knicks I'd be ALL over any deals like this. They don't need a center but they certainly can use the pick and cap space means nothing to them.

-Also suggests Miami may do something similar with Winslow being "the pick" in this case, again the Knicks should be "in" on this.

-Bucks as well to dump Teletovic

also from Lowe

The Knicks finish last in points allowed per possession

New York would be a flammable defensive team even if Kristaps Porzingis were 25, and well-versed in the nuances of pick-and-roll containment after years learning in a functional environment. He's 22, a little unsteady in open space, and entering Year 3 working at the circus.

Courtney Lee is solid, but almost everyone else is either a train wreck, a youngster, or Joakim Noah. Teams are going to get whatever they want against the Knicks.

Don't count out the Lakers, Kings and Suns, but I'm betting on New York bringing up the rear.
The Knicks should absolutely be in on it  
Jay on the Island : 10/13/2017 10:16 am : link
I think they will be able to trade Kanter at some point because playoff teams could also use an offensive big like him.

They should also try to trade Lee while he still has some value. This season should be all about loading up on picks and let the youngsters develop.
I'm betting  
Enzo : 10/13/2017 10:19 am : link
on our horrific defense to keep us at no more than 25 wins.
Wouldn't the Wiz need to find someone under the cap to trade their  
Heisenberg : 10/13/2017 10:21 am : link
center to?
RE: I'm betting  
bceagle05 : 10/13/2017 10:24 am : link
In comment 13646629 Enzo said:
Quote:
on our horrific defense to keep us at no more than 25 wins.


Yep, a pretty good bet. Only concern is we play in the East - teams like Sac/LAL/Phx probably have a little more talent, but tougher schedules.
Horrendous  
DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 10:27 am : link
defense and very little "go to" proven offense. Any night where THjr or KP are having an off night you are looking at Willy, Beasley and the like to help CARRY the offense. This idea that some have of the Knicks pushing for .500 and the playoffs is absurd.
as of now the Knicks  
Enzo : 10/13/2017 10:31 am : link
don't project to have the cap space to absorb deals of any significance next summer. They'd need to trade guys like Lee or Lance for an expiring. Kanter could always opt out, but as of now I don't see that happening.
RE: as of now the Knicks  
DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 10:33 am : link
In comment 13646667 Enzo said:
Quote:
don't project to have the cap space to absorb deals of any significance next summer. They'd need to trade guys like Lee or Lance for an expiring. Kanter could always opt out, but as of now I don't see that happening.


Begley claims Thomas and KOQ are garnering trade interest
apparently  
Enzo : 10/13/2017 10:35 am : link
the Knicks over/under is still 30.5. That seems WAY high to me. Who gets buckets for this team down the stretch? Unless KP takes a giant leap forward....or maybe Hornacek has them playing a system where guys are getting open looks (ha!), I just don't see it. And they're going to get murdered by opposing point guards every night.
People STILL want Winslow?  
Greg from LI : 10/13/2017 10:37 am : link
What the hell? He's awful.
RE: People STILL want Winslow?  
DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 10:40 am : link
In comment 13646675 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
What the hell? He's awful.


His defense is A+. For that reason alone as part of a dump he's absolutely worth a look. His defense is really, really good. The numbers suggest he could be the next great wing defender ie Tony Allen.
RE: apparently  
DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 10:41 am : link
In comment 13646672 Enzo said:
Quote:
the Knicks over/under is still 30.5. That seems WAY high to me. Who gets buckets for this team down the stretch? Unless KP takes a giant leap forward....or maybe Hornacek has them playing a system where guys are getting open looks (ha!), I just don't see it. And they're going to get murdered by opposing point guards every night.


Unless Hornacek is a super genius keeping his offense under wraps it's safe to say their system isn't going to be anything all too special.
Of  
DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 10:43 am : link
the top 6 players in the NBA in defensive win shares per game last year you had 4 warriors, Rudy Gobert and... Justise Winslow. He's EXTREMELY flawed but his defense alone could be a major, major value to someone.
RE: RE: as of now the Knicks  
Enzo : 10/13/2017 10:44 am : link
In comment 13646670 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 13646667 Enzo said:


Quote:


don't project to have the cap space to absorb deals of any significance next summer. They'd need to trade guys like Lee or Lance for an expiring. Kanter could always opt out, but as of now I don't see that happening.



Begley claims Thomas and KOQ are garnering trade interest

I'm sure those two and a few others on the team have appeal to various teams. What's coming back to us is obviously the great unknown. Are teams offering straight up expiring? Or are they offering back contracts of similar length? If caps space is the goal - do we just dump those players into a team's open cap space for a crappy second rounder?
RE: People STILL want Winslow?  
Ira : 10/13/2017 10:45 am : link
In comment 13646675 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
What the hell? He's awful.


I do think that defense is underrated by most fans and media, but Winslow's offense is so awful that he won't be in the nba for very long.
RE: Horrendous  
djm : 10/13/2017 10:50 am : link
In comment 13646656 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
defense and very little "go to" proven offense. Any night where THjr or KP are having an off night you are looking at Willy, Beasley and the like to help CARRY the offense. This idea that some have of the Knicks pushing for .500 and the playoffs is absurd.


Horn's influences will surely get this team to play over its head. You know they will play tenacious defense even if lacking in that area.....




jk...28 wins tops.
The only real drama  
bceagle05 : 10/13/2017 11:00 am : link
is whether or not there will be any typical Knicks drama. Is there a midseason coaching change? Is KP still a diva? Do the benched big men bitch and moan about it? Hopefully they just stay under the radar, deal off a couple of vets, and look forward to the draft.
I  
DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 11:00 am : link
just don't want the season to be a total circus. All I care about is KP/Frank/Willy/Dotson having fruitful developmental seasons AND things staying "normal bad NBA team" level and not off-court bizarre Knicks-only stuff where we again are dealing with KP wanting out etc etc.
hopefully by this  
Enzo : 10/13/2017 11:04 am : link
time next year KP has already signed his max extension. If he doesn't, it's going to make a lot of the previous drama seem tame by comparison.
Good job handling Free Agency, Phil  
Heisenberg : 10/13/2017 11:07 am : link
Quote:
I heard some horror stories about Phil in presentation situations with players – unprepared, just disorganized,” Wojnarowski said. “And sometimes, he’d have Steve Mills in there, who’d try to re-direct him. But I know of a couple players who walked out of meetings in a couple different free-agent scenarios and, “Wow, that was Phil Jackson? That’s not how I imagined he’d be.”

from Begley talking to Woj on Woj's podcast. - ( New Window )
.  
DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 11:12 am : link
ESPN NBA analyst Jeff Van Gundy was asked on a conference call about the Knicks this season and if he thought Kristaps Porzingis was ready to take the next step forward in his career: "I think the Knicks obviously have declared what they want to do, which is rebuild, and so much is going to be -- this season is going to be about Porzingis and Hernangomez, their development, and Frank's ability to learn the NBA quickly at a difficult position and get him significant minutes to grow. This is a great opportunity for Porzingis. Hopefully he can remain healthy. I did not think he made the jump that everyone expected last year. There was a lot of commotion and noise last year that surrounded the Knicks that didn't have anything to do with winning or development, so this year hopefully it's a calmer environment, but he's got to take responsibility and accountability for doing what great players do, which is produce every night and unite your team through your effort and unselfishness."


Ian Begley, ESPN Staff Writer
Sounds right  
idiotsavant : 10/13/2017 11:33 am : link
My fear then would be this.

If its seen as a developmental year for the young players, coach might be tempted to 'try a bit of this and a bit of that' and see what sticks, which, like the Giants comments in pre-season, if you lack a particular scheme, style, method, or technique - such that the kids can get a groove going in-, bad things happen. Its not just the W/L.

In other words, young players need that, that feeling of being in a groove, that they know which way things are going, win or loose, what the style of play is, what their roll is, or they risk not developing as players, get frustrated, exhausted or injured.

Win or loose, you need a particular style of play and an identity to build on. Once again, see players leave the team, fit into other teams, as roll players, in systems that do 'groove', and win.

You cannot just 'plan to experiment' with young players.
Knicks need to suck for next 2-3 years  
Vanzetti : 10/13/2017 12:09 pm : link
That’s the only way to rebuild.

They should be looking to acquire picks several years in the future, like Boston did with the Nets.

Being terrible for the next two seasons will be a piece of cake.  
bceagle05 : 10/13/2017 12:14 pm : link
Part two of the plan has to be to remove the dysfunction from the basketball operation. Perry has made a nice first impression, but he and Mills needs to commit to a coach - be it Hornacek or someone else - and figure out what Knicks basketball is gonna look like beyond the typical rebuilding platitudes of "youth," "intensity," "effort" etc.
just find an identity to suck at  
idiotsavant : 10/13/2017 12:28 pm : link
or you waste the porzingases and frenchies of the world
Sounds  
DanMetroMan : 10/13/2017 12:47 pm : link
like Enes Kanter will be the starter opening night.
RE: I  
Mike from SI : 10/13/2017 2:42 pm : link
In comment 13646734 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
just don't want the season to be a total circus. All I care about is KP/Frank/Willy/Dotson having fruitful developmental seasons AND things staying "normal bad NBA team" level and not off-court bizarre Knicks-only stuff where we again are dealing with KP wanting out etc etc.


Agree 100%. Well stated.
I also want Frenchy  
Carl in CT : 10/13/2017 3:02 pm : link
To show he belongs. Cause if Monk and DSJ become All Stars (that we passed on) would really piss me off.
Carl same here...  
Chris684 : 10/13/2017 4:35 pm : link
I'm trying to remain open-minded on our draft pick but I keep going back to draft night where I heard every analyst compare him to George Hill in best case scenario.

I'm sure hoping for more than that.
I have my fingers crossed, too...  
manh george : 10/13/2017 5:53 pm : link
but exactly how many analysts on draft night had scouted Ntilikina as often as the Knicks had? Or could even spell his name?
hornacek said  
nygiants16 : 10/13/2017 6:40 pm : link
kp and frank would play if it was regular season game
Watched Frank N. in the one game he has  
Chris L. : 10/13/2017 6:51 pm : link
played while not being injured. Absolute criminal negligence that Jackson picked him over Dennis Smith. We will all regret that one for a long, long time.
Last season, according to ESPN's Real Plus Minus,  
Ira : 10/13/2017 6:52 pm : link
George Hill was the 6th ranked point guard in the league.
Link - ( New Window )
RE: Watched Frank N. in the one game he has  
nygiants16 : 10/13/2017 7:09 pm : link
In comment 13647375 Chris L. said:
Quote:
played while not being injured. Absolute criminal negligence that Jackson picked him over Dennis Smith. We will all regret that one for a long, long time.


wow i didnt know 1 game defined a career good work
re: DSJr  
PaulBlakeTSU : 10/13/2017 7:31 pm : link
I worry that the way he leaps and lands will lead to chronic knee injuries
The way everyone acts around here  
Carl in CT : 10/13/2017 7:37 pm : link
If DSJ gets hurt it will be like "See I told you", if Frenchy keeps sitting out it will be hey you can't blame management for injuries. Double standard?
RE: The way everyone acts around here  
bceagle05 : 10/13/2017 7:53 pm : link
In comment 13647437 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
If DSJ gets hurt it will be like "See I told you", if Frenchy keeps sitting out it will be hey you can't blame management for injuries. Double standard?


And if we drafted Smith and he got hurt the two sides would have the same type of fight.
so much for this year is about youth  
nygiants16 : 10/13/2017 7:58 pm : link
oquinn ahead of willy...makes sense..

Tough night  
Carl in CT : 10/13/2017 8:02 pm : link
Yanks, Rangers & Knicks all at the same time.
RE: so much for this year is about youth  
Ten Ton Hammer : 10/13/2017 11:10 pm : link
In comment 13647451 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
oquinn ahead of willy...makes sense..
They're both going to play a lot. It's an 82 game season.
Regarding Frank N. vs. Dennis Smith  
Chris L. : 10/14/2017 12:18 pm : link
one guy is an explosive athlete the other is not. You don't need a whole bunch of time to figure that out. This is the NBA. Point guards who are not explosive have an up hill road. I am a big Knicks fan. I will be rooting hard for the French kid but I'm here to tell you passing on Smith was a BIG mistake.
RE: Regarding Frank N. vs. Dennis Smith  
nygiants16 : 10/14/2017 12:33 pm : link
In comment 13648044 Chris L. said:
Quote:
one guy is an explosive athlete the other is not. You don't need a whole bunch of time to figure that out. This is the NBA. Point guards who are not explosive have an up hill road. I am a big Knicks fan. I will be rooting hard for the French kid but I'm here to tell you passing on Smith was a BIG mistake.


huh? so being able to junp out of the gym makes a player have more potential?

chris paul? tony parker? 2 guys who are not crazy athletes...

fact you have no idea what frank wjll become, and saying after 1 game you know smith will be better is a joke..

RE: RE: Regarding Frank N. vs. Dennis Smith  
Canton : 10/14/2017 12:37 pm : link
In comment 13648049 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 13648044 Chris L. said:


Quote:


one guy is an explosive athlete the other is not. You don't need a whole bunch of time to figure that out. This is the NBA. Point guards who are not explosive have an up hill road. I am a big Knicks fan. I will be rooting hard for the French kid but I'm here to tell you passing on Smith was a BIG mistake.



huh? so being able to junp out of the gym makes a player have more potential?

chris paul? tony parker? 2 guys who are not crazy athletes...

fact you have no idea what frank wjll become, and saying after 1 game you know smith will be better is a joke..


Chris L and Earl the Goat must be roommates
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