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Very Disappointed John Mara still supports McAdoo and Reese

gidiefor : Mod : 10/18/2017 2:52 pm
Quote:
Giants co-owner John Mara can't hide his feelings about his team's dismal start to the season.

"I'm very disappointed," Mara said at the NFL's fall owners meeting. "We're 1-5. How could I possibly feel good about that?"

Mara has heard fans' unhappiness with coach Ben McAdoo and general manager Jerry Reese. But never one to make rash decisions, Mara said his support hasn't wavered.

"I do hear what (fans) have to say, but at the end of the day, we're still in the middle of the season.We're trying to win games and do the best we can," Mara said. "I support both of them. You have to. It's hard enough to win in this league. But if the general manager and the head coach don't have the support of ownership, it makes it almost impossible."


- more by Dan Duggan -
'Very disappointed' Giants owner John Mara still supports Ben McAdoo and Jerry Reese - ( New Window )
One of the reasons  
ryanmkeane : 10/18/2017 2:55 pm : link
Giants are a class organization is they don't make decisions in a vacuum. They'll evaluate how these players respond the rest of the year.
10  
joeinpa : 10/18/2017 2:58 pm : link
Games left. I d be very disappointed if that wasn t their public stance
Following his token of support  
Chris684 : 10/18/2017 2:59 pm : link
he says "you have to".

That is certainly not a ringing endorsement. Sounds like John is plenty pissed off but recognizes that even though it's a long shot, this team can hang around a playoff race if it gets its act together.
Title was a bit off, I thought Gidie was disappointed  
jcn56 : 10/18/2017 3:02 pm : link
Uncharacteristic of him...
"Class organization"  
lawguy9801 : 10/18/2017 3:02 pm : link
I'd say they're too comfortable in what is familiar and are not striving enough to be a perennial great team. They'd rather have "class" and be mediocre than do what it takes to try to make themselves a perennial contender. Starting with: shit-canning their underperforming failure of a GM.
The thread title makes it seem like you  
Keith : 10/18/2017 3:03 pm : link
are disappointed that Mara still supports McAdoo and Reese. This ownership doesn't panic or make knee jerk reactions. That's a good thing.
Like he said, IT'S THE MIDDLE OF THE SEASON  
BigBlue4You09 : 10/18/2017 3:07 pm : link
The Giants aren't going to cut bait, we all know that. So of course he's going to "support" them. Doesn't mean they won't be gone after the year.
.  
Danny Kanell : 10/18/2017 3:11 pm : link
"we're still in the middle of the season."

Am I reading too much into it or is this a pretty telling statement?
Fake title!  
CT Charlie : 10/18/2017 3:12 pm : link
Good tidbit, but the thread title is inadvertently misleading in an almost clickbait-seeking way.
RE: .  
lawguy9801 : 10/18/2017 3:14 pm : link
In comment 13655229 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
"we're still in the middle of the season."

Am I reading too much into it or is this a pretty telling statement?


Right. And "I have to" implies that he doesn't necessarily WANT to support them but realizes that that's the position he has to take in order to try to make the most out of this season. Reese was on a short leash a couple of years ago, and I'd imagine that it's even shorter or almost nonexistent at this point.
RE: Fake title!  
Danny Kanell : 10/18/2017 3:14 pm : link
In comment 13655233 CT Charlie said:
Quote:
Good tidbit, but the thread title is inadvertently misleading in an almost clickbait-seeking way.


Ha, I know it wasn't meant that way but the thread title definitely had be thinking that gidiefor is pissed that Mara still supports these guys.
Sorry - I that to clip things in the title  
gidiefor : Mod : 10/18/2017 3:14 pm : link
the full version of which is printed at the bottom of the OP with the link.

I did not express myself above -- only reporting what was written -- but it's a fact that I am very disappointed at the way the first five games went -- I also thought Mara expressed it well -- especially his comments about the defense playing the Broncos the way we all thought they should have played this season.

I don't think his support is a ringing endorsement by the way.

mealymouth mara  
sundayatone : 10/18/2017 3:15 pm : link
all talk very little action
They'll have missed the playoffs 7/9 seasons and finished below .500  
Devon : 10/18/2017 3:17 pm : link
4/5 when this season wraps up.

There's nothing rash about cleaning house at this point. There's just looking for excuses to not do it.
makes no sense to clean house during the season. that said,  
Victor in CT : 10/18/2017 3:18 pm : link
while patience is a good thing, how long of a rope does Reese get? He was told "it's on him" after 2015 and he somehow escaped when Coughlin got axed. 2 years later 1 and 5 and the team is in turmoil. And no, the record had ZERO to do with injuries.
RE:  
an_idol_mind : 10/18/2017 3:21 pm : link
In comment 13655211 lawguy9801 said:
Quote:
I'd say they're too comfortable in what is familiar and are not striving enough to be a perennial great team. They'd rather have "class" and be mediocre than do what it takes to try to make themselves a perennial contender. Starting with: shit-canning their underperforming failure of a GM.


Whenever people complain about the Giants' "class" getting in the way of championships, I have to wonder what sort of team they'd rather emulate.

Do you want to be more like the Cowboys, who don't worry about "class" and have a whole two playoff wins this century to show for it?

Sure, there's the Patriots, but they're not really the franchise you want to point to when you're saying the Giants should be more impulsive and can their coach/GM.

While the Giants have been bad for several seasons now, the fact is that from 2005 through 2011 they were one of the most successful franchises in the league. They achieved that by not panicking. If they had listened to fans, Coughlin would have been fired in 2006 and there would be two fewer Super Bowls.

Im not trying to defend McAdoo or Reese, but freaking out and firing them mid-season doesn't accomplish much of anything.
RE: makes no sense to clean house during the season. that said,  
an_idol_mind : 10/18/2017 3:26 pm : link
In comment 13655245 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
while patience is a good thing, how long of a rope does Reese get? He was told "it's on him" after 2015 and he somehow escaped when Coughlin got axed. 2 years later 1 and 5 and the team is in turmoil. And no, the record had ZERO to do with injuries.


To be fair, Reese seemed to have vindicated himself last season when his acquisitions helped to completely turn the defense around.

Just a few months ago, it looked like the Giants had done the right thing by getting rid of Coughlin and bringing Reese in. And, honestly, a couple of better in-game coaching decisions could have completely changed the way this season feels right now.
RE: 10  
BlueHurricane : 10/18/2017 3:26 pm : link
In comment 13655199 joeinpa said:
Quote:
Games left. I d be very disappointed if that wasn t their public stance


THIS ^^^
He would never undermine them 6 games into the season  
steve in ky : 10/18/2017 3:26 pm : link
regardless of how might feel about them.

If he felt strong enough to publicly state that he no longer supported them he would also be firing him at that point.
Being 11-5 and getting back to the playoffs does get you something  
Ten Ton Hammer : 10/18/2017 3:29 pm : link
How much that plays into it is the discretion of ownership, but you can't just look past that as if it didn't happen.

And player performance shouldn't be separated from this as well. When guys are not playing to the standard they have demonstrated they're capable of, how much of that falls on which guy? Somebody needs to write a book on this season and attempt to explain why this defense sleepwalked through 5 weeks.
he's  
Les in TO : 10/18/2017 3:30 pm : link
not jerry jones and going to throw his GM and coach publicly under the bus not even half way through the season. that said, the quote is not exactly a guarantee that either's job is secure.
RE: RE: makes no sense to clean house during the season. that said,  
Victor in CT : 10/18/2017 3:30 pm : link
In comment 13655254 an_idol_mind said:
Quote:
In comment 13655245 Victor in CT said:


Quote:


while patience is a good thing, how long of a rope does Reese get? He was told "it's on him" after 2015 and he somehow escaped when Coughlin got axed. 2 years later 1 and 5 and the team is in turmoil. And no, the record had ZERO to do with injuries.



To be fair, Reese seemed to have vindicated himself last season when his acquisitions helped to completely turn the defense around.

Just a few months ago, it looked like the Giants had done the right thing by getting rid of Coughlin and bringing Reese in. And, honestly, a couple of better in-game coaching decisions could have completely changed the way this season feels right now.


I had no problem with TC going, but I thought Reese deserved to go as much if not more. And let's nt forget, the 2016 FA signing binge was necessitated by Reese's shitty drafting.
What if the Giants finish 8-8? Who gets how much blame?  
Ivan15 : 10/18/2017 3:49 pm : link
If the Giants finish strong, would you say Reese gave McAdoo enough talent but the Giants went 0-5 because McAdoo didn't know how to use the talent until he pulled his head out of his nether regions? I would say that!

If the Giants finish with 4 or fewer wins, you have to say the talent wasn't there and no one could have made this team look good. That would be Reese's fault.

Somewhere between 4 and 8 wins, the blame will have to land on both of them.
RE: RE: RE: makes no sense to clean house during the season. that said,  
an_idol_mind : 10/18/2017 3:51 pm : link
In comment 13655262 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
In comment 13655254 an_idol_mind said:


Quote:


In comment 13655245 Victor in CT said:


Quote:


while patience is a good thing, how long of a rope does Reese get? He was told "it's on him" after 2015 and he somehow escaped when Coughlin got axed. 2 years later 1 and 5 and the team is in turmoil. And no, the record had ZERO to do with injuries.



To be fair, Reese seemed to have vindicated himself last season when his acquisitions helped to completely turn the defense around.

Just a few months ago, it looked like the Giants had done the right thing by getting rid of Coughlin and bringing Reese in. And, honestly, a couple of better in-game coaching decisions could have completely changed the way this season feels right now.



I had no problem with TC going, but I thought Reese deserved to go as much if not more. And let's nt forget, the 2016 FA signing binge was necessitated by Reese's shitty drafting.


I agree that Reese should have been shown the door. However, I can see why ownership chose not to give him the axe.

2013 was a disaster, but it was Reese's first losing season as a GM.

2014 was arguably the time to clean house, but since they decided to keep Coughlin it didn't make sense to remove the GM.

2015 would have been a good time to give Reese the axe, but he also hadn't been given a chance to hire his own head coach, so there was some logic in keeping him.

In 2016, the team obviously had some success and it looked like things were changing for the better.

There were a couple of years where removing Reese would have made sense and would have been the best for the team in hindsight. However, it's not like the team didn't have decent reasons for keeping him.

If the Giants have a 1-15 or 2-14 type of season like many are expecting right now, it would be very hard for them to defend a decision to stand pat and not tear the whole thing down.
RE: mealymouth mara  
Motley Two : 10/18/2017 4:01 pm : link
In comment 13655241 sundayatone said:
Quote:
all talk very little action



"mealymouthed" doesn't really work with "all talk"
He should be supporting Reece  
Rflairr : 10/18/2017 4:16 pm : link
But Not McAdoo
That was not exactly a strong statement of support  
Vanzetti : 10/18/2017 4:20 pm : link
Mara said he supports them because you have to support your GM and coach during the season?
That is very tepid support

Yep, not a strong show of support at all for Reese.  
Dave in Hoboken : 10/18/2017 4:22 pm : link
Very good sign.
It's a long season  
Bluesbreaker : 10/18/2017 4:34 pm : link
that stance can change not easily but how many times have
you heard the vote of confidence then the guy gets shit canned .
I hear you and I have been one of the most vocal critics of both  
Matt M. : 10/18/2017 4:37 pm : link
Reese and McAdoo here. But, that statement can also very likely just be rhetoric. They aren't firing either one during the season and I don't blame them. So, while they are on board, ownership will "support" them.
Gidi wants to fight Mara !!  
djm : 10/18/2017 4:38 pm : link
Pass it on..
What else is he going to say ...  
Beer Man : 10/18/2017 4:54 pm : link
Regardless of what he thinks regarding the futures of Mac&Cheese & Reese's Pieces, do you really think he would say anything else while the season is in progress?
I'm expecting the same next season as well  
micky : 10/18/2017 5:01 pm : link
this is their product and they're happy with it..nothing can do but accept it
These next few weeks are going to be crucial  
gmen9892 : 10/18/2017 5:01 pm : link
To both Reese and McAdoo's future. If this team rallies and fights hard for a playoff spot, I think both will be back on solid ground. If they go back to their losing ways and end up with less than 6 wins on the year, it will get shakier and shakier with each loss.
RE: I'm expecting the same next season as well  
BillT : 10/18/2017 5:06 pm : link
In comment 13655374 micky said:
Quote:
this is their product and they're happy with it..nothing can do but accept it

Yeah, that's how they won 4 SB and went to the playoffs last year. Because "this is their product and they're happy with it.." BBI at it's finest.
Man, you guys jump ship in bunches.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 10/18/2017 5:11 pm : link
And can't wait to wave that "proud of this franchise, let's laugh at dallas" flag when they win.
Thread starter  
RetroJint : 10/18/2017 6:03 pm : link
Man you jump off fast, off first . Let the guy coach this season. Most head-coaching changes don't work out. I once did a 20-year study cataloging each change. 3 possible outcomes: 1. Team improved. 2. Team got worse. 3. Team remained the same. ( in other words, it didn't work out). 82% fell in categories 1 & 2.

Sometimes you hit it straight. Mike Tomlin was a great choice . He wasn't even a DC. He was a position coach from a crap team. But, for the most part, you get guys who bumped up from great units, who then sucked as HCs. Then there are the retreads. Don't go with pedigree. In other words - Belichick acolytes. Secretariat's offsprings were all flat tires on the racetrack .

Don't know if you've noticed but these are difficult times to coach, what with the social-Justice issues and other sundry distractions. The main guys in college want nothing to do with the NFL, especially since salaries are commensurate with the wage scale for most teams in the NFL. So that source of candidates has dried up.

Then there is the Cowher obsession that never goes away. Thr guy is never coaching again. He's great at what he does. They pay him well. People care about what he says. He stays relevant. He enjoys it.

Hope that McAdoo is the guy.

Excuse me  
RetroJint : 10/18/2017 6:04 pm : link
82% fell in categories 2 &3
Even if  
old man : 10/18/2017 6:14 pm : link
He wants to throw either under the bus it would reopen all the rift of the last few weeks that the win closed up at least temporarily.... and you could have your GM and coach quitting on the organization as we've feared the players did with Mc.
Silence is golden....til season end at least.Then if necessary we get the ANOTHER DIRECTION... and IN
THE BEST INTERESTS OF THE GIANTS.. speeches.
Think it is past time that Reese and his crew (Ross etc)  
TMS : 10/18/2017 6:42 pm : link
were fired for incompetence and past performance. McAdoo or Sullivan should be OC and Spagnuolo the DC under a new GM like Gettleman. The GM should evalute and upgrade the personnel in the scouting system for drafts and FA.
.  
arcarsenal : 10/18/2017 7:11 pm : link
I don't think anyone really benefits by firing Reese and McAdoo mid-season. I think the best course of action at this point is to let the season play out and see what comes of it.

I think we're way too far in the hole to even think about the playoffs or anything like that - but if the team comes together and plays good football down the stretch, perhaps that'll change the overall outlook going into next year.

I lost a lot of the faith I had in McAdoo this year, but I think we may as well ride it out with him at this point and see what happens the rest of the way.
What he said was..  
EricJ : 10/18/2017 7:22 pm : link
1. You have to support the GM and coaches that are in place now otherwise it makes it harder for them to do their job.
2. The win vs Denver was nice but it is just one win.
3. He will evaluate the situation at the end of the season. No changes will be made mid-season.
RE: The thread title makes it seem like you  
FStubbs : 10/19/2017 6:12 am : link
In comment 13655213 Keith said:
Quote:
are disappointed that Mara still supports McAdoo and Reese. This ownership doesn't panic or make knee jerk reactions. That's a good thing.


Firing a general manager with one winning season in the last 6 and 4 first round disappointments in the last 6, and a floundering head coach, isn't a knee jerk reaction.
RE: .  
FStubbs : 10/19/2017 6:13 am : link
In comment 13655596 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
I don't think anyone really benefits by firing Reese and McAdoo mid-season. I think the best course of action at this point is to let the season play out and see what comes of it.

I think we're way too far in the hole to even think about the playoffs or anything like that - but if the team comes together and plays good football down the stretch, perhaps that'll change the overall outlook going into next year.

I lost a lot of the faith I had in McAdoo this year, but I think we may as well ride it out with him at this point and see what happens the rest of the way.


You get a lot of benefit by firing Reese mid season. The new GM has time to put together a new scouting staff, evaluate players and coaches, and create a new team philosophy before the offseason.
playoffs last year  
bc4life : 10/19/2017 6:20 am : link
lost several close games this year. could be 5 -1, or 4-2. I'd be disappointed if he was talking about firing them, especially McAdoo.

I do think they need to look at scouting department or approach to talent evaluation. They have a lot of 1st round picks, not playing like 1st rounders.
RE: RE: .  
CromartiesKid21 : 10/19/2017 6:28 am : link
In comment 13655913 FStubbs said:
Quote:
In comment 13655596 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


I don't think anyone really benefits by firing Reese and McAdoo mid-season. I think the best course of action at this point is to let the season play out and see what comes of it.

I think we're way too far in the hole to even think about the playoffs or anything like that - but if the team comes together and plays good football down the stretch, perhaps that'll change the overall outlook going into next year.

I lost a lot of the faith I had in McAdoo this year, but I think we may as well ride it out with him at this point and see what happens the rest of the way.



You get a lot of benefit by firing Reese mid season. The new GM has time to put together a new scouting staff, evaluate players and coaches, and create a new team philosophy before the offseason.

Nah we have Chris Mara for all that
Any smart owner is going to support his guys...  
Gary from The East End : Admin : 10/19/2017 6:54 am : link
...until he doesn't. Then they're fired.
RE: Any smart owner is going to support his guys...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 10/19/2017 7:18 am : link
In comment 13655923 Gary from The East End said:
Quote:
...until he doesn't. Then they're fired.


Yup.
RE: RE: .  
jcn56 : 10/19/2017 10:04 am : link
In comment 13655913 FStubbs said:
Quote:
In comment 13655596 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


I don't think anyone really benefits by firing Reese and McAdoo mid-season. I think the best course of action at this point is to let the season play out and see what comes of it.

I think we're way too far in the hole to even think about the playoffs or anything like that - but if the team comes together and plays good football down the stretch, perhaps that'll change the overall outlook going into next year.

I lost a lot of the faith I had in McAdoo this year, but I think we may as well ride it out with him at this point and see what happens the rest of the way.



You get a lot of benefit by firing Reese mid season. The new GM has time to put together a new scouting staff, evaluate players and coaches, and create a new team philosophy before the offseason.


Really? The replacement GM and staff that you're assembling are all off at this time of year, not working for other teams? Sounds like a great crew you're putting together.

There's a reason teams fire these guys at the end of the season - it's because you need to hire new guys, and good ones aren't usually just hanging out at the local Starbucks waiting for the phone to ring.
RE: makes no sense to clean house during the season. that said,  
TMS : 10/19/2017 11:00 am : link
In comment 13655245 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
while patience is a good thing, how long of a rope does Reese get? He was told "it's on him" after 2015 and he somehow escaped when Coughlin got axed. 2 years later 1 and 5 and the team is in turmoil. And no, the record had ZERO to do with injuries.
Think this shocking start has them thinking of a major change in the football side of the organization. That comes with a new GM or VP of Football with the power to overhaul everything. Coaches and others (scouting) could be kept or gone in that scenario.
my hate or fear for McAdoo  
djm : 10/19/2017 2:01 pm : link
sort of died down a few days before the Denver game for some reason. I accepted the season, and took the approach to judge things at the end of the year. Wasn't expecting much but you never know...let it play out. After the win I now feel like they will battle for the rest of the season. How many wins remains to be seen. Still terribly frustrated with the early season but talk to me in January. You never know what can and will happen. I think that's probably how anyone should feel right now, including the owners.
RE: RE: RE: . 13655596  
TMS : 10/19/2017 2:29 pm : link
In comment 13656119 jcn56 said:
Quote:
In comment 13655913 FStubbs said:


Quote:


In comment 13655596 arcarsenal said:


Quote:Arc Are you suggesting that the only time a major front office change can be made is at the end of the current season ? This BS has kept these fools in power long enough. A new GM or VP of Football can bring in staff anytime and do what is necessary to get rid of this dead wood. What is this ? a never ending continuation in incompetency. Reese got his chance that is all anybody gets in this gams. MO


I don't think anyone really benefits by firing Reese and McAdoo mid-season. I think the best course of action at this point is to let the season play out and see what comes of it.

I think we're way too far in the hole to even think about the playoffs or anything like that - but if the team comes together and plays good football down the stretch, perhaps that'll change the overall outlook going into next year.

I lost a lot of the faith I had in McAdoo this year, but I think we may as well ride it out with him at this point and see what happens the rest of the way.



You get a lot of benefit by firing Reese mid season. The new GM has time to put together a new scouting staff, evaluate players and coaches, and create a new team philosophy before the offseason.



Really? The replacement GM and staff that you're assembling are all off at this time of year, not working for other teams? Sounds like a great crew you're putting together.

There's a reason teams fire these guys at the end of the season - it's because you need to hire new guys, and good ones aren't usually just hanging out at the local Starbucks waiting for the phone to ring.
RE: RE: .  
Ten Ton Hammer : 10/19/2017 3:22 pm : link
In comment 13655913 FStubbs said:
Quote:
In comment 13655596 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


I don't think anyone really benefits by firing Reese and McAdoo mid-season. I think the best course of action at this point is to let the season play out and see what comes of it.

I think we're way too far in the hole to even think about the playoffs or anything like that - but if the team comes together and plays good football down the stretch, perhaps that'll change the overall outlook going into next year.

I lost a lot of the faith I had in McAdoo this year, but I think we may as well ride it out with him at this point and see what happens the rest of the way.



You get a lot of benefit by firing Reese mid season. The new GM has time to put together a new scouting staff, evaluate players and coaches, and create a new team philosophy before the offseason.


The college season is underway right now. Scouting is happening now. We're already half a dozen games in, and scouts are on assignment.

That's why when teams clean house they do so in spring after the draft.
Mara and Tiche made this mess  
LauderdaleMatty : 10/19/2017 4:02 pm : link
He needs to support them then he needs to fire them and hire football
People to Do the job and stop Interfering so much

They made TC fire Gilbride, then Fewell, then he got canned while Reese
Ross and Chris Mara got and still get
Total passes.

They are very loyal in general but classy when it has suits them. Upper
Level management Has been meddling for years w the team and allowed
TC to take the fall.

IMO TC needed to move on but that the FO has gotten a free pass
For years makes it obvious they are equally culpable and
Don't want any of the blame for
Their interventions.

Classy may not mean the same thing to me as it does to others. They meddled W TC but not the GM or Chris Mara who is ownership. Not classy when the wheels come off and they allow
Others to suffer from their bad decisions

Somebody up above said the Giants are content with mediocrity.  
81_Great_Dane : 10/19/2017 5:11 pm : link
I don't think that's true, exactly. Every time they hire a coach or GM, they are hoping it's Parcells or Howell or Coughlin or George Young. It takes a while to figure out what you have, and if it's not working, then you're back to square one with the next guy. A few bad choices in a row and that's about 15 years. That's a helluva long time.

With the Mara family, I wonder about 1) Their own involvement with the business. Are they the best people for the job? and 2) What influences their hiring decisions for people outside the family? I'm not making any accusations, I just end up scratching my head sometimes. Like "What was behind that decision? I don't get it." But I'm in no way a football insider.

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