I'd expect a close game, something like 17-16....Seattle isn't killing people with their offense. Wilson's scramble ability is a wildcard factor, though.
I agree. I think it's a toss-up game. I have no idea how a team that struggles to score points could be a 4.5-6 point favorite over the Giants. Giants have to play excellent around the margins like last Sunday... excellent defense with no turnovers or special teams gaffs.
I agree with you, he will usually look for any reason NOT to fire someone or NOT to make a change.
I think it's different this time. I think TC had an extended leash (2013, 14 and 15) not only because of his resume but because of the significance of TC being one of the last few organizational connections to his father.
Obviously Mac doesnt have the nostalgic value. I can also see where 11-5 actually works against him. Basically, every decision this past offseason was made in "win-now" mode with an eye on this and next season. Signing Marshall, retaining JPP, the high draft pick of another weapon for Eli. More than anything else Mac's fate is tied to and might be doomed because of Reese. If Mara removes him, Mac won't survive and you'll see a total regime change.
I have been saying since things have gone terribly south that a lot of us might be surprised this offseason barring a miracle.
We finish 7-9. Mara incorrectly comes to the conclusion that the structural problems don't exist or have been addressed. We miss out on the franchise QB and draft the defensive end.
2018 and the offense with a 37-year old Eli still can't score, the special teams keep losing games, and the defense alternates the good with the bad and we're flirting with 8-8 again.
DRAFT BETTER! MAKE BETTER FREE AGENT DECISIONS! FIX THE FREAKING OFFENSIVE LINE AND RUN THE DAMN BALL! It's been almost a decade now (the 2011 wasn't good either...those guys were on their last legs). GET A REAL SPECIAL TEAMS COACH!
Last year our defense struggled couldn't keep late leads and had no turnovers until game six
Game six was Rams in London game
suddenly our defense turned on - (Landon Collins amazing pick 6 )
this year the same thing happen
Defense struggled couldn't keep late leads and had no turnovers
Game 6 it wakes up
Can someone please explain to me how Tom Quinn still has a job?
We had some awful ST units under TC.. I too wonder how he made it this far.. Is there any longer tenured ST Coordinators around the league? He is in year 10 at least.. When has ST been a strength? Maybe one or two seasons under Quinn's ten year watch, sad.
I will say that I'm at least comforted by having Davis Webb here. If that is how it turns out, we are not without a post-Eli plan/option. I know it's likely we won't see or know much about Webb by season's end but I like the Cal connection to Rodgers and now Goff who seems to be getting it. I know that's immaterial but does help.
The key is Reese. With no playoffs I don't see how Reese stays and I don't think Mara will continue to make change one piece at a time.
Great preview and vent. I don't know how anybody can argue these points that you brought up especially the O-line configuration how does a team at least not explore the options that you have.
My biggest fear is that they win about 5 games and nothing changes other then a poor draft pick and huge amounts of money thrown at OBJ
There seemed to be an uptick in the special teams when Larry Izzo was an assistant. But things seemed to get worse again when he was hired by the Texans. Coincidence?
It's not mandatory to draft a qb high this year and I think you are reading too much into the stat line. The offense did a good job jumping to a lead and then ball control in the second half. Given the circumstances that is much better than all the empty passing yards in losses we have seen.
i agree there should be outrage at 0-5 and if there is not a serious swing this season in record a 5-11 campaign should still mean changes need to be made.
that harps on the Giants and not defending Eli and his HOF stats. The bottom line is that this team needs a new Franchise QB....We as fans can take bad seasons if we have a franchise qb learning...getting to 6-10 or 7-9 does absolutely zero for me. I saw nothing from the offense except a few busted up the gut runs from Orleans for big yards. The offense and Eli look the norm as below avergage as can be. The defense played well but vs a pedestrian qb. Worst thing that can happen to this team is to win 5-7 games...It will mean same old same old...1 season of playoffs in 6 and counting...Eli will end his career missing the playoffs in most of the last 10 years....
Can someone please explain to me how Tom Quinn still has a job?
This has been a bone of contention for me the last number of years.....in favor of Quinn.
Special teams coach to me is basically responsible for coverage of kicks and return of kicks.
There are only so many ways to do it, as opposed to offense and defense where there are a multitude of matchups and options. Those positions are where coaching really can make a difference.
It comes down to players wanting to do it, and following instructions on specials.
To me, it's been more the players than Quinn.
And as far as the two kickers, if you have a really good punter and a really good place kicker, that makes your ST coach look much better than he really is most likely.
Having said that, sure you could make a case for replacing Quinn....but how much would it really help?
I think the last four games are what we will see a lot of the rest of the season. Obviously not so much success in the passing game as Eli enjoyed prior to WR-4, but a lot of competitive, close games which could go either way depending on how well the defense plays and how many breaks the Giants get.
Wouldn't be surprised if in our remaining 10 games we win about 25% of them (2-3 more wins).
I LOVED your criticisms of the coaching staff's personnel choices. Why has it taken so long to decide that maybe, just maybe the optimal line included Pugh at T and Fluker? Maybe they still don't feel that way. UGH. Can you imagine how we're going to feel if Richburg and Hart get 100% and they move everyone back to their original positions, only to struggle again?
Let's hope the newly shaped OL is up to another quality defensive front. They've got their work cut out for them.
be 3-3 or 4-2 had the defense shown some ability to come up with a key 4th quarter stop. If they were, the narrative is completely different although the injuries might have still occurred.
And it is 20/20 hindsight to say that the Marshall signing was bad now.
However, given they are 1-5 I dont see them beating Seattle which I guess is a good thing eventhough I will still feel shitty afterwards.
And Eric, you didn't have to go all the way back to 1990. The 2008 OL was pretty stout. :)
How Quinn still has a job is mind boggling. As far as the Seattle game is concerned, we will struggle to contain Wilson. That most likely will be enough for the Hawks to win this one. Our offense is not going to be very good from here forward. If we win games they will be 20-17 kinds of games.
That 2007 and 2011 were years where one play here or there and we have two less Lombardi’s. They were not great teams in any stretch of the imagination. Average is a better adjective. In fact management thought they had all the answers and didn’t make the improvements that average teams need to make. Those two trophies setup years of mediocre if not shitty football.
The defense played great despite not having Casillas?? Â
The game against Denver wasn't a good sign for the Giants, or something to celebrate even, it just proved that Ben McAdoo is in over his depth as a NFL Head Coach. His quote, about giving up play calling, referenced in your preview is infuriating to me. A total lack of self accountability.
The Broncos game should not be reason to Mara to keep McAdoo, it should be reason to fire him.
I feel that Reese has an inflated ego of the type that needs constant feeding. I think he tends to draft/sign people that have little chance of succeeding BUT if they do it's because of Jerry's genius !
I did this early in my career as a banking exec but learned eventually that it was short sighted.
In my 50 year career I observed that most people will sink to the lowest possible denominator. I think that's what happened to the defence the first 5 games. "Why bust our asses if mgmt. did nothing to improve the offence."
I found in the bank or any large organization that people try to "fly under the radar"and become complacent if allowed to!
I think that the giants organization as a group have condoned this because it's easier and they don't have to work as hard and are not accountable.
We see this in government as well.
I know that Mara/Tisch need to grow some balls and push their people to succeed and use the big stick hard and often.
They need to do this now until this team knows that second or third best is not an option and that includes everybody including players, coaches,management,. Also the hot dog server!
EVERYBODY SHOULD WANT TO WIN AND DEMAND EXCELLENCE IN EVERYTHING THAT SAYS "GIANTS" !!!
I don't get why you are fixated on this issue. They had more time of possession than Denver, and were playing with a lead. Would you prefer that the Giants had 16 first downs, and that Darkwa didn't have a 47 yard run? Denver's 20 first downs amounted to 10 points, and seven of those were with 4 minutes left. On the ensuing drive, the Giants got a huge first down, on a 3rd and 9, when everyone knew they would run.
Denver's defense isn't exactly a pushover, and everyone expected the Giants to get crushed.
I'm not saying the Giants are some great team, and I have no clue what to expect this Sunday. I'm just not as much of a downer based on the Denver game.
watching practice during training camp😀 That was a funny preview not too upset are we?? Seriously im still not sure if this mess is coaching or the players (roster JR put together) and I would be Mara’s not sure who to blame either. The SAFE play for him is a complete house cleaning, but then he has to hire the right people
RE: RE: The defense played great despite not having Casillas?? Â
Why did the Giants draft Davis Webb knowing that the 2018 draft would be rich in QB talent? Because at the time they didn't think they would have a high enough draft pick in 2018 and decided to hedge their bets with Webb? I just don't get it.
If wins from here on out ruin draft position, how can you be doing anything other than taking the position that the Giants should tank the rest of the season, regardless of what they could be capable of doing? That whole concept leaves a very bad taste in my mouth for any team to do. Sure, play rookies, give them a chance to gain real game experience and develop them and see where it takes the team. But to advocate tanking is just awful, IMV.
As far as Quinn and still having a job - I think the Giants management is taking the path of least resistance. So few people seem to put nearly enough emphasis on special teams play than they should. Special teams performance win and lose games every single week - just look at last night's OAK/KC game as case in point. I've never understood why special teams never seem to be made much of a priority for any team, yet are so pivotal.
arms again.
Half the DBs on here ranted that Pugh wasn't at tackle. Couple of talent evaluators around here said he was best at guard.. his arms are 1/2 inch shorter than optimal. 1/2 inch - dick for brains.
All along it was obvious he had the feet and quickness to be either tackle. Frankly put, Pugh kicked Von Miller's ass. Guy got one sack that Eli walked into (he's been good at that recently).
Talent - it ain't talent. It's coaching. I look at other teams' rosters and say how are these guys better than what we have. Ok, LB, RB and some of the line, but almost every other position group is equal to or better than other teams.
And Eric, don't hold your breath for a franchise QB in this draft - there isn't one. You do not need a franchise QB to win. Look at the crap winning games around the NFL.
feel the same. I'm just very soured on this whole thing..until I see change then I'll get on board with them..right now, to me, the giants are irrelevant. thanks mr mara and crew
arms again.
Half the DBs on here ranted that Pugh wasn't at tackle. Couple of talent evaluators around here said he was best at guard.. his arms are 1/2 inch shorter than optimal. 1/2 inch - dick for brains.
All along it was obvious he had the feet and quickness to be either tackle. Frankly put, Pugh kicked Von Miller's ass. Guy got one sack that Eli walked into (he's been good at that recently).
Talent - it ain't talent. It's coaching. I look at other teams' rosters and say how are these guys better than what we have. Ok, LB, RB and some of the line, but almost every other position group is equal to or better than other teams.
And Eric, don't hold your breath for a franchise QB in this draft - there isn't one. You do not need a franchise QB to win. Look at the crap winning games around the NFL.
Who exactly are the crap QBs winning games in the NFL? You think the Packers are happy to lose their franchise QB? Think the Raiders aren't happy to have theirs back? You cannot win consistently in the NFL with crap QBs. That's ludicrous.
Who exactly are
arms again.
Half the DBs on here ranted that Pugh wasn't at tackle. Couple of talent evaluators around here said he was best at guard.. his arms are 1/2 inch shorter than optimal. 1/2 inch - dick for brains.
All along it was obvious he had the feet and quickness to be either tackle. Frankly put, Pugh kicked Von Miller's ass. Guy got one sack that Eli walked into (he's been good at that recently).
Talent - it ain't talent. It's coaching. I look at other teams' rosters and say how are these guys better than what we have. Ok, LB, RB and some of the line, but almost every other position group is equal to or better than other teams.
And Eric, don't hold your breath for a franchise QB in this draft - there isn't one. You do not need a franchise QB to win. Look at the crap winning games around the NFL.
Who exactly are the crap QBs winning games in the NFL? You think the Packers are happy to lose their franchise QB? Think the Raiders aren't happy to have theirs back? You cannot win consistently in the NFL with crap QBs. That's ludicrous.
Who exactly are
Because, one way or another, I don't think they well.
I think it's fairly obvious Eli is next up on the scapegoat pile and the team will use picking or trading up for a QB this draft and pairing him with a recovered Odell + Engram to sell the fanbase on a new era and better things to come, but what's rotten with this organization runs clearly deeper than that and that's what worries me about them winning meaningless games -- it's going to fully "let" them not clean house the way a team that will have finished under .500 4/5 seasons and have missed the playoff 7/9 years should.
They'll just move on to wasting a different QB's window, if this group can even properly evaluate and develop the right one anyway (highly questionable). Great.
We resigned both when many called for a changing of the guard Eli is who he is a top 13-16 QB in the NFL for years now with a major physical NFL shortfalls. JPP has one or two outstanding games then disappears for six to eight games before ending the season on IR, how many games does he have left this season? Everyone wants to blame the coaches and not the players but it’s the players who are on the field making or not making plays. Pugh is now the coming of saint Jude but he is in truth just another average NFL OL nothing more. If they loose this next game clean house trade those veteran players with even modest value build around the youth on this team forget the Super Bowl dream look to the future. Just so everyone knows Eli has been on the field for every game that reportable was wasted for his hall of fame post note no one else has played QB for this team quit blaming everyone else.
The Giants expected to be drafting late in the first round in 2018, not near the top. Hence, the flier on Webb.
Personally I think the conviction had to go deeper than "Webb is worth a flier". They clearly believed this year was going to be a good year. They could have strengthened any number of positions with a solid choice in the third round, thereby strengthening their chance at a SB run in 2017. I think they took Webb not because they didn't think they would be able to find someone next year (or any year later), but because they thought he was good value at that point, and because they believed he really can be special.
Now, if they go QB in round 1 of this year it won't say a lot about how they felt when they took Webb, but maybe how they feel about him on draft day 2018, or just that whoever they select they believe to be that much better than Webb. QB is so important that it's not a bad idea to have a couple of ones you think are great.
I think a lot of people have false hopes after one win and the bottom line is that I would be shocked if we win 5 games this year. It was foreseeable only last week that this team would not win a game as I only saw a couple of teams that they could possibly win against with the offense.
I do think, however that you are underestimating the win. Any given Sunday. The defense showed up against a flawed team and the offense did basically very little - just a lot more than usual.
There is a concern that the first 5 games will be forgotten but I think with all the crap surrounding the NFL itself, Mara needs to be very careful. I'm 46 years old and a huge fan for 35 years. I'm ready to walk away and I think a lot of others are too.
Reese needs to go and a total reset needs to happen. The only one who could possibly survive is Eli. Say that we don't see a franchise quarterback, it is foreseeable to have Eli play another year or two in hopes of passing the torch to Webb. We weren't that far away last year so the window is short. With better coaching and a great draft with high picks, this team can get back in the mix. Structural change is needed for consistent success.
I hate that every time mcadoo opens his mouth he literally confirms that year two is still very much on the job training. This is getting old and fast.
Ill wait till the season is over. Probably already is. But man, mcadoo just scares the hell out of me.
I can't really argue with much that Eric has written Â
a small point -- I don't believe Marshall was done this year until he got injured -- his syndrome was one shared by most of the team -- including other pro bowlers -- this team was just plain out of sync and not ready to play for the first five games
There is no way the season starts that way with out some really bad stuff going on -- and in my eyes -- it has to be the way they are managed -- there is some real talent on the Giants right now -- when there's talent and poor performance -- the problem is not the players
Its always better to win than to lose. This team will be in better shape going forward if they finish 7-9 than if they finish 3-13. I remember something Parcells said during the 1987 season. That team, aided by the strike replacements started 0-5. They had problems even when the strike ended. Parcells was asked if there was any point in pushing for wins. To paraphrase he said " We can't let this team hit rock bottom. If we do so and the team loses a couple of early games next year we'll never be able to re-establish a winning attitude"
Same thing here. If this team mails in the rest of the season, they'll be bad for years, I don't care who they draft. If, on the other hand they play competitive football we can decide which of these guys are worth keeping and have something to build on. We won't have to spend half of next year doing player evaluations and we could be a playoff team next year or the year after, even with a new QB.
Here's what I would do.
1.McAdoo must go. And I think he will. Mara and Tisch may be arrogant but they're not stupid. They will continue to publicly support him and not hang him out to dry a la George Steinbrenner. But even they can see he's in over his head. An above average X's and O's OC has risen to his level of incompetence . He has no sense of the game, he's a terrible judge of talent and he doesn't know how to deal with people; players and assistants.
2. Geno Smith must go. Every minute he's on the team is a waste of time and effort. Davis Webb needs to be getting reps in practice and needs to be the QB if Eli goes down. They need to start grooming him now. Who knows ? Our future franchise QB may already be here. We all can see he has skills and he appears to have a head on his shoulders.
3. Let OBJ Walk. I will confess I'm being a tad subjective here. I admit I don't like him as a person. Being as objective as I can, we've seen that he is an immature undisciplined young man, and an injury prone one at that. Guys like him tend to flame out after short careers. If he was the guy to put us over the top it would be different but as this team stands it would be foolish to tie up cap money for years in an attempt to hang on to him.
I disagree quite frankly with a preview like this Â
Way too reactionary and emotional even if I agree with much of it.
How about previewing the opponent rather than the diatribe against the franchise?
I agree with niner land-a team that goes 3-13!is not better than 7-9. You want to see professionalism and a lack of quit- it means a lot. Otherwise a complete rehaul is needed and I think that is not the case here. And that takes years to fix.
And draft slotting-we can find plenty of cherry picked examples either way. It means little to me overall. Even the Cedric jones va Ogden example, ray Lewis went 27th and Marvin harrison 18th. Both are arguably better (one is definitely better) than Ogden.
Even in 03 in a Manning draft, Giants ended up trading up and sending futures to sd.
There is no can't miss prospect at qb and guys will be available later. If that is even direction they go.
to win a championship I would say two more years after this
season . The fact that the terrible Reese drafts you can't
go two seasons getting ZERO out of the draft .
No players develop here there all bums . Hence poor special teams plays so poor we had to sign one of the better
players Dwayne Harris. Linebackers are a joke ok maybe
after how many years that we have not drafted a LB that can stay with a TE ? Or a sideline to sideline tackling machine .
ZERO Depth at O-line or a Developing starter . RB ...???
Nothing to get excited about since Tiki .
By opening day, they HAD to know they had the wrong mix at OL - a lot of players playing out of position and better players sitting on the bench, but NO, they sacrificed Sunday afternoon results favor of the Mythical "Consistency" god.
They did (to their credit) tried Shane Smith at fullback, but they gave up on him and sent him to the Practice Squad (it became easy to blame him for the terrible run game results and not the O-line). IF the run game continues to be decent, I think it could actually ascend to "good" with reliable fullback play.
in the NFL to play starters as little as possible during the preseason. If the coaching staff had seen the first string offense play the first half of all the preseason games then maybe they would have made modifications to the offensive line before the games counted.
Maybe they would have realized that Perkins was not a number one running back on anyone's team and given his snaps to one of the other backs. Maybe they would have revised their play calling.
When your offense is as questionable as the Giants' maybe it's worth risking an injury to preview what you've got before it counts in the standings. So the season starts and you have all these injuries anyway.
I have it in my memory, but given the state of my memory not sure that it's true, that in preseason Parcells used to put the first string defense back out on the field late in the 4th quarter if the Giants' lead was challenged. He thought that it was important for a team to have the image of itself as a winner.
I'd expect a close game, something like 17-16....Seattle isn't killing people with their offense. Wilson's scramble ability is a wildcard factor, though.
I agree. I think it's a toss-up game. I have no idea how a team that struggles to score points could be a 4.5-6 point favorite over the Giants. Giants have to play excellent around the margins like last Sunday... excellent defense with no turnovers or special teams gaffs.
I think it's different this time. I think TC had an extended leash (2013, 14 and 15) not only because of his resume but because of the significance of TC being one of the last few organizational connections to his father.
Obviously Mac doesnt have the nostalgic value. I can also see where 11-5 actually works against him. Basically, every decision this past offseason was made in "win-now" mode with an eye on this and next season. Signing Marshall, retaining JPP, the high draft pick of another weapon for Eli. More than anything else Mac's fate is tied to and might be doomed because of Reese. If Mara removes him, Mac won't survive and you'll see a total regime change.
I have been saying since things have gone terribly south that a lot of us might be surprised this offseason barring a miracle.
We finish 7-9. Mara incorrectly comes to the conclusion that the structural problems don't exist or have been addressed. We miss out on the franchise QB and draft the defensive end.
2018 and the offense with a 37-year old Eli still can't score, the special teams keep losing games, and the defense alternates the good with the bad and we're flirting with 8-8 again.
DRAFT BETTER! MAKE BETTER FREE AGENT DECISIONS! FIX THE FREAKING OFFENSIVE LINE AND RUN THE DAMN BALL! It's been almost a decade now (the 2011 wasn't good either...those guys were on their last legs). GET A REAL SPECIAL TEAMS COACH!
Game six was Rams in London game
suddenly our defense turned on - (Landon Collins amazing pick 6 )
this year the same thing happen
Defense struggled couldn't keep late leads and had no turnovers
Game 6 it wakes up
Why ?
We had some awful ST units under TC.. I too wonder how he made it this far.. Is there any longer tenured ST Coordinators around the league? He is in year 10 at least.. When has ST been a strength? Maybe one or two seasons under Quinn's ten year watch, sad.
I will say that I'm at least comforted by having Davis Webb here. If that is how it turns out, we are not without a post-Eli plan/option. I know it's likely we won't see or know much about Webb by season's end but I like the Cal connection to Rodgers and now Goff who seems to be getting it. I know that's immaterial but does help.
The key is Reese. With no playoffs I don't see how Reese stays and I don't think Mara will continue to make change one piece at a time.
My biggest fear is that they win about 5 games and nothing changes other then a poor draft pick and huge amounts of money thrown at OBJ
It's not mandatory to draft a qb high this year and I think you are reading too much into the stat line. The offense did a good job jumping to a lead and then ball control in the second half. Given the circumstances that is much better than all the empty passing yards in losses we have seen.
i agree there should be outrage at 0-5 and if there is not a serious swing this season in record a 5-11 campaign should still mean changes need to be made.
This has been a bone of contention for me the last number of years.....in favor of Quinn.
Special teams coach to me is basically responsible for coverage of kicks and return of kicks.
There are only so many ways to do it, as opposed to offense and defense where there are a multitude of matchups and options. Those positions are where coaching really can make a difference.
It comes down to players wanting to do it, and following instructions on specials.
To me, it's been more the players than Quinn.
And as far as the two kickers, if you have a really good punter and a really good place kicker, that makes your ST coach look much better than he really is most likely.
Having said that, sure you could make a case for replacing Quinn....but how much would it really help?
I think the last four games are what we will see a lot of the rest of the season. Obviously not so much success in the passing game as Eli enjoyed prior to WR-4, but a lot of competitive, close games which could go either way depending on how well the defense plays and how many breaks the Giants get.
Wouldn't be surprised if in our remaining 10 games we win about 25% of them (2-3 more wins).
I LOVED your criticisms of the coaching staff's personnel choices. Why has it taken so long to decide that maybe, just maybe the optimal line included Pugh at T and Fluker? Maybe they still don't feel that way. UGH. Can you imagine how we're going to feel if Richburg and Hart get 100% and they move everyone back to their original positions, only to struggle again?
Let's hope the newly shaped OL is up to another quality defensive front. They've got their work cut out for them.
And it is 20/20 hindsight to say that the Marshall signing was bad now.
However, given they are 1-5 I dont see them beating Seattle which I guess is a good thing eventhough I will still feel shitty afterwards.
And Eric, you didn't have to go all the way back to 1990. The 2008 OL was pretty stout. :)
Don't take a QB for the sake of saying he's our next franchise QB. In that case, pick BPA and go with Webb as the future until otherwise.
Look at the kid from the Bears. Franchise QB, or just a pick because he's a QB with a chance???
Still our most consistent linebacker, especially in coverage.
The game against Denver wasn't a good sign for the Giants, or something to celebrate even, it just proved that Ben McAdoo is in over his depth as a NFL Head Coach. His quote, about giving up play calling, referenced in your preview is infuriating to me. A total lack of self accountability.
The Broncos game should not be reason to Mara to keep McAdoo, it should be reason to fire him.
I did this early in my career as a banking exec but learned eventually that it was short sighted.
In my 50 year career I observed that most people will sink to the lowest possible denominator. I think that's what happened to the defence the first 5 games. "Why bust our asses if mgmt. did nothing to improve the offence."
I found in the bank or any large organization that people try to "fly under the radar"and become complacent if allowed to!
I think that the giants organization as a group have condoned this because it's easier and they don't have to work as hard and are not accountable.
We see this in government as well.
I know that Mara/Tisch need to grow some balls and push their people to succeed and use the big stick hard and often.
They need to do this now until this team knows that second or third best is not an option and that includes everybody including players, coaches,management,. Also the hot dog server!
EVERYBODY SHOULD WANT TO WIN AND DEMAND EXCELLENCE IN EVERYTHING THAT SAYS "GIANTS" !!!
He didnt give you the "inspirational" garbage Tisch provided.
When asked what he thought of the win he said "I think we're 1-5 and not 0-6" or something to that effect.
He could have said anything remotely positive there and he didnt. That is a lack of any endorsement, as it should be.
I don't get why you are fixated on this issue. They had more time of possession than Denver, and were playing with a lead. Would you prefer that the Giants had 16 first downs, and that Darkwa didn't have a 47 yard run? Denver's 20 first downs amounted to 10 points, and seven of those were with 4 minutes left. On the ensuing drive, the Giants got a huge first down, on a 3rd and 9, when everyone knew they would run.
Denver's defense isn't exactly a pushover, and everyone expected the Giants to get crushed.
I'm not saying the Giants are some great team, and I have no clue what to expect this Sunday. I'm just not as much of a downer based on the Denver game.
Quote:
Come on now...let's keep it real. This guy is currently sitting in the best place we can utilize his talents...on the inactive list.
Still our most consistent linebacker, especially in coverage.
Robinson made more plays in one game than Casillas did all year thus far.
Comparisons of our LBs against each other is akin to a 100 yard dash of one-legged men...
Just my 2 cents
If wins from here on out ruin draft position, how can you be doing anything other than taking the position that the Giants should tank the rest of the season, regardless of what they could be capable of doing? That whole concept leaves a very bad taste in my mouth for any team to do. Sure, play rookies, give them a chance to gain real game experience and develop them and see where it takes the team. But to advocate tanking is just awful, IMV.
As far as Quinn and still having a job - I think the Giants management is taking the path of least resistance. So few people seem to put nearly enough emphasis on special teams play than they should. Special teams performance win and lose games every single week - just look at last night's OAK/KC game as case in point. I've never understood why special teams never seem to be made much of a priority for any team, yet are so pivotal.
Half the DBs on here ranted that Pugh wasn't at tackle. Couple of talent evaluators around here said he was best at guard.. his arms are 1/2 inch shorter than optimal. 1/2 inch - dick for brains.
All along it was obvious he had the feet and quickness to be either tackle. Frankly put, Pugh kicked Von Miller's ass. Guy got one sack that Eli walked into (he's been good at that recently).
Talent - it ain't talent. It's coaching. I look at other teams' rosters and say how are these guys better than what we have. Ok, LB, RB and some of the line, but almost every other position group is equal to or better than other teams.
And Eric, don't hold your breath for a franchise QB in this draft - there isn't one. You do not need a franchise QB to win. Look at the crap winning games around the NFL.
Half the DBs on here ranted that Pugh wasn't at tackle. Couple of talent evaluators around here said he was best at guard.. his arms are 1/2 inch shorter than optimal. 1/2 inch - dick for brains.
All along it was obvious he had the feet and quickness to be either tackle. Frankly put, Pugh kicked Von Miller's ass. Guy got one sack that Eli walked into (he's been good at that recently).
Talent - it ain't talent. It's coaching. I look at other teams' rosters and say how are these guys better than what we have. Ok, LB, RB and some of the line, but almost every other position group is equal to or better than other teams.
And Eric, don't hold your breath for a franchise QB in this draft - there isn't one. You do not need a franchise QB to win. Look at the crap winning games around the NFL.
Who exactly are the crap QBs winning games in the NFL? You think the Packers are happy to lose their franchise QB? Think the Raiders aren't happy to have theirs back? You cannot win consistently in the NFL with crap QBs. That's ludicrous.
Who exactly are
Quote:
arms again.
Half the DBs on here ranted that Pugh wasn't at tackle. Couple of talent evaluators around here said he was best at guard.. his arms are 1/2 inch shorter than optimal. 1/2 inch - dick for brains.
All along it was obvious he had the feet and quickness to be either tackle. Frankly put, Pugh kicked Von Miller's ass. Guy got one sack that Eli walked into (he's been good at that recently).
Talent - it ain't talent. It's coaching. I look at other teams' rosters and say how are these guys better than what we have. Ok, LB, RB and some of the line, but almost every other position group is equal to or better than other teams.
And Eric, don't hold your breath for a franchise QB in this draft - there isn't one. You do not need a franchise QB to win. Look at the crap winning games around the NFL.
Who exactly are the crap QBs winning games in the NFL? You think the Packers are happy to lose their franchise QB? Think the Raiders aren't happy to have theirs back? You cannot win consistently in the NFL with crap QBs. That's ludicrous.
Who exactly are
Geezuz - Smith, Cousins, Russell, Prescott, Taylor, Simien --
that enough?
I think it's fairly obvious Eli is next up on the scapegoat pile and the team will use picking or trading up for a QB this draft and pairing him with a recovered Odell + Engram to sell the fanbase on a new era and better things to come, but what's rotten with this organization runs clearly deeper than that and that's what worries me about them winning meaningless games -- it's going to fully "let" them not clean house the way a team that will have finished under .500 4/5 seasons and have missed the playoff 7/9 years should.
They'll just move on to wasting a different QB's window, if this group can even properly evaluate and develop the right one anyway (highly questionable). Great.
Personally I think the conviction had to go deeper than "Webb is worth a flier". They clearly believed this year was going to be a good year. They could have strengthened any number of positions with a solid choice in the third round, thereby strengthening their chance at a SB run in 2017. I think they took Webb not because they didn't think they would be able to find someone next year (or any year later), but because they thought he was good value at that point, and because they believed he really can be special.
Now, if they go QB in round 1 of this year it won't say a lot about how they felt when they took Webb, but maybe how they feel about him on draft day 2018, or just that whoever they select they believe to be that much better than Webb. QB is so important that it's not a bad idea to have a couple of ones you think are great.
I do think, however that you are underestimating the win. Any given Sunday. The defense showed up against a flawed team and the offense did basically very little - just a lot more than usual.
There is a concern that the first 5 games will be forgotten but I think with all the crap surrounding the NFL itself, Mara needs to be very careful. I'm 46 years old and a huge fan for 35 years. I'm ready to walk away and I think a lot of others are too.
Reese needs to go and a total reset needs to happen. The only one who could possibly survive is Eli. Say that we don't see a franchise quarterback, it is foreseeable to have Eli play another year or two in hopes of passing the torch to Webb. We weren't that far away last year so the window is short. With better coaching and a great draft with high picks, this team can get back in the mix. Structural change is needed for consistent success.
Ill wait till the season is over. Probably already is. But man, mcadoo just scares the hell out of me.
There is no way the season starts that way with out some really bad stuff going on -- and in my eyes -- it has to be the way they are managed -- there is some real talent on the Giants right now -- when there's talent and poor performance -- the problem is not the players
Look for Sherman to keep his guy in soft coverage and try to jump other routes too.
Be nice if Eli could outsmart this group a bit at their own game...
Same thing here. If this team mails in the rest of the season, they'll be bad for years, I don't care who they draft. If, on the other hand they play competitive football we can decide which of these guys are worth keeping and have something to build on. We won't have to spend half of next year doing player evaluations and we could be a playoff team next year or the year after, even with a new QB.
Here's what I would do.
1.McAdoo must go. And I think he will. Mara and Tisch may be arrogant but they're not stupid. They will continue to publicly support him and not hang him out to dry a la George Steinbrenner. But even they can see he's in over his head. An above average X's and O's OC has risen to his level of incompetence . He has no sense of the game, he's a terrible judge of talent and he doesn't know how to deal with people; players and assistants.
2. Geno Smith must go. Every minute he's on the team is a waste of time and effort. Davis Webb needs to be getting reps in practice and needs to be the QB if Eli goes down. They need to start grooming him now. Who knows ? Our future franchise QB may already be here. We all can see he has skills and he appears to have a head on his shoulders.
3. Let OBJ Walk. I will confess I'm being a tad subjective here. I admit I don't like him as a person. Being as objective as I can, we've seen that he is an immature undisciplined young man, and an injury prone one at that. Guys like him tend to flame out after short careers. If he was the guy to put us over the top it would be different but as this team stands it would be foolish to tie up cap money for years in an attempt to hang on to him.
How about previewing the opponent rather than the diatribe against the franchise?
I agree with niner land-a team that goes 3-13!is not better than 7-9. You want to see professionalism and a lack of quit- it means a lot. Otherwise a complete rehaul is needed and I think that is not the case here. And that takes years to fix.
And draft slotting-we can find plenty of cherry picked examples either way. It means little to me overall. Even the Cedric jones va Ogden example, ray Lewis went 27th and Marvin harrison 18th. Both are arguably better (one is definitely better) than Ogden.
Even in 03 in a Manning draft, Giants ended up trading up and sending futures to sd.
There is no can't miss prospect at qb and guys will be available later. If that is even direction they go.
season . The fact that the terrible Reese drafts you can't
go two seasons getting ZERO out of the draft .
No players develop here there all bums . Hence poor special teams plays so poor we had to sign one of the better
players Dwayne Harris. Linebackers are a joke ok maybe
after how many years that we have not drafted a LB that can stay with a TE ? Or a sideline to sideline tackling machine .
ZERO Depth at O-line or a Developing starter . RB ...???
Nothing to get excited about since Tiki .
They did (to their credit) tried Shane Smith at fullback, but they gave up on him and sent him to the Practice Squad (it became easy to blame him for the terrible run game results and not the O-line). IF the run game continues to be decent, I think it could actually ascend to "good" with reliable fullback play.
https://www.bigblueview.com/2017/9/6/16255728/2017-ny-giants-film-study-fullback-shane-smith-offense-news-analysis-rumors
Maybe they would have realized that Perkins was not a number one running back on anyone's team and given his snaps to one of the other backs. Maybe they would have revised their play calling.
When your offense is as questionable as the Giants' maybe it's worth risking an injury to preview what you've got before it counts in the standings. So the season starts and you have all these injuries anyway.
I have it in my memory, but given the state of my memory not sure that it's true, that in preseason Parcells used to put the first string defense back out on the field late in the 4th quarter if the Giants' lead was challenged. He thought that it was important for a team to have the image of itself as a winner.