His cool, easy-going demeanor, known to never be too down and not throwing teammates under the bus is viewed as one of his greatest strengths. We know it helps him when the game is on the line in tough situations.
Having said that, does Eli the prankster and easy-going captain of this team share some of the responsibility for tolerating mistakes?
For those of you who see only black and white, let me be clear: I'm not saying Eli is a bad player, teammate, or the only person responsible for this season. My point is a bit more nuanced than that. It happens that Eli is one of my all-time favorite Giants and I love how he picked his game up for several weeks after a bad start to the season.
he's the quarterback and so of course he gets some of the blame. but i think more for his play than his demeanor. his slow starts have been a killer.
that said, i do think his demeanor was better suited for a team on which he was the young guy and there were more senior, more vocal leaders already established. as he became more senior, i do think he needed to be more vocal, but that's just not him.
i also think he had a lot of fun playing with the guys he came up with. since they've retired, it seems more like eli is just going through the motions. just a subjective observation...
Definitely agree that the Head Coach is most responsible, followed by all the other coaches and the front office.
Wondering though if Eli contributes at all to fostering an easy-going, laid back and fun practice attitude absorbed by underachieving players.
Again, not saying totally Eli's fault, or even primarily his fault. I just know that there are hard-core leaders who demand accountability from within on some units. Maybe Eli isn't that and is part of the reason why underperformance is tolerated.
he's the quarterback and so of course he gets some of the blame. but i think more for his play than his demeanor. his slow starts have been a killer.
that said, i do think his demeanor was better suited for a team on which he was the young guy and there were more senior, more vocal leaders already established. as he became more senior, i do think he needed to be more vocal, but that's just not him.
i also think he had a lot of fun playing with the guys he came up with. since they've retired, it seems more like eli is just going through the motions. just a subjective observation...
Definitely an interesting guy, yes. I don't think he's just going through the motions, but I think his approach to helping young guys fit in, work hard, and try to improve may be too casual a model for some of these underperformers.
Then you have the really serious guys like Brees, the assholes like Rivers and Cutler and the rest are mainly young guys trying to figure it out.
Randy Moss once talked about how Brady would get people cracking up, but before coming to NE he didn't know that was his style.
I think one thing that is important to note...almost everyone on this site said last January that Eli was done...that if we were going to beat Green Bay it would be through OBJ or Shepard or someone else. But the fact is Eli was the only one who showed up to play. His passes were accurate and it was these kids who let him down.
Easy E still has it...unfortunately the rest of his offensive teammates, save Engram, do not. Personally, if I was Eli I would be in Jerry Reese's office every day and reaming his ass out over the shit he has to deal with.
But Eli just has too much class...if anything, I would say, for this current edition of the Giants, Eli has far too much class and work ethic. It is a shame he has to put up with this B.S. at this point in his career.
Then you have the really serious guys like Brees, the assholes like Rivers and Cutler and the rest are mainly young guys trying to figure it out.
Randy Moss once talked about how Brady would get people cracking up, but before coming to NE he didn't know that was his style.
The Pats in general are amazing. That culture fosters and inspires competition and a winning attitude. The Bills this year had a rb go to the Patsin FA and from interviews he was saying how incredible the entire culture is there. Everything matters, even weight room practice is a competition. Going from players coach Rex Ryan to the demand excellence Pats was amazing for him.
Belicheck said when he was with the Giants, he was at a clinic with Simmons who told the coaches that he never wanted his players afraid to fail because it meant they wouldn't try. That's why he allowed them to do behind the back passes and shots and do things that previously lacrosse players hadn't done. If they could succeed, they could do things their way
Belicheck adopted that philosophy which is why you see him letting players do their thing, and as long as they perform, he isn't a taskmaster about it. And if you see what Bill does - he's very rigid about performance, but how that gets accomplished he's very loose about. You can showboat like Gronk or be workmanlike.
When Zidane got the job he actually said he envied Modric's ability to hit the ball with the outside of his foot. And he challenged Ronaldo to a set piece competition in training and whipped him.
I'm wondering if his style is best matched to a HC who is a taskmaster so that his personality keeps people positive and focused on improving without dwelling on the past. In other words, he might be best matched with Tom Coughlin. Alternatively perhaps his style doesn't work as well with a player's coach.
Either way, I enjoy reading your thoughts on the matter. Some great comments in here that have me thinking. Thanks.
If Eli's last name were not Manning he would have been skewered years ago.How many games has Eli "brain farted" at the end?
He had a good run, if a few things (Plaxico shooting self) he probably wins another SB.
The reality is - He has lost it. he looks completely confused and the supporting cast can't help.
It is time to move on. If he feels he can still play arrange for him to go where he wants.Let Eli go out gracefully
The same season where Eli Manning had an NFL record 14 4th quarter TD's, and 7 4th quarter comebacks?
Shut up.
Yea Eli is not a leader, ok...
This is the same guy who before SB46 went before the team and talked about watching the pain of what his brother went through after losing to New Orleans 2 years before and how he didnt want that for any of them.
The same guy who takes every criticism this town has laid at his feet head on and never ONCE threw another teammate or coach under the bus and God knows he's had plenty of opportunities to do so.
He is a two-time title winner who has never missed a start and even though he has made his share of mistakes is always the most prepared player on the field.
Unbelievable.
Odell Beckham is treated here the way Eli Manning should be treated. Very sad.
Um yes. The worst defense to win a SB? Playing to of the best offenses of all time in GB (2nd highest ever) and NE(Too 10 ever). Defense held them to more than 2TDs below their season avg. Falcons were also a high scoring team and held them to 23+ points below their average potints scored.
Is that the worst defense ever you're talking about?
The defense was outstanding and did a tremendous job in both title runs. Most notably against the Pats in 07 and Packers in 11 but you take it too far.
Basically, that Eli walked on to the field losing late in the 4th quarter in each game and delivered the goods punches a big hole in your argument.
Also, regarding both playoff runs. I don't think there is another QB in this era, not Brady, not Peyton, not Rodgers, not Ben, and definitely not Brees who could've walked into both Green Bay and San Francisco for those two title games and won both.
The level of guts, balls and patience, and ability to make all the throws needed to win both of those games in those elements and that defense is through the roof.
2004 - October 2012 this was a successful franchise. There was a plan. Build a team that can rush the passer & run the ball. This plan yielded 2 SB titles. As improbable as 2011 was, the team did go into Foxboro and beat the Pats. They were 6-2 and had hard luck losses.
@ NE (Brady) (win)
@ New Orleans (Brees)
Green Bay (Rodgers) (blown call on Ballard TD was key in close loss)
@ San Francisco (against that defense)
Seattle (as they were becoming the force they have been since)
Obviously Dallas and Romo twice
The Jets when Rex's program was still successful
That schedule was a damn gauntlet looking back on it and people rip a 9-7 record. Good enough to win the division by the way.
Um yes. The worst defense to win a SB? Playing to of the best offenses of all time in GB (2nd highest ever) and NE(Too 10 ever). Defense held them to more than 2TDs below their season avg. Falcons were also a high scoring team and held them to 23+ points below their average potints scored.
Is that the worst defense ever you're talking about?
And if Eli didn't pull off all those 4Q comeback victories during the regular season, then the Giants wouldn't be in the playoffs, and the D would never have had the chance to step up. Funny how things work in team sports.
Eli s lack of mobility is a problem, not the demeanor that led him to the resume he has in big games.
Eli s lack of mobility is a problem, not the demeanor that led him to the resume he has in big games.
No disrespect taken. Just was speculating about one narrow aspect of the current team - the culture on the practice field. Many may argue that it isn't a problem at all. For those who think there may be a culture problem, I figured it was worth a discussion to hear what people think about Eli.
In short, I don't believe for a minute that Eli's attitude in practice is the reason for a losing season.
Eli's work ethic is well documented and very few in the league seem to match it. Eli is about the most prepared player in the league, which is why he is allowed and expected to do so much at the line of scrimmage. He extends those high expectations to his teammates. We just read a couple of weeks ago about the study guides he made up for the entirely new WR corps. Yet, we are now questioning whether or not he is a leader and whether he is accepting of players being unprepared.
I have a sneaking suspicion you wouldn't want to be in the closed door locker room with Eli after a huge F up. He is the one guy who, week after week, year after year, will get in front of the media and shoulder all the blame, even if he played a near perfect game. He has yet to throw anyone under the bus and usually tries to stop himself from doing so demonstratively on the field. But, he will go right over to someone and explain what he saw, etc. But, after the game, I have a feeling that player is shown in no uncertain terms what the F they did wrong.