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Remember this...

Britt in VA : 11/12/2017 6:55 pm
Remember this when you talk about how Eli's salary holds the team back. At least he's trying.

$200 million dollar defense.

I really  
rocco8112 : 11/12/2017 6:55 pm : link
wish Eli would sound off. He is likely to get scape-goated anyway.
....  
yankees78 : 11/12/2017 6:56 pm : link
$200 million waste. Holy shit
Why isn't Pierre Paul's contract holding the team back?  
Britt in VA : 11/12/2017 6:56 pm : link
Why isn't Vernon's contract holding the team back?
Yeah the defense sucks  
est1986 : 11/12/2017 6:57 pm : link
& this thread fits the scheme.
Just so sad  
Boatie Warrant : 11/12/2017 6:57 pm : link
Defense is the biggest difference from last year to this year
What a fucking horror show  
Go Terps : 11/12/2017 6:59 pm : link
Gutless roster full of highly paid losers.

The problems won't go away if only Reese and McAdoo are fired. The organization should liquidate the roster at every opportunity.
Sadly, a performance like this by the defense..  
Sean : 11/12/2017 7:00 pm : link
will accelerate the end of the Eli era. Fuck these players.
Go Terps I agree  
bubba0825 : 11/12/2017 7:00 pm : link
Yet we won’t even know risk dressing Webb to see what we have in him
RE: Go Terps I agree  
Britt in VA : 11/12/2017 7:01 pm : link
In comment 13687885 bubba0825 said:
Quote:
Yet we won’t even know risk dressing Webb to see what we have in him


Webb isn't ready!!!!

God damn... If he can't dress against an 0-9 team, it's obvious he's not ready!

They've been saying he's a project, what better indication of that than not dressing against an 0-9 team!?!?!?!
The problem is that too many of these guys are  
Bockman : 11/12/2017 7:02 pm : link
good enough to stay into the next regime. It makes me want to punch my TV watching Jackrabbit avoid contact, but are we really going to get rid of him? What are the realistic options?
RE: RE: Go Terps I agree  
BleedBlue : 11/12/2017 7:03 pm : link
In comment 13687899 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 13687885 bubba0825 said:


Quote:


Yet we won’t even know risk dressing Webb to see what we have in him



Webb isn't ready!!!!

God damn... If he can't dress against an 0-9 team, it's obvious he's not ready!

They've been saying he's a project, what better indication of that than not dressing against an 0-9 team!?!?!?!



ready for what? LMAO...we are horrible throw him in and see how he handles shit. the best way to learn is that. throw him in and see if he shows any sign of ability...
Those contracts are a problem  
AcesUp : 11/12/2017 7:04 pm : link
.
RE: I really  
montanagiant : 11/12/2017 7:05 pm : link
In comment 13687818 rocco8112 said:
Quote:
wish Eli would sound off. He is likely to get scape-goated anyway.

^^^^ This
Next loss will be Eli’s 100th with the team  
LatHarv83 : 11/12/2017 7:05 pm : link
No qb has ever lost 100 with one team. That record may never be broken. Weird nugget about his career, because you have to do some things along the way for a franchis to allow you to lose that many times, and you have to play a long time
What's the point in gutting the roster?  
widmerseyebrow : 11/12/2017 7:07 pm : link
And starting from scratch? Until we have a real front office in place, it's just more dart throwing. Why give Jerry a fresh batch of darts?
Should we expect  
Dodge : 11/12/2017 7:07 pm : link
This much Eli circle jerking from you after he finally retires?
RE: What a fucking horror show  
WillVAB : 11/12/2017 7:09 pm : link
In comment 13687868 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Gutless roster full of highly paid losers.

The problems won't go away if only Reese and McAdoo are fired. The organization should liquidate the roster at every opportunity.


The most expensive guys on the roster can’t be cut due to the cap hit for at least the next two seasons.
RE: RE: What a fucking horror show  
AcesUp : 11/12/2017 7:15 pm : link
In comment 13687972 WillVAB said:
Quote:
In comment 13687868 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Gutless roster full of highly paid losers.

The problems won't go away if only Reese and McAdoo are fired. The organization should liquidate the roster at every opportunity.



The most expensive guys on the roster can’t be cut due to the cap hit for at least the next two seasons.


This is conventional thinking but it may be in our best interest to purge next year and eat the upfront costs. Whether ownership would, justifiably, want to light that money on fire is another story.
RE: Should we expect  
Reb8thVA : 11/12/2017 7:18 pm : link
In comment 13687961 Dodge said:
Quote:
This much Eli circle jerking from you after he finally retires?


See #10, that is called integrity, learn it, love it, respect it.
RE: RE: Should we expect  
Britt in VA : 11/12/2017 7:19 pm : link
In comment 13688063 Reb8thVA said:
Quote:
In comment 13687961 Dodge said:


Quote:


This much Eli circle jerking from you after he finally retires?



See #10, that is called integrity, learn it, love it, respect it.


+1

Some losers will never learn.
I would rather have dead money than Jenkins, Vernon, and JPP  
Go Terps : 11/12/2017 7:20 pm : link
And the roster moves shouldn't stop with those three.
RE: RE: RE: What a fucking horror show  
WillVAB : 11/12/2017 7:20 pm : link
In comment 13688027 AcesUp said:
Quote:
In comment 13687972 WillVAB said:


Quote:


In comment 13687868 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Gutless roster full of highly paid losers.

The problems won't go away if only Reese and McAdoo are fired. The organization should liquidate the roster at every opportunity.



The most expensive guys on the roster can’t be cut due to the cap hit for at least the next two seasons.



This is conventional thinking but it may be in our best interest to purge next year and eat the upfront costs. Whether ownership would, justifiably, want to light that money on fire is another story.


The hit would be astronomical. Forget any FA signings. We’d be looking at another dismal season featuring street FA’s starting on both sides.
I'm ok with that  
AcesUp : 11/12/2017 7:21 pm : link
We need to stop plugging the dam and build something.
...  
christian : 11/12/2017 7:23 pm : link
Nice to see your down to other players suck to as your defense for your hero.
RE: ...  
Britt in VA : 11/12/2017 7:24 pm : link
In comment 13688124 christian said:
Quote:
Nice to see your down to other players suck to as your defense for your hero.


Yeah? Fuck off. Eli Manning is the only thing good about the 2017 New York Giants.

Deal with it.
Eli never quits..  
Sean : 11/12/2017 7:27 pm : link
The rest of the team could learn from him.

And I’ll say it again, fuck the boat trip. 1-9 since then and it might be awhile before this team sees another opportunity in the playoffs.
The plan  
WillVAB : 11/12/2017 7:30 pm : link
Should be to get back to building this team the right way. Trade down and build the trenches. Add legitimate talent at the LB position. Phase out JPP.

If this organization blows up the roster they could be Cleveland Browns bad for the next decade.
Clevelend habitually trades down  
AcesUp : 11/12/2017 7:33 pm : link
And invests all their resources in the trenches.
Eli with a 114 QBR...ho hum  
BurberryManning : 11/12/2017 7:37 pm : link
Yet he’s considered “part of the problem” by many. Perhaps he’s 51st or 52nd on the list of “problems” within this organization but he’s certainly not among those chief in holding the franchise back on Sundays.
I guess you guys missed Eli throwing off his back foot  
Vanzetti : 11/12/2017 7:39 pm : link
and back peddling to avoid being hit and as a result missing a wide open receiver for what would have been an easy first down inside the ten-yard line

if he steps into the throw or even just throws it flat-footed, it's a pass a 12 year old completes

so Eli was making business decisions just like everyone else.
RE: Eli with a 114 QBR...ho hum  
family progtitioner : 11/12/2017 7:41 pm : link
In comment 13688231 BurberryManning said:
Quote:
Yet he’s considered “part of the problem” by many. Perhaps he’s 51st or 52nd on the list of “problems” within this organization but he’s certainly not among those chief in holding the franchise back on Sundays.


Are you serious? The team can’t score and you’re saying the qb, the most important position by far, is not a problem? I don’t even know what to say
RE: RE: ...  
christian : 11/12/2017 7:41 pm : link
In comment 13688135 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 13688124 christian said:


Quote:


Nice to see your down to other players suck to as your defense for your hero.



Yeah? Fuck off. Eli Manning is the only thing good about the 2017 New York Giants.

Deal with it.


And by good you mean decidedly average and good for a boneheaded turnover on his side of the field per game?
RE: I guess you guys missed Eli throwing off his back foot  
BurberryManning : 11/12/2017 7:43 pm : link
In comment 13688258 Vanzetti said:
Quote:
and back peddling to avoid being hit and as a result missing a wide open receiver for what would have been an easy first down inside the ten-yard line

if he steps into the throw or even just throws it flat-footed, it's a pass a 12 year old completes

so Eli was making business decisions just like everyone else.
Please cite the other quarterback performances this week or otherwise in which zero errant passes were thrown. It seems as if you expect God behind center.
Eli gives 110%  
TommytheElephant : 11/12/2017 7:43 pm : link
While many guys on this team are dogging it

Eli Apple, please change your first name
The Eli debate is old  
AcesUp : 11/12/2017 7:45 pm : link
He's the best QB in Giants history. He's still playing hard. He's still the best QB on the roster. But he's also the starting QB of a 1-8 team and hasn't won a playoff game in 6 years. He's certainly not part of the solution.
Nobody can ever say that Eli is not giving 100%  
EricJ : 11/12/2017 7:46 pm : link
or that he does not care. The guy is a true professional.
Eli is one of the best things we have  
PatersonPlank : 11/12/2017 7:47 pm : link
Never quits, 14 TDs only 6 Ints, and 2,100 yards
RE: RE: RE: ...  
BurberryManning : 11/12/2017 7:47 pm : link
In comment 13688270 christian said:
Quote:
In comment 13688135 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


In comment 13688124 christian said:


Quote:


Nice to see your down to other players suck to as your defense for your hero.



Yeah? Fuck off. Eli Manning is the only thing good about the 2017 New York Giants.

Deal with it.



And by good you mean decidedly average and good for a boneheaded turnover on his side of the field per game?
Oh no! A turnover predicated by the failure of his teammates to prevent an onslaught of rushes from attacking him. It’s almost as if quarterbacks are prone to fumbling footballs when in position to discharge the ball via a throwing motion intended to discharge the ball. Sure, Eli and his 75% completion rate with a roster devoid of nearly all pass catching talent is among the top 10 reasons that the Giants lost....
RE: RE: I guess you guys missed Eli throwing off his back foot  
christian : 11/12/2017 7:47 pm : link
In comment 13688283 BurberryManning said:
Quote:
In comment 13688258 Vanzetti said:


Quote:


and back peddling to avoid being hit and as a result missing a wide open receiver for what would have been an easy first down inside the ten-yard line

if he steps into the throw or even just throws it flat-footed, it's a pass a 12 year old completes

so Eli was making business decisions just like everyone else.

Please cite the other quarterback performances this week or otherwise in which zero errant passes were thrown. It seems as if you expect God behind center.


It's not a zero sum world. No one expects Manning to be perfect. In fact I suspect many accept he has eroded skills and will never be close to the quarter back he once was. But that doesn't equate to good play or indicate future success.

And "they're doing too" is a wildly mature way to defend a stance.
RE: Clevelend habitually trades down  
WillVAB : 11/12/2017 7:47 pm : link
In comment 13688202 AcesUp said:
Quote:
And invests all their resources in the trenches.


They also habitually draft bad QBs high in the draft.
I love Eli, but he's part of the problem.  
BH28 : 11/12/2017 7:47 pm : link
I'm not advocating getting rid of him, but he can't fumble the fucking ball like that. It's clear he needs players around him to pick him up, he does not have the ability to elevate his teammates anymore.
Not at the top of the draft  
AcesUp : 11/12/2017 7:48 pm : link
They play patty cake in the 2nd and 3rd rounds after trading down.
RE: RE: I guess you guys missed Eli throwing off his back foot  
Sarcastic Sam : 11/12/2017 7:50 pm : link
In comment 13688283 BurberryManning said:
Quote:
In comment 13688258 Vanzetti said:


Quote:


and back peddling to avoid being hit and as a result missing a wide open receiver for what would have been an easy first down inside the ten-yard line

if he steps into the throw or even just throws it flat-footed, it's a pass a 12 year old completes

so Eli was making business decisions just like everyone else.

Please cite the other quarterback performances this week or otherwise in which zero errant passes were thrown. It seems as if you expect God behind center.


Mark Sanchize. No butt fumbles this week.
This will be unpopular with some, most or all but  
Powerclean765 : 11/12/2017 7:53 pm : link
I am not that upset with the defense. Would I like them to play like the 85 Bears at all times? Of course. And did watching Jenkins and JPP today sicken me a bit? Yes.

But as I said last week, young players can't afford to quit if they want NFL careers. The guys you will see quit (fall on their swords) are the veterans with job security. The uncuttables. Who on this team is uncuttable? Eli, JPP, Vernon, Snacks and Jenkins. I'd also throw Landon Collins into that mix.

Eli & Snacks aren't going to tank. The others are.

It's the way pro football works when you want a coach out. I'm not pointing my pitchfork at the players in a financial position to take the stand.

P.S. With Jenkins, this is personal. He no doubt hates McAdoo at this point and is a respected guy in the lockerroom. I doubt they bro-hugged over a simple misunderstanding last week. I'll bet it's really bad and you saw it boil over today.
RE: I love Eli, but he's part of the problem.  
PetesHereNow : 11/12/2017 7:54 pm : link
In comment 13688326 BH28 said:
Quote:
I'm not advocating getting rid of him, but he can't fumble the fucking ball like that. It's clear he needs players around him to pick him up, he does not have the ability to elevate his teammates anymore.


You can’t elevate practice squad players like Roger Lewis and Bobby Hart. And you especially can’t do it when your defense treats CJ Beathard like he’s Joe Montana.
RE: RE: RE: I guess you guys missed Eli throwing off his back foot  
BurberryManning : 11/12/2017 7:54 pm : link
In comment 13688323 christian said:
Quote:
In comment 13688283 BurberryManning said:


Quote:


In comment 13688258 Vanzetti said:


Quote:


and back peddling to avoid being hit and as a result missing a wide open receiver for what would have been an easy first down inside the ten-yard line

if he steps into the throw or even just throws it flat-footed, it's a pass a 12 year old completes

so Eli was making business decisions just like everyone else.

Please cite the other quarterback performances this week or otherwise in which zero errant passes were thrown. It seems as if you expect God behind center.



It's not a zero sum world. No one expects Manning to be perfect. In fact I suspect many accept he has eroded skills and will never be close to the quarter back he once was. But that doesn't equate to good play or indicate future success.

And "they're doing too" is a wildly mature way to defend a stance.
“They’re doing it too,” is a completely logical defense when not evaluating performance within a ridiculously arbitrary vacuum. You evaluate performance within the context of rationality otherwise we might as well expect every offensive snap to result in a touchdown and/or you play musical chairs with talent in an elusive chase to capture perfection.
RE: I love Eli, but he's part of the problem.  
christian : 11/12/2017 7:57 pm : link
In comment 13688326 BH28 said:
Quote:
I'm not advocating getting rid of him, but he can't fumble the fucking ball like that. It's clear he needs players around him to pick him up, he does not have the ability to elevate his teammates anymore.


I'll never understand the need to so richly make believe defend a stranger that as awful losses wrap, jump directly to posting all the good things they did or better yet, cling to the fact others did poorly too. It's super weird.

Point of fact there are lots of bad players, coaches and execs on this team. That's how you get to this place.

But I guess if only everything else was different, and everyone else was better, Manning would be having a better year. And that's all that really matters, right?
I don't get the post premise  
hassan : 11/12/2017 8:20 pm : link
Unless there are a group of people who just rail on manning. I believe almost everyone here will call the defense putrid and I have not seen much defense of them or their salaries here.

I do get maybe there is too much made of Manning not being worth his contract vs the others but he hardly did great today either. Total bonehead play in SF territory.

I'd be curious what the average qb has done to this d.

I'd say every player that is paid more relative to their production is a problem. Lots on this team.
RE: Why isn't Pierre Paul's contract holding the team back?  
LauderdaleMatty : 11/12/2017 10:23 pm : link
In comment 13687841 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
Why isn't Vernon's contract holding the team back?


Vernon by all accounts BSO a really good guy and works his ass off. BUT his contract is an abomination. Reese should get fired for one deal alone.

RE: RE: I love Eli, but he's part of the problem.  
BH28 : 11/12/2017 10:31 pm : link
In comment 13688409 christian said:
Quote:
In comment 13688326 BH28 said:


Quote:


I'm not advocating getting rid of him, but he can't fumble the fucking ball like that. It's clear he needs players around him to pick him up, he does not have the ability to elevate his teammates anymore.



I'll never understand the need to so richly make believe defend a stranger that as awful losses wrap, jump directly to posting all the good things they did or better yet, cling to the fact others did poorly too. It's super weird.

Point of fact there are lots of bad players, coaches and execs on this team. That's how you get to this place.

But I guess if only everything else was different, and everyone else was better, Manning would be having a better year. And that's all that really matters, right?


Actually sounds like you and I are on the same page?
RE: I don't get the post premise  
BlackLight : 11/12/2017 11:32 pm : link
In comment 13688526 hassan said:
Quote:
Unless there are a group of people who just rail on manning.


Bingo.
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