Draft picks JR did not make(help needed)

Jerry Reese does not make decisions in a vacuum. Every pick is an organizational pick based on consensus. Firing Reese is not going to change anything if he is replaced with another company man whose decisions are based on consensus and compromise.

Second of all, Reese said they had OBJ in their top ten but not top five, ahead of Mike Evans, but behind Sammy Watkins. Which is nothing to be ashamed of because other than Chip Kelly saying he had OBJ at the tippy-top of his big board, I expect just about every other team had Watkins in front of OBJ, with most having Evans ahead of him as well.

It is too easy to have hindsight with the draft.

He missed on Tom Brady, too.

I blame him for not doing more to replace the OL of the past Super Bowls SOONER....as it has taken 5 and half season to see Eli actually sit in the pocket like he did last week. Granted, with our top 4 WRs out now....that all becomes mute.

Reese has a decent eye for talent....not 100% probably not even 50%.....but compared to other GMs he does ok. Maybe even better then ok.

We as fans only look at the misses and the lost opportunities....but every team has them.

Letting Linval Joseph go was ridicuous

George from PA said:

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It is too easy to have hindsight with the draft.... He missed on Tom Brady, too.

Not that it really dilutes your point, but I think Reese was scouting down south when Brady was at Michigan. Accorsi and Sunderland missed on Brady. Then again, so did the whole NFL.

I agree that Reese tried to hold the 2008 line together for too long. It's likely that Coughlin played a big role there. Snee is his son-in-law. O'Hara and Diehl were basically family too. All three got paid for past performance while in rapid decline. Ultimately, of course, the buck stops on the GM's desk. The ill-fated UFA signings - Baas, Beatty, Schwartz - sure didn't help.

gtt350 said:

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Letting Linval Joseph go was ridiculous

OK, that's one. Who else?

In comment 13701888 George from PA said:

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It is too easy to have hindsight with the draft. He missed on Tom Brady, too. I blame him for not doing more to replace the OL of the past Super Bowls SOONER....as it has taken 5 and half season to see Eli actually sit in the pocket like he did last week. Granted, with our top 4 WRs out now....that all becomes mute. Reese has a decent eye for talent....not 100% probably not even 50%.....but compared to other GMs he does ok. Maybe even better then ok. We as fans only look at the misses and the lost opportunities....but every team has them.

Jerry Reese missed on Tom Brady? Last I checked Ernie Accorsi was the GM in 2000. Also would love to hear how you arrived at Reese having a 50% "decent eye" for talent. And btw, it's moot not mute.

Diehl. Cruz (OK, udfa, but basically rookie, ) and Brandon Jacobs is that those were relatively unknown prospects that were discussed on bbi prior to the drafts, yet not typical Reese target picks.

Jerry probably has had more impact on picks 1,2,3 and in that light it's not just the bust/star ratio but the overall nature of the roster that may be at issue.

JR does not make the draft decisions in a vacuum, its a group effort is true, but at the end of the day, it is his role to make the picks.

If that is your argument then you cannot hold him accountable for the horrific drafts we have had under his time as GM.

Part of the role of the GM is to build a roster, that is not the responsibility of the coach or the scouts.

'Win' drafts that have loosing seasons with the stars they drafted due to poorly conceived overall rosters.

Someone mentioned the browns.

The Giants as a team have never drafted well when you compare them to New England and the Pittsburgh Steelers. They always need to bring in a player from another team by FA signing or by trade to win. They seldom have dominate teams that win 12 or more games ( Parcells had two such teams... and that is about it that I can recall). The Giants where carried by ELI to two SBs with two teams that were 9-7 and 10-6 . And you are what your record says you are...so please do not start with we won TWO Super Bowls under Reese. That is a tournament...and a mediocre average team with a hot QB can win a tournament. Those wins are a tribute to Eli who led two mediocre teams. I am not sure what accounts for the inability of the G-men to build truly dominate teams that can consistently win division titles go 12-4, 13- 3 and make the playoffs year after year. I want to see the Giants win consistently every year like NE and Pitt. Perhaps they place too much emphasis on athletic ability, and size instead of the desire of the player to engage in contact and be a good TOUGH football player on the field. A basic amount of speed is necessary to play in the NFL. Beyond speed, I think what is inside a player that he displays on film is more important than combine stats. That is what BB in NE studies ..FILM. Over and over and more than any other coach and he feeds that to his GM. They are also not afraid in NE to trade players who are on the verge of decline to move up in the draft and that is something the Giants rarely do. They are too loyal to their players and they keep the old gang together until they drop. So I think the Giants have to re-evaluate how they VALUE college players at the start in the draft and when to unload them. Always draft good football players who have the required basic skills.. and not super skilled athletes or super sized linemen who faced little resistance in college. I think you are going to frequently find they will not like the hard contact and the PAIN of that contact at the next level in the NFL. This also includes the QB position.

In comment 13701936 Big Blue Blogger said:

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gtt350 said: Quote: Letting Linval Joseph go was ridiculous OK, that's one. Who else?

Hankins too. We've spent 2nd rounders on DTs 3X lately...that's a waste of resources, imo.

And if he'd have hit on more mid and late round picks, we'd have had the cap room to re-sign more of our own draft picks.

But this goes beyond Reese. I just don't trust that they "self-scout" their own scouts, assessing which of them do a great job, and which support drafting guys who turn out to be stiffs. If there is a consistent pattern to this, there should be more turnover in the scouting department than we've seen. Clearly, Reese is getting some bad information from the scouting department, especially with regards to drafting for the OL. Identifying the source of such poor data is crucial to improving the whole player procurement staff.

Consider the all methods of getting talent, not just one.

The Pats aren't great at drafting but at getting talent, they are simply the best. Should BB be fired because he doesn't draft all that well?

All methods count when considering the value of a GM.

In comment 13701939 1st and 10 said:

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JR does not make the draft decisions in a vacuum, its a group effort is true, but at the end of the day, it is his role to make the picks. If that is your argument then you cannot hold him accountable for the horrific drafts we have had under his time as GM. Part of the role of the GM is to build a roster, that is not the responsibility of the coach or the scouts.

Is it? If it's proven that it's a consensus with the owner voting as well, then it calls into question what Reese's exact role is and makes turning this team around much more difficult.

WHich is why I say Reese, Ross, AND Chris Mara must go.

In comment 13701936 Big Blue Blogger said:

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gtt350 said: Quote: Letting Linval Joseph go was ridiculous OK, that's one. Who else?

You cant say that and not consider the trade off.

Joesph resigns with the Giants means DRC never is a Giant. An as I recall CB in 2014 was a way bigger need then DT with Hankins in the wings

The draft is a crap shoot

IMO The Giants have not developed players for the most part. We seem to be hurt more than most teams when it is time for "next man up". Our reserves do not seem to improve. One could say that it is because they are not good enough to begin with, but I expect that coaching/player development approach may contribute. We end up signing FAs for depth, guys like (Cockeral sp) rather than developing our own (Hunter etc).

Our coaches have also been stubborn with respect to who plays and the team's strategic approach. The solution to any failures is always about improving execution and never about having a better plan.

We are told that the players need to self motivate. I think they need some help. Less cerebral and more emotion. Since Strahan left there does not seem to be anyone who gets the team fired up.

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-He wanted L. Floyd, the LB taken by the Bears. (He was very convinced on him and did not move up). -JR also wanted Conklin and again, did not move up for him.

I've heard fans speculate on this but never heard anyone in the Giants front office say this.

Tom Brady on David Carr's Texans would be out of the league by now.

As Colin pointed out, sometimes you get lucky, sometimes you don’t.

but this is really a fruitless effort. Every GM has mistakes or good guys they didn't take or whatever virtually every draft.

Where I have more of a problem is the lack of a real plan year after year. For example, how many years did they ignore LB with the talent in FA never getting any better? They spent 3 high picks on OL and very little else, with all 3 being questionable at best. Then in FA they mostly ignore the top talent and sign veterans in the 2nd and 3rd tier. That says they either overvalued who they had or they are completely inept at evaluating the OL or both. Rb is another position they have screwed up for years.

I don't believe just Reese needs to be held accountable. The scouting department needs to go, the entire coaching staff including HC needs to get, and some players need to go.

In comment 13701936 Big Blue Blogger said:

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gtt350 said: Quote: Letting Linval Joseph go was ridiculous OK, that's one. Who else?

No money in the CAP....Hamilton(?) was every bit as good and Tomlinson looks like he may be better.....

In comment 13703517 section125 said:

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In comment 13701936 Big Blue Blogger said: Quote: gtt350 said: Quote: Letting Linval Joseph go was ridiculous OK, that's one. Who else? No money in the CAP....Hamilton(?) was every bit as good and Tomlinson looks like he may be better.....

Ooops Hankins not Hamilton...