for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Baker Mayfield - Oklahoma

B in ALB : 11/25/2017 5:38 pm
This kid is getting better and better every single week. There are a few red flags regarding discipline but I'm really starting to like this kid (culminating with last week's mistake). Today West Virginia - in their typical trash fashion - has been baiting him and his teammates all day. He's been the first to calm his guys down and let his play do the talking.

And he just put up 42 points...in the first half (now 45).

Kid has the highest completion percentage in the country - nearly 70% for his career - can move, has solid mobility and absolutely drops dimes. He's impressed me more than Rosen, Darnold, Jackson, etc.

If I'm GM, I'm definitely looking at a trade down scenario to allow for a Mayfield pick + another in the first round or multiple picks in the 2nd. McShay has him as the fourth QB off the board. The kid is a winner and I really like his fight and skill set.
He's looking  
Bill in UT : 11/25/2017 5:42 pm : link
great today. Strong on short and long throws. Throws darts in the red zone. Just afraid he's got some Johnny Manziel along with the Phillip Rivers in him. His celebrations are really excessive. Could be a zoo with both him and OBJ
So you'd trade down  
djm : 11/25/2017 5:42 pm : link
And hope to get the qb later? That's risky. I'd even say that's crazy.

Don't get your hopes up with mayfield. I'd be shocked if they draft him. The Giants are weird with measurables, especially qb measurables.
I've been watching that game a bits  
adamg : 11/25/2017 5:43 pm : link
And I agree. Imagining his and OBJ's swagger combined. That would drive the old fogies nuts.
Not to mention any so called character concerns  
djm : 11/25/2017 5:44 pm : link
.. not that he has any true character concerns but you know the Giants. They don't typically go after qbs that are lightning rods. Kerry Collins was the exception and he came here on the cheap.

Let's be honest, the Giants are weird.
My issue is not what he can or cannot do on the field.  
robbieballs2003 : 11/25/2017 5:45 pm : link
My concerns are hiw he will deal with losing and how he will deal with the media. Everybody can make an argument for who is better between Eli, Rivers, and Ben but I don't think Rivers would have handled the media well when he was younger. I think Ben would have gotten eaten alive in NY with the rape accusations and motorcycle incident. This has to be considered if a QB is gonna play in NY.
Are they allowed to play defense in the big 12?  
bubba0825 : 11/25/2017 5:46 pm : link
It’s hard to judge because of the lack of defenses he’s played
The kid is going in the first 5 picks  
Giant John : 11/25/2017 5:47 pm : link
I hope it’s to the Giants. This kid is the best in college and it’s not close.
Francesa already dismissed him as a "system QB"  
bceagle05 : 11/25/2017 5:47 pm : link
so that guarantees he'll be a Hall of Famer. Let's get him.
I’ve been watching  
Jolly Blue Giant : 11/25/2017 5:48 pm : link
The big 3 QBs for the past 3 or 4 weeks. He’s my favorite. Maybe the last 13 years with Eli has made me want a firey QB just for a change of pace, but I love it. I don’t care if he’s not 6’4”
I should also add he’s only listed at 6’ 1”  
bubba0825 : 11/25/2017 5:49 pm : link
Will be difficult to see over his oline in the nfl
B  
BigBlueShock : 11/25/2017 5:50 pm : link
I’m actually shocked that you’re taking this stance on Mayfield. Not saying you’re wrong, but he’s doing this against mostly absolutely horrific defenses in the Big 12 and seems to be quite the douche.

He may be a good one, but doing I can’t take him seriously until I see him do it against one of these big time schools in the playoff. Do it against Alabama and he’ll have my attention. I can’t take West Virginia High School seriously
I bet by April  
Jolly Blue Giant : 11/25/2017 5:51 pm : link
He’s rated higher than Darnold. I hope he makes the playoffs so we can see him against big time competition.
B right with you  
Jint Fan in Buc Land : 11/25/2017 5:55 pm : link
Really hope
What kind of defenses did  
Bill in UT : 11/25/2017 5:56 pm : link
Wentz and Prescott play against? Just asking
He is really tough to evaluate..  
hitchchops2 : 11/25/2017 5:58 pm : link
...against essentially flag football defenses. I agree he has looked exceptional this year, but really none of what you are seeing applies to his future, as these are essentially as meaningful as walk-throughs. He has a good arm, but the scrambling seems unlikely to translate. At this point I'll take Rosen if available.
RE: B  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 6:00 pm : link
In comment 13704968 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
I’m actually shocked that you’re taking this stance on Mayfield. Not saying you’re wrong, but he’s doing this against mostly absolutely horrific defenses in the Big 12 and seems to be quite the douche.

He may be a good one, but doing I can’t take him seriously until I see him do it against one of these big time schools in the playoff. Do it against Alabama and he’ll have my attention. I can’t take West Virginia High School seriously


It's a fair point and I agree. NFL defenses no doubt offer much stiffer challenges. That said, he's got the physical tools (though a bit short for a QB by a couple inches) to be a really good pro. And he's already more seasoned than either Rosen or Darnold.

I like his swagger and confidence. But I like his skills more.

Whoever brought up the media - and losing more than he's used to - again, fair points. But the kid is definitely an NFL QB. I don't think he's going in the Top 5 - and if the Giants can swing a deal for more picks by trading down and snatching Mayfield - I'm all for it.
RE: What kind of defenses did  
BigBlueShock : 11/25/2017 6:00 pm : link
In comment 13704976 Bill in UT said:
Quote:
Wentz and Prescott play against? Just asking

Wentz didn’t play against strong competition but he’s 6’5” with tremendous athleticism for a QB. Prescott played in the SEC, so....

Put it this way in regards to the Big 12 defenses, they have QBs breaking records seemingly every single season and yet have exactly ONE starting QB in the NFL. Their claim to fame? The one and only Andy Dalton.
And he did beat Ohio State in Columbus  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 6:02 pm : link
earlier this season - so there's that.
If he is your guy  
Sy'56 : 11/25/2017 6:02 pm : link
You take him the second he is available when you are on the clock. Do not game it.
Too many flags  
WillVAB : 11/25/2017 6:05 pm : link
Could be Colt McCoy or could be Brees. Giants need a clean prospect in round 1.
He's my guy  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 6:05 pm : link
What do you think Sy?
I think some folks forgot Ohio  
Giant John : 11/25/2017 6:06 pm : link
Away. Let’s get him in the playoffs...
I’m with you Sy.  
Giant John : 11/25/2017 6:06 pm : link
No doubt.
RE: Too many flags  
Jay on the Island : 11/25/2017 6:09 pm : link
In comment 13704991 WillVAB said:
Quote:
Could be Colt McCoy or could be Brees. Giants need a clean prospect in round 1.

I don't understand the Colt McCoy comparisons. McCoy didn't have the arm strength to succeed in the NFL. That was apparent and the reason he wasn't a 1st or 2nd round pick.
RE: He's my guy  
robbieballs2003 : 11/25/2017 6:10 pm : link
In comment 13704992 B in ALB said:
Quote:
What do you think Sy?


Sy has said that Rosen is his top guy right now but he cannot get away from Mayfield. I hope I am not misquoting him.

It sounds to me that Baker Mayfield can leapfrog to the top if he shows well in the playoffs and the shirne or senior bowl plus the combine and other stuff.
It remains to be seen if the Giants like him or not  
Jay on the Island : 11/25/2017 6:11 pm : link
But if they do then they should and will draft him in the 1st round. As Sy said you can't risk trading down and losing a potential franchise QB.
Only way I'd like him more,  
Default : 11/25/2017 6:11 pm : link
is if he knelt for the national anthem.
I love the kid.  
Vin_Cuccs : 11/25/2017 6:13 pm : link
Not sure about how he will be as a pro, but he is a leader and a winner. I know people are crushing him over last week, but I kind of like it. Showing fight and some moxie. That kind of guys is what this pathetic team could use.

As for those who say that this team likes measureables, no one knows what a potential new GM might be looking for in a QB.

By all accounts, he's a coachable kid, and loves the game.

I have a feeling he will really impress at the combine and his stock will soar. I think as it is already, he's probably a mid-first round guy. He might not grade out that high, but somebody is going to fall in love with him and take him there.

If the Giants love him, and think he's a future star, they should take him no matter where they draft. If it's 1st overall, 5th overall, or anywhere in between. Trust your scouts, and don't hesitate to pull the trigger if he's your guy. The old saying is you'd rather take a guy a few picks, or a few rounds early rather than miss out on him all together.

The more I think about it, the more I would really like a mobile QB. Having someone who can move in the pocket, and make throws on the run, is really what this league is turning into. Especially considering the weaknesses of the offense of lines around the league. Having a guy who can make something happen when a play breaks down is priceless. That is how drives get extended.
I see more Russell Wilson than Drew Brees in him.  
robbieballs2003 : 11/25/2017 6:17 pm : link
.
RE: And he did beat Ohio State in Columbus  
BigBlueShock : 11/25/2017 6:20 pm : link
In comment 13704986 B in ALB said:
Quote:
earlier this season - so there's that.

Yes he did. But Ohio State was not the same team early in the season. Their defense is extremely young. The week before they played Oklahoma they gave up 410 passing yards to....Indiana.

But again, I’m not saying that Mayfield won’t be great, I’m just extremely skeptical. He’s throwing to guys that don’t have defenders within 5 yards of them on most plays
RE: RE: Too many flags  
WillVAB : 11/25/2017 6:22 pm : link
In comment 13705001 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 13704991 WillVAB said:


Quote:


Could be Colt McCoy or could be Brees. Giants need a clean prospect in round 1.


I don't understand the Colt McCoy comparisons. McCoy didn't have the arm strength to succeed in the NFL. That was apparent and the reason he wasn't a 1st or 2nd round pick.


By Colt McCoy I mean enough skill and athleticism to dominate in college but not enough to translate to the pros.

Mayfield moves around well in college but I’m not sure it will work at the next level. He’s not great at feeling the pressure, but you don’t see it become an issue that often at this level. He also gets away with some throws that will be picks at the next level.

Don’t get me wrong, he’s having a great year and deserves the hype. I just wouldn’t be comfortable taking him top 5.
As skeptical as I am though  
BigBlueShock : 11/25/2017 6:26 pm : link
I’m pulling for him and hoping that he continues to perform well into the playoffs and he skyrockets up the draft boards. It can only help the Giants to have as many potential superstar QBs in the draft as possible because you just know they will miss out on the other two
RE: As skeptical as I am though  
robbieballs2003 : 11/25/2017 6:30 pm : link
In comment 13705018 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
I’m pulling for him and hoping that he continues to perform well into the playoffs and he skyrockets up the draft boards. It can only help the Giants to have as many potential superstar QBs in the draft as possible because you just know they will miss out on the other two


Absolutely. Even if we want Barkley this can help because right now it seems like SF will take him and they will likely be picking second. If there is less top end talent they will just make the pick. If there are some QBs then there will probably be a team that will package a great deal too good for SF to pass on pushing other players down if we choose to stay put.
RE: He's my guy  
Sy'56 : 11/25/2017 6:31 pm : link
In comment 13704992 B in ALB said:
Quote:
What do you think Sy?


No final grading yet.

But gun to my head, I am taking my chance with Mayfield over any of these other QBs right now.
The thing I like most about him are the intangibles.....  
Simms11 : 11/25/2017 6:36 pm : link
He’s a gamer. Sy even mentioned that we need to draft more guys that love to play the game, and I think he’s one. He’s got great mobility and a good arm. Only issue is height, but Brees and Wilson re short QBs and both have won Super Bowls.

Rosen to me is a gifted, skilled passer, but there’s concerns with his desire to play football, as well and he’s oft injured, which is already not a good sign.
Mayfield  
Sammo85 : 11/25/2017 6:38 pm : link
May not make it to the middle of the 1st.

Too many teams needing QB options early on. Browns, Giants, Broncos, Cardinals, Jets. Plus other teams like the Bills and Saints being interested too.

If Darnold doesn’t come out, that really pushes Mayfield if there’s a team that wants him. It only takes one.

Mayfield has impressed me with his touch and passing. He’s got a really good accurate arm for a guy who is shorter and compact in body type.

And going from a stoic business only guy like Eli  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 6:38 pm : link
(nothing wrong with that, btw) to a fiery, outspoken, often times arrogant player under center would be a lot of fun for the fans. As long as he can perform.
For the record  
Sy'56 : 11/25/2017 6:45 pm : link
This would be a very out-of-the-box draftee by the NYG organization
RE: For the record  
djm : 11/25/2017 6:50 pm : link
In comment 13705038 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
This would be a very out-of-the-box draftee by the NYG organization


Completely out of the box. Only way it happens is if some huge profile GM/coach is brought in and he loves mayfield. Then he'd still have to convince Mara tech that mayfield is a safe bet. All the while mayfield can't fuck up some single bit on or off the field from now until next April.

It's not happening. 10 dominoes would need to fall for the Giants to draft mayfield.
RE: For the record  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 6:51 pm : link
In comment 13705038 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
This would be a very out-of-the-box draftee by the NYG organization


It absolutely would. And I like that.
This decision might also be made for them.  
Vin_Cuccs : 11/25/2017 7:01 pm : link
The automatic assumption is that Darnold, Rosen, Allen, and Jackson will all declare for the draft.

Darnold is a red shirt sophomore.
Jackson and Rosen are juniors.
Allen is a red shirt junior.
Mayfield is a red shirt senior.

The more of these guys get pushed up to early 1  
idiotsavant : 11/25/2017 7:07 pm : link
The more value will be there lower down in trade down scenarios.

If trading down to 10 or 15 gets you out of the QB hunt, so be it, take that risk.

You still get (3?) Legit players for the one, including the one elite type. If not two of those high round 1 types, as they drop..stockpile offensive and defensive linesmen, linebackers and running backs.
B in ALB:  
mrvax : 11/25/2017 7:12 pm : link
I agree. This kid is certainly worth a long hard look.
RE: The more of these guys get pushed up to early 1  
BigBlueShock : 11/25/2017 7:15 pm : link
In comment 13705057 idiotsavant said:
Quote:
The more value will be there lower down in trade down scenarios.

If trading down to 10 or 15 gets you out of the QB hunt, so be it, take that risk.

You still get (3?) Legit players for the one, including the one elite type. If not two of those high round 1 types, as they drop..stockpile offensive and defensive linesmen, linebackers and running backs.

The Giants rarely get a chance at a top 5 pick. They aren’t trading that pick to move out of the top 10. They may be open to moving back a couple of spots but then the problem is finding a taker. After the QBs the next group of guys will likely have similar grades so why would a team trade a boatload of picks to move up a couple of spots? There’s no chance that the Giants miss a chance at a top 5 pick to move out of the top 10. This opportunity doesn’t come along very often
If Reese AND/OR McAdoo are coming back  
Sy'56 : 11/25/2017 7:18 pm : link
There is no shot they go QB this year.
Ginats will not draft him as long as  
Stan in LA : 11/25/2017 7:21 pm : link
Reese is in charge.
RE: If Reese AND/OR McAdoo are coming back  
BigBlueShock : 11/25/2017 7:21 pm : link
In comment 13705064 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
There is no shot they go QB this year.

Reese has spent an awful lot of time scouting these QBs to proclaim there’s “no shot”. And McAdoo is clearly not an Eli fan. I can actually see him using the “get me a more WCO friendly QB” as his defense to desperately plead his case.
I like him.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 11/25/2017 7:24 pm : link
Though I don't know how he'll translate to pros. But people were saying the same thing about Watson so...
RE: Ginats will not draft him as long as  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 7:25 pm : link
In comment 13705065 Stan in LA said:
Quote:
Reese is in charge.


Agree. And that's a shame.
RE: RE: Ginats will not draft him as long as  
Stan in LA : 11/25/2017 7:26 pm : link
In comment 13705072 B in ALB said:
Quote:
In comment 13705065 Stan in LA said:


Quote:


Reese is in charge.



Agree. And that's a shame.


Having said that watching him today was like watching a budding superstar. He has the 'it' factor in spades.
I have a bad feeling  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 7:41 pm : link
that the Giants aren't going to completely dismantle this team unless they lose every single remaining game.

And that is really concerning. The coach is lost. And he's lost the team. He's got players completely off the reservation.

Mayfield may end up being a pipe dream. And that's shitty.
I haven't seen him play other than highlights...  
Milton : 11/25/2017 7:56 pm : link
Which seem to feature broken plays that he turns into big gains. How is he at standing tough in the pocket and going through his progressions to hit the open man even if it isn't the first read? I don't want a QB who bolts the pocket if his first option isn't open. And I don't care that he's looking to throw when he escapes the pocket, it's still a broken play.

So that would be my question to those of you who have seen a lot more of his game than I have.
Mayfield equals  
Carl in CT : 11/25/2017 7:57 pm : link
Doug Flutie.
RE: Mayfield equals  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 8:03 pm : link
In comment 13705092 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Doug Flutie.


Didn't know we had another professional scout posting on bbi offering top notch analysis. Great post! Awesome.
RE: Mayfield equals  
BigBlueShock : 11/25/2017 8:08 pm : link
In comment 13705092 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Doug Flutie.

Exactly! Except, wait, they are literally nothing alike in any way. Great call!
RE: I haven't seen him play other than highlights...  
Bill in UT : 11/25/2017 8:19 pm : link
In comment 13705090 Milton said:
Quote:
Which seem to feature broken plays that he turns into big gains. How is he at standing tough in the pocket and going through his progressions to hit the open man even if it isn't the first read? I don't want a QB who bolts the pocket if his first option isn't open. And I don't care that he's looking to throw when he escapes the pocket, it's still a broken play.

So that would be my question to those of you who have seen a lot more of his game than I have.


I don't recall any broken plays today. Basically everything he threw was from the pocket
West Virginia has zero defense - just wanted to point that out  
PatersonPlank : 11/25/2017 8:20 pm : link
.
btw, as far as defenses  
Bill in UT : 11/25/2017 8:22 pm : link
I don't know who the announcers were today, I was fast-forwarding between this game and Ala-Auburn, but one of the guys did say that he thought the Big 12 defenses were better than the Pac 10, (home of Rosen and Darnold). his feelings, not mine
I got really excited last year when watching him . . . .  
TC : 11/25/2017 8:24 pm : link
while looking at other Oklahoma players. He's one of the most exciting QB's I've seen in a while. I have NO concerns about his height. But I have to wonder how his style of play will work in the NFL. I DON'T think that every successful NFL QB has to be a 6'5" pocket passer. But I'm not sure what he does on the field will work as well against NFL level defenders.

And while I'm not looking for the Giants to draft the next St. Eli, some of what he's done this year with the cops and side line antics would write a year's worth of headlines for NY sports media. Put all together, I wonder how huge sums of money and unlimited access to booze, drugs and whatever other mischief he might fancy would interact with his volatile persona.

I think he is likely to either be a very special NFL QB, or a bust.
RE: West Virginia has zero defense - just wanted to point that out  
Bill in UT : 11/25/2017 8:25 pm : link
In comment 13705101 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
.


From what I sae, he was by far the top rated college passer before playing West Virginia. Just wanted to point that out :)
Everyone needs to relax  
nyballa0891 : 11/25/2017 8:27 pm : link
The kid has done this all season, but the same concerns that were there weeks ago are still there. I still think he drops to the second round if not late first. Under no scenario do I see him going in the top 10
RE: RE: I haven't seen him play other than highlights...  
Milton : 11/25/2017 8:27 pm : link
In comment 13705099 Bill in UT said:
Quote:
In comment 13705090 Milton said:

Which seem to feature broken plays that he turns into big gains. How is he at standing tough in the pocket and going through his progressions to hit the open man even if it isn't the first read? I don't want a QB who bolts the pocket if his first option isn't open. And I don't care that he's looking to throw when he escapes the pocket, it's still a broken play. So that would be my question to those of you who have seen a lot more of his game than I have.

I don't recall any broken plays today. Basically everything he threw was from the pocket
Thanks!
B  
Carl in CT : 11/25/2017 8:43 pm : link
Go use the C word again. You are nothing but first class.
And by the way  
Carl in CT : 11/25/2017 8:46 pm : link
If you see a QB you like that fits your system you draft him. You don't trade down and hope he is there genius. I was actually giving the kid a compliment as I haven't seen a college QB with a much moxie and desire as that kid since Doug Flutie.
Sy's right, that Mayfield would be a very  
CT Charlie : 11/25/2017 8:53 pm : link
outside-the-box pick for the Giants. With all the distractions he'd bring as a quarterback in New York, he would make OBJ look like Mitt Romney. I think the Maras would rather lose (a little...) with a guy like Eli than win with a guy like Mayfield.
RE: B  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 8:57 pm : link
In comment 13705128 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Go use the C word again. You are nothing but first class.


Aww. Was that you complaining to the mods because you're a limp dick? Pathetic.
RE: And by the way  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 9:02 pm : link
In comment 13705131 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
If you see a QB you like that fits your system you draft him. You don't trade down and hope he is there genius. I was actually giving the kid a compliment as I haven't seen a college QB with a much moxie and desire as that kid since Doug Flutie.


A compliment?

Moxie and desire? You haven't seen it in over 30 years?

They are completely different players in completely different generations.

Is he the next Jeff Kimlo?

Hahaha. Clownshow.
RE: If he is your guy  
Thegratefulhead : 11/25/2017 9:15 pm : link
In comment 13704987 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
You take him the second he is available when you are on the clock. Do not game it.


He is the guy...I know, height and Big 12, receivers very open. Please go watch people, he hits people in stride down the field with people in his face. HE IS SO FUCKING ACCURATE> There is no defense against the perfect pass. I think he can be better than R Wilson or D Brees. Mayfield to OBJ would be unstoppable because OBJ can't be covered for than a few seconds at best. Throw great on the run, has touch like we have never seen as Giant fans. Trade up and get him, don't even get cute, heads and shoulders above the other QBs. Arm is above average. I think he is a can't miss. He will be better than Luck. Accuracy, accuracy accuracy.
RE: RE: Mayfield equals  
djm : 11/25/2017 9:43 pm : link
In comment 13705095 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
In comment 13705092 Carl in CT said:


Quote:


Doug Flutie.


Exactly! Except, wait, they are literally nothing alike in any way. Great call!


Plus, flutie was fucking awesome.
RE: RE: The more of these guys get pushed up to early 1  
WillVAB : 11/25/2017 9:54 pm : link
In comment 13705062 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
In comment 13705057 idiotsavant said:


Quote:


The more value will be there lower down in trade down scenarios.

If trading down to 10 or 15 gets you out of the QB hunt, so be it, take that risk.

You still get (3?) Legit players for the one, including the one elite type. If not two of those high round 1 types, as they drop..stockpile offensive and defensive linesmen, linebackers and running backs.


The Giants rarely get a chance at a top 5 pick. They aren’t trading that pick to move out of the top 10. They may be open to moving back a couple of spots but then the problem is finding a taker. After the QBs the next group of guys will likely have similar grades so why would a team trade a boatload of picks to move up a couple of spots? There’s no chance that the Giants miss a chance at a top 5 pick to move out of the top 10. This opportunity doesn’t come along very often


Buffalo obviously wants a franchise QB and has acquired the ammo to move up for one. If the Giants trade down with Buffalo they’d likely get 2 first rounders in the 15-25 range (maybe better), 2 second rounders, and at least a first in ‘19. That’s 5-6 picks that could yield high end starters even with Reese drafting. That’s my preference as opposed to maybe one elite player at 3.

Ultimately it’s probably academic considering SF is in a better position to trade down. They already acquired their QB, Hyde is a more than capable back, and Barkley isn’t worth number 2 overall.
RE: I see more Russell Wilson than Drew Brees in him.  
bradshaw44 : 11/25/2017 9:54 pm : link
In comment 13705011 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
.


I haven’t watche a minute of his play. But all descriptions have sounded like Russel Wilson yet nobody but you have mentioned this that I’ve seen.
There's a lot to like about Mayfield, and I wouldn't be unhappy about  
Ira : 11/25/2017 10:07 pm : link
seeing him in blue. But let's not overrate this swagger thing. Tim Tebow had swagger.
Comparing Mayfield to Tebow  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 10:18 pm : link
is hilarious.

Tebow had swagger?

Me thinks you don't know what swagger be.
his..  
outeiroj : 11/25/2017 10:18 pm : link
"swagger" reminds me too much of that vanilla midget johnny football.

PASS
Vanilla midget?  
B in ALB : 11/25/2017 10:35 pm : link
What's that mean?

Short white boy.

Pass.
One thing that Mayfield definitely has is  
Ira : 11/25/2017 10:35 pm : link
very good receivers.
RE: I have a bad feeling  
old man : 11/25/2017 11:09 pm : link
In comment 13705083 B in ALB said:
Quote:
that the Giants aren't going to completely dismantle this team unless they lose every single remaining game.

And that is really concerning. The coach is lost. And he's lost the team. He's got players completely off the reservation.

Mayfield may end up being a pipe dream. And that's shitty.


"unless they lose every single remaining game".

You're betting AGAINST that?
More likely to lose them all than win 1(ONE).
FWIW  
old man : 11/25/2017 11:19 pm : link
Fewer college are using the QB under C; eventually NFL will have to adjust to that.
It'd be nice if the outcome of this '17 debacle is the Giants play AHEAD of the curve and not be another copycater and commit to a shotgun-EXCLUSIVELY QB.
I know Payton made Brees this kind of QB, and other teams have drafted mobile, 'gun QBs, but 10 years from now the under C QB will be history.
I think Mayfield is having a great year and should win the Heisman  
PatersonPlank : 11/25/2017 11:41 pm : link
however I'm not sure he translates into an NFL QB. Lots of really good/great college QB's don't translate. For one his size is a big issue in the NFL. Second his arm strength is questionable, and I guess we'll see at teh combine. Third his temperment. Teamas who draft a guy in Rd 1, especially a QB, are looking for character as well as talent.

In the NFL you can't just run at the QB position like you can in college. The defenses are too big, fast, and athletic. You need to be able to pass the ball accurately down the field into small windows. Mobility is great if you can use it to buy more time to throw, something Wilson is great at (like Tarkenton was). However running for the sake of getting yards doesn't cut it in the NFL, and eventually gets the QB hurt (there are lots of examples of this). Even a big guy like Cam got beat up, and now stays in the pocket more. He has learned not to run, but to buy time to throw.

Guys like Darnold, Allen, Rosen, Rudolph, and of course I am throwing Webb in there, have the size and arm strength to play in the NFL. They can also move pretty well, although not as well as Mayfield, but good enough. These guys accuracy will be figured out at the combine. However they definitely have the size and arm to get it done in the NFL.
Today was the only day  
Bill in UT : 11/26/2017 12:02 am : link
that I've really watched him. The last 2 years, he's averaged 6.5 rushes per game, for less than a 3 yard average. He's also averaged over 11 yards per pass attempt, 325 ypg, 37 TDs and 6.5 Ints, with close to a 200 qb rating. I don't think those are the stats of "run first" qb
You can say a lot of things about Mayfield, but . . . .  
TC : 11/26/2017 12:09 am : link
saying his arm strength is questionable is comic. I've seen the guy throw the ball 70-80 yards!

But of course, if he plays for McAdon't, it doesn't matter, he only needs to be able to throw 3 yard check downs! ;-)
Yeah. Arm strength is questionable?  
B in ALB : 11/26/2017 12:32 am : link
That statement automatically disqualifies someone from talking about football. Holy ass hairs.
Baker  
DavidinBMNY : 11/26/2017 7:17 am : link
Please new GM of the future go get us some Baker Mayfield!!!
I don’t know enough about Mayfield  
UConn4523 : 11/26/2017 7:34 am : link
to have an educated conversation on him but I will say I’m done thinking we need to have or any nfl team needs to have, a prototype QB to have success in the this league. It simply isn’t true anymore and will only continue to change direction, IMO.

If the off field stuff checks out I’d be on board with taking him.
For those thinking he is too short,  
section125 : 11/26/2017 7:36 am : link
Drew Brees and Russell Wilson disagree. Phil Simms said even a 6'4" QB has trouble throwing over 6'6" OL and they need passing lanes.
I think the Giants need to go with a more mobile QB. It is dangerous injury wise, but it is so hard to build a brick wall Oline today, that mobility (Aaron Rodgers style) is needed.
Mayfield versus good defenses...  
Jimmy Googs : 11/26/2017 7:55 am : link
I thought this was brought up a few weeks ago. Yes of course his competition in Big 12 is a joke, but that he also had very good film against Ohio St and one other (forget?) team as of late.

I like Rosen a good bit, but agree we are better off with a few guys up there to compete against Webb next year, after we cut Eli...

Mayfield  
Sammo85 : 11/26/2017 8:14 am : link
Has better arm strength and accuracy down field than Webb.
RE: Mayfield  
Jimmy Googs : 11/26/2017 8:16 am : link
In comment 13705371 Sammo85 said:
Quote:
Has better arm strength and accuracy down field than Webb.


I hear that Webb has been lighting up the practice squads games with perfectly accurate deep bombs each game.

But sadly, he's not ready to run this complex offense of 1 run and 2 three yard passes each series...

RE: I think Mayfield is having a great year and should win the Heisman  
NikkiMac : 11/26/2017 9:40 am : link
In comment 13705289 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
however I'm not sure he translates into an NFL QB. Lots of really good/great college QB's don't translate. For one his size is a big issue in the NFL. Second his arm strength is questionable, and I guess we'll see at teh combine. Third his temperment. Teamas who draft a guy in Rd 1, especially a QB, are looking for character as well as talent.

In the NFL you can't just run at the QB position like you can in college. The defenses are too big, fast, and athletic. You need to be able to pass the ball accurately down the field into small windows. Mobility is great if you can use it to buy more time to throw, something Wilson is great at (like Tarkenton was). However running for the sake of getting yards doesn't cut it in the NFL, and eventually gets the QB hurt (there are lots of examples of this). Even a big guy like Cam got beat up, and now stays in the pocket more. He has learned not to run, but to buy time to throw.

Guys like Darnold, Allen, Rosen, Rudolph, and of course I am throwing Webb in there, have the size and arm strength to play in the NFL. They can also move pretty well, although not as well as Mayfield, but good enough. These guys accuracy will be figured out at the combine. However they definitely have the size and arm to get it done in the NFL.



False about the arm strength furthermore this kid can make every pass with accuracy is mobile and I don’t buy that stuff about playing against inferior defenses he’s winning against the guys that he is going to play against in the future ..... the only thing I wonder about would be his durability taking hits especially if the team plans on running some read option also more bullshit that he can’t take the snap from center ,I seen him do that with success too ..... you have to love this kids passion the only other problem I see imo is he might have some OBJ in him and I don’t no if that’s good or bad
The  
AcidTest : 11/26/2017 10:12 am : link
entire debate is probably irrelevant. My guess is that the Giants will not draft Mayfield because of his perceived "character concerns," especially after Will Hill, OO, and now Apple. Giants management may insist that the top five pick only be used on a "completely clean" player.

Mayfield is also only 6'1", which is a lot less than the size requirements the Giants have for QBs.

Mayfield has also been playing against dreadful defenses.

I think all of this will apply even with a new GM, although there is certainly a greater chance that Mayfield could be picked in that situation. And unlike Reese, a new GM also has no investment in Webb.

I think therefore that Rosen and Darnold are the only QBs the Giants would consider in the top five, regardless of who is GM.

I have seen a lot of Mayfield. Like others, I agree he's a dynamic, electric, player. He has more than enough arm strength, mobility, and accuracy. I would consider him, even in the top five. But I don't think the Giants will.
I'd take Jackson  
ajr2456 : 11/26/2017 10:19 am : link
Before Mayfield
I have to admit I'm turning into a Mayfield fan. All the more reason  
Blue21 : 11/26/2017 10:22 am : link
I'll be disappointed on draft day.
They can probably get Mayfield  
NikkiMac : 11/26/2017 4:13 pm : link
By moving down and they could get extra picks doing that for OL LB RB

Then go into season with Eli Webb and Mayfield let them duke it out !!!!

That’s what I’d like to see anyway !
RE: I'd take Jackson  
bw in dc : 11/26/2017 4:22 pm : link
In comment 13705470 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
Before Mayfield


I would too. Mayfield is another mirage courtesy of the Big 12 clown show...
Big 12 plays no defense this season, dreadful units  
JonC : 11/27/2017 8:21 am : link
I'm another who puts more weight on that than Mayfield being an elite NFL prospect ... and, he's a tool bag.
The asshole factor is the only red flag I see with Mayfield.  
Heisenberg : 11/27/2017 9:22 am : link
I love how he plays.
Big 12 Defense comments  
GiantGrit : 11/27/2017 3:21 pm : link
Understood, fair arguments...just curious if you guys watched Oklahoma at OSU this year. What about that defense?
first question that has to be answered about any qb prospect is  
Dave : 11/28/2017 8:21 am : link
can he throw the deep out?

That is the hardest pass to complete, and its hard to be successful in the nfl without being able to make that throw, imo. (but I'm an accountant, not a scout)

Back to the Corner