for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
as dirt. I believe Mara over McAdoo, but I think Mara takes blame for not being in the building when all this shit went down which is why McAdoo wasnt fired on the spot.
is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
everything is evaulated...cmon people, you know how the Mara's operate
Personally, I think there's a history of how Wellington Mara operated. I think a lot of owners feel/felt the same way but today's NFL is a little different. John Mara, as President, really hasn't had a situation like this. The league has changed, why can't Mara? After all, what's being done now is not working and he's taking a ton of heat right now.
is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
This place is a disaster. People are finally going to get what they wanted but will still find reasons to be outraged. For fucks sake.
It is when your employee doesnt communicate properly and tarnishes your reputation.
Not just for the reasons you mentioned and the abysmal track record. But at this point, it becomes a security issue to have Ben take the sidelines in MetLife.
Ian RapoportVerified account @RapSheet
3m3 minutes ago
Sources: Some members of the #Giants ownership did not agree with how Eli Manning was handled this week and there was intense and serious internal debate. They are trying to figure out the fallout, leading to John Mara not guaranteeing Ben McAdoo would finish the season.
But, I do believe John Mara and I believe he was highly pissed off about how mcadoo handled this whole situation and would have fired him on Wednesday except for the fact that we were already into the weeks preparation.
It is all wait and see, but mcadoo is a disaster and his ouster can't happen quick enough
@rapsheet Sources: Some members of the #Giants ownership did not agree with how Eli Manning was handled this week and there was intense and serious internal debate. They are trying to figure out the fallout, leading to John Mara not guaranteeing Ben McAdoo would finish the season.
regarding the above
Quote:
@RVacchianoSNY
Ralph Vacchiano Retweeted Ian Rapoport
This is true. The split has been festering for a while over direction of the franchise (and, to an extent, the GM), a source said. It got worse with the Eli Manning mess. Some influential people at the top are furious with how it was handled.
But, I do believe John Mara and I believe he was highly pissed off about how mcadoo handled this whole situation and would have fired him on Wednesday except for the fact that we were already into the weeks preparation.
It is all wait and see, but mcadoo is a disaster and his ouster can't happen quick enough
I agree. Mara isnt perfect, but I trust him on this. It was a fucking stupid decision to trust McAdoo to handle such a dicey situation. Mara knows he screwed up which is why McAdoo wasnt hired on the spot IMO.
is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
This place is a disaster. People are finally going to get what they wanted but will still find reasons to be outraged. For fucks sake.
I know I don't want it. For one thing, I agree with the point that it's a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage (um, Tennessee?), and for another, I don't want to risk an interim coach - whether that's Spags or Sully - coming in and firing the team up for an extra win or two that actually harms the franchise's long-term opportunity.
They're all culpable in this dumpster fire of a season. Now just let it burn.
is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
what organization are you talking about? The Maras have always operated that way
Ralph VacchianoVerified account @RVacchianoSNY
16m16 minutes ago
Ralph Vacchiano Retweeted Ian Rapoport
This is true. The split has been festering for a while over direction of the franchise (and, to an extent, the GM), a source said. It got worse with the Eli Manning mess. Some influential people at the top are furious with how it was handled.
Just once in the last 80+ years (Arsparger in 1976), but then again, most of that time was under Wellington, so who knows.
Mara and Tisch may be thinking about what the next home game would be like if Mac were still in charge. If they fire Mac and start Eli next game there will be less negative fan reaction.
Ive been waiting for this since Wellington passed away.
The Tisch side of the house has let the Maras have too much say over football decisions. I also wouldnt be surprised if Tim Mara skewered John and Chris over how much they have diminished and mishandled the Giants the last four years. The Tisches tend to have a good handle into the pulse of the media and PR landscape and have lots of connections to the Hollywood aspect of things.
Mara made the McAdoo decision. He deserves to be roasted for it and the Eli fallout.
I hope this forces the owners to bring in a neutral party to be an empowered head of all football operations.
Chris and John Mara have no business being involved whatsoever. Theyve proven themselves incapable.
RE: Giants Have Fired Their Coach During The Season...
Just once in the last 80+ years (Arsparger in 1976), but then again, most of that time was under Wellington, so who knows.
Mara and Tisch may be thinking about what the next home game would be like if Mac were still in charge. If they fire Mac and start Eli next game there will be less negative fan reaction.
So, you let McAdoo make Eli the scapegoat and do your dirty work, then you fire him the day after if it doesn't work out, making him the new scapegoat. That only stinks of more dysfunction.
Bottom line, if they wanted to see Webb, they should have been getting Webb ready a few weeks ago. Everything they've done with Webb from the summer on has been head scratchingly bad. Everything they did this week was unprofessional, poorly managed, disrespectful, cold, and also don't seem to make sense. Geno neither requires a look (he has a 4 year resume), gives you a better chance to win, or figures in to the future...unless he is really the guy you want mentoring Webb and/or a top 3 draft pick. I know I sure would rather have had Eli doing that and made for a more graceful exit for Eli after next season.
is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
This place is a disaster. People are finally going to get what they wanted but will still find reasons to be outraged. For fucks sake.
I know I don't want it. For one thing, I agree with the point that it's a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage (um, Tennessee?), and for another, I don't want to risk an interim coach - whether that's Spags or Sully - coming in and firing the team up for an extra win or two that actually harms the franchise's long-term opportunity.
They're all culpable in this dumpster fire of a season. Now just let it burn.
I think we all agree that we dont want any extra wins. But this team is too far gone and an interim coach isnt going to be able to fire this team up enough to win any games. Its not happening, they just dont have the talent at this point.
Theyve got to get McAdoo out of the building though. Instantly. There is literally zero upside to keeping him around to finish the season.
Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Maras roll in all this about Elis disgraceful benching just doesnt add up. I'm sure hes livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, hey, theres been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so hes going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder whos advising Mara on all these matters. Since we havent heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe theres a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Elis extraordinary streak to be ended
HOWEVER, if they lose today (and they will), does Mara really want McAdoo around for the Dallas, Philly And Skins home games? Each game will be a zoo atmosphere and ownership will be booed mercilessly and thoroughly embarrassed. Best way to at least temper the anger and embarrassment would be to fire McAdoo and Reese ahead of the next game. I could see it happening. Attitude might shift to E-L-I M-A-N-N-I-N-G chants instead of fire breathing against coach, GM and owners. Damage control to some degree.
for this organization. it's not just about hurting eli's feelings. as others have pointed out, they've been cold in the past with other face-of-the-franchise players. this is about their brand, which is supposed to be about being the competent, thoughtful franchise in this town. that image has been eroding for a while - the not-so-well handled coughlin firing while keeping reese, the josh brown fiasco, the odell stuff. but this is a whole other order of magnitude of badness. they're basically squandering decades of reputation.
can they really let mcadoo have those brutal press conferences five times a week for the last month of the season? the press already hates him and will just use them as an opportunity to - fairly - ridicule the franchise. this is not the same media environment it was 25 years ago, and i don't think the fact they haven't fired a coach midseason since Arnsparger will stop them from doing it now
poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
They were definitely firing him after the season anyway
but this complete fuck up of a situation is what is pushing this. Its not a knee jerk reaction to fan pressure. It is simply Mara being so pissed off that this moron completely screwed up what they wanted to present to manning that he has no choice but to get rid of him ASAP (Monday) and right the wrong.
Mcadoo has forced Maras hand, not the fans or the media.
the vibe next Sun at MetLife if we lose today and Mac is still there. the boos and catcalls will be deafening and all over Sportscenter. If it possible to be even more of an NFL laughing stock that will do it. At least the "17 years of lousy football" plane was local.
I wouldnt have let him on the plane after the SF loss
Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Maras roll in all this about Elis disgraceful benching just doesnt add up. I'm sure hes livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, hey, theres been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so hes going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder whos advising Mara on all these matters. Since we havent heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe theres a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Elis extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Maras roll in all this about Elis disgraceful benching just doesnt add up. I'm sure hes livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, hey, theres been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so hes going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder whos advising Mara on all these matters. Since we havent heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe theres a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Elis extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation. This is about an awful head coach and an ownership group who have embarrassed themselves time and time again three straight years.
RE: They were definitely firing him after the season anyway
but this complete fuck up of a situation is what is pushing this. Its not a knee jerk reaction to fan pressure. It is simply Mara being so pissed off that this moron completely screwed up what they wanted to present to manning that he has no choice but to get rid of him ASAP (Monday) and right the wrong.
Mcadoo has forced Maras hand, not the fans or the media.
Think whatever you want, but if McAdoo had presented Eli with something that was completely different from what Mara signed off on, he'd have been fired last Monday (when it was initially presented to Eli). The version that Mara tried to walk back to in his statements is one that wouldn't have even required a conversation with Mara or Eli, yet people still believe it?
This is absolutely a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage. For better or worse, that's what it is.
Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Maras roll in all this about Elis disgraceful benching just doesnt add up. I'm sure hes livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, hey, theres been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so hes going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder whos advising Mara on all these matters. Since we havent heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe theres a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Elis extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation. This is about an awful head coach and an ownership group who have embarrassed themselves time and time again three straight years.
Um, what about my comment said anything about player evaluation? Or are you just replying to the wrong post?
What would this accomplish other than acquiescing to
1) John Mara makes his "Let's look at other QB's" statement to Reese two weeks or so ago, presumably after the SF loss. It's very possible that he also made the decision to fire McAdoo then as well, after the season.
2) Mara knows that he's going to have a problem getting the coach he wants. The big problem is Eli's consecutive streak; any coach that sits Eli down is going to be a villian. The ideal way to do this is to get McAdoo to do it, then fire him.
3) John Mara is a Bachelor of Science, Cum Laude, from Boston College. He's grown up with the Giants, from a football family. He's not a dummy, he's personally known countless players, both during their football careers and has hired ex Giants for the organization. He should know how they react.
Anyone really think that Mara was shocked by Eli's reaction? Mara grew up in NY. Is it creditable that he does not know what the media reaction would be? He saw the public reaction when Tarenton was traded, when Simms was sat down by Handley. He's been there.
Eli's family has always had incredible respect for the history of the NFL. Mara knows this. Mara knew that Eli would never do something that would affect the integrity of the game (or his own credibility), like treating regular season games like pre-season games.
This wasn't an offer Eli couldn't refuse, it was an offer Eli would never accept, and John Mara knew that.
3) How to accomplish this? Look up "The Murder of Thomas Becket". King Henry of England, and Thomas Becket, Arch Bishop of Canterbury, were great friends at one time. They quarreled over control of the clergy, to the point where King Henry said the following:
Quote:
What sluggards, what cowards have I brought up in my court, who care nothing for their allegiance to their lord. Who will rid me of this meddlesome priest."
This "insipred" four knights who overheard it to assassinate Becket. King Henry was "shocked" this happened, and he disgraced the knights. Four years later, in an act of penance, the king donned a sack-cloth walking barefoot through the streets of Canterbury while eighty monks flogged him with branches. King Henry knew about PR, even as long ago as 1170!
Let me go out on a branch. I'll bet Mara knows this story; if you take any History of England course, you'll know it. It's a classic way of using others to accomplish your goals, without getting 100% of the blame. After all, King Henry could always say he was "misunderstood", and blame it on "miscommunication". Sound familiar?
4) Mara tells Reese, Reese tells McAdoo. The expected happens. The media storm hits, with "denials" from Mara about what he meant.
Very convenient. If you believe it.
John Mara was appointed the chairman of the Management Council Executive Committee/Labor. He's going to be involved with negotiations with the NFLPA and any new CBA. This is a guy who has an issue communicating?
Seriously?
5) Mara knows what MetLife will be if McAdoo comes back as head coach. He knows the fans are blaming him right now, with Reese and McAdoo as puppets.
Mara also knows a third of the roster is on IR, and starting Geno is pretty much conceding the game to Oakland.
So, if McAdoo loses in Oakland (as expected), Mara has the perfect excuse to fire him. Mara will expect this to blunt the reaction at MetLife next week. This makes it easier to get a new coach for the team. It might even be a way to keep Reese, if Mara can pin everything on McAdoo.
The funny thing here is if McAdoo does pull out a win there, and ruin everything. The way this season is going, who knows?
Then after the season whack Reese. Time to rebuild the management starting with McIdiot.
This also lays credence to the fact that McAdoo really screwed up the communication and plan with Eli. I do believe Mara agreed to a plan to look at Webb, but expected Mac to work with Eli on a plan. He did not expect Mac to dictate "one half", etc., and force Eli into a corner.
I said earlier this week that I didn't want McAdoo fired, because I wanted him to feel the wrath of the fans next week v. Dallas. It makes sense for management to short-circuit that, since it would be arguably the ugliest Giant home game in history (yes, even uglier than the plane banner game).
1) John Mara makes his "Let's look at other QB's" statement to Reese two weeks or so ago, presumably after the SF loss. It's very possible that he also made the decision to fire McAdoo then as well, after the season.
2) Mara knows that he's going to have a problem getting the coach he wants. The big problem is Eli's consecutive streak; any coach that sits Eli down is going to be a villian. The ideal way to do this is to get McAdoo to do it, then fire him.
3) John Mara is a Bachelor of Science, Cum Laude, from Boston College. He's grown up with the Giants, from a football family. He's not a dummy, he's personally known countless players, both during their football careers and has hired ex Giants for the organization. He should know how they react.
Anyone really think that Mara was shocked by Eli's reaction? Mara grew up in NY. Is it creditable that he does not know what the media reaction would be? He saw the public reaction when Tarenton was traded, when Simms was sat down by Handley. He's been there.
Eli's family has always had incredible respect for the history of the NFL. Mara knows this. Mara knew that Eli would never do something that would affect the integrity of the game (or his own credibility), like treating regular season games like pre-season games.
This wasn't an offer Eli couldn't refuse, it was an offer Eli would never accept, and John Mara knew that.
3) How to accomplish this? Look up "The Murder of Thomas Becket". King Henry of England, and Thomas Becket, Arch Bishop of Canterbury, were great friends at one time. They quarreled over control of the clergy, to the point where King Henry said the following:
Quote:
What sluggards, what cowards have I brought up in my court, who care nothing for their allegiance to their lord. Who will rid me of this meddlesome priest."
This "insipred" four knights who overheard it to assassinate Becket. King Henry was "shocked" this happened, and he disgraced the knights. Four years later, in an act of penance, the king donned a sack-cloth walking barefoot through the streets of Canterbury while eighty monks flogged him with branches. King Henry knew about PR, even as long ago as 1170!
Let me go out on a branch. I'll bet Mara knows this story; if you take any History of England course, you'll know it. It's a classic way of using others to accomplish your goals, without getting 100% of the blame. After all, King Henry could always say he was "misunderstood", and blame it on "miscommunication". Sound familiar?
4) Mara tells Reese, Reese tells McAdoo. The expected happens. The media storm hits, with "denials" from Mara about what he meant.
Very convenient. If you believe it.
John Mara was appointed the chairman of the Management Council Executive Committee/Labor. He's going to be involved with negotiations with the NFLPA and any new CBA. This is a guy who has an issue communicating?
Seriously?
5) Mara knows what MetLife will be if McAdoo comes back as head coach. He knows the fans are blaming him right now, with Reese and McAdoo as puppets.
Mara also knows a third of the roster is on IR, and starting Geno is pretty much conceding the game to Oakland.
So, if McAdoo loses in Oakland (as expected), Mara has the perfect excuse to fire him. Mara will expect this to blunt the reaction at MetLife next week. This makes it easier to get a new coach for the team. It might even be a way to keep Reese, if Mara can pin everything on McAdoo.
The funny thing here is if McAdoo does pull out a win there, and ruin everything. The way this season is going, who knows?
Dude, you definitely need to post more often. Big ups to anyone who brings the Bard to BBI! Not sure I believe Maras this smart, but I like way you think!
poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Great post! One of the best I've seen here. Love the Henry IV references.
However...I dost think though giveth Mr. Mara too much credit! I do not think he is bright enough to have thought out this dastardly a plan. If we've learned anything about John Mara, it is that he doesn't understand PR.
Mara doesn't fire mcadoo because of horrible San Fran performance
but now going to fire him because Mara didn't anticipate the fan backlash of benching Eli --
Jerry Reese and Ben Macadoo getting together and deciding that they knew better than most of the fans, better than most of the league. That they could see the perfect future and were willing to throw the players and fans under the bus to get there.
Turns out their vision was based in bullshit to begin with.
Wake me when someone says is or will be instead of could be
Jerry Reese and Ben Macadoo getting together and deciding that they knew better than most of the fans, better than most of the league. That they could see the perfect future and were willing to throw the players and fans under the bus to get there.
Turns out their vision was based in bullshit to begin with.
Which fans got thrown under the bus?
Signed,
Gatorade Dunksavant
Fire him after the game. Obviously should have been done after SF
There is no reason to expose mcadoo to the giant fans wrath next week.
Why are we gong to let this drag on. I believe most giant fans respect spans, allow him to be the interim and mara can do what he thinks is right after the season is over.
Ralph VacchianoVerified account @RVacchianoSNY
16m16 minutes ago
Ralph Vacchiano Retweeted Ian Rapoport
This is true. The split has been festering for a while over direction of the franchise (and, to an extent, the GM), a source said. It got worse with the Eli Manning mess. Some influential people at the top are furious with how it was handled.
poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Or that Reese took Mara's message and him and McAdoo decided to use Geno as a last-ditch attempt to save their jobs. They stupidly used the idea of Webb playing as cover but the idiots did not even have him remotely ready to play knowing that means Geno gets his chance to save them
Dude, you definitely need to post more often. Big ups to anyone who brings the Bard to BBI! Not sure I believe Maras this smart, but I like way you think!
playoffs followed by a really bad season. It's up to them. You fire a coach after two seasons - have to wonder how the decision was made to hire him in the first place.
poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Also, maybe the fact that Webb has not received any reps since Mara first raised the possibility of working him in, depending on game situations, up to and including this week. And the plan McAdoo presented, splitting the game ala pre-season does not exactly demonstrate a commitment to winning.
He is. Look up his comments on Ted Marchibroda's passing. Look at the tears in his eyes when he was talking about coaching the 80's Giant teams, walking through his old offices. Ask him about Jim Brown and Paul Brown. He nearly broke down saying goodbye to Ted Bruschi in 2009. Look at his commments about Vince Wilfork when that player left for the Texans:
Quote:
Few players reached or will ever reach the special level of Vince Wilfork. He is a great champion and one of the classiest people I have ever been around just a kind, genuine and giving person who was all about our team, football, winning and bringing joy to others. There may have never been anyone at his position with as much strength, toughness, intelligence, instinctiveness and athleticism. He is the best defensive linemen I ever coached, an all-time great Patriot whose place on our team will be missed but whose remarkable career as a Patriot will be remembered forever.
Great Football coaches have great passion. You can't inspire players without that passion, that emotion. They know the history of their teams, the game.
What you see at press conferences isn't the man. Ask his current and former players about him.
There's no comparison to McAdoo, none. McAdoo is an X's and O's guy, he does not command respect, nor has he earned it. He cannot lead people. He's a puppet, pure and simple, and the players sense AND know it. You don't respect a puppet.
He has all the bad attributes of Ray Handley without any of the good ones. The fact that they replaced a great Giant, and decent man in Tom Coughlin with this excuse of a puppet says volumes about this front office.
Dude, you definitely need to post more often. Big ups to anyone who brings the Bard to BBI! Not sure I believe Maras this smart, but I like way you think!
+1
I fucking loved that!
How bout them Cowboys, they've got nothing on us NOW, we can sleaze with the best of them. Probably all our draft picks will start the season with four game suspensions.
He is. Look up his comments on Ted Marchibroda's passing. Look at the tears in his eyes when he was talking about coaching the 80's Giant teams, walking through his old offices. Ask him about Jim Brown and Paul Brown. He nearly broke down saying goodbye to Ted Bruschi in 2009. Look at his commments about Vince Wilfork when that player left for the Texans:
Quote:
Few players reached or will ever reach the special level of Vince Wilfork. He is a great champion and one of the classiest people I have ever been around just a kind, genuine and giving person who was all about our team, football, winning and bringing joy to others. There may have never been anyone at his position with as much strength, toughness, intelligence, instinctiveness and athleticism. He is the best defensive linemen I ever coached, an all-time great Patriot whose place on our team will be missed but whose remarkable career as a Patriot will be remembered forever.
Great Football coaches have great passion. You can't inspire players without that passion, that emotion. They know the history of their teams, the game.
What you see at press conferences isn't the man. Ask his current and former players about him.
There's no comparison to McAdoo, none. McAdoo is an X's and O's guy, he does not command respect, nor has he earned it. He cannot lead people. He's a puppet, pure and simple, and the players sense AND know it. You don't respect a puppet.
He has all the bad attributes of Ray Handley without any of the good ones. The fact that they replaced a great Giant, and decent man in Tom Coughlin with this excuse of a puppet says volumes about this front office.
I'm not implying that he isn't emotional. I'm saying he doesn't allow it to inform his football decisions.
I'm going to repeat what I said on the Archie Manning thread:
And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
That's something you learn as you get experience coaching. Coughlin did the same shit. He reflected on that when the NFL network did a football life.
1) The Raiders blow out the Giants, Geno is bad, the offense is the same? Probably McAdoo fired.
2) Geno looks good, the offense is better, the Giants still lose? McAdoo could still be fired for fucking this up so badly.
3) Geno looks good, the offense is better, the Gians win? Probably McAdoo lives to coach another week.
What's interesting to me is that Mara seems to have wanted one thing, McAdoo did something else that Mara didn't want. I've gotten in trouble at work for doing something my boss didn't want me to do. And my mistake didn't cause problems for the entire organization.
Makes it all the more infuriating that we're going through with this bullshit today. McAdoo's parting gift is going to be most of the most embarrassing weeks this entire franchise has ever seen.
for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
'Did you meet with Mr. Mara?' I got back a three-word text:
"'It went well.'"
I believe that speaks volumes. VOLUMES.
In what way other that what you hope it does? It might very well mean exactly what you hope, but there is absolutely nothing in that quote that indicates it.
RE: RE: I love the Giants and have been a fan since 1965....but I am hoping
for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
Oh, this will be a fun Giants history test for our resident syntax/spelling blunder poster... who would have been hired instead of Handley?
RE: RE: RE: I love the Giants and have been a fan since 1965....but I am hoping
for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
Oh, this will be a fun Giants history test for our resident syntax/spelling blunder poster... who would have been hired instead of Handley?
And Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara? Nice work.
RE: Why tomorrow? Why didn't this happen last week?
for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
Oh, this will be a fun Giants history test for our resident syntax/spelling blunder poster... who would have been hired instead of Handley?
And Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara? Nice work.
Woops, typing on my phone and I fucked up. Sorry to get your estrogen laden body in a tizzy. Cramping? Mara obviously chose McAdoo first as
OC and then as HC. So sorry. Hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me during this his holiday season.
I'm not sure whom the Giants would have hired if Parcells had just retired at the end of The season.
Do you really think that they wouldn't have interview Bill B? No one else than Ray Handley who wasn't even a coorindatoe could have possibly been hired Yeah. Ok
Hope you and your family habe a wonderful holiday season. You are gem. What would this place do without your proofreading
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I love the Giants and have been a fan since 1965....but I am hoping
for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
Oh, this will be a fun Giants history test for our resident syntax/spelling blunder poster... who would have been hired instead of Handley?
And Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara? Nice work.
Woops, typing on my phone and I fucked up. Sorry to get your estrogen laden body in a tizzy. Cramping? Mara obviously chose McAdoo first as
OC and then as HC. So sorry. Hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me during this his holiday season.
I'm not sure whom the Giants would have hired if Parcells had just retired at the end of The season.
Do you really think that they wouldn't have interview Bill B? No one else than Ray Handley who wasn't even a coorindatoe could have possibly been hired Yeah. Ok
Hope you and your family habe a wonderful holiday season. You are gem. What would this place do without your proofreading
I'm certain that it's well known that George Young would NOT have hired Belichick, and favored Handley over anyone else on Parcells' staff. And I don't think that's especially private knowledge.
And I'm sorry for taking the time to use the "preview" button and give a crap about the words that I write. You should try it some time. It's a great feature. Are all of your typos your phone's fault? Maybe get a new phone? Like one that won't autocorrect "have" to "habe" and insert random line breaks?
Mara needs to take a long hard look in the mirror.
Personnel, particularly draft issues, aside. The biggest mistake was ignoring Gilbride when he said they needed to retool OLine. Offense wasn't broken, they had an aging OLine.
They bring in an west coast offense coordinator for a QB who is clearly not a WC QB. And, he has proven successful in non west coast offenses and is in his mid 30s.
Eli being a good, no make that great soldier, tries to make the transition.
Notwithstanding all that, if he had decent OLine where they could generate some semblance of a running game and predict to a reasonable level - they'd have a shot.
Wow....great move Ben. The 2-9 Giants almost beat the 5-6 Raiders with Geno Smith at the helm.....what went wrong? Cant wait to hear you say its my responsibility to do everything I can to help us win games. Cant wait to hear your bullshit line, we didnt play complimentary football. You suck McAdoo and so does anyone else that had anything to do with sitting Eli. Hope you get fired tomorrow you dope.
John Mara is a fucking coward. Of course Mac should be fired, but Reese should be gone already, they should have been shopping for a new GM as well as a new coach when they were 0-5. It makes mores sense to fire the GM in season and get the new one in so he can evaluate the players.
Mara said he was unhappy about how Mac handled the QB change? He wasnt even in the fucking building. What difference would it have made if he directed Mac to wait till next week so that he could talk to arguably the best player in franchise history who always did it the Giants way, with class, more class than Mara has shown of late.
John Mara is a fucking coward. Of course Mac should be fired, but Reese should be gone already, they should have been shopping for a new GM as well as a new coach when they were 0-5. It makes mores sense to fire the GM in season and get the new one in so he can evaluate the players.
Mara said he was unhappy about how Mac handled the QB change? He wasnt even in the fucking building. What difference would it have made if he directed Mac to wait till next week so that he could talk to arguably the best player in franchise history who always did it the Giants way, with class, more class than Mara has shown of late.
You know, when reading this right now, it just hit me.
We have a bigger problem than McAdoodoo and Reese.
Why is Mara directing the head coach as to who to play and who not to play? When did we get Danny boy Snyder as owner?
poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Or that Reese took Mara's message and him and McAdoo decided to use Geno as a last-ditch attempt to save their jobs. They stupidly used the idea of Webb playing as cover but the idiots did not even have him remotely ready to play knowing that means Geno gets his chance to save them
Why on earth did the owners promote to HC an individual who explicitly promised Joe Montana-type plays (screens, laterals and other short passes) in a West Coast scheme when their (beloved) QB can only throw long balls? Eli has more difficulty with short passes than most other QBs; hes not good throwing these passes. His strength is precisely what Reese has disabled by giving him no time (by mediocre OL selections and non selections) and what McAdoo promised not to use. This is organization-wide dysfunction at every level: ownership, GM, and HC.
John Mara is a fucking coward. Of course Mac should be fired, but Reese should be gone already, they should have been shopping for a new GM as well as a new coach when they were 0-5. It makes mores sense to fire the GM in season and get the new one in so he can evaluate the players.
Mara said he was unhappy about how Mac handled the QB change? He wasnt even in the fucking building. What difference would it have made if he directed Mac to wait till next week so that he could talk to arguably the best player in franchise history who always did it the Giants way, with class, more class than Mara has shown of late.
You know, when reading this right now, it just hit me.
We have a bigger problem than McAdoodoo and Reese.
Why is Mara directing the head coach as to who to play and who not to play? When did we get Danny boy Snyder as owner?
You're learning. Been sticking his nose in since 2013
John Mara is a fucking coward. Of course Mac should be fired, but Reese should be gone already, they should have been shopping for a new GM as well as a new coach when they were 0-5. It makes mores sense to fire the GM in season and get the new one in so he can evaluate the players.
Mara said he was unhappy about how Mac handled the QB change? He wasnt even in the fucking building. What difference would it have made if he directed Mac to wait till next week so that he could talk to arguably the best player in franchise history who always did it the Giants way, with class, more class than Mara has shown of late.
You know, when reading this right now, it just hit me.
We have a bigger problem than McAdoodoo and Reese.
Why is Mara directing the head coach as to who to play and who not to play? When did we get Danny boy Snyder as owner?
You're learning. Been sticking his nose in since 2013
The Mara family has never been the best in making HC decisions (e.g, letting Landry, Lombardi, and Belichick walk). Finding good FO talent is hard work. So long as people keep paying and watching, team performance and quality are not so important. Its about profit, and ownership leases space and pays salaries for very nice profits. I would bet that Snyder has made more money as owner of the Skins than all the prior owners combined.
Is and has been the problem for years in the wide open deep offense his numbers were middle of the pack. We were always teased about what could be but never materialized. In the west coast his percentage went up but unless Cruz/OBJ caught one and ran thirty or more yards it was a flat offense. Now due to lack of talent and inability to complete a drive which requires eight or more plays this offense breakdowns consistently. Lets not kid ourselves we saw the same thing even when our best players were healthy. I dont expect Eli to be perfect but the Eli we have seen for years is just well below average.
Much is made about practice but however when the coach says I just dont see enough to keep someone at starting QB, all the world cries foul because that guy is just to nice to be benched. Forget how it was handled its a team game in the end he was on the sidelines just like any other benched player would be. The Giants team before Eli Manning and will be here long after he is gone the fact of time passing. I recall when he first got a start man he did not look like a special player at all. He started his career with lots of questions now today many of those questions still stand out unfortunately.
Is and has been the problem for years in the wide open deep offense his numbers were middle of the pack. We were always teased about what could be but never materialized. In the west coast his percentage went up but unless Cruz/OBJ caught one and ran thirty or more yards it was a flat offense. Now due to lack of talent and inability to complete a drive which requires eight or more plays this offense breakdowns consistently. Lets not kid ourselves we saw the same thing even when our best players were healthy. I dont expect Eli to be perfect but the Eli we have seen for years is just well below average.
Much is made about practice but however when the coach says I just dont see enough to keep someone at starting QB, all the world cries foul because that guy is just to nice to be benched. Forget how it was handled its a team game in the end he was on the sidelines just like any other benched player would be. The Giants team before Eli Manning and will be here long after he is gone the fact of time passing. I recall when he first got a start man he did not look like a special player at all. He started his career with lots of questions now today many of those questions still stand out unfortunately.
Dragon - nope. In the WCO offense we ran in 2014 and 2015, we had a balanced, well oiled offense with Eli putting up outstanding numbers. When McAdoo became HC, his offense changed and still hasn't adjusted. I don't know if 2014-15 had Cpoughlin's influence, McAdoo started coaching as a castrated man, or what, but this is not the same offense. Under Gilbride, they had an offense that was in the top 1/3 of the league consistently when they had an OL.
what good is it going to do to fire him with 4 games left.
Both him and Reese should be out the door right after the season ends, no reason to wait around for a couple weeks,
John Mara....Can they fire the owner too, it was HIS idea
for the other QB's to play, McAdoo (love him or hate him),
was carrying out the marching orders....It wasn't handled smoothly, but hey he is a young coach, new at this stuff, not very smooth, we get it.
I said earlier this season, it will be an ugly divorce,
was made a little uglier than it should have been. Just keep in mind, who initiated it, not backing Mac here at all.
This season has shown he is in over his head as a HC, was a bad hire by the GM and owner.
He was young and bright, they were afraid to lose him to another organization, if you recall the Eagles interviewed him as well as the Giants....
That was a big reason he got the HC position here.
Is and has been the problem for years in the wide open deep offense his numbers were middle of the pack. We were always teased about what could be but never materialized. In the west coast his percentage went up but unless Cruz/OBJ caught one and ran thirty or more yards it was a flat offense. Now due to lack of talent and inability to complete a drive which requires eight or more plays this offense breakdowns consistently. Lets not kid ourselves we saw the same thing even when our best players were healthy. I dont expect Eli to be perfect but the Eli we have seen for years is just well below average.
Much is made about practice but however when the coach says I just dont see enough to keep someone at starting QB, all the world cries foul because that guy is just to nice to be benched. Forget how it was handled its a team game in the end he was on the sidelines just like any other benched player would be. The Giants team before Eli Manning and will be here long after he is gone the fact of time passing. I recall when he first got a start man he did not look like a special player at all. He started his career with lots of questions now today many of those questions still stand out unfortunately.
Tere's no data to support this and there is no control. That period of downturn you talk about, even though his numbers a couple years ago upticked, coincided exactly with a downward spiral of offensive talent at the offensive line, running back, and wide receiver (other than OBJ) positions. There's no control comparing Eli with an average to above-average supporting cast or even a putatively "better" QB with the supporting cast that ELi had.
Not saying your wrong; only saying that it's speculation with no supporting evidence. In reality, there's no way to know if it's Eli or if it's everything else. Yesterday's performance would suggest that it's mostly everything else because the numbers at QB were virtually the same.
Link - ( New Window )
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
Next is Reese, or Mara is more clueless than I thought.
I agree, that it is not the Giant way to fire a HC, or GM, during the season.....
But if Mara is thinking of firing him, and possibly Reese, he has to have a plan in action now, but how does he keep it under his hat?
It is when your employee doesnt communicate properly and tarnishes your reputation.
Will do. Whats your phone number?
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
Personally, I think there's a history of how Wellington Mara operated. I think a lot of owners feel/felt the same way but today's NFL is a little different. John Mara, as President, really hasn't had a situation like this. The league has changed, why can't Mara? After all, what's being done now is not working and he's taking a ton of heat right now.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
This place is a disaster. People are finally going to get what they wanted but will still find reasons to be outraged. For fucks sake.
Quote:
Whatever. Call me when it actually happens
Will do. Whats your phone number?
867-5309. Ask for Jenny.
Quote:
Not the Mara's style.
It is when your employee doesnt communicate properly and tarnishes your reputation.
Not just for the reasons you mentioned and the abysmal track record. But at this point, it becomes a security issue to have Ben take the sidelines in MetLife.
3m3 minutes ago
Sources: Some members of the #Giants ownership did not agree with how Eli Manning was handled this week and there was intense and serious internal debate. They are trying to figure out the fallout, leading to John Mara not guaranteeing Ben McAdoo would finish the season.
It is all wait and see, but mcadoo is a disaster and his ouster can't happen quick enough
regarding the above
Ralph Vacchiano Retweeted Ian Rapoport
This is true. The split has been festering for a while over direction of the franchise (and, to an extent, the GM), a source said. It got worse with the Eli Manning mess. Some influential people at the top are furious with how it was handled.
It is all wait and see, but mcadoo is a disaster and his ouster can't happen quick enough
I agree. Mara isnt perfect, but I trust him on this. It was a fucking stupid decision to trust McAdoo to handle such a dicey situation. Mara knows he screwed up which is why McAdoo wasnt hired on the spot IMO.
Sounds like it
Quote:
is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
This place is a disaster. People are finally going to get what they wanted but will still find reasons to be outraged. For fucks sake.
I know I don't want it. For one thing, I agree with the point that it's a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage (um, Tennessee?), and for another, I don't want to risk an interim coach - whether that's Spags or Sully - coming in and firing the team up for an extra win or two that actually harms the franchise's long-term opportunity.
They're all culpable in this dumpster fire of a season. Now just let it burn.
This. Just let Mac and JR get on when their lives, the fans get caught holding the bag anyway.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
16m16 minutes ago
Ralph Vacchiano Retweeted Ian Rapoport
This is true. The split has been festering for a while over direction of the franchise (and, to an extent, the GM), a source said. It got worse with the Eli Manning mess. Some influential people at the top are furious with how it was handled.
Anybody ever stop to think maybe the two owners didn't agree on the benching or starting of Eli Manning?
@MikeGarafolo
Replying to @LicensePlateGuy
Two? Keep counting. This was far from a unanimous decision amongst all with the name Mara or Tisch.
You're right but then again this isn't a typical situation where style or normalcy prevails. This is much different.
Mara and Tisch may be thinking about what the next home game would be like if Mac were still in charge. If they fire Mac and start Eli next game there will be less negative fan reaction.
The Giants are so lost right now. Everything is out the window.
Cmon dude relax
The Tisch side of the house has let the Maras have too much say over football decisions. I also wouldnt be surprised if Tim Mara skewered John and Chris over how much they have diminished and mishandled the Giants the last four years. The Tisches tend to have a good handle into the pulse of the media and PR landscape and have lots of connections to the Hollywood aspect of things.
Mara made the McAdoo decision. He deserves to be roasted for it and the Eli fallout.
I hope this forces the owners to bring in a neutral party to be an empowered head of all football operations.
Chris and John Mara have no business being involved whatsoever. Theyve proven themselves incapable.
Mara and Tisch may be thinking about what the next home game would be like if Mac were still in charge. If they fire Mac and start Eli next game there will be less negative fan reaction.
Bingo.
Hold on to ya butts
which is dumb..they blew it no turning back now to save face
move on and try to be "smarter"
Bottom line, if they wanted to see Webb, they should have been getting Webb ready a few weeks ago. Everything they've done with Webb from the summer on has been head scratchingly bad. Everything they did this week was unprofessional, poorly managed, disrespectful, cold, and also don't seem to make sense. Geno neither requires a look (he has a 4 year resume), gives you a better chance to win, or figures in to the future...unless he is really the guy you want mentoring Webb and/or a top 3 draft pick. I know I sure would rather have had Eli doing that and made for a more graceful exit for Eli after next season.
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In comment 13718624 David B. said:
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is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
This place is a disaster. People are finally going to get what they wanted but will still find reasons to be outraged. For fucks sake.
I know I don't want it. For one thing, I agree with the point that it's a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage (um, Tennessee?), and for another, I don't want to risk an interim coach - whether that's Spags or Sully - coming in and firing the team up for an extra win or two that actually harms the franchise's long-term opportunity.
They're all culpable in this dumpster fire of a season. Now just let it burn.
I think we all agree that we dont want any extra wins. But this team is too far gone and an interim coach isnt going to be able to fire this team up enough to win any games. Its not happening, they just dont have the talent at this point.
Theyve got to get McAdoo out of the building though. Instantly. There is literally zero upside to keeping him around to finish the season.
But Maras roll in all this about Elis disgraceful benching just doesnt add up. I'm sure hes livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, hey, theres been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so hes going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder whos advising Mara on all these matters. Since we havent heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe theres a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Elis extraordinary streak to be ended
You say that now, but if Mac is fired and you get nothing else for Christmas, I don't think you'll be happy ;>)
yankeeslover : 9:58 am : link : reply
When it wasn't too late to have intern hc insert Eli back?
Mac should have been canned on Tuesday.
can they really let mcadoo have those brutal press conferences five times a week for the last month of the season? the press already hates him and will just use them as an opportunity to - fairly - ridicule the franchise. this is not the same media environment it was 25 years ago, and i don't think the fact they haven't fired a coach midseason since Arnsparger will stop them from doing it now
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
Mcadoo has forced Maras hand, not the fans or the media.
Yeah, and then we can throw mud at him during recess!!
This is news? ESPN looks like they scooped it if it does happen and takes no heat if it doesn't.
But Maras roll in all this about Elis disgraceful benching just doesnt add up. I'm sure hes livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, hey, theres been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so hes going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder whos advising Mara on all these matters. Since we havent heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe theres a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Elis extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
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Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Maras roll in all this about Elis disgraceful benching just doesnt add up. I'm sure hes livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, hey, theres been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so hes going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder whos advising Mara on all these matters. Since we havent heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe theres a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Elis extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation. This is about an awful head coach and an ownership group who have embarrassed themselves time and time again three straight years.
Mcadoo has forced Maras hand, not the fans or the media.
Think whatever you want, but if McAdoo had presented Eli with something that was completely different from what Mara signed off on, he'd have been fired last Monday (when it was initially presented to Eli). The version that Mara tried to walk back to in his statements is one that wouldn't have even required a conversation with Mara or Eli, yet people still believe it?
This is absolutely a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage. For better or worse, that's what it is.
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In comment 13718713 trueblueinpw said:
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Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Maras roll in all this about Elis disgraceful benching just doesnt add up. I'm sure hes livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, hey, theres been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so hes going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder whos advising Mara on all these matters. Since we havent heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe theres a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Elis extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation. This is about an awful head coach and an ownership group who have embarrassed themselves time and time again three straight years.
Um, what about my comment said anything about player evaluation? Or are you just replying to the wrong post?
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Let's put the tinfoil hats on.
1) John Mara makes his "Let's look at other QB's" statement to Reese two weeks or so ago, presumably after the SF loss. It's very possible that he also made the decision to fire McAdoo then as well, after the season.
2) Mara knows that he's going to have a problem getting the coach he wants. The big problem is Eli's consecutive streak; any coach that sits Eli down is going to be a villian. The ideal way to do this is to get McAdoo to do it, then fire him.
3) John Mara is a Bachelor of Science, Cum Laude, from Boston College. He's grown up with the Giants, from a football family. He's not a dummy, he's personally known countless players, both during their football careers and has hired ex Giants for the organization. He should know how they react.
Anyone really think that Mara was shocked by Eli's reaction? Mara grew up in NY. Is it creditable that he does not know what the media reaction would be? He saw the public reaction when Tarenton was traded, when Simms was sat down by Handley. He's been there.
Eli's family has always had incredible respect for the history of the NFL. Mara knows this. Mara knew that Eli would never do something that would affect the integrity of the game (or his own credibility), like treating regular season games like pre-season games.
This wasn't an offer Eli couldn't refuse, it was an offer Eli would never accept, and John Mara knew that.
3) How to accomplish this? Look up "The Murder of Thomas Becket". King Henry of England, and Thomas Becket, Arch Bishop of Canterbury, were great friends at one time. They quarreled over control of the clergy, to the point where King Henry said the following:
This "insipred" four knights who overheard it to assassinate Becket. King Henry was "shocked" this happened, and he disgraced the knights. Four years later, in an act of penance, the king donned a sack-cloth walking barefoot through the streets of Canterbury while eighty monks flogged him with branches. King Henry knew about PR, even as long ago as 1170!
Let me go out on a branch. I'll bet Mara knows this story; if you take any History of England course, you'll know it. It's a classic way of using others to accomplish your goals, without getting 100% of the blame. After all, King Henry could always say he was "misunderstood", and blame it on "miscommunication". Sound familiar?
4) Mara tells Reese, Reese tells McAdoo. The expected happens. The media storm hits, with "denials" from Mara about what he meant.
Very convenient. If you believe it.
John Mara was appointed the chairman of the Management Council Executive Committee/Labor. He's going to be involved with negotiations with the NFLPA and any new CBA. This is a guy who has an issue communicating?
Seriously?
5) Mara knows what MetLife will be if McAdoo comes back as head coach. He knows the fans are blaming him right now, with Reese and McAdoo as puppets.
Mara also knows a third of the roster is on IR, and starting Geno is pretty much conceding the game to Oakland.
So, if McAdoo loses in Oakland (as expected), Mara has the perfect excuse to fire him. Mara will expect this to blunt the reaction at MetLife next week. This makes it easier to get a new coach for the team. It might even be a way to keep Reese, if Mara can pin everything on McAdoo.
The funny thing here is if McAdoo does pull out a win there, and ruin everything. The way this season is going, who knows?
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But thats only part of the problem. This organization cant move forward until they get rid of Reese too.
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation.
See, I can do it too!
This also lays credence to the fact that McAdoo really screwed up the communication and plan with Eli. I do believe Mara agreed to a plan to look at Webb, but expected Mac to work with Eli on a plan. He did not expect Mac to dictate "one half", etc., and force Eli into a corner.
Fuck McAdoo.
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In comment 13718858 WillVAB said:
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But thats only part of the problem. This organization cant move forward until they get rid of Reese too.
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation.
See, I can do it too!
Actually Reeses firing has everything to do with player evaluation.
He now sucks at it along with not being able to build an NFL roster.
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In comment 13718862 Sammo85 said:
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In comment 13718858 WillVAB said:
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But thats only part of the problem. This organization cant move forward until they get rid of Reese too.
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation.
See, I can do it too!
Actually Reeses firing has everything to do with player evaluation.
He now sucks at it along with not being able to build an NFL roster.
I was referring to your reply to my earlier post which made absolutely no sense. Scroll up.
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In comment 13718876 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 13718862 Sammo85 said:
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In comment 13718858 WillVAB said:
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But thats only part of the problem. This organization cant move forward until they get rid of Reese too.
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation.
See, I can do it too!
Actually Reeses firing has everything to do with player evaluation.
He now sucks at it along with not being able to build an NFL roster.
I was referring to your reply to my earlier post which made absolutely no sense. Scroll up.
Too much text. My bad. I probably didnt read it fully. Saw Jonas
Seawright mentioned and flew into a tizzy.
Coming off a wicked stomach virus yesterday.
I said earlier this week that I didn't want McAdoo fired, because I wanted him to feel the wrath of the fans next week v. Dallas. It makes sense for management to short-circuit that, since it would be arguably the ugliest Giant home game in history (yes, even uglier than the plane banner game).
Let's put the tinfoil hats on.
1) John Mara makes his "Let's look at other QB's" statement to Reese two weeks or so ago, presumably after the SF loss. It's very possible that he also made the decision to fire McAdoo then as well, after the season.
2) Mara knows that he's going to have a problem getting the coach he wants. The big problem is Eli's consecutive streak; any coach that sits Eli down is going to be a villian. The ideal way to do this is to get McAdoo to do it, then fire him.
3) John Mara is a Bachelor of Science, Cum Laude, from Boston College. He's grown up with the Giants, from a football family. He's not a dummy, he's personally known countless players, both during their football careers and has hired ex Giants for the organization. He should know how they react.
Anyone really think that Mara was shocked by Eli's reaction? Mara grew up in NY. Is it creditable that he does not know what the media reaction would be? He saw the public reaction when Tarenton was traded, when Simms was sat down by Handley. He's been there.
Eli's family has always had incredible respect for the history of the NFL. Mara knows this. Mara knew that Eli would never do something that would affect the integrity of the game (or his own credibility), like treating regular season games like pre-season games.
This wasn't an offer Eli couldn't refuse, it was an offer Eli would never accept, and John Mara knew that.
3) How to accomplish this? Look up "The Murder of Thomas Becket". King Henry of England, and Thomas Becket, Arch Bishop of Canterbury, were great friends at one time. They quarreled over control of the clergy, to the point where King Henry said the following:
Quote:
What sluggards, what cowards have I brought up in my court, who care nothing for their allegiance to their lord. Who will rid me of this meddlesome priest."
This "insipred" four knights who overheard it to assassinate Becket. King Henry was "shocked" this happened, and he disgraced the knights. Four years later, in an act of penance, the king donned a sack-cloth walking barefoot through the streets of Canterbury while eighty monks flogged him with branches. King Henry knew about PR, even as long ago as 1170!
Let me go out on a branch. I'll bet Mara knows this story; if you take any History of England course, you'll know it. It's a classic way of using others to accomplish your goals, without getting 100% of the blame. After all, King Henry could always say he was "misunderstood", and blame it on "miscommunication". Sound familiar?
4) Mara tells Reese, Reese tells McAdoo. The expected happens. The media storm hits, with "denials" from Mara about what he meant.
Very convenient. If you believe it.
John Mara was appointed the chairman of the Management Council Executive Committee/Labor. He's going to be involved with negotiations with the NFLPA and any new CBA. This is a guy who has an issue communicating?
Seriously?
5) Mara knows what MetLife will be if McAdoo comes back as head coach. He knows the fans are blaming him right now, with Reese and McAdoo as puppets.
Mara also knows a third of the roster is on IR, and starting Geno is pretty much conceding the game to Oakland.
So, if McAdoo loses in Oakland (as expected), Mara has the perfect excuse to fire him. Mara will expect this to blunt the reaction at MetLife next week. This makes it easier to get a new coach for the team. It might even be a way to keep Reese, if Mara can pin everything on McAdoo.
The funny thing here is if McAdoo does pull out a win there, and ruin everything. The way this season is going, who knows?
Dude, you definitely need to post more often. Big ups to anyone who brings the Bard to BBI! Not sure I believe Maras this smart, but I like way you think!
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Not the Mara's style.
You're right but then again this isn't a typical situation where style or normalcy prevails. This is much different.
Mara is pissed mcadonothing went rogue and embarrassed him and the Giants ,he's done!
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Great post! One of the best I've seen here. Love the Henry IV references.
However...I dost think though giveth Mr. Mara too much credit! I do not think he is bright enough to have thought out this dastardly a plan. If we've learned anything about John Mara, it is that he doesn't understand PR.
but now going to fire him because Mara didn't anticipate the fan backlash of benching Eli --
so classless
Turns out their vision was based in bullshit to begin with.
Turns out their vision was based in bullshit to begin with.
Which fans got thrown under the bus?
Signed,
Gatorade Dunksavant
Why are we gong to let this drag on. I believe most giant fans respect spans, allow him to be the interim and mara can do what he thinks is right after the season is over.
This insane that its gone on like this.
16m16 minutes ago
Ralph Vacchiano Retweeted Ian Rapoport
This is true. The split has been festering for a while over direction of the franchise (and, to an extent, the GM), a source said. It got worse with the Eli Manning mess. Some influential people at the top are furious with how it was handled.
Quote:
poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Or that Reese took Mara's message and him and McAdoo decided to use Geno as a last-ditch attempt to save their jobs. They stupidly used the idea of Webb playing as cover but the idiots did not even have him remotely ready to play knowing that means Geno gets his chance to save them
No they wont. They'll sell off their tickets as they've always done.
Dude, you definitely need to post more often. Big ups to anyone who brings the Bard to BBI! Not sure I believe Maras this smart, but I like way you think!
+1
I fucking loved that!
Not sure I'd fire him but not my call.
Now, let's not be vulgar. "Good-Bye Bennie" works for me.
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poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Also, maybe the fact that Webb has not received any reps since Mara first raised the possibility of working him in, depending on game situations, up to and including this week. And the plan McAdoo presented, splitting the game ala pre-season does not exactly demonstrate a commitment to winning.
Great Football coaches have great passion. You can't inspire players without that passion, that emotion. They know the history of their teams, the game.
What you see at press conferences isn't the man. Ask his current and former players about him.
There's no comparison to McAdoo, none. McAdoo is an X's and O's guy, he does not command respect, nor has he earned it. He cannot lead people. He's a puppet, pure and simple, and the players sense AND know it. You don't respect a puppet.
He has all the bad attributes of Ray Handley without any of the good ones. The fact that they replaced a great Giant, and decent man in Tom Coughlin with this excuse of a puppet says volumes about this front office.
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In comment 13718875 JohnF said:
Dude, you definitely need to post more often. Big ups to anyone who brings the Bard to BBI! Not sure I believe Maras this smart, but I like way you think!
+1
I fucking loved that!
How bout them Cowboys, they've got nothing on us NOW, we can sleaze with the best of them. Probably all our draft picks will start the season with four game suspensions.
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Few players reached or will ever reach the special level of Vince Wilfork. He is a great champion and one of the classiest people I have ever been around just a kind, genuine and giving person who was all about our team, football, winning and bringing joy to others. There may have never been anyone at his position with as much strength, toughness, intelligence, instinctiveness and athleticism. He is the best defensive linemen I ever coached, an all-time great Patriot whose place on our team will be missed but whose remarkable career as a Patriot will be remembered forever.
Great Football coaches have great passion. You can't inspire players without that passion, that emotion. They know the history of their teams, the game.
What you see at press conferences isn't the man. Ask his current and former players about him.
There's no comparison to McAdoo, none. McAdoo is an X's and O's guy, he does not command respect, nor has he earned it. He cannot lead people. He's a puppet, pure and simple, and the players sense AND know it. You don't respect a puppet.
He has all the bad attributes of Ray Handley without any of the good ones. The fact that they replaced a great Giant, and decent man in Tom Coughlin with this excuse of a puppet says volumes about this front office.
I'm not implying that he isn't emotional. I'm saying he doesn't allow it to inform his football decisions.
'Did you meet with Mr. Mara?' I got back a three-word text:
"'It went well.'"
I believe that speaks volumes. VOLUMES.
That's something you learn as you get experience coaching. Coughlin did the same shit. He reflected on that when the NFL network did a football life.
Steve L : 11:24 am : link : reply
Fly commercial ya bitch.
Link - ( New Window )
2) Geno looks good, the offense is better, the Giants still lose? McAdoo could still be fired for fucking this up so badly.
3) Geno looks good, the offense is better, the Gians win? Probably McAdoo lives to coach another week.
What's interesting to me is that Mara seems to have wanted one thing, McAdoo did something else that Mara didn't want. I've gotten in trouble at work for doing something my boss didn't want me to do. And my mistake didn't cause problems for the entire organization.
Good god no!!!
Apologize to Eli and make him the starter and instill some pride in the team.
exactly, if Mara is giving into fan pressure, this is the thing he's going to do of all things?
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
You're joking right? McAdoo is absolutely to blame as well. They're all a joke.
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'Did you meet with Mr. Mara?' I got back a three-word text:
"'It went well.'"
I believe that speaks volumes. VOLUMES.
In what way other that what you hope it does? It might very well mean exactly what you hope, but there is absolutely nothing in that quote that indicates it.
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for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
Oh, this will be a fun Giants history test for our resident syntax/spelling blunder poster... who would have been hired instead of Handley?
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In comment 13718572 GiantBlue said:
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for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
Oh, this will be a fun Giants history test for our resident syntax/spelling blunder poster... who would have been hired instead of Handley?
And Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara? Nice work.
What's an intern HC?
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In comment 13719662 LauderdaleMatty said:
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In comment 13718572 GiantBlue said:
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for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
Oh, this will be a fun Giants history test for our resident syntax/spelling blunder poster... who would have been hired instead of Handley?
And Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara? Nice work.
Woops, typing on my phone and I fucked up. Sorry to get your estrogen laden body in a tizzy. Cramping? Mara obviously chose McAdoo first as
OC and then as HC. So sorry. Hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me during this his holiday season.
I'm not sure whom the Giants would have hired if Parcells had just retired at the end of The season.
Do you really think that they wouldn't have interview Bill B? No one else than Ray Handley who wasn't even a coorindatoe could have possibly been hired Yeah. Ok
Hope you and your family habe a wonderful holiday season. You are gem. What would this place do without your proofreading
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In comment 13719861 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 13719662 LauderdaleMatty said:
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In comment 13718572 GiantBlue said:
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for a statement loss to Oakland, SF beats Chicago and we move up to #2 pick.....and McAdoo gets tossed out on his ass tomorrow morning at the facility.
I thought Handley was the worst coach the Giants would have during my lifetime....and Reeves was close....but McAdoo takes the cake. Goodbye and Good Riddance!
The sad and big difference is that Handley would Never have been hired had not Parcells abruptly retired well Into the offseason.
Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara. Huge blind spot w this guy by ownership. If Mara actually nuts up fires Him he may win some
Respect back From the fan base
Oh, this will be a fun Giants history test for our resident syntax/spelling blunder poster... who would have been hired instead of Handley?
And Mara was hand chosen twice by Mara? Nice work.
Woops, typing on my phone and I fucked up. Sorry to get your estrogen laden body in a tizzy. Cramping? Mara obviously chose McAdoo first as
OC and then as HC. So sorry. Hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me during this his holiday season.
I'm not sure whom the Giants would have hired if Parcells had just retired at the end of The season.
Do you really think that they wouldn't have interview Bill B? No one else than Ray Handley who wasn't even a coorindatoe could have possibly been hired Yeah. Ok
Hope you and your family habe a wonderful holiday season. You are gem. What would this place do without your proofreading
I'm certain that it's well known that George Young would NOT have hired Belichick, and favored Handley over anyone else on Parcells' staff. And I don't think that's especially private knowledge.
And I'm sorry for taking the time to use the "preview" button and give a crap about the words that I write. You should try it some time. It's a great feature. Are all of your typos your phone's fault? Maybe get a new phone? Like one that won't autocorrect "have" to "habe" and insert random line breaks?
Just let that one marinate for yourself for a minute. coorindatoe. That's not even close to a word.
You're not even trying to create words. But your opinion should be taken seriously?
Personnel, particularly draft issues, aside. The biggest mistake was ignoring Gilbride when he said they needed to retool OLine. Offense wasn't broken, they had an aging OLine.
They bring in an west coast offense coordinator for a QB who is clearly not a WC QB. And, he has proven successful in non west coast offenses and is in his mid 30s.
Eli being a good, no make that great soldier, tries to make the transition.
Notwithstanding all that, if he had decent OLine where they could generate some semblance of a running game and predict to a reasonable level - they'd have a shot.
Mara said he was unhappy about how Mac handled the QB change? He wasnt even in the fucking building. What difference would it have made if he directed Mac to wait till next week so that he could talk to arguably the best player in franchise history who always did it the Giants way, with class, more class than Mara has shown of late.
Mara said he was unhappy about how Mac handled the QB change? He wasnt even in the fucking building. What difference would it have made if he directed Mac to wait till next week so that he could talk to arguably the best player in franchise history who always did it the Giants way, with class, more class than Mara has shown of late.
You know, when reading this right now, it just hit me.
We have a bigger problem than McAdoodoo and Reese.
Why is Mara directing the head coach as to who to play and who not to play? When did we get Danny boy Snyder as owner?
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In comment 13718783 Matt in SGS said:
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poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Or that Reese took Mara's message and him and McAdoo decided to use Geno as a last-ditch attempt to save their jobs. They stupidly used the idea of Webb playing as cover but the idiots did not even have him remotely ready to play knowing that means Geno gets his chance to save them
Why on earth did the owners promote to HC an individual who explicitly promised Joe Montana-type plays (screens, laterals and other short passes) in a West Coast scheme when their (beloved) QB can only throw long balls? Eli has more difficulty with short passes than most other QBs; hes not good throwing these passes. His strength is precisely what Reese has disabled by giving him no time (by mediocre OL selections and non selections) and what McAdoo promised not to use. This is organization-wide dysfunction at every level: ownership, GM, and HC.
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John Mara is a fucking coward. Of course Mac should be fired, but Reese should be gone already, they should have been shopping for a new GM as well as a new coach when they were 0-5. It makes mores sense to fire the GM in season and get the new one in so he can evaluate the players.
Mara said he was unhappy about how Mac handled the QB change? He wasnt even in the fucking building. What difference would it have made if he directed Mac to wait till next week so that he could talk to arguably the best player in franchise history who always did it the Giants way, with class, more class than Mara has shown of late.
You know, when reading this right now, it just hit me.
We have a bigger problem than McAdoodoo and Reese.
Why is Mara directing the head coach as to who to play and who not to play? When did we get Danny boy Snyder as owner?
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In comment 13720963 Glover said:
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John Mara is a fucking coward. Of course Mac should be fired, but Reese should be gone already, they should have been shopping for a new GM as well as a new coach when they were 0-5. It makes mores sense to fire the GM in season and get the new one in so he can evaluate the players.
Mara said he was unhappy about how Mac handled the QB change? He wasnt even in the fucking building. What difference would it have made if he directed Mac to wait till next week so that he could talk to arguably the best player in franchise history who always did it the Giants way, with class, more class than Mara has shown of late.
You know, when reading this right now, it just hit me.
We have a bigger problem than McAdoodoo and Reese.
Why is Mara directing the head coach as to who to play and who not to play? When did we get Danny boy Snyder as owner?
You're learning. Been sticking his nose in since 2013
The Mara family has never been the best in making HC decisions (e.g, letting Landry, Lombardi, and Belichick walk). Finding good FO talent is hard work. So long as people keep paying and watching, team performance and quality are not so important. Its about profit, and ownership leases space and pays salaries for very nice profits. I would bet that Snyder has made more money as owner of the Skins than all the prior owners combined.
R** H*****y.
Well, outside of football,
Isiah Thomas.
Much is made about practice but however when the coach says I just dont see enough to keep someone at starting QB, all the world cries foul because that guy is just to nice to be benched. Forget how it was handled its a team game in the end he was on the sidelines just like any other benched player would be. The Giants team before Eli Manning and will be here long after he is gone the fact of time passing. I recall when he first got a start man he did not look like a special player at all. He started his career with lots of questions now today many of those questions still stand out unfortunately.
Much is made about practice but however when the coach says I just dont see enough to keep someone at starting QB, all the world cries foul because that guy is just to nice to be benched. Forget how it was handled its a team game in the end he was on the sidelines just like any other benched player would be. The Giants team before Eli Manning and will be here long after he is gone the fact of time passing. I recall when he first got a start man he did not look like a special player at all. He started his career with lots of questions now today many of those questions still stand out unfortunately.
Both him and Reese should be out the door right after the season ends, no reason to wait around for a couple weeks,
John Mara....Can they fire the owner too, it was HIS idea
for the other QB's to play, McAdoo (love him or hate him),
was carrying out the marching orders....It wasn't handled smoothly, but hey he is a young coach, new at this stuff, not very smooth, we get it.
I said earlier this season, it will be an ugly divorce,
was made a little uglier than it should have been. Just keep in mind, who initiated it, not backing Mac here at all.
This season has shown he is in over his head as a HC, was a bad hire by the GM and owner.
He was young and bright, they were afraid to lose him to another organization, if you recall the Eagles interviewed him as well as the Giants....
That was a big reason he got the HC position here.
They need to fire Reese first!
Much is made about practice but however when the coach says I just dont see enough to keep someone at starting QB, all the world cries foul because that guy is just to nice to be benched. Forget how it was handled its a team game in the end he was on the sidelines just like any other benched player would be. The Giants team before Eli Manning and will be here long after he is gone the fact of time passing. I recall when he first got a start man he did not look like a special player at all. He started his career with lots of questions now today many of those questions still stand out unfortunately.
Not saying your wrong; only saying that it's speculation with no supporting evidence. In reality, there's no way to know if it's Eli or if it's everything else. Yesterday's performance would suggest that it's mostly everything else because the numbers at QB were virtually the same.