I’ve been waiting for this since Wellington passed away.
The Tisch side of the house has let the Maras have too much say over football decisions. I also wouldn’t be surprised if Tim Mara skewered John and Chris over how much they have diminished and mishandled the Giants the last four years. The Tisches tend to have a good handle into the pulse of the media and PR landscape and have lots of connections to the Hollywood aspect of things.
Mara made the McAdoo decision. He deserves to be roasted for it and the Eli fallout.
I hope this forces the owners to bring in a neutral party to be an empowered head of all football operations.
Chris and John Mara have no business being involved whatsoever. They’ve proven themselves incapable.
RE: Giants Have Fired Their Coach During The Season... Â
Just once in the last 80+ years (Arsparger in 1976), but then again, most of that time was under Wellington, so who knows.
Mara and Tisch may be thinking about what the next home game would be like if Mac were still in charge. If they fire Mac and start Eli next game there will be less negative fan reaction.
So, you let McAdoo make Eli the scapegoat and do your dirty work, then you fire him the day after if it doesn't work out, making him the new scapegoat. That only stinks of more dysfunction.
Bottom line, if they wanted to see Webb, they should have been getting Webb ready a few weeks ago. Everything they've done with Webb from the summer on has been head scratchingly bad. Everything they did this week was unprofessional, poorly managed, disrespectful, cold, and also don't seem to make sense. Geno neither requires a look (he has a 4 year resume), gives you a better chance to win, or figures in to the future...unless he is really the guy you want mentoring Webb and/or a top 3 draft pick. I know I sure would rather have had Eli doing that and made for a more graceful exit for Eli after next season.
is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
This place is a disaster. People are finally going to get what they wanted but will still find reasons to be outraged. For fucks sake.
I know I don't want it. For one thing, I agree with the point that it's a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage (um, Tennessee?), and for another, I don't want to risk an interim coach - whether that's Spags or Sully - coming in and firing the team up for an extra win or two that actually harms the franchise's long-term opportunity.
They're all culpable in this dumpster fire of a season. Now just let it burn.
I think we all agree that we don’t want any extra wins. But this team is too far gone and an interim coach isn’t going to be able to fire this team up enough to win any games. It’s not happening, they just don’t have the talent at this point.
They’ve got to get McAdoo out of the building though. Instantly. There is literally zero upside to keeping him around to finish the season.
Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Mara’s roll in all this about Eli’s disgraceful benching just doesn’t add up. I'm sure he’s livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, “hey, there’s been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so he’s going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page”. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder who’s advising Mara on all these matters. Since we haven’t heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe there’s a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Eli’s extraordinary streak to be ended
HOWEVER, if they lose today (and they will), does Mara really want McAdoo around for the Dallas, Philly And Skins home games? Each game will be a zoo atmosphere and ownership will be booed mercilessly and thoroughly embarrassed. Best way to at least temper the anger and embarrassment would be to fire McAdoo and Reese ahead of the next game. I could see it happening. Attitude might shift to E-L-I M-A-N-N-I-N-G chants instead of fire breathing against coach, GM and owners. Damage control to some degree.
for this organization. it's not just about hurting eli's feelings. as others have pointed out, they've been cold in the past with other face-of-the-franchise players. this is about their brand, which is supposed to be about being the competent, thoughtful franchise in this town. that image has been eroding for a while - the not-so-well handled coughlin firing while keeping reese, the josh brown fiasco, the odell stuff. but this is a whole other order of magnitude of badness. they're basically squandering decades of reputation.
can they really let mcadoo have those brutal press conferences five times a week for the last month of the season? the press already hates him and will just use them as an opportunity to - fairly - ridicule the franchise. this is not the same media environment it was 25 years ago, and i don't think the fact they haven't fired a coach midseason since Arnsparger will stop them from doing it now
poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
They were definitely firing him after the season anyway Â
but this complete fuck up of a situation is what is pushing this. It’s not a “knee jerk reaction to fan pressure.” It is simply Mara being so pissed off that this moron completely screwed up what they wanted to present to manning that he has no choice but to get rid of him ASAP (Monday) and right the wrong.
Mcadoo has forced Maras hand, not the fans or the media.
RE: No, Let Him Go Home For One More vs the Boys Â
the vibe next Sun at MetLife if we lose today and Mac is still there. the boos and catcalls will be deafening and all over Sportscenter. If it possible to be even more of an NFL laughing stock that will do it. At least the "17 years of lousy football" plane was local.
I wouldn’t have let him on the plane after the SF loss Â
Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Mara’s roll in all this about Eli’s disgraceful benching just doesn’t add up. I'm sure he’s livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, “hey, there’s been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so he’s going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page”. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder who’s advising Mara on all these matters. Since we haven’t heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe there’s a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Eli’s extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Mara’s roll in all this about Eli’s disgraceful benching just doesn’t add up. I'm sure he’s livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, “hey, there’s been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so he’s going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page”. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder who’s advising Mara on all these matters. Since we haven’t heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe there’s a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Eli’s extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation. This is about an awful head coach and an ownership group who have embarrassed themselves time and time again three straight years.
RE: They were definitely firing him after the season anyway Â
but this complete fuck up of a situation is what is pushing this. It’s not a “knee jerk reaction to fan pressure.” It is simply Mara being so pissed off that this moron completely screwed up what they wanted to present to manning that he has no choice but to get rid of him ASAP (Monday) and right the wrong.
Mcadoo has forced Maras hand, not the fans or the media.
Think whatever you want, but if McAdoo had presented Eli with something that was completely different from what Mara signed off on, he'd have been fired last Monday (when it was initially presented to Eli). The version that Mara tried to walk back to in his statements is one that wouldn't have even required a conversation with Mara or Eli, yet people still believe it?
This is absolutely a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage. For better or worse, that's what it is.
Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Mara’s roll in all this about Eli’s disgraceful benching just doesn’t add up. I'm sure he’s livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, “hey, there’s been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so he’s going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page”. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder who’s advising Mara on all these matters. Since we haven’t heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe there’s a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Eli’s extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation. This is about an awful head coach and an ownership group who have embarrassed themselves time and time again three straight years.
Um, what about my comment said anything about player evaluation? Or are you just replying to the wrong post?
What would this accomplish other than acquiescing to Â
1) John Mara makes his "Let's look at other QB's" statement to Reese two weeks or so ago, presumably after the SF loss. It's very possible that he also made the decision to fire McAdoo then as well, after the season.
2) Mara knows that he's going to have a problem getting the coach he wants. The big problem is Eli's consecutive streak; any coach that sits Eli down is going to be a villian. The ideal way to do this is to get McAdoo to do it, then fire him.
3) John Mara is a Bachelor of Science, Cum Laude, from Boston College. He's grown up with the Giants, from a football family. He's not a dummy, he's personally known countless players, both during their football careers and has hired ex Giants for the organization. He should know how they react.
Anyone really think that Mara was shocked by Eli's reaction? Mara grew up in NY. Is it creditable that he does not know what the media reaction would be? He saw the public reaction when Tarenton was traded, when Simms was sat down by Handley. He's been there.
Eli's family has always had incredible respect for the history of the NFL. Mara knows this. Mara knew that Eli would never do something that would affect the integrity of the game (or his own credibility), like treating regular season games like pre-season games.
This wasn't an offer Eli couldn't refuse, it was an offer Eli would never accept, and John Mara knew that.
3) How to accomplish this? Look up "The Murder of Thomas Becket". King Henry of England, and Thomas Becket, Arch Bishop of Canterbury, were great friends at one time. They quarreled over control of the clergy, to the point where King Henry said the following:
Quote:
What sluggards, what cowards have I brought up in my court, who care nothing for their allegiance to their lord. Who will rid me of this meddlesome priest."
This "insipred" four knights who overheard it to assassinate Becket. King Henry was "shocked" this happened, and he disgraced the knights. Four years later, in an act of penance, the king donned a sack-cloth walking barefoot through the streets of Canterbury while eighty monks flogged him with branches. King Henry knew about PR, even as long ago as 1170!
Let me go out on a branch. I'll bet Mara knows this story; if you take any History of England course, you'll know it. It's a classic way of using others to accomplish your goals, without getting 100% of the blame. After all, King Henry could always say he was "misunderstood", and blame it on "miscommunication". Sound familiar?
4) Mara tells Reese, Reese tells McAdoo. The expected happens. The media storm hits, with "denials" from Mara about what he meant.
Very convenient. If you believe it.
John Mara was appointed the chairman of the Management Council Executive Committee/Labor. He's going to be involved with negotiations with the NFLPA and any new CBA. This is a guy who has an issue communicating?
Seriously?
5) Mara knows what MetLife will be if McAdoo comes back as head coach. He knows the fans are blaming him right now, with Reese and McAdoo as puppets.
Mara also knows a third of the roster is on IR, and starting Geno is pretty much conceding the game to Oakland.
So, if McAdoo loses in Oakland (as expected), Mara has the perfect excuse to fire him. Mara will expect this to blunt the reaction at MetLife next week. This makes it easier to get a new coach for the team. It might even be a way to keep Reese, if Mara can pin everything on McAdoo.
The funny thing here is if McAdoo does pull out a win there, and ruin everything. The way this season is going, who knows?
Then after the season whack Reese. Time to rebuild the management starting with McIdiot.
This also lays credence to the fact that McAdoo really screwed up the communication and plan with Eli. I do believe Mara agreed to a plan to look at Webb, but expected Mac to work with Eli on a plan. He did not expect Mac to dictate "one half", etc., and force Eli into a corner.
I said earlier this week that I didn't want McAdoo fired, because I wanted him to feel the wrath of the fans next week v. Dallas. It makes sense for management to short-circuit that, since it would be arguably the ugliest Giant home game in history (yes, even uglier than the plane banner game).
1) John Mara makes his "Let's look at other QB's" statement to Reese two weeks or so ago, presumably after the SF loss. It's very possible that he also made the decision to fire McAdoo then as well, after the season.
2) Mara knows that he's going to have a problem getting the coach he wants. The big problem is Eli's consecutive streak; any coach that sits Eli down is going to be a villian. The ideal way to do this is to get McAdoo to do it, then fire him.
3) John Mara is a Bachelor of Science, Cum Laude, from Boston College. He's grown up with the Giants, from a football family. He's not a dummy, he's personally known countless players, both during their football careers and has hired ex Giants for the organization. He should know how they react.
Anyone really think that Mara was shocked by Eli's reaction? Mara grew up in NY. Is it creditable that he does not know what the media reaction would be? He saw the public reaction when Tarenton was traded, when Simms was sat down by Handley. He's been there.
Eli's family has always had incredible respect for the history of the NFL. Mara knows this. Mara knew that Eli would never do something that would affect the integrity of the game (or his own credibility), like treating regular season games like pre-season games.
This wasn't an offer Eli couldn't refuse, it was an offer Eli would never accept, and John Mara knew that.
3) How to accomplish this? Look up "The Murder of Thomas Becket". King Henry of England, and Thomas Becket, Arch Bishop of Canterbury, were great friends at one time. They quarreled over control of the clergy, to the point where King Henry said the following:
Quote:
What sluggards, what cowards have I brought up in my court, who care nothing for their allegiance to their lord. Who will rid me of this meddlesome priest."
This "insipred" four knights who overheard it to assassinate Becket. King Henry was "shocked" this happened, and he disgraced the knights. Four years later, in an act of penance, the king donned a sack-cloth walking barefoot through the streets of Canterbury while eighty monks flogged him with branches. King Henry knew about PR, even as long ago as 1170!
Let me go out on a branch. I'll bet Mara knows this story; if you take any History of England course, you'll know it. It's a classic way of using others to accomplish your goals, without getting 100% of the blame. After all, King Henry could always say he was "misunderstood", and blame it on "miscommunication". Sound familiar?
4) Mara tells Reese, Reese tells McAdoo. The expected happens. The media storm hits, with "denials" from Mara about what he meant.
Very convenient. If you believe it.
John Mara was appointed the chairman of the Management Council Executive Committee/Labor. He's going to be involved with negotiations with the NFLPA and any new CBA. This is a guy who has an issue communicating?
Seriously?
5) Mara knows what MetLife will be if McAdoo comes back as head coach. He knows the fans are blaming him right now, with Reese and McAdoo as puppets.
Mara also knows a third of the roster is on IR, and starting Geno is pretty much conceding the game to Oakland.
So, if McAdoo loses in Oakland (as expected), Mara has the perfect excuse to fire him. Mara will expect this to blunt the reaction at MetLife next week. This makes it easier to get a new coach for the team. It might even be a way to keep Reese, if Mara can pin everything on McAdoo.
The funny thing here is if McAdoo does pull out a win there, and ruin everything. The way this season is going, who knows?
Dude, you definitely need to post more often. Big ups to anyone who brings the Bard to BBI! Not sure I believe Mara’s this smart, but I like way you think!
poor communication skills, on par with Handley, is what will finally doom him. As I mentioned after the Eli benching, it's clear McAdoo didn't like Eli or felt he was fitting his offense. Mara obviously relented and wanted to see others at QB. What is Mara's fault is you know that McAdoo is a shitty communicator and blew the discussion with Eli. We've heard hints about how back McAdoo has been all season. From the rebellion by the defense against him, to quotes in the press about "that's not how he's been raised" in being warm and fuzzy with the press or players.
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Great post! One of the best I've seen here. Love the Henry IV references.
However...I dost think though giveth Mr. Mara too much credit! I do not think he is bright enough to have thought out this dastardly a plan. If we've learned anything about John Mara, it is that he doesn't understand PR.
Cmon dude relax
The Tisch side of the house has let the Maras have too much say over football decisions. I also wouldn’t be surprised if Tim Mara skewered John and Chris over how much they have diminished and mishandled the Giants the last four years. The Tisches tend to have a good handle into the pulse of the media and PR landscape and have lots of connections to the Hollywood aspect of things.
Mara made the McAdoo decision. He deserves to be roasted for it and the Eli fallout.
I hope this forces the owners to bring in a neutral party to be an empowered head of all football operations.
Chris and John Mara have no business being involved whatsoever. They’ve proven themselves incapable.
Mara and Tisch may be thinking about what the next home game would be like if Mac were still in charge. If they fire Mac and start Eli next game there will be less negative fan reaction.
Bingo.
Hold on to ya butts
which is dumb..they blew it no turning back now to save face
move on and try to be "smarter"
Bottom line, if they wanted to see Webb, they should have been getting Webb ready a few weeks ago. Everything they've done with Webb from the summer on has been head scratchingly bad. Everything they did this week was unprofessional, poorly managed, disrespectful, cold, and also don't seem to make sense. Geno neither requires a look (he has a 4 year resume), gives you a better chance to win, or figures in to the future...unless he is really the guy you want mentoring Webb and/or a top 3 draft pick. I know I sure would rather have had Eli doing that and made for a more graceful exit for Eli after next season.
Quote:
In comment 13718624 David B. said:
Quote:
is gives the fans a pound a flesh, which is fine, but it also shows that the organization is knee-jerk responding to fan outrage, which is something they've never really done. Should they be doing that? Not really.
So they fire him and you get Spags for the rest of the season. So what.
This place is a disaster. People are finally going to get what they wanted but will still find reasons to be outraged. For fucks sake.
I know I don't want it. For one thing, I agree with the point that it's a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage (um, Tennessee?), and for another, I don't want to risk an interim coach - whether that's Spags or Sully - coming in and firing the team up for an extra win or two that actually harms the franchise's long-term opportunity.
They're all culpable in this dumpster fire of a season. Now just let it burn.
I think we all agree that we don’t want any extra wins. But this team is too far gone and an interim coach isn’t going to be able to fire this team up enough to win any games. It’s not happening, they just don’t have the talent at this point.
They’ve got to get McAdoo out of the building though. Instantly. There is literally zero upside to keeping him around to finish the season.
But Mara’s roll in all this about Eli’s disgraceful benching just doesn’t add up. I'm sure he’s livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, “hey, there’s been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so he’s going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page”. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder who’s advising Mara on all these matters. Since we haven’t heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe there’s a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Eli’s extraordinary streak to be ended
You say that now, but if Mac is fired and you get nothing else for Christmas, I don't think you'll be happy ;>)
yankeeslover : 9:58 am : link : reply
When it wasn't too late to have intern hc insert Eli back?
Mac should have been canned on Tuesday.
can they really let mcadoo have those brutal press conferences five times a week for the last month of the season? the press already hates him and will just use them as an opportunity to - fairly - ridicule the franchise. this is not the same media environment it was 25 years ago, and i don't think the fact they haven't fired a coach midseason since Arnsparger will stop them from doing it now
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
Mcadoo has forced Maras hand, not the fans or the media.
Yeah, and then we can throw mud at him during recess!!
This is news? ESPN looks like they scooped it if it does happen and takes no heat if it doesn't.
But Mara’s roll in all this about Eli’s disgraceful benching just doesn’t add up. I'm sure he’s livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, “hey, there’s been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so he’s going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page”. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder who’s advising Mara on all these matters. Since we haven’t heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe there’s a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Eli’s extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
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Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Mara’s roll in all this about Eli’s disgraceful benching just doesn’t add up. I'm sure he’s livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, “hey, there’s been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so he’s going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page”. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder who’s advising Mara on all these matters. Since we haven’t heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe there’s a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Eli’s extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation. This is about an awful head coach and an ownership group who have embarrassed themselves time and time again three straight years.
Mcadoo has forced Maras hand, not the fans or the media.
Think whatever you want, but if McAdoo had presented Eli with something that was completely different from what Mara signed off on, he'd have been fired last Monday (when it was initially presented to Eli). The version that Mara tried to walk back to in his statements is one that wouldn't have even required a conversation with Mara or Eli, yet people still believe it?
This is absolutely a kneejerk reaction to fan outrage. For better or worse, that's what it is.
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In comment 13718713 trueblueinpw said:
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Just based on the failure on the field, McAdoo and Reese deserve to be fired.
But Mara’s roll in all this about Eli’s disgraceful benching just doesn’t add up. I'm sure he’s livid and he should be as his name and the reputation of the Giants has been indelibly stained. But all he ever needed to do to reverse the damage was to say, “hey, there’s been a mistake, the NY Giants play every game to win and I believe Eli gives us the best chance to win in Oakland so he’s going to start. I spoken to all my employees and I promise you all that we are now all completely on the same page”. I think I t was the long silence in between McAdoo butt fumbling the really simple and eminently reasonable objective to get a look at Webb and Mara speaking to the press which really exacerbated this dreadful situation.
I really wonder who’s advising Mara on all these matters. Since we haven’t heard from Tisch, I wonder if maybe there’s a split opinion between he and Mara? Anyway, this is a sad day and completely unacceptable way for Eli’s extraordinary streak to be ended
I guess you missed the part where Mara acknowledged that the fan outrage was much more than he expected. That, to me, spoke more volumes than any sort of backtracking on what the original plan with McAdoo was. Don't forget, that plan was presented to Eli on Monday, not Tuesday. Mara might not have been in the building when everything went down on Tuesday, but you can bet your ass he was aware of exactly what had already gone down before you and I were. If McAdoo acted beyond his marching orders, he could have been fired then and there. He wasn't.
If they fire McAdoo tomorrow, it's absolutely a response to fan anger. That's a little bit disappointing, because if they believed it was the right move, own it. If the Giants start getting run by a democracy of the fans, we're in real trouble - you don't have to look far to see that. We'd have Jonas Seawright starting at DT and would have cut Corey Webster halfway through his second season.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation. This is about an awful head coach and an ownership group who have embarrassed themselves time and time again three straight years.
Um, what about my comment said anything about player evaluation? Or are you just replying to the wrong post?
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Let's put the tinfoil hats on.
1) John Mara makes his "Let's look at other QB's" statement to Reese two weeks or so ago, presumably after the SF loss. It's very possible that he also made the decision to fire McAdoo then as well, after the season.
2) Mara knows that he's going to have a problem getting the coach he wants. The big problem is Eli's consecutive streak; any coach that sits Eli down is going to be a villian. The ideal way to do this is to get McAdoo to do it, then fire him.
3) John Mara is a Bachelor of Science, Cum Laude, from Boston College. He's grown up with the Giants, from a football family. He's not a dummy, he's personally known countless players, both during their football careers and has hired ex Giants for the organization. He should know how they react.
Anyone really think that Mara was shocked by Eli's reaction? Mara grew up in NY. Is it creditable that he does not know what the media reaction would be? He saw the public reaction when Tarenton was traded, when Simms was sat down by Handley. He's been there.
Eli's family has always had incredible respect for the history of the NFL. Mara knows this. Mara knew that Eli would never do something that would affect the integrity of the game (or his own credibility), like treating regular season games like pre-season games.
This wasn't an offer Eli couldn't refuse, it was an offer Eli would never accept, and John Mara knew that.
3) How to accomplish this? Look up "The Murder of Thomas Becket". King Henry of England, and Thomas Becket, Arch Bishop of Canterbury, were great friends at one time. They quarreled over control of the clergy, to the point where King Henry said the following:
This "insipred" four knights who overheard it to assassinate Becket. King Henry was "shocked" this happened, and he disgraced the knights. Four years later, in an act of penance, the king donned a sack-cloth walking barefoot through the streets of Canterbury while eighty monks flogged him with branches. King Henry knew about PR, even as long ago as 1170!
Let me go out on a branch. I'll bet Mara knows this story; if you take any History of England course, you'll know it. It's a classic way of using others to accomplish your goals, without getting 100% of the blame. After all, King Henry could always say he was "misunderstood", and blame it on "miscommunication". Sound familiar?
4) Mara tells Reese, Reese tells McAdoo. The expected happens. The media storm hits, with "denials" from Mara about what he meant.
Very convenient. If you believe it.
John Mara was appointed the chairman of the Management Council Executive Committee/Labor. He's going to be involved with negotiations with the NFLPA and any new CBA. This is a guy who has an issue communicating?
Seriously?
5) Mara knows what MetLife will be if McAdoo comes back as head coach. He knows the fans are blaming him right now, with Reese and McAdoo as puppets.
Mara also knows a third of the roster is on IR, and starting Geno is pretty much conceding the game to Oakland.
So, if McAdoo loses in Oakland (as expected), Mara has the perfect excuse to fire him. Mara will expect this to blunt the reaction at MetLife next week. This makes it easier to get a new coach for the team. It might even be a way to keep Reese, if Mara can pin everything on McAdoo.
The funny thing here is if McAdoo does pull out a win there, and ruin everything. The way this season is going, who knows?
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But that’s only part of the problem. This organization can’t move forward until they get rid of Reese too.
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation.
See, I can do it too!
This also lays credence to the fact that McAdoo really screwed up the communication and plan with Eli. I do believe Mara agreed to a plan to look at Webb, but expected Mac to work with Eli on a plan. He did not expect Mac to dictate "one half", etc., and force Eli into a corner.
Fuck McAdoo.
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In comment 13718858 WillVAB said:
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But that’s only part of the problem. This organization can’t move forward until they get rid of Reese too.
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation.
See, I can do it too!
Actually Reeses firing has everything to do with player evaluation.
He now sucks at it along with not being able to build an NFL roster.
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In comment 13718862 Sammo85 said:
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In comment 13718858 WillVAB said:
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But that’s only part of the problem. This organization can’t move forward until they get rid of Reese too.
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation.
See, I can do it too!
Actually Reeses firing has everything to do with player evaluation.
He now sucks at it along with not being able to build an NFL roster.
I was referring to your reply to my earlier post which made absolutely no sense. Scroll up.
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In comment 13718876 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 13718862 Sammo85 said:
Quote:
In comment 13718858 WillVAB said:
Quote:
But that’s only part of the problem. This organization can’t move forward until they get rid of Reese too.
He should be fired tomorrow too.
Bullshit. This has nothing to do with player evaluation.
See, I can do it too!
Actually Reeses firing has everything to do with player evaluation.
He now sucks at it along with not being able to build an NFL roster.
I was referring to your reply to my earlier post which made absolutely no sense. Scroll up.
Too much text. My bad. I probably didn’t read it fully. Saw Jonas
Seawright mentioned and flew into a tizzy.
Coming off a wicked stomach virus yesterday.
I said earlier this week that I didn't want McAdoo fired, because I wanted him to feel the wrath of the fans next week v. Dallas. It makes sense for management to short-circuit that, since it would be arguably the ugliest Giant home game in history (yes, even uglier than the plane banner game).
Let's put the tinfoil hats on.
1) John Mara makes his "Let's look at other QB's" statement to Reese two weeks or so ago, presumably after the SF loss. It's very possible that he also made the decision to fire McAdoo then as well, after the season.
2) Mara knows that he's going to have a problem getting the coach he wants. The big problem is Eli's consecutive streak; any coach that sits Eli down is going to be a villian. The ideal way to do this is to get McAdoo to do it, then fire him.
3) John Mara is a Bachelor of Science, Cum Laude, from Boston College. He's grown up with the Giants, from a football family. He's not a dummy, he's personally known countless players, both during their football careers and has hired ex Giants for the organization. He should know how they react.
Anyone really think that Mara was shocked by Eli's reaction? Mara grew up in NY. Is it creditable that he does not know what the media reaction would be? He saw the public reaction when Tarenton was traded, when Simms was sat down by Handley. He's been there.
Eli's family has always had incredible respect for the history of the NFL. Mara knows this. Mara knew that Eli would never do something that would affect the integrity of the game (or his own credibility), like treating regular season games like pre-season games.
This wasn't an offer Eli couldn't refuse, it was an offer Eli would never accept, and John Mara knew that.
3) How to accomplish this? Look up "The Murder of Thomas Becket". King Henry of England, and Thomas Becket, Arch Bishop of Canterbury, were great friends at one time. They quarreled over control of the clergy, to the point where King Henry said the following:
Quote:
What sluggards, what cowards have I brought up in my court, who care nothing for their allegiance to their lord. Who will rid me of this meddlesome priest."
This "insipred" four knights who overheard it to assassinate Becket. King Henry was "shocked" this happened, and he disgraced the knights. Four years later, in an act of penance, the king donned a sack-cloth walking barefoot through the streets of Canterbury while eighty monks flogged him with branches. King Henry knew about PR, even as long ago as 1170!
Let me go out on a branch. I'll bet Mara knows this story; if you take any History of England course, you'll know it. It's a classic way of using others to accomplish your goals, without getting 100% of the blame. After all, King Henry could always say he was "misunderstood", and blame it on "miscommunication". Sound familiar?
4) Mara tells Reese, Reese tells McAdoo. The expected happens. The media storm hits, with "denials" from Mara about what he meant.
Very convenient. If you believe it.
John Mara was appointed the chairman of the Management Council Executive Committee/Labor. He's going to be involved with negotiations with the NFLPA and any new CBA. This is a guy who has an issue communicating?
Seriously?
5) Mara knows what MetLife will be if McAdoo comes back as head coach. He knows the fans are blaming him right now, with Reese and McAdoo as puppets.
Mara also knows a third of the roster is on IR, and starting Geno is pretty much conceding the game to Oakland.
So, if McAdoo loses in Oakland (as expected), Mara has the perfect excuse to fire him. Mara will expect this to blunt the reaction at MetLife next week. This makes it easier to get a new coach for the team. It might even be a way to keep Reese, if Mara can pin everything on McAdoo.
The funny thing here is if McAdoo does pull out a win there, and ruin everything. The way this season is going, who knows?
Dude, you definitely need to post more often. Big ups to anyone who brings the Bard to BBI! Not sure I believe Mara’s this smart, but I like way you think!
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Not the Mara's style.
You're right but then again this isn't a typical situation where style or normalcy prevails. This is much different.
Mara is pissed mcadonothing went rogue and embarrassed him and the Giants ,he's done!
In looking back at what will hopefully be his final game as a head coach, most NFL head coaches are pretty much insane. But McAdoo looks like a football lifer who isn't fit to be an NFL head coach. "The smartest man in the room" as Reese called him. When he showed up as the head coach of the NY Football Giants in his intro conference, we all kind of laughed at him because he came in a suit that didn't fit. But in hindsight, we are seeing a guy who looks like he might well be barely functional in day to day life outside of football. And he's acting like Belichick in the way he handles his team and press. The problem is...he's not Belichick. You need rings on your fingers to do that shit. Otherwise, you look like a hard ass clueless asshole. No different than what we saw from Schiano. Or Mangini. Or countless others who saw how Belichick acted, and did the same when they had no credentials to do so.
McAdoo blew the conversation with Eli because he was incapable of doing it the right way. Mara and Tisch know this guys drill. It's almost as if they needed HR in the room to talk to Eli about that move, which is what would have happened in a corporate setting. But they let this idiot handle it.
The Tisch's and Mara's are aware of what MetLife will look like next week with Dallas in town. They have almost no choice but to leave this guy in Oakland tonight and get some semblance of the fans back on their side.
It's also possible McAdoo deliberately misrepresented Mara's direction on how to get the other QBs some work and that may be why he gets canned now instead of after the season.
Great post! One of the best I've seen here. Love the Henry IV references.
However...I dost think though giveth Mr. Mara too much credit! I do not think he is bright enough to have thought out this dastardly a plan. If we've learned anything about John Mara, it is that he doesn't understand PR.