Older fans: Best Giants QB of all time?

but yeah, I'd take Eli over Simms. Simms was better in some ways, but Eli's clutch performance is unsurpassed. And Eli's durability counts: Simms was hurt a lot both early and late in his career. That's how we got Scott Brunner (blechhh) and Jeff Hostelter (at least a nice player).

Also Eli over Tarkenton, whom I'm just old enough to remember. Tark was good at the things Eli isn't: Scrambling, accurate short passing. But still.

I don't remember Conerly or Tittle. There were guys before that, too, like Benny Friedman.

to win the argument, imo. Simms was tough as nails and great at the intermediate throws, but not great at bombs. Eli was likely the best, imo, and by far the best at reading defenses.

In comment 13721437 yatqb said:

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to win the argument, imo. Simms was tough as nails and great at the intermediate throws, but not great at bombs. Eli was likely the best, imo, and by far the best at reading defenses.

I'm with at. Tittle was great but he came to the Giants at age 34. I don't remember that much about Conerly (I'm not that old) but I think he'd be in the discussion if I'd seen him more - he was a career Giant and a good one. Simms was great but for durability and the most amazing moments I think you have to say Eli was/is #1.

"at" = "yat".

Too difficult to compare. Simms never had weapons like Eli. He did finish much stronger than Eli as but the beginning of Simms career was very rough.

Simms also came into a totally hopeless Giants squad. This team is nothing compared to the crap situation the Giants were in for decades when Simms came.

It's interesting though that Eli's qb rank relative to his peers is not as good as Simms in their best years. And why many can look at the overall stats and think it's a runaway for Eli but it's much closer than that.

Then Simms

Eli, Simms and then Collins.
(Dave Brown gets a shout out too for that one time he knocked cocky Deion on his ass in Dallas) :-)

....in his four year career with the Giants. Nuff said.

1982, Eli is the best. Simms was really good but had a shorter career.

Super bowl ever going 22 for 25 and 3 TDs. But you can’t compare QBs from different eras. Eli’s numbers are inflated relative to guys from past cause of emphasis on passing and rule changes.

Service and I believe return to U of Miss. to graduate. Nevertheless he was my favorite. His stats are lowered by the stupididity of the head coach who kept him out of the game in the first quarter so Heinrich could probe the defense. Maybe Giants should have done this with Eli.

YAT great warrior and passer but he wasn't hindered as Charlie was. I think Phil Simms was tough, had bad luck, and was limited. No way he is best or even in top three. After Charlie and YAT comes Eli, a winning and great deep passer. If Eli could keep the ball down he would have been so much better.


A QB I never saw was Goldberg (I think that's right) who many would argue was best as he helped innovate T formation, but that requires older records than are in my head.

So in my lifetime and "opinion"
1. Charlie Conerly #42
2. YA Tittle
3. Eli Manning
4. # 10 from and to Vikings
5. Phil Simms

"lifers" and both also went to U Miss. Conerly was a major dude, I'll grant that just from what little I remember and also what I read. Conerly was also the model for the "Marlboro Man" - OK, today we all know cigarettes are bad, but back then that was a pretty major ad gig.

In comment 13721470 plato said:

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Service and I believe return to U of Miss. to graduate. Nevertheless he was my favorite. His stats are lowered by the stupididity of the head coach who kept him out of the game in the first quarter so Heinrich could probe the defense. Maybe Giants should have done this with Eli. YAT great warrior and passer but he wasn't hindered as Charlie was. I think Phil Simms was tough, had bad luck, and was limited. No way he is best or even in top three. After Charlie and YAT comes Eli, a winning and great deep passer. If Eli could keep the ball down he would have been so much better. A QB I never saw was Goldberg (I think that's right) who many would argue was best as he helped innovate T formation, but that requires older records than are in my head. So in my lifetime and "opinion" 1. Charlie Conerly #42 2. YA Tittle 3. Eli Manning 4. # 10 from and to Vikings 5. Phil Simms

AGREE. #6. Kerry Collins

Conerly and Tittle.
Conerly because he was QB when I first became a Giants fan and his passes to Rote, Gifford, and Shnelker.
And YA because of the passing game opened up under Sherman.

I think Mc would have loved Gary Wood...he was mobile.. O k, he had to be.

but may not have been the best QB to play on the team. I just do not know enough about Tarkenton and Y.A

Because the rule change that you can’t hit a receiver beyond 5 yards made it much easier for QBs.

Of course, what's he gonna say?

I'm not older enough to have an opinion pre-1972, but here's the thing. Simms played on a team that was all about the defense. He played with LT and Harry Carson. When I think about the heroes of that era, he's not the first guy I think of. But his Super Bowl performance was amazing.

But it wasn't *dramatic*. I think those come-from-behind Super Bowl wins--coupled with a few of those playoff games--are defining for Eli. At least for me. When I think about the heroes of the Coughlin era, Eli is at the top.

But I'm talking about perception really, more than comparing their strengths.

Y.A. Tittle was the best pure passer to wear a Giants uniform. He was unflappable, tough, savvy. Conerly I saw at the end of his career, so I cannot really comment on him. But Tittle was better than Simms and Eli. I would rank Eli second.

In comment 13721482 Del Shofner said:

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"lifers" and both also went to U Miss. Conerly was a major dude, I'll grant that just from what little I remember and also what I read. Conerly was also the model for the "Marlboro Man" - OK, today we all know cigarettes are bad, but back then that was a pretty major ad gig.

A couple of years ago, out of the blue, I wrote a letter to Eli's mother and father, telling them how happy and proud we Giant fans were with Eli,, not only because of his talent and skill, but his decency and demeanor. I said that I believe that comes from his upbringing and I'm writing to compliment and thank you both on raising such a solid citizen and terrific human being.

She wrote back, thanked me and added that the Mannings had a soft spot for the Giants because of Charlie Connerly and are glad Eli was a Giant.

esp. after the beatings he took early in career and then endured to blossom towards ladder part of career.

But, Eli passed him. Though his ups and downs, hes been the best in my lifetime. I wasn't around to see Connelly (sp?) or likes prior to 1970s and may have a case to be the best..but in this era I'd say Eli

In comment 13721537 micky said:

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esp. after the beatings he took early in career and then endured to blossom towards ladder part of career. But, Eli passed him. Though his ups and downs, hes been the best in my lifetime. I wasn't around to see Conerly (sp?) or likes prior to 1970s and may have a case to be the best..but in this era I'd say Eli

Pre Super Bowl NFL is mpossible to compare to the modern era. I’ll always be a Phil Simms guy. But what Eli did in the playoffs elevates him to #1 for me. So many hall of fame level playoff games for Eli.

for me to distinguish between Tittle, Simms, and Eli, because they are all Giants ledgens

I was a kid when Tittle played and thought he was wonderful. Simms brought Giants fans success that for 18 years was reserved for other elite teams, and we all know what Eli has done.

I guess if I had to pick one, it would be Simms.

Tough question

Y.A.'s two NFL MVP's (and my handle) make it close. But Eli gets my nod. Primarily because he's been excellent here for a longer period of time.

Someone who should at least get honorable mention in this conversation is Ed Danowski. Other than Eli he was the only QB to win 2 titles with the Giants. It was in the 1930's and the QB's role was very different then, but still. (Full disclosure: he was once my gym teacher.)

Fran Tarkenton? Played on some awful teams but was fun to watch.

Simms simply lost too much time to injury. And even during his prime, he was prone to mental errors. His arm talent was top-notch, but overall Eli’s legacy is stronger.

One thing that under-40s may not fully appreciate: remember the beating Eli took in the NFC Title Game against San Francisco? That’s the first five years of Phil’s career. Every... single... week. And for his first eight years, his wide receivers were the equivalent of Tavarres King and Roger Lewis (plus maybe Sterling Shepard for the year or so when Lionel Manuel was healthy and motivated). Mark Bavaro could only do so much from the TE spot.

tough sonnabitch. and aside Ernie Gray, who did he have to throw to? But I too over the course of work must go with Eli. YA while very good did not have the longevity to be in the same conversation.

Tittle didn't have the NFL rules that protected QBs like Eli was fortunate to have. In Tittle's day, QBs were mercilessly destroyed. The picture of him laying all bloodied-up on the stadium carpet is the most priceless football picture of all time IMO. Now that was football!

Eli was very smart and resilient. Not to mention a great human being on and off the field. I don't think he was a great QB, but a very good manager of the offense. He made as many mistakes as he didn't. He once had a great long ball, but the west coast offense that he was forced into... will forever be seen as the beginning of the end of his career. He was, (and is) ill-suited for such an offense.

I saw YA in person and he was great, but could not get the job done in the title games. Weather and other factors were certainly an issue (my brother was at that '62 game at Yankee Stadium, and he said the conditions were brutal but perfect for Green Bay), but Eli got it done in the biggest moments, and against perhaps the greatest team of all time. YA had the best individual years. On balance, I go with this order: Manning, Tittle, Simms, and Conerly.

Pampered QB and WR era, and his numbers are still ordinary.

Simms would have lit things up in this era.

So it’s Simms, since I didn’t see the Titles of the world.

Simms.

In comment 13721554 Bubba said:

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Fran Tarkenton? Played on some awful teams but was fun to watch.

Tarkenton was good for an additional 3 wins a season. The team from 67-71 would have been under .500 every year without him. Instead, as I recall, they had 1 winning season and two .500 seasons out of the 5.

Eli is the best QB ever. Conely and Title were very good but not compared to Eli. Simms was excellent but was injured often. Eli won two Superbowls and was named MVP in both.

Definitely best flat top on a Giants QB ever.

If not, just say "post merger" or something like that.

For example, Benny Friedman. Given his time, probably the best Giants QB in comparison to his competition.
Link - ( New Window )

and the first 5 years of his career had OLs as bad or worse than this one. Once the line solidieid in 1984 he blossomed.

Tha said, I think Eli is better. Nothing wrong with being # 2 to Eli.

Never a fan of Tarkenton.

Never saw Tittle, I was born in 196, but the numbers speak for themselves. My dad loved him, said he was tremendous.

Thanks everyone for the varied viewpoints and friendly discussion. It's been very educational to read up on everyone's point of views.

Apologies for missing Benny Friedman, he was definitely another great QB.

I'd take Simms over Eli every time. You put Phil Simms in an offense under the rules they play under now, with the receivers Eli has had for most of his career, and this wouldn't even be a question.

Bill Walsh once said that, had the Giants not picked him and he had been drafted by Miners like Walsh intended to, that he would have done just as well as Joe Montana.

passer we had since the early 80s. I never saw Tittle, Conerly or Tarkenton, but since the late 70s, early 80s, I would say
Collins. Simms was an absolute great leader and very good QB and Eli of course had had some of the greatest moments in Giants history and so I think we need to clarify or define greatest.

Simms is a God in my family and when I played sports as a kid I always wore #11 in his honor. However, if we're going to bring up Simms' lack of great receiving weapons and the defensive-oriented time in which he played, we also have to mention he had a great OL, great running game, great tight end, dominant defense and one of the best coaching staffs ever assembled. Eli never played on a team that could hold a candle to the '86 and '90 Giants - the 2008 team was the closest, and he was QBing that one quite well until Plax's incident.

Simms and Eli played two different games.

With all respect to the '90, '07 and '11 teams, the 1986 team was the best ever, by far, in my lifetime. Simms was a big contributor, but the running game and defense were dominant.

That said, Eli put the team on his back for those two runs. Clutch. Eli is the NYG GOAT, by a nose, in my lifetime.

Eli had a rather good OL from around 2005 until maybe 2010, didn't he?

And while the 1990 era OL were road graders, they weren't exactly the best pass blocking crew.

Simms benefited from a great running game and defense but Eli didn't? I must have been watching someone else holding the highest scoring team in league history to 14 points in 2007.

Eli played well in the Super Bowl, but a Giants QB holding the record for completion % in a SB isn't named Eli Manning.

was a better qb than eli. Simms made eli plays early in his career, like dumb throws, but cleaned it up when the game slowed for him. Simms was on the level of some of his contemporaries in his prime and should be in the hall of fame. Much more accurate thrower, better arm. I still love eli though, just opinion.

with emotional, childhood attachments to Conerly and Tittle, great appreciation for Simms but the body of work, the two SB MVPs, the incredible NFC title game in Green Bay (for which he still doesn't get enough credit), the toughness and durability, I'd put Eli at No. 1 followed by Tittle, Simms, and Conerly. I never was a Tarkenton fan. He was an arrogant jerk and could never win the big game anywhere.

I've been watching since 1955, and Eli is tops.

I'd follow him with Simms, Tittle, and my sentimental favorite Conerly in that order.

Then there's a huge gap. I don't even know who I'd put next, but it would not be Tarkington. Probably Kerry Collins.

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