for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Amassing Fact about the Steelers

Alwaysblue22 : 12/5/2017 8:23 am
Three of their 5 starting O-lineman are UDFAs. And their line makes ours look like shit. What accounts for this? Better player evaluations or better coaching?
I don't think you are going out on a limb  
Diver_Down : 12/5/2017 8:28 am : link
by saying a team's OL makes ours look like shit. Every NFL team's OL makes ours look like shit. I think the biggest reason behind this is a focus on spelling.
I guess I am stupid today...  
EricJ : 12/5/2017 8:29 am : link
what is an "amassing" fact? One that gets larger over time?
Is this..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 12/5/2017 8:31 am : link
a thread to accumulate "facts" about the Steelers?

The Pittsburgh Steelers were founded by Arthur J. Rooney on July 8, 1933. Now the seventh-oldest franchise in the NFL, the Pittsburgh team was known as the Pirates until 1940.
RE: Is this..  
Diver_Down : 12/5/2017 8:33 am : link
In comment 13725184 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
a thread to accumulate "facts" about the Steelers?

The Pittsburgh Steelers were founded by Arthur J. Rooney on July 8, 1933. Now the seventh-oldest franchise in the NFL, the Pittsburgh team was known as the Pirates until 1940.


Now that is amassing...
they've been woefully underperforming most of the year  
Banks : 12/5/2017 8:41 am : link
They poured about 150 million in that line and were expected to be much better, but they are near the bottom the league in rushing and yards per carry. Ben got killed early in the season, but they've been good in pass pro for awhile now. Part of that is Ben's ability to get away from pressure. For a guy that looks like he hits the gym once a month, he has nimble feet
As far as the OL goes,  
Doomster : 12/5/2017 8:46 am : link
I think Solari has done nothing with these guys.....the fact that the line improved a little because he was forced to make changes because of injuries, shows his rigidness in keeping the mess in tact, when a guy like Hart should not have been out there....

Somehow, this guy has been given a free pass for accomplishing nothing...
OL Coach is Mike Munchek  
djstat : 12/5/2017 8:49 am : link
Arguably the best OL coach in football. David DeCastro was a 1st round pick, Marcus Gilbert a 2nd round pick, Pouncy a 1st round pick. SO they have a good mix. Better coaching, better scheme.
Giants won a Super Bowls  
pjcas18 : 12/5/2017 9:04 am : link
with two UDFA's and a 5th round pick for 3 of their 5 OL and none of the other two was a 1st round pick like on the Steelers.
Brandon Hunt.  
ArcadeSlumlord : 12/5/2017 9:13 am : link
Steelers Pro Scout.
another amazing  
japanhead : 12/5/2017 9:39 am : link
fact about the steelers.. i believe ben tied eli for all-time 4th quarter comebacks last night
two players on the offensive line were first round picks  
GentleGiant : 12/5/2017 9:47 am : link
and 2 were undrafted. That's scouting. The Giants have only drafted 1 offensive lineman with their first pick in this century. The Patriots have used their first pick 4 times to draft to the O line.
RE: Giants won a Super Bowls  
Greg from LI : 12/5/2017 9:49 am : link
In comment 13725274 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
with two UDFA's and a 5th round pick for 3 of their 5 OL and none of the other two was a 1st round pick like on the Steelers.


Honestly, I think that the success of unheralded guys on that 2007 line wrongly convinced Jerry that this was a blueprint to be followed rather than a wonderful fluke.
RE: two players on the offensive line were first round picks  
pjcas18 : 12/5/2017 9:52 am : link
In comment 13725396 GentleGiant said:
Quote:
and 2 were undrafted. That's scouting. The Giants have only drafted 1 offensive lineman with their first pick in this century. The Patriots have used their first pick 4 times to draft to the O line.


??? what?

Pugh
Flowers

for the Giants.

Not sure why you brought the Patriots up, but

Solder
Mankins

who else?

unless you're counting their 2nd round pick in Adrian Klemm in 2000, then you can add Richburg for the Giants.

Not sure if you confused something in your post.
I agree with greg  
mattlawson : 12/5/2017 9:54 am : link
Emboldened by Victor Cruz in 2011. The whole big sexy moves thing.

Ask any Miami Dolphins fan what they thought of John Jerry and they will tell you about the matador
RE: RE: Giants won a Super Bowls  
pjcas18 : 12/5/2017 9:55 am : link
In comment 13725398 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 13725274 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


with two UDFA's and a 5th round pick for 3 of their 5 OL and none of the other two was a 1st round pick like on the Steelers.



Honestly, I think that the success of unheralded guys on that 2007 line wrongly convinced Jerry that this was a blueprint to be followed rather than a wonderful fluke.


But if you look at the 12 playoff teams every year you find that (OL a mix between high picks and late picks/UDFA's is the norm. The Cowboys are the exception.

Most teams do not have more than 1 or 2 1sts/2nds on their OL.

look at the Broncos, Seahawks, Patriots, Packers, Panthers, etc. or teams from the past few years.

I think you HAVE to get OL contribution from elsewhere or coach up/develop them (or just sign FA's), but not many teams exercise the model of using their most precious asset (1st round draft picks) repeatedly on the OL.
I get that  
Greg from LI : 12/5/2017 10:05 am : link
But, for a long time, the Giants rarely spent anything but late round picks on OL. You had Snee in the second in 2004, followed by Koets in the 6th in 2007, Beatty at the end of the second in 2009, Petrus in 5th in 2010, Brewer in 4th in 2011, Mosely in the 4th and McCants in the 6th in 2012. Between 2004 and 2013, when they drafted Pugh, they picked a lineman earlier than the 4th round one time. A mix of early picks and late round/UDFA guys might be necessary, but to make that happen you have to spend a 1-3 pick on a lineman occasionally.
RE: I get that  
pjcas18 : 12/5/2017 10:11 am : link
In comment 13725433 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
But, for a long time, the Giants rarely spent anything but late round picks on OL. You had Snee in the second in 2004, followed by Koets in the 6th in 2007, Beatty at the end of the second in 2009, Petrus in 5th in 2010, Brewer in 4th in 2011, Mosely in the 4th and McCants in the 6th in 2012. Between 2004 and 2013, when they drafted Pugh, they picked a lineman earlier than the 4th round one time. A mix of early picks and late round/UDFA guys might be necessary, but to make that happen you have to spend a 1-3 pick on a lineman occasionally.


I think the Giants problem on the OL has been:

1. scouting. it's the players not the investment
2. coaching. Almost no late round picks/low $$ free agents have become starters
3. scheme. they really need their OL to give the QB time, since with Eli he's not doing much to "create" at his age
4. Injuries.

If you said without knowing the names your team has two 1st round picks (Pugh, Flowers), 1 2nd round pick (Richburg) a former 3rd round pick (Jerry) and one other (Hart) on your line, and another former 1st (Fluker) in the rotation you'd probably be confident the OL was at least adequate.

Wouldn't you? It feels like you have to be because investing more than that seems neglectful to other areas of the team and it will catch up eventually.
I don't think you're wrong  
Greg from LI : 12/5/2017 10:28 am : link
But I think that, when you look at the big picture, the dearth of linemen being brought in from 2005-2012 is what spurred what we've seen since. They were complacent because they had an excellent line for a while, so they let the pipeline dry up. The line got old, injured, and ineffective in a hurry and they had no one worth a shit waiting in the wings to step up. So from 2013 on they've been compelled to draft OL early, and maybe forced some of those picks because of acute need.
RE: Is this..  
Larry in Pencilvania : 12/5/2017 10:38 am : link
In comment 13725184 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
a thread to accumulate "facts" about the Steelers?



So I guess that's not rediculous
Back to the Corner