He had a rough week. These players will always defend each other but really who cares?
We literally had an owner can his gm and coach (rightfully) but if it's to preserve his feelings and there is a good chance he leaves will people feel so bad for Eli then? I know many in his club will feel justified.
“I’m not blaming one individual, I’m not finger-pointing, I’m upset with the organization as a whole, there’s more than one person in this decision,’’ Snee said. “There’s plenty of intelligence and plenty of people who have been there a long time and know the way things have been done in the past, the way the Giants have always been proud of. By all of the former players speaking out gives you an indication we feel this is not the way things have always been done.’’
And I care about HOW things are done within this organization. The Giants have been a large part of my life for 50+ years. So I care. Maybe I should be heartless, but I can't just turn my emotions on and off like some fucking robot.
Former teammates being emotional about this is expected Â
it does not say he was incapable of eating a hot dog because he was so distraught at his benching. Snee says, that in a preseason game in which you are not playing you hang out in the locker room. Perhaps you play on your ipad or eat a hot dog. Instead, Eli went back out to the field to help the other teammates that were playing.
It's not a story of poor Eli. It's a story of his character and actions as a teammate.
That's not directed at you but the sentiment of him not being able to eat a hot dog? This story has grown to ridiculous levels about 'poor Eli'.
I don't think that was the point. And there wasn't a "not being able to" about it. That was about how most people who weren't playing a game would relax, eat hot dogs, and good around. Eli took his job seriously and still involved himself in game preparations. The hot dog was meant to illustrate that football is in his blood and nothing more. Not sure how "sentiment" plays into it.
To not reading the rest of the article after seeing the waterworks by Snee. Very turned off by the heart break comments I've read in other places.
My heart hardly breaks for him. Ad Baadbill, here is some context. Mike Webster was a homeless hobo after a first team all pro career for the Steelers.
Eli is getting first class PR due to mismanagement of the situation. He's no big martyr.
“He (Eli) grew up on the Tom Coughlin system, he is a 34 passes, 32 runs type of guy. We know exactly who Eli is and for the majority part of this season, last season he hasn’t been able to be that guy.’’
I found it strange that the Giants’ front office and ownership wanted to change the offense. They had a precise blueprint on how to win a super bowl with the quarterback they had. Why change it to something else? It showed me that the GM and ownership didn’t understand what they were doing. I think Reese really wanted to take advantage of the NFL becoming a “passing league”. But, to me, that is kind of amateur thinking. You still need to have a running game. A consistent running game helps with short yardage situations, staying on “schedule” to get your offense into manageable 3rd downs, and goal line. It is a safer to run the ball into the end zone than throw it because of the really tight confines of goal line field position. As for the league being a passing league, I still see the DB’s hands all over the receivers past the five yard-line and you get six points whether you pass it in or run it in.
Since I really don’t know who is making the decisions within the Giants organization, I can’t say who is at fault with forcing Coughlin to go to the west coast offense. So, I blame both Jerry and John. If John wasn’t the owner, he should be fired, too. Whoever wrote to him telling him he should fire himself was correct in doing so. Looking back, Coughlin should have quit right then and there. He knew the offensive scheme wasn’t the problem. He should not have gone along with it.
his streak was ended because of how the situation was handled (Mara, Reese, Mcadoodoo).
It really sucks, man.
Even if he had just started through the end of this season and next season, he would have had 231 consecutive starts, which would have been 4th on the all-time list.
At least he still ends with the 2nd most ever for a QB and he did end up with more than Peyton, so there will always be that I suppose.
I found it strange that the Giants’ front office and ownership wanted to change the offense. They had a precise blueprint on how to win a super bowl with the quarterback they had. Why change it to something else?
I think McAdoo presented it as an offense you can run with. In fairness to McAdoo, it is hard to run behind that OL, and when you have average RB's (although I do like Gallman).
Ad Baadbill, here is some context. Mike Webster was a homeless hobo after a first team all pro career for the Steelers.
Eli is getting first class PR due to mismanagement of the situation. He's no big martyr.
I'm not sure I understand the point you're trying to make. All I said is that I care about the Giants as an organization. That the Giants have been a large part of my life for 50+ years and as a result, yes, I have an emotional attachment to HOW they do things. I do have an emotional reaction when I think the Giants organization are being assholes. I do have an emotional reaction when I believe the head coach intentionally tried to cause disruption with Manning.
Not sure what your point is about Webster - but it seems sort of stupid. If I am not happy about John Mara that means I must not be capable of caring about a player who became a homeless hobo as you put it?
So is your point that I'm fucked up because the Giants have been part of my life for 50+ years? Or because I LIKED it when I thought the Giants ownership had class and character? That I get upset to hear that McAdoo apparently felt it was appropriate to tell Manning he wasn't starting in a QB meeting with other players present rather than have a private conversation?
Well, sorry, but I do get angry and upset at those things. Maybe the Giants are just the same as some movie actor or something for you. But, as I've said, they have been a part of my persona for 50+ years. While I'm not a "gaga" type of fan... I don't have placards on my car... I don't own Giants gear... I don't wave flags or wear hats... what I have done is not missed a single snap of a Giants game in 50 years... I won't go to a game live (despite being offered seats)... and I won't watch with anyone else in the room... I won't attend family or business events... and all family and friends know exactly where I am when the Giants game is on ... they know I won't answer the phone ... won't leave the house ... won't respond to a text... they all email me after a significant event and ask me what is going on in Giants world...
And that has been my life for 50+ years.
So, yea, the Giants are a big part of who I am.
And, so, yea, I happen to have emotional reactions (anger in this case) when the Giants organization doesn't act classy. When the organization treats one of its great ambassadors (if not the greatest) like a pile of rotten shit.
Sorry. That's just me. And isn't going to change. Like I said... I'm not some fucking robot who can just turn it on and turn it off.
One of the reasons I've loved the Giants is because of my perception (perhaps deluded perception) that it has been a classy organization - a class act.
I found it strange that the Giants’ front office and ownership wanted to change the offense. They had a precise blueprint on how to win a super bowl with the quarterback they had. Why change it to something else?
I think McAdoo presented it as an offense you can run with. In fairness to McAdoo, it is hard to run behind that OL, and when you have average RB's (although I do like Gallman).
It is a horrible system that does not work for the QB that we have. The mistake was trying to turn Eli into something that he isn't. I would have preferred to bring Killdrive out of retirement.
Reading my post after posting (probably should use preview more)... when I refer to "flags and hats", I mean all Giants gear... no jerseys, no mugs, no Giants hats or Giants pennants... no bumper stickers ... nothing... just isn't me... I just wear my jeans and a shirt and watch the game alone
My point is Webster is an example of someone whose suffered a real injustice. Pretty simple. You think it's dumb.
Personally I think your post is altogether horrendous trash and embarrassing if you've been alive for 50 years or more. You seem to infer a lot from my point of this around judgement which seems fairly imaginary on your part.
The offense was broken because they had no offensive line Â
and therefore having Eli take 5 or 7 step drops, as he used to, was going to get him killed and so, instead of admitting this, and tackling the offensive line issue, they decided to go to an offense that minimized the OL problems. Only, that didn't work either because they couldn't even block long enough for this offense.
It all goes back to Reese's outside in building of this team or rebuilding. While football changes from time to time, it is still a league where you have to run the ball to be successful. I'm not sure why this is so difficult to understand. Even way back when SF and Bill Walsh brought in the WC offense, they were very good when they ran the ball well. When they didn't, they did not go very far.
To be successful in the NFL does not take rocket science.
It is a horrible system that does not work for the QB that we have. The mistake was trying to turn Eli into something that he isn't. I would have preferred to bring Killdrive out of retirement.
Oh I agree, but if you look back to when the Giants were interviewing HC candidates, Eli was coming off of 2 of his best seasons, and with a McAdoo offense. At the time, we didn't know how much influence TC had on that offense, and while I would have hoped the FO would have had a better idea, my guess is that they didn't.
So they hired the guy who ran an offense that Eli flourished in. I can understand them doing that, but I don't think they took other aspects into account, like his complete lack of presence. I hope they've learned their lesson, but I fear they haven't.
I found it strange that the Giants’ front office and ownership wanted to change the offense. They had a precise blueprint on how to win a super bowl with the quarterback they had. Why change it to something else?
I think McAdoo presented it as an offense you can run with. In fairness to McAdoo, it is hard to run behind that OL, and when you have average RB's (although I do like Gallman).
Why do you say that?
Before Sullivan took over the Giants we're passing the ball about 66 percent of the time. Also, one of the premises of the WCO is ball control using short passes.
At this point, there are many variations of the WCO. When I think WCO, I think Bill Walsh and Joe Montana. Their running game was usually not very good. They got it done with precise passing based on timing.
Regardless how it was sold, it was a bad choice.
The other thing that annoyed me was McAdoo stated very definitively that he would build his offense around his personnel. He would not try to force his offense to work with the players he had. But as the years went on, it didn't appear he was doing that. I think Sullivan has been trying to do that. The offense looks more Coughlin-Gilbride like since he took over play calling duties.
Forcing the offense on the players was one of the gripes the fan base was having with Gilbride.
We literally had an owner can his gm and coach (rightfully) but if it's to preserve his feelings and there is a good chance he leaves will people feel so bad for Eli then? I know many in his club will feel justified.
And I care about HOW things are done within this organization. The Giants have been a large part of my life for 50+ years. So I care. Maybe I should be heartless, but I can't just turn my emotions on and off like some fucking robot.
It's not a story of poor Eli. It's a story of his character and actions as a teammate.
My heart hardly breaks for him. Ad Baadbill, here is some context. Mike Webster was a homeless hobo after a first team all pro career for the Steelers.
Eli is getting first class PR due to mismanagement of the situation. He's no big martyr.
I found it strange that the Giants’ front office and ownership wanted to change the offense. They had a precise blueprint on how to win a super bowl with the quarterback they had. Why change it to something else? It showed me that the GM and ownership didn’t understand what they were doing. I think Reese really wanted to take advantage of the NFL becoming a “passing league”. But, to me, that is kind of amateur thinking. You still need to have a running game. A consistent running game helps with short yardage situations, staying on “schedule” to get your offense into manageable 3rd downs, and goal line. It is a safer to run the ball into the end zone than throw it because of the really tight confines of goal line field position. As for the league being a passing league, I still see the DB’s hands all over the receivers past the five yard-line and you get six points whether you pass it in or run it in.
Since I really don’t know who is making the decisions within the Giants organization, I can’t say who is at fault with forcing Coughlin to go to the west coast offense. So, I blame both Jerry and John. If John wasn’t the owner, he should be fired, too. Whoever wrote to him telling him he should fire himself was correct in doing so. Looking back, Coughlin should have quit right then and there. He knew the offensive scheme wasn’t the problem. He should not have gone along with it.
It really sucks, man.
Even if he had just started through the end of this season and next season, he would have had 231 consecutive starts, which would have been 4th on the all-time list.
At least he still ends with the 2nd most ever for a QB and he did end up with more than Peyton, so there will always be that I suppose.
I found it strange that the Giants’ front office and ownership wanted to change the offense. They had a precise blueprint on how to win a super bowl with the quarterback they had. Why change it to something else?
I think McAdoo presented it as an offense you can run with. In fairness to McAdoo, it is hard to run behind that OL, and when you have average RB's (although I do like Gallman).
Eli is getting first class PR due to mismanagement of the situation. He's no big martyr.
I'm not sure I understand the point you're trying to make. All I said is that I care about the Giants as an organization. That the Giants have been a large part of my life for 50+ years and as a result, yes, I have an emotional attachment to HOW they do things. I do have an emotional reaction when I think the Giants organization are being assholes. I do have an emotional reaction when I believe the head coach intentionally tried to cause disruption with Manning.
Not sure what your point is about Webster - but it seems sort of stupid. If I am not happy about John Mara that means I must not be capable of caring about a player who became a homeless hobo as you put it?
So is your point that I'm fucked up because the Giants have been part of my life for 50+ years? Or because I LIKED it when I thought the Giants ownership had class and character? That I get upset to hear that McAdoo apparently felt it was appropriate to tell Manning he wasn't starting in a QB meeting with other players present rather than have a private conversation?
Well, sorry, but I do get angry and upset at those things. Maybe the Giants are just the same as some movie actor or something for you. But, as I've said, they have been a part of my persona for 50+ years. While I'm not a "gaga" type of fan... I don't have placards on my car... I don't own Giants gear... I don't wave flags or wear hats... what I have done is not missed a single snap of a Giants game in 50 years... I won't go to a game live (despite being offered seats)... and I won't watch with anyone else in the room... I won't attend family or business events... and all family and friends know exactly where I am when the Giants game is on ... they know I won't answer the phone ... won't leave the house ... won't respond to a text... they all email me after a significant event and ask me what is going on in Giants world...
And that has been my life for 50+ years.
So, yea, the Giants are a big part of who I am.
And, so, yea, I happen to have emotional reactions (anger in this case) when the Giants organization doesn't act classy. When the organization treats one of its great ambassadors (if not the greatest) like a pile of rotten shit.
Sorry. That's just me. And isn't going to change. Like I said... I'm not some fucking robot who can just turn it on and turn it off.
One of the reasons I've loved the Giants is because of my perception (perhaps deluded perception) that it has been a classy organization - a class act.
Quote:
I found it strange that the Giants’ front office and ownership wanted to change the offense. They had a precise blueprint on how to win a super bowl with the quarterback they had. Why change it to something else?
I think McAdoo presented it as an offense you can run with. In fairness to McAdoo, it is hard to run behind that OL, and when you have average RB's (although I do like Gallman).
It is a horrible system that does not work for the QB that we have. The mistake was trying to turn Eli into something that he isn't. I would have preferred to bring Killdrive out of retirement.
Personally I think your post is altogether horrendous trash and embarrassing if you've been alive for 50 years or more. You seem to infer a lot from my point of this around judgement which seems fairly imaginary on your part.
It all goes back to Reese's outside in building of this team or rebuilding. While football changes from time to time, it is still a league where you have to run the ball to be successful. I'm not sure why this is so difficult to understand. Even way back when SF and Bill Walsh brought in the WC offense, they were very good when they ran the ball well. When they didn't, they did not go very far.
To be successful in the NFL does not take rocket science.
It is a horrible system that does not work for the QB that we have. The mistake was trying to turn Eli into something that he isn't. I would have preferred to bring Killdrive out of retirement.
Oh I agree, but if you look back to when the Giants were interviewing HC candidates, Eli was coming off of 2 of his best seasons, and with a McAdoo offense. At the time, we didn't know how much influence TC had on that offense, and while I would have hoped the FO would have had a better idea, my guess is that they didn't.
So they hired the guy who ran an offense that Eli flourished in. I can understand them doing that, but I don't think they took other aspects into account, like his complete lack of presence. I hope they've learned their lesson, but I fear they haven't.
Quote:
I found it strange that the Giants’ front office and ownership wanted to change the offense. They had a precise blueprint on how to win a super bowl with the quarterback they had. Why change it to something else?
I think McAdoo presented it as an offense you can run with. In fairness to McAdoo, it is hard to run behind that OL, and when you have average RB's (although I do like Gallman).
Why do you say that?
Before Sullivan took over the Giants we're passing the ball about 66 percent of the time. Also, one of the premises of the WCO is ball control using short passes.
At this point, there are many variations of the WCO. When I think WCO, I think Bill Walsh and Joe Montana. Their running game was usually not very good. They got it done with precise passing based on timing.
Regardless how it was sold, it was a bad choice.
The other thing that annoyed me was McAdoo stated very definitively that he would build his offense around his personnel. He would not try to force his offense to work with the players he had. But as the years went on, it didn't appear he was doing that. I think Sullivan has been trying to do that. The offense looks more Coughlin-Gilbride like since he took over play calling duties.
Forcing the offense on the players was one of the gripes the fan base was having with Gilbride.
Heartbreaking stuff.
Heartbreaking stuff.
"We'll get through this... [sniff, sniff]...We'll get through this..."