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Geno/Reese Theory

mac attack : 12/6/2017 8:48 am
This is just me spitballing here, but hear me out.

Reese had been with the franchise for over 20 years. He has seen pretty much everything with the Giants; the highest highs and some pretty low lows.

Is there any chance in your mind that one of Reese's goals was to see an African American QB start a game for NYG? I mean its pretty embarrassing as it is that the Giants never had a black starter in 2017. But do you see anyway that there was a motive to start Geno before he got shown the door? I am not trying to make this political or offensive, merely just a theory that may or may not make sense.
Has nothing to do with it  
Rflairr : 12/6/2017 8:49 am : link
Mara said it was all McAdoo’s idea
no  
rocco8112 : 12/6/2017 8:49 am : link
.
No..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 12/6/2017 8:50 am : link
it was Mac looking to get Geno on the field, not Reese.

From what we've heard this week, Mac really wanted geno to play as early as week 5.
I think you're on to something.  
RottenApple : 12/6/2017 8:51 am : link
I'm pretty sure I saw Reese kneeling during the anthem on Sunday.
I don't think it's embarrasing that the Giants haven't had a black  
BrettNYG10 : 12/6/2017 8:51 am : link
Starting QB.

Five other teams started their first post-Eli.
RE: No..  
BrettNYG10 : 12/6/2017 8:52 am : link
In comment 13727132 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
it was Mac looking to get Geno on the field, not Reese.

From what we've heard this week, Mac really wanted geno to play as early as week 5.


Really? JFC.
If so, why would he choose a  
idiotsavant : 12/6/2017 8:53 am : link
Personality like Geno?

I mean, that's not how you open peoples minds.

Assuming they need to be opened. Which they don't .
Holy Shit Snacks  
ATL_Giants : 12/6/2017 8:54 am : link
 :/
there's a lot of stupid shit said here. Reese wants to keep his job  
Victor in CT : 12/6/2017 8:59 am : link
win. Period.
NO  
Alwaysblue22 : 12/6/2017 9:01 am : link
Geno Smith was Mack's idea and not Jerry's. Mack never wanted Eli to run his WCO. He thought Eli did not have the ability to extend plays or play in a "dirty" pocket.That was why he took public swipes at Eli for some loses. He put in Smith against the Raiders because he knew he was getting fired and was hoping to prove that his view of Eli being the problem was correct. Smith played well but also showed that even a mobile QB cannot play behind this wretched O-line. So the result was the same. Reese had a blind spot for evaluating, drafting or acquiring Offensive linemen and linebackers. The decline of this team had really nothing to do with either Mack or ELi... as Mara said when they axed TC.. Jerry knows this is on him. Reese did not fill out this roster properly....PERIOD.
RE: No..  
ron mexico : 12/6/2017 9:02 am : link
In comment 13727132 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
it was Mac looking to get Geno on the field, not Reese.

From what we've heard this week, Mac really wanted geno to play as early as week 5.


What Are you basing this on?

one line in a post game presser?
if your theory is remotely valid....  
George from PA : 12/6/2017 9:04 am : link
Reese would never have been a good scout...let alone a good GM.
Really?  
ij_reilly : 12/6/2017 9:05 am : link
This is probably the stupidest post I've ever seen on BBI.
Not from a presser...  
FatMan in Charlotte : 12/6/2017 9:08 am : link
Quote:
What Are you basing this on?

one line in a post game presser?


There've been reports this week from the beat writers that Mac had been trying to get Geno playing time, believing Eli was the problem with the offense.

Which is inline with the odd decision not to give Webb practice reps and the situation we we're left with in eli's benching where it was Geno coming in instead of Webb.
This is a wild conspiracy theory  
Emil : 12/6/2017 9:22 am : link
I'm sure you mean no harm by it, but to insinuate that Geno earned a start because the African American GM wanted to have an African American QB start for the first time in franchise history is an insult to Jerry Reese's 23 years of service to the organization.
We should have  
Doomster : 12/6/2017 9:25 am : link
signed RG III when we had the chance......

I mean, seriously?
the problem is that everybody already knew what Geno Smith is  
Victor in CT : 12/6/2017 9:46 am : link
athletic, big arm, small mind turnover machine. He showed them all during and after the game. Apparently McAdoo never received that scouting report.
First of all  
Matt in SGS : 12/6/2017 11:35 am : link
no, this has nothing to do with it.

Secondly, it's been clearly apparent that McAdoo didn't like Eli as a player. He felt Eli was holding back what he wanted out of the QB to be mobile. When everyone was shitting on Flowers as a left tackle, McAdoo's response was "no QB plays with a clean pocket, so Eli will need to be better". McAdoo wanted another Aaron Rodgers, who could move and make plays. Guess what, every team wants Aaron Rodgers. Eli was always a pocket passer. So with the skills he had to work with, McAdoo ran his playbook as if he had the original Tecmo Bowl game on Nintendo, about 6 plays. And if Odell didn't out run a single high safety, they never scored.

In reading Mara's comments, even after he fired Reese and McAdoo, he made it clear he wants to win games. And they were fired because they didn't win games. McAdoo decided to double down with that challenge and decided that if he's getting fired because he needs to win, then he wants Geno instead of Eli, because Geno can move around a bit more.

As McAdoo showed in his time here, he had zero understanding of the world around him, and in New York as well. When he showed up in that suit that didn't fit in his initial presser, the laughs at him were in hindsight warranted. He didn't have a fucking clue. So if he's told to win a game, then fine, I will do it with Geno.

Reese's tied his wagon to McAdoo either way. If he had any chance to make that pick next April, the Giants needed to win. So he and McAdoo made the move to bench Eli because they really felt that Geno gave them a better chance to win. Period. Not because they were trying to start the first black QB before they go and draft a Darnold or Rosen and see another 10+ years of a QB. They tried a hail mary to save their jobs, and dragged down an all time great Giant and the Giants organization name. That's why they were both fired now and not at the end of the year. Mara knew with 3 home games remaining it was going to be a complete shitshow at MetLife for whoever decided to show up.

I went to the last games with Handley at coach at home, in both 1991 and 1992. In both games, the Giants actually won (beating Houston and then Kansas City). Both times the fans came to boo Handley, not cheer the team, and we all left kind of pissed to see the Giants win. That was going to be the last 3 games this year and Mara pulled the plug.
RE: This is a wild conspiracy theory  
Section331 : 12/6/2017 11:36 am : link
In comment 13727214 Emil said:
Quote:
I'm sure you mean no harm by it, but to insinuate that Geno earned a start because the African American GM wanted to have an African American QB start for the first time in franchise history is an insult to Jerry Reese's 23 years of service to the organization.


You said it much more politely than I would have, but yes, you are entirely correct.
This off-season is gonna  
Modus Operandi : 12/6/2017 11:58 am : link
Be so awesome.
RE: First of all  
SMitch2 : 12/6/2017 2:07 pm : link
In comment 13727500 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
no, this has nothing to do with it.

Secondly, it's been clearly apparent that McAdoo didn't like Eli as a player. He felt Eli was holding back what he wanted out of the QB to be mobile. When everyone was shitting on Flowers as a left tackle, McAdoo's response was "no QB plays with a clean pocket, so Eli will need to be better". McAdoo wanted another Aaron Rodgers, who could move and make plays. Guess what, every team wants Aaron Rodgers. Eli was always a pocket passer. So with the skills he had to work with, McAdoo ran his playbook as if he had the original Tecmo Bowl game on Nintendo, about 6 plays. And if Odell didn't out run a single high safety, they never scored.

In reading Mara's comments, even after he fired Reese and McAdoo, he made it clear he wants to win games. And they were fired because they didn't win games. McAdoo decided to double down with that challenge and decided that if he's getting fired because he needs to win, then he wants Geno instead of Eli, because Geno can move around a bit more.

As McAdoo showed in his time here, he had zero understanding of the world around him, and in New York as well. When he showed up in that suit that didn't fit in his initial presser, the laughs at him were in hindsight warranted. He didn't have a fucking clue. So if he's told to win a game, then fine, I will do it with Geno.

Reese's tied his wagon to McAdoo either way. If he had any chance to make that pick next April, the Giants needed to win. So he and McAdoo made the move to bench Eli because they really felt that Geno gave them a better chance to win. Period. Not because they were trying to start the first black QB before they go and draft a Darnold or Rosen and see another 10+ years of a QB. They tried a hail mary to save their jobs, and dragged down an all time great Giant and the Giants organization name. That's why they were both fired now and not at the end of the year. Mara knew with 3 home games remaining it was going to be a complete shitshow at MetLife for whoever decided to show up.

I went to the last games with Handley at coach at home, in both 1991 and 1992. In both games, the Giants actually won (beating Houston and then Kansas City). Both times the fans came to boo Handley, not cheer the team, and we all left kind of pissed to see the Giants win. That was going to be the last 3 games this year and Mara pulled the plug.


This is about the best summation of events that I've heard -- we don't know exactly what went down and how it went down (likely more will leak from players over the course of the next several months), but this seems to best fit with pressers and commentators (Bob Papa).

Although I'm just conjecturing, I would put money on a bet that part of Ben's animus toward Eli had to do with Eli asking pointed questions in the QB room that made Ben look foolish. It was a sub-pro level offense that Mac installed and he had no answers or adjustments (as evidenced by our inability to beat a cover 2 all last year). I wouldn't doubt that once Eli learned the whole offense, he started asking some pretty specific questions that Mac couldn't answer -- and like any incompetent, he resented it. Was Geno ever going to challenge his knowledge?
Personally I think they knew they were gone  
mdc1 : 12/6/2017 4:44 pm : link
but the Eli benching was more of a cheap shot to give them numbers that compared Geno's performance to Eli's. It did indict McAdoo's offense but it did not reflect on Eli's effectiveness and provided a data point around price (Eli's compensation and performance (his play) ratio. Beyond the emotional and love for Eli it was not a flattering thing for Eli. Good thing they have him back in next game to minimize the exposure.
It's crazy how far we all will go to fill in the blanks...  
Dan in the Springs : 12/6/2017 6:59 pm : link
in our own knowledge.

Let me ask you a question. If JR really wanted to start a black QB, why was his plan to start Eli, then go to the black QB at the half?

If McAdoo really knew he was going to be fired and wanted to prove that Eli was what was wrong with the offense, why did he have a plan to start Eli? Are we to suppose that Coach McAdoo was so determined to start someone other than Eli but clever enough to accomplish it by the roundabout process of "insulting Eli" with an offer to start and play only half a game?

I think if either was the case, they would have simply made a change without offering to have Eli play half the game.

But heck, I know that I don't know everything about what's really going on. It seems too many here don't recognize the same.
RE: It's crazy how far we all will go to fill in the blanks...  
mdc1 : 12/6/2017 7:46 pm : link
In comment 13728344 Dan in the Springs said:
Quote:
in our own knowledge.

Let me ask you a question. If JR really wanted to start a black QB, why was his plan to start Eli, then go to the black QB at the half?

If McAdoo really knew he was going to be fired and wanted to prove that Eli was what was wrong with the offense, why did he have a plan to start Eli? Are we to suppose that Coach McAdoo was so determined to start someone other than Eli but clever enough to accomplish it by the roundabout process of "insulting Eli" with an offer to start and play only half a game?

I think if either was the case, they would have simply made a change without offering to have Eli play half the game.

But heck, I know that I don't know everything about what's really going on. It seems too many here don't recognize the same.


Do you really think McAdoo was expecting the wheels to fall off this season? It happened so quickly and he was under the weight of the criticism wheel. Reese himself has also been critical of Eli consistency over the years. They (Reese/McAddo) had to DO SOMETHING to keep their jobs, Eli did not go along with the game and their plan backfired. As I have said many times on this board, Eli is the real boss of the head coach. Just look at what happened. Sometimes power is held beyond organizational trees and titles. Ever wonder why TC eventually never criticized Eli, he knew who was the real boss with power.
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