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NFT: What am I missing with Bryce Harper and Machado?

Spirit of '86 : 12/9/2017 10:47 pm
With Stanton coming question has been asked about Harper and Machado.
Is there room for them. I don’t get the Harper $400 million talk. He’s had one 30+ HR 90+ RBI year. Why all the fuss? Very good player. But that kind of $? Machado has had 3 30+ HR years in a row and is great fielder but no 100+ RBI years. I’d these guys are worth $300-$400 mil what are Sanchez and Judge worth? Can’t see Yankees going after either. Stanton is a steal at net $265 compared to them.
Youth, good plate discipline, and production.  
robbieballs2003 : 12/9/2017 10:54 pm : link
I totally understand what you are saying. How many players have really been worth these crazy contracts? Very few. Most seem to be an albatross. I don't know how anybody can find fault with what the Yanks did today.
Harper  
old man : 12/10/2017 12:48 am : link
is a butthole and turning into a china doll; Machado is mostly just a crazy butthole.
How many OFs do you need?
How many guys do you want that will force a manager to lose the locker room, and in the case of those 2, there will be lots of jealousy if they do come, knowing they are THE 5,6,7th GUY and not THE GUY(but the money will still be good).
RE: Harper  
Del Shofner : 12/10/2017 1:06 am : link
In comment 13732134 old man said:
Quote:
is a butthole and turning into a china doll; Machado is mostly just a crazy butthole.


Important distinction, though.
Also, I am sure the Yanks were interested because  
robbieballs2003 : 12/10/2017 2:28 am : link
They are good players but I am also sure their agents want the Yanks interested to drive up the price like every other agent and player wants. When Harper is locked in there are few that compare. As someone pointed put, though, he has been injured and that has affected his numbers in certain seasons.

I don't know much more than that. I have heard he is an arrogant prick but I cannot speak to that. If true, the Yanks can stay away now. From my understanding not only is Stanton a hell of an offensive player but he is a very good fielder and supposedly a great locker room guy. This team seems like it is full of quality people so there is no reason to disrupt that now especially with the talent they have. Every team always wants high character guys but it isn't always possible. The Yanks seem to have done that.
The Yankees  
mdthedream : 12/10/2017 7:45 am : link
are all set and if they can shed a little more bad contracts this is a awesome trade.Seeing what the cost of the other players will be.
not to beat the sabermetrics drum  
Matt in SGS : 12/10/2017 8:31 am : link
but RBIs is a terrible stat to judge how good a hitter is. Old school said 100 RBIs was the mark. But an RBI is all about the guys hitting in front of you. What if the rest of those hitters sucked and they rarely got on base, or in scoring position? The right way to look at RBIs is related to opportunity. What if a guy gets up and he only has a man in scoring position (when you get your RBIs) only 80 times in a season. And he knocks them in for 70. But another guy has 100 RBIs, but he had an opportunity with guys on 175 times. The 100 RBI guy wasn't as good as the 70 RBI guy.

Same idea as looking at wins as a pitcher.

Machado is more clearly the Yankees target because he would represent a clear upgrade from what they have and will have in the pipeline at 3rd base.

I don't think Harper really seriously considers the Yankees, other than Boras to have a team to leverage.
I agree the salaries are insane  
mavric : 12/10/2017 8:31 am : link
Unless a team doesn't mind paying the luxury tax and willing to handcuff themselves to an albatross contract, it makes no sense.

With that said, I'd still like to see Machado in pinstripes locking down 3rd base, but not at those prices. We have to save money to lockup Judge and Sanchez for the next decade. Plus, if Bird breaks out and hits like he was expected to hit, he will also demand huge bucks.

Teams are smarting up, in part because of the disasters that the Yanks went through with insane contracts to A-Rod, CC, etc. I don't think Hal will be as loose with money as his father was. In short: would love Machado, but don't see it happening unless a sweet deal falls in their lap.
I don't know how they get to $400 million  
allstarjim : 12/10/2017 9:37 am : link
But Harper had a 9.9 WAR in 2015. I know 2016 wasn't great, but then he bounced back with a big year this year that probably would've been closer to what he did in 2015 if he hadn't been injured. But 2015, a .330 average, .460 OBP, 1.109 OPS, 42 homeruns, and a nearly 1:1 BB/K ratio (124 BBs to 131 Ks)...that was a pretty spectacular season, and if you think he can repeat that kind of season, or come pretty close, absolutely he's getting record money. A lot will depend on this next year in terms of whether he just gets big money or record-setting money.

And let me say this...Harper is a better hitter overall than Stanton. His best is better than Stanton's best, it's pretty inarguable. Stanton is a better HR-hitter, to be sure, and there's great value in that, and that statement doesn't diminish Stanton as a player. He is the closest thing to being able to call the HR before it happens since Bonds' 73 HR season.
Also  
allstarjim : 12/10/2017 9:38 am : link
Harper is three years younger than Stanton.
I'm not suggesting the Yankees should sign either  
pjcas18 : 12/10/2017 9:42 am : link
but it's just not often you find superstars (and both Harper and Machado easily qualify as superstars even with Machado's sub-standard 2017) become available for "just" money.

they won't cost prospects, they're major league ready, they're at or among the best in their respective positions, and they're young.

that's what you're missing.
relative to what Harper will command next offseason  
PaulBlakeTSU : 12/10/2017 9:42 am : link
Stanton was a cheap contract.
RE: relative to what Harper will command next offseason  
pjcas18 : 12/10/2017 9:50 am : link
In comment 13732290 PaulBlakeTSU said:
Quote:
Stanton was a cheap contract.


agree, if he stays healthy, though now more than before, I expect Stanton to opt out. doesn't change that the Yankees made a no-brainer trade, only changes how long it's a "cheap" contract IMO.
Shocked if Harper doesn't end up in CHI or LA  
Bobby Humphrey's Earpad : 12/10/2017 10:29 am : link
Boras drives this bus, and both teams can afford him. Cubs makes a lot of sense, but they'd need to get rid of Heyward's contract. SF was in for Stanton, so not shocked if they are in the running as ell.
If businesses will no longer be allowed to write off  
MetsAreBack : 12/10/2017 11:30 am : link
Entertainment expenses .... none of these guys is getting $400 million.

Harper is probably staying in Washington regardless
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