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Eli to start rest of season

AnskyJK : 12/10/2017 11:53 am
Reports this morning that the plan is for Eli to start rest of season. I was part of the camp like most that obviously did not think they handled Eli situation well. With that said, I fully support Macs intention of evaluating guys when you're 2-10. You got to Davis Webb an opportunity here. Some will say he's not ready- so what? It will help accelerate his development.
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You play to win the game  
jbeintherockies : 12/10/2017 11:58 am : link
.
It's possible that the Giants  
Jay on the Island : 12/10/2017 12:01 pm : link
don't think Webb is close to being ready to start or that he just hasn't progressed as hoped.
Like Mara had a choice?  
MOOPS : 12/10/2017 12:04 pm : link
The tar was warming up and the feathers were gathered.
Don't Think This Rules Out Webb  
clatterbuck : 12/10/2017 12:05 pm : link
getting some snaps if/when Giants think he's ready.
Good chance this takes us out of a top 2 draft pick  
MetsAreBack : 12/10/2017 12:06 pm : link
Fucking idiots. The streak is over at this point... so this became stupid. They're just doing it to placate the fans - which is not how to run a team - and maybe to try and patch things up with Eli but elis not an idiot, he knows this was Mara's idea to begin with damage is probably already done.
RE: It's possible that the Giants  
mfsd : 12/10/2017 12:08 pm : link
In comment 13732462 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
don't think Webb is close to being ready to start or that he just hasn't progressed as hoped.


Yup, plus maybe they don’t want him playing behind backups on the OL and throwing to practice squad guys at WR
RE: RE: It's possible that the Giants  
Jimmy Googs : 12/10/2017 12:09 pm : link
In comment 13732474 mfsd said:
Quote:
In comment 13732462 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


don't think Webb is close to being ready to start or that he just hasn't progressed as hoped.



Yup, plus maybe they don’t want him playing behind backups on the OL and throwing to practice squad guys at WR


but fuck it...let Eli do it
...  
christian : 12/10/2017 12:09 pm : link
Manning was going to start the whole season until he decided he didn't want to - how that's missed on anyone is confusing to me.
sounds like Webb isn't what they thought he'd be  
micky : 12/10/2017 12:14 pm : link
heck he can't even win backup spot
.  
arcarsenal : 12/10/2017 12:15 pm : link
How does anyone know that starting Webb right now will "accelerate" his development? It could be the opposite if he's not prepared - especially with arena league WR's and this offensive line.

Why is that different with Eli? Gee, I don't know - maybe because he has well over a decade of NFL experience?
I guess the Giants are tanking by putting Eli  
NYSports1 : 12/10/2017 12:16 pm : link
in to start for the rest of the season....Good job now we can assure of top 2 pick
RE: sounds like Webb isn't what they thought he'd be  
christian : 12/10/2017 12:16 pm : link
In comment 13732482 micky said:
Quote:
heck he can't even win backup spot


It's not been a typical 2 weeks. The chaos of Eli 'benching' and then the coaches being fired is undoubtedly cauisng a hiccup in planning.

By the last quarter of the season Webb will be getting reps at #2, I have no doubt.
How do you know it will slow it down?  
Jimmy Googs : 12/10/2017 12:16 pm : link
...
RE: RE: RE: It's possible that the Giants  
mfsd : 12/10/2017 12:17 pm : link
In comment 13732475 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In comment 13732474 mfsd said:


Quote:


In comment 13732462 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


don't think Webb is close to being ready to start or that he just hasn't progressed as hoped.



Yup, plus maybe they don’t want him playing behind backups on the OL and throwing to practice squad guys at WR



but fuck it...let Eli do it


Well, obviously there’s more to the equation than that with Eli - I agree with the idea the Giants want to save face with Eli to try and keep the door open to keep him here next year.

Just saying part of it could likely be they don’t think Webb is ready given all the factors
Playing Eli and grooming Webb  
Earl the goat : 12/10/2017 12:17 pm : link
Is the right thing to do. Let Eli play next year and continue to groom Webb another year. The guy has the tools and the intelligence to be a starting QB

Giants should trade down and acquire draft picks with their high number one pick
This is more of an indictment  
bluesince56 : 12/10/2017 12:18 pm : link
of Ben and Jerry. Why wasn’t Webb given more snaps during the season? Once they went 0-5 they should have worked to get him more practice time. Geno was not the future of this team. Just pure incompetence!
.  
arcarsenal : 12/10/2017 12:22 pm : link
Webb was not supposed to play at all this season. People keep forgetting that. The coaches were not preparing him to play this year. Talks of him playing only started a couple weeks ago.

It's like people just assume there's no learning curve at all for rookie QB's. Webb was thought to be a project from the day we drafted him. No one had him pegged as a guy who could just step right in and play. But now all of a sudden, several fans think he can.

This is a terrible situation to put a young kid in, especially if you feel he's more of a project.
Its almost Christmas  
Jimmy Googs : 12/10/2017 12:23 pm : link
look at the calendar...
RE: Playing Eli and grooming Webb  
micky : 12/10/2017 12:24 pm : link
In comment 13732494 Earl the goat said:
Quote:
Is the right thing to do. Let Eli play next year and continue to groom Webb another year. The guy has the tools and the intelligence to be a starting QB

Giants should trade down and acquire draft picks with their high number one pick


so Webb will not see any playing time or see the field til 2020? sounds about right
you saw how the OL  
crick n NC : 12/10/2017 12:26 pm : link
played last week without Eli there to check in and out of plays and call out protections
I was on the play Webb bandwagon  
mrvax : 12/10/2017 12:29 pm : link
but now I'm thinking differently. I believe that no matter how good/bad Webb plays, it will not stop the Giants drafting the best QB they can get next April.

If that's true, just let Webb & the draft pick battle it out through camp.
RE: You play to win the game  
baadbill : 12/10/2017 12:29 pm : link
In comment 13732457 jbeintherockies said:
Quote:
.


Why?
Says who?
What does that even mean?

So, let's assume the Giants have the 2nd pick in the draft and select a QB in 2018... and they have been mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, under your scenario they are **not allowed** to start their new QB to give him some game time?

So, teams that have made the playoffs and their position is locked - can't be changed - they are obligated to play their starters? And you think teams that have done otherwise many, many times in the past should be what? Fined?

And - we all know the answer to that is: "Of course that would be ok." (if that isn't the answer, then explain yourself)

And how is the above any different than having Webb play these last 3-4 games so he gets some valuable experience and the Giants get some game film on him?

I say you play the players you need to play that is best for your organization - and then expect those players to "play to win the game" (i.e. no player or coach should ever be on the field **trying to lose**)

But who you decide to dress or start - so long as its done for purpose of evaluating your talent or giving them playing time - is entirely legitimate.
Almost all Giants fans  
joeinpa : 12/10/2017 12:30 pm : link
Are big Eli fans. Some are more Eli fans than Giants fans, if we are to believe their comments about rooting for Eli to come back and beat the Giants.

But at 2-9 and Eli a part of the poor play, I m having trouble relating to the idea that some aggregious wrong had be perpetuated.

I get the optics of who did it, I even get how bad the Giants looked in the process.

But because of Eli s stature I don t see any scenerio where the move would have gone smoothly.

Eli made it pretty clear he s not ok with sharing time, so, what should they have done.

Don t see how you can be in the camp that Webb should play, and be outraged at Mara for what he wanted to do.
RE: .  
baadbill : 12/10/2017 12:32 pm : link
In comment 13732502 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Webb was not supposed to play at all this season. People keep forgetting that. The coaches were not preparing him to play this year. Talks of him playing only started a couple weeks ago.

It's like people just assume there's no learning curve at all for rookie QB's. Webb was thought to be a project from the day we drafted him. No one had him pegged as a guy who could just step right in and play. But now all of a sudden, several fans think he can.

This is a terrible situation to put a young kid in, especially if you feel he's more of a project.


arc, how could letting him play the last 3 games not be good for his development? You think letting him getting the reps in practice and game time experience over the last 3 games would **hurt** him?

I don't see how game time experience - with appropriate preparation and planning - isn't always valuable.
Playing Webb is a useless exercise  
BillT : 12/10/2017 12:33 pm : link
First, you aren't learning anything about him with this kind of talent (or lack thereof) around him. Second, if you have a conviction about one of the top QBs in the draft you have to take him regardless (See: Browns, Cleveland).
RE: Playing Webb is a useless exercise  
baadbill : 12/10/2017 12:37 pm : link
In comment 13732530 BillT said:
Quote:
First, you aren't learning anything about him with this kind of talent (or lack thereof) around him. Second, if you have a conviction about one of the top QBs in the draft you have to take him regardless (See: Browns, Cleveland).


I agree the Giants should definitely draft a QB regardless of what Webb does.

But wouldn't developing a game plan for Webb and practicing it all week - and then starting him and having him play the entirety of the last three games - provide him with invaluable experience? And who would it hurt to do that? Why **wouldn't** the Giants want to do that?

You wouldn't do it if your on a campaign to save face for Eli  
Jimmy Googs : 12/10/2017 12:40 pm : link
and you're an organization that has lost complete focus...
RE: Good chance this takes us out of a top 2 draft pick  
section125 : 12/10/2017 12:41 pm : link
In comment 13732473 MetsAreBack said:
Quote:
Fucking idiots. The streak is over at this point... so this became stupid. They're just doing it to placate the fans - which is not how to run a team - and maybe to try and patch things up with Eli but elis not an idiot, he knows this was Mara's idea to begin with damage is probably already done.


Yeah because Eli has been lights out this year. Besides the line isn't fixed, in fact it is worse; he has nobody to throw to; defense is a shell in the back 7.

They may luck into a win and will not have anything to do with Eli starting.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 12/10/2017 12:41 pm : link
In comment 13732525 baadbill said:
Quote:
In comment 13732502 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


Webb was not supposed to play at all this season. People keep forgetting that. The coaches were not preparing him to play this year. Talks of him playing only started a couple weeks ago.

It's like people just assume there's no learning curve at all for rookie QB's. Webb was thought to be a project from the day we drafted him. No one had him pegged as a guy who could just step right in and play. But now all of a sudden, several fans think he can.

This is a terrible situation to put a young kid in, especially if you feel he's more of a project.



arc, how could letting him play the last 3 games not be good for his development? You think letting him getting the reps in practice and game time experience over the last 3 games would **hurt** him?

I don't see how game time experience - with appropriate preparation and planning - isn't always valuable.


It's a terrible situation to put a young kid in - especially one considered a project.

You'd be playing him under an interim HC, with very few weapons and bad pass protection.

How much better do people think Davis Webb is going to be going forward if he plays in 3-4 games where he's running for his life on the majority of his pass attempts?

I really don't see Webb benefitting a whole lot by playing in this situation.
Is Webb going to get a chance to play next season?  
Dave in Hoboken : 12/10/2017 12:43 pm : link
We're obviously drafting a QB in the first round in the draft, no matter what spot we have. So, if Eli is back, and is going to be mentoring that top pick....where does that leave Webb?

If he doesn't play these last 4 games, which he isn't, he's pretty much a wasted draft pick by a GM that drafted him who is no longer here.

Shocker.  
Britt in VA : 12/10/2017 12:43 pm : link
.
So, basically, Webb is in no-man's land.  
Dave in Hoboken : 12/10/2017 12:43 pm : link
.
Giants apparently think it’s 2007  
jeff57 : 12/10/2017 12:45 pm : link
Instead of 2017
arc  
baadbill : 12/10/2017 12:46 pm : link
Quote:
How much better do people think Davis Webb is going to be going forward if he plays in 3-4 games where he's running for his life on the majority of his pass attempts?


If that was the outcome, I'd agree. But I have to assume a professional coaching staff is capable to preparing a game plan and scheme - designed for a young QB - to offset the difficulties of the OL. Even if it is running the ball 70% of the time - which allows him to throw the ball 30% of the time without a big rush ... gives him game time experience ... that Manning doesn't need and he does.

Shit - what else are these fucking games good for?
Another wasted third round pick  
jeff57 : 12/10/2017 12:46 pm : link
.
Right move  
Go Terps : 12/10/2017 12:48 pm : link
Anyone calling for Webb to start, or worse, for the Giants to tank, hasn't been understanding what they've been watching since they started following football.
Some people just can't accept that Webb isn't ready....  
Britt in VA : 12/10/2017 12:49 pm : link
Despite every indication supporting exactly that.
RE: arc  
Dave in Hoboken : 12/10/2017 12:51 pm : link
In comment 13732563 baadbill said:
Quote:


Quote:


How much better do people think Davis Webb is going to be going forward if he plays in 3-4 games where he's running for his life on the majority of his pass attempts?



If that was the outcome, I'd agree. But I have to assume a professional coaching staff is capable to preparing a game plan and scheme - designed for a young QB - to offset the difficulties of the OL. Even if it is running the ball 70% of the time - which allows him to throw the ball 30% of the time without a big rush ... gives him game time experience ... that Manning doesn't need and he does.

Shit - what else are these fucking games good for?


Nothing. These games are completely worthless and meaningless.
wrong move  
GiantsFan84 : 12/10/2017 12:51 pm : link
let the mismanagement continue
RE: Right move  
baadbill : 12/10/2017 12:53 pm : link
In comment 13732567 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Anyone calling for Webb to start, or worse, for the Giants to tank, hasn't been understanding what they've been watching since they started following football.


What are you implying? That it affects the real interests? The betting line?
RE: arc  
arcarsenal : 12/10/2017 12:53 pm : link
In comment 13732563 baadbill said:
Quote:


Quote:


How much better do people think Davis Webb is going to be going forward if he plays in 3-4 games where he's running for his life on the majority of his pass attempts?



If that was the outcome, I'd agree. But I have to assume a professional coaching staff is capable to preparing a game plan and scheme - designed for a young QB - to offset the difficulties of the OL. Even if it is running the ball 70% of the time - which allows him to throw the ball 30% of the time without a big rush ... gives him game time experience ... that Manning doesn't need and he does.

Shit - what else are these fucking games good for?


Point is - I just don't think he's ready to play. And if that's the case, there's nothing to gain by forcing the issue.

McAdoo wasn't preparing him to play this year. None of this really started until a few weeks ago. Geno was still ahead of him on the depth chart.

I think fans want to see Webb more because it could give them something to feel good about if he makes a few plays, but aren't realizing that if the plan was not for him to play this year and he wasn't being prepared to play for 3/4 of the season, it's probably not beneficial to put him out there.

I don't think it helps him or anyone else.
If/When the Phila game gets out of hand next week, we'll see  
Tom in NY : 12/10/2017 12:55 pm : link
if they go back to the original plan of letting the other 2 QBs play.

I pray for Eli's health with the Oline he's working with, vs. the Phil and Dallas pass rush
RE: RE: arc  
baadbill : 12/10/2017 12:58 pm : link
In comment 13732576 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 13732563 baadbill said:


Quote:




Quote:


How much better do people think Davis Webb is going to be going forward if he plays in 3-4 games where he's running for his life on the majority of his pass attempts?



If that was the outcome, I'd agree. But I have to assume a professional coaching staff is capable to preparing a game plan and scheme - designed for a young QB - to offset the difficulties of the OL. Even if it is running the ball 70% of the time - which allows him to throw the ball 30% of the time without a big rush ... gives him game time experience ... that Manning doesn't need and he does.

Shit - what else are these fucking games good for?



Point is - I just don't think he's ready to play. And if that's the case, there's nothing to gain by forcing the issue.

McAdoo wasn't preparing him to play this year. None of this really started until a few weeks ago. Geno was still ahead of him on the depth chart.

I think fans want to see Webb more because it could give them something to feel good about if he makes a few plays, but aren't realizing that if the plan was not for him to play this year and he wasn't being prepared to play for 3/4 of the season, it's probably not beneficial to put him out there.

I don't think it helps him or anyone else.


This shouldn't be a situation where they are suddenly thinking about this for the first time now. And if it is - then the entire organization - from owners on down to ball boys - suck the big wazoo in an indescribable way. Talk about incompetence.
They're not.  
Britt in VA : 12/10/2017 12:59 pm : link
The plan has always been for him to sit, since the day they drafted him.

Both Reese and Ross are quoted as saying so.
C.J. Beathard was drafted after Webb  
jeff57 : 12/10/2017 12:59 pm : link
And has played. There’s no reason Webb can’t. They just don’t want him to. All the other excuses are bogus.
RE: C.J. Beathard was drafted after Webb  
arcarsenal : 12/10/2017 1:03 pm : link
In comment 13732595 jeff57 said:
Quote:
And has played. There’s no reason Webb can’t. They just don’t want him to. All the other excuses are bogus.


If he's not ready to play, he shouldn't play.

Some of you guys seem to just think every young QB should play regardless of preparedness or circumstances.

That's not how it works.
RE: They're not.  
baadbill : 12/10/2017 1:03 pm : link
In comment 13732593 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
The plan has always been for him to sit, since the day they drafted him.

Both Reese and Ross are quoted as saying so.


Yea, and plans change. Shit, I was vocal about them being in trouble when they lost the opening game for the 3rd time in 4 years. And when they went 0-2 they were statistically speaking already pretty dead in the water from a playoffs standpoint. It didn't take many more games after that to know the season was a fucking disaster.


What doesn't change...  
Britt in VA : 12/10/2017 1:05 pm : link
is that if he's not ready, and they don't think he's ready, then he's not ready.
RE: .  
mitch300 : 12/10/2017 1:06 pm : link
In comment 13732502 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Webb was not supposed to play at all this season. People keep forgetting that. The coaches were not preparing him to play this year. Talks of him playing only started a couple weeks ago.

It's like people just assume there's no learning curve at all for rookie QB's. Webb was thought to be a project from the day we drafted him. No one had him pegged as a guy who could just step right in and play. But now all of a sudden, several fans think he can.

This is a terrible situation to put a young kid in, especially if you feel he's more of a project.

The Giants were also projected to be a playoff team and not a2-10 team. Things change. Nobody thought they would have a chance to draft in the top 5 either and have to make a decision to draft a QB in the first round.
RE: What doesn't change...  
baadbill : 12/10/2017 1:08 pm : link
In comment 13732608 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
is that if he's not ready, and they don't think he's ready, then he's not ready.


Britt, what does that mean "not ready"?

You can't mean physically, so you must mean mentally. He's a tad slow you're saying?
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