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NFT: MLB Winter Meetings Day 3

DaddyM89 : 12/13/2017 1:34 am
Things are starting to heat up on the hot stove:

-Machado and Ozuna are on the block. Look for the Cards to get one of them after losing out on Stanton.

- JD Martinez is down in Orlando negotiating with teams (my hunch is he goes to the Red Sox somewhere around 6 Years 170 Million.)

- After trading Headley on Tuesday, what is Cashmans next move. All signs seem to point to them trading for a cost controlled pitcher (Fulmer, Cole, Archer etc.) with their crop of prospects. That could be at the missing piece for a legit title run.

- Will the Mets finally do something? All ive seen from Mets fans is frustration the past two days, and I don't blame them one bit.

- Rumors of a possible Greinke trade also. That is a massive contract to move.

Should be a fun day.
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RE: Love to see the Mets  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 12:10 pm : link
In comment 13739046 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
still pursue Reed.

Familia, Ramos, Reed, Blevins, Swarzak is a bullpen you can win with. now as for the rotation, a lot of finger crossing and praying.

I did read that Familia is not the closer so no clue who is Ramos hasn't proven he can consistently close.


Agreed. I think the comments about closer were more that they are going to let multiple guys close, and not exclusively rely on Familia like Collins did. Which makes sense since they have Ramos. Familia needing to save 50+ games is not ideal. Collins ran him into the ground the past few years.
RE: Love to see the Mets  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 12:12 pm : link
In comment 13739046 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
still pursue Reed.

Familia, Ramos, Reed, Blevins, Swarzak is a bullpen you can win with. now as for the rotation, a lot of finger crossing and praying.

I did read that Familia is not the closer so no clue who is Ramos hasn't proven he can consistently close.


PJ,
Callaway suggested having no closer and going with matchups not that familia would be removed from the end of games. Sandy later backtracked and said its one such option is no set closer
.  
arcarsenal : 12/13/2017 12:17 pm : link
I like the idea of not necessarily forcing one specific guy into a closer role. Familia should still see most of the sv opps but I've felt for a few years now that it's sort of an antiquated approach to be so rigid about one guy always pitching the 9th inning.

Obviously if it's an elite closer like Jansen, that's one thing - but I like the way the Indians use Miller, who is their best reliever, but not their closer.
Eric  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 12:17 pm : link
Callaway is talking about using your best relievers in the highest leverage spots. It had nothing to do with workload. The idea would be seeing a guy like Familia face a big hitter or 2 in the 7th if need be ba waiting until the final 3 outs. The RP workload may even increase.
RE: Callaway's intended use of the bullpen, isnt this  
Chris684 : 12/13/2017 12:19 pm : link
what we've seen with the Indians the last 2 postseasons and how they utilized Miller?
Swarzaks  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 12:20 pm : link
Whip post May was 1.28 so presumably hitters caught on to his new weapon. Hopefully 1. He adjusts 2. NL hitters take time to do so
.  
arcarsenal : 12/13/2017 12:22 pm : link
Not just postseason - Cody Allen is their closer. They use Miller as a wild card in middle innings when the highest leverage spots present themselves. It's a good strategy if you have a capable closer like Allen even if Allen isn't their best reliever.

I think eventually, most teams will use a more flexible approach like this rather than having these specific guys drilled into "set up" and "closer" roles where managers won't use them anywhere else.
RE: RE: Callaway's intended use of the bullpen, isnt this  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 12:24 pm : link
In comment 13739062 Chris684 said:
Quote:
what we've seen with the Indians the last 2 postseasons and how they utilized Miller?


"Fluid roles depending on the situation" was how I took the comments.
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 12:25 pm : link
In comment 13739065 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Not just postseason - Cody Allen is their closer. They use Miller as a wild card in middle innings when the highest leverage spots present themselves. It's a good strategy if you have a capable closer like Allen even if Allen isn't their best reliever.

I think eventually, most teams will use a more flexible approach like this rather than having these specific guys drilled into "set up" and "closer" roles where managers won't use them anywhere else.


Right - this is how I understood it.
What is this team  
Rory : 12/13/2017 12:29 pm : link
doing about first base? Not feeling the warm and fuzzies over here with Dom Smith.

You cant succeed in this league without a adequate hitting first baseman.

RE: What is this team  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 12:30 pm : link
In comment 13739073 Rory said:
Quote:
doing about first base? Not feeling the warm and fuzzies over here with Dom Smith.

You cant succeed in this league without a adequate hitting first baseman.


Reportedly interested in Lind and horrific Napoli/Moreland.
Sure they'll do that during the regular  
pjcas18 : 12/13/2017 12:32 pm : link
season until the guy like AJ Ramos blows multiple games then they'll decide they need a reliable guy who can withstand the pressure and consistently close out games.

I don't think it's a rigid approach to have a closer, not everyone is suited to close. Maybe if you have multiple legit closer options like the Yankees (Chapman, Robertson, and Betances) then it's more realistic.

and it cost the Indians and almost cost the Cubs in the 2016 WS.

Miller and Chapman came in to pitch in "important" situations, shit the bed, and then they had to patchwork the rest of the game.
Normandin-  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 12:34 pm : link
Cardinals making progress on acquiring Marcell Ozuna
Man you know it's bad when we are excited about the two year deal and  
figgy2989 : 12/13/2017 12:35 pm : link
Saving the extra $2M per.

I really wish they would make a play on Hosmer. I know he is a Boras guy and the Mets are the butt of all his jokes, but he would really be a great addition to a pretty average lineup.
.  
arcarsenal : 12/13/2017 12:37 pm : link
Well, it's basically impossible to go through an entire season and nail your BP usage every time - eventually someone's going to blow a game, you just hope it doesn't happen in a critical spot and you try to maximize your odds.

I'm not advocating just using guys at random every night - I just don't think you necessarily have to designate one guy for a specific place and be resistant towards using him anywhere else.

The Mets shouldn't be against using Familia in the 7th inning if there's a pivotal point in the game where they feel he gives them the best chance of escaping a jam and keeping the game in their favor.
RE: Man you know it's bad when we are excited about the two year deal and  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 12:37 pm : link
In comment 13739080 figgy2989 said:
Quote:
Saving the extra $2M per.

I really wish they would make a play on Hosmer. I know he is a Boras guy and the Mets are the butt of all his jokes, but he would really be a great addition to a pretty average lineup.


Sandy and Boras are friendly. The public stuff is for show. The reason Hosmer wouldn't be a Met is straight economics not any issues with the agent.
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 12:38 pm : link
Jon Heyman of FanRag Sports reports that the Rockies are closing in on a deal to bring back Greg Holland.

When is Rule 5 Draft?  
Mike in NY : 12/13/2017 1:01 pm : link
Looking at the names available, Franmil Reyes is intriguing even if he is coming off a broken hamate bone in Arizonal Fall League. Also, Kohl Stewart was a high draft pick for a reason and his groundball tendencies can work out of the bullpen (plus gives the Mets another option if a starter gets hurt)
RE: RE: RE: I don't get Ellsbury  
Beer Man : 12/13/2017 1:04 pm : link
In comment 13739026 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 13738787 BigBlue4You09 said:


Quote:


In comment 13738774 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


He apparently doesn't want to leave. Who wants to stay on a team where they're rarely going to play?



A guy that's getting older and getting paid a ton


But he'll get paid regardless. If he doesn't want to play, just retire.
IMO, he's playing hardball. If he puts the yanks in a position of having to cut him, then he still collects what the Yanks owe him, plus what ever he can get signing with another team.
RE: .  
pjcas18 : 12/13/2017 1:05 pm : link
In comment 13739084 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
Well, it's basically impossible to go through an entire season and nail your BP usage every time - eventually someone's going to blow a game, you just hope it doesn't happen in a critical spot and you try to maximize your odds.

I'm not advocating just using guys at random every night - I just don't think you necessarily have to designate one guy for a specific place and be resistant towards using him anywhere else.

The Mets shouldn't be against using Familia in the 7th inning if there's a pivotal point in the game where they feel he gives them the best chance of escaping a jam and keeping the game in their favor.



I don't disagree in theory and certainly I'm not more qualified than Callaway to disagree even if I wanted to, just sounds a lot like the cliched "closer by committee" approach teams use when they don't have a legit closer and/or they have an injury to the closer.

getting to the 9th with a lead is the most important thing, but if they guy you have on the mound in the 9th can't seal the deal, what's the point?

I love the fact the Mets at least have a guy who thinks in the dugout this year and will not be predictable and traditional in his approach.
RE: When is Rule 5 Draft?  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 1:05 pm : link
In comment 13739113 Mike in NY said:
Quote:
Looking at the names available, Franmil Reyes is intriguing even if he is coming off a broken hamate bone in Arizonal Fall League. Also, Kohl Stewart was a high draft pick for a reason and his groundball tendencies can work out of the bullpen (plus gives the Mets another option if a starter gets hurt)


Tomorrow morning.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I don't get Ellsbury  
pjcas18 : 12/13/2017 1:05 pm : link
In comment 13739117 Beer Man said:
Quote:
In comment 13739026 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 13738787 BigBlue4You09 said:


Quote:


In comment 13738774 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


He apparently doesn't want to leave. Who wants to stay on a team where they're rarely going to play?



A guy that's getting older and getting paid a ton


But he'll get paid regardless. If he doesn't want to play, just retire.

IMO, he's playing hardball. If he puts the yanks in a position of having to cut him, then he still collects what the Yanks owe him, plus what ever he can get signing with another team.


Plus, if he retires he doesn't get paid. Not wanting to play (if that's the case, I have no idea) <> not wanting to get paid.
Ozuna to Cards  
pjcas18 : 12/13/2017 1:07 pm : link
Quote:
Ken Rosenthal Retweeted
Jesse Sanchez‏Verified account @JesseSanchezMLB
3m3 minutes ago

Source: Marcel Ozuna has been traded to the Cardinals. The deal is pending a physical.
RE: Ozuna to Cards  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 1:33 pm : link
In comment 13739122 pjcas18 said:
Quote:


Quote:


Ken Rosenthal Retweeted
Jesse Sanchez‏Verified account @JesseSanchezMLB
3m3 minutes ago

Source: Marcel Ozuna has been traded to the Cardinals. The deal is pending a physical.




Good pickup for the Cards. Will be interested to see what level prospects they gave up.
The rich gets richer  
spike : 12/13/2017 1:35 pm : link
The cards do need
More offense
Yelich  
spike : 12/13/2017 1:37 pm : link
Next
RE: Yelich  
arcarsenal : 12/13/2017 1:43 pm : link
In comment 13739154 spike said:
Quote:
Next


Certainly won't be headed here - that's for sure.
Yelich  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 1:47 pm : link
would cost Rosario (plus). Not happening.
.  
arcarsenal : 12/13/2017 1:50 pm : link
The Marlins really know how to alienate their fans.

One of the best young outfields in baseball with Ozuna/Yelich/Stanton and they're going to wind up trading all 3 away.

I have no idea what the endgame ever is for that franchise. They're pathetic.
If they make someone take on Prado's $30M  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 1:50 pm : link
it's going to be hard to also get a Rosario-type.
RE: If they make someone take on Prado's $30M  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 1:51 pm : link
In comment 13739173 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
it's going to be hard to also get a Rosario-type.


Teams are asking about Prado independently (namely the Braves). Unlike Stanton Yelich has an incredible contract. If they deal him they will get a bounty. The Mets don't have that to offer.
Yelich  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 1:53 pm : link
is making the same salary in 2018 as Anthony Swarzak, and 2.75 million less over the next 2 seasons. THAT's how good his contract is.
I'm not in any way disputing Yelich's ability or great contract  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 1:59 pm : link
but the Marlins are not operating in normal fashion by any standard. They may be getting calls on Prado, but I very much doubt any team would take on his full contract for free.

Quote:

Barry Jackson‏Verified account
@flasportsbuzz
5m5 minutes ago
More
Disgraceful MLB allowed underfinanced group to buy team.Disgraceful Marlins won't say real reason for slashing:investors told no cashcalls
and Dan prior to the last week I didn't think there was any way Yelich  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 2:04 pm : link
would even be available. There is no logical reason to deal him because he's young enough to be part of any rebuild. But the word coming out of all the top reporters in Miami around their financial situation makes it sound like they are in a slashing mode without parallel. I guess we'll see. It sounds like Ozuna brought back a couple of pitchers and a position player.
RE: and Dan prior to the last week I didn't think there was any way Yelich  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:07 pm : link
In comment 13739190 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
would even be available. There is no logical reason to deal him because he's young enough to be part of any rebuild. But the word coming out of all the top reporters in Miami around their financial situation makes it sound like they are in a slashing mode without parallel. I guess we'll see. It sounds like Ozuna brought back a couple of pitchers and a position player.


Ozuna has 2 years left, Yelich has 5. Yelich's contract is roughly 100 million in surplus value. If Yelich were a FA he'd be looking at 150+ million. Everyone is reporting the price on Yelich is far greater than Ozuna (as it should be)
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:08 pm : link
Joel Sherman‏Verified account
@Joelsherman1
2m2 minutes ago
More
#Mets have at least been curious if not aggressive on Frazier, who could make Cabrera more versatile to play a few places rather than lock in at 3b, and serve as righty platoon/insurance for Dom Smith at 1b.
Eric,  
GiantFilthy : 12/13/2017 2:08 pm : link
I agree. Obviously the Marlins are shedding salary like crazy but there is zero reason to throw Yelich away while doing so. I'm hoping Atlanta uses Prado's salary dump as a way to talk down the Yelich price a bit. Sure seems like the Marlins would be dumb enough to listen.
I'd love..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 12/13/2017 2:08 pm : link
to be in Ellsbury's shoes. I'm getting to the end of my career and I have another shot to win a World Series while getting paid a lot.

A better question is Why would he want to leave?
As  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:10 pm : link
for Prado, if they eat half to move him, that's still 14 million saved. There is no need to lessen the value of Yelich to do so. He's their golden goose of trade value.
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:11 pm : link
Joel Sherman‏Verified account
@Joelsherman1
Following Following @Joelsherman1
More
As many as 10 teams have engaged on Todd Frazier for 3b, 1b and most interesting, some 2b. Frazier played 2b so often in #Yankees shifts that some teams think the minor league SS can handle that.

1:58 PM - 13 Dec 2017
Sandy Alcantara  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:12 pm : link
one of the pieces to Miami, MONSTER pure stuff. Well see if he puts it together.
We will see - there is ZERO reason to trade Yelich  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 2:13 pm : link
unless they need dump a contract they couldn't dump otherwise.
.  
pjcas18 : 12/13/2017 2:14 pm : link
Quote:
Joel Sherman‏Verified account @Joelsherman1
2h2 hours ago

If #Mets fans care, 3 scouts have now weighed in, each feels Swarzak uptick last yr was not flukey. Fastball/slider mix strong, confidence grew with success, went back-to-back lots to show durability, low maintenance, competitive.
RE: Sandy Alcantara  
arcarsenal : 12/13/2017 2:15 pm : link
In comment 13739211 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
one of the pieces to Miami, MONSTER pure stuff. Well see if he puts it together.


If he does, they'll just trade him.
Throws  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:16 pm : link
95-99 as a SP, command comes and goes. Likely ends up a reliever but still time, could be a big time talent but is raw. Marlins wanted him in the Stanton deal so no shock here.
..  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:18 pm : link
Sam Dykstra‏
@SamDykstraMiLB
1m1 minute ago
More
Sandy Alcantara gives the #Marlins another high-octane arm. Averaged 98.4 mph with his fastball in eight MLB relief appearances. Secondaries are behind, and his control can waver plenty. But he's got the arm to dream on.
What would be the Marlins position right now....  
Chris684 : 12/13/2017 2:19 pm : link
specifically for the new ownership, if Jose hadnt passed away?

Would they try to improve their team?
RE: What would be the Marlins position right now....  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:20 pm : link
In comment 13739227 Chris684 said:
Quote:
specifically for the new ownership, if Jose hadnt passed away?

Would they try to improve their team?


Would have traded him for sure. Package would have been huge but they are headed toward a total reset.
If he's the main headliner isn't that relatively cheap  
Eric on Li : 12/13/2017 2:20 pm : link
for a young all star who can play CF and just hit 37 homers? Law had him 7th in their system, MLB pipeline has him 9th. Doesn't appear to be in the top 100 anywhere.
RE: If he's the main headliner isn't that relatively cheap  
DanMetroMan : 12/13/2017 2:21 pm : link
In comment 13739229 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
for a young all star who can play CF and just hit 37 homers? Law had him 7th in their system, MLB pipeline has him 9th. Doesn't appear to be in the top 100 anywhere.


BA's new list had him 4th.
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