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NFT: MLB Winter Meetings Day 4

DaddyM89 : 12/14/2017 1:43 am
Could this be the day we see Machado moved? Do the yankees make a move for a pitcher or a bold one in getting said Machado? Will the Mets make a big splash on the last day. Hopefully it'll be an exciting one after the last few days were a little slow.
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RE: RE: Should  
DanMetroMan : 12/14/2017 3:54 pm : link
In comment 13740790 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 13740723 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


also be pointed out this was his second full season in AAA.



Don't want to turn this into a Mets prospects thread but the TL:DR is that there's reason to believe he had some bad luck last year and a clean slate from a new staff would be a good idea. I know the org was down on him last year and I'm sure there's some reason why, but he's exactly the type contact oriented low strikeout player they have previously mis-evaluated.

The "bad luck" argument is that his #'s in AAA the last 2 years were a lot more similar than people realize except for 1 stat - singles. He had 23 less singles last year. His BABIP dropped and was one of the lowest on Vegas' roster (12th out of 15th among guys over 100 ABs). So the difference between a 128 wRC and an 85 wRC was a bunch of singles (and some situational factors with RBIs and RS).

2016 (499 PA) - 8 homers, 27 doubles, 2 triples, 48 BB, 55 K's
2017 (497 PA) - 6 homers, 27 doubles, 3 triples, 40 BB, 61 K's

A year ago his biggest issue was throwing errors which were mostly corrected with the move from SS to 2B (8 errors there). In a pretty weak system, especially at the higher levels, he's not someone I'd sell low on.


Eric,
THEY decided it was worth giving Phil Evans (a guy they sent home only to call back because of injuries) a look over Cecchini. Sandy and Co. made that decision. Evans was sitting on his couch and HE got an extended look over a former 1st round pick. That doesn't tell you something? Do you hear ANY buzz around him? From the Mets? from scouts? It should also be noted while you are comparing the 2 seasons, his 2016 actually wasn't all that amazing either. 128 wRC+ was good for 6th on his own team behind Conforto, Nimmo, Rivera, Taijeron and Ty Kelly. His wOBA in 2016 was also 6th on his own team. He was "solid" in 2016 and awful in 2017. Neither season was he "MLB starter" good.
2016 rankings (200+ PA's)  
DanMetroMan : 12/14/2017 3:58 pm : link
wOBA 6th
wRC+ 6th
Slugging 8th
OBP 4th
ISO 11th
SB's 7th

And again these are his rankings on his own team during his "good" AAA season in 2016

Baseball America dropped him from the Mets top 10 prospects while calling the Mets system "bottom 3rd in the league".

BP had him 9th while again saying the system was pretty terrible
THEY also non-tendered Justin Turner  
Eric on Li : 12/14/2017 3:58 pm : link
again, I am not disputing that they are down on him. I know they are. I am not disputing that he may be a bust. Most of THEIR draft picks have been. I just don't think we've seen enough of him at the MLB level to make any strong determination.
Whoops  
DanMetroMan : 12/14/2017 3:59 pm : link
BP actually dropped him from the top 10, I was looking at the 2017 list. This was their blurb BEFORE his awful season


OFP 50Average major league second baseman
Likely 40Utility guy that makes you cringe a bit when hes your Sunday shortstop
I'd  
DanMetroMan : 12/14/2017 4:06 pm : link
call the Cardinals about Schrock. He's TINY but can flat hit and is the kind of grinder we could use.
RE: RE: RE: Yes, I get the sense that the Tigers just let it be known that  
Milton : 12/14/2017 4:35 pm : link
In comment 13740769 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
And that's a lot of effort to try to justify wanting a mediocre NL pitcher who is older, more expensive and less effective rather than Fulmer.

They literally said at every opportunity that they are not actively trying to trade Fulmer. By your twisted logic, why would the Pirates trade such a stud (/s) as Cole?
I don't prefer Cole to Fulmer, I just find it a little suspicious the way Avila waxes on and on about teams asking and him listening (next up from him will be a wife-swapping analogy, "If you're at a club and a guy keeps asking your wife to dance...").

And surely you can see why it makes much more sense for the Pirates to part with Cole for prospects. I don't need to explain it to you because you've said the same yourself.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Yes, I get the sense that the Tigers just let it be known that  
Gatorade Dunk : 12/14/2017 4:40 pm : link
In comment 13740842 Milton said:
Quote:
In comment 13740769 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


And that's a lot of effort to try to justify wanting a mediocre NL pitcher who is older, more expensive and less effective rather than Fulmer.

They literally said at every opportunity that they are not actively trying to trade Fulmer. By your twisted logic, why would the Pirates trade such a stud (/s) as Cole?

I don't prefer Cole to Fulmer, I just find it a little suspicious the way Avila waxes on and on about teams asking and him listening (next up from him will be a wife-swapping analogy, "If you're at a club and a guy keeps asking your wife to dance...").

And surely you can see why it makes much more sense for the Pirates to part with Cole for prospects. I don't need to explain it to you because you've said the same yourself.

Of course it makes more sense. Because Cole is meh.
Rosenthal says the White Sox have the best deal  
Dave in Hoboken : 12/14/2017 4:52 pm : link
on the table for Machado currently.
Carig confirms the Mets are allegedly thinking like  
pjcas18 : 12/14/2017 5:45 pm : link
me (hopefully) so maybe Matt Reynolds (who was obviously a hyperbolic example) is not the guy, but I'm not touching a top 10 prospect (which is really top 10 - 20 for some teams) for Kipnis.

Quote:
Marc Carig‏Verified account @MarcCarig

When it comes to second base, source says Mets are actually more concerned about giving up talent (which is limited) than they are about taking on some money (go ahead, be skeptical). Anyway, thats why the Mets have so much interest in Jason Kipnis.
Pretty depressing piece by cerrone on metsblog  
bhill410 : 12/14/2017 8:13 pm : link
It is about as close as he will come to insulting the Mets front office and ownership group. You know if he is saying this stuff then they are really in bad straights. I am not going to stop following them but the Wilpons really really make it difficult to root for the team when you are going to be in the bottom third of payroll yet again with a core talent that could compete if you committed to them. Even last year when they spent money they still hedged on a bunch of short term deals and were only middle of pack in payroll.
Carig saying the Mets could explore  
ZGiants98 : 12/14/2017 10:10 pm : link
Cozart for 2B although Mets view it as a "long shot".

PLEASE!
RE: Just listening to Kay...  
dpinzow : 12/14/2017 11:25 pm : link
In comment 13740766 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
He said the Yankees are going "full bore" for Machado, and he's heard Machado wants to play in New York, whether it's this year or next. Remember, Kay is close with Buck Showalter, so that's probably the source.

However, he still doesn't think Angelos will sign off on a Yankee deal, and he (Kay) thinks they should wait till free agency rather than deplete their starting pitching supply in the minors.

I know, I know - I hate Kay, too - but his Yankee insights have some value.


I fully believe this on Machado

1. He sees the Yanks are building something unstoppable and wants to be a part of it
2. He detests the Red Sox
3. He always looked up to ARod when he came up to the bigs
RE: Rosenthal says the White Sox have the best deal  
dpinzow : 12/14/2017 11:30 pm : link
In comment 13740866 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
on the table for Machado currently.


Yanks actually have the best deal but Angelos won't trade with the Yanks so the White Sox have the best deal the Orioles are looking at. That makes sense. Question is, will the White Sox pay him the money
RE: RE: Rosenthal says the White Sox have the best deal  
Gatorade Dunk : 12/15/2017 12:05 am : link
In comment 13741229 dpinzow said:
Quote:
In comment 13740866 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


on the table for Machado currently.



Yanks actually have the best deal but Angelos won't trade with the Yanks so the White Sox have the best deal the Orioles are looking at. That makes sense. Question is, will the White Sox pay him the money

Yeah? What's the offer?

None of us actually know. The Yanks have the best pool to deal from, but the White Sox are right there with them. Yes, it's well documented that Angelos is extremely resistant to a trade with the Yanks, but to declare that the Yanks have the best deal is just speculation.
Just sayin'  
Ryan in Albany : 12/15/2017 7:58 am : link

Jeinny Lizarazo‏Verified account
@Jeinnylizarazo
Follow Follow @Jeinnylizarazo
More Jeinny Lizarazo Retweeted Bob Nightengale
Today I received information from a good source that no matter what happens...Machado knows he will be with the Yankees....whether in 2018 or 2019...
Orioles can't do anything about it...
Cashman is simply saying...take this or leave it...get something for him or get nothing
In case anyone missed it  
Shecky : 12/15/2017 8:07 am : link
Like clockwork...

I think that the meetings were helpful to help us resolve the bullpen situation and give us a little more clarity on options at other positions, Alderson said shortly before departing. So I think were relatively happy going home.
who is Jeinny Lizarazo?  
Greg from LI : 12/15/2017 9:07 am : link
.
Galvis  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 12:20 pm : link
for Enyel De Los Santos. Nice move by Phi
RE: In case anyone missed it  
Modus Operandi : 12/15/2017 12:26 pm : link
In comment 13741356 Shecky said:
Quote:
Like clockwork...

I think that the meetings were helpful to help us resolve the bullpen situation and give us a little more clarity on options at other positions, Alderson said shortly before departing. So I think were relatively happy going home.


Did Sandy kick any doors down on the way out?
Sandy has done as well as anyone could under the restrictions  
Eric on Li : 12/15/2017 12:29 pm : link
but I think it's time to move on. Bring back Depo to help with the draft (they obviously need it) and then let him take the reigns next offseason. Let Sandy stay on as team president but give someone else a chance.
Awful-  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 12:29 pm : link
The New York Mets and Minnesota Twins are interested in free agent first baseman Mike Napoli according to Gerry Fraley of Dallas Morning News. The Tampa Bay Rays are also interested per Marc Tompkin of the TB Times.
RE: Sandy has done as well as anyone could under the restrictions  
pjcas18 : 12/15/2017 12:36 pm : link
In comment 13741780 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
but I think it's time to move on. Bring back Depo to help with the draft (they obviously need it) and then let him take the reigns next offseason. Let Sandy stay on as team president but give someone else a chance.


I think DePo got a promotion in CLE. From what I read he now reports directly to Haslam, as does the GM and coach.

I thought he'd get tossed with Sashi, but if I read correctly doesn't seem like that is the case, at least not yet.
RE: RE: Sandy has done as well as anyone could under the restrictions  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 12:52 pm : link
In comment 13741799 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
In comment 13741780 Eric on Li said:


Quote:


but I think it's time to move on. Bring back Depo to help with the draft (they obviously need it) and then let him take the reigns next offseason. Let Sandy stay on as team president but give someone else a chance.



I think DePo got a promotion in CLE. From what I read he now reports directly to Haslam, as does the GM and coach.

I thought he'd get tossed with Sashi, but if I read correctly doesn't seem like that is the case, at least not yet.


New GM apparently shit on DePo
Link - ( New Window )
Mike  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 12:53 pm : link
Napoli's numbers the past 3 seasons? He's been worth 1.1 fWAR TOTAL since opening day 2015, NEGATIVE -0.5 fWAR in 2017 and is 36.
Carlos  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 1:34 pm : link
Jon Heyman‏Verified account
@JonHeyman
2m2 minutes ago
Santanas deal is $60M for 3 years with philly
Great deal  
brunswick : 12/15/2017 1:52 pm : link
For Phillies
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 2:08 pm : link
Mike Berardino‏Verified account
@MikeBerardino
Follow Follow @MikeBerardino
More
Rodney also had offers from TEX, NYM, DET.

-Kipnis does not have a no-trade (so he has no say) but he does not want to be traded
Dan..  
Sean : 12/15/2017 2:10 pm : link
Is Cerrone still involved with MetsBlog? Cant tell from his Twitter.
Cozart  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 2:12 pm : link
3 for 38 with LAA, Eppler is kicking ass
RE: Dan..  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 2:13 pm : link
In comment 13741955 Sean said:
Quote:
Is Cerrone still involved with MetsBlog? Cant tell from his Twitter.


Yeah he still runs the site.
Mets might be  
spike : 12/15/2017 2:24 pm : link
A 3rd place team next season
.  
arcarsenal : 12/15/2017 2:28 pm : link
Quality players flying off the board.

Mets waiting for their bargain as usual.
If someone said 3 weeks ago  
brunswick : 12/15/2017 3:41 pm : link
Santana would only get 3/60 you would certainly think the Mets would have been involved. It's tough to get difference makers and they just missed out on one.
Mets might be trading Gsellman  
ZGiants98 : 12/15/2017 3:45 pm : link
For Villar.
RE: Mets might be trading Gsellman  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 3:52 pm : link
In comment 13742139 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
For Villar.


Puma says otherwise-
The Mets received the impression Brian Dozier likely wont be dealt by the Twins. And team officials dont view the Brewers Jonathan Villar as a serious possibility at the moment.
How old is  
brunswick : 12/15/2017 3:53 pm : link
Villar?
Ehalt  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 3:55 pm : link
says nothing brewing between the Mets and Indians and Mets not deep in talks for any 2b.
ZZZZ  
brunswick : 12/15/2017 3:56 pm : link
Where did you hear/see that one?
RE: How old is  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 3:56 pm : link
In comment 13742147 brunswick said:
Quote:
Villar?


He's 27 this season. Had an absolutely horrendous 2017, beyond bad. Very good 2016. Awful career outside of 2016.
The latest  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 3:57 pm : link

Matt Ehalt @MattEhalt
2m
Hearing there is nothing currently brewing with regards to Jason Kipnis and the Mets. Not that it can't happen, but no traction toward a deal at the moment.


Matt Ehalt @MattEhalt
now
Also, the Mets are not hot with any other potential 2B at the moment.
From all the tweets I'm reading  
pjcas18 : 12/15/2017 3:57 pm : link
that's not a great deal for Philly.

it's a good deal for all the other 1B options, based on twitter comments. For example....

Quote:
Jeff Passan‏Verified account @JeffPassan
54m54 minutes ago

The consensus on Carlos Santana's $60M deal with the Phillies: It bodes awfully well for free agent hitters. Santana is four years older than Eric Hosmer. A seven-year, $175M ask no longer seems beyond the pale. Good news for Logan Morrison and other available first basemen, too.
34 replies 54 retweets 107 likes
RE: From all the tweets I'm reading  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 4:00 pm : link
In comment 13742158 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
that's not a great deal for Philly.

it's a good deal for all the other 1B options, based on twitter comments. For example....



Quote:


Jeff Passan‏Verified account @JeffPassan
54m54 minutes ago

The consensus on Carlos Santana's $60M deal with the Phillies: It bodes awfully well for free agent hitters. Santana is four years older than Eric Hosmer. A seven-year, $175M ask no longer seems beyond the pale. Good news for Logan Morrison and other available first basemen, too.
34 replies 54 retweets 107 likes





Just because the AAV is high. People expected 4 years at a lower number but he's older than Hosmer so the AAV bodes well for guys like him.
Dave  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 4:01 pm : link
Cameron for example had Santana his #1 "bargain" at 4 for 72.

Dave Cameron 4 $18.0 M $72.0 M

"This is bananas. Santana projects as a better player than Edwin Enacnacion did last year, when the latter got 3/$60M after turning down 4/$80M from the Blue Jays. And Encarnacion got that despite only being able to negotiate with the few AL teams that had openings at DH. Santanas market should be much broader, and if he doesnt eclipse Encarnacions $60 million guarantee from last winter, a bunch of teams screwed up. I guessed that hed actually sign for $72 million, but Id probably go as high as $80 million if hed spread it out over five years. Santana might not be a superstar, but hes a good, consistent, durable player who will help his next team more than it seems many people might anticipate."
.  
arcarsenal : 12/15/2017 4:03 pm : link
I like the Santana deal - I would have been very happy with that if we signed him. High AAV but the term is perfect.
More  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 4:06 pm : link
on Napoli... he hit .196 vs. lefties last season (which would presumably be his role), and 2 position players 36 or older posted 2.0 fWAR last year Grandy/Nelson Cruz.
I'm not saying  
pjcas18 : 12/15/2017 4:08 pm : link
I wouldn't like it if the Mets signed him.

Though part of me wouldn't like it be because it signals the end of Dom Smith at low cost for a player at a relatively high cost that who knows how much of an improvement he'd be.

but my point was in response to the "great deal for Philly" posts. It's not that great IMO unless you see the Phillies as a contender in the next 3 years.

Not sure I do.
RE: I'm not saying  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 4:09 pm : link
In comment 13742181 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
I wouldn't like it if the Mets signed him.

Though part of me wouldn't like it be because it signals the end of Dom Smith at low cost for a player at a relatively high cost that who knows how much of an improvement he'd be.

but my point was in response to the "great deal for Philly" posts. It's not that great IMO unless you see the Phillies as a contender in the next 3 years.

Not sure I do.


Phillies have an INSANE amount of money to spend upcoming so Santana is a nice add to what they already have. They have something like 7 million committed for 2019 (now 7+ Santana).
Astros  
DanMetroMan : 12/15/2017 4:10 pm : link
are so well run.

Astros signed RHP Hector Rondon to a two-year, $8.5 million contract. Reportedly also in on Darvish.

Arc  
brunswick : 12/15/2017 4:10 pm : link
Agree 100%. It just appears that the Mets have their minds made up and there is no moving off of their plan. There is absolutely no creativity with the FO. I know we have "limited" funds but there is no excuse for some of the things happening. Why isn't Lagares name floated out there? There was/is no intention to trade Dom Smith...why not? His value is too low...stop already. They need to think out of the box. This team is a disgrace.
As a Yankee fan,  
Dave in Hoboken : 12/15/2017 4:11 pm : link
happy Santana left the Indians.
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