@JasonLaCanfora
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Giants remain very high on the internal candidates they interviewed but Gettleman has GM experience. Can work well with them
seems like a tough prick whose dickhead nature bit him in the ass. hopefully he's learned from it. that said, he oversaw winning programs at NYG and CAR. i'll take it, just will pray he sends marc ross packing..
the waiting, they arent even going to interview the other candidates after Sunday? Gettleman seems like a rush job, next we will have Spags staying as coach. I was hoping for more change, a new GM that doesnt have ties to all the scouts and execs.
He's a proven talent evaluator and the teams he built in Carolina speak for themselves, including this season. There's also the correlation of the degrading of the NYG roster since he left in 2012. But that could be for a number of reasons. I'd hope he's learned from what went wrong in Carolina and has improved his management and communication skills.
What I'm worried about though is this just means we keep the status quo for the scouting department. Marc Ross has got to go, and making an "in house" hire like this leaves me less confident of that
would they not interview some of the talent in management of other teams? I'm sure other teams would have granted permission for assistant GMs or directors of scouting/pro personnel the chance for a career growth opportunity. seems like a quick/lazy/stick to what you know process if they only interviewed two current Giants employees, an unemployed former GM and a TV personality.
not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
Like I said last week: it was a predetermined dog and pony show from the start. Expect more of the same poor to mediocre at best products on the field. Mara blew it, as expected.
Sounds like Gettleman is here to mentor Abrams for a few more years till retirement. A frontrunner for HC now has to be current Panthers DC Steve Wilks. He has done a good job with that talented defense. It will be curious to see if the Giants go to a 3-4 now. If I'm not mistaken, Carolina's defense is a 3-4.
Kevin Abrams that we would predicate our GM hire on grooming this guy to take over down the line? I sure as hell hope Abrams future played zero role in this.
Wolf
Caserio
DeCosta right off the top of my head. The NYG way hasnt worked for quite a while and now they bring a guy back with that in his blood. This thing needed an enema, not a blood transfusion.
I actually know him and his family. My wife is best friends with his daughter and I have met him a few times over the years. He actually was the guest speaker at my sister in laws graduation and he brought his 2011 Super Bowl Giants ring for everyone to see. Hope he does a great job!!!
is that Gettleman and Mara can be in a airport hotel in Carolina or Foxboro to get the first crack at their HC choice next week when the season is over.
I actually know him and his family. My wife is best friends with his daughter and I have met him a few times over the years. He actually was the guest speaker at my sister in laws graduation and he brought his 2011 Super Bowl Giants ring for everyone to see. Hope he does a great job!!!
You've outed yourself as a future asshat.
We expect good things.
RE: RE: For those who don't like the Gettleman pick
Wolf
Caserio
DeCosta right off the top of my head. The NYG way hasnt worked for quite a while and now they bring a guy back with that in his blood. This thing needed an enema, not a blood transfusion.
NYG way hasnt worked for quite a while? They won 2 Super Bowls in the last 10 years. Those dont count as working?
again, as we have said, if you have spent any time seeing how the Mara family does business, they rarely go outside the "family" for a major role in the organization.
Who is the coach I want. Gettleman has a pretty good draft record. If he can identify the problems and fix them, then I don't care who he is or that he used to work for the organization (during a pinnacle of success period for the Giants).
I think people getting all pissed off about the hire is strange. Not sure why you automatically assume he will fail.
not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
I do remember complaining about this last week and being told I dont know the rules and I dont know anything about hiring and about Garsfolo discussing a Gettleman/Abrams duo (although he had it in reverse) as something that makes the most sense. You were actually nice about it T-Bone but some of the others chose to bury their heads in the sand and ignore Garafolos tweets. This kind of reminds me of the Spags/McAdoo dilemma when McAdoo got the job, if Spags was in more demand and he would have left Spags would have gotten the HC job. It is clear they do t like muhchange. The Giants are rarely bold and rarely go outside their comfort zone. Since the young/Perkins hiring, the only guy I remember ever being outside the chain was Reeves and he was from the Landry coaching tree, which Wellington had a connection with.
He's got a reputation of being sort of a dick - which means he was probably brought in to smack some heads together, make hard choices that are unpopular but necessary, and then leave after three years as a the long-term choice for GM takes his place with everything set in place for awhile.
You've seen it in your own workplace, I'll bet. I know I have.
Why not just keep Reese? Nothing against Gettleman, but they needed a fresh start. All this does is change the voice, with all the same people in the building.
Wolf
Caserio
DeCosta right off the top of my head. The NYG way hasnt worked for quite a while and now they bring a guy back with that in his blood. This thing needed an enema, not a blood transfusion.
An enema is a more thorough flushing of the system than a blood transfusion? That's some enema.
1. I understand many wanted fresh blood and a new approach. Some wanted a splash. Well I don't think the GM hire is where you make a splash. You need a GM with a steady hand, especially with this team right now.
2. Much has been made of how Gentleman handled negotiations with veteran players. But to be honest, the Panthers were over invested in two aging RBs and an aging WR. Aside from his handling of the Olson contract I see no issue there.
3. On Josh Norman, the mistake he made there was not trading him. Norman is not a shutdown corner.
4. Reports are he is gruff and not personable. You can make the case this organization needs a bit more of that. Besides, I think Abrams will continue to manage the cap and contracts.
5. Agree with those who say he is grooming Abram.
6. I think the Giants wanted to get the GM in place so they can interview coaching candidates after this weekend.
7. Keep an eye on Carolina d coordinator Steve Will as a HC candidate, Al Holcomb panthers LB coach as an D coordinator candidate, and Chase Blackburn Carolina asst special teams coach as a special teams coach for the Giants.
- Guy has been involved in a bunch of teams, including us, appearing in a lot of super bowls.
- Relieved of his duties in Carolina, not because he couldn't build a team, because he made big boy moves and got rid of old aging stars. He was willing to make tough decisions for the betterment of the franchise.
- I don't see this as a way of Mara escaping changes. If anything, he's probably a little worried...Gettleman is going to tell him whats wrong with this roster right to his face.
- By far the most accomplished guy available, what's the argument for hiring a young guy with less success? IF he is successful he can stay around longer? Let's worry about now. He is the right guy.
insert another team, everything else equal, would there be as much moaning and groaning? Bottom line, he did a good job when he was here. He did a good job in Carolina and got fired for trying to do what many here complain that Reese wouldn't do. If they are sold on his abilities why wait 6-8 weeks? Get started now.
Thank God for Pete Rozelle. He forced the Maras to hire George Young, which turned the franchise around. Otherwise we would have had a succession of Andy Robustellis the last 40 years.
1. I understand many wanted fresh blood and a new approach. Some wanted a splash. Well I don't think the GM hire is where you make a splash. You need a GM with a steady hand, especially with this team right now.
2. Much has been made of how Gentleman handled negotiations with veteran players. But to be honest, the Panthers were over invested in two aging RBs and an aging WR. Aside from his handling of the Olson contract I see no issue there.
3. On Josh Norman, the mistake he made there was not trading him. Norman is not a shutdown corner.
4. Reports are he is gruff and not personable. You can make the case this organization needs a bit more of that. Besides, I think Abrams will continue to manage the cap and contracts.
5. Agree with those who say he is grooming Abram.
6. I think the Giants wanted to get the GM in place so they can interview coaching candidates after this weekend.
7. Keep an eye on Carolina d coordinator Steve Will as a HC candidate, Al Holcomb panthers LB coach as an D coordinator candidate, and Chase Blackburn Carolina asst special teams coach as a special teams coach for the Giants.
Emil, good post. Sounds like George Young to me lol.......
Def agree with point #6, as they probably definitely already have a guy in mind, as it came up in the interview no doubt.
not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
I do remember complaining about this last week and being told I dont know the rules and I dont know anything about hiring and about Garsfolo discussing a Gettleman/Abrams duo (although he had it in reverse) as something that makes the most sense. You were actually nice about it T-Bone but some of the others chose to bury their heads in the sand and ignore Garafolos tweets. This kind of reminds me of the Spags/McAdoo dilemma when McAdoo got the job, if Spags was in more demand and he would have left Spags would have gotten the HC job. It is clear they do t like muhchange. The Giants are rarely bold and rarely go outside their comfort zone. Since the young/Perkins hiring, the only guy I remember ever being outside the chain was Reeves and he was from the Landry coaching tree, which Wellington had a connection with.
Yeah... I was pretty nice about it... and you proceeded to ignore me throughout that thread. I hate being ignored. I'd rather you just tell me to fuck off than ignore me. That said, with the news that just broke about the new GM, that thread would've made a lot more sense had you posted it NOW than when you did.
insert another team, everything else equal, would there be as much moaning and groaning? Bottom line, he did a good job when he was here. He did a good job in Carolina and got fired for trying to do what many here complain that Reese wouldn't do. If they are sold on his abilities why wait 6-8 weeks? Get started now.
Because it seems he was hired for that part of his resume you want us to leave out.
During that time period the Giants made the playoffs 7 times.
During that time period the Giants Made 3 super bowls appearances.
During that time period the Giants won 2 championships.
1. I understand many wanted fresh blood and a new approach. Some wanted a splash. Well I don't think the GM hire is where you make a splash. You need a GM with a steady hand, especially with this team right now.
2. Much has been made of how Gentleman handled negotiations with veteran players. But to be honest, the Panthers were over invested in two aging RBs and an aging WR. Aside from his handling of the Olson contract I see no issue there.
3. On Josh Norman, the mistake he made there was not trading him. Norman is not a shutdown corner.
4. Reports are he is gruff and not personable. You can make the case this organization needs a bit more of that. Besides, I think Abrams will continue to manage the cap and contracts.
5. Agree with those who say he is grooming Abram.
6. I think the Giants wanted to get the GM in place so they can interview coaching candidates after this weekend.
7. Keep an eye on Carolina d coordinator Steve Will as a HC candidate, Al Holcomb panthers LB coach as an D coordinator candidate, and Chase Blackburn Carolina asst special teams coach as a special teams coach for the Giants.
Gettleman has done a good job everywhere he's been.
insert another team, everything else equal, would there be as much moaning and groaning? Bottom line, he did a good job when he was here. He did a good job in Carolina and got fired for trying to do what many here complain that Reese wouldn't do. If they are sold on his abilities why wait 6-8 weeks? Get started now.
Because it seems he was hired for that part of his resume you want us to leave out.
During that time period the Giants made the playoffs 7 times.
During that time period the Giants Made 3 super bowls appearances.
During that time period the Giants won 2 championships.
and coughlin won two championships as a coach do you want to hire him back too? Your point?
do we have to dust the cobwebs off gettleman before he steps into the building?
RE: RE: Gettleman was with the Giants from 99-2012
During that time period the Giants made the playoffs 7 times.
During that time period the Giants Made 3 super bowls appearances.
During that time period the Giants won 2 championships.
and coughlin won two championships as a coach do you want to hire him back too? Your point?
do we have to dust the cobwebs off gettleman before he steps into the building?
In regards to Coughlin, after this past season, yes.
1. I understand many wanted fresh blood and a new approach. Some wanted a splash. Well I don't think the GM hire is where you make a splash. You need a GM with a steady hand, especially with this team right now.
2. Much has been made of how Gentleman handled negotiations with veteran players. But to be honest, the Panthers were over invested in two aging RBs and an aging WR. Aside from his handling of the Olson contract I see no issue there.
3. On Josh Norman, the mistake he made there was not trading him. Norman is not a shutdown corner.
4. Reports are he is gruff and not personable. You can make the case this organization needs a bit more of that. Besides, I think Abrams will continue to manage the cap and contracts.
5. Agree with those who say he is grooming Abram.
6. I think the Giants wanted to get the GM in place so they can interview coaching candidates after this weekend.
7. Keep an eye on Carolina d coordinator Steve Will as a HC candidate, Al Holcomb panthers LB coach as an D coordinator candidate, and Chase Blackburn Carolina asst special teams coach as a special teams coach for the Giants.
Emil, good post. Sounds like George Young to me lol.......
Def agree with point #6, as they probably definitely already have a guy in mind, as it came up in the interview no doubt.
The Giants ONLY interviewed four candidates for the position. Three were intimately tied to the Giants:
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
this is what bothers me...whats the rush? Is Gettleman/Wilks that much of a hot GM/coaching candidates we needed to have a GM in place before year end?
The fact they didn't do an extensive search is bogus to me. We needed a house cleaning instead the interviewed a bunch of guys they already new and picked one instead of god forbid looking outside the organization for once...SMH rinse, wash, repeat with the mara's.
The Giants ONLY interviewed four candidates for the position. Three were intimately tied to the Giants:
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
Eric - again, I think it's because they know Gettleman, and realize the coach they want is out there, and you can't wait to start interviewing HC's at the end of January - while they stew on a GM.
DG wasn't safe in CAR jettisoning players left and right. For all we know, he's the polar opposite of Reese and wants to operate much differently. Truth is, no one really knows his MO other than he's ok letting people walk like Norman, Smith, Davis and Stewart. Doesnt seem like Reese at all, would he have resigned JPP? He's got experience and has drafted decently. Eager for the first press conference.
I'm sure many here would have loved Coughlin as the GM. Got no issue with Gentleman's age. This franchise just needs to win games. If a 90 year old helps you do that, you hire him.
The Giants ONLY interviewed four candidates for the position. Three were intimately tied to the Giants:
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
Its was Gettlemans job as soon as Reese handed in his building access card. The exhaustive search was nothing more than dog and pony show rhetoric. Mara could have done better if he wasnt terrified of change. Nothing is going to change here. If I had to guess, if this is a 3-5 year appointment due to his advanced age, Im expecting mediocre drafts, rosters, and team records. Exactly like the Reese years.
The owners take a very long view. The Mara family has been owners for nearly 100 years. The've won a bunch of NFL and Super Bowl championships. They have a way of doing things, and over that century, it's been pretty successful. There have been bad times over that century but they've always come back to succeed.
We fans, though, are much more in the here-and-now, and less inclined to think in the long-term (like, decades). We want villains punished (Reese, McAdoo, Ross, whoever) and new heroes in their place. Or maybe old heroes like Coughlin, Parcells and Belichik. We want to feel good NOW.
I don't know that the owners' long-term view is any healthier than the fans' view at this point, but even if it is, it's not clear they're succeeding strategically anyway. It's not like ownership has been killing it lately. Met Life Stadium is new, expensive and unloved. The team's gone from crummy-mediocre to flat out terrible, the drafts have stunk, the locker room is in chaos, the coaches seem helpless.
Until proven otherwise, I'm inclined to think that the owners take the long view, ineffectively.
Get ready for the HC search and his experience is the main reason he was hired. Familiarity was obviously another reason, and I can't say I blame Mara/Tisch.
There are countless moving parts to contend with:
1. Hiring the next head coach
2. How to handle Eli Manning
3. How to approach OBJ contract
4. Eli Apple disaster
5. Creating cap space
6. Rebuilding the O Line
7. Drafting and signing NFL Linebackers
8. Handling the highest draft pick since 1981
I would want somebody I know and trust to handle this many issues in one offseason.
I give Gettlemen as good a shot as anyone to chip away at this list.
Lotulelei, Kawann Short, Kelvin Benjamin, Trai Turner, Shaq Thompson, Devin Funchess, James Bradberry. That's above average, especially on the lines and defensively
it represents another very cautious move by the ownership. I know nothing about Gettleman and cannot criticize him for his performance in Carolina. If getting rid of aging fan favorites is his crime, then I am all in. If he is an ass who cannot deal with players/agents then it could be a problem for free agency.
The Giants ONLY interviewed four candidates for the position. Three were intimately tied to the Giants:
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
And doubtful Ross and Abrams were serious candidates. Abrams is a cap guy without any personnel experience and Ross was in part to blame for the team's personnel problems.
So a guy they saw on TV and the guy they intended to hire all along.
Get ready for the HC search and his experience is the main reason he was hired. Familiarity was obviously another reason, and I can't say I blame Mara/Tisch.
There are countless moving parts to contend with:
1. Hiring the next head coach
2. How to handle Eli Manning
3. How to approach OBJ contract
4. Eli Apple disaster
5. Creating cap space
6. Rebuilding the O Line
7. Drafting and signing NFL Linebackers
8. Handling the highest draft pick since 1981
I would want somebody I know and trust to handle this many issues in one offseason.
I give Gettlemen as good a shot as anyone to chip away at this list.
Yep. And he probably sold Mara on who the next coach could be, and do it well.
insert another team, everything else equal, would there be as much moaning and groaning? Bottom line, he did a good job when he was here. He did a good job in Carolina and got fired for trying to do what many here complain that Reese wouldn't do. If they are sold on his abilities why wait 6-8 weeks? Get started now.
Because it seems he was hired for that part of his resume you want us to leave out.
Point is, objecting to Gettleman only because he previously worked in the Giants organization makes no sense. It's an emotional reaction. If there are issues with his job performance when he was here or in Carolina, let's hear them.
The Giants ONLY interviewed four candidates for the position. Three were intimately tied to the Giants:
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
this is what bothers me...whats the rush? Is Gettleman/Wilks that much of a hot GM/coaching candidates we needed to have a GM in place before year end?
The fact they didn't do an extensive search is bogus to me. We needed a house cleaning instead the interviewed a bunch of guys they already new and picked one instead of god forbid looking outside the organization for once...SMH rinse, wash, repeat with the mara's.
I think it's that this team is such a mess that they don't want to waste any time getting leadership in place and fixing the problems.
Pretty much my thoughts although Abrams may have been a somewhat serious candidate. Ross was never in the mix and my gut says Riddick wasn't either. He's been away from the game too long.
not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
The Giants ONLY interviewed four candidates for the position. Three were intimately tied to the Giants:
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
this is what bothers me...whats the rush? Is Gettleman/Wilks that much of a hot GM/coaching candidates we needed to have a GM in place before year end?
The fact they didn't do an extensive search is bogus to me. We needed a house cleaning instead the interviewed a bunch of guys they already new and picked one instead of god forbid looking outside the organization for once...SMH rinse, wash, repeat with the mara's.
I think it's that this team is such a mess that they don't want to waste any time getting leadership in place and fixing the problems.
Yes exactly Emil. I think the Browns move with Dorsey scared them. Just like the Eagles interning Macadoo years ago. They just get duped or panic easily. Unless some big time coach has told them he wants the job I dont understand the rush. Who else was interviewing Gettleman?
During that time period the Giants made the playoffs 7 times.
During that time period the Giants Made 3 super bowls appearances.
During that time period the Giants won 2 championships.
and coughlin won two championships as a coach do you want to hire him back too? Your point?
do we have to dust the cobwebs off gettleman before he steps into the building?
My point is that find me another possible GM with that track record. By the way, I didn't mention what he did for Carolina.
Lotulelei, Kawann Short, Kelvin Benjamin, Trai Turner, Shaq Thompson, Devin Funchess, James Bradberry. That's above average, especially on the lines and defensively
Not at all. Big hits on the lines. Hes missed largely everywhere else including at WR. Funchess who I like is not making enough strides or consistency. Benjamin has faded. Thompson is highly overrated and snt that good. Kuechly and Davis would make a motionless cadaver look good. Hes added some secondary help through the draft but that was presented out of necessity because of mishandling the Norman situation. Out of the four picks theyve made there only one looks like a player in Bradberry. Worley is terrible. His Carolina draft impact will rest now on the McCaffrey pick.
Beckham, Collins, Kennard, Tomlinson, Pugh, Richburg, Engram, Shepard all in the same time period.
More importantly, he had tremendous success with the Giants.
Pro Personnel Director 1999-2012
Look at the free agents he brought in...Kerry Collins, Barrow, Pierce, Plax, Mackenzie, O'Hara along with countless other solid role players like Bob Whitfield and Sam Madison.
What got him kicked out of Carolina is what this roster needs now....some tough love. Also, butting heads with Jerry Richardson doesn't look too bad in retrospect does it??
Not a thrilling or exciting hire, but not the worst. I am hoping that they bring in a new head of Collegiate Scouting, that's Gettleman's weak spot. Also hoping they get a little more creative on the coaching front.
not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
I do remember complaining about this last week and being told I dont know the rules and I dont know anything about hiring and about Garsfolo discussing a Gettleman/Abrams duo (although he had it in reverse) as something that makes the most sense. You were actually nice about it T-Bone but some of the others chose to bury their heads in the sand and ignore Garafolos tweets. This kind of reminds me of the Spags/McAdoo dilemma when McAdoo got the job, if Spags was in more demand and he would have left Spags would have gotten the HC job. It is clear they do t like muhchange. The Giants are rarely bold and rarely go outside their comfort zone. Since the young/Perkins hiring, the only guy I remember ever being outside the chain was Reeves and he was from the Landry coaching tree, which Wellington had a connection with.
Yeah... I was pretty nice about it... and you proceeded to ignore me throughout that thread. I hate being ignored. I'd rather you just tell me to fuck off than ignore me. That said, with the news that just broke about the new GM, that thread would've made a lot more sense had you posted it NOW than when you did.
I kept telling people (which i assumed everyone knew) Garafolo doesnt spitball stuff, his credibility relies on it, especially with the Giants. His tweets (which were spot on except that he had it as a Abrams/Gettleman team as opposed to Gettleman/Abrams) led me to believe this was not the due diligence that people were saying but that the job was real and I wanted them to go bold. With that said, as I mentioned in the post, of the four Gettleman makes me the most comfortable. He has been involved with 9 teams who made the Super Bowl (3 with us). We could have done worse.
Is there urgency to fix this ASAP? I hope not, even if it means his successor reaps the benefits of his labor. This program is in shambles. They cannot even think about playoffs with them currently possessing the worst qb situation in the division (age, performance, roster/supporting cast). Is Gettleman prepared to do something prudent like, if Darnold stays at usc, shop the #2 pick and/or trade OBJ for picks to gain ammunition if he needs to trade up for a franchise qb in 2019?
OK with Gettleman, but I agree with Eric that this whole process did seem predetermined. Gettleman did a good job when he was here, and at Carolina. The Giants are in disarray, and he can be a steadying influence. Perhaps now is not the time for a bold choice at GM, although I understand and respect those who think that's what the Giants should have done.
My real concern with Gettleman is his age. This is a demanding job. My guess is Abrams will be groomed to succeed him in three or four years. All of this is consistent with how the Giants operate, namely hiring and promoting current and former employees. Reese started as a scout for the Giants.
It seems like we were way stronger in evaluating pro personnel and them we hired a guy strong in that area. We have bombed our drafts and I am not as high on his drafts as some seem to be. This just wreaks of some guy trying to get with his high school crush 15 years later after she has gone downhill because of what could have been had they stayed together when they were younger.
Everything that has transpired over the last several weeks....
Just made me feel like it was time for grown ups to come in restore some order and that putting the organization in the hands of some unproven kids to fix all this dysfunctional its was too big a risk. Yes the reward might be great, and I was intrigued by the guy from the Seahawks,Kirchner, but the risk was great also.
Tom Rock (@TomRock_Newsday)
12/28/17, 5:10 PM
Interim GM Kevin Abrams is expected to stay on board with the Giants, I'm told. Of course, other teams may want to interview him for their GM jobs.
Is there urgency to fix this ASAP? I hope not, even if it means his successor reaps the benefits of his labor. This program is in shambles. They cannot even think about playoffs with them currently possessing the worst qb situation in the division (age, performance, roster/supporting cast). Is Gettleman prepared to do something prudent like, if Darnold stays at usc, shop the #2 pick and/or trade OBJ for picks to gain ammunition if he needs to trade up for a franchise qb in 2019?
Thats the fear! A lot of nice QBs coming out, gotta take one.
I actually know him and his family. My wife is best friends with his daughter and I have met him a few times over the years. He actually was the guest speaker at my sister in laws graduation and he brought his 2011 Super Bowl Giants ring for everyone to see. Hope he does a great job!!!
Thanks. A little counter info to the 'ogre-prick' trope.
Its was Gettlemans job as soon as Reese handed in his building access card. The exhaustive search was nothing more than dog and pony show rhetoric.
Bingo.
I was told that was the case before Reese was fired, I'd hoped it would not be reality.
I couldnt help but feel that way when Gettleman was fired by Carolina. I was almost pissed because I couldnt help but think that we now have our next GM....
Oh well, it is what it is. Like others have said, Im not overly pissed about the choice, but moreso Im pissed about the process.
Gettleman has been a part of seven Super Bowl teams (*three winners):
-Buffalo in 1990 and 1991
-Denver in 1997*
-Giants in 2000, 2007* and 2011*
-Panthers in 2015
In 13 or 14 years, the Giant had one terrific free agent class, in 2005, landing Plaxico Burress, Antonio Pierce and Kareem McKenzie. He helped stitch together the ragtag offensive line that went to Super Bowl XXXV. There were a few other nice acquisitions, like Shaun O'Hara, Fred Robbins, Antrel Rolle and Micheal Barrow, and some guys who contributed more modestly, like Chris Canty, Deon Grant, Michael Boley, Martellus Bennett, Sam Madison, Dominik Hixon and even (very briefly) David Baas. I don't know how deeply Gettleman was involved in the resurrection of Kerry Collins. DG was on the job in 1999, but Accorsi seems to have flown solo on that one.
That's a decent list. It's less impressive when you consider that it was spread over more than a decade.
RE: Everything that has transpired over the last several weeks....
Just made me feel like it was time for grown ups to come in restore some order and that putting the organization in the hands of some unproven kids to fix all this dysfunctional its was too big a risk. Yes the reward might be great, and I was intrigued by the guy from the Seahawks,Kirchner, but the risk was great also.
Im ok with Gettleman if he is indeed the guy
That is the perfect way to put it...He is a grown up, and does not play. It may be one of the reasons he was let go from Carolina. With the recent news about the Carolina owner, it would not surprise me if Gettleman "over stepped" his boundaries by standing up to Richardson's inappropriate behavior.
football man. I'd be happy if Abrams stays, but Ross HAS TO GO. As does the entire coaching staff. Sullivan is the only one I'd feel remorse about losing.
In 13 or 14 years, the Giant had one terrific free agent class, in 2005, landing Plaxico Burress, Antonio Pierce and Kareem McKenzie. He helped stitch together the ragtag offensive line that went to Super Bowl XXXV. There were a few other nice acquisitions, like Shaun O'Hara, Fred Robbins, Antrel Rolle and Micheal Barrow, and some guys who contributed more modestly, like Chris Canty, Deon Grant, Michael Boley, Martellus Bennett, Sam Madison, Dominik Hixon and even (very briefly) David Baas. I don't know how deeply Gettleman was involved in the resurrection of Kerry Collins. DG was on the job in 1999, but Accorsi seems to have flown solo on that one.
That's a decent list. It's less impressive when you consider that it was spread over more than a decade.
I think it's more impressive that you give it credit for. You have to remember the dollars those guys were signed for, many of them were dirt cheap. A lot of homeruns there, especially a guy like O'Hara who was a bargain bin guy that turned into a perennial pro bowler. Canty, Baas and Boley were mild busts for the price but still contributed. You can add Kenny Holmes to that list. In terms of their own players, which he's advising as well, I can't think of any missteps outside of letting Griffin walk. With the kind of mine field that free agency brings and the value we extracted vs. the contracts, that's a very impressive list IMO.
I was intrigued by Riddick, but when it became apparent that he would
I have my doubts that Reese would have even been fired if DG wasn't available. For a position that is so significantly responsible for the success of a franchise, HOW do you not talk to a larger pool of candidates? YOU"RE CERTAIN that your 66 year old retread is the best hire?
I've seen people say they're excited about Gettleman bc he will fix the Giants offensive line. At Carolina, Daves major FA signing was matt Khalil at LT- it's one of the worst contracts in football. If you look at PFF they killed the deal right after it happened Bc of how poorly he was graded years prior.
RE: Whats next? Fox as head coach if he gets canned?
Fucking Mara couldnt wait one god damn week to see if there was someone better?
No. Clearly Mara doesn't care about winning he just wanted to hire someone who you hated.
Funny that half of BBI loved gettleman two years ago. Now for whatever reason half of BBI things he's part of the old guard. I don't even know what that means. Neither does anyone else here.
Exactly. As soon as Reese was fired, I said its going to be Gettelman. That interview process was a disgrace. I expect all scouts and members of the front office to keep their jobs, even the coaching staff.
A quote from ESPNs the "great analytics rankings" written in 2015.
"Enter New England, where Dimitroff worked from 2002-2008. From the ESPN analytics article, One NFL analytics professional called the Patriots a "big black hole" when it comes to revealing any secrets But some evidence of the implementation of analytics has escaped the Patriots' gravitational field, and it suggests that the Patriots are one of the most innovative teams in the NFL. For 15 years, Ernie Adams a former Wall Street trader has worked to create cutting edge models for team building and in game play. It goes on to talk about their arbitrage strategies multiplying draft picks and squeezing trade value out of declining veterans."
The Pats have been great at minimizing weaknesses and limiting the downside of individual moves to remain prosperous. There is no doubt in my mind advanced analytics have played a part in this.
The Eagles are sitting atop the NFC right now with one of the more progressive analytics programs.
Now was the time to look forward and it seems we've doubled down on the past. There is such thing as too much loyalty, especially when technology is rapidly advancing.
It would be another thing if I could be optimistic and say "hey, maybe Gettleman is an open minded guy that will combine many opinions and leverage a lot of new ideas." everything I've read about him makes him seem the polar opposite.
He's a smart football man and he has the guts to stand up to anyone.
Except John Mara......
He was fired from the Panthers for disagreeing with ownership and standing his ground. So yeah, you have no clue wtf youre talking about.
I do actually. He got hired because hes a part of the good ole boy network here. He will do what John-boy tells him to.
He had no ties to Richardson and he was only fired to appease players who basically mutinied. Richardson by all accounts liked Gettleman and was pressured by others to fire him.
not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
this is why they'll most likely wind up where they are in 2017..I'll bet anything..because they..mara..is afraid to think outside the box so to speak. pretty bad imo
They knew who the next guy was, probably before even firing the current guy, and then put on their transparent dog and pony show for the fans. There was not interest in bringing in someone from the "outside." Mara has no balls to do that.
not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
Eh... well see. Im not one of those We need to hire some outside the box! guys. My disappointment stems strictly from the fact that their extensive search wasnt very extensive at all... not in the amount of interviews they had before settling on someone NOR the types of individuals they interviewed (ie. someone not already linked to the organization either currently or in the past). I just feel like theyre really missing out on a golden opportunity to get some thoughts from some guys outside the organization to hear what theyd do to fix this mess. Even if they didnt go with any of those other choices they wouldve at least perhaps heard some suggestions that they couldve incorporated anyway.
Gettleman being the pick doesnt bother me... how quickly he was the pick does.
this is why they'll most likely wind up where they are in 2017..I'll bet anything..because they..mara..is afraid to think outside the box so to speak. pretty bad imo
not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
Yes. I honestly don't know enough about most of the GM candidates to comment one way of the other on who would be better, but your assessment seems correct. Is there someone else you wanted? I was intrigued by Riddick, but honestly have no idea if he would be any good.
Dave Gettleman loves his hog mollies, as he likes to call them. Expect him to go to work almost immediately on that offensive line.
Love hearing this. So he likes to build from the inside out. I don't see how Ross survives the purge.
I understand those who are disappointed with the process. This was not an exhaustive search. But, there is a lot to like here.
I said all along that this process was about Mara returning the franchise to its foundation. If Gentleman is a trenches first, and pushes for the hire of a head coach with leadership qualities, then Mara has taken a major step to doing just that.
So in 2005, at age 54, he repented and put his faith in Yeshua (Jesus) as the promised Messiah who died and rose again for the forgiveness of his sins, to give him eternal life.
Its given me such a sense of peace, a sense of calm that I didnt have before, Gettleman said.
He believes it was Gods plan to bring him to the Panthers from the Giants in January 2013, long after he had envisioned becoming a general manager.
I'm a complete believer in religious freedom, so I have no problem with anyone's beliefs.
But I have to admit, most of the Jews for Jesus that I have met are a little bit nutty
then hes going to be a Fav around here. I like the hire. Its a no nonsense hire and thats what the Giants need right now. Someone that can come in and start to right the ship immediately. A new GM, with no prior experience would be feeling his way for a little while. Abrahms will probably be groomed to take over and thats not a bad thing either.
Lets get this ball rolling the other way now. Wondering if Wilks will be the favorite now or will they go with experience?
1. Successful experience as GM
2. Good record in the draft
3. Shrewd contract negotiator
4. Emphasizes importance of line play
5. Good at finding value in FA.
seems like a tough prick whose dickhead nature bit him in the ass. hopefully he's learned from it. that said, he oversaw winning programs at NYG and CAR. i'll take it, just will pray he sends marc ross packing..
Sometimes you need a "tough prick".
- read the riot act
- get rid of those not "all in"
- cut bait with stars BEFORE they start their decline
I am still uncertain whether his hard nosed style did him in or did Jerry Richardson's surgery cause a change n judgement to where he got over attached to his "stars". (the "I love you buddy" syndrome.)
We here at Jints Central hereby summons everyone back into the box!
The Jints Central Box!
How f-ckin predictable.
Right. And you just knew that mcadoo and Reese would be fired mid seasons And gettleman would replace them.
This was anything but predictable. Just because the Giants hired a guy with ties here doesn't mean it's a bad or lazy hire. And vice Versa bringing in an outsider doesn't ensure success. Mcadoo was an outsider. How'd that work. You guys are being ridiculous.
the Panthers were a mediocre team before he got there. They had Cam and Kuechly but little else. From 2006-2012 they had 1 winning season (2008 at 12-4) but they were always 6-10, 7-9, 8-8 with a 2-14 dropped in there (the year before they drafted Cam).
Gettleman gets there and the Panthers make the playoffs 3 times (12-4, 7-8-1 in a lucky season, and 15-1) and the Super Bowl once
RE: RE: For those who don't like the Gettleman pick
Ahh, the ignorance of youth (including math).
He is 66. The last time I looked, the NYGs don't require their GM to participate in scrimmages.
As someone older than Dave I can attest that mental capabilities are still sharp at 70 and are enhanced by experience.
Tom Coughlin was a predictable hire too. He was part of the old guard. Was that an uninspiring hire? Mcadoo wasn't part of any old guard here. He sucked.
To continue, not many GMs are sitting on the couch
with a 12-4 season and a 15-1 season + NFC Championship on their resume in 4 years as GM. Gettleman is the goods. He and Reese were the minds behind the 2007-2008 Giants who went 25-5 over a 30 game stretch with a Super Bowl
the Panthers were a mediocre team before he got there. They had Cam and Kuechly but little else. From 2006-2012 they had 1 winning season (2008 at 12-4) but they were always 6-10, 7-9, 8-8 with a 2-14 dropped in there (the year before they drafted Cam).
Gettleman gets there and the Panthers make the playoffs 3 times (12-4, 7-8-1 in a lucky season, and 15-1) and the Super Bowl once
That team was already rebuilding before Gettleman got there. He got the job just as Cam was turning into a finished product at QB. It's tough to pin "winning" on the guy who got to inherit a pair of franchise-changing talents.
Sounds like Gettleman is here to mentor Abrams for a few more years till retirement. A frontrunner for HC now has to be current Panthers DC Steve Wilks. He has done a good job with that talented defense. It will be curious to see if the Giants go to a 3-4 now. If I'm not mistaken, Carolina's defense is a 3-4.
you need linebackers that can actually play to play a 3-4
the Panthers were a mediocre team before he got there. They had Cam and Kuechly but little else. From 2006-2012 they had 1 winning season (2008 at 12-4) but they were always 6-10, 7-9, 8-8 with a 2-14 dropped in there (the year before they drafted Cam).
Gettleman gets there and the Panthers make the playoffs 3 times (12-4, 7-8-1 in a lucky season, and 15-1) and the Super Bowl once
That team was already rebuilding before Gettleman got there. He got the job just as Cam was turning into a finished product at QB. It's tough to pin "winning" on the guy who got to inherit a pair of franchise-changing talents.
Gettleman had the option to fire Ron Rivera when he was hired and chose to keep him. A very important move and the correct one for the Panthers. Cam and Kuechly were there but the rest of that team needed an overhaul and Gettleman successfully did it
the Panthers were a mediocre team before he got there. They had Cam and Kuechly but little else. From 2006-2012 they had 1 winning season (2008 at 12-4) but they were always 6-10, 7-9, 8-8 with a 2-14 dropped in there (the year before they drafted Cam).
Gettleman gets there and the Panthers make the playoffs 3 times (12-4, 7-8-1 in a lucky season, and 15-1) and the Super Bowl once
That team was already rebuilding before Gettleman got there. He got the job just as Cam was turning into a finished product at QB. It's tough to pin "winning" on the guy who got to inherit a pair of franchise-changing talents.
Gettleman had the option to fire Ron Rivera when he was hired and chose to keep him. A very important move and the correct one for the Panthers. Cam and Kuechly were there but the rest of that team needed an overhaul and Gettleman successfully did it
They finished 2nd in their division in 2012, before he got there, and were middle of the pack in offensive and defensive rankings. He took over a team that was already moving in the right direction, but was hamstrung by cap mismanagement.
Also, if you think back to our FA signings during Gettleman's tenure
as pro personnel director here, they were largely good before he left, and went to pot after he left.
--He helped build a veteran OL to get Kerry Collins protected in 2000. Then that line broke down and he helped build the Diehl-Seubert-O'Hara-Snee-McKenzie group (was part of signing Seubert, O'Hara and McKenzie)
--He was instrumental in bringing Plax and Pierce here along with the aforementioned McKenzie in 2005. Reese ran the draft for EA at the time so those signings were largely Gettleman.
--He helped sign key veterans in the SB 42 run like RW McQuarters, Sam Madison, and Kawika Mitchell.
--He helped bring in Michael Boley, Rocky Bernard, and Chris Canty, who were key parts of the SB 46 season. He and Reese were part of finding Cruz
Since Gettleman left in 2012, we haven't done nearly as well in FA. DRC was our best signing in 2014. Vernon was an overpay. Jenkins had a Pro Bowl year in 2016 but had an off year this year. Every other FA was a bust
RE: Also, if you think back to our FA signings during Gettleman's tenure
Since Gettleman left in 2012, we haven't done nearly as well in FA. DRC was our best signing in 2014. Vernon was an overpay. Jenkins had a Pro Bowl year in 2016 but had an off year this year. Every other FA was a bust
Damon Harrison was a bust?
Gettleman was here for CC Brown and Brandon Myers too
Right. And you just knew that mcadoo and Reese would be fired mid seasons And gettleman would replace them.
This was anything but predictable. Just because the Giants hired a guy with ties here doesn't mean it's a bad or lazy hire. And vice Versa bringing in an outsider doesn't ensure success. Mcadoo was an outsider. How'd that work. You guys are being ridiculous.
Look, Jints Central tried the young head coach and the young African American GM. So they can always say they checked the youth box and the minority box.
Now that that has failed, it's back to the "Giants Way" - older white guys back in charge.
Can we really deny that? They bring back the former old white guy - Ernie Accorsi - to advise the older white guy owner - Mara - to hire the former old white guy who is now an older white guy. It's just so Jints Central... ;)
RW mcquarters, Kawika Mitchell and sam Madison- that's who you're using to defend his work? That's pathetic
All three were signed very cheaply but played huge roles in our SB winning 2007 season so that isn't pathetic and this is coming from someone who isn't a big Gettleman fan.
is insisting they all of a sudden hired Gettleman because they have a big name coach interested. He thinks its Harbaugh. I think its just they want to start interviewing head coaches right away.
Right. And you just knew that mcadoo and Reese would be fired mid seasons And gettleman would replace them.
This was anything but predictable. Just because the Giants hired a guy with ties here doesn't mean it's a bad or lazy hire. And vice Versa bringing in an outsider doesn't ensure success. Mcadoo was an outsider. How'd that work. You guys are being ridiculous.
Look, Jints Central tried the young head coach and the young African American GM. So they can always say they checked the youth box and the minority box.
Now that that has failed, it's back to the "Giants Way" - older white guys back in charge.
Can we really deny that? They bring back the former old white guy - Ernie Accorsi - to advise the older white guy owner - Mara - to hire the former old white guy who is now an older white guy. It's just so Jints Central... ;)
Hey T-Bone. Happy Holidays old BBI friend. Good to be back, kicking it around...
Hope things are good with you and your family.
Things are great sir, thanks. Some of these guys dont know... you oooooooold school. LMAO! Really good to see some of the old heads pop in here from time to time. Of course with you itd be when the team is sucking. lol
From what I have read. He trades up and down. He has a great eye for finding free agents at the right price with good value. He inherited a team that was 13 million over the cap. He fired no one in the front office and was greatly respected for that by the organization. He was fired because he wanted to get rid of a few very expensive vets who were not worth their salaries but were loved by the owner. I'm very hopeful that he has similar success with the NYFG.
Things are great sir, thanks. Some of these guys dont know... you oooooooold school. LMAO! Really good to see some of the old heads pop in here from time to time. Of course with you itd be when the team is sucking. lol
Happy Holidays to you and yours too.
Well, BBI is most interesting when things start to get a little dirty and nuts. And you know that's always been catnip for me... ;)
I wanted Riddick but I am satisfied with this issue. From the Giants point of view I am sure he absolutely killed the interview. He knows them. His is experienced.
I am happy. I think he can fix this. That is all that matters. We might as well all get behind him. He is what we got, support him until he proves unworthy. Would rather have him operate from a position of security and confidence rather than indecisive and weak.
Let's see who the head coach is, that will tell us more. I would be interested to see if Webb plays. It has to be the reason they activated him. This was in the works(guess). Part of his interview was to tell them they need to play the young kid immediately. No reason to announce it and let the other team know.
is insisting they all of a sudden hired Gettleman because they have a big name coach interested. He thinks its Harbaugh. I think its just they want to start interviewing head coaches right away.
I expect Mara and Gettleman will be scheduling interviews by Monday at lunchtime.
He was responsible for our best FA hauls and in season stocking of the roster for a long time. McKenzie, Burress, Pierce, O'Hara, Bass, Boothe, Andrews, Hiding, Hedgecock, the list goes on. He kept this OL stocked and he kept the end of the roster strong for years. He's been involved with 7 super bowl teams, that is not a coincidence, the dude knows football and players and how to build a team but he's old and white and he's been here before so he sucks right? He is the best candidate for this job hands fucking down. If you don't like it, you know dick about football and that's honestly most of you. Most of you never played and have no fucking idea what makes a good football player or a good football team. So go cry for a while over dinner and when this team is a contender again in a few months or a year you can cry about something else.
I was in the third row when we played Gettleman's team in 2015
That team was on another level physically from us. Shaq Thompson fucked Dewayne Harris up in a kick return... It got the biggest cheer from the Panther sideline of the whole game. That team was full of violent, unpleasant players and would have won the Super Bowl if Cam Newton weren't such a gutless punk.
There are countless moving parts to contend with:
4. Eli Apple disaster
I doubt this is as big a thing for the front office as it is for us fans. He's a problem, he's troubled, and though he's talented, he's on the verge of being a colossal bust for the Giants. But he's not the first troubled problem player with a lot of talent (the Giants had Will Hill not that long ago), it's not that unusual around the league. First rounders bust all the time. Experienced executives have seen this before and know what to do about it.
RE: I was in the third row when we played Gettleman's team in 2015
That team was on another level physically from us. Shaq Thompson fucked Dewayne Harris up in a kick return... It got the biggest cheer from the Panther sideline of the whole game. That team was full of violent, unpleasant players and would have won the Super Bowl if Cam Newton weren't such a gutless punk.
It wasnt a team put together by Gettleman though. lol. They went to the Super Bowl because Cam Newton was unbelievable that season.
I'm sure if that was Reese he'd get full credit, though.
... He kept this OL stocked and he kept the end of the roster strong for years.
Hi Joey. Good to see your regard for fellow BBIers in mid-season form.
Although I have no particular problem with the choice of Gettleman, I think your assessment of his track record is overly generous in some areas.
Did he really keep the OL stocked and the bottom of the roster strong? How many seasons during his tenure were derailed by thin patches in the roster, and/or a cluster of injuries? Remember the crater at CB in 1999? The DL and WRs in 2002? The OL and TE in 2003? The DL in 2004? The LBs and CBs in 2005? The DL in 2006? The DL again and WRs in 2008? The safeties and LBs in 2009? The WRs in 2010? The LBs again during the November/December slump in 2011?
What about the gradual implosion of the OL after 2008? You see a unit that was kept "stocked". I see depth that was mostly untested during the line's prime years. From 2005 to 2008, Snee, O'Hara, McKenzie and Diehl missed a total of four starts. Health aside, there was another important element of luck: When Petitgout went down, Seubert returned from a catastrophic injury to give five years of surprising yeoman service, and Diehl proved adequate at left tackle. So Coughlin and Flaherty seldom had to dig deeper than the first man off the bench. When they did... well, remember Bob Whitfield at tackle in 2006?
Then there's the other depth bullet this team has dodged, which mostly goes overlooked: the appalling backups to Eli Manning. Aside from Jesse Palmer filling in for Collins at the end of a lost 2003 season, the Accorsi/Reese Giants never had to cope with an injury at quarterback. Imagine Tim Hasselbeck or Jared Lorenzen under center in a playoff game. Good lord.
I don't really blame Gettleman for this history. Accorsi and Reese allocated the team's resources. But if you're going to credit Dave Gettleman with astute bottom-of-the-roster acquisitions like R.W. McQuarters or the overdue return of Chase Blackburn, it's important to also acknowledge the meaningful snaps taken by marginal pros and spent vets like Jeremy Lincoln, Ian Allen, Darnell Dinkins, Kevin Lewis, Alonzo Jackson, Terrell Buckley, Will Demps, C.C. Brown, Aaron Rouse, Danny Clark, Michael Clayton, and many others.
in a very long time. So I really have no issue with people being up in arms over this.
There is as much validity in being for it as there is for being against it.
I was indifferent to it, it was an expected, safe hire...
But like I said, when I see certain posters get up in arms over it, posters who are usually pretty wrong more often than not, it makes me feel better about the hire.
RE: RE: The Giants front office hasn't done much of anything right
in a very long time. So I really have no issue with people being up in arms over this.
There is as much validity in being for it as there is for being against it.
I was indifferent to it, it was an expected, safe hire...
But like I said, when I see certain posters get up in arms over it, posters who are usually pretty wrong more often than not, it makes me feel better about the hire.
the giants have had a framework that has been successful, regardless of the fk ups of recent years.
they believe in it, and the guy they are hiring has been successful. this is not a reach, and its not a forced in house hire. Its a professional with success that has worked with the team before but also offers a fresh view on talent evaluation and the draft and cap usage... that has been the issue.
the key for the future imo is more around the coach and his assistants... what scheme are we running and does it fit our players.
Has a lot of work to do. There is some serious roster cleanup needed. There are removals needed to clean up the toxicity in the locker room. Theres also serious accountability needed on guys like Sternfeld and Ross who have done very shaky here.
Those who think this is just a coaching change and a few tweaks away from being a playoff team are kidding themselves.
QB of the future is a big one this offseason. I think the chances actually increased still that we take a QB, but this probably gives Eli one more year. Im willing to accept that so long as the coach is given the support to bench Eli next year when things go awry.
Im willing to give this a chance but the window for success if really not they big and this may only end up a 3 year GM stint. I like continuity as much as the next guy but continuity and familiarity doesnt always guarantee itself to be able to generate the sustainable success teams look for.
This is pretty much par for the course when it comes to
Some things to really like about Gettleman - especially his lack of nostalgia for vets.
Mara trusts him - big element in this. For the crowd who wants Mara completely out of the room, this should point toward that.
Also - in a development that might make Go Terps just go ahead and die a happy man now - Gettleman could have the distinction of being the guy who opted not sign both Norman and Beckham to longterm deals.
That team was on another level physically from us. Shaq Thompson fucked Dewayne Harris up in a kick return... It got the biggest cheer from the Panther sideline of the whole game. That team was full of violent, unpleasant players and would have won the Super Bowl if Cam Newton weren't such a gutless punk.
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Giants remain very high on the internal candidates they interviewed but Gettleman has GM experience. Can work well with them
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Ha ha. Most exhaustive search since Dick Cheney found himself for W's VP.
And for all we know, Gettlemen might have just blown the other interviewees out of the water.
^^^ This
What I'm worried about though is this just means we keep the status quo for the scouting department. Marc Ross has got to go, and making an "in house" hire like this leaves me less confident of that
😂😂😂
Atoning for their sins?
Hopeful we get a young progressive coach.
Guess we'll hear the coaching candidates on Monday
Wolf
Caserio
DeCosta right off the top of my head. The NYG way hasnt worked for quite a while and now they bring a guy back with that in his blood. This thing needed an enema, not a blood transfusion.
LOL......HC, Free agency, and draft will be the real excitement :)
lol - ( New Window )
He's 66, this figures to be a relatively short stint.
Lonk - ( New Window )
Obviously doesnt know the organization. They almost never go beyond their safety zone. And thats my problem with the hire.
He's 66, this figures to be a relatively short stint.
More interested to see who is named to Ross' spot. Not to mention, hoping to hear Ross is canned.
No, it was BS from day 1. Just Mara needing to feel "comforted".
1. Nepotism is king
2. Aaron Rogers cures a lot of poor drafts.
No one from New England has ever done anything away from Belichek, not even on the Executive level. No one.
I do like Decosta, he learned under Newsome, who is one of the best executives in the league.
not a 70 year old...
You've outed yourself as a future asshat.
We expect good things.
Quote:
Who would you rather have?
not a 70 year old...
Well, he's 66 for starters.
Quote:
Who would you rather have?
Wolf
Caserio
DeCosta right off the top of my head. The NYG way hasnt worked for quite a while and now they bring a guy back with that in his blood. This thing needed an enema, not a blood transfusion.
NYG way hasnt worked for quite a while? They won 2 Super Bowls in the last 10 years. Those dont count as working?
Just because he worked with Reese doesn't mean he'll operate like Reese.
Very interested to see who the HC will be.
Ernie Accorsi earning a six figure commission on this is kind of hilarious.
I think people getting all pissed off about the hire is strange. Not sure why you automatically assume he will fail.
Just because he worked with Reese doesn't mean he'll operate like Reese.
Very interested to see who the HC will be.
I think the fear is he will retain a bunch of Scouts including Marc Ross, when our drafting has been piss poor.
I do remember complaining about this last week and being told I dont know the rules and I dont know anything about hiring and about Garsfolo discussing a Gettleman/Abrams duo (although he had it in reverse) as something that makes the most sense. You were actually nice about it T-Bone but some of the others chose to bury their heads in the sand and ignore Garafolos tweets. This kind of reminds me of the Spags/McAdoo dilemma when McAdoo got the job, if Spags was in more demand and he would have left Spags would have gotten the HC job. It is clear they do t like muhchange. The Giants are rarely bold and rarely go outside their comfort zone. Since the young/Perkins hiring, the only guy I remember ever being outside the chain was Reeves and he was from the Landry coaching tree, which Wellington had a connection with.
I wouldn't bet on that now. I see them trying to go for the quick fix and when that doesn't work, having this same conversation a year from now.
You've seen it in your own workplace, I'll bet. I know I have.
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Gettleman seems to be a winner.
Just because he worked with Reese doesn't mean he'll operate like Reese.
Very interested to see who the HC will be.
I think the fear is he will retain a bunch of Scouts including Marc Ross, when our drafting has been piss poor.
We'll have to see. He's in charge of that now, so he'll be making the decision on the scouting department.
Quite possibly we get some of the scouts from Carolina, with the team up for sale?
I think Gettleman blazes his own trail...........
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draft a QB round 1 and not try and make a run with Eli.
Eli looks bad. He isnt going to do anything but continue to get worse. He made his hundreds of millions. Its time for him to go.
I wouldn't bet on that now. I see them trying to go for the quick fix and when that doesn't work, having this same conversation a year from now.
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Who would you rather have?
Wolf
Caserio
DeCosta right off the top of my head. The NYG way hasnt worked for quite a while and now they bring a guy back with that in his blood. This thing needed an enema, not a blood transfusion.
An enema is a more thorough flushing of the system than a blood transfusion? That's some enema.
OK, I laughed.
He's 66, this figures to be a relatively short stint.
Of course it's uninspired - it's the Maras. When it comes time to make tough decisions they have rarely thought outside the box or the lineage.
Does Gettleman = Darnold or Chubb?
Two negative outcomes of this move.
However I will judge Gettleman on three things:
HC
QB
Culture
These are things he must change and improve quickly for a turnaround.
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to help them find...Gettleman?
Ernie Accorsi earning a six figure commission on this is kind of hilarious.
It's worse than the Gene Okerlund hotline he used to have in WWE and WCW. #Scam
If ownership really was wowed by Riddick then they should replace Ross with him.
2. Much has been made of how Gentleman handled negotiations with veteran players. But to be honest, the Panthers were over invested in two aging RBs and an aging WR. Aside from his handling of the Olson contract I see no issue there.
3. On Josh Norman, the mistake he made there was not trading him. Norman is not a shutdown corner.
4. Reports are he is gruff and not personable. You can make the case this organization needs a bit more of that. Besides, I think Abrams will continue to manage the cap and contracts.
5. Agree with those who say he is grooming Abram.
6. I think the Giants wanted to get the GM in place so they can interview coaching candidates after this weekend.
7. Keep an eye on Carolina d coordinator Steve Will as a HC candidate, Al Holcomb panthers LB coach as an D coordinator candidate, and Chase Blackburn Carolina asst special teams coach as a special teams coach for the Giants.
@RVacchianoSNY
New Giants GM Dave Gettleman is expected to keep interim GM Kevin Abrams on board in his previous position, as assistant GM, according to sources.
- Guy has been involved in a bunch of teams, including us, appearing in a lot of super bowls.
- Relieved of his duties in Carolina, not because he couldn't build a team, because he made big boy moves and got rid of old aging stars. He was willing to make tough decisions for the betterment of the franchise.
- I don't see this as a way of Mara escaping changes. If anything, he's probably a little worried...Gettleman is going to tell him whats wrong with this roster right to his face.
- By far the most accomplished guy available, what's the argument for hiring a young guy with less success? IF he is successful he can stay around longer? Let's worry about now. He is the right guy.
I would like this
2. Much has been made of how Gentleman handled negotiations with veteran players. But to be honest, the Panthers were over invested in two aging RBs and an aging WR. Aside from his handling of the Olson contract I see no issue there.
3. On Josh Norman, the mistake he made there was not trading him. Norman is not a shutdown corner.
4. Reports are he is gruff and not personable. You can make the case this organization needs a bit more of that. Besides, I think Abrams will continue to manage the cap and contracts.
5. Agree with those who say he is grooming Abram.
6. I think the Giants wanted to get the GM in place so they can interview coaching candidates after this weekend.
7. Keep an eye on Carolina d coordinator Steve Will as a HC candidate, Al Holcomb panthers LB coach as an D coordinator candidate, and Chase Blackburn Carolina asst special teams coach as a special teams coach for the Giants.
Emil, good post. Sounds like George Young to me lol.......
Def agree with point #6, as they probably definitely already have a guy in mind, as it came up in the interview no doubt.
You make the splash with your HC, not the GM.
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not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
I do remember complaining about this last week and being told I dont know the rules and I dont know anything about hiring and about Garsfolo discussing a Gettleman/Abrams duo (although he had it in reverse) as something that makes the most sense. You were actually nice about it T-Bone but some of the others chose to bury their heads in the sand and ignore Garafolos tweets. This kind of reminds me of the Spags/McAdoo dilemma when McAdoo got the job, if Spags was in more demand and he would have left Spags would have gotten the HC job. It is clear they do t like muhchange. The Giants are rarely bold and rarely go outside their comfort zone. Since the young/Perkins hiring, the only guy I remember ever being outside the chain was Reeves and he was from the Landry coaching tree, which Wellington had a connection with.
Yeah... I was pretty nice about it... and you proceeded to ignore me throughout that thread. I hate being ignored. I'd rather you just tell me to fuck off than ignore me. That said, with the news that just broke about the new GM, that thread would've made a lot more sense had you posted it NOW than when you did.
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Ralph VacchianoVerified account
@RVacchianoSNY
New Giants GM Dave Gettleman is expected to keep interim GM Kevin Abrams on board in his previous position, as assistant GM, according to sources.
How can you have anything negative to say about Abrams?
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Ralph VacchianoVerified account
@RVacchianoSNY
New Giants GM Dave Gettleman is expected to keep interim GM Kevin Abrams on board in his previous position, as assistant GM, according to sources.
More that that, hes going to groom him to be his successor in 3-5 years.
Because it seems he was hired for that part of his resume you want us to leave out.
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Ralph VacchianoVerified account
@RVacchianoSNY
New Giants GM Dave Gettleman is expected to keep interim GM Kevin Abrams on board in his previous position, as assistant GM, according to sources.
Why ugh? This is a very good thing. Abrams is an excellent cap guy.
During that time period the Giants made the playoffs 7 times.
During that time period the Giants Made 3 super bowls appearances.
During that time period the Giants won 2 championships.
2. Much has been made of how Gentleman handled negotiations with veteran players. But to be honest, the Panthers were over invested in two aging RBs and an aging WR. Aside from his handling of the Olson contract I see no issue there.
3. On Josh Norman, the mistake he made there was not trading him. Norman is not a shutdown corner.
4. Reports are he is gruff and not personable. You can make the case this organization needs a bit more of that. Besides, I think Abrams will continue to manage the cap and contracts.
5. Agree with those who say he is grooming Abram.
6. I think the Giants wanted to get the GM in place so they can interview coaching candidates after this weekend.
7. Keep an eye on Carolina d coordinator Steve Will as a HC candidate, Al Holcomb panthers LB coach as an D coordinator candidate, and Chase Blackburn Carolina asst special teams coach as a special teams coach for the Giants.
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insert another team, everything else equal, would there be as much moaning and groaning? Bottom line, he did a good job when he was here. He did a good job in Carolina and got fired for trying to do what many here complain that Reese wouldn't do. If they are sold on his abilities why wait 6-8 weeks? Get started now.
Because it seems he was hired for that part of his resume you want us to leave out.
Matty. Once again you and I see it the same way.
During that time period the Giants made the playoffs 7 times.
During that time period the Giants Made 3 super bowls appearances.
During that time period the Giants won 2 championships.
and coughlin won two championships as a coach do you want to hire him back too? Your point?
do we have to dust the cobwebs off gettleman before he steps into the building?
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As Pro Personnel Director.
During that time period the Giants made the playoffs 7 times.
During that time period the Giants Made 3 super bowls appearances.
During that time period the Giants won 2 championships.
and coughlin won two championships as a coach do you want to hire him back too? Your point?
do we have to dust the cobwebs off gettleman before he steps into the building?
In regards to Coughlin, after this past season, yes.
Firing him was a mistake two years ago.
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1. I understand many wanted fresh blood and a new approach. Some wanted a splash. Well I don't think the GM hire is where you make a splash. You need a GM with a steady hand, especially with this team right now.
2. Much has been made of how Gentleman handled negotiations with veteran players. But to be honest, the Panthers were over invested in two aging RBs and an aging WR. Aside from his handling of the Olson contract I see no issue there.
3. On Josh Norman, the mistake he made there was not trading him. Norman is not a shutdown corner.
4. Reports are he is gruff and not personable. You can make the case this organization needs a bit more of that. Besides, I think Abrams will continue to manage the cap and contracts.
5. Agree with those who say he is grooming Abram.
6. I think the Giants wanted to get the GM in place so they can interview coaching candidates after this weekend.
7. Keep an eye on Carolina d coordinator Steve Will as a HC candidate, Al Holcomb panthers LB coach as an D coordinator candidate, and Chase Blackburn Carolina asst special teams coach as a special teams coach for the Giants.
Emil, good post. Sounds like George Young to me lol.......
Def agree with point #6, as they probably definitely already have a guy in mind, as it came up in the interview no doubt.
You make the splash with your HC, not the GM.
That was my thought too. George Young like hire.
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In comment 13757828 Mr. Bungle said:
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to help them find...Gettleman?
Ernie Accorsi earning a six figure commission on this is kind of hilarious.
It's worse than the Gene Okerlund hotline he used to have in WWE and WCW. #Scam
Can't even get mad at it, pretty genius. Start an NFL Executive hiring consultancy firm and just suggest your old buddies to your clients.
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
He is still the same guy
He's 66, this figures to be a relatively short stint.
If Darnold stays in school, I'm all onboard for retooling with Eli
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Now, does DG make the safe move and try to retool with Eli at QB, if Darnold stays at USC. Does he fret about paying OB, LC, et al.
He's 66, this figures to be a relatively short stint.
If Darnold stays in school, I'm all onboard for retooling with Eli
Ridiculous. Hes turning 37!!!!
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
this is what bothers me...whats the rush? Is Gettleman/Wilks that much of a hot GM/coaching candidates we needed to have a GM in place before year end?
The fact they didn't do an extensive search is bogus to me. We needed a house cleaning instead the interviewed a bunch of guys they already new and picked one instead of god forbid looking outside the organization for once...SMH rinse, wash, repeat with the mara's.
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
Eric - again, I think it's because they know Gettleman, and realize the coach they want is out there, and you can't wait to start interviewing HC's at the end of January - while they stew on a GM.
They want to do it starting next week.
They were not. They were average.
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Who would you rather have?
not a 70 year old...
I'm sure many here would have loved Coughlin as the GM. Got no issue with Gentleman's age. This franchise just needs to win games. If a 90 year old helps you do that, you hire him.
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Ralph VacchianoVerified account
@RVacchianoSNY
New Giants GM Dave Gettleman is expected to keep interim GM Kevin Abrams on board in his previous position, as assistant GM, according to sources.
Why ugh? This is a very good thing. Abrams is an excellent cap guy.
Based on what? The JPP contract?
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
Its was Gettlemans job as soon as Reese handed in his building access card. The exhaustive search was nothing more than dog and pony show rhetoric. Mara could have done better if he wasnt terrified of change. Nothing is going to change here. If I had to guess, if this is a 3-5 year appointment due to his advanced age, Im expecting mediocre drafts, rosters, and team records. Exactly like the Reese years.
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draft a QB round 1 and not try and make a run with Eli.
I wouldn't bet on that now. I see them trying to go for the quick fix and when that doesn't work, having this same conversation a year from now.
If Darnold stays in school, I doubt they take a QB in round 1.
The owners take a very long view. The Mara family has been owners for nearly 100 years. The've won a bunch of NFL and Super Bowl championships. They have a way of doing things, and over that century, it's been pretty successful. There have been bad times over that century but they've always come back to succeed.
We fans, though, are much more in the here-and-now, and less inclined to think in the long-term (like, decades). We want villains punished (Reese, McAdoo, Ross, whoever) and new heroes in their place. Or maybe old heroes like Coughlin, Parcells and Belichik. We want to feel good NOW.
I don't know that the owners' long-term view is any healthier than the fans' view at this point, but even if it is, it's not clear they're succeeding strategically anyway. It's not like ownership has been killing it lately. Met Life Stadium is new, expensive and unloved. The team's gone from crummy-mediocre to flat out terrible, the drafts have stunk, the locker room is in chaos, the coaches seem helpless.
Until proven otherwise, I'm inclined to think that the owners take the long view, ineffectively.
He has a great chance. Spineless Mara knows him and feels comfortable. That itself probably has him as candidate #1.
There are countless moving parts to contend with:
1. Hiring the next head coach
2. How to handle Eli Manning
3. How to approach OBJ contract
4. Eli Apple disaster
5. Creating cap space
6. Rebuilding the O Line
7. Drafting and signing NFL Linebackers
8. Handling the highest draft pick since 1981
I would want somebody I know and trust to handle this many issues in one offseason.
I give Gettlemen as good a shot as anyone to chip away at this list.
Look, Gettleman may be the best candidate.
But it is clear the Giants were NEVER serious about exploring other options. Even in terms of kabuki theater, the Giants are horrible.
"Sorry, I have to take a shit...."
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why are so many people upset with this hire?
They were not. They were average.
Thank you.
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why are so many people upset with this hire?
They were not. They were average.
Winning team in a tough division. He was a success in Carolina.
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why are so many people upset with this hire?
They were not. They were average.
Lotulelei, Kawann Short, Kelvin Benjamin, Trai Turner, Shaq Thompson, Devin Funchess, James Bradberry. That's above average, especially on the lines and defensively
Restore pride
Bingo.
The Jints Central Box!
How f-ckin predictable.
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
And doubtful Ross and Abrams were serious candidates. Abrams is a cap guy without any personnel experience and Ross was in part to blame for the team's personnel problems.
So a guy they saw on TV and the guy they intended to hire all along.
There are countless moving parts to contend with:
1. Hiring the next head coach
2. How to handle Eli Manning
3. How to approach OBJ contract
4. Eli Apple disaster
5. Creating cap space
6. Rebuilding the O Line
7. Drafting and signing NFL Linebackers
8. Handling the highest draft pick since 1981
I would want somebody I know and trust to handle this many issues in one offseason.
I give Gettlemen as good a shot as anyone to chip away at this list.
Yep. And he probably sold Mara on who the next coach could be, and do it well.
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insert another team, everything else equal, would there be as much moaning and groaning? Bottom line, he did a good job when he was here. He did a good job in Carolina and got fired for trying to do what many here complain that Reese wouldn't do. If they are sold on his abilities why wait 6-8 weeks? Get started now.
Because it seems he was hired for that part of his resume you want us to leave out.
Point is, objecting to Gettleman only because he previously worked in the Giants organization makes no sense. It's an emotional reaction. If there are issues with his job performance when he was here or in Carolina, let's hear them.
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The Giants ONLY interviewed four candidates for the position. Three were intimately tied to the Giants:
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
this is what bothers me...whats the rush? Is Gettleman/Wilks that much of a hot GM/coaching candidates we needed to have a GM in place before year end?
The fact they didn't do an extensive search is bogus to me. We needed a house cleaning instead the interviewed a bunch of guys they already new and picked one instead of god forbid looking outside the organization for once...SMH rinse, wash, repeat with the mara's.
I think it's that this team is such a mess that they don't want to waste any time getting leadership in place and fixing the problems.
Accorsi: "Did I ever tell you about the time I was at Polo Grounds in 1951 and saw the Dodgers stealing signs from the outfield before..."
Mara: "Ernie! Ernie! Please focus..."
Accorsi: "Oh, yeah...sorry. Sure. Uh...who was the rotund guy when I was here? He went to Carolina? Gentlemen?"
Mara: "Uh - Gettlemen. It was Gettlemen."
Accorsi: "Right! Him...hire him!"
Mara: "Makes sense, Ernie. Makes sense..."
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In comment 13757921 Eric from BBI said:
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The Giants ONLY interviewed four candidates for the position. Three were intimately tied to the Giants:
(1) Ross
(2) Gettleman
(3) Abrams
(4) Riddick
Whether or not Gettleman is a good candidate, this "exhaustive" process (sarcasm) leaves me very underwhelmed.
this is what bothers me...whats the rush? Is Gettleman/Wilks that much of a hot GM/coaching candidates we needed to have a GM in place before year end?
The fact they didn't do an extensive search is bogus to me. We needed a house cleaning instead the interviewed a bunch of guys they already new and picked one instead of god forbid looking outside the organization for once...SMH rinse, wash, repeat with the mara's.
I think it's that this team is such a mess that they don't want to waste any time getting leadership in place and fixing the problems.
Yes exactly Emil. I think the Browns move with Dorsey scared them. Just like the Eagles interning Macadoo years ago. They just get duped or panic easily. Unless some big time coach has told them he wants the job I dont understand the rush. Who else was interviewing Gettleman?
Get a guy who commands respect in the locker room. Could be Wilkes
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As Pro Personnel Director.
During that time period the Giants made the playoffs 7 times.
During that time period the Giants Made 3 super bowls appearances.
During that time period the Giants won 2 championships.
and coughlin won two championships as a coach do you want to hire him back too? Your point?
do we have to dust the cobwebs off gettleman before he steps into the building?
My point is that find me another possible GM with that track record. By the way, I didn't mention what he did for Carolina.
Accorsi: "Did I ever tell you about the time I was at Polo Grounds in 1951 and saw the Dodgers stealing signs from the outfield before..."
Mara: "Ernie! Ernie! Please focus..."
Accorsi: "Oh, yeah...sorry. Sure. Uh...who was the rotund guy when I was here? He went to Carolina? Gentlemen?"
Mara: "Uh - Gettlemen. It was Gettlemen."
Accorsi: "Right! Him...hire him!"
Mara: "Makes sense, Ernie. Makes sense..."
LOL...
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In comment 13757926 dpinzow said:
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why are so many people upset with this hire?
They were not. They were average.
Lotulelei, Kawann Short, Kelvin Benjamin, Trai Turner, Shaq Thompson, Devin Funchess, James Bradberry. That's above average, especially on the lines and defensively
Not at all. Big hits on the lines. Hes missed largely everywhere else including at WR. Funchess who I like is not making enough strides or consistency. Benjamin has faded. Thompson is highly overrated and snt that good. Kuechly and Davis would make a motionless cadaver look good. Hes added some secondary help through the draft but that was presented out of necessity because of mishandling the Norman situation. Out of the four picks theyve made there only one looks like a player in Bradberry. Worley is terrible. His Carolina draft impact will rest now on the McCaffrey pick.
Beckham, Collins, Kennard, Tomlinson, Pugh, Richburg, Engram, Shepard all in the same time period.
Pro Personnel Director 1999-2012
Look at the free agents he brought in...Kerry Collins, Barrow, Pierce, Plax, Mackenzie, O'Hara along with countless other solid role players like Bob Whitfield and Sam Madison.
What got him kicked out of Carolina is what this roster needs now....some tough love. Also, butting heads with Jerry Richardson doesn't look too bad in retrospect does it??
Not a thrilling or exciting hire, but not the worst. I am hoping that they bring in a new head of Collegiate Scouting, that's Gettleman's weak spot. Also hoping they get a little more creative on the coaching front.
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In comment 13757790 T-Bone said:
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not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
I do remember complaining about this last week and being told I dont know the rules and I dont know anything about hiring and about Garsfolo discussing a Gettleman/Abrams duo (although he had it in reverse) as something that makes the most sense. You were actually nice about it T-Bone but some of the others chose to bury their heads in the sand and ignore Garafolos tweets. This kind of reminds me of the Spags/McAdoo dilemma when McAdoo got the job, if Spags was in more demand and he would have left Spags would have gotten the HC job. It is clear they do t like muhchange. The Giants are rarely bold and rarely go outside their comfort zone. Since the young/Perkins hiring, the only guy I remember ever being outside the chain was Reeves and he was from the Landry coaching tree, which Wellington had a connection with.
Yeah... I was pretty nice about it... and you proceeded to ignore me throughout that thread. I hate being ignored. I'd rather you just tell me to fuck off than ignore me. That said, with the news that just broke about the new GM, that thread would've made a lot more sense had you posted it NOW than when you did.
I kept telling people (which i assumed everyone knew) Garafolo doesnt spitball stuff, his credibility relies on it, especially with the Giants. His tweets (which were spot on except that he had it as a Abrams/Gettleman team as opposed to Gettleman/Abrams) led me to believe this was not the due diligence that people were saying but that the job was real and I wanted them to go bold. With that said, as I mentioned in the post, of the four Gettleman makes me the most comfortable. He has been involved with 9 teams who made the Super Bowl (3 with us). We could have done worse.
Didnt take a Kreskin to predict Gettleman.
My real concern with Gettleman is his age. This is a demanding job. My guess is Abrams will be groomed to succeed him in three or four years. All of this is consistent with how the Giants operate, namely hiring and promoting current and former employees. Reese started as a scout for the Giants.
That IS funny
Whether that is reality or not remains to be seen.
Im ok with Gettleman if he is indeed the guy
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Its was Gettlemans job as soon as Reese handed in his building access card. The exhaustive search was nothing more than dog and pony show rhetoric.
Bingo.
I was told that was the case before Reese was fired, I'd hoped it would not be reality.
12/28/17, 5:10 PM
Interim GM Kevin Abrams is expected to stay on board with the Giants, I'm told. Of course, other teams may want to interview him for their GM jobs.
As opposed to Jerry,in which I hated everything he did.
So it's a slight improvement.
Thats the fear! A lot of nice QBs coming out, gotta take one.
Thanks. A little counter info to the 'ogre-prick' trope.
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Its was Gettlemans job as soon as Reese handed in his building access card. The exhaustive search was nothing more than dog and pony show rhetoric.
Bingo.
I was told that was the case before Reese was fired, I'd hoped it would not be reality.
I couldnt help but feel that way when Gettleman was fired by Carolina. I was almost pissed because I couldnt help but think that we now have our next GM....
Oh well, it is what it is. Like others have said, Im not overly pissed about the choice, but moreso Im pissed about the process.
-Buffalo in 1990 and 1991
-Denver in 1997*
-Giants in 2000, 2007* and 2011*
-Panthers in 2015
And it's just incredible how predictable the script was.
That's a decent list. It's less impressive when you consider that it was spread over more than a decade.
Im ok with Gettleman if he is indeed the guy
That is the perfect way to put it...He is a grown up, and does not play. It may be one of the reasons he was let go from Carolina. With the recent news about the Carolina owner, it would not surprise me if Gettleman "over stepped" his boundaries by standing up to Richardson's inappropriate behavior.
That's a decent list. It's less impressive when you consider that it was spread over more than a decade.
I think it's more impressive that you give it credit for. You have to remember the dollars those guys were signed for, many of them were dirt cheap. A lot of homeruns there, especially a guy like O'Hara who was a bargain bin guy that turned into a perennial pro bowler. Canty, Baas and Boley were mild busts for the price but still contributed. You can add Kenny Holmes to that list. In terms of their own players, which he's advising as well, I can't think of any missteps outside of letting Griffin walk. With the kind of mine field that free agency brings and the value we extracted vs. the contracts, that's a very impressive list IMO.
Wanna bet?
Except John Mara......
I'm extremely disappointed.
No. Clearly Mara doesn't care about winning he just wanted to hire someone who you hated.
Funny that half of BBI loved gettleman two years ago. Now for whatever reason half of BBI things he's part of the old guard. I don't even know what that means. Neither does anyone else here.
Exactly. As soon as Reese was fired, I said its going to be Gettelman. That interview process was a disgrace. I expect all scouts and members of the front office to keep their jobs, even the coaching staff.
A mighty round of applause for anybody that predicted this shocking news, or wants to let us know they heard the scoop earlier...
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He's a smart football man and he has the guts to stand up to anyone.
Except John Mara......
He was fired from the Panthers for disagreeing with ownership and standing his ground. So yeah, you have no clue wtf youre talking about.
we kinda do, it seems gettleman/wilks is a duo...
i think the exact opposite its unwise to hire a GM before you interview GM's from other teams...thats not doing an extensive search...
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He's a smart football man and he has the guts to stand up to anyone.
Except John Mara......
Where are you going with this one? I am not so sure DG is the kind of guy that bows down often...
"Enter New England, where Dimitroff worked from 2002-2008. From the ESPN analytics article, One NFL analytics professional called the Patriots a "big black hole" when it comes to revealing any secrets But some evidence of the implementation of analytics has escaped the Patriots' gravitational field, and it suggests that the Patriots are one of the most innovative teams in the NFL. For 15 years, Ernie Adams a former Wall Street trader has worked to create cutting edge models for team building and in game play. It goes on to talk about their arbitrage strategies multiplying draft picks and squeezing trade value out of declining veterans."
The Pats have been great at minimizing weaknesses and limiting the downside of individual moves to remain prosperous. There is no doubt in my mind advanced analytics have played a part in this.
The Eagles are sitting atop the NFC right now with one of the more progressive analytics programs.
Now was the time to look forward and it seems we've doubled down on the past. There is such thing as too much loyalty, especially when technology is rapidly advancing.
It would be another thing if I could be optimistic and say "hey, maybe Gettleman is an open minded guy that will combine many opinions and leverage a lot of new ideas." everything I've read about him makes him seem the polar opposite.
Sad day for the future of the Giants in an already sad season.
Great analytics rankings - ( New Window )
Best thing to Happen to the @giants in 2017!! Big 1st step in restoring #GiantsPride
That's not true. You can take issue with this "search" for a GM.
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In comment 13758090 Ira said:
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He's a smart football man and he has the guts to stand up to anyone.
Except John Mara......
He was fired from the Panthers for disagreeing with ownership and standing his ground. So yeah, you have no clue wtf youre talking about.
I do actually. He got hired because hes a part of the good ole boy network here. He will do what John-boy tells him to.
He had no ties to Richardson and he was only fired to appease players who basically mutinied. Richardson by all accounts liked Gettleman and was pressured by others to fire him.
To know
this is why they'll most likely wind up where they are in 2017..I'll bet anything..because they..mara..is afraid to think outside the box so to speak. pretty bad imo
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not with them picking Gettleman so much as now they're not going to interview anyone else for the job and I think they're cheating themselves (and the fans) by doing this. I'd have no problem if they'd interviewed everyone they could've interviewed (this is keeping in mind that perhaps their list was much shorter than everyone elses) and decided to go with Gettleman because it would mean they just liked his presentation more. But to only interview what... 3 or 4 people (most of whom were either already in-house or used to be)... just doesn't seem like it was much of a search to me...
Eh... well see. Im not one of those We need to hire some outside the box! guys. My disappointment stems strictly from the fact that their extensive search wasnt very extensive at all... not in the amount of interviews they had before settling on someone NOR the types of individuals they interviewed (ie. someone not already linked to the organization either currently or in the past). I just feel like theyre really missing out on a golden opportunity to get some thoughts from some guys outside the organization to hear what theyd do to fix this mess. Even if they didnt go with any of those other choices they wouldve at least perhaps heard some suggestions that they couldve incorporated anyway.
Gettleman being the pick doesnt bother me... how quickly he was the pick does.
this is why they'll most likely wind up where they are in 2017..I'll bet anything..because they..mara..is afraid to think outside the box so to speak. pretty bad imo
Love hearing this. So he likes to build from the inside out. I don't see how Ross survives the purge.
I understand those who are disappointed with the process. This was not an exhaustive search. But, there is a lot to like here.
I said all along that this process was about Mara returning the franchise to its foundation. If Gentleman is a trenches first, and pushes for the hire of a head coach with leadership qualities, then Mara has taken a major step to doing just that.
So in 2005, at age 54, he repented and put his faith in Yeshua (Jesus) as the promised Messiah who died and rose again for the forgiveness of his sins, to give him eternal life.
Its given me such a sense of peace, a sense of calm that I didnt have before, Gettleman said.
He believes it was Gods plan to bring him to the Panthers from the Giants in January 2013, long after he had envisioned becoming a general manager.
I'm a complete believer in religious freedom, so I have no problem with anyone's beliefs.
But I have to admit, most of the Jews for Jesus that I have met are a little bit nutty
Messianic Jew - ( New Window )
2014
2015 (twice)
2017
And drafted a linebacker in the first round
Lets get this ball rolling the other way now. Wondering if Wilks will be the favorite now or will they go with experience?
1. Successful experience as GM
2. Good record in the draft
3. Shrewd contract negotiator
4. Emphasizes importance of line play
5. Good at finding value in FA.
True.
2014
2015 (twice)
2017
And drafted a linebacker in the first round
Whats a linebacker?
Whether that is reality or not remains to be seen.
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The only thing I know for sure is that John Mara is good at PR and fans will feel much better about this pick tomorrow at noon.
Whether that is reality or not remains to be seen.
I hope the press hammers him on why he rushed the choice and didnt interview a single candidate currently succeeding on another team.
It's already starting
https://nypost.com/2017/12/28/the-result-might-work-but-this-giants-process-was-bad/
Sometimes you need a "tough prick".
- read the riot act
- get rid of those not "all in"
- cut bait with stars BEFORE they start their decline
I am still uncertain whether his hard nosed style did him in or did Jerry Richardson's surgery cause a change n judgement to where he got over attached to his "stars". (the "I love you buddy" syndrome.)
The Jints Central Box!
How f-ckin predictable.
Right. And you just knew that mcadoo and Reese would be fired mid seasons And gettleman would replace them.
This was anything but predictable. Just because the Giants hired a guy with ties here doesn't mean it's a bad or lazy hire. And vice Versa bringing in an outsider doesn't ensure success. Mcadoo was an outsider. How'd that work. You guys are being ridiculous.
To me it's all about the HC and QB. We need to get that right.
Gettleman gets there and the Panthers make the playoffs 3 times (12-4, 7-8-1 in a lucky season, and 15-1) and the Super Bowl once
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Who would you rather have?
not a 70 year old...
Ahh, the ignorance of youth (including math).
He is 66. The last time I looked, the NYGs don't require their GM to participate in scrimmages.
As someone older than Dave I can attest that mental capabilities are still sharp at 70 and are enhanced by experience.
Gettleman gets there and the Panthers make the playoffs 3 times (12-4, 7-8-1 in a lucky season, and 15-1) and the Super Bowl once
That team was already rebuilding before Gettleman got there. He got the job just as Cam was turning into a finished product at QB. It's tough to pin "winning" on the guy who got to inherit a pair of franchise-changing talents.
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the Panthers were a mediocre team before he got there. They had Cam and Kuechly but little else. From 2006-2012 they had 1 winning season (2008 at 12-4) but they were always 6-10, 7-9, 8-8 with a 2-14 dropped in there (the year before they drafted Cam).
Gettleman gets there and the Panthers make the playoffs 3 times (12-4, 7-8-1 in a lucky season, and 15-1) and the Super Bowl once
That team was already rebuilding before Gettleman got there. He got the job just as Cam was turning into a finished product at QB. It's tough to pin "winning" on the guy who got to inherit a pair of franchise-changing talents.
Gettleman had the option to fire Ron Rivera when he was hired and chose to keep him. A very important move and the correct one for the Panthers. Cam and Kuechly were there but the rest of that team needed an overhaul and Gettleman successfully did it
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In comment 13758300 dpinzow said:
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the Panthers were a mediocre team before he got there. They had Cam and Kuechly but little else. From 2006-2012 they had 1 winning season (2008 at 12-4) but they were always 6-10, 7-9, 8-8 with a 2-14 dropped in there (the year before they drafted Cam).
Gettleman gets there and the Panthers make the playoffs 3 times (12-4, 7-8-1 in a lucky season, and 15-1) and the Super Bowl once
That team was already rebuilding before Gettleman got there. He got the job just as Cam was turning into a finished product at QB. It's tough to pin "winning" on the guy who got to inherit a pair of franchise-changing talents.
Gettleman had the option to fire Ron Rivera when he was hired and chose to keep him. A very important move and the correct one for the Panthers. Cam and Kuechly were there but the rest of that team needed an overhaul and Gettleman successfully did it
They finished 2nd in their division in 2012, before he got there, and were middle of the pack in offensive and defensive rankings. He took over a team that was already moving in the right direction, but was hamstrung by cap mismanagement.
--He helped build a veteran OL to get Kerry Collins protected in 2000. Then that line broke down and he helped build the Diehl-Seubert-O'Hara-Snee-McKenzie group (was part of signing Seubert, O'Hara and McKenzie)
--He was instrumental in bringing Plax and Pierce here along with the aforementioned McKenzie in 2005. Reese ran the draft for EA at the time so those signings were largely Gettleman.
--He helped sign key veterans in the SB 42 run like RW McQuarters, Sam Madison, and Kawika Mitchell.
--He helped bring in Michael Boley, Rocky Bernard, and Chris Canty, who were key parts of the SB 46 season. He and Reese were part of finding Cruz
Since Gettleman left in 2012, we haven't done nearly as well in FA. DRC was our best signing in 2014. Vernon was an overpay. Jenkins had a Pro Bowl year in 2016 but had an off year this year. Every other FA was a bust
Since Gettleman left in 2012, we haven't done nearly as well in FA. DRC was our best signing in 2014. Vernon was an overpay. Jenkins had a Pro Bowl year in 2016 but had an off year this year. Every other FA was a bust
Damon Harrison was a bust?
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Right. And you just knew that mcadoo and Reese would be fired mid seasons And gettleman would replace them.
This was anything but predictable. Just because the Giants hired a guy with ties here doesn't mean it's a bad or lazy hire. And vice Versa bringing in an outsider doesn't ensure success. Mcadoo was an outsider. How'd that work. You guys are being ridiculous.
Look, Jints Central tried the young head coach and the young African American GM. So they can always say they checked the youth box and the minority box.
Now that that has failed, it's back to the "Giants Way" - older white guys back in charge.
Can we really deny that? They bring back the former old white guy - Ernie Accorsi - to advise the older white guy owner - Mara - to hire the former old white guy who is now an older white guy. It's just so Jints Central... ;)
All three were signed very cheaply but played huge roles in our SB winning 2007 season so that isn't pathetic and this is coming from someone who isn't a big Gettleman fan.
Maybe one day youll get a chance to shine one of those scrubs Super Bowl rings...
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In comment 13757959 bw in dc said:
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Right. And you just knew that mcadoo and Reese would be fired mid seasons And gettleman would replace them.
This was anything but predictable. Just because the Giants hired a guy with ties here doesn't mean it's a bad or lazy hire. And vice Versa bringing in an outsider doesn't ensure success. Mcadoo was an outsider. How'd that work. You guys are being ridiculous.
Look, Jints Central tried the young head coach and the young African American GM. So they can always say they checked the youth box and the minority box.
Now that that has failed, it's back to the "Giants Way" - older white guys back in charge.
Can we really deny that? They bring back the former old white guy - Ernie Accorsi - to advise the older white guy owner - Mara - to hire the former old white guy who is now an older white guy. It's just so Jints Central... ;)
😂 😂 😂😂😂
Hey T-Bone. Happy Holidays old BBI friend. Good to be back, kicking it around...
Hope things are good with you and your family.
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beedub!
Hey T-Bone. Happy Holidays old BBI friend. Good to be back, kicking it around...
Hope things are good with you and your family.
Things are great sir, thanks. Some of these guys dont know... you oooooooold school. LMAO! Really good to see some of the old heads pop in here from time to time. Of course with you itd be when the team is sucking. lol
Happy Holidays to you and yours too.
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Things are great sir, thanks. Some of these guys dont know... you oooooooold school. LMAO! Really good to see some of the old heads pop in here from time to time. Of course with you itd be when the team is sucking. lol
Happy Holidays to you and yours too.
Well, BBI is most interesting when things start to get a little dirty and nuts. And you know that's always been catnip for me... ;)
I am happy. I think he can fix this. That is all that matters. We might as well all get behind him. He is what we got, support him until he proves unworthy. Would rather have him operate from a position of security and confidence rather than indecisive and weak.
Let's see who the head coach is, that will tell us more. I would be interested to see if Webb plays. It has to be the reason they activated him. This was in the works(guess). Part of his interview was to tell them they need to play the young kid immediately. No reason to announce it and let the other team know.
I could make the argument that bringing in an outsider like MacAdoo and his offense was not Giant like.
Perkins to Parcells worked pretty well. As did bringing back one of Parcells boys, Coughlin.
Dan Reeves didn t work out so well.
Doing what you know best isn t always bad
I like the pick
They went and got their guy. They've had time to plot this move.
I expect Mara and Gettleman will be scheduling interviews by Monday at lunchtime.
There are countless moving parts to contend with:
4. Eli Apple disaster
I doubt this is as big a thing for the front office as it is for us fans. He's a problem, he's troubled, and though he's talented, he's on the verge of being a colossal bust for the Giants. But he's not the first troubled problem player with a lot of talent (the Giants had Will Hill not that long ago), it's not that unusual around the league. First rounders bust all the time. Experienced executives have seen this before and know what to do about it.
It wasnt a team put together by Gettleman though. lol. They went to the Super Bowl because Cam Newton was unbelievable that season.
Although I have no particular problem with the choice of Gettleman, I think your assessment of his track record is overly generous in some areas.
Did he really keep the OL stocked and the bottom of the roster strong? How many seasons during his tenure were derailed by thin patches in the roster, and/or a cluster of injuries? Remember the crater at CB in 1999? The DL and WRs in 2002? The OL and TE in 2003? The DL in 2004? The LBs and CBs in 2005? The DL in 2006? The DL again and WRs in 2008? The safeties and LBs in 2009? The WRs in 2010? The LBs again during the November/December slump in 2011?
What about the gradual implosion of the OL after 2008? You see a unit that was kept "stocked". I see depth that was mostly untested during the line's prime years. From 2005 to 2008, Snee, O'Hara, McKenzie and Diehl missed a total of four starts. Health aside, there was another important element of luck: When Petitgout went down, Seubert returned from a catastrophic injury to give five years of surprising yeoman service, and Diehl proved adequate at left tackle. So Coughlin and Flaherty seldom had to dig deeper than the first man off the bench. When they did... well, remember Bob Whitfield at tackle in 2006?
Then there's the other depth bullet this team has dodged, which mostly goes overlooked: the appalling backups to Eli Manning. Aside from Jesse Palmer filling in for Collins at the end of a lost 2003 season, the Accorsi/Reese Giants never had to cope with an injury at quarterback. Imagine Tim Hasselbeck or Jared Lorenzen under center in a playoff game. Good lord.
I don't really blame Gettleman for this history. Accorsi and Reese allocated the team's resources. But if you're going to credit Dave Gettleman with astute bottom-of-the-roster acquisitions like R.W. McQuarters or the overdue return of Chase Blackburn, it's important to also acknowledge the meaningful snaps taken by marginal pros and spent vets like Jeremy Lincoln, Ian Allen, Darnell Dinkins, Kevin Lewis, Alonzo Jackson, Terrell Buckley, Will Demps, C.C. Brown, Aaron Rouse, Danny Clark, Michael Clayton, and many others.
This is rich from the guy who cries the loudest and most emotionally when something happens that he doesn't like.
IF he cuts Eli. If he doesn't, and even funnier if we pass on a QB round one, I'll enjoy your tears.
There is as much validity in being for it as there is for being against it.
There is as much validity in being for it as there is for being against it.
I was indifferent to it, it was an expected, safe hire...
But like I said, when I see certain posters get up in arms over it, posters who are usually pretty wrong more often than not, it makes me feel better about the hire.
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in a very long time. So I really have no issue with people being up in arms over this.
There is as much validity in being for it as there is for being against it.
I was indifferent to it, it was an expected, safe hire...
But like I said, when I see certain posters get up in arms over it, posters who are usually pretty wrong more often than not, it makes me feel better about the hire.
^^^^^
This
they believe in it, and the guy they are hiring has been successful. this is not a reach, and its not a forced in house hire. Its a professional with success that has worked with the team before but also offers a fresh view on talent evaluation and the draft and cap usage... that has been the issue.
the key for the future imo is more around the coach and his assistants... what scheme are we running and does it fit our players.
Those who think this is just a coaching change and a few tweaks away from being a playoff team are kidding themselves.
QB of the future is a big one this offseason. I think the chances actually increased still that we take a QB, but this probably gives Eli one more year. Im willing to accept that so long as the coach is given the support to bench Eli next year when things go awry.
Im willing to give this a chance but the window for success if really not they big and this may only end up a 3 year GM stint. I like continuity as much as the next guy but continuity and familiarity doesnt always guarantee itself to be able to generate the sustainable success teams look for.
You have fans that don't like it, and then you have other fans telling them why they are stupid for not liking it.
Can't wait for the next round of this when they hire a new head coach.
Mara trusts him - big element in this. For the crowd who wants Mara completely out of the room, this should point toward that.
Also - in a development that might make Go Terps just go ahead and die a happy man now - Gettleman could have the distinction of being the guy who opted not sign both Norman and Beckham to longterm deals.
Not afraid to make tough moves - knew Norman's real worth. Knew when Beason was done. That team has been competitive for the most part.
What did their drafts look like?
I like this post. A lot.