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| The Jaguars won the AFC South for the first time in franchise history, are making their first playoff appearance since 2007 and have their first home playoff game since 1999, and it began when Khan decided to bring in Tom Coughlin, install him above general manager Dave Caldwell in the pecking order and give him total control of all football operations. "Tom has been a very successful coach," Khan said Thursday from his suite overlooking the field at EverBank Field, where the Jaguars (10-6) will play Buffalo (9-7) on Sunday. "This is a different stage for him. Can he embrace it? I think It turned out better than probably, certainly, I thought it would. And really the credit is to him. "I can tell you he never asked for the 53-man roster. It was my idea. 'Tom, that means nothing changed [if he didn't give him control]. It's maybe not good for Dave's ego, but there has to be somebody in charge, and it needs to be you.' It's easy to see why Khan wanted change. The Jaguars were 17-63 since he took over as owner in 2012 and hadn't won more than five games in any of those five seasons. Khan hired Caldwell, who in turn hired Gus Bradley, and they began a complete rebuild beginning in 2013. By the end of the 2016 season, however, it was clear things weren't working, and Khan fired Bradley with two games remaining in the regular season. He decided to try a different approach and turned to Coughlin, the franchise's inaugural coach, who took the team to a pair of AFC Championship games in the first five seasons of existence and won two Super Bowls with the New York Giants. "What I felt we lacked was football IQ," Khan said. "You just can't say, 'Let me go to craigslist or backpage.com and get some football IQ.' You want somebody who really has the passion, the emotion, the drive. Nobody really personifies it better than Tom Coughlin. |
kind of lame to finish off with that when your inconsistencies have been highlighted repeatedly on this thread alone.
I was a HUGE supporter of the entire process between 2007 and 2011-12. Huge. In Reese I trust. Argued against anybody that had a bad word to say about the guy, even excused a lot of stuff that happened in 2012. But by 2013, it was clear that the Offensive line had been neglected, and needed to be rebuilt quickly. It was crucial in our entire philosophy that we had been using successfully for years. Gilbride and Coughlin needed it, and Eli needed it. When we had a good offensive line, we were good. We basically had to scrap our entire playbook that we had been using since 2007 after 2013 because the offensive line was a commplete mess. Gilbride lost his job over it. We tried to retool and rebuild, but couldn't. Meanwhile, the defensive roster was also falling to shit, and our drafts were bad, but I believe even then, with a decent offensive line we could have gotten past it. We never got one, and Coughlin was the next to fall. I don't know if Reese convinced McAdoo or McAdoo convinced Reese that that wasn't a big deal, but the complete ignoring of it this past offseason was just another year of neglect that ended the season before it began.
It's a very simple, logical progress that formed my opinion:
1. Offensive line failed
2. Gilbride and Coughlin could not run their system without it.
3. Gilbride, then Coughlin fired.
4. Eli could not operate behind it and is now getting the blame.
It all goes back to the offensive line for me. That's why I blame Reese. And you can say, well Coughlin had input too. Well, Coughlin got fired. This past offseason, Reese made a decision to let it ride with the hopes it was good enough. And it was another bad decision. Teams rebuild lines in single offseasons. Coughlin has helped Jacksonville's line get humming pretty quickly. Reese's has been bad for 7 years.
Nothing more, nothing less, certainly nothing sinister as has been implied in the past, here.
kind of lame to finish off with that when your inconsistencies have been highlighted repeatedly on this thread alone.
I have not been inconsistent. My opinion has been pretty damn consistent for the past five years, unlike the backtracking and spinning that occurs regularly here in regards to Coughlin, McAdoo, Reese, and Eli.
Could it be that the recently sainted TC (at least by some here) had a hand in the decisions that have not worked out?
you are certainly single-minded - I'll give you that... but the logic you and others use to support that single mindedness is flawed at best.
Could it be that the recently sainted TC (at least by some here) had a hand in the decisions that have not worked out?
The line began falling apart in 2009. It wasn't ignored, but they waited too long to address it, and when they did, they failed in free agency and the draft.
so let's be clear, TC didn't have any input on personnel decisions? is that your position now?
But I'm not going to sit here and go in circles with the mob. I felt firing Coughlin was the wrong move at the time, and I believe the results have played that out.
That's it. You disagree, fine.
I didn't say that. I said that you can say that he did, but then he got fired. Then I went on to point at this last offseason where the line was completely ignored and deemed good enough as constructed as a solo Reese effort.
But I'm not going to sit here and go in circles with the mob. I felt firing Coughlin was the wrong move at the time, and I believe the results have played that out.
That's it. You disagree, fine.
Britt, so when you wax poetic on here about ignoring the OL, isn't that on both Reese AND Coughlin?
Sometimes I think you just argue for the sake of arguing.
As LG pointed out two posts after yours that was addressed to me, the O-line hadn't been 'neglected' until this past off-season (which was why I had no issue with Reese being let go now... for him to have no backup plan was inexcusable)... it was simply that the moves that were made didn't work out... and for that, he's been fired. But also has been said, it's not like Reese drafted and signed those players to the team and told Coughlin 'Here ya go... make it work!', which is what you and others seem to imply. In your post you make it sound like you're upset that Coughlin and Gilbride were let go but Reese wasn't... which is how these things usually happen. But I find it hard to believe that HAD Reese been let go along with Coughlin that any of you would hold him in any higher regard than you do now.
Fact: anyone who tries to blame all the failures (or successes for that matter) of the past decade on one single person sounds stupid.
Sometimes I think you just argue for the sake of arguing.
He's right about this. You keep on making excuse after excuse for Coughlin (and they're getting sillier and sillier by the way) .
You're constant whining about how poor wittle Eli and Coughlin have suffered so much at the hands of that evil Jerry Reese not withstanding...
And that still doesn't make you right.
The OL rebuild was delayed by several years by his stubborn attachment to the old guard. Hell, re-inserting O'Hara in the starting lineup in 2010 was part of the kiss of death down the stretch.
To their credit, Diehl, Snee and McKenzie performed as valiantly as they could for as long as they could but to have guys retiring during training camp means their rope was too long.
Reese... he must've hypnotized him.
but he is a good man, coached us to two incredible super bowl runs and I'm glad he is enjoying success in the upper office of an afc team.
And yet that doesn't ever stop you and others from placing all the blame squarely on Reese.
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And yet that doesn't ever stop you and others from placing all the blame squarely on Reese.
Or vice versa.
I was in the "if one should go, both should go" camp, but I also remember thinking that I didn't want anybody to get fired, just stay the course.
You were thinking both should have been retained? Boy you are tough person to reason with. Have a good night.
you didn't just argue with people who criticized Eli...you initiated threads that directly or indirectly praised/absolved Eli while the building was burning.
and you've shown the same unyeilding traits as respects TC... taking any oppty to try and puff your chest about him as if whatever success Jax is having somehow makes you smart and everyone else an idiot.
I am quite sure you wouldn't feel like such a punching bag if you would dial it back a few notches. But instead you have absolutely positioned yourself as "Eli above all other"... seemingly even if it means the team suffers as a result.
Just my 2 cents.
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In comment 13773993 Britt in VA said:
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And yet that doesn't ever stop you and others from placing all the blame squarely on Reese.
Or vice versa.
If you could name one or two names or evidence of anyone saying it was ALL Coughlin’s fault I’d appreciate it. Thanks!
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In comment 13774036 T-Bone said:
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In comment 13773993 Britt in VA said:
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And yet that doesn't ever stop you and others from placing all the blame squarely on Reese.
Or vice versa.
If you could name one or two names or evidence of anyone saying it was ALL Coughlin’s fault I’d appreciate it. Thanks!
I don't have the time or energy to go back two or three years and dig up archived threads, but if you're going to sit there and tell me that there weren't posters that wanted to heap it all on Coughlin, well, we'll just agree to disagree. Thanks.
But you won’t give Reese any credit for his part in that era?
That seems fair. Basically you’ve chosen to view only certain members of the organization for the successes and certain ones for the failures instead of giving credit to everyone involved. I don’t know what that makes you... but ‘homer’ isn’t a word that comes to mind.
This is exactly the problem. I swear, every one of your posts come across like you think you are involved in some kind of contest to prove who the biggest Giants fan is. Being the biggest Giants homer on the planet is a nice title to give yourself, but if it means putting blinders on and ignoring every single flaw that a player or coach may have isn’t something to be proud of. It doesn’t make you a better fan. It makes you an ignorant fan.
Eli and TC are Giants legends forever. It’s ok to admit that they are/were far from perfect and had their warts. Unless of course you’re looking for a prize for your ignorance/allegiance.
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I think Eli and Coughlin are two of the greatest Giants of all time. It was a rare era that we were lucky to witness, and if I'm being honest, it will likely be a decade or two before we witness it again (like last time). I'm going to defend them, because I think when the dust settles, in fifty years, they will be the two guys we're talking about. Like Parcells, LT, and Simms, who we hold in such high regard.
But you won’t give Reese any credit for his part in that era?
That seems fair. Basically you’ve chosen to view only certain members of the organization for the successes and certain ones for the failures instead of giving credit to everyone involved. I don’t know what that makes you... but ‘homer’ isn’t a word that comes to mind.
On that note, bowing out of the conversation.
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In comment 13774245 Britt in VA said:
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I think Eli and Coughlin are two of the greatest Giants of all time. It was a rare era that we were lucky to witness, and if I'm being honest, it will likely be a decade or two before we witness it again (like last time). I'm going to defend them, because I think when the dust settles, in fifty years, they will be the two guys we're talking about. Like Parcells, LT, and Simms, who we hold in such high regard.
But you won’t give Reese any credit for his part in that era?
That seems fair. Basically you’ve chosen to view only certain members of the organization for the successes and certain ones for the failures instead of giving credit to everyone involved. I don’t know what that makes you... but ‘homer’ isn’t a word that comes to mind.
On that note, bowing out of the conversation.
Just to be clear about what I said above Britt... I honestly don’t think ‘homer’ is applicable to you in this case. When I think of a ‘homer’ I think of someone who blindly agrees with every move their favorite team makes and you don’t do that. You (unfairly IMO) blindly blame any and all success to Coughlin and Eli and everything that’s gone wrong has been Reese’s fault. I honestly don’t even know how you can reach that conclusion... and yes, I’d argue against anyone who believes that the team’s struggles were because of only Coughlin or Eli. I’d hope those three individuals would agree with my stance.
Anyway, I like ya enough to feel the need to clarify myself for you because I don’t want you to have the impression that I had a ‘word’ in mind. I didn’t and still don’t. We can disagree with this but it’s not that serious...
Head coach and QB are premier positions. GM is a behind the scenes thing. If you notice, I'm the one that started the Jerry Reese appreciation thread after he was fired. I acknowledge and appreciate everything he did for the Giants, not only as a GM, but everything before. But at the end of the day, he was the GM, and I hold him accountable for the personnel. Everybody else has been held accountable and now everybody (except Eli, although not for long) is gone.
We can all agree that we're Giants fans and we want the best for the Giants for the next 20-30 years as well.
Hopefully we're back on track, let's get a new coaching staff and right this ship!
for Eli, before his 5 mill. bonus is due in March.
That would be best for everybody concerned, start anew
with a new GM & HC, and QB. That might be too much to ask
for the Giants and Mara...Most of the team was already there when Coughlin took over, they brought in Bouje and
Calais Campbell as free agents on defense, the team had
good defensive pieces in place, and they drafted a RB.