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NFT: Knicks Chat: DNPCD's in Beasley's future?

DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 10:27 am
For the first time in 20 games, Hardaway Jr. was upgraded from out to questionable for Friday night’s game against the Timberwolves. And once Hardaway Jr. returns and is 100 percent, coach Jeff Hornacek indicated that the rotation will revert to its previous incarnation — meaning the possibility of DNPs for Beasley.

“Every one of (our bench players) lends us something and it could be situational,” Hornacek said. “Lance (Thomas) has done a great job defending some of these guys. Prior to when Tim was here, there were nights when Lance didn’t play. There were nights Mike didn’t play. So we’ll probably end up going back to that.”-NYPOST


THjr obviously is more important than Beasley but this is kind of absurd when you consider Lance Thomas will have guaranteed PT but Beasley out of the rotation. I'd argue he's "easily" been one of the top 3-4 players on the team.
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I'll wait to see how it all unfolds before freaking out,  
Keith : 1/12/2018 10:28 am : link
but if that is truly what happens, that's terrible.
RE: I'll wait to see how it all unfolds before freaking out,  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 10:31 am : link
In comment 13784496 Keith said:
Quote:
but if that is truly what happens, that's terrible.


It's a direct quote from Hornacek
Not sure how Lance Thomas  
Jan in DC : 1/12/2018 10:32 am : link
became Bruce Bowen, but ok...
RE: I'll wait to see how it all unfolds before freaking out,  
nygiants16 : 1/12/2018 10:38 am : link
In comment 13784496 Keith said:
Quote:
but if that is truly what happens, that's terrible.


Hornacek already said he will play Thomas over beasley..

Which absolutely absurd, he is going to bench a guy averaging 14 points per game for lance Thomas haha
JJ  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 10:39 am : link
Redick is not "convinced" Dinosaurs existed.
nowhere in that direct quote  
djm : 1/12/2018 10:40 am : link
does Horn say he's going to bench or not play Beasley. Let's see what happens first.

Honestly if Hardway is back to his old self we probably won't have the pressing need for Beasley's scoring as much as we do now, but games are fluid.
RE: JJ  
Beezer : 1/12/2018 10:42 am : link
In comment 13784518 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Redick is not "convinced" Dinosaurs existed.


Wait. What? lol
Lance Thomas  
Pete44 : 1/12/2018 10:45 am : link
I'm not a fan of Lance Thomas, but he does play good defense and every coach has liked him.

Beasley has been great, but I feel like I'm watching Melo Ball again.
RE: RE: JJ  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 10:46 am : link
In comment 13784523 Beezer said:
Quote:
In comment 13784518 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


Redick is not "convinced" Dinosaurs existed.



Wait. What? lol


He claims someone coined the term and then suddenly fossils started showing up. He seems like a smart guy (and I have yet to listen to the audio) so maybe he was just doing some sort of shtick but everyone who listens to his podcast is reporting he said it "straight".
RE: nowhere in that direct quote  
nygiants16 : 1/12/2018 10:48 am : link
In comment 13784521 djm said:
Quote:
does Horn say he's going to bench or not play Beasley. Let's see what happens first.

Honestly if Hardway is back to his old self we probably won't have the pressing need for Beasley's scoring as much as we do now, but games are fluid.


He said it a couple of weeks ago
He's  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 10:53 am : link
made more than 1 remark implying we likely won't see much of Beasley

"“Mike knows his role,” Knicks coach Jeff Hornacek said. “If K.P.’s out he obviously gets the bigger minutes. I thought he played great in filling in for him. He really helped us get some points on the board. Defensively I liked what he was doing. He’s definitely a rotation guy for us. We have still Tim out. That enables us to put Lance (Thomas) in there a little bit more so Mike’s still going to get that rotation. When Tim does comes back, it kind of goes back - how are we going to do it? But he’s played well.”

RE: RE: I'll wait to see how it all unfolds before freaking out,  
Keith : 1/12/2018 10:54 am : link
In comment 13784517 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 13784496 Keith said:


Quote:


but if that is truly what happens, that's terrible.



Hornacek already said he will play Thomas over beasley..

Which absolutely absurd, he is going to bench a guy averaging 14 points per game for lance Thomas haha


I'll still wait and see how it unfolds. Words are one thing, actions are another. It's an absurd thought. Hopefully some team comes calling about Lance.
RE: RE: RE: JJ  
Beezer : 1/12/2018 10:54 am : link
In comment 13784528 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 13784523 Beezer said:


Quote:


In comment 13784518 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


Redick is not "convinced" Dinosaurs existed.



Wait. What? lol



He claims someone coined the term and then suddenly fossils started showing up. He seems like a smart guy (and I have yet to listen to the audio) so maybe he was just doing some sort of shtick but everyone who listens to his podcast is reporting he said it "straight".


So random.

Hysterical. lol
RE: RE: RE: I'll wait to see how it all unfolds before freaking out,  
nygiants16 : 1/12/2018 11:00 am : link
In comment 13784551 Keith said:
Quote:
In comment 13784517 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


In comment 13784496 Keith said:


Quote:


but if that is truly what happens, that's terrible.



Hornacek already said he will play Thomas over beasley..

Which absolutely absurd, he is going to bench a guy averaging 14 points per game for lance Thomas haha



I'll still wait and see how it unfolds. Words are one thing, actions are another. It's an absurd thought. Hopefully some team comes calling about Lance.


When has hornacek ever benched Thomas?
RE: Lance Thomas  
Keith : 1/12/2018 11:03 am : link
In comment 13784526 Pete44 said:
Quote:
I'm not a fan of Lance Thomas, but he does play good defense and every coach has liked him.

Beasley has been great, but I feel like I'm watching Melo Ball again.


Please explain. Melo ball from Melo's prime years or Melo ball circa 2016/2017/2018?

No way is this anything like the current version of Melo. He's more like prime Melo if anything and is that really a bad thing? He's a bench player making nothing.

Beasley is taking the ball to the rim a lot. Over 60% of Beasleys shots are coming from within 10 feet. A third of his shots are coming right at the rim. Compare that to Melo, the last 3 years he's averaging 20% of his shots coming from within 10 feet. Right now, under 10% of Melo's shots are at the rim.

All of that makes a huge difference and it's why Melo is no longer a good player. You are gonna need scorers in Iso, give me the guy that takes the ball to the rim and things happen over the guy that takes contested long jumpers that lead to breaks for the other team.
Melo Ball  
Pete44 : 1/12/2018 11:06 am : link
When I say Melo Ball, there were several times down the stretch recently, where the ball goes to Beasley, he puts his head down and shoots. The Bulls knew exactly what the Knicks were going to do.

The Knicks don't play Melo Ball until the end of games and it is quite frustrating to watch.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I'll wait to see how it all unfolds before freaking out,  
Keith : 1/12/2018 11:06 am : link
In comment 13784565 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 13784551 Keith said:


Quote:


In comment 13784517 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


In comment 13784496 Keith said:


Quote:


but if that is truly what happens, that's terrible.



Hornacek already said he will play Thomas over beasley..

Which absolutely absurd, he is going to bench a guy averaging 14 points per game for lance Thomas haha



I'll still wait and see how it unfolds. Words are one thing, actions are another. It's an absurd thought. Hopefully some team comes calling about Lance.



When has hornacek ever benched Thomas?


Never. I'm not doubting that this will be the move, I'm just gonna wait to complain until it actually happens. lol
RE: Melo Ball  
Keith : 1/12/2018 11:07 am : link
In comment 13784577 Pete44 said:
Quote:
When I say Melo Ball, there were several times down the stretch recently, where the ball goes to Beasley, he puts his head down and shoots. The Bulls knew exactly what the Knicks were going to do.

The Knicks don't play Melo Ball until the end of games and it is quite frustrating to watch.


So Melo ball = Iso ball? Every team does that. Beasley is a blessed scorer, he was scoring the day he came into this world. That's what he does. There was nothing wrong when Melo did it either when he was actually good and could get to the rim.
Beasley  
Pete44 : 1/12/2018 11:15 am : link
Keith - I don't agree. Even Lebron James passes the ball in crunch time. The Knicks become too predictable and that is why they lose a lot of close games.
Lebron is a very unique player.  
Keith : 1/12/2018 11:18 am : link
If the Knicks had a PG that was good, I'd say you have a point. The fact is, we don't, so we need our scorers to make things happen sometimes and that's what Beasley does. Again though, I'm fine with the Iso play when Beasley is on because he usually gets off a good shot close to the rim. So if he misses, we have 3 guys there to get the rebound.
RE: Beasley  
nygiants16 : 1/12/2018 11:18 am : link
In comment 13784584 Pete44 said:
Quote:
Keith - I don't agree. Even Lebron James passes the ball in crunch time. The Knicks become too predictable and that is why they lose a lot of close games.


Are you serious? So because he is not doing what the greatest player the world is doing it is wrong?

You realize that LeBron is their point guard right? So the reason why down the stretch he is passing is because he is their facilitator...

Who is going to do that for the knicks?
Every  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 11:23 am : link
team in the NBA calls ISO's for their scorers in crunch time. Beasley is one of the Knicks top scorers thus late in games ISO's are called for him. This isn't 1973. This is how the game is played. I'd argue Beasley is one of the more efficient non-star scorers in the entire NBA. Doesn't force 3's or long 2's, plays to his strengths. If anything the Knicks would have more late game losses without Beasley.
Most Teams  
Pete44 : 1/12/2018 11:29 am : link
Most teams have more than one scorer to choose from in crunch time, which makes iso ball less predictable, everybody in MSG knew the Knicks were going to Beasley.

I'm sorry going to Michael Beasley time after time in crunch time is not the best strategy.

Beasley is not efficient, he is a turnover machine.

I remember one play in the Bulls game, Beasley put his head down, drove to the hoop. Porzingis was standing wide open, Beasley forced the shot and it got blocked, fast break the other way.
RE: Most Teams  
nygiants16 : 1/12/2018 11:33 am : link
In comment 13784606 Pete44 said:
Quote:
Most teams have more than one scorer to choose from in crunch time, which makes iso ball less predictable, everybody in MSG knew the Knicks were going to Beasley.

I'm sorry going to Michael Beasley time after time in crunch time is not the best strategy.

Beasley is not efficient, he is a turnover machine.

I remember one play in the Bulls game, Beasley put his head down, drove to the hoop. Porzingis was standing wide open, Beasley forced the shot and it got blocked, fast break the other way.


Michael beasley is not effecient? Hahahahahahahahahaha

He is averaging 13 points on 52 percent shooting, 54 percent on 2s..

Oh and turnover machine? He has 2 turnovers per game..

Oh btw only playing 19 minutes a night
"Turnover machine"  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 11:33 am : link
except he averages 2.0 per game 19.2 minutes, Jarrett Jack 2.0 in 26 minutes per, Frank 1.8 in 21 minutes, Kanter 1.7 in 25 minutes. 52% from the field, 36% from 3 (when he does take them). Last 5 games 17 and 8 on 55% from the field, 1.4 turnovers per game (23 minutes per). This just isn't based in reality.
The dude is the definition of efficiency right now.  
Keith : 1/12/2018 11:34 am : link
He's scoring at almost a point per minute clip.
What  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 11:36 am : link
kind of offense do you think the Knicks will be running late when THjr returns? It will look exactly the same except with THjr taking most/all of Beasley's touches. It's not suddenly going to be lacking in ISO's.
Even  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 11:37 am : link
Breen/Clyde who opened the year scoffing at Beasley give him his props as an efficient scorer, Clyde can't even believe some of the shots he takes and hits, off-balance etc
McDermott and Thomas should both have minutes reduced/sit  
Vanzetti : 1/12/2018 11:40 am : link
Thomas is a good defender and you need him at crunch time on defensive possessions.

McDermott is a good shooter and does a nice job moving without the ball.

But both guys are very limited players. McDermott is a "scorer" who has a terrible point output per minute played and does not create shots for others. Severely limited player, yet there is no outcry about Beasley sitting for him. Wonder why that could be?

I think if the knicks can relieve their center glut  
nygiants16 : 1/12/2018 11:40 am : link
I would start Beasley at the 4 with kp at the 5
Man, can the Knicks get a great PG please!  
Keith : 1/12/2018 11:41 am : link
What do we need to do to get Trae Young?
RE: McDermott and Thomas should both have minutes reduced/sit  
nygiants16 : 1/12/2018 11:41 am : link
In comment 13784634 Vanzetti said:
Quote:
Thomas is a good defender and you need him at crunch time on defensive possessions.

McDermott is a good shooter and does a nice job moving without the ball.

But both guys are very limited players. McDermott is a "scorer" who has a terrible point output per minute played and does not create shots for others. Severely limited player, yet there is no outcry about Beasley sitting for him. Wonder why that could be?


Because like you said mcdermott plays a role, he is an off ball, spread the floor shooter..

Lance Thomas does nothing of value on the court, spare me is a good defender, he tries hard that is as about all he does..
RE: Man, can the Knicks get a great PG please!  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 11:49 am : link
In comment 13784637 Keith said:
Quote:
What do we need to do to get Trae Young?


1. Tank hard

or
2. Trade KP

Otherwise I don't see any way he's there when we pick
RE: RE: RE: JJ  
Mad Mike : 1/12/2018 11:57 am : link
In comment 13784528 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
He claims someone coined the term and then suddenly fossils started showing up. He seems like a smart guy (and I have yet to listen to the audio) so maybe he was just doing some sort of shtick but everyone who listens to his podcast is reporting he said it "straight".

He was being pretty straight. He had Kyrie Irving on, and he was asking him about the flat earth thing, and then they were talking about conspiracy theories in general, and being skeptical about stuff, and Redick said "I know I'm wrong about this, but the one that gets me ..." is dinosaurs. It didn't seem like he adamantly believes all the fossils and everything are completely made up, but that he just thinks there's something fishy about all of it, like how do scientists really know how the bones go together to create these dinosaur skeletons as opposed to a woolly mammoth or any other kind of animal.
Personally  
Jan in DC : 1/12/2018 12:24 pm : link
as much as I like the team, I'd be looking to trade off as many of these guys to contenders before the trade deadline.

McDerrmott, O'Quinn, Beasley. Even Kanter. All the guys who can opt out or have contracts up this year, get picks or young cost controlled assets for them if you can. Unless you think they have a future on the team (not sure what the orgs thoughts on Kanter are).

If we could land a middle of the pack 1 for some of these guys and don't add to the future salary, it could really help us down the road.
Yahoo  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 1:24 pm : link
As teams pick up trade activity before the trade deadline, the Cavaliers are shaping up to be perhaps the most fascinating contending team. They have two first-round draft picks — including the heralded Brooklyn Nets’ selection via the Irving trade — but the superstar player whom the franchise could pursue with that pick has not been made available. Multiple NBA teams have cited Tristan Thompson as an asset Cleveland is willing to move in the right deal, such as one for the Los Angeles Clippers’ DeAndre Jordan. Nevertheless, the superstar talent of Oklahoma City’s Paul George or New Orleans’ DeMarcus Cousins, each deserving of that Nets first-rounder, won’t see the light in this trade market as of right now, league sources said, as those teams are fully focused on winning with each respective player.

RE: Yahoo  
Earl the goat : 1/12/2018 1:32 pm : link
In comment 13784793 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
As teams pick up trade activity before the trade deadline, the Cavaliers are shaping up to be perhaps the most fascinating contending team. They have two first-round draft picks — including the heralded Brooklyn Nets’ selection via the Irving trade — but the superstar player whom the franchise could pursue with that pick has not been made available. Multiple NBA teams have cited Tristan Thompson as an asset Cleveland is willing to move in the right deal, such as one for the Los Angeles Clippers’ DeAndre Jordan. Nevertheless, the superstar talent of Oklahoma City’s Paul George or New Orleans’ DeMarcus Cousins, each deserving of that Nets first-rounder, won’t see the light in this trade market as of right now, league sources said, as those teams are fully focused on winning with each respective player.



The Brooklyn pick isn’t as heralded as it was when the trade happened
The nets are playing very well. Atkinson is one of the better young coaches in the league. This team plays hard and may not be in the lottery
You'd think the Beas has some trade value too  
Heisenberg : 1/12/2018 1:40 pm : link
Immediate offense for a stretch run. Easy contract to take on.
Hypothetical trade scenario NYK and Cavaliers  
DennyInDenville : 1/12/2018 1:51 pm : link
We send them..

Beasley, Oquinn, Jack, Lee for the Nets pick? Plus some salary
Two lotto picks would be very nice  
DennyInDenville : 1/12/2018 1:53 pm : link
KP just needs to man up and be the #1 and not be a bitch when we tank, he needs to understand the path to success .
RE: Personally  
DennyInDenville : 1/12/2018 1:58 pm : link
In comment 13784687 Jan in DC said:
Quote:
as much as I like the team, I'd be looking to trade off as many of these guys to contenders before the trade deadline.

McDerrmott, O'Quinn, Beasley. Even Kanter. All the guys who can opt out or have contracts up this year, get picks or young cost controlled assets for them if you can. Unless you think they have a future on the team (not sure what the orgs thoughts on Kanter are).

If we could land a middle of the pack 1 for some of these guys and don't add to the future salary, it could really help us down the road.

Fully agree with this. I will be soooo excited if Perry/Mills do this. In a way if they traded all these guys you mention it'll speed up our process greatly imo. It would feel like a Brian Cashman job.

Anyways I hope they trade all those guys , if not for picks then maybe attach Noah for cap relief.

Wouldn't hurt signing another THJR level player to compliment KP, Frank, and our draft pick.
RE: You'd think the Beas has some trade value too  
Jan in DC : 1/12/2018 1:58 pm : link
In comment 13784822 Heisenberg said:
Quote:
Immediate offense for a stretch run. Easy contract to take on.


I'd think it'd be easy to find a trade partner for him. It's getting back a worthwhile pick/players that may be tough.
I'd listen to offers on everyone.  
bceagle05 : 1/12/2018 2:07 pm : link
KP is the closest thing to untouchable, but if someone came in with an offer you can't refuse, so be it.

Gotta figure Hardaway and Ntilikina are viewed as building blocks, but they shouldn't be off the table. Everyone else is fair game, and Courtney Lee should've been moved already.

Problem is, Steve Mills has already harped on stability, given all the chaos in recent years. Leads me to believe trades will be minimal, and Hornacek will stick around.

RE: Personally  
NoGainDayne : 1/12/2018 2:12 pm : link
In comment 13784687 Jan in DC said:
Quote:
as much as I like the team, I'd be looking to trade off as many of these guys to contenders before the trade deadline.

McDerrmott, O'Quinn, Beasley. Even Kanter. All the guys who can opt out or have contracts up this year, get picks or young cost controlled assets for them if you can. Unless you think they have a future on the team (not sure what the orgs thoughts on Kanter are).


I agree with this and have been in this boat for a bit now. KP isn't ready to carry a team into the playoffs he needs help and we need to lose as many games as possible for that. I'd go further and say that a 1st rounder isn't even necessary grab a bunch of second rounders even for Lee, KOQ and Kanter. One would be fine but one this year and one next year is realistic for these guys.

If we could land a middle of the pack 1 for some of these guys and don't add to the future salary, it could really help us down the road.
RE: I'd listen to offers on everyone.  
Keith : 1/12/2018 2:22 pm : link
In comment 13784858 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
KP is the closest thing to untouchable, but if someone came in with an offer you can't refuse, so be it.

Gotta figure Hardaway and Ntilikina are viewed as building blocks, but they shouldn't be off the table. Everyone else is fair game, and Courtney Lee should've been moved already.

Problem is, Steve Mills has already harped on stability, given all the chaos in recent years. Leads me to believe trades will be minimal, and Hornacek will stick around.


KP is untouchable in my eyes. Not sure why anyone would even consider that an option. He's made a big leap as "the man" and he's shown that he can do it. NOw he needs to prove he can do it for 82 games(crap, I'll take 72!).

Out of curiousity, what is an offer you can't refuse for KP? Being realistic.
Beasley  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 2:29 pm : link

MINNEAPOLIS — Michael Beasley has carried the Knicks offensively in many games recently, but he said he’s not surprised that his playing time could be dramatically cut when Tim Hardaway Jr. returns from injury.

“Honestly, no,” Beasley said Friday. “I’m used to it at this point. Just doing what the team needs, doing what the team asks. If they don’t ask for anything I guess I don’t do anything.”\

“I’m used to dramatic change, I’m used to ups and downs,” Beasley said. “If anything happens to where I don’t play anymore I can’t cry about it. Just got to look forward to tomorrow, get my work in, keep my conditioning up.”
If the skid continues  
rich in DC : 1/12/2018 2:41 pm : link
I think that the Knicks send out Lee and O'Quinn for whatever picks they can get. They MIGHT try and trade Beasley, if they can get a pick back.

I think the BIG question- and one that could change everything- what if the Knicks decide to shut down KP and have the elbow surgery in March so he's fully rested and healed for next year?

The Knicks would almost certainly sink into the high lottery then.
Keith, I honestly have no idea.  
bceagle05 : 1/12/2018 2:50 pm : link
I don't want to trade KP at all, just pointing out the obvious that everyone has a value. Boston probably could've swayed me on draft night, but that ship has sailed now that Tatum is a stud and the Brooklyn pick landed them Kyrie. They're not turning back. Too many question marks regarding Philly/LA. Those are the only teams that strike me as possible trade partners.
*Regarding Philly/LA's young talent.  
bceagle05 : 1/12/2018 2:52 pm : link
.
I  
DanMetroMan : 1/12/2018 3:16 pm : link
don't like the Lakers young talent to make a realistic trade that makes any sense for both teams.
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