Some negative Gettleman feedback buried in this Shrine Game

In comment 13794824 arniefez said:

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So if Abrams or Riddick was the GM the Mara Bros would be hiring someone else? Gettleman got to sit in the room. He got to voice his opinion for whatever that's worth and then the Mara's Bros hired their new coach. A new coach who would sign on to the Mara Bros structure or not be offered the job.

You are truly a broken record and an idiot.

"People" are upset? Who? What people? People who didn't get the job? Giants fans? Unemployed scouts who'd hoped they'd land a job if "their guy" got the position?

I mean, what forces outside of the Giants organization have any stake in who the Giants hire as GM?

to ignore the how Mara Bros have gone back to the ways of Wellington the past 5 or 6 years. Hey believe whatever you want. Maybe this time the results will be better. Can't get too much worse than 3-13 and no playoff wins for 6 years.

In comment 13794819 arniefez said:

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Quote: general manager Ernie Accorsi and was hired based on his previous tenure and familiarity with the organization rather than the franchise doing an exhaustive search for the best person for the job. They are people that needed "sources" to know this? There are NFL people that aren't aware how the Mara's operate? Hopefully Gettleman does a good job. GM of the Giants is a middle management position with limited authority and micro managing from two Mara owners. We've already seen Gettleman didn't get to hire his Head Coach. So it goes with the Mara Bros.

Spot on.

He said Chuck Noll told him his biggest mistake was allowing sentimentality to color his thinking and force him into keeping some of the great 70s veterans too long.

Another example, though in another sport, is the Spanish national soccer team. They dominated between 2008-2012, winning all three major tournaments, which is unprecedented. When the 2014 rolled around the manager opted to try one more run with the great members of those teams instead of moving to the next generation. They lost their opener in horrifying fashion 5-1, and three of their very best players in particular were among the most responsible. They'd chosen not to retire, so the game retired them.

Gettleman was trying to avoid that scenario by questioning the value of two sacred cows in Carolina: Olsen and Davis.

I hope he is ruthless here. This team has needed a ruthless hand since the end of the 2012 season. Instead they've kicked the can down the road trying to make "one more run with Eli". It actually ended up being a great disservice to him.

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In comment 13794832 arniefez said:

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to ignore the how Mara Bros have gone back to the ways of Wellington the past 5 or 6 years. Hey believe whatever you want. Maybe this time the results will be better. Can't get too much worse than 3-13 and no playoff wins for 6 years.

Because firing the head coach and GM during the regular season is SO much like the Giants, right? They made decisions that didn't work out, obviously they had enough and are going to try to get back to that period of time between 2005-2011 where they won two Super Bowls and made many trips to the playoffs.

It's fine to be skeptical but you come off like such a whiny dick.

about ruffling feathers of people outside the otrganization about who the Giants hire? Personally, I care about the Giants winning football games

Kicking Bobby Hart in the ass was just what the team needed and what Hart deserved. Ok with me so far.

...seems to me like that’s the biggest reason Gettleman was fired.

In comment 13794834 Go Terps said:

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He said Chuck Noll told him his biggest mistake was allowing sentimentality to color his thinking and force him into keeping some of the great 70s veterans too long. Another example, though in another sport, is the Spanish national soccer team. They dominated between 2008-2012, winning all three major tournaments, which is unprecedented. When the 2014 rolled around the manager opted to try one more run with the great members of those teams instead of moving to the next generation. They lost their opener in horrifying fashion 5-1, and three of their very best players in particular were among the most responsible. They'd chosen not to retire, so the game retired them. Gettleman was trying to avoid that scenario by questioning the value of two sacred cows in Carolina: Olsen and Davis. I hope he is ruthless here. This team has needed a ruthless hand since the end of the 2012 season. Instead they've kicked the can down the road trying to make "one more run with Eli". It actually ended up being a great disservice to him.

Excellent post.

been waiting a couple of months for intelligent posts.

He doesn’t say.

He’s a bad GM because he’s not a people person, but he only got hired here because the people he used to work with here like him. What a stupid premis. Maybe the issue isn’t DG. Sounds like it could just as well be the folks in Carolina.

Right or wrong, the Giants like stability at GM. Things got so bad, Mara needed to hire a guy whose a proven winner to fix it. I’d guess Gettleman is here 3-4 years and then Abrams becomes GM.

His press conference spoke volumes about his approach, fixing the O Line being a priority.....the next week.....Bobby Hart cut. He wants to build the Giants just the way us fans are used to see NYG: run the ball, stop the run, rush the passer. Music to my ears and it should be to every Giants fan.

DG is the right guy. I think Shurmur is a smart hire as well.

Call it safe, call it Mara's pick. I don't care. 3-13 is a nightmare and this past season was a complete disappointment. Taking chances on executives and head coaches may not be wise when you have a talented enough roster to win.

Members inside the Giants organization?
Good, maybe they need to be ruffled.

If not, then who gives a fuck?

One of the other candidates mentioned didn't even get the Green Bay job. Who else was out there? You couldn't wait for NE, not that any of them are great shakes anyway.

In this article. Ear to the ground. Amazing, really.

I recall how many of us respected the way the Eagles used to cut a lot of their veterans once they hit their 30's.

We all wished the Giants were more like that, because we knew they were keeping aging players too long.

Now we have someone who isn't afraid to do it.

In comment 13794832 arniefez said:

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to ignore the how Mara Bros have gone back to the ways of Wellington the past 5 or 6 years. Hey believe whatever you want. Maybe this time the results will be better. Can't get too much worse than 3-13 and no playoff wins for 6 years.

I'll note the Senior VP of Player Evaluation stayed on. If Reese and Ross are gone, certainly the person in that position should go as well.

Oh wait.

...in his line of work. It could even be considered a negative to some degree. You don't want a people-pleaser in that position. You want an opinionated SOB who has a talent for talent evaluation and isn't afraid to ruffle feathers.

I liked Reese. I think he was made a scapegoat for what were organizational decisions, but it can be said that that was the problem with him. He wasn't a visionary with a strong voice. Eleven years as GM and I can't recall a single story of he and Coughlin banging heads (other than when Reese lost Ballard on the waiver wire).

For all of you who complain that Reese didn't supply Coughlin with talent he could win with, I would bet the truth is that Coughlin was every bit as responsible for the talent as was Reese. If Coughlin didn't approve, we would've heard about it. The point being that decisions made by consensus tend to be of the high floor-low ceiling variety compared to decisions made by a singular vision.

I'll say it again, I think Reese was made a fall guy for decisions in which ownership was equally at fault. If he was guilty of anything it was doing things....
The Company Way - ( New Window )

In comment 13794884 FStubbs said:

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In comment 13794832 arniefez said: Quote: to ignore the how Mara Bros have gone back to the ways of Wellington the past 5 or 6 years. Hey believe whatever you want. Maybe this time the results will be better. Can't get too much worse than 3-13 and no playoff wins for 6 years. I'll note the Senior VP of Player Evaluation stayed on. If Reese and Ross are gone, certainly the person in that position should go as well. Oh wait.

While we don’t know how much of the mess was created by Chris Mara you are not getting some of the die hard Mara fans to admit they meddle and are/were part of th problem. Forget all he personel fuck ups. McAdoo was a John Mara hire foisted on Cauglin then the whole team. The Mara’s are meddlers. Period. And for this loyalists they have the right to be as owners. Regardless the contingent that thinks they haven’t been knee deep in the shifty state of this team are not going to admit it.

That’s all that matters.

In comment 13794879 Brown Recluse said:

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I recall how many of us respected the way the Eagles used to cut a lot of their veterans once they hit their 30's. We all wished the Giants were more like that, because we knew they were keeping aging players too long. Now we have someone who isn't afraid to do it.

Yup, Patriots too

you can tell people over and over again what the real story was in Carolina, yet many will just ignore it to further an anti-Mara stance:

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And it's no secret that Gettleman is abrasive and disliked by a lot of people. That's why he got canned in Carolina

Gettleman was canned in Carolina because he had the "nerve" to lok at options on how to handle the future of Greg Olsen and Thomas Davis, two of richardson's favorite players.

There wasn't a lot of nuance to the firing. Richardson told Gettleman that under no circumstances were those players to be moved and Gettleman told him that exploring options is what a GM has to do.

This isn't fiction, yet many people here willingly ignore what the firing meant.

And as pointed out above, Richardson brought back the GM who he was familiar with and who had put them into cap troubles, Marty Hurney, and as Richardson prepares to exit the team, he's taken steps to protect friends and rid himself of others. They already fired Shula and the QB coach, and they are going to give Hurney a promotion to full-time GM and Executive VP

gonna hate.

If you have nothing else to write about, bash somebody.

Hmmm, should I think Gettleman was the problem in CAR, or perv owner Jerry Richardson's dysfunctional ownership?

people in the organization are not happy? GOOD! Many of these people needed to be fired a long time ago. We talked about cleaning house and now it is a bad thing that these people are nervous because their new boss does not give them the "warm and fuzzies"?

The free ride to mediocrity is over people. You will now be held accountable. DG does not want to know how your MLK day off was. He just wants to know what you got accomplished this week.

of course there are roughled feathers at the Shrine Game. That's where a good number of Giants Scouts are hanging out... and what do you know....

Gettleman just unceremoniously fired their boss, Mark Ross, almost immediately after he was hired. Gettleman is in charge of their office for now, and they all directly report to him I'm sure he has put a few golden cows on notice in the scouting department that they have to do better.

The College Scouting department hasn't been getting the job done with offensive lineman, running backs, linebackers, or cornerbacks. I'd be roughling a few feathers and kicking their asses too.

For those of you who wanted change and think Gettleman is a sign of the same ol' thing, this is a sure sign that change is happening and that it's not going to be the same o' thing.

And just let me say this: Thank god a few feathers are roughled in the College Scouting department!

In comment 13794948 gidiefor said:

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of course there are roughled feathers at the Shrine Game. That's where a good number of Giants Scouts are hanging out... and what do you know.... Gettleman just unceremoniously fired their boss, Mark Ross, almost immediately after he was hired. Gettleman is in charge of their office for now, and they all directly report to him I'm sure he has put a few golden cows on notice in the scouting department that they have to do better. The College Scouting department hasn't been getting the job done with offensive lineman, running backs, linebackers, or cornerbacks. I'd be roughling a few feathers and kicking their asses too. For those of you who wanted change and think Gettleman is a sign of the same ol' thing, this is a sure sign that change is happening and that it's not going to be the same o' thing. And just let me say this: Thank god a few feathers are roughled in the College Scouting department!

AMEN Brother gidie!

Many are familiar with - a totally new guy would probably fire them all after the draft. And maybe DG still will.

what a load of crap.

They took a guy they knew, and felt confident in. Bad move? Please.

So he's not an ass-kisser and he plays hardball with player salaries. So people are gonna get butt-hurt. And now some Giants players will, too.

Do you want a GM everyone loves? Is there even such a thing?

In comment 13794948 gidiefor said:

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of course there are roughled feathers at the Shrine Game. That's where a good number of Giants Scouts are hanging out... and what do you know.... Gettleman just unceremoniously fired their boss, Mark Ross, almost immediately after he was hired. Gettleman is in charge of their office for now, and they all directly report to him I'm sure he has put a few golden cows on notice in the scouting department that they have to do better. The College Scouting department hasn't been getting the job done with offensive lineman, running backs, linebackers, or cornerbacks. I'd be roughling a few feathers and kicking their asses too. For those of you who wanted change and think Gettleman is a sign of the same ol' thing, this is a sure sign that change is happening and that it's not going to be the same o' thing. And just let me say this: Thank god a few feathers are roughled in the College Scouting department!

Agree! The moment DG fired Marc Ross, it was a sign there was a new sheriff in town, to borrow a quote, and the 'same old same old' was no longer the way the team would operate.

Today's football GOD BB is certainly not a people person.No Organization has been more ruthless in cutting or trading fan popular players away then The New England Patriots. If you want to play there you have to work your ass off to keep your job, otherwise you will be gone. A super bowl ring almost every year is the replacement for the "Warm and Fuzzes" Even Tom Brady knows he is not safe and he has to devote his entire LIFE STYLE to being the starting QB, and he almost got traded anyway. Warm and Fuzzes is the formula for LOSERS. That is one of the many reasons why Reese and Ross are on th junk pile.

Another Kentavius Street appearance.
Shrine Monday practice report - ( New Window )

No bullshit, cut and dry. The Panthers being in Carolina, are the complete opposite.

He fits in better in NY then he ever has in Carolina. Quite frankly Carolina was dumb for getting rid of him because he wouldn't pay crazy contracts to players that were going to be on a steep decline very shortly.

In comment 13794948 gidiefor said:

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of course there are roughled feathers at the Shrine Game. That's where a good number of Giants Scouts are hanging out... and what do you know.... Gettleman just unceremoniously fired their boss, Mark Ross, almost immediately after he was hired. Gettleman is in charge of their office for now, and they all directly report to him I'm sure he has put a few golden cows on notice in the scouting department that they have to do better. The College Scouting department hasn't been getting the job done with offensive lineman, running backs, linebackers, or cornerbacks. I'd be roughling a few feathers and kicking their asses too. For those of you who wanted change and think Gettleman is a sign of the same ol' thing, this is a sure sign that change is happening and that it's not going to be the same o' thing. And just let me say this: Thank god a few feathers are roughled in the College Scouting department!

Good post giddie.

good post gidie

Gettleman gets hired as GM in Carolina based on his work in NY. Fired in Carolina for going against owner's wishes - perceived as a negative against Gettleman.

Hired in NY as GM, returning to organization that he has been clearly held in high regard by. Hires coach (speculatively) that owners approve of. Is seen as a negative against Gettleman.

Can't make this shit up.

I don't understand how anybody can put an ounce of stock in his judgement in light of recent developments.

He doesnt come across as a people person.

Mara and Tisch have their fingerprints all over the Hindenberg that was the 2017 team, and people who are distrustful of their decision-making and meddling have every reason to be distrustful.

They re-hired Gettleman because they know him and the default with this team has been the familiar. Gettleman can also be an abrasive prick. Neither of these facts alone or together precludes Gettleman from being a good general manager.

If he has kicked a few of our scouts out or in the ass, good.

Exploring options is what a GM is supposed to do. If Richardson meddled in who was the target of the options, then Gettleman will be right at home here because he will get the same kind of meddling. Goes with the territory. Again, it doesn't prevent Gettleman from being a good GM unless the options he is allowed to take turn out to be lousy.

For all the statements about "sacred cows" and "sentimentality", you can only get rid of a player when you have someone better to take his place. Chuck Noll can chide himself for his sentimentality about keeping Bradshaw or Franco Harris, for example, but when the alternatives are Cliff Stoudt and Mark Malone or Greg Hawthorne, Russell Davis, Walter Abercrombie and Frank Pollard, there is not much choice to make.

Get talented players in here through the draft, FA, UDFA and none of this stuff is a problem.

damning part of the issue in Carolina is that Gettleman hadn't even decided what to do with Olsen or Davis, he had only gotten to the point at looking at restructuring contracts and looked at possible trading partners.

The players and their agents went to Richardson and he told Gettleman not to even consider any other options that would reduce their pay of move them from the team.

I really don't see any possible way this gets turned back as a negative on Gettleman

I'm glad feathers were ruffled. To echo gidie, with the draft record this franchise has had the past 8 years, feathers needed to ruffled and heads needed to role. Reese and Ross are gone and the scouts are nervous. They should be.

Stress brings out the best and the worst in people. Let's see how the Giants respond. Get your big boy pants on

In comment 13794948 gidiefor said:

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of course there are roughled feathers at the Shrine Game. That's where a good number of Giants Scouts are hanging out... and what do you know.... Gettleman just unceremoniously fired their boss, Mark Ross, almost immediately after he was hired. Gettleman is in charge of their office for now, and they all directly report to him I'm sure he has put a few golden cows on notice in the scouting department that they have to do better. The College Scouting department hasn't been getting the job done with offensive lineman, running backs, linebackers, or cornerbacks. I'd be roughling a few feathers and kicking their asses too. For those of you who wanted change and think Gettleman is a sign of the same ol' thing, this is a sure sign that change is happening and that it's not going to be the same o' thing. And just let me say this: Thank god a few feathers are roughled in the College Scouting department!

Agreed...excellent post.

Nothing negative about that. Best news I have heard in a while. Makes the hiring look better to me.

Since the Super Bowl win the Giants are 42-54. Their point differential in that stretch is -162. This hasn't been a fun team to root for in years, and some of the players are difficult even to like. No one in that building should be happy or feeling safe in their job. I hope the players are uncomfortable and unhappy.

I hope there are a bunch of players that end of hating Gettleman and motherfucking him as they are being shown the door.

In comment 13795327 Go Terps said:

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Since the Super Bowl win the Giants are 42-54. Their point differential in that stretch is -162. This hasn't been a fun team to root for in years, and some of the players are difficult even to like. No one in that building should be happy or feeling safe in their job. I hope the players are uncomfortable and unhappy. I hope there are a bunch of players that end of hating Gettleman and motherfucking him as they are being shown the door.

All true, agreed

If memory serves, there was some grousing amongst Jaguars vets last spring about the harsh offseason program Coughlin installed

Don’t recall if we found out who, but they’re either not on the squad anymore, or now playing in the AFC championship game after beating a tough Steelers team in Pittsburgh.

Anyone thing some early negative feedback about Coughlin was a bad thing there?

In comment 13795081 Rflairr said:

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He doesnt come across as a people person.

I assume you are referring to Dave Gettleman. If so, I say WHO GIVES A FUCK! We don't need a people person. We need a kick-ass GM who will hold everyone accountable!

I hear this but no name's,sounds like back door bitching from people who don't matter.