I do not like projecting trades...if you want to look at odds...they are overwhelmingly tipped towards NYG not trading the #2 pick.
So assuming that NYG stays put and they do not like the concerns surrounding the QBs (everyone has to admit that is at least a possibility right now)...this team goes in to the draft needing to build around Eli Manning one more time for 2018, possibly 2019.
Whether you have this unproven theory that running backs should not be taken this high or not, assume Saquon Barkley may be the strongest option available. I don't see any other players meeting the elite grade mark, and passing on a talent like him would be borderline foolish. I will say the evaluation process still has a little ways to go, so someone like a Bradley Chubb or a Connor Williams or a Minkah Fitzpatrick could warrant the #2 spot, but I am leaning towards that not happening.
So Barkley to NYG at #2...does this require them to take OL at the top of the 2nd round? Drafting solely based on need is never a good idea, kind of like going to the grocery store when you are hungry. What if, say a LB like Roquan Smith is there, do you pass on him for a guard? Or a tackle that may not be able to win the left tackle job?
That, just as much as what to do with the #2 pick, is as tough as it gets. All of this can be solved Gettleman gets really aggressive with the OL via free agency, but shelling out big dollars for the guys in this class would worry me just as much as relying on day 1/2 rookies. One thing is for certain, this team cannot go in to 2018 with what they left 2017 with along the OL.
I agree. There is a lot talent at the QB position. Potentially 6 QBs could go RD 1. What’s the record for first rd QBs taken?
And that line was STILL better than the Giants OL.
Not coming out of the Draft and/or Free Agency with 2 new Tackles would be very close to gross negligence.
Not infusing some talent to the Linebacker unit would be regular negligence...
jeez this draft is good at rb...and rb's are position of dime or dozen.
take best qb..teams that ignore the position flounder for years trying to get a franchise qb..I'm sure 1 of these qbs will turn out to be a franchise one. homework. and to build around a 37 yr qb, is plain stupid imo
Not coming out of the Draft and/or Free Agency with 2 new Tackles would be very close to gross negligence.
Not infusing some talent to the Linebacker unit would be regular negligence...
I feel the same way. Grab a QB and you have Webb and the draftee and hope one or both pans out. If both look good you can trade one.
Which means that they should probably take a QB at #2.
With Eli and a good scheme, health, OL, RB, yadda, yadda, they don’t sniff the top of the draft for another two years. And then, it’s too late.
Giants need a franchise QB and they may not be in this draft position again anytime soon.
Darnold and Rosen are franchise QBs well worth the #2 pick in the draft. The team that picks them is potentially set at the most important position on the field for the next 10-15 years. The team that picks Barkley can't say that.
It’s a dereliction of duty so egregious that DG should be fired on the spot. If Manning is 27, then fine. But Manning is 37 and deep on the back nine of his career. And there are 3 QB prospects that could easily spell another 10+ years of competitive play. If you think playing QB is easy to play now, compared to when QBs were treated with disdain like the other 21 players on the field, wait until 3+ years from now when the QB is wearing a belt around his waste with flags attached to it...
Can Gettleman get a Andrew Norwell in FA to play guard and an offensive lineman in Rd 2 then the offense will roll with the proper coach and OC
Eli mentors Webb for another year
Now we just need a pass rush and some LBs
No. He'll go in the Top 10.
If you’re looking for an alternative approach to the draft, load up on value defensive talent. Hope to hit on OL in FA/late in the draft.
1. Chubb DE
2. Jefferson LB
And go from there.
If you’re looking for an alternative approach to the draft, load up on value defensive talent. Hope to hit on OL in FA/late in the draft.
1. Chubb DE
2. Jefferson LB
And go from there.
Hoping to hit on on OL late in the draft is the Jerry Reese approach to improve the OL which didn't work.
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No.
At this point, I think anything is possible with Flowers. LT, RT, RG, benched.
I don't think so. He is a top 20 lock in my eyes.
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At CGS event. Picked some brains at the end of the nights at the bar. Lots of raving about Notre Dame OL Nelson. Apparently he's a no brainer All Star type at the next level. Any possible way he gets to 2nd round?
I don't think so. He is a top 20 lock in my eyes.
Picking a G at #2 would be unheard of.
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There are 5-6 RBs just as good as Barkley, many projecting 1-2 rounds later.
If you’re looking for an alternative approach to the draft, load up on value defensive talent. Hope to hit on OL in FA/late in the draft.
1. Chubb DE
2. Jefferson LB
And go from there.
Hoping to hit on on OL late in the draft is the Jerry Reese approach to improve the OL which didn't work.
I agree. But the OP is suggesting an alternative approach to the draft with no trade downs. In that scenario, the logical decision would be to build around the talent we have on defense and be a kick ass defensive squad next year. Chubb and Jefferson would be nice value picks at the Giants slot.
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There are 5-6 RBs just as good as Barkley
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No.
He's more right than wrong. Kerryon Johnson has the goods. Had he not been hurt for the Georgia game in the SEC championship game, a great case could have been made that he was the Heisman winner...great prospect.
Sonny Michel is just as talented as Barkley. What can't he do?
You can be suspicious of his competition, but Penny's production has been nothing short of spectacular.
I think Guice is has skills that just weren't exposed at LSU because the QB play was so incompetent. I think he could be a terrific receiver and flourish with quality NFL QB...
I'm actually a big fan of the Hines kid for NC State. Every game I saw he was doing something good. Low tread on his tire as he had few touches his frosh and soph years. Could be a real find...
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In comment 13795926 kelsto811 said:
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At CGS event. Picked some brains at the end of the nights at the bar. Lots of raving about Notre Dame OL Nelson. Apparently he's a no brainer All Star type at the next level. Any possible way he gets to 2nd round?
I don't think so. He is a top 20 lock in my eyes.
Picking a G at #2 would be unheard of.
Drafting a QB at #2 may not be ideal, especially if they don't like the warts on the prospects out there, and considering a new QB needs an Oline in front of him, which they don't have, and needs to be built, putting a new QB out behind a mess of a line may just get him killed or ruin him. It would be kind of hysterical to find out a new QB is even less able to run an offense than Manning is in his current state, and instead finds himself running for his life as opposed to running the offense. Kinda like finding out that although we thought Coughlin was over the hill and new blood would be the cure for what ails us, instead it was the steady hand of experience that was what really kept everything together, as opposed to being the problem.
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In comment 13795976 Sy'56 said:
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In comment 13795926 kelsto811 said:
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At CGS event. Picked some brains at the end of the nights at the bar. Lots of raving about Notre Dame OL Nelson. Apparently he's a no brainer All Star type at the next level. Any possible way he gets to 2nd round?
I don't think so. He is a top 20 lock in my eyes.
Picking a G at #2 would be unheard of.
He was picked as a tackle but failed at that position, so they were forced to move him inside.
Gettleman will pick up some offensive line pieces in FA, and I'm sure he will take a strong look at the lineman in the second. But if Smith is there in the 2nd and he is higher on your board then the lineman, pull the plug on Smith. He seems like a talented backer, something we haven't had since Antonio Pierce.
This roster can use talent at every position. Take the talent when you get offered it.
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In comment 13795980 GFAN52 said:
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In comment 13795976 Sy'56 said:
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In comment 13795926 kelsto811 said:
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At CGS event. Picked some brains at the end of the nights at the bar. Lots of raving about Notre Dame OL Nelson. Apparently he's a no brainer All Star type at the next level. Any possible way he gets to 2nd round?
I don't think so. He is a top 20 lock in my eyes.
Picking a G at #2 would be unheard of.
He was picked as a tackle but failed at that position, so they were forced to move him inside.
Obviously I'm not advocating taking him at 2 which is why mentioned 2nd round.
Funny Gallery is mentioned though bc he came up in that conversation. We had a bit of a debate on whether he was a "bust" or not. To me he clearly was but some good points brought up that he was drafted out of position and was a good guard. Wasn't and should have never been a LT.
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In comment 13795989 Sarcastic Sam said:
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In comment 13795980 GFAN52 said:
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In comment 13795976 Sy'56 said:
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In comment 13795926 kelsto811 said:
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At CGS event. Picked some brains at the end of the nights at the bar. Lots of raving about Notre Dame OL Nelson. Apparently he's a no brainer All Star type at the next level. Any possible way he gets to 2nd round?
I don't think so. He is a top 20 lock in my eyes.
Picking a G at #2 would be unheard of.
He was picked as a tackle but failed at that position, so they were forced to move him inside.
Obviously I'm not advocating taking him at 2 which is why mentioned 2nd round.
Funny Gallery is mentioned though bc he came up in that conversation. We had a bit of a debate on whether he was a "bust" or not. To me he clearly was but some good points brought up that he was drafted out of position and was a good guard. Wasn't and should have never been a LT.
I'm with you on going OL in the second. BPA at either OT or OG.
I have had this exact thought multiple times this past two weeks, and I like Barkley as a player. at the #2 pick overall he immediately becomes one of the highest paid RB's in the league.
This is why high draft picks tend to go toward QB, DE, WR, and Shutdown CB types because the value per dollar on the rookie contract is outstanding compared to the second contract especially if you are talking a top notch NFL player.
Don't take the easy way out with this post. Of course if there is garbage at QB in this draft you don't take one. But you know that is not the case nor can anyone be 100% sure.
You pick a QB this year at #2. Otherwise, you gotta sell that spot.
Come on...
First, there's a much better success rate hitting on RBs in the middle to later rounds than any other position. Thats where teams like us, with holes all over the roster, take RBs.
Its also a very bad way to allocate our cap dollars. He'd immediately be the 4th highest paid RB in the league. Now if its a QB, he's not even in the top 20 highest paid. Big difference which allows for a lot of flexibility with the rest of the roster.
And its nothing like Gurley. He was selected 10th overall not 2nd. Thats a big difference in pay and secondly, after Winston and Mariota there wasn't a QB selected until the 3rd round. I'm sure the Rams are happy they got him but if they were picking 2nd overall in 2015 and being a QB needy team they would've been the team selecting Mariota. Instead the very following year the Rams had to give up nearly 2 drafts to move up to get Goff.
I understand the allure of getting a RB like Barkley especially today where most fans are more concerned with their fantasy rosters but selecting a RB with the #2 pick in the draft, thats a luxury pick. Look at this roster, do we have the luxury?
He is perfect for it physically and seems to have the mental side of being a pro perfected.
How ready he is to succeed is anyone's guess.
First, there's a much better success rate hitting on RBs in the middle to later rounds than any other position. Thats where teams like us, with holes all over the roster, take RBs.
Its also a very bad way to allocate our cap dollars. He'd immediately be the 4th highest paid RB in the league. Now if its a QB, he's not even in the top 20 highest paid. Big difference which allows for a lot of flexibility with the rest of the roster.
And its nothing like Gurley. He was selected 10th overall not 2nd. Thats a big difference in pay and secondly, after Winston and Mariota there wasn't a QB selected until the 3rd round. I'm sure the Rams are happy they got him but if they were picking 2nd overall in 2015 and being a QB needy team they would've been the team selecting Mariota. Instead the very following year the Rams had to give up nearly 2 drafts to move up to get Goff.
I understand the allure of getting a RB like Barkley especially today where most fans are more concerned with their fantasy rosters but selecting a RB with the #2 pick in the draft, thats a luxury pick. Look at this roster, do we have the luxury?
Very, very well said.
Jones is a backup IMO
I would go LB in the 2nd
“The whole purpose of free agency is to set up your draft. You never go into a draft saying ‘I gotta have a,’ whatever that ‘a’ is. You don’t want to be in that spot because now you’re shopping hungry,” Gettleman said during a Tuesday appearance on WFAN.
“We’ll use free agency. There’s always the trade route, there’s always the waiver wire. You’ve gotta do your film work. It’s not pretty, it’s not easy but you’ve gotta get it done.”
The glaring holes (notably the OL, probably LB and RB) will be addressed before the draft. They likely won't be finished products, but those positions will be better than they are now. The #2 pick will be whoever Gettleman has at the top of the board. That may be a QB or Barkley or Chubb or someone else.
Same as any position, really.
At some point you just have to hope that the guys who get paid handsomely to assess a prospect's NFL talent level nail this one. If they determine Barkley is worthy of a top-5 choice and are proven right, fine by me.
First, there's a much better success rate hitting on RBs in the middle to later rounds than any other position. Thats where teams like us, with holes all over the roster, take RBs.
Its also a very bad way to allocate our cap dollars. He'd immediately be the 4th highest paid RB in the league. Now if its a QB, he's not even in the top 20 highest paid. Big difference which allows for a lot of flexibility with the rest of the roster.
And its nothing like Gurley. He was selected 10th overall not 2nd. Thats a big difference in pay and secondly, after Winston and Mariota there wasn't a QB selected until the 3rd round. I'm sure the Rams are happy they got him but if they were picking 2nd overall in 2015 and being a QB needy team they would've been the team selecting Mariota. Instead the very following year the Rams had to give up nearly 2 drafts to move up to get Goff.
I understand the allure of getting a RB like Barkley especially today where most fans are more concerned with their fantasy rosters but selecting a RB with the #2 pick in the draft, thats a luxury pick. Look at this roster, do we have the luxury?
Fantastic assessment.
njm : 1/18/2018 5:00 pm : link : reply
1. We will know if an OL was signed as a FA and who has left.
2. Shurmur will have spent some time with Webb and will have at least gauged his arm strength.
If there is no FA OL signed and Pugh is lost the Giants' hand is forced. They have to take one in the 1st or 2nd, maybe both. What good is Barkley if he is gets so beat up in his rookie year his potential is permanently diminished? Who do I taken then? Quinten Nelson, even at #2.
As far as the need for a QB goes if there have been some signings I'll rely on Shurmur's and Gettleman's judgement. If they don't go QB Fitzpatrick and Collins would be the best safety tandem in the league. Chubb would give juice to the pass rush.
I love Chub as well but Gallman survived ok as did the injury prone Darkwa ..
Barkley is a tough shifty is putting it lightly that would have taken many a run to the house this past season the guy has amazing vision a HR hitter ad WR and RB ..
Fix the line get a few LB take some of the heat off Collins .If Smith LB is there in the 2nd jump on him !